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	<title>Comments on: Austin Debate Thread #4</title>
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	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/</link>
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		<title>By: gharlane</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1290392</link>
		<dc:creator>gharlane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 10:44:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1290392</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Obama: “My number one job as president will be to keep the American people safe.” Oh, Lordy this again. No, Barack. It’s not. It’s to defend the Constitution. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Definitely an “eeeewwww” moment.  I expect better from you, Barack.  Pure pandering.  And as Blue Texan points out, &lt;em&gt;it’s the oath you swear when you take office.&lt;/em&gt;  If you forget it, I say as one of your supporters, I will press for impeachment, same as I do for the Smirking Chimp-in-Chief.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Obama: “My number one job as president will be to keep the American people safe.” Oh, Lordy this again. No, Barack. It’s not. It’s to defend the Constitution. </p>
</blockquote>
<p>Definitely an “eeeewwww” moment.  I expect better from you, Barack.  Pure pandering.  And as Blue Texan points out, <em>it’s the oath you swear when you take office.</em>  If you forget it, I say as one of your supporters, I will press for impeachment, same as I do for the Smirking Chimp-in-Chief.</p>
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		<title>By: MarilynSanAntone</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1290208</link>
		<dc:creator>MarilynSanAntone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 06:13:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1290208</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;If I lived closer, I would come for you.  Hope you will feel better.&lt;br /&gt;
Marilyn&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If I lived closer, I would come for you.  Hope you will feel better.<br />
Marilyn</p>
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		<title>By: Maddy</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289955</link>
		<dc:creator>Maddy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 04:27:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289955</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;707, a little quick on the draw I was.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;MarkH-to me we don’t have exactly stellar choices, and everyone will shoot me for saying that I don’t believe we really vote for president as much as, are manipulated into choices that are acceptable to those who call the shots..the men with the money that you never see, but then what the bleep do I know.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>707, a little quick on the draw I was.</p>
<p>MarkH-to me we don’t have exactly stellar choices, and everyone will shoot me for saying that I don’t believe we really vote for president as much as, are manipulated into choices that are acceptable to those who call the shots..the men with the money that you never see, but then what the bleep do I know.</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289874</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 04:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289874</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;MarkH wrote:&lt;br /&gt;
We thought that would help Howard Dean too. He was kicked around like a hacky sack. The only reason it might be easier now since the public has already come around to opposing the war. There isn’t much convincing that needs to be done in a political campaign, just tell the people your position.
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I don’t recall that Howard Dean ran against George Bush…instead I recall that it was a pair of guys that voted FOR the WAR that got booted around as flip-floppers. AND who would only criticize the strategy of the war, not its fundamental framework.
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I didn’t say Dean ran against Bush. I said he didn’t even get that far because the people weren’t against the war back then. The Dem ticket didn’t argue against the ‘flip-flopper’ charge very well. I blame Kerry and still wonder if he wasn’t perfectly happy being a senator and letting Bush be preznit.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Actually, for a senator to vote against the AUMF would’ve been ridiculous. It had caveats which required Bush to get U.N. support. It was perfectly reasonable. It wasn’t a direct vote FOR war!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;OTOH, I don’t criticize someone who was outside the senate, like Howard Dean or Barack Obama, for saying we shouldn’t go to war. Actually, you could easily take both positions at once: against the war, but for the AUMF.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Where it all falls apart is when you have Clinton voting for the AUMF (alright), but then continuing to support the war despite it’s obvious failures and the revelation that the evidence for it was fake or nonexistent or when Obama says that if he’d been in the senate he probably would’ve voted for the war despite using it as an argument to pound Clinton (hypocrisy).&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Neither Obama nor Clinton show much character or Leadership.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote>
<blockquote><p>MarkH wrote:<br />
We thought that would help Howard Dean too. He was kicked around like a hacky sack. The only reason it might be easier now since the public has already come around to opposing the war. There isn’t much convincing that needs to be done in a political campaign, just tell the people your position.
</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I don’t recall that Howard Dean ran against George Bush…instead I recall that it was a pair of guys that voted FOR the WAR that got booted around as flip-floppers. AND who would only criticize the strategy of the war, not its fundamental framework.
