Of all the terrible and shallow performances of the American media in regard to Iraq, with perhaps the exception of the early cheerleading days, no topic has been more poorly covered than the war’s financial cost. After nearly five years, I have still rarely seen a White House Press reporter not named Helen Thomas even broach the subject.
And yet, while the reports in general about Iraq diminish and the topic becomes less important to the public the expense becomes ever greater, up to $15 billion a month.
When McCain starts saying Obama or Clinton wants the wave the white flag, it’s not only preposterous strategically, even if it were true we could not afford the white flags.
When U.S. troops invaded Iraq in March 2003, the Bush administration predicted that the war would be self-financing and that rebuilding the nation would cost less than $2 billion.
Coming up on the fifth anniversary of the invasion, a Nobel laureate now estimates that the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan are costing America more than $3 trillion…
The book, co-authored with Harvard University professor Linda Bilmes, builds on previous research that was published in January 2006. The two argued then and now that the cost to America of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan is wildly underestimated.
When other factors are added — such as interest on debt, future borrowing for war expenses, the cost of a continued military presence in Iraq and lifetime health-care and counseling for veterans — they think that the wars’ costs range from $5 trillion to $7 trillion.
"I think we really have learned that the long-term costs of taking care of the wounded and injured in this war and the long-term costs of rebuilding the military to its previous strength is going to far eclipse the cost of waging this war," Bilmes said in an interview.
The book and its estimates are the subject of a hearing Thursday by the Joint Economic Committee of Congress.
Naturally, this leads the Bush Administration to proclaim a Nobel Prize winning economist is nothing but a traitorous, lilly-livered, terrorist-lover:
"People like Joe Stiglitz lack the courage to consider the cost of doing nothing and the cost of failure. One can’t even begin to put a price tag on the cost to this nation of the attacks of 9-11," said White House spokesman Tony Fratto, conceding that the costs of the war on terrorism are high while questioning the premise of Stiglitz’s research.
"It is also an investment in the future safety and security of Americans and our vital national interests. $3 trillion? What price does Joe Stiglitz put on attacks on the homeland that have already been prevented? Or doesn’t his slide rule work that way?"
Jeebus, why not just do the ol’ "I’m rubber and you’re glue" Tony? Thanks for not answering. Well, at least someone asked. But that’s about the last we hear of it. Nevertheless, with the exception of some print media reports I have seen nothing of this in the broadcast media, nor, at this point have I seen either of the remaining Democratic candidates use it to a substantial degree. It might be time to bring it up — a lot.
I look forward to John McCain NOT being asked about this by Michael Scherer and the rest of his harem of press agents.
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paraphrasing ol’ Ev Dirkson, a trillion here, a trillion there ……, he’s turning in his Republic grave at what his beloved party has become.
Good post again Attaturk
The cost of war in money is just one cost…consider the cost to reputation of America as a world leader…consider the damage to our own self image…consider the damage to our own democracy, humane rights, general credibility…consider the moral damage. How do we recover these priceless assets?
O/t but on the subject of costs -
I’m assuming Jane or Christy will do a post on this later today but DWT has an appeal up for contributions to help cover medical expenses for Tommy Yum’s son:
http://downwithtyranny.blogspo…..-meet.html
A few dollars here, a few dollars there….and pretty soon we’ve made a difference. *g*
Hope this gets through I’m in Rice hill Oregon heading to Suzanne’s shindig. The internet connection sucks at the hotel.
Anyway its not an either or question. Its not either we go to war or Al Quieda takes the oil. It is what else could we have bought for its 3 trillion dollars?
Imagine if we used the money for hybrids, GM volts and alternative power? Would we need oil then that much or would the price drop.
Using hindsight we know that war in the middle east does mean higher gas prices which is hurting the economy.
We know that the dollar is dropping in value as a result.
We know that, well everyone but WallStreet knows that the war debt means higher taxes once Bush is out of office.
Our Presidential candidates must tell the American people especially the morons on WallStreet and the business channel that the rich will get stuck paying for Bush’s war, not the middleclass.
I am open though to the idea of declaring Sauda Arabia a supporter of terror and seizing their assets worldwide to pay for the war.
Plus with 3 trillion I’m pretty sure we could have the best healthcare in the world.
Have a good weekend ya’ll, headed to Virginia.
Safe travels!
Yea, we love 85!
What’s the attachment to VA and what part of the state?
Anybody want to take bets on whether the MSM even mentions that drudge is the source for outing Harry’s presence in Afghanistan?
Hey Things – doing a drive by on my way to bed and saw you are headed down I5. Way forking kewl and you are gonna definitely be the pup who traveled the furthest to attend a Bear Creek meetup :)
World leader? World leader in what? We are we supposed to be leading the world?
Why do you buy into that meme that the USA is, was or even should be the world’s leader?
The White House can’t put a price on 9/11 either because they stopped looking for Ossama if it were not for Obama ribbing them does anyone think they would have sent the drone over Pakistan to get that Al Quieda guy?
But of course we are suppose to believe that only freakin now has there been any actionable intel on any Al Quieda guys in Pakistan.
