Egads, this officially means I have stayed up waaaay to late.

Ha! me too.

g’night.

dizgusting

Mornin’ pups.

There is nothin in the world quite like two BFF’s sharing lunch.

Lemon Party anyone?

The Surge is not working and despite the hype job by the press. Even 30%ers can put two and two together and figure out that higher gas prices mean the Surge is not working.
Corn, Wheat etc are up the Dollar is going down as Helicopter Ben cuts rates again in a desperate attempt to keep the stock market from tanking.
But despite all this bad news people WILL BLAME BUSH’s endorsement of McCain for McCain’s expected drop in poll numbers.
Granted Bush caused all these bad things to happen. But despite this McCain still wanted G.W’s blessing?
And I thought Mark Penn was out of touch with reality.

That picture again? Lord help us all…

Howdy Attaturk…

Whats this last minute negative ad that people were talking about helping Hilary? I can understand why Penn desperate for his job is pushing the story that going negative has saved Hilary but how much can a last minute ad change opinions?
The polls being wrong about Hilary again seems the more likely culprit.

“If the Gods had wanted us to vote, he would have given us candidates.” - Jim Hightower…

So who wants to discuss policy matters? A recent item leads me to believe that “The People” have once again been betrayed by the Democratic Party:

[Continued from the most recent thread…]

Speaking of Obama moving to the Left, it would appear that from his recent reaction to the assault on the FARC in Ecuador, Obama is solidly imperialist and right-wing on Latin policy:

[SNIP]

Significantly, both of the candidates for the Democratic presidential nomination echoed Bush’s unconditional support for the right-wing government of Uribe and its aggression against Ecuador.

Senator Hillary Clinton, speaking Tuesday to the Spanish-language television network Telemundo, asserted that “the Colombian state has the right to defend itself against terrorist drug-trafficking organizations which have kidnapped innocent citizens, including Americans.”

She added, “In supporting the FARC, [Venezuelan President] Chavez is openly taking the side of illegal groups that are threatening Colombian democracy and the peace and security of the region.”

Taking a nearly identical position, Senator Barak Obama issued a statement declaring, “The Colombian people have suffered more than four decades at the hands of a terrorist insurgency and the Colombian government has every right to defend itself against the FARC.”

Neither of the Democrats evinced the slightest concern for the violation of Ecuador’s sovereignty, much less the suffering inflicted on the Colombian people by decades of massacres and assassinations perpetrated by the Colombian military and its allies in the right-wing paramilitary death squads.

The message was unmistakable. No matter which party wins the White House in November, Washington’s pursuit of its strategic interests in Latin America by means of aggression and provocation will continue unabated…

[END SNIP]

RGD comment: OK, so I just spent the last four years getting up to speed on the actual issues between the FARC and the Bogata govenment in Columbia and found that they follow the classical pattern. People’s movement vs. Oligarchy, with the oligarchy totally in control of the media both in Columbia and in the U.S.

Apparently Barack Obama is not quite as keen on “Si, Se Puede” activism and democratic movements as he might like us to believe. His assault on the FARC annoys me. Hillary Clinton’s attack, OTOH, is precisely what I’d expect from such an imperial aristocrat.

here you are, but i’m on the other side of the moon this time, drinking wine instead of coffee: this is what I use to tell people about in the latest 1990s 2000s, when I was living a global kinda life. Now I’m doing it again after 4-5 years down time. Bit I LOVE it…

To repeat myself annoyingly, yes, yes, HRC would have incredible sympathy for the FARC and do all she can to straighten Columbia out. It goes without saying. She will support a myriad of freedom movements against corporate control over Third World countries at every opportunity. And monkeys will fly out my……

Yes, the image of flying monkeys is evocative. And apt for our very own Evita Peron wannabee.

Oh, bully! Something else we can start wars over… water:

http://www.alternet.org/blogs/video/78666/

http://flowthefilm.com/

Just some numbers:

At way early in the morning, Kos shows a net +1 delegate gain for Clinton tonight. Still too early, though, to call…

Are they both insane Columbia has a ton of troops for a reason they have rebels. So unless we back them with air support/strikes on Venezuela AN OIL PRODUCER AND OPEC MEMBER IN GOOD STANDING, Ecuador, and probably Bolivia then Columbia will fall.
Do we really want to fight a jungle war against rebels after this disaster in Iraq?
Do we really want to risk an OPEC boycott? Do we have the troops to occupy 2-4 countries?
Do we have the money? No really China can ask for Taiwan in exchange for their continued buying of U.S Treasury bonds that we will need to fight another war.
When weak don’t go looking for fights. Tell Columbia to eat some crow.

