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Robert Dreyfuss, writing about McCain in The Nation:
"He’s the true neocon," says the Brookings Institution’s Ivo Daalder, a liberal interventionist who conceived the idea of a League of Democracies with Robert Kagan. "He does believe, in a way that George W. Bush never really did, in the use of power, military power above all, to change the world in America’s image. If you thought George Bush was bad when it comes to the use of military force, wait till you see John McCain…. He believes this. His advisers believe this. He’s surrounded himself with people who believe it. And I’ll take him at his word."
It’s a tribute to the power of barbecue lovin’ hackery that people continue to see him as able to unite the country in anything other than opposition to endless war.
C&L has video of Dreyfuss talking about McCain’s temperamental bellicosity.
He really is worse than Bush.
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zed. I hope not, cause he may yet win.
Crazy as a shit house rat is not a good thing.
No
Third
Term
So I guess BBQ sauce is the new kool aid.
oh please not four more years.
I’m with Teddy on this, no third McBush term.
John McBu’ush.
I think after all those trips to Crawford with Bush the MSM is enchanted with the Sedona region of Arizona. It is very beautiful.
Would bet that impeachment would be on the table in about 6 months. We would hear the sound of a nation tearing itself apart.
I can’t see how you think McCain is worse than Bush. Yes McCain ain’t great and I wouldn’t want him in office, but saying he is like Bush is just sad. Respect the man but not his views.
Regards,
Ryan
NO!
I refuse to cede barbecue sauce or the nation to CrazyTrain McCain
John McCain, IMO, is a very dangerous candidate. He has all the general population good will, the rep as a maverick, the war hero thing, and has been demonstrating a very shiny new Teflon jacket lately.
I’ve heard that it it very beautiful there.
There’s the rallying call we’re looking for. Save America, Save BBQ Sauce, Vote Democratic./s
McCain is dangerous
You just can’t make this sh*t up…
DAYTON, Ohio, March 27 — President Bush hailed Iraqi leaders Thursday for making “remarkable” progress toward settling the deep-seated political disputes that have fueled the five-year-old war, and he called on critics in Congress to stop “hectoring” Baghdad over the pace of reconciliation.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..id=topnews
McCain wants to be like Cheney, not Bush.
I’m glad to see FDL focusing the message on McCain.
And, of course, they today had to order the lockdown of the Green Zone. Of course, there’s “no civil war” raging an growing by day. LOL!
Is John McCain Dick Cheney’s puppet?
He went on to praise Maliki’s courage and decisiveness… F*cking bat-shit insane… 8-(
McCain is anxious to show what a real military man can do.
Gonna be an interesting next couple of weeks. Maliki could end up with an RPG up his ass.. Then what, Bu’ush?
NBC nightly news did not begin with Iraq this evening. Some story about pharmaceuticals. Iraq was second.. beyond Bush’s talking points (We’re winning now boy) the snippet about fighting mentioned almost nothing about American troop involvement.
Conflate it! …bomb, bomb, bomb Iran! 8-(
Yeah, a shitty pilot who graduated near the bottom of his Academy class.
Not that he didn’t show major stones while in captivity. Bu’ush would have pissed his Depends every day — though he made damn certain his heroics were circumscribed to keeping those squadrons of Vietcong heavy fighter-bombers out of the No-Fly Zone above the TANG golf course and NCO Club.
The best way to fight McBush is with his own mouth. Once people hear what he says, rather than the sanctified discussions in MSM, most will run away screaming. And most is enough.
Boxturtle (I see a commercial where the tagline is “He said THAT?!?”)
I misread that as “McCain is anxious to know what a real military man can do.”
…And in other news (Sorry for the OT):
Your TSA tax dollars hard at work in Lubbock, TX (no pun intended)
Hold your nose (Faux Snooze Alert) Siegelman released on bail.
McCan’t was a service ace… Taking out five US fighters all by himself, and, killing and maiming US personnel on a Carrier deck…!
From the wisdom of John McCain
Yeah, jeez…
If it were McBu’ush doing the carrier landing “Mission Accomplised” stunt, he’d probably overshoot the deck and corkscrew into the sea.
The AP is also reporting the Seigelman story.
