Yesterday, Senator Clinton again echoed McCain’s claim that he is qualified to be Commander in Chief, adding her own qualifications to be on the same stage but implying Senator Obama did not belong there. TPM has the video:
“I think that since we now know Sen. McCain will be the nominee for the Republican Party, national security will be front and center in this election. We all know that. And I think it’s imperative that each of us be able to demonstrate we can cross the commander-in-chief threshold,”. . .
“I believe that I’ve done that. Certainly, Sen. McCain has done that and you’ll have to ask Sen. Obama with respect to his candidacy,” she said.
Should we conclude that the Clinton campaign believes their best strategy for capturing the nomination is to convince the superdelegates/party leaders they must choose her because she’s prepared to make it impossible for Senator Obama to beat John McCain?
In the meantime, any candidate who touts their foreign policy experience should explain what role, if any, their "experience" played in creating the conditions in which this is still an almost daily occurence:
BAGHDAD — Two bombings killed at least 54 people and wounded 123 more in a bustling shopping district in the heart of Baghdad on Thursday evening, Iraqi authorities said.
The attack, in the Karrada neighborhood, was the worst the capital has seen since early February, when bombings killed almost 100 people at two Baghdad pet markets, and reinforced fears that insurgents can still carry out devastating bombings in well-guarded areas despite reduced levels of violence in recent months.
According to witnesses, the attackers used an old tactic to maximize the casualties: detonating one bomb and then using a second blast to kill unsuspecting passers-by who rush to the scene to aid the victims of the first explosion.
Thursday’s initial explosion sent shards of glass, shrapnel, blood and flesh across a radius of 50 yards. People rushed to the scene to tend to the wounded. Then, minutes later, a man wearing an explosive vest ran into in the crowd and blew himself up, killing many more people.
And here are additional questions I’d like our Democratic candidates to answer:
1. Given that the Bush/Cheney regime has been the most lawless and destructive of Constitutional safeguards in our lifetimes, what do you intend to do to bring those who flouted the law to justice? If nothing, how do you expect to restore respect for the Constitution and the rule of law and restore confidence in the Department of Justice?
2. On repeated occasions, far too many Democrats have voted in Congress to enable or immunize lawless actions by the Bush/Cheney regime. What would you do as President to restore respect for the Constitution within your own party?
3. The country has been deliberately and cynically divided by Republican rule. The right wing has poisoned the political climate, compromised the media’s journalistic integrity, and through incompetence and corruption, undermined government’s ability to function in the public interest. What do you plan to do between now and next January to reunite the country, to return effective governance in the public interest, to fashion a movement strong enough to overcome the continued efforts to divide the country, and to marshal the forces necessary to enact and implement meaningful changes at the federal level?
4. How will you mobilize the country to deal with the necessary and massive transformations it faces if we are to solve issues of (e.g.) universal health care, economic insecurity, global climate change and alternative energy development?
5. With those goals in mind, how do you intend to conduct yourself during the campaign, and how do you propose to treat your fellow Democratic opponent? How will you use the campaign to build and unite the party and the country? Update: E.g., how do we avoid having things like this happen?
6. How do you intend to pay for the cost of the Iraq and Afghanistan invasions and prepare the country to fund the public investments you think vital to our economic interests?
7. How do you propose to change the attitudes and mindset that led us into aggressive wars?
The country is pleading for serious leadership, but you’re not answering these questions, and no one has earned my vote yet. How about some answers to real questions, which I suspect are on the minds of millions of Americans, before ever answering another absurd question from the likes to Tim Russert. Surprise me.
Related posts:
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- GRITtv Live: Wangari Maathai – The Politics of Global Climate Change
- Obama, in OFA Webcast, Urges Unity for “Least” of Health Care Bills
- Health Care: HELP Bill Released During Public Option Call With Sens. Dodd, Brown and Whitehouse
- Clinton Talks Positively About Snowe’s Trigger
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Wow scarecrow, I had just, I mean JUST complained about Hillary saying that in the last thread!
Maybe Hillary thinks Lieberman would be a good VP to run with? Shit, how about a Clinton/McCain ticket, he seems to be her favorite candidate!
GREAT POST…thank you
IMAGINE IF the MSM asked the candidates real questions….I know…..I need a reality check!
Scarecrow, excellent post! I can’t believe Clinton thinks her new approach is a winning strategy for anyone but McCain. What the fuck is she doing. I’m at almost at the point where I won’t even vote for her no matter what and I never thought it would come to that.
That’s me. I had been defending her and giving her the benefit of the doubt until I saw those clips last night. In my lifetime of experience (a few years longer than hers), I’ve never seen such a self-interested betrayal since reading about Aaron Burr challenging Thomas Jefferson for the presidency.
If Clinton is nominated, Dems lose in November. It’s that simple.
The only threshold that Hillary has crossed is the one that enters a pigs sty.
Senator Obama has made some nice comments regarding some of these issues in speeches, but the press has zero interest in these things, so it is never mentioned. The press behavior encourages the campaigns to talk about horse race issues. Reading the candidates’ issue pages at their websites is about the only way to get this information.
I did some more of myown research after the discussion yesterday (hat tip to Sadlyyes). Hillary is a hawk and Bush’s move to remove Admiral Fellon because he stands in the way of attacking Iran should raise flags for most people.
I think you’re giving her too much credit, Scarecrow. People really are sick of war and sick of the goings on in DC. And definitely don’t want to get dragged into yet another war with Iran.
Jane and Christy have done an excellent job trying to keep the focus of this blog on issues and I wish that our candidates would do the same.
Scarecrow, the questions are brilliant. Far beyond the MSM’s insight and intellect.
I guess the question is whether WE will do anything to maybe insure a more favorable supreme court by electing Hillary. I remain unconvinced that she actually appoint anyone any better than McCain would.
cawCAW Scarecrow!
Good Morning Scarecrow,
Should we conclude that the Clinton campaign believes their best strategy for capturing the nomination is to convince the superdelegates/party leaders they must choose her because she’s prepared to make it impossible for Senator Obama to beat John McCain?
was very close to this conclusion myself last night
I would have argued with you yesterday, but not today.
enshure
THANK YOU. I respect Christy’s argument that it’s all about the Supreme Court. But I have absolutely no faith that Hillary would help us in this regard, or fight with the Senate to help confirm a candidate we could live with.