I was driving back from Suzanne’s Firepup meet up in California for the last few days. I just got back and had my first meal in days that was home cooked.

On the brightside the press will ask McCain about the Columbia problem. I’m sure that McCain will easily out war the Democrats on this issue.
Which will effect his poll numbers even more over the next few weeks as more people hear about the situation.

I think that if the presidential candidates all had to drive their own cars during presidential campaigns then we would have had high speed monorails years ago.
Not all of us can afford private jets.

Jumping in to say good night pups.
And you, Things - epic drive, was pleased to meet you @ Suzanne’s.

Good to meet you too! I wanted to talk more about known Lefties getting searched on airplanes.

We’ll have our chance. ttyl

I was talking about a friend who works with indigenous people in the field in Venezuela. She noted that although Hugo Chavez has included a large section about Indios rights in the Constitution, the natural gaurd does manoeuvres in areas of traditional land and uses the Indians as “target practice”. She also says FARC does the same thing, apparently on both sides of the border…killing native people. She says she doesn’t know if the Columbian military is pulling the same extermination/drive native peoples off the land policies on their side of the border, since the government held territory is a bit far away from the groups she lived with.

She said she wouldn’t be surprised if Chavez has been supplying FARC with weapons and money. She’s seen large shipments of weapons off-loaded on the docks when she was picking up supplies in the little upriver village, and she also says she has to be careful not to come into that town when FARC fighters come across the border and go there. They have apparently heard about her living out there with the Indios. Local people tell her when it’s safe. One time FARC came out into the savannah to, she suspects, try and kidnap her for ransom, but the local Indios moved her deep into their territory in an area where she wouldn’t be found.

Imagine all the gas we could save if we had 200mph monorails powered by the wind and sun taking me to California from Seattle in a lot less time than it took to drive!
Imagine all the lives saved of long distance drivers who won’t be falling asleep behind the wheel so much.

My friends… I thank George W Bush for being my friend. I hope he will find me more friends who will donate money to my campaign. My friends… I hope that the friends of my friend George W Bush like me because I plan to be just like my friend George W Bush. I plan on continuing the policies that have helped his friends. And… My friends… I hope that they help my friends as well.

But TCU,

You are thinking rationally. How un-American of you! Haven’t you heard our new motto? “Damn the cerebellums, full speed ahead! We have the audacity to hope for world conquest and dominion, reality be damned as well!”

Assuming that she is right wouldn’t there be a corresponding racist philosophy or at least a birth control/sterilization campaign for the Indians ?

I’m getting more ambivalent about Hugo. Ello es un lacarer des mujeres - an abuser of women. I’ve read statements by one of his ex-wives and one of his ex-mistresses that leave me very sad.

New post up on the current state of GOP meltdown in Alaska.

I expect that from Bush, McCain and the GOP. But who is advising Hilary and Obama on foreign policy and military matters Donald Rumsfeld?

That needs a barf warning if ever a barf warning was needed ;-)

Hey Noron is still on.

What the hell am I doing up this late/early? Insomnia, I’m thinking, is not all it’s cracked up to be.

Texas decided yet?

Hi cinnamonape,

That is indeed a very bizarre story you have just related. It does not comport at all with bona fide stories I’ve read about the Chavez regime, Hugo Chavez’s native ancestry or general facts regarding the nature of the FARC movement. Is your friend a part of an organization that has a web presence? I’d be very curious to learn more about what she is up to. What you have writen makes little sense from what I have learned of Latin American politics from experts and my own due diligence in the matter.

Well shit, I have to listen to her for MONTHS now.

But who is advising Hilary and Obama on foreign policy and military matters Donald Rumsfeld?

Key advisors to Clinton include Madeleine “500,000 deaths is an acceptable price for our policy” Albright and the absolutely duplicitous and imperial Richard Holbrooke.

