El foldo?

Pray tell, what was he supposed to do when Reid did what was within Reid’s power to do?

Yeah! What Jane said.
El Foldo….harumph.

Yeah - I just listened to him and could not help thinking: “What the f#@k is he getting so hot and bothered now, for?”

Ain’t going to do any good for me to sign since Dan Lungren is my rep. Grrrrr.

I believe Pat is sending a follow up letter… just to be clear.

The thing is, I didn’t think he sounded hot and bothered at all.
Some of his words were strong, but his body language seemed to have given up in every muscle.

Where’s the outrage????

It was really interesting when Mikulski used the anthrax attacks as justification for going along with FISA….her office was a target…so was Leahey, and so was Daschle…

Strange that only Dems were really targeted….along with a bunch of people who died as a result of handling it…

You play or you pay…

I’ll see your Dan Lungren and raise you the execrable Lamar Smith, Ranking Member of the HJC

He and Dodd and Boxer (etc) were talking to you and to the House; they all know it’s dead in the Senate. If you don’t want to listen, fine, but please don’t act as if blogging puts you on a higher road than speaking passionately on the Floor. Thanks.

Funny how Bushco always gets its opposition to dig their own graves do their dirty work for them. In the figurative sense obviously.

The whole thing makes me want to crawl into a hole and hide.

What I really want to know is what does Chimpy have on all of these people to cause them to cave so easily? Or are they just shells of themselves?

Yea. One of the people that died was a reporter who took unflattering photos of one of the Bush twins.

But, LS, what Oppostion are you talking about?
I don’t hear any of that here…/s
(hi, you.)

Not stand on the floor of the Senate, say “I think the distinguished majority leader is doing the absolute right thing” and encourage everybody to get it over with so they could all jet off to Davos?

Pat Leahy is the Democratic equivalent of Arlen Specter. All noise and fury, but in the end giving up with a whimper. They are comfortable in their incumbancy and with the status quo. So they put on some theatrics at hearings to make as though they are fighting the system, and then they retire to the golf course to relax before the curtain lifts again.

The opposition needs something to do since Nancy keeps the difficult stuff off the table.

Is there possibly a cave, or closet large enough to hold all the skeletons it would take to make them Do This to us?

Leahy is doing a Specter: make a stink and pretend to stand for something, but in the end, cave.

How do you feel about Hillary not showing up for the vote on FISA?

Nice kneepads, Pat.

Don’t forget to look ‘em in the eye and smile when you swalllow.

Helps with the repeat trade, so I’m told.

Signed it earlier this morning. Found the link over at Glenn Greenwald before I saw it here. DFA is having an action call out to its members call their senators and to:
Report your call:

lol

Hiya!!

Cute. Invent a quote. Very good.

But you still haven’t answered my question. When you said Leahy folded, I asked what he was supposed to do differently. If you have no other choice, it’s not a fold, is it?

So: what was Leahy supposed to do, in your opinion, when Reid chose the IC’s bill as the base bill?

Is there possibly a cave, or closet large enough to hold all the skeletons it would take to make them Do This to us?

it must be a very deep and dark one.

RevDEb asks ”What I really want to know is what does Chimpy have on all of these people to cause them to cave so easily? Or are they just shells of themselves?”

Quoting Atrios:

While one can’t discount legalized bribery campaign dollars entirely, I do think too often we assume they’re the reason lawmakers do the ”wrong thing” when the simpler explanation that they believe the wrong thing is in fact the right thing is the answer.

Too many Democrats simply don’t have the values we imagine they do, and it lets them off the hook too much to assume they’re simply craven people who need to get re-elected instead of bad people who don’t share our values.

I think that’s fairly accurate.

As a former Edwards supporter…. with that little scale out measuring BO & HRC…. sure makes the scales tip over to the BO column.

I am a monthly contributor to the ACLU as a “defender of Liberty”, I appreciate their work to preserve what little there is of the constitution left.