Excellent, Scarecrow. The Timmeh’s and Tweety’s are all concerned about the process. I don’t think we can get responsible answers to anything right now because the whole MSM is focused on the heavyweight battle/horserace/pick yer silly sports faux manly-man metaphor right here, folks. We need responsible questions, too. And questioners!
That said, I really think the current Hillary team tactics which have been ratcheting up of late are going to backfire on them. People are fed up with that stuff. One thing nobody that I know of ever mentioned in the 2000 election. Was it really “Gore’s to lose”? What role did people being “fed up” with the Clintonistas back then as they are fed up now with neocon BushCo have to play in turning off enough voters to cost Gore the election? I dunno…just asking. But certainly that’s an under-the-radar factor… or why else would we be talking tiein’ McCain so cozy to Bush?
Prairie Today: The Worst Way
And Scarecrow, thank you for these questions. Obviously, if Jane is sitting in on Clinton conference calls, she might have a chance to ask a few there. Then, we need to find a mole to ask them of Obama as well. Fair is fair.
The POO has been flung from the top and it’s affecting the Democratic Party.
I think she has more arguments than that.
I fear you may be right. I’ve said from the start that Sen. Clinton was unelectable, because she’s red meat to the lizard brains on the other side and will rally their base base (by which I mean their base is base). Now she seems to be doing everything in her power to alienate us too. I cannot recall any election in the past where this tactic has been used — can anyone else?
I like this one.
I’d really like to hear some answers to it. Especially as the House prepares to
cave ontake up the FISA bill this week.I know she does, but that’s the only one that can penetrate my complete antipathy towards Hillary. From the beginning, my reasoning has been a bit different–I’m a “no dynasty, no monarchy” gal. That’s not my country.
Crow,
Great questions and as the late Freddie Mercury sang” keep getting louder and louder.” My prediction- the coming Iran war will be the last war this country starts.
I saw the news, http://weblogs.chicagotribune……nderi.html
I can not believe it!!!1
I don’t think we matter, Marion. We’re the Constitutional democrats–the populist democrats–that the DLC seems to find disgusting.
Al Olbermann remarked, whatever that threshold is, Laura Bush must have crossed it too.
Helluva post, and great questions all.
Sadly, Sen. Clinton has already answered question #5 and it ain’t pretty.
I think with respect to the Constitution, we’ve got a better chance of pasting it back together with someone who has taught Constitutional Law for ten years.
The rest of this comes from EPU land:
I’ve lost much respect for her as a candidate. For all the talk of momentum after last Tuesday, these comments clearly reflect the fact that they know “the math” is still against them.
So, the approach becomes “McCain & I” are the Very Serious Candidates and junior here just made a speech. This is for the benefit of the superdelegates , because she can’t win unless they go against the popular vote & pledged delegates.
She is risking the Clinton legacy with this approach, and I don’t think it’s gonna work. All she is succeeding at is alienating Democratic voters. There’s not a chance in hell the pledged delegates will flip, and the supers aren’t going to give her this election if she remains behind.
McCain has long since crossed the threshold away from acceptability as commander-in-chief and with this remark so did Hillary Clinton. One dimension of that threshold has to do with knowing when a war is utterly unnecessary and wrong and when it is not. Another is knowing who knows that and who does not, lest one as President put such a person in charge of the DoD or the military itself.
Superb post, Scarecrow! I have lost a lot of my initial enthusiasm in the last few days after seeing how some people are willing to play the game. I guess the upside is that we have at least a veneer of civilization, so they can’t adopt the tactics which they would actually prefer, the type commonly employed in, oh, Zimbabwe…
It’s a shame that neither candidate will deign to answer these questions.
Al Olbermann remarked, whatever that threshold is, Laura Bush must have crossed it too.
Ooooh! We could have a Reagan/Bush ticket! Nancy Reagan and Laura Bush!
HRC crossed the “Lieberman line” by endorsing McCain over Obama. As much as I’ve hated what the republicans have done, I will not vote for her should she be nominated. If there are any super delegates reading this site, you can be assured that I am not alone in feeling this way. I expect the Democratic party to nominate a Democrat. By endorsing McCain, HRC shows me that she is not a Democrat. I actually kind of liked her up until a couple of weeks ago, now I am beginning to understand the visceral hatred she aroused in so many people over the years.
my comments just disappeared into the toobz…Mods?
“It’s a shame that neither candidate will deign to answer these questions.”
The bigger problem is they don’t get asked.
My wife is now glad she did not vote for Clinton (edwards) and is thinking of witholding support if Clinton ”wins”. I am not sure but we will likely each donate to Obama on Wednesday.
This is outta line but I have to find out – if it plays out as expected and there is a reverse FLA 2000 or super delegates swing the popular vote I have to imagine many African Americans are going to be thinking its 3/5ths all over no? I already know what I will feel with the fear tactics and kitchen sink.
my comments were about Hillary-Obama…ticket.
I wish both Senators would go to the Senate and make news there. They have power right now. Not destroy each other.
GHWB came out and backed McCain a couple of weeks ago. I thought it was extremely odd how he stated that did not mean for Huckabee to drop out of the race. I have never heard such an odd endorsement before.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02…..ref=slogin
Then I read Rush was telling his audience to vote for Hillary. I surfed the web yesterday and yes, many Repub’s were proudly stating they and members of their families voted for Hill. Now I see that even Bush’s dad and McCain himself were in on the unscruppleness of keeping the Rep’s in the primaries of the states TX, Ohio, Rhode Island and Vermont for the sole reason of Repubs crossing over and voting for Hill because they think it would be easier to beat her than Obama. McCain was so far ahead of Huckabee that I wondered why he stayed in the race. I am outraged at the Republican’s dishonest and immoral behavior.
Why in the world do they still have open primaries? We get the nominee that the other side choses for us? That is disqusting. They are so devious. I only recently started following primaries but does both parties pull this crap?
Prior to yesterday, I wouldn’t have stooped to this, but there may be a host of unknown women who crossed the line. She’s the one who brought it up and the Republicans won’t ignore it.
Thanks scarecrow. I’ll support the Democratic nominee, but Hillary just made that more of a chore than it already was. I’m really glad you emphasized that we really can’t afford to occupy two foreign countries.