Obama’s team are slightly less odious, featuring as a softer touch the academic Samantha Powers, who, in this Democracy NOW! interview makes it perfectly clear that having the U.S. policing the world is “a good thing”. I kinda thought Jeremy Scahill wiped Samantha on the floor for her odious and despicable meddlesomeness. But maybe that was just me rooting for all the victims that idiot do-gooders create in their mindless interventionist daydreams and nightmares.

Not to rain on your MSM parade, BBC has this and other reports on the Columbian incursion into Ecuador. More links to Venezuela/Chaves on the page. Dare find out for yourselves what real news reporting is like.

When is Biodun expected back?

He is back, he was stuck in Zinnzinaaty last night.

Don’t CIA types pose as reporters charity workers at not for profits, employees of shell companies etc? Hugo and the FARC have every reason to be careful around Americans.
They have no way of knowing who is a real person there to help and who is a spy. The CIA is also known to have spread stories about America’s enemies before.
On the other hand There has been a few dark skinned Hispanics who have oppressed and killed their own people before.
What does the BBC say about this I trust them more on international news than anyone else.

My dearest Arnie,

Re:

Not to rain on your MSM parade, BBC… Dare find out for yourselves what real news reporting is like.

Ahem. In the runup to the illegal and immoral invasion and occupation of Iraq and the creation of Anglo-America’s worst quagmire since Viet Nam, the PBS network was guilty of gross mis-representation of expert opinion on the war. As I recall the study that was done, for every 8 pundits or experts who questioned the wisdom of the invasion, PBS featured 100 pundit segments with cheerleaders for war.

And your pseudo-equitable and purportedly fair-minded BBC? They only had a ratio of 3:100 intelligent commentators vs. war whoring cheerleaders.

So, Arnie, if you meant to imply that the BBC offers “real news reporting”, I dare say you need to get out more often. There is a real world out there, but you’ll never find it via the BBC.

A few of dozens of web resources I can recommend for suitable depth of coverage and more of a populist/progressive slant would include:

http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/

http://www.granma.cu/ingles/index.html

http://www.narconews.com/

Seemed to me he asked a question.

I still say that McCain’s speech last night had all of the enthusiasm of thanking the local Kiwani’s Club for that swell chicken dinner they just served him…

Where would FARC get Enriched Uranium from except a Nuclear Power? Did Bush loose some? Are we ready to go to war with Russia or China? Did Pakistan betray us again. I don’t see India or Israel having any bones in this fight or the EU countries but I could be wrong.
But if we take Columbia at its word then we are talking war. Thank God that Columbia as an American Puppet does not have much cred on WMD.

McCain would be hurting himself when he talks if he only could get more people to listen.

Hillary may have won three out of four, but gain no delegates. Kos is posting that - So total for the night, thus far, is Clinton 185 and Obama 184.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyo.....604/469268

This with about 34% of the Texas caucuses reporting… Obama tends to do well in those; he may yet end up with a net gain for the night…

She’s an anthropologist, and I trust her experiences as authentic. I’m not going to provide her name or where she works for several reasons that relate to a) her ability to continue to do research in the region, and b) risks she would have if someone inappropriate identified her and passed it on to inappropriate persons.

Chavez indeed does claim that he has Indio ancestry. But there are a lot of people here in the US that have asserted that over the generations and did not have much sympathy for their land rights or other issues.

As well, she did point out Chavez’s push for indigenous rights in the Constitution. It may be that he’s been unaware of what his military is doing. But I would point out that deploying hundreds of tanks along the border, most of which is areas that are occupied by still traditional native peoples is hardly going to be beneficial to their livelihoods. Neither would a shooting war.

As far as a sterilization program or racist philosophy, one hardly needs to do the former to displace people to the cities. As for the latter…it’s called “modernization”…a rationale that has led to millions of indigenous peoples moving off their traditional lands, which if not specifically established as such, are taken for use as vacant lands for herding, logging and agriculture. This is particularly the major issue in Amazonia and the Orinoco basin.

McCain’s strategy then oughta be to put ‘em to sleep as quickly as possible when he must speak?

Well, if that’s the case - the man’s a natural…

What does the BBC say about this I trust them more on international news than anyone else.