Ex-Ala. Governor to Be Freed on Bond
Published: 3/27/08, 6:46 PM EDT
By BOB JOHNSON
MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) – A federal appeals court approved the release of former Alabama Gov. Don Siegelman on bond Thursday while he appeals his convictions in a corruption case.
The 11th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals said the former governor had raised “substantial questions of fact and law” in challenging his conviction, which Siegelman claims was politically motivated
http://my.att.net/s/editorial……#038;ch=ne
I insist that there had to be “rank” favoritism for a person who graduated near the bottom of his Academy class to even get the opportunity to be a shitty pilot! According to USNA grads that I have known, those were the most sought after billets and were scarfed up by those with the best class standing. Ordinarily, a guy with McCain’s class standing would have been consigned to a Surface Line billet, likely an unglamorous one aboard a auxiliary ship (Frieghter, Oiler, etc.) to boot!
Poking fun at McBush’s service record isn’t going to work for us. You can’t argue his POW experiences and that simply eclipses his other lack of accomplishments. The vital middle will turn against those attacks.
If he brings up his war experiences, our response should be “But we’re not still fighting the Viet Nam war…are we?”.
He’s vulnerable there.
Boxturtle (Not trying to be nice to McBush, just aiming for a more tender spot)
Right, Bush is a better pilot than McCain, get a grip.
“…they will follow us home.”
I hate that fucking mindless crap. Are so many people really so daft as to believe that? To believe that getting out of Iraq simply means unilaterally standing down our defenses everywhere?
I loved how Barack Obama made the comment that McCain is Bush’s 3rd term. How true and that’s why we need to kick Hillary to the curb to get Barack in there! McCain doesn’t have a chance going against him.
By the way, Jane I love, love, love your new haircut! I went short last summer. So much easier to deal with now! ;-)
And, can we all have a group hug:
http://firedoglake.com/2008/03…..ticipated/
Lots of peeps feeling anxiety about this election, about the progressive movement, and each other. FDL is the last refuge of complete thoughts & sentences…and great voices! I hope it never changes.
Gotta lot of pilots on oilers do they?
Yeah, I guess the terrorists aren’t too good at reading maps. The only way they could find us is if they followed us home. I wonder how they got here on 9/11.
I’d love to see them do a dogfight over the TANG golf course.
McCain’s aircraft was hit by the accidental launch of a missle from another aircraft while he was in his cockpit. He barely escaped alive and, yes, a great many sailors died that day.
Thanks, at least I’m not alone on this one. Next thing they’ll be raggin about how he treated Ted Sampley and his fucking nut cases.
We all know that Bu’ush didn’t really fly that plane in. He “took the controls” for a bit as Mr. Play Warrior Ace.
I like to tell Bubba’s who say that.. I will start worrying about that when Baghdad Bass Pro Shop has a clearance sale and a big run on large boats.. Until then, fear not! (or BS! depending on the audience)
Roger that, he also was never under fire. I realize that doesn’t mean much here but it does to me.
Nah, only goig in and out of port. Point is, not many of those guys that aren’t in the top third of their class even get a shot an aviation billet (w/o an act of God or someone of similar rank).
I beg to differ, look at the success the swift boaters had in taking down Kerry… Here’s an interesting synopsis of McBuush’s service record…
http://findarticles.com/p/arti…..i_61361646
“You can’t argue his POW experiences “
I certainly did not. See prior. I copped to his stones on that experience.
Plenty of present day low hanging rotten McBu’ush fruit to be had.
Great News now he can clear his name. Hopefully the rethugs that set him up will get some press before the election.
Or being an Admirals son. I realize all that but what is the point in diminishing his service. Lot’s of people ended up in jobs they were not the best choice for, Rusty Calley comes to mind. There were also plenty of people way over qualified, that’s the way it goes. There is plenty to hammer this guy on that is relevant.
Raven, I left a couple of thoughts on that thread for you, I hope you will read them.
David
Jane said, [John McCain] “really is worse than Bush.”
George Bush supports torture of human beings by the United States of America because he is an arrogant, self-centered bully and an insensitive idiot who blew up frogs as a child and giggled about executions as the governor of Texas.
John McCain supports torture of human beings by the United States of America because he views it as politically expedient–to prove he is “tough on terra’”–even though he knows by personal experience how wrong it is.
He really is worse than Bush.