She’s making a naked grab to Reagan Democrats.
You might want to consider adding a question about how the U.S. is “safer,” after spending two-trillion to make Iran the dominant power in the Middle East. I missed where that was in our national interest.
Hillary and most of the Vichy Dems act as though we really are “safer,” because we destroyed the Sunni counterweight to Iraninan expansion. Not only is there zero evidence to support that, there’s tons of evidence that we’ve demolished moderates throughout the Middle East. Bush/Cheney/McCain has made the Middle East a lot more of a breeding ground for violence than it was before we invaded.
Why in the world do they still have open primaries?
Parties do that in order to grow the party. I don’t like them, and I’m happy that my state (PA) is closed. People have to register by March 24th as a Dem to vote for a Dem on April 22nd.
Good morning. To be clear, I’m not making an argument for/against either candidate. I don’t assume either would make better/worse choices for the Supreme Court — I simply don’t believe that. Nor do I assume either is significantly more/less “progressive” than the other. The voting records don’t really seem to support that one way or another.
The point here is that the campaign will degenerate into destructive territory unless the public pushes them back towards more responsible directions. I believe they’re both more capable of being better, and I want to encourage that. And, it just so happens, they really do need to be thinking about these questions.
Oh, and if Timmeh reads this, too? Saright.
I don’t see anything in moderation or Teh Spam Filter™ from you. Try resubmitting it.
Up until a few weeks ago, both candidates were doing a fairly decent job of talking about issues. But one candidate fell behind in the delegate race and started destructive name-calling, IMHO. If the other candidate ignores that, the press will jump on that candidate for not responding.
we don’t matter or figure in to the current bs, HRC campaign does not have the numbers, all they do have is Superdelegates and a weak ass prayer about MI and FL –
and oh please, even if they answered Scarecrow’s most excellent questions. Corp Media would report
Prickly Dems Lash Out, Erode Voter Confidence
Timmeh does have a page for suggesting questions.
Let’s submit a few
He’s looking forward to hearing from us. :)
I am not sure that anything else is needed in order to decide who the dem candidate should be after Hillary has stated that only she and the gooper candidate are qualified to be pres.
She is simply clarifying the simple fact that she is a gooper lite!
In addition, she has demonstrated her illingness to employ any means in order to win the presidency including a willingness to destroy the Democratic Party.
For those who think we don’t matter, I think that’s a mistake. We do matter. Collectively we are strong, and we matter. It is time for us to speak and speak loudly and often.
I’ve seeing a lot of defeatism in the blogs/progressive media lately. We’re discourage. Time to get off our butts, and start kicking a few.
Probably should check on my meds. Oh, I don’t take any!
The scorned Mrs. Clinton and her handlers are disgraceful…to put it nicely. They feel entitled to this nomination, and will do or say anything to that end.
She and McBatshitCrazySaint share many similarities, and that fact is now coming to light much to the chagrin of the Democratic Party and moreso to the average U.S. citizen.
This isn’t snark. I really feel for Sen. Clinton supporters.
She’s taken a historic candidacy and trashed it all in one fell swoop.
Just read the comments from them here and elsewhere. People have moved from active support to not voting for her even if she wins the nomination.
I’m for Sen. Obama, but I don’t take any joy in this.
It’s entirely too damaging for the Democratic Party.
I do believe her campaign is in a mode of doing whatever they think is necessary for the moment, and they’ll face the consequences when they get to them, even if they destroy the party. It’s time for the super delegates to put the HRC campaign out of its misery.
I’d like to see that ad on youtube. They already had an add that showed McCain as liberal as Clinton, now our side needs an ad showing how she has crossed over too.
Having said the above, I think the Clinton campaign has stepped in ‘it’ for the last time. Aligning herself with McSame will be her demise.
Today they announced the USNonfarm payroll data and we lost 63000 jobs and that’s on top of the 40000 jobs the government added and what will Hillary say.
You and I have been on opposite sides many times, Crosstimbers, but I couldn’t agree with you more on this.
I haven’t read much abt who Obama would appoint on the Supreme court. Any links out there abt this issue?
It’s also important to note that neither candidate has been forced to answer questions like these. We need to push them both, even though much of concern about a particular line of attack at this moment seems focused on Clinton. This could easily degenerate on both sides very quickly.
If we remember how DLC-candidate Harold Ford constantly trashed us during his campaign, I think that gives us a taste of where Senator Clinton’s campaign is coming from. I don’t think we can influence her rhetoric.
—-
What do you plan to do between now and next January to reunite the country, to return effective governance in the public interest, to fashion a movement strong enough to overcome the continued efforts to divide the country, and to marshal the forces necessary to enact and implement meaningful changes at the federal level?
—-
At this point, I’m more concerned about how to unite Democratic supporters after a presidential nominee is selected. As the campaigns slide into negative territory (thanks a lot Senator Clinton), there may be irreparable damage being done to party cohesion. This is what happens when you focus on winning the battle and not the war.
- Tom
I watched a super-delegate, Marcy Kaptur, explaining last night how she would vote for Hillary irregardless of how the popular vote went in her district. The rationale was that she had “been elected to do what was best for the people in her district” and that was what she was going to since HRC was better for the depressed industrial area in Ohio. She in her wisdom knew what was best for them, even if they didn’t. This kind of thinking really worries me.
Scarecrow,
It isn’t I think we don’t matter, was only referring to the current HRC gambit
discouraged ? not on your life. article the other day (Salon ?) reminding us all that Kerry was the exception not the rule in clinching by June
and oh, did I mention I now live in a town, county, State that went Blue by the millions ?
Went to MTP site to see if Sunday’s guest/s had been posted yet and saw this headline at the top of the page, Breaking News:
As long as the campaign is framed as who’s got the biggest c-in-c cojones, ain’t nothing gonna change.
War = manly-manness is not the issue.
War = a destroyed economy, destroyed families and lives is the issue.
Georgie and the neocons can tap dance all they want, but they have led us down the Soviet Union in Afghanistan road with Iraq as our Afghanistan. And look at how well that turned out.
Maybe after getting smacked down by Imus this week Russet will knock off the gotchas and get down to real.
Mrs. Clinton has crossed over the threshold into the looking-glass.
Because of limited funds, I was going to wait until the general election to donate for the democratic candidate. Although I always supported Obama, I just added a few dollars to the cause.