See my criticism of the BBC at @38

Re:

Don’t CIA types pose as reporters charity workers at not for profits, employees of shell companies etc?

The Directorate of Operations at the CIA has an almost unbelievable record of criminality and mendacity. How any nation can believe itself to be a democracy and stil maintain such an odious secret police force is beyond my comprehension. Or to phrase this indelicately, tens of millions of simpletons living inside the Homeland’s borders are deluded to think that they have some personal freedom while their government runs roughshod over the entire planet acting essentially like a criminal mafia.

There’s many good resources on this despicable institution called the “intelligence community”.

The recently deceased Philip Agee wrote the classic on CIA manipulations and criminality in Latin America in “CIA Diary: Inside the Company”

William Blum wrote “Killing Hope” and continues with his monthly “Anti-Empire Reports”

Stephan Kinzer has written a wonderful history of the CIA’s massive blunder in blowback, the overthrow of Iran’s popular and democratically elected leader, Mohammed Mossadegh in the book, “All the Shah’s Men”.

Oh, and don’t let’s get started on the CIA’s involvement in drug trafficking, shall we…

America faked or at best was misled by themselves concerning Iraqi WMD. Columbia can go to the UN with this story but given the past nobody but our puppets will take it seriously.
Still it would be good to see exactly who our puppets are.

Really Ray, There is a significant difference between reporting what the government (propaganda) is and what is actually taking place. Thanks for your links, will look at them anon.

About getting out, since 1994 my news sources have included: The Irish Times, The Irish(Cork) Examiner, RTE 1, RTE 2, The Guardian, The Sunday Times, The Independent (Both British and Irish Newspapers), TV3 (Irish independent TV), Euro News (French based CNN (original CNN) type TV News reporting), and others. With such a spread of news input, there is surprisingly little divergence in fact. Maybe you should get out a little more yourself. What is apparent is the near complete accord of reported propaganda of your MSM

For the most part I find much to agree with your comments, we part ways with your self-centered arrogance.

Gee, I never knew the CIA was bad, amazing!

No shit

Yup. And as I said earlier, math matters. Good diary on the potential future numbers there.

She’s an anthropologist, and I trust her experiences as authentic. I’m not going to provide her name or where she works for several reasons that relate to a) her ability to continue to do research in the region, and b) risks she would have if someone inappropriate identified her and passed it on to inappropriate persons.

We don’t want or need a name but some unbiased unrelated sources to back up the story would be nice after Judy Miller, as I’m sure you can understand.

That’s The Math!

I would add to my # 48,

It sticks in my craw when someone approaches with the attitude they have all the answers, That usually means that there are no answers left over for anybody else.

Chavez indeed does claim that he has Indio ancestry. But there are a lot of people here in the US that have asserted that over the generations and did not have much sympathy for their land rights or other issues.

Agreed

She’s an anthropologist, and I trust her experiences as authentic.

Well, what she is describing, i.e. military jackasses taking pot shots at the locals, is pretty much what the U.S. has going on in Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia, etc. So, that part of the story does seem plausible.

from the picture caption:

What’s a little slander and needless slaughter amongst us dear?

foreplay?

Mornin’ pups. Little early to be growlin’ at each other, no? Raven — another jungle war against insurgents, eh? They could hire you for technical advice.

Don’t you have somewhere to be?

Out of here. Will leave something from The Guardian, looks like cold times ahead in hell.

morning all!

how nice - i thread not consumed by the primary. i’m enjoying reading all the comments this morning.

what’s with that?

i know not everyone has the same interests, but can’t there be a space for this kind of discussion too?

You like this lecture we have been getting?

Discussion?

yeah - that’s math even I can understand (for the most part) even when semi-awake/comatose, like right now for instance…

As well, she did point out Chavez’s push for indigenous rights in the Constitution. It may be that he’s been unaware of what his military is doing. But I would point out that deploying hundreds of tanks along the border, most of which is areas that are occupied by still traditional native peoples is hardly going to be beneficial to their livelihoods. Neither would a shooting war.

He may be unaware or this story may not be true. But it seems to me Columbia is the one pushing for war. The Genocide Charge? The Money given to the FARC charge which is probably true, the Dirty Bomb might have been true but Enriched Uranium is a little hard to come by.
I think that bit was to much to be believed. Plus the timing of all these negative stories seems suspicious. It reminds me of the press rollout of stories before the war with Iraq.