Ok, I did, not sure what to do with it. Guilt, you are fucking right, but I’m not going to let it kneecap me. Life, as you know, is too short.
I wouldn’t presume to! I will denigrate no person’s service. It is not a winner politically, certainly not with me. I was merely pointing it out among friends. The child of privilege thing. Officers in the Navy are treated well, when I was in the Naval Officer’s Manual still stated that enlisted people were not to be trusted, for they would steal the silver from the Officer’s Mess! We had a running joke going on about marketing some purloined silver.
Yes.
Re Siegelman, the federal judge who sent him to prison in such an expedited and unusual way was Mark Fuller. Fuller dragged his feet not once but twice with regard to requests from the appellate panel of the very conservative 11th Circuit as to why Siegelman should not be freed on bond. These requests clearly signaled that they thought Siegelman should be out on bail unless Fuller came up with something really persuasive. Instead he blew them off. Siegelman’s release his good news. It is also a slap at Fuller.
I also really appreciate your comments.
I listened to Bushface this morning addressing the Airforce academy and it was all war, war, war. It assured them and us that Iraq is a success story. Honky-dory, in fact. Any problem is Al Quida.
He has a great source of information – Elm Street Freddie Kagan who said a few days ago that the Civil War in Iraq ended two years ago. How does he know? Because he declared it so.
Beware of the Kagans and the American Enterprise Institute. Everyday, they speak as the voice of authority on war policies, economics, social security, health care and Constitutional law on C-SPAN. If demons took on human form they would be a family called Kagan and Kristol.
Bobby, I beg to differ. Bush wouldn’t have cared one whit about the NCO club. The O club, however…
My old man was a mustang, 4 years in the Pacific on an APD, and after college on the GI Bill he took a commission. I grew up in Great Lakes, Norfolk, San Diego. . .and joined the dam Army. And I would swipe any silver those butter bars left in the open. Nothing in the world more dangerous that a 2nd Lt with a compass.
I repeat: Whatever McBush did/did not do prior to his POW experiences is completely irrevelent to the vital middle. Unless you can turn up evidence that he was a snitch or such, he was hero enough during that time. We do not want fight him there.
We don’t need to swiftboat, we’ve got the issues on our side. Hang his own words around his neck, that’s all we have to do.
Boxturtle (First issue: Define “win” in Iraq and explain how military force gets us there”
Some of the very same people are trying to SB him right now, Ted Sampley and friends.
gee, who was it that said “Some Humans Ain’t Human”
would this be a good time to mention how much I despise mccain? For someone who was himself tortured to support torture himself is just sad and despicable beyond belief … not to mention that he’s clearly bought and paid for. another tool …
This is yet another reason to question Hillary’s judgement since she thinks McCain would be better than Obama. Perhaps she is not ready to be President.
Hint: It wasn’t Rev. Moon.
Tell me please….tell me what about McCain’s background makes him “qualified” to be Commander-in-Chief of he Armed Forces…I want to know. What? Tell me? And, don’t bother telling me that being tortured and locked up as a POW qualifies him. It does not “qualify” him.
Tell me what makes him “qualified” to be President of the United States!! Tell me???
What???
I’ve said this before but the most effective thing the SB vets did was the campaign by the former POW’s. You can argue till the cows come home about Cambodia, Ghengis Kahn and all that but when the POW’s talked about how they felt, that was not up for argument.
McVain is a sawed off little Napolean,without the brains and spirit…fade away McVain,fade away
Nothing, that’s the point, all this bullshit about what kind of cadet and pilot he was doesn’t mean shit to a tree.
1,794 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen Raven:
“Nothin in the world more dangerous than a 2nd Lt. with a compass.”
Unless he’s got a map too.
KEEP THE FAITH AND DON’T BELIEVE THE MYTHOLOGY!!
well he has delusions of grandeur
Thanks fer that!
he’ll do what he’s told? Are there any qualifications for the thug nominee?
Thank you.
They are wasting their money. We need to keep far, far away from that.
A wise man once said that 80% of the vote is already decided, we’re fighting over the remaining 20%. I’m on our side, but I DON’T like to see McBushs service record mocked. Imagine how it looks to the people who haven’t made up their minds.
Why’d it work on Kerry and yet won’t work on McBush? Because the sb’s attacked the part of his war record that Kerry ran upon. To have the same effect on McBush, you’d have to show he didn’t behave the hero while a POW.