Hillary is pulling a Lieberman, going for Republican votes, or so it seems. It’s distasteful, to put it mildly. I believed come November I’d vote for the Democrat, even if it were Hillary, but now I’m not sure. IMHO Nader will do better against Hillary than Obama. It is depressing and demonstrates once again, that liberals need more a more powerful method of demonstrating than comments on blogs.
excellent, excellent post.
i od’ed on this primary a couple of months ago – but you make a very compelling case for not ignoring it.
and if we could just figure out how to hold our dem politicians accountable after they are elected…
“It’s also important to note that neither candidate has been forced to answer questions like these.”
I made that point @35.
“This could easily degenerate on both sides very quickly.”
Let’s stay focused on where it has degenerated very quickly.
On Sen. Clinton’s side.
If you want , you can contact the super delegates from Obama’s contact page.
http://my.barackobama.com/page/s/superdelstory
OK:
I’m beginning to see the possibility of an Hillary (P)-Obama (VP) ticket. The hell with an identity-politics ticket being stacked. If Hill-Obama can’t defeat a McCain-Joe-Lie ticket (or whomever St-John picks to be his running mate), then this country is in more trouble than I thought…
Those of us who donate time, money, writing letters, phone banks, campainging, canvassing, putting up signs, etc. for our party needs to write Hillary and Dean and let him know we are angry about her comments and may not put any time and effort in the election as campaign workers this fall.
Lot’s of places seem to be turning blue, as Attaturk’s post on the AP/Ipsos poll notes. So we’re likely to win — but it would be better to win with a strong mandate, cause we got a lot of really hard stuff to do, and we’ll get nothing but obstruction from the remaining Repubicans.
A mystery to me. clinton2 has pronounced herself ready willing and able to create a nuclear holocaust. She has at the same time described Obama as being not so capable of pushing the button. So if clinton2 has obama1 as VP and she croaks during the inauguration do we have to assume that that makes obama1 instantly able of creating nuclear holocaust? Maybe I am missing something… pixie dust?
Obama Adviser Says Clinton “A Monster”
Clinton has already flunked this test. Read Jonathan Alter’s piece in
Newsweek, do the math… she has already lost the nomination. All this
blather about supers and makeovers is nothing but an attempt to negate
the bottom up democratically selected candidate. That makes Clinton a
Neoconservative, unacceptable as a democrat on any national ticket. The
aptly named CNN has siezed upon this “can she win it” line out of a
pure profit motive… she lost the nomination and cannot “win” it, only
steal it from the party she uses as a host for her own mad ambition. If
that happens an entire generation of new Democrats will and should be
lost. Too bad, because a lot of down ticket democrats will not stand a
chance in the fall… Obama should run as an independent so we can get
on with the cleanup after the elephant parade and the kool-aid party.
I’ve been watching Nader too. Can’t stomach Hill.
I lost respect for him when he went “Republican Lite” in his Senate race.
His father was a much better Democrat as I remember it.
That would at least put an end to the circular firing squad that the Dems seem to form EVERY TIME THERE’S AN ELECTION. Although after all the trash she’s talked about Obama I can’t see him as being enthused by the idea…
TPM has her apology. It was an unfortunate statement but no where in the column did it praise John McCain.
There goes North Dakota. Perhaps, we can win with a 49 state strategy.
FWIW Samantha Power, won a Pulitzer in 2003 for “A Problem from Hell: America and the Age of Genocide.”
Perhaps it’s not trash talking. Perhaps it’s that Clinton triangulation.
It’s despicable, either way.
GREAT questions. Let’s spread them all over the Internet.
I’ve never been good at triangulation — I barely passed geometry in 9th grade!
The market has lost abt 1,000 pts since Jan.
The Bush tax cuts just keep on working….for Bush, his family, and his cronies. Yet, Bush escapes any responsibility. Great job by the MSM and the Democrats, especially Nancy and Harry.
an Hillary (P)-Obama (VP) ticket = pipe dream
Breaking from the NYTimes:
Really bad news. After I passed through US Immigration and Customs in Cincinnati last Tuesday, I exchanged 10 euros for—14 US dollars.
Pathetic…
I am not making excuses for Clinton. I am just questioning the competency of the Obama campaign staff. I mean, conceding the Monster vote to the opposition this early in the race is just plain sloppy.
Ohh I like that idea.
You’re right on this score…His response to inquiries about this has been cold at best. Hill is much more enamored (if i can use that term) about the idea of a ticket with him…
That idiot Amanda Carpenter from TownHall.com is on MSNBC now…and boytoy Rachel Sklar from Huff Post is also on…ha!
So Sen. Clinton praises McCain vs. Sen. Obama 3 or 4 times over the last few days (this from her own mouth, mind you!) and that equals a stupid comment an aide makes in Scotland.
Look, please get my point. It isn’t “Obama always great”, “HRC always bad.”
It’s that she has gone waaaay over the line by praising the nominee of the party that has screwed us royal for the last 7 plus years.
That can’t be tolerated. Period.
The comment the aide made in Scotland was stupid and uncalled for. And, BTW Sen. Obama’s campaign has rightfully apologized and distanced themselves from the remark.
OTOH, Sen. Clinton has repeated her unfortunate comparison of McCain vs. Obama in the press several times.
A weak comparison IMHO.
great post, scarecrow. right on.
Yes, and the stock market is just one symptom. Several stories in the last couple of days. The number of homeowners in negative equity — recored levels. The average equity is now below the break even point. That means on average homes is a net loser in wealth. As Ian explained in a post a few weeks back, much of our “wealth” is tied up in our homes, and they’re now worth less.
Great post, Scarecrow. I have to say, I don’t get what micro-target Penn has identified with this latest round, other than the continued courting of the Archie Bunker class perhaps? But if she ends up winning the primary, do they not understand that McCain’s people will simply turn right around and put her own speech footage in an ad for the general election?
Makes absolutely no long-term sense to me, let alone short-term branding (a la BT’s post from the other day).