Notice that the ever complaint press hasn’t said a word. Probably because they are still worried about “access”
Never mind that all their “access” has resulted in Judy Miller lies/stories.
We need to take away her Pulitizer I think the future shame of Judy having to testify before Congress or at war trials might convince the Times to lean on the Pulitzer committee before the Times becomes the story.
I’m not bringing any food :(
Hey it would be nice if we were and we used our powers to help the world. We do have the power we are just using it wrong.
“”It is also an investment in the future safety and security of Americans and our vital national interests.”
That means our OIL.
But even the oil is sold to us at huge profits by the corporations… our dealers.
So the US goes around with its big stick policy costing the taxpayer’s trillions, costing the lives 100s of thousands, making the MIC flush with cash, starving the economy so we can “lead” the world?
Or dominate the world so we can take what is good for trans national corporations? Why do I care about the welfare of these huge corporations? They do nothing for the people?
The foreign policy apparatus and the national security state have been turned into the facilitators of trans national corporations.
That is something that needs to change.
There are no threats to the USA worth trillions and thousands of lives. If we want and need commodities, we can simply bid for them in the market. How bout that?
no problem – i’m sure there will be plenty (based on last time – my table was groaning). off to the land of nod…
Helping is something that the US can do through the UN and other NGOs.
But we don’t even help OUR OWN PEOPLE, what do we need to go around helping other nations?
And we don’t help people, we prop up friendly leaders who will do the bidding for our corporations, like buy power plants and dams and so forth.
We bombed Iraq and the gave no bid contracts to American corporations to re build it. That’s pure madness. And they stole the money and did nothing. Less electricity and water today than under Saddam. Are you better off today under the Americans than you were under Saddam?
Good morning, pups. Bobo’s all alone today, remembering William F. Buckley. He says his greatest talent was friendship. He showered affection on his friends, and he had an endless stream of them, old and young. His second great talent was leadership. He also gave Bobo his start, for which I’m sure he is answering now.
http://mgpaquin.wordpress.com/
The coffee, tea and hot chocolate are ready, and the biscuits are out of the oven. Ah, Friday, glorious Friday! Have a good one.
Glad to see you won’t be missing that stature.
Some of us remember when people overseas looked at us in admiration, whether fully deserved or not.
The other word which is neveer heard, even here, is reparations.
Your right charity begins at home good night
Hello FDLers–from Paris, France. The Biodun landed about two hours ago at De Gaulle, and I’m now installed at my friend’s apartment at rue Rocroy…
Hi Raven…
See any rabbits at CDG?
Paris is one of my favorite places and we’ve only been there once
Why did Biodun change names?
What are reputations for if not to position you do accomplish something?
The USA at one point seemed to represent democracy and human rights, but we don’t promote those any more. We talk big but our actions are aggressive and anti democratic around the world. We have a new reputution because those in power want to TAKE wealth from the world out there. And that’s what they have done for 6 decades now.
rabbits at CDG? In a word, no.
3/19/08 ~ Sick Of IT Day!
Just a little note for KayinMaine this morning.
Bonjour Biodun, ca va bien? What is the snow fall in Paris? Auntie said that you were tracking the bazillions missing from Iraq. Is this true?
You would think that people with some indication of intelligence, such as the researchers mentioned, would be less concerned about rebuilding the military to some imagined benchmark and instead would be applying their knowledge and skills to the more urgent task of how to dismantle the military that the U.S. has even at this point. It is far and away too bloated and in fact would not be missed if it were eliminated altogether.
My full name is Biodun Iginla…My first FDL book salon announcement outed my full name, so I told Jane I’d like to started using my full name from now on…
no snow here…rain though. mid-50s F…..That’s what Auntie said I was doing? Word’s got out, eh?
On the way here I met a Special Forces guy who is progressive as hell and has promised to write some diaries for consideration….
the airport is built over a huge rabbit warren
i couldn’t beleive my eyes when my wife pointed them out to me
It’s time for a cost-benefit analysis.
Forget about the patriotic flag-waving, or the hand wringing about the “cost of 9-11″ or the “cost of doing nothing”.
Let’s talk plainly about what we got for our money.
I think there’s a good case to be made that we’ve got nothing significant to show for that multi-trillion dollar investment, and that money would have done a heck of a lot more good had it been spent on other things.
It’s really hard to wrap one’s mine around FIVE-TRILLION dollars. Those kinds of numbers really don’t mean anything to the average person. It has to be defined in terms of what could have been done with it.
Morning Attaturk, morning Dawgs -
It’s 18 degrees this morning and my feet are cold.
But the Assam tea is hot and Steve explains it all this morning.
Going up to read now and I’ll meet you all back in the thread.
If I hit the calculator buttons right, $5 Trillion works out to…
$16,667 for every person in the U.S.
So for a family of four…$66,000.
Imagine how many foreclosures could have been avoided with that?
Pennies compared to what we each get from Soros… [/s]
“We” didn’t get anything from it. But virtually all the money spent passed through some corporation and lots of it ended up in bank accounts.