How does Rachel Sklar look so darn good at this time of the morning? (MSNBC)

Arnie,

Re:

It sticks in my craw when someone approaches with the attitude they have all the answers,

I never said I had all the answers. What I said was that the BBC has been a shill for the Labour government’s policy, and a deceitful source of propaganda that proved disasterously and immorally evil for the five million or so innocent Iraqi citizens who have either been murdered, mutilated or moved-on by the reprehensible governments in London and Washington. Pointing out that the BBC is an immoral accomplice to the greatest crime of the 21st Century seems to be a valid and useful observation to pass along when some people still place far too much faith in such a feckless source.

sheesh!

back from answering e-mails. you pups are staying up all night, eh? it’s not like Dick Cheney shot his best friend and is waiting for an apology.

well argue back if you disagree.

after how many primary threads you’re asking me if i like a topic about what’s going on in columbia? are you serious?

Some of us just got up.

touche…

No, had nothing to do with you. I, like Arnie, felt that there was a lecture being given. I don’t care what the topic is.

Let me add, sorry for the misunderstanding.

That’s particularly the reason that I won’t reveal the identity…because she will “outed” as a spy by “true believers” merely because she has observed such activities. Hate to say it but lots of people get “exposed” as CIA agents who are far from it and legitimately observe atrocities.

And I will not tell you either who she is or which group she has done research with because it would not only poise a major risk to her, but also her academic colleagues in Venezuela, and to the Indio group she works with there. I will say that there doesn’t appear to be any ORGANIZED systematic effort to exterminate the groups. The killings are “incidental” to the military’s activities. If a indigenous individual is killed it’s simply because they happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. When a group of NG are out hunting for deer, or training and take a pot-shot at them (she referred to this as “using them for target practice”). The Indios make themselves, and their families scarce when armed men might be seen coming into their areas. They have hiding places they run to. In addition these people, though not all, are nomadic…and thus very hard to locate. They run from their small temporary villages when a helicopter or plane is heard approaching. They are quite skittish regarding any modern technology like this.

She suspects that the FARC came out looking for HER because they had been asking about her in the village on the river, and they rarely bother to come that way for anything else. There are plenty of river routes up into Colombia; going overland is quite difficult and nearly impossible through the marshes. The locals know the dry paths and can cover ground quite quickly, so long before the armed men approached they had gotten her far away from the camp. As it was the FARC didn’t even locate the camp as the grass was high and the huts they use are low to the ground and made of thatch. Almost impossible to see from the ground.

See “Men With Guns” by John Sayles. “Who was it that did this to you, soldiers or revolutionaries” “We don’t know, it was men with guns”.

We might agree with you more if you were a bit more polite. If you treat people as the enemy well they respond in kind.
I might doubt Cinniamonape on some of this but his track record deserves respect. Unless I am damm well sure he is wrong which I’m not.
I think you overreacted to Arnie who seems to have accepted your criticism of the BBC a little bit @48
However we all work better when we respect each other.

ah, raven, you can give me shit anytime.

i’m so happy to have some new topic to consider that i haven’t even noticed anything more than a disgreement where people are actually providing an argument and evidence to back up their views. really loving the back and forth between those who’ve read difference sources and cinnomonape who’s friend has on the ground experiences. very cool.

ET - just working on the first coffee of the day.

Back to Attaturk’s post topic -

Rachael Maddow said something last night to the effect that Dems are depending too much on people being turned off by mccain making nice with bush….that’s a poor translation but iirc sorta close to her meaning. What think you, pups?

I wouldn’t think of giving you shit!

Mornin Waccamaw

The orthopod (actually PA) sentenced the girl to 8 week in a full, rigid leg brace. The break is right next to the tendon so and separation of the fracture might result in surgery. Gonna be a difficult garden season.

Saw that also. I also saw her earlier give Pat Buchanan shit for his idiotic fear mongering. I sure do like her.