Marion, you are right about the circular firing squad issue — really worries me, not so much for the presidential race, which will end up sorting itself out — because it always does. But for all those VERY important down-ticket races where the work really gets done for the rest of us. A President can set a tone or an overall agenda, but the real work is done at the state and local levels, and at the Congressional level in terms of reversing all this crap from the last few years. And if people lose the energy to work to get those folks elected because they get turned off by campaign bile? We are in a world of shit — because the GOP feeds off that, and they are counting on all of us to throw up our hands, walk away, and hand the election to them. Their pot-stirring from the outside is only going to get worse, as is the media’s, and we all need to resist getting bogged down in minutiae and missing that bigger picture.
Anyone else feeling the need for an election vacation? Or is it just me this morning?
TPM has the video of the Clinton comments, and I’ve substituted that link at the top of the post. Also added the Samantha Power’s apology link.
I know this will sound terrible, but Sen. Clinton is really starting to make me feel uncomfortable. Physically uncomfortable. Watching her praise McCain, and rip Obama, just ain’t cool. She’s the drunk at the bar ya’ just can’t seem to shake…and I should know, usually, I’m that drunk. Is anyone else feeling that way? I honestly don’t want to hear any more from her.
Um…I think twolf just found a news item and was trying to make a light funny about it. Let’s walk back the hair trigger a coupla steps…I didn’t see where he was excusing the Clinton behavior anywhere unless I missed a comment somewhere.
but that doesn’t qualify her to be a foreign policy advisor. like all the other Very Serious People, she sees the use of USA military power as a force for good. and she also is very good at convincing dems and liberals – which makes her doubly dangerous in my view.
good debate/discussion at democracy now! with jeremy scahill and samantha powers (there’s also an older debate/discussion/ of her with chomsky that i’m going to have to try to find)
Late arrival here. Hillary has now crossed a line for me. I was undecided til she started going negative. Then I started actively working for Obama. Now, I am not sure I’d vote for her if she got the nomination and I told my story (more colorfully) on Obama’s site where you can send an email to superdelegates.
Hopefully a candiate will address the issue of genocide.
What have you got against the way pigs live?
Markets just opened up and are down 120 already.
Not to excuse it — because it is a stupid, microtargeting clusterfuck of a comment for the long-term from the Clinton camp — but to put it in context: when JFK and LBG were at the height of their haggle at the convention to see who would be where on the ticket, LBJ sent one of his chief minions out to announce from the podium at the convention that JFK had Addington’s disease. While the selection process was ongoing behind the scenes.
We haven’t nearly gotten there yet — thank god — and let’s hope we don’t.
1,778 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen Scarecrow and the Firepup Freedom Fighters:
I am feelin’ particularly cranky taday after spendin’ the last 24 hours on major steroids for what was diagnosed as a major disc problem but is more likely a hip that will need replacement…so I ain’t takin’ prisoners anymore, no more “Mister Niceguy”. I have jest one thing to ask of those who have been dancin’ to the tune of “I will vote for either of them, the point is to beat McCain”…ARE YOU AWAKE YET???!!!
Mrs. Clinton is now, has been since birth and will forever be a self-interested, self-centered upper-middleclass corporatist. In fact she IS part of the “vast right-wing conspiracy” and has been since she figured out that the corporate fascists were gunna win and she sold her politics to Rupert Murdock for a $4 million contribution to the Clinton library and the endorsement of Cruella Ann Coulter and Pumpkin Limbaugh. The strategy now is to destroy Obama as a viable candidate on the “security” and “experience” issues and divert all attention and conversation from real issues especially the economy. If she doesn’t succeed in winning the nomination, she will have driven Obama’s negatives up high enough and forced Obama to Balkanize the Democratic Party so that there will never be another opportunity to put bring the progressive base of the party back to power.
I have been sayin’ this for two fuckin’ years…there is no “moderate, middle” in our politics now. When a radical authoritarian element takes power in a Democracy there is no longer a middle but an “us against them” or, better still “the people against the powerful”. Mrs. Clinton has taken the mask off and the face of fascism underneath is not very “friendly” when looked at from “the village”. Our sole hope is that Obama has the chops to unite us while not makin’ Clinton-McCain the only issue…Obama must show the poise and class that neither Mrs. Clinton or McCrazy have, he must call Clinton out on the war, her lack of experience, her record of right-wing postures and her divisive tactics and her racism…yes folks, we ken use that term ‘cuz she’s been doin’ it with savoir faire. Obama risks allowing Clinton to paint him as a “left-wing extremist” but that’s what’s gunna happen anyway…so he’s gunna hafta talk the talk AND walk the walk, take the gloves off and separate himself from ALL of Clinton’s positions on NAFAT, free trade, the Iraq war, and JOE LIBERMAN!!
This is it folks…the Witch from Wherever has pushed it this far…there is no middle ground here, she is tryin’ ta force enough of the “moderates” and “independents” that she’s been losin’ by the millions away from Obama by fear. We don’t like it, but it’s time to step up and get this man’s back…it’s the good guys against the bad guys.
KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE FUCKIN’ AMMUNITION OR OUR KIDS HAVE NO FUTURE!!
Good morning Christy. I guess my frustration comes from a sense we have this huge opportunity, and I’ll be sick if we blow it. We’ve got most/all the issues working for Dems; we’ve got massive rejection of Republicans and Bush looking for an outlet; we’ve got lots of enthusiasm from the candidates supporters, seeking to crash one or the other barrier; new people coming into the process — and we risk that by turning a lot of people off? We’ve got a massive job to do to reverse the last 7 years and start moving forwards, and our problems/challenges have not been this huge since WWII — We need a huge mandate. I want to wring their necks for jeopardizing this. Metaphorically speaking.
707!
Okay, following are my comments (including some damned typos and mispellings) sent via that method:
I am a life long Democrat who first voted for Lyndon Johnson in 1964. I believe the current election is one of the most critical in American history and there is massive work to be done in restoring the nation’s standing in the world, putting us on the road to economic recovery, correcting abuses of power, and restoring the constitutional separation of powers.
I believe the Democratic Party was blessed with a large number of well qualified candidates for the presidency and I felt any of several, including Senators Obama and Clinton, would make excellent candidates. As the primaries progressed, I contributed small amounts to both campaigns, because I did not wish money to be a factor limiting the ability of the candidates to express their views. When it evolved that I would have to make a decision in the Texas Primary, I saw very little difference in policy and was proud of both candidates. However, I felt it was time to put an end to the campaigns before party divisions resulted. Accordingly, I voted for Senator Obama because I felt he and his campaign demonstrated better organization and the hope of increasing the size and future success of the Democratic Party.