Boxturtle (Somebody has to be the worse pilot to pass. Next year, someone else was the worst)
was it mebbe this guy?
btw that Moon video was just, well, — I have no words.
They also attacked his VVAW statement by taking it totally out of context.
WASHINGTON (CNN) — A company accused of supplying corroded and decades-old Chinese ammunition to the Afghan Army and police has been suspended by the U.S. government for violating its contract, according to U.S. Army documents obtained by CNN.
Miami Beach, Florida-based AEY Inc. is under criminal investigation by the government for allegedly misrepresenting what the company was providing the Afghan security forces.
Under the contract, AEY said it would supply ammunition manufactured in Hungary. But an investigation by the Army found most of the bullets were made in China, a violation of the contract, according to the documents.
U.S. regulations bar companies from purchasing weapons or ammunition from a Chinese military company directly or indirectly, according to U.S. military officials.
The Cadet part was…embarrassing on top of it.
He is a Fortunate Son, and that is all she wrote..the whole shebang…I repeat…
Just like Bush43, just like Kristol, just like Kagan. He has always been “connected”…
I take nothing away…nothing…nothing..from his terrible suffering as a POW…nothing…but, it doesn’t make him “qualified” to be the President. The man is a loose cannon…he’s not “qualified”.
He is not “qualified”.
1,794 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen Raven:
“…the most effective thing the SB vets did was the campaign by the former POW’s.”
Right, that’s why we don’t make this about service and veterans but about “old” and “new”…McCrazy’s time has come and gone, his temperment is an issue and the generals on our side ken kick his ass around on military tactics. McCrazy is not a threat unless the Dems try and fight this on his ground…and why would we, his ground has a Vietnamese flag over it.
KEEP THE FAITH AND KEEP YER EYES ON THE PRIZE , TIME TA LEAVE THE PAST BEHIND!!
Has anyone on this blog EVER said he was?
KO time
No. Just venting…the media is constantly “qualifying” him mainly because of his military record…
An excellent song, no matter how much I listen to it.
That is definitely a dangerous combination, Norske, I’ve bailed out numerous Looeys and Capn’s even… I swear you have to go in the opposite direction… Just like the Orwell-speak of this Maladministration…
Here’s the latest from the Beeb:
Hey Raven…
BTW, Raven have you seen this web site…
http://www.vietnamveteransagai…..mccain.htm
I agree he’s not qualified…heck, I question now if he should even be a Senator. And we can and should let him make that point for us: McBush could be our best spokesman this fall.
We need leave his service out of it other then to wonder loudly if he’s still fighting Viet Nam if HE brings it up.
Boxturtle (His political kneecap is his own big mouth. Let’s aim there)
Yea, it’s Sampley, he’s a shit eatin dog fucker of the lowest denomination.
Aha!
Exactly!
he needs to retire to his money and barbecue pit!!!!!!!
Maybe we should turn this around by saying McCain is OVERQUALIFIED for the presidency? Hey, might work.
What gets me about McCain is that he is a dim bulb, and not a very honest one either. People in Washington must have known this for decades but it is only now that the blogosphere has started taking a serious look at him that this is coming out. While the mainstream media still seem mostly on automatic pilot with the maverick, straightshooter schtik, the questions are building here and they are not going to be able to ignore them. He doesn’t know about the economy. He wants to stay in Iraq but has no understanding of the place (even less than the MSM). He wants to bomb Iran. He is owned by lobbyists. He was one of the Keating 5. He supports the use of torture. He blocked investigation into the Abramoff scandal by sitting on a huge store of documents. He portrayed himself as the big reformer of campaign finance and then ignored the rules the first time they restricted his fundraising. And lets not forget his first marriage for the family values folks. Or how he has waffled on tax cuts, immigration, the war in Iraq, torture, abortion, and the religious Right.
This is what we need to keep hammering on. We don’t need to swiftboat this guy. All we need to do is tell the truth.
McCain has about as many qualifications to be prez as it takes to push a grocery cart and sleep under the overpass. Those who are diehard wingnuts and of weak mind are not persuaded by lack of qualification. They will bow to Mccain and whisper how fine his clothes are as he parades before them naked.