War spending is for “things”. Things that people manufacture, that kill and lots of stealing, bribes and profits too. Oh… I forgot soldier’s pay.
That would pay back all of my own debts, and my parents could retire on their own shares. *sighs* It won’t happen though, at least not in my lifetime. I may be younger than most of the regulars i know here, but i tend to be cynical about how much change can be wrought. I expect knock down drag out policy fights as soon as things are all settled after Jan 20th, 2009.
The path of least resistance is status quo, and people are loathe to leave it.
so you’re saying we each get to pay $16,667 for the privilege of decimating someone else’s country.
good morning!
Whenever I hear a wingnut wondering about how Obama or Clinton think that they are going to pay for all of these healthcare plans and social programs that they are proposing I just chuckle.
End the war and soak the rich. End of argument.
If the figure is $5 Trillion that’s correct.
Good thing we didn’t use that money for universal health care, education, and porn.
No, our children/grandchildren get to pay it.
except that I’ve all ready used my $16,667 on health care, education, and porn. So I guess I’ll just leave an I.O.U.
Attaturk -
Just now finished reading the main article you ref’d and it’s interesting how anytime there is some half-way decent reporting on virtually any subject, the name McClatchey is attached to it.
Am I off-base on this evaluation?
I read that 1% of ‘merkuns are in the pokey. May I make a suggestion that the prison population be increased by at least ∞. bush, cheney, rummy, condi, addington, gonzalez, roberts, alito, ….oh shit I can’t list them all.
I was wondering where my 16,000 went. I did not intend to commit murder with it however.
I heard them talking about it on the TeeVee this morning.
Brits are furious at drudge. Huge story in Britain.
plus interest
The Omion does a better job reporting truth than any other organization.
I am not joking and it is not funny.
Jan 17, 2001
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/28784
Oh, by the way and in case no one else has said it, happy Sadie Hawkins Day everyone!
At the risk of conflating, Tis it not Sadie Hawkins Day? where bachelors are required to respond to certain requests?
Poor little Harry, he was having so much fun killing folks now he has to go home and count jewels, bummer.
will ye quit reading me mind ;-)
Thank you Attaturk!
TV as in the Beeb? or US?
The only place I’ve seen anything about it has been Brit papers and a few lefty blogs. CNN earlier even went to the effort of placing the blame on an Aussie magazine…..interesting that they also went on to say it was leaked via the internet. ;-)
Stiglitz is going to be on democracynow this morning.
I think I heard about Drudge being the source on Dan Abrams. They implied that Harry would probably be reassigned now.
Nader’s up on Washington Journal – CSPAN1
As opposed to “The Today Show” which is where he should also be.
Seems like Prof Cole is on the same wavelength this morning Attaturk:
http://www.juancole.com/
I recommend this article @ Tom Dispatch:
and this from Noam Chomsky:
http://tomdispatch.com/post/17…..world_over
Stiglitz up on democracynow.org
The nation is run by the MIC and their absurd construct of “security” which is a code word for stealing from the world – DOMINION over the earth and it’s people.
The world does not love us, it hates us and it makes perfect sense.
Hey, somebody has to be an empire.
Crooks & Liars has a post up about Drudge the Super Slimeball revealing that Prince Harry was in Afghanistan and now the Brits are pulling him out immediately. He’d been there since December and the press had agreed to keep a lid on it so his unit wouldn’t be specifically targeted. The British guvmint is not happy. Drudge’s post was spread around the internet. Nice goin’, Slimeball. I don’t want to be anywhere around Slimeball when his karma catches up with him.
It was on MSNBC this morning.
Drudge endangered troops when he “outed” the Prince, just like Geraldo did when he disclosed plans and troop positions in ‘03. Self-promotion trumps even the safety of the troops for some.
(More on the “Distance Between Influence and Integrity” here):
http://newsprism.wordpress.com/
As for the cost of Iraq, we’re not bothering to count the Iraqi casualties, much less our own spending. But every US troop death is highlighted by we anti-war types as well as by the jingoists. What a shame.
And I read that the total cost could pass $1 TRILLION by the time all the veterens wend their ways through the health care system. All so DUHbya could get it up, I’m afraid…
Steve explains it all
That was excellent Sangeman. My thoughts to to every jot and tittle.
I would add a little thought in the hopes you would respond.
Capitalism needs constance growth, something I have been aware of in my conversations with others, but we live in a finite world so the system has a major flaw that will eventually destroy itself-we need a ….? many words in my head and the wrong place to write them.
I would love to have a conversation about this that I think about frequently.
And very apropos to this thread.
“No, our children/grandchildren get to pay it.”
[edited by mod] Don’t have a mortgage?
YOU are paying NOW. It’s called INTEREST. This money could be used for other things other than paying the rich, who lent the US Bilions of dollars.
Running the US Gov on debt is a wealth transfer. From Poor to Rich.
[Mod Note; Please do not insult other commenters. Thank you.]
The MIC definition of security is selfish and greedy. It ignores the need for a healthy economy.
Could the MIC continue without Tax Revenus to pay the bills.