In the brief period since the Texas adn Ohio primaries, I have tended to defend the statements of Hillary Clinton against widespread criticism, because I have long admired both she and President Clinton and I wished to promote party unity. However, the recent statements by Senator Clinton, indicating her endorsement of Senator McCain’s crdientials over those of Senator Obama, represent an unprecidented betrayal of the trust placed in her by those who voted for her and of the Democratic Party. While it may be possible to repair the damage done to party unity, it is essential to begin at the earliest moment. Therefore, in the interest of the Democratic Party and the nation, I would ask Democratic superdelegates to announce their support of Senator Obama’s candidacy at this time.
Good show, Scarecrow!
Yep, I’m done with Hillary. More importantly, if she succeeds with her dirt and smear campaign, aka “the Kitchen Sink,” many Blacks will not go to the polls, unless they vote for Nader, same goes for the youth that Obama brought in, and people like me who have decided she is definitely not worthy. Without all these groups, she’s done. I would rather have Nader than Hillary at this point, but much as I dislike the whole idea of a McBush Presidency, it seems to me a Hill Presidency would be half a dozen of one and six of the other. I will not vote for her under any circumstances!
LBG?
Did JFK beat RBG’s brother, in addition to Johnson?
*g*
IMO Hillary could talk about her strengths without giving John McCain a hug along the way. That’s the threshold she crossed.
Bush has never been prepared, not since day one, not since day 2,555, or ever, for the job. He was a governor with a staff of 20 or something. He never had any prep for the job and he still can’t do it.
The argument seems ridiculous to me, I don’t know why she does it.
at least LBJ wasn’t sending someone out to lie.
Totally agree — the worst part of this is that surrogates for both campaigns have been flinging this shit back and forth at each other for a while, under the radar though. That it’s spilling over publicly now shows the level of anxiety as things head forward to PA.
That the Clinton camp is making errors this large says to me that Mark Penn’s been given too much free rein — I wish she would have fired his ass after Iowa, because his “common touch” sucks. And the “monster” smack back didn’t help with the few attempts that I know of to try and wratchet down the level of crap that a few folks have tried to make the last couple of days. It’s worth keeping in mind that the presidential election is only ONE part of this election cycle. And folks like Vic Wulsin and all of the rest of our Blue America candidates, who are wonderful folks — as well as all those local election folks — need us to focus there, because otherwise we’ll be stomaching the like of Mean Jean Schmidt for another two years and, frankly, I’ve had all I can stomach of that sort of member of Congress for a lifetime. SIGH
True — but it also was the same asinine “scorched earth” idiocy for the general. You’d think we would have learned a lesson or two since then, wouldn’t you? *g* (yeah, yeah, I know…politics…)
I’m trying to be cool, but it’s getting harder. I can’t fucking believe it, but I’m emotionally involved!! I never really cared before and now I’m living and dying with each primary. It’s starting to affect my mood!! You’re right, I need a vacation from this too.
I never could figure out why Gore picked Lieberman for VP spot. Any one else would have been better.
Christy, Do you have any ideas on how to get back on track? Hillary has only one way to win the primary at this point and that is to destroy Obama. Unfortunately, she could destroy the unity of the party with it. I feel powerless to prevent that.
Say what?
agree about the “scorched earth” idiocy.
Two words: federal courts. For me, that trumps everything else as I contemplate the long-term ramifications of more Federalist Society legalisms in place over several generations.
But YMMV on that one, I suppose. It’s a huge one for me, though…
I wish I did. I’ve been trying to find some way to articulate something useful — but it all ends up sounding like “Jeebus, people, grow the hell up!” And that’s not really very effective as a communication strategery with any campaign people. *g*
JFK did have Addington’s disease.
not saying what LBJ did was right (i happen to be of the mind that a poltician’s health is their own business, so long as they don’t lie about it)
Agree.
‘morning all – coffee is ready…
I don’t think Clinton will “destroy” Obama, nor him her… emotions are very high right now… hopefully all will take a step back from the edge.
Too much is at stake.
I personally would much prefer a Commander-in-Chief who was against perpetual warfare. In which case Obama has the best credentials.
That is a better idea than mine of an independent run, but do the supers
realize that the Clinton blitzkrieg must be broken before it destroys
the party? It is not the Clinton surrogates, it is Clinton herself that
is unfit for the responsibility of that office. She has already lost the
nomination, somebody break the news to her, intervention is what you
propose and it would be justified.
1,778 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen JPL9:
YOU ARE NOT POWERLESS! Please don’t give up now…that’s exactly what Clinton wants, to drive enough people out of the process so that even if she can’t win the nomination Obama will never be President. Stand up! Write letters to the Clinton camapign in your state, e-mail the Clinton campaign nationally, write letters to your local paper and donate to Obama. Mrs. Clinton has declared war but like many folks who have never experienced the real thing, she thinks that war is jest a word and that people don’t have the guts to stand up against it…let’s prove her wrong!
KEEP THE FAITH ANDPASS THE AMMUNITION AND DO IT FOR THE VILLAGE!!!
But, the thing is…with the new info on HRC, I *don’t* believe she would necessarily be an improvement over a Supreme Court choice by McSame…she’s leaning so far to the right right now that she’s nearly falling over…IMO, she would get a DINO justice in there.
JFK had Addisons Disease, which is a glandular disorder. Addingtons Disease is a cancerous condition of Constitutional democracies that can be only effectively be treated by measures such as prosecution under the rule of law and, as a final measure, impeachment. Unfortunately, the is as yet no Wikipedia entry for this condition.
clinton2’s praising of McBus and damning of obama only demonstrates her lack of experience.
I know that all this has been said; but I must express it because I am so angry. I have always admired her until now. But flattering a Republican opponent is traitorous in my book.
Hillary Clinton is an idiot. Hard to believe but she has stepped into the Bush Leagues. She has gone Rovian in her politics willing to do or say anything to win the nomination.
I do not believe that I have ever seen any candidate in history compliment her opposing party nominee while denigrating the competition in the same party. If she were to win the nomination it will be difficult for many Democrats to back her.
I doubt that her recent behavior will have the effect of driving the uncommitted delegates into Obama’s camp, but that is what should happen to any candidate that shows such party disloyalty.