The floods can submerge the first floor of their home, they will send their one and only child to die for the terror-cause, pay $10.00 a gallon for gas, lose their teeth for lack of dental care but they will vote, damn it, for the Repugs. The only people they fear and need to destroy are those terrible liberals. They are the cause of all ills.
Qualifications is a rational postulation. There is nothing rational in most people’s voting preference.
Be sure to drum up some hysteria here.
You have summarized McCain’s attributes very well.
I just read on think progress seigleman is going to be released
man, this case was getting to me
The media are a bunch of chickensh*ts…and they are going to coronate McCain, because of his POW experience, because they won’t go there…just like the race problem, and just like the gender problem – they don’t want to say…
Being a POW does not qualify you to to be President. Who you are, and what your judgment is, and how you live your life, and how you view the world is what qualifies you.
Boy, you get on something like a gila monster.
We should not be talking about whether McCain’s POW experience “qualifies,” or entitles, him to be president.
We should be talking about all of the things that disqualify him from being president.
What Hugh said @ 96
I’ve got it:
Whoever throws the best BBQ for the media…wins.
End of story. Honestly, it is all about food and drink. D’Oh…everybody knows that the person that brings donuts to the office is the most popular. Rove – 101. There we have it…back to cocktail schmoozing parties and wienies. Vienna sausages on a stick, and a lot of booze.
That is what qualifies you.
Spit!
it’s amazing what a little sunshine can do.
LOL…I’m really pissed off.
I think it would be hysterical if we all started saying, “McCain doesn’t need the presidency. He’s way too qualified for that!”. Sometimes reverse psychology works. Sometimes it doesn’t. LOL
I think you are on to something. NeoCons call themselves and each other “brilliant”. I guess they think they are the Di Vinci’s of our times. LOL.
Becky Thatcher and the white picket fence.
They’re trying hard. But I don’t think anybody is listening anymore. The drop for Obama/Clinton in some polls is due to their actions, not MSM’s or McBush’s. See how the Wright story didn’t take off, even though MSM pushed it HARD?
Very true. But being a POW Hero will make a lot of the vital middle think you’ve got the strength & courage to lead. And it’s a loser to attack that. We need to show that our choice is the better leader. And we need to point out where McBush will lead us.
Boxturtle (Do you care how good the leader is if he’s leading you the wrong direction?)
Boxturtle
Have you ever been turned down for a menial job because you were overqualified? Remember the feeling? Well, it would kick McCain in the butt if after all this time of campaigning for the job, turns out, he’s too qualified and can’t get it. LOL!
And the older I got the more over-qualified I became ;)
1. They are not trying hard…they spend 24/7 discrediting Obama and HRC.
2. I disagree…attack that. Being a POW does not, “But being a POW Hero will make a lot of the vital middle think you’ve got the strength & courage to lead.” How can you “lead” when you are locked up? BS. That means that everyone in Gitmo is now “qualified” to lead something or some country…that is a big fat illusion. Sorry, nothing personal.
I would not concede that he is qualified in any way, shape or form.
Let’s talk about why our candidate is more qualified, and why McBush would be a big mistake.
Are you just looking for a fight? There was plenty of occasion for leadership in the POW camps. Damn, take a break.
A 527 campaign can Swiftboat McCain in the same way Kerry was barbequed. That article you linked to portrays McCain as a joking, jackass fortunate son, a poor student and a worse pilot. Hmmm, reminds me of someone.
KO citing “The surge didn’t work-gate” as one of the currently-running Bush administration scandals…
Righto. ;-)
It was also supposed to be the energy vortex of “Harmonic Convergence”. Lots of free thinkers there.
Bob in HI
(Flagstaff, AZ 1987-2004)
We have tens of thousands of qualified personnel that went through and is in the prison system. Maybe we can jutapose McCain’s image with their image to praise his qualifications. Especially with the ones you don’t want around your neighborhood. But, they are qualified.
http://www.reuters.com/article…..6320080328
Oh, I don’t take at all personally. And you’re correct at #1, the Wright story was a large part of the discredit Obama time.
As for #2, well, I’ve read McBush’s POW experiences. IF what I read is true, he showed tremendous courage and leadership under near death conditions. We do NOT want to go there. IMO, we’re best if we focus on what he’s said since he started running and what his plans are. I’m very comfortable going there.