</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I didn’t say Dean ran against Bush. I said he didn’t even get that far because the people weren’t against the war back then. The Dem ticket didn’t argue against the ‘flip-flopper’ charge very well. I blame Kerry and still wonder if he wasn’t perfectly happy being a senator and letting Bush be preznit.</p>
<p>Actually, for a senator to vote against the AUMF would’ve been ridiculous. It had caveats which required Bush to get U.N. support. It was perfectly reasonable. It wasn’t a direct vote FOR war!</p>
<p>OTOH, I don’t criticize someone who was outside the senate, like Howard Dean or Barack Obama, for saying we shouldn’t go to war. Actually, you could easily take both positions at once: against the war, but for the AUMF.</p>
<p>Where it all falls apart is when you have Clinton voting for the AUMF (alright), but then continuing to support the war despite it’s obvious failures and the revelation that the evidence for it was fake or nonexistent or when Obama says that if he’d been in the senate he probably would’ve voted for the war despite using it as an argument to pound Clinton (hypocrisy).</p>
<p>Neither Obama nor Clinton show much character or Leadership.</p>
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		<title>By: kirk  murphy</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289866</link>
		<dc:creator>kirk  murphy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 04:06:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289866</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Congrats on the Cow’s Tail, maddy!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Congrats on the Cow’s Tail, maddy!</p>
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		<title>By: MrWhy</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289807</link>
		<dc:creator>MrWhy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 03:55:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;She didn’t answer the question.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Her answer was that she was blessed, committed to serving her country, and nothing she has experienced is as difficult as what most soldiers who’ve spent time in Iraq have faced.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;It wasn’t the relentless attacks from the RightWingNuts, the failure of her healthcare efforts from Bill’s 1st term, it wasn’t Bill’s impeachment, or Bill’s womanizing, it wasn’t her father’s death. I can see being grateful for your blessings, but that wasn’t the question. She didn’t answer the question.  Unless the question is out of line, you don’t get extra points from me if you avoid answering the question. I know politicians do it all the time. Doesn’t mean I have to like it.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>She didn’t answer the question.</p>
<p>Her answer was that she was blessed, committed to serving her country, and nothing she has experienced is as difficult as what most soldiers who’ve spent time in Iraq have faced.</p>
<p>It wasn’t the relentless attacks from the RightWingNuts, the failure of her healthcare efforts from Bill’s 1st term, it wasn’t Bill’s impeachment, or Bill’s womanizing, it wasn’t her father’s death. I can see being grateful for your blessings, but that wasn’t the question. She didn’t answer the question.  Unless the question is out of line, you don’t get extra points from me if you avoid answering the question. I know politicians do it all the time. Doesn’t mean I have to like it.</p>
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		<title>By: kirk  murphy</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289794</link>
		<dc:creator>kirk  murphy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 03:53:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289794</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Isn’t 136 a little late for the zed?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Well, now that you mention it - yes.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;em&gt;But it’s never too late for the bloody Vikings….&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Isn’t 136 a little late for the zed?</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Well, now that you mention it &#8211; yes.</p>
<p><em>But it’s never too late for the bloody Vikings….</em></p>
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		<title>By: Maddy</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289783</link>
		<dc:creator>Maddy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 03:51:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289783</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Okay you all get zeds&lt;br /&gt;
I get Cows tail Woot!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay you all get zeds<br />
I get Cows tail Woot!</p>
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		<title>By: Maddy</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289754</link>
		<dc:creator>Maddy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 03:45:35 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;em&gt;But with fewer calories, the trailer hitches don’t gain weight.&lt;br /&gt;
reply&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;You mean bumble seats?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>But with fewer calories, the trailer hitches don’t gain weight.<br />
reply</em></p>
<p>You mean bumble seats?</p>
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		<title>By: PetePierce</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289725</link>
		<dc:creator>PetePierce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 03:41:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://firedoglake.com/2008/02/21/austin-debate-thread-4/#comment-1289725</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I wonder how to quantify the impact of any debate on the primaries or the general.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder how to quantify the impact of any debate on the primaries or the general.</p>
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