Her insistence of what she will and will not accept for the resolution of the Fla. Michigan delegates is simply outrageous. She agreed to and was fine with the Democratic Committee’s decision until she found herself behind. Once she came off the fantasy of inevitability, suddenly all those rules were unfair. Notice that she never complained about caucuses prior to the beginning of the election, but has become highly critical after losing most of them.
The strangest thing is that she is shooting herself in the foot if she should ever become the nominee. Her statements about McCain will surely come back to bite her in a general election. Her references to Obama fans as being delusional will cost her literally thousands of Democratic votes. Oh, the young and black voters may not vote for McCain; but there is a very good chance that they will not vote for her. It’s like saying, ” If I can’t be the Democratic Nominee, I will make sure the Democrats lose.” At the same time, if she does become the nominee, she is assuring her own loss. The leaders of the party need to move against her fast; but I doubt that they will.
two words:
Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court, Supreme Court.
Peterr, That really was damn witty.
I think we could use some more laughs around here and in this campaign.
Sorry, when I read “LBJ didn’t lie” I jumped the gun. . . wonder why?
I take the Powers apology as a good sign – the Obama camp isn’t gonna rise to the bait – believed for a while now Lanny and Raspenntin are pushing it as it puts their opponent into the ‘politics as usual’ box
also like Chairman Dean’s firmness
I have been trying to stay objective & neutral about Clinton & Obama thinking either would be heads above any republican but the last few weeks of watching Hilary makes me very uneasy. I have gone from feeling apathetic about Hilary to uncomfortable & now I am just plain disgusted. If this is the real Hilary, I am not impressed to put it mildly.
LOL, thank you for the correction!
Scarecrow, to your earlier comment (sorry took so long–problems with the site saying I wasn’t logged in_–
It’s not that I don’t think *we* don’t matter…I think to the DINO’s in the DLC–their perception of us is that we don’t matter.
I am going to post your post on my blog to hopefully spread those excellent questions for everyone to start asking the candidates.
Hmmmm….What administration does this sound like?
“Based on guidance by Bill Clinton, federal archivists at Clinton’s library are preventing the public from seeing hundreds of pages of Clinton’s papers on the 140 pardons he issued in his last days – including his granting of clemency to fugitive millionaire Marc Rich. The decision has blocked USA Today’s Freedom of Information Act Request for information about White House pardon communications and pardon requests rejected by the Justice Department. (USA Today)
That’s 40.
Getting the super delegates to commit now is a hell of a good idea. How do we get lists of super delegates and innundate them with whatever we can innundate them with.
John Edwards was my nfirst choice but when dropped out I swung my vote to Sen Clinton based on many factors too many to enumerate. However her latest statements regarding McCain vs Sen Obama have me scratching my head. I agree with Scarecrow however that we need better answers to the voting public regarding the question posed. Too much nonsense about personality, religion and other crap that just doesn’t matter. We need the League of Women Voters back to the debates. Their questions were more spot on and less nonsensical. MSM is just infotainment, those debates, on both sides, were absolutely worthless.
As does cheney
yeah. i should have stipulated that this was a special case.
my apologies to raven and all who were affected by the lies of LBJ.
Message for HRC and the Big Dog, “one thing you can’t hide is when youre
crippled inside”.
Listening to the soundbytes I couldn’t help wondering if Clinton is angling for a McCainClinton ticket.
Either that or an America for Clinton party.
(btw, anyone else thing that Conneticut for Lieberman sounded like he considers it a possession , as opposed to Lieberman for Conneticut which implies public service – I get the same feeling from Clinton sometimes)
Thanks for the link. And the boss appreciates it.
Maybe we have..this this type of talk from Markos is getting disturbing…
“Civil War” resulting from the “wrong” result coming out of the Democratic Convention?
People are really starting to go off of the rails and it is not helping to defeat the Thugs.
Thanks Elliot
As stated repeatedly – I will campaign for and vote for the Democratic nominee.
Not at all, I should have read more carefully.
Addison’s Disease
Funny, I don’t see any outrage over Obama’s Foreign Affairs advisor (Samantha Power) calling Hillary Clinton a “MONSTER”. Appaarently that’s okay. Also, Susan Rice (another Obama advisor) brought this stuff up yesterday by claiming neither Obama not Clinton is “ready for that 3 AM phone call”. That is pretty unhelpful, also. Hillary states she is ready and she doesn’t know about Obama. They are in a tight race for the nomination, she is not obligated to do Obama’s campaigning for him.
Then to demonstrate that she is prepared to take on foreign policy, she released a comprehensive document outlining her policy concerning Afghanistanht NOQUARTER. I did not see any mention of this very important document here.
Maybe Obama can copy it and take out the stuff about women’s rights and call it his own.
I agree, but so far it was the only thing I could see to do. I missed your idea, but will go back and review. I was busy knitting tricolor caps and building a guillotine.
That was a gut reaction to Hillary saying she and McCain are the only ones capable of being president. And that Obama isn’t capable. And she didn’t plan to say it. It slipped out. And she apologized for it. And it didn’t come from Obama himself.
And do we have an apology from Clinton? Was it a slip? Hardly, as she keeps saying it over and over. Over and over, she keeps saying a Republican who has sold his soul (torture, e.g.) is a better candidate for president than her Democratic opponent. That’s destructive for the party and I, like many others who were previously undecided, have now switched to Obama as a result.
Chuckle
Yeah — I got that. Was reading something about Cheney this morning, and I’m afraid I had Addington on the brain. Multi-tasking not working so well for me today. *g*
Do read through the comments before going apoplectic, please. Start here…
As I noted early, I added a link to the unfortunate Powers’ comment. Check the post.
see snowbird42’s most excellent link at 69 above
always love your posts scarecrow and this one is no exception
My other thought about Clinton’s claim is this: Why is someone who is backing a disastrous Iraq and Iran strategy (McCain) in any way qualified from a security perspective. The republicans and JM especially, have been a national security disaster. Why isn’t this the theme instead! Since Edwards dropped out I’ve stayed out of things but I’m now backing Obama. Gawq!
707
I get the French Revolution reference, but let’s try and refrain from talking about “off with their heads” devices in the comments or anything close to it, shall we? Thanks!
Frustrated like everyone else with HRC! Is there anyone or anywhere that we could write a flood of letters to her campaign to express our rage with their tactics?