Boxturtle (There are times when men of conscience will disagree – Tom Paine(?) )
TED SAMPLEY
In my discussion of the attacks on Senator John McCain, I rely on work published by Ms. Susan Katz Keating in her book Prisoners of Hope: Exploiting the POW-MIA Myth in America. Ms. Keating, while she was a reporter for the Washington Times, was convinced that live American POWs remained in Vietnam. As time went on and she became more and more acquainted with the issue, she discovered the facts of the charlatans who take advantage of MIA families and who flim-flam the public, as well as discovering that the US government could have done a better job of managing the issue.
The attacks on John McCain can be traced largely to the work of one man, Ted Sampley, of Kinston, NC. The following is a direct quote of the entire chapter about Sampley from Ms. Keating’s book; she titled the chapter “The Merry Prankster.” Below is the first page of the chapter in jpeg format — I want readers to see that I really do have the book. The remainder of the chapter is in text format; I did this because the chapter is thirteen pages long and I did not want to put thirteen jpeg files on my web server.
I think he’s the worst person for the job CONSIDERING his history. That said, my comment was in jest, with a tad of sarcasm, and wasn’t meant to be the next Political Strategy of the 21st Century. ;-)
No I am not. If anyone is, you are, because every time anyone says anything you don’t agree with your hackles go up. You chill out yourself. I’m addressing a situation which is that the media is annointing a person, and not looking at his weaknesses, because they don’t dare, and I have a right to say that. It is not personal to you. So Peace, but let me have my say, without you monitoring it. Ok?
Hmm, that makes me think of Clavell’s, ‘King Rat’, Raven.
But I agree completely with you and Norske. Too much baggage around POW
‘tack’, I think we’re wiser to allow McFlames to shoot himself out of the sky, which he’s has the ammunition and instinct to do.
At least McCain served his time, in more ways than one. The Chimperor couldn’t be bothered.
Bob in HI
Or maybe we should follow the life of a POW we captured over the past five or six years to see what he or she has done with their life. Could be an indicator of what we’ll see if McCain gets in office.
(Just kidding here Raven! Take a deep breath. *showing you breathing exercises & putting on my hockey suit*)
By my count, McCain wrecked nine airplanes – one plane in Pensacola, one plane en route to a ball game, six planes on an aircraft carrier and the last one that wasn’t necessarily his fault. 20 hours of combat and 28 medals. Not bad for an admiral’s son. /s
Of course he did. He is a hero, by any measurement of what he endured. I just don’t make the jump that it “qualifies” him in particular to lead the world…that is where I’m coming from.
It’s a “discussion board” if you don’t want your comments commented on, don’t make them.
you know, this belongs downstairs I guess but it’s really important
rachael maddow reported on an 18 year old that set up a “defense company” and they landed millions of dollars for trading 40 year old ammo from china and sending this crap to our troops
talk about privatizing failure, this is the epitome
I wish I could provide a link but I can’t find one
I think the story in at Huff Post.
I have no problem with you disagreeing or commenting on what I say at all. I respect you totally, sometimes you get personal, and that is what I’m saying. And I’m not a “chickenshit”…like you told me once before.
So there :P
Mr. Bush was content to drink and drive his first forty years. Even when sober, he just went along for the ride as a bidnessman, governator and el Presidente (Cheney took his keys on day one and has never let him drive alone).
McBush, a hot shot looking for a target, has always been more active. He may be equally flawed, but he has more energy and experience, more axes to grind and debts to pay, more manhood to prove. If not via his little blue pills, then via his DOJ, his gun turrets, his “Go Cheney yourself!” superiority and temper.
He is not the man to put in the Oval Office; he is the one to keep as far away from it as possible.
My understanding was he sold the ammo to our Afghan allies.
Wasn’t this in the news box earlier today?
Perris, here’s the link on the story:
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpoi…..ad_304.php
It’s not surprising considering Jenna Bush’s ex-boyfriend at the age of 22 was given a high position at NASA (or part of it can’t remember at the moment). Age doesn’t matter to the Bushies….Evangelicalism does! Just an observation…
Perris, here’s an excellent rundown on it…
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpoi…..ad_304.php
Dang, I owe ya a Coke, Kay! 8-)
Here’s a great article, 5 Things you need to know about the Iraq situation:
http://www.alternet.org/waroni…..age=entire
And I got personal when? The statement about the possibility of leadership in confinement being bullshit is, in my opinion, totally uninformed. I doubt if I ever called you a chickenshit but I might have said that something you said was chickenshit. Screw it, I’ll just watch the second half.