It’s really sickening when you think of all of the brave souls who have fought to uphold our rights and our Constitution, and then you have these morons throw it all away for nothing; just because the boy King dictator tells them to. That is why I think they have been somehow threatened. In any case, anyone who supported this is a flaming coward.

With slime and stuff.
Eeeuuuuwwww.
(I’m tapping my toe, whistling and trying to ignore something here.)
Oh, I know, we’ve got 35 minutes until the supposed VOTE, maybe I’ll get some housework done.)
Hi El.

JTMinIA:
learn how to read. That’s nopt a made up quote.

” Mr. LEAHY. Mr. President, we have a number of Members who are supposed to go to the Davos economic summit tomorrow night, and I would note I have talked with Senator Bennett of Utah, who is the senior Republican on that trip, and the trip that is set to leave tomorrow night will not. We will put it on hold until Thursday, to determine whether we can leave on Thursday.

If I could have the attention of the majority leader for a moment. I appreciate the majority leader has been very clear. I happen to concur with him that this is important and we should finish it. All we want to do is to know how it will go. There is a Judiciary Committee amendment to the bill. I would not anticipate taking a great deal of time on that, but I think the distinguished majority leader is doing the absolute right thing.”

he didn’t have to give it his express support like that. He could have put a hold on it himself: any senator can do that. he could have backed Dodd’s promised filibuster. He could have inserted poison pill amendments.

Any number of things.

Spit.

What use is a petition? Congress will never listen to anyone who doesn’t have a wad of crisp hundreds in their hand. It’s useless. We have no protection from these Republican and Democratic monsters in Washington any longer. We, the people, are on our own. We have been betrayed. We have been sold to the highest bidder. We are mere fodder for the corporations to chew up and spit out. Vote McCain, at least we know with him, the world will end with a bang. Should make good TV.

Sorry to hear Lungren is your congresscritter. My rep, Sam Farr is a good guy and I can only hope and trust the emails he is receiving will be effective. Have a call into his district office to keep the nudging going.

“invent” a quote?

It’s in the post. I didn’t invent it.

Cui Bono?

Could this simply be about saving the telcoms from big lawsuits? That sounds insane.

The people must simply think that someone was and is out to get us and these telcoms were and are patriotic and the spying is saving aA.

The f*ckers believe security paranoia trumps the constitution. What else could it be?

I can read fine, thanks. Even more, I can restrict my reading to items that are relevant. That quote has zero to do with Reid’s decision to go with the IC’s bill as the base bill. By the time that quote came around, we were weeks beyond that point and Leahy knew it was a dead issue in the Senate.

Going farther, if you can think as well as read, you might wonder if speeding things up right now is in the interest of the Constitution. You see, if we come up against a time-limit, such that there isn’t time to do a conference, then the House might just pass the Senate version and it’s all over. But if we speed up now, given that it’s lost in the Senate, then the House might stand firm and send back a version without immunity.

I know that’s a little complicated, but it worth thinking through.

housework

there goes a lot of frustrations

Remember who were the other targets of Anthrax? The media. Now, who would target only Democrats and “the liberal media”. Wouldn’t terrorists go after the people who were in power? Why go after the Democrats and the media?

I apologize. You’re quite correct that taking a quote completely out of context is the exact opposite as making one up. I really apologize.

Now, tell me what Leahy was supposed to do when Reid went with the IC’s bill. Back up the “el foldo” or retract it.

Oh. Look. They’re back.
All the distractions didn’t work.
(LS, kindly direct the spit in the direction of the furniture I’m polishing. Thank you.)

Seems pretty elementary to me dear Watson. And who would prevent it from ever being thoroughly investigated…

And An indignant Pat Leahy speaking now in the Senate

Signed it, called my Senator, Barbara Mikuski–who backstabbed us–and wrote a letter to her and to my closest Democratic representative in the House.

This is unprecedented nonsense by the Senate. It condones illegality and unconstitutional police powers, and rewards those companies who did so willingly and in knowledge of the law.

I urge each of you to do likewise.