Excellent questions, Scarecrow. i must spotlight these!! or is digging the modern way?
You’re welcome!! And let me say I am so grateful for firedoglake and the rest of the progressive blogosphere for getting the info out there!
1,778 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen Steve-AR and the Firepup Freedom Fighters:
“‘Civil War’ resulting from the ‘wrong’ result coming out of the Democratic Convention? People are really starting to go off the rails…”
Yes, civil war, that’s how this all started in the first place in 1860…Jesus H. keeeRIST man, where the fuck have you been??!! We have been in in the same unstable political situation as the period from 1842-1859 since at least 1994 with a minority controllin’ the congress and the courts. In fact, the base of that minority is in the same geographic cluster as that of the Confederacy. We are in a war created by a minority, bankrupting the federal treasury, transferring tax money to corporations to create private mercenary armies, breaking the state militias and the standing army with the government spying on all the correspondence of United States citizens and you don’t think we’re in a bit a trouble here??!!! Get yer head out here where the sun shines!!
KEEP THE FAITH AND DON’T WHISTLE A HAPPY TUNE WHEN THEY COME FOR YA!!!
1,778 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND..
Citizen apishapa:
“Funny I don’t see any outrage over Obama’s foreign affairs advisor… calling Hillary Clinton a ‘MONSTER’…”
First off, that advisor apologized for a “slip of the tongue” but it now appears that the apology was premature. If you wanna support Mrs. Clinton taday for her support of John McCain for President go ahead but don’t try and divert attention by attackin’ Obama…that’s reall pretty “Clintonesque” don’tcha think?!!
Mrs. Clinton has clearly decided that she can’t win the nomination without splitting the Democratic Party and the country and she’s clever enough (I won’t ever again call her “smart”) ta know that she killed her chance to be President at the same time. That’s the definition of a “MONSTER” in my book…
KEEP THE FAITH AND DON’T TRY TO SUPPORT THE UNSUPPORTABLE!!!
my theory why gore picked lieberman – already the Republican moles in the Democratic party (DLC) were active in sabotage and pushed their man onto the ticket
It sure would be nice if those questions were answered in the primaries. Instead it’s all about extraneous stuff.
Scarecrow:
I think you hit it with this:
“Should we conclude that the Clinton campaign believes their best strategy for capturing the nomination is to convince the superdelegates/party leaders they must choose her because she’s prepared to make it impossible for Senator Obama to beat John McCain?”
I was taking the “red phone” campaign and its more explicit follow up of her McCain comments as appeals to the press and the superdelegates to understand they had to get in line behind the war, and therefore her candidacy. But I think your interpretation of it as a form of blackmail is better.
Mine, too. I think Brazile was forced on him, too.
I watched a super-delegate, Marcy Kaptur, explaining last night how she would vote for Hillary irregardless of how the popular vote went in her district. The rationale was that she had “been elected to do what was best for the people in her district” and that was what she was going to since HRC was better for the depressed industrial area in Ohio. She in her wisdom knew what was best for them, even if they didn’t. This kind of thinking really worries me.
———–
I saw that, Abrams really boxed her in without being rude.
Her entire argument was representative democracy (she being the all knowing elected leader) – but then finally admitted that she would not pledge to vote the way her district did.
She also totally had no response for if her role as a Super Delegate was in any way different than her role as Congress person. That is to say is it OK to back-room deal for OH in order to support one or the other candidates.
Made me sick to see yet another argument with a total lack of logic.
No…No….NO!
Obama has dibs on appointing Crazy Joey to SCOTUS.
It’s the bi-partisan way to go doncha know!
Looks like they grow the party for 1 day during primaries.
The bigger problem is they don’t get asked.
No, that’s just the MSM doing their control-the-process shtick.
It’s really up to the candidates to inform the electorate. If a candidate just lets the media control the questioning and areas of interest which are discussed it’s because the candidate is happy to do that and isn’t trying to lead the discussion or to really assist the electorate. It just shows they aren’t really leaders.
I think it’s great that Dems might pull those folks back to our side, so we can win. But, hasn’t it been Obama who has depended most on Independents and Republicans to get this far? I don’t think you can take those votes and then complain that Hillary is doing something unseemly.
Frankly I’m happy to see a candidate scrap for every vote possible. I only wish she had fought Obama last summer and fall when it mattered much more.
Edwards rightly knocked Clinton out of the race during and after Iowa. She should’ve stayed knocked out, but had money and like a zombie just kept going.
Now we’re stuck with zombie Hillary and cult of Cool-Aid Obama and their crazed supporters. I’m growing less fond of Hillary’s Republican-look campaign and Obama’s passive-aggressiveness as time goes on.
Please, somebody tell me again, what was wrong with John Edwards?
Teh funny!
Hey, Clinton gets the zombie vote and Obama gets the cultie vote, so who *should* get the ‘monster’ vote?
Really? He apologized? That would be a first, wouldn’t it?
Cite?
What was it Obama said about Pakistan? Was it that he would use tactical nukes?
Did Obama vote to continue funding the Iraq war?
Tell me again how Obama is all hippy cool?
It’s time to put George W. Bush and John McCain who represent the early 1960s pro-Vietnam war attitude into the past. Over. Been there done that. Got the t-shirt.
Now we’re faced with the Clinton v. Obama redux of Humphrey and JFK. Obama may have intended to appear to be the anti-war RFK, but didn’t seem to really take to that position.
Are Clinton and Obama also pro-war attitude candidates representing the early-’60s positions? They seem to want to be there. Clinton may even be representing the Goldwater friendliness-toward-Arizona’s-McCain position. Note: for those who don’t know Goldwater was also from Arizona.
Where’s the post-war attittude?
Clinton: “get ready for the next war”
Obama: “we’ll nuke Pakistan”
Edwards: “We’ll get out of Iraq except for enough troops to defend the embassy.”
It’s time to get over the war and the ’60s and move on. Remember, if we just get to the late ’60s there is always the Nixonian era to come and we really don’t want to have to go through that, do we.
Who can shift our attention to *today* instead of forcing us to relive the divisiveness of the 1960s? Somehow I don’t see Obama uniting us, despite saying he’s a Uniter.
America needs Leadership, not all this divisive garbage. C’mon everybody, let’s get with it.