Thanks! yesterday, I couldn’t name even ONE smart thing that Cheney has done. :-)
Boxturtle (Sorry, couldn’t resist)
LOL Is there an echo in here? ;-)
Maybe these guys were vetted by Mr. Ol’ 60 Grit, like the kids sent to run the Green Zone…
Aww, Raven, don’t lurk! I did a little more research and I agree that Ted is a scumbag, he did assail Kerry too…!
forgive the OT
but pups might be interested in PBS’ series on race and health:
Unnatural Causes: Is Inequality Making Us Sick?
Do We All Have An Equal Chance for Health
you’ll have to check your local listings tho.
Thanks for the link. Iraq is out of hand and this morning in a speech Bush says everything is honky-dory. We are successful. Here is a short paragraph from the Reuters report:
He never mentioned this detail. I note that the Iraqis are mustering more support in their demonstrations than are US citizens in their war protests.
Raven, to be fair to you, can you tell us why McCain’s military service and his time as a POW qualifies him to be president?
I’ll go in the dungeon with another persona non grata.
I’d appreciate it if you’d just state what you think about “what” I say, and not tell me to “take a break” or “do I want to fight”….that’s what I’m saying…and you did call me a “chickenshit” ! *G*…I’m not your enemy, and I’m not totally “uninformed”. My point is that when someone is held prisoner, as awful and unimaginable as that is, it does not make you a “leader” even if you endured torture. It doesn’t. That is just my opinion.
Peace.
Jesus Christ on a Kiddy Car, I never ever said anything like that. . .ever.
‘Tis not so much what we think which is at issue, but the ‘romance’, the ’story’ which culturally is too deeply ingrained, as Norske said, McShame, has got Nam all over his jammies and the publick, bless their little hearts, need to be weaned from that long-playing, endless narrative by current day reality. Anything that tarnishes the shine on Ole John’s mettle plays right to that meme …
Of course being a POW is not of itself worth much, in truth, but lots of license plates proudly proclaim the fact, whether for sympathy or respect perplexes yet.
I would acknowledge such a fact had fate so treated me, but I’m not certain I’d be bragging about it.
I don’t think any of us Vietnam era folks have much to brag about. A lot to own up to, and a lot of baggage to carry …
Good. So we can all agree that it does not qualify him, and move on.
Jeebus, you could be right! Maybe this is why things are so screwed up over there! Wouldn’t surprise me. *shaking head*
Did you watch Bush’s speech in Ohio today at the Air Force museum? During the speech Bush bragged about how there was a 5K race in Baghdad recently. I laughed and thought to myself, “Yeah, it was the Sunnis, the Shiites, and the Americans chasing each other for miles!”. LOL
Xaiver 50 WVU 47, 10:56 to go
Oh.
No, you have never said that. It was me, I asked the question.
I’d linked to a Wapoo article about Shrub praising Maliki’s courage earlier at 16… What a travesty, and, it is sad we aren’t as vocal as the Iraqis…! 8-(
So…here’s another question. Does anybody think that there were POW’s left in Vietnam that McCain did not want to find??? Does anybody think that the government did not fully pursue the search for those left behind? Is any of that true?
You may be refering to what I posted. I said that in the eyes of the vital middle, his POW experiences are seen as strength and courage under fire. Which I hope you agree is good for a president to have.
We need to make sure he doesn’t wrap himself in it. Make him discuss the issues, that’s what will kill him.
Boxturtle (And for the record, I feel he’s even less qualified for the oval office than it’s current occupant)
Careful, that will get you moderated…! Bwhahaha… 8-P
Yea, as if Christy isn’t watching her eers.
We’ve got to come up with a different acronym for main-stream-media. The best I came up with is too lame to share. :~(
How bout the left wing press, that’s what half the goddamn country calls it.
I agree strength and courage is good to have, but does having a person who has gone through that kind of trauma in his life and can have a flashback at any moment the kind of person we want running our nation? Personally, I don’t. Honestly, torture is not good for anyone and I don’t care who it is and what situation it has happened under(a woman being raped/brutally raped is torture too). No amount of therapy can correct the pain. They can learn ways to deal with it, but the images and the trauma is always there.