Again nobody is asking you her name. Other unrelated unbiased sources to back up her story if available would be nice.

will say that there doesn’t appear to be any ORGANIZED systematic effort to exterminate the groups. The killings are “incidental” to the military’s activities. If a indigenous individual is killed it’s simply because they happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

This is tragic and very believable. I think the way you phrased it before left me with the impression that it was organized which it very well might be but I would need more proof for that.
I just want to be careful about potential justifications for our next war. Because you see I was one of the saps who read Judy Miller everyday and believed her:(

Uh I am turned off by Bush backing McCain. If anything I think we should link them together even more? I like Rachel why does she think it won’t work?

That Sayles comment probably pretty much applies.

I got the impression that the group really doesn’t know much about the political affiliation of people. The group she was with have no members that are literate, and most don’t even speak any Spanish…just a few words that allow them to trade their baskets, woven goods and a few forest goods in town for things like salt, yarn (for weaving). She said that she discovered that the dialect they use hasn’t even been recorded in a dictionary. It took her months to learn to speak. They would go into town maybe once in two or three months and leave within the day. The folks she stayed with off and on for 3 years didn’t even have a gun amongst them. They used bows.

As for her being a CIA agent…given that there was almost no contact with the outside world and little in the way of figuring out what was going on along the river…it would be a totally useless assignment.

well, considering how many times i’ve given you a hard time, if you did i’d only think i had it coming.

… whoa who’s broke their leg?

Morning, selise:

Per our chat last week about Glass-Steagall in the banking crisis, here’s a bank that went under from a subprime pyramid before Glass-Steagall repeal, which was in 1999. Unfortunately, it’s the bank that BOba’s finance director was involved in, but there’s no putting that one back in the lamp now:o( The case is considered by some to be sui generis.

I’m sure G-S repeal reduced some of the costs of the industry model that got us into this mess, and there are other problems with it due to the lack of firewalls (which is what Stiglitz goes into in The Roaring Nineties when discussing G-S), but it does not seem to have been strictly required for the mortgage crisis to have developed. The subject of how the industry changed to allow it is worth a good article, though.

Cheerio, I’m going to be off pretty soon until this evening.

Rachael Maddow said something last night to the effect that Dems are depending too much on people being turned off by mccain making nice with bush…

I think that maybe for the first time I disagree with her. I hope that there are lots and lots of pictures taken this morning when Crazy Train meets with Georgie this morning.

However, somebody made the point (and it might have been Rachel) that any appearances together will be more or less on the QT, and only in front of audiences pre-vetted as being very conservative…

But there are cameras everywhere, and there’s no way the two of them can avoid being seen together.

How many Troops, planes,and ships do we have in South America or can get there quick? How long can we keep troops there? Or is everything in Iraq?

My bride. She fell getting out of the van Sunday.

no saps in this thread.

imo, a sap is someone who gets punked by miller and then doesn’t rethink what’s going on. we all get punked from time to time (see me and the democratic party).

Oh, daymn!!! So sorry to hear that, fellow. I fractured a kneecap (and elbow) a number of years ago during a visit to Lyon and the initial thinking was surgery; fortunately it didn’t separate and healed up pretty well given my age. *g* Hope the same holds true for your dear lady. At least you’re in a setting where there is no question of language barrier, etc.

I think the 82nd is still the quick reaction force.

Thanks:)

thanks for the follow up info - much appreciated.

Here’s a rather glib look at the circular firing squad, albeit down to two contenders, called the Democratic Presidential nomination race:

From Asia Times…

“This ticket will self-destruct in five seconds.”

Yea, if she follows orders it should be ok but this is a woman who lives for her garden.

How many Troops, planes,and ships do we have in South America or can get there quick?

Three.

I opted out of TV last night having reached the point of, “I bloody well can’t take anyone of this!” Just happened to catch that one little bit on a rerun this morning and don’t know anymore about context, etc. of surrounding conversations.

Do you think we will use air strikes first on the planes and possibly the leaders? Would Bush send the 82nd to protect Venezuela’s oil or help Columbia first?
I am assuming Bush or Hugo starts a war and that the Dems roll over again.

raven, i hope she will be ok even if it means not much gardening this year. it sounds like a very serious break.

Within 18 hours of notification, the 82nd Airborne Division strategically deploys, conducts forcible entry parachute assault and secures key objectives for follow-on military operations in support of U.S. national interests.

Three are you joking is that enough?