IIRC the ancient greek ultimate punishment was the expulsion of a wrongdoer from the civilization of the city to foreign barbarian lands for their misdeeds. How ironic, that punishment will not work there, most all foreign lands are now civilized, it is the barbarians that populate America.

LOL…

You made me feel guilty, so I just went in and looked at the dust in my living room and turned around…I’m going outside!! *g*

No need for Sarcasm Lessons here.
We’re pretty good at that. *g*

Signed the petition, and emailed the link to 10 others.

Not proud to be a Dem today, that’s for sure . . .

Oh, I lied. Made something up. Ha.
All I did was switch over the laundry.
But, outside works for me.

Roll Call…

Patience. We have to sit through Kit Bond one more time first.

We’ve been fighting for our rights - and the Constitution - for a couple of years now, writing to Congress, calling them, sending them rubber stamps and books, and they make nice speeches about freedom and protecting our rights, and then they fold, dang near every time.

(I don’t remember seeing you here when we were donating money to get their attention with those stamps and books. Were you using another name, or just lurking?)

I don’t buy this characterization of Leahy as the bad guy. He has clearly been opposed to retroactive immunity from the beginning. The bill that came out of the JC struck down immunity. I don’t pretend to understand all of the parliamentary manuevers that have gone on, but there is no way he hasn’t fought for the Constitution. Bare knuckle brawling? Maybe not, his gentlemanliness may work against him there - but I do not doubt his commitment, not for a minute.

I just want to thank Jane and FDL for being here in our time of great loss and sorrow.

And you think that smearing one of the few defenders of the Constitution is going to help … how?

Why not just attack Dodd, while you’re at it.

I signed the petition… not that I think it will do any good but because I wanted to let them know I disapprove of the actions they have taken :>(

The majority of the Dems in DeeCee have all been Kabuki dancers for at least 20 years. Many of the same names have been there this whole time, including Leahy.

The DLC was created in 1985 to infiltrate the DemocratIC Party from within, and prevent actual Liberals from passing anything that might hurt BigMoney too much. As they go along, they throw Dem voters just enough Liberal bones, usually social issues and not fiscal, so Dem voter will keep electing the Kabuki dancers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D.....ip_Council

This has been so plainly obvious for so long, it hurts. Why do so few understand this simple truth?

This is why Blue America is so important. We’ve got to clean house, literally. more and BETTER!

RevDEb asks ”What I really want to know is what does Chimpy have on all of these people to cause them to cave so easily? Or are they just shells of themselves?”

There are multiple reasons. One of which is all the “professionals” who are working the issue. Explaining that this is “really not a immunity deal”, but instead about protecting the country from terror and making sure that the intelligence community really needs the help of the telcos and if there is another attack and the intelligence isn’t there because of THEIR vote, they will go down in history as one of the people who allowed 9/11 times 2 to happen.

Fear is used, money is used, social pressure is used. And they also will point out that mostly DFHs are going against this. Where are the REAL groups who don’t want this? Where is the opposing money. Because money means “seriousness” to these people. That gives the journalists an X vs. y narrative and without out it, the rule of law is too abstract in a world where corporations rule the day.

The lobbyists will tell the staff and senators that they are real. We don’t have big organized PACs and people who will be there next year and the year after that. They will point out all the jobs that are in their state and how if this immunity didn’t get passed PEOPLE WOULD LOSE THEIR JOBS IN YOUR STATE. So not only would they be responsible for the terrorists attacking because the NSA couldn’t get the info they needed, JOBS would be LOST!

One thing that I wish I could do was to battle the LOBBYISTS in this deal. They are the ones bringing these arguments to the Senators and their staff. Who is bring the opposing arguments to them?

I don’t know what to make of all the pieces either. But Leahy sent out mass emails yesterday (or the day before?) saying he would filibuster..when it was clear he was not doing any such thing.

Jane -

What was Leahy supposed to do when Reid chose the IC’s bill as the base?

So Mike Applebee’s used to eat squirrels with a popcorn popper. We know he’s a nutcase. And like his fellow Repubes, he thinks Ronnie Raygun was a great Prez.