Anyways, I agree with you that the issues should be our only focus when it comes to him. But! The POW history is a big one and will always be around.
Who won the Tar Heel/Wazoo matchup?
Carolina up by 20 w 9 to go
Do you all know that Siegelman’s been released? MSNBC
It is not the uniform that was worn, but what wore it… there is no
religious or military requirement for the presidency, a couple of good
ones had no service records, Lincoln and FDR were CIC in circumstances
as difficult as any and gave good account of themselves. This whole
military image is a holdover from Reagan of the Culver City Commandoes
snapping salutes, which is against military protocol, just an image
rolled out by the repugs to claim superior patriotism.
Do you all know that Siegelman’s been released? MSNBC
Dan Abrams is taking credit.
Always a fast learner, Mr. Clinton had much improved his salute by today, finally giving it the stiff-wristed snap at the end that puts it nearly on a par with the one Ronald Reagan polished as a celluloid warrior.
But even as Mr. Clinton perfected this military greeting, some of his top advisers were fretting that he shouldnot be saluting at all. They pointed out that, until President Reagan made it a practice, protocol dictated that the troops salute Presidents but that Presidents not salute back. Dwight D. Eisenhower, they said, never saluted back, and he should have known.
Hoop em Horns…
The president has no uniform, so he can never salute… anyone out of
uniform cannot salute. As for Clinton, well what would he know except
imitate “daddy”… guy makes me puke.
That was a great article, and the companion one it referenced at the end about the Bush administration believing it’s own propaganda. I’ve felt all along for a few years that al Sadr was going to emerge as the main player in Iraq. He has to make his move sometime, but I wonder what effect the coming provincial elections has on whether he makes his move now or later after the elections.
I just pulled that down of the NYT database, it’s from some long forgotten trip to Normandy.
Good catch, that Reagan thing is like a virus and is soooo Hollywood.
Hell, even the real Elvis would have known better!
That Presidential saluting business always bugged me. Any fool knows this, which explains how I came into possession of this knowledge…
I resemble that remark!
He has to make it now, or he will will marginalized. That’s the reason stated in the article, the puppet gov. is wanting to win to partition the country & enact the oil law.
Hi again. I know, I’m always late to the party/post, and therefore irrelevant. but i DO show up, and believe you me!, i’m all over important CSpan senate/house goings on. Thanks for putting up with all that, FDL folk…..OOOOOPS, pups.
and i’m off topic again, and I apologize, but must say one thing:
The post re McSame’s campaign violations and Jane dropping off the papers of COMPLAINT! did you SEE that rag tattered “thing” in the FEC window????!!! WHAT A HUGE AND IMPORTANT thing to do!
and there’s this, sorry, BUT doesn’t she look great in the short “do”???? i know, i know. we’re all not into the looks thing, and God and Patriot alike know that there’s more going on inside that head than whatever coif goes on outside. BUT ISN’T SHE JUST SO CUTE!??!
NOW, on topic,
I have a hard time believing McSame is WORSE than Cheney, and it was Cheney who ran this administration; Bush being the perfect asshole from the WAY WAY BACK MACHINE-UPPER CRUST, belligerent, self centered, ALLL FOR THE rrrrriche, psychopathic power mongering, TOXIC to all life, silver spooned never held responsible for anything anywhere, stupid to point of being ultra manipulatativ-able, Cheney wet dream of an upfront guy/pResident. EVAH!
so, IMHO, that McSame is worse than all the above, is likely true in that McSame will only serve to CONTINUE what has been done to America. Not that he’s worse to begin with, but that he’s worse FOR America cause he’ll STAY THE COURSE.
but that’s just a humble O, and Jane!
Your hair is just darling, dah’lin!
Promise: next time I’ll truly to endeavor to be just as opinionated and NOT so irrelevant with the “looks” thang.
thank you, (as I say to my email lists to whom I pass on petitions, FDL actions, MoveOn actions and a BUNCH of other actions, and petitions and phone no.s and etc. ad infinitum)
for putting up with me. ONE OF THESE DAYS, I promise, I’ll be relevant here.
u r tooooooooo kind.