Perhaps we should call him….Squirrel Nut Gipper?

(does tommy yum still stop by here?)

funny

I can’t listen to Bond, will somebody note when he’s gone? thanks

I gave a measurable percentage of my paycheck to him.

What have you done for the country lately, besides insulting our hostesses and most of the people who’ve been here for years?

[mods: sorry for the tone, but this one sounds like troll to me.]

As if listening to Reid (now) is any better. Hanging on Jello’s nuts.

El.
Now.
But, but, it’s Harry.

He could have put a hold on it.
He could have spoken then, and since, against it.
He could have helped Dodd try to filibuster it.
He didn’t do any of those.

Jello and Reid, making out. JayBud went into “public service” to allow himself more power to GO WITH all that money! The bucks just weren’t enough for him! PPPPEEEEEEE EWWWWWWWWWWW Reid. How bout some STFU?!!?
I’m soooo over GIVE EM EVERYTHING THEY WANT Harry!

hmmm
thanks!

If FDL thinks I’m a troll for calling out a thread that I see as a smear, then they are welcome to remove me and/or all that I’ve written.

You, on the other hand, have zero rights to my history. I require no pro hominem help; I ask that you apply no ad hominem attacks. Take my words for what they are.

Is someone gonna bounce this nut or what???? and when?????

I have tried so hard to see Hillarys side. Asking here about dynasty…no answer.
This does it for me, if she cant show up for such an important vote she cant represent me.

Whenever I feel afraid,
I hold my head erect,
And whistle a happy tune,
So no one will suspect….

funny i was just humming that.

Is it time for yet another round of deep breathing exercises?

Signed!

a comment for Mistress Nancy and the Boys:

Gentlemen and Gentleladies of the House -

Are you, too, eager to be slaves?

Today America’s Senate joined the Roman Senate under Tiberius in fulsome capitualtion to the Executive.

Will you kneel with them, or stand on your own?

You swore an Oath to uphold and protect the Constitution.

Will you uphold the Republic and the co-equal power of the three branches of our Federal government, and oppose this Imperial President?

You have that power - and in deciding to use it, you can retain it.

But only if you choose to do so.

Honor your Oath - and reclaim the Honor of the Congress.

Make the conference committee a true meeting of equals; you have the power to kill warrantless spying AND retroactive immunity.

Use your power - or be forsworn and know that in your surrender, you helped destroy the Republic.

Look past your re-election and serve the People, not the telcos.

Deny Bush and Cheney a free ride on yet another set of real crimes.

Stand up and use your power.

Or in failing, forever lose it.

Unlike the Senate majority, the majority of Americans oppose warrantless spying and retroactive immunity.

The People you claim to represent are not so eager to be slaves.

Are you?

Oh I don’t know?

He could place a hold on the bill?

I’m just coming online. Give me a sec I’m sure I can find some arcane rule that would could have been used to throw Reid under the bus

Mc Cain is in a spitting war with Fidel!

Speaking of Kabuki…

Rush Limpills is doing his usual off-key song and dance about McCandyCain.

http://politicalticker.blogs.c.....ble-asset/

I still for the life of me cannot understand why people pay attention to this shit stain. You’d think being caught with viles of V*agra, on a private jet, with a bunch of men, going to a popular sex trade destination, would be enough for the self-proclaimed “family values conservatives” to say, “Ya know…this child doesn’t represent my beliefs at all.” Not to mention the years and years worth of other deviant behaviour.

But they still listen. Freaky.

RBG
Does whistling count? If I deep breathe in between exhales?
Hi Mare.

“He could have put a hold on it.
He could have spoken then, and since, against it.
He could have helped Dodd try to filibuster it.
He didn’t do any of those.”

Thanks, Jane, for your reply.

No, he couldn’t put a hold on it. And, it’s not like Dodd’s earlier hold did anything, anyway.
He did speak against it. Maybe not as early as you would have wanted, but he did.
Help Dodd filibuster? What are you talking about? Please go back and review when cloture was filed and who voted which way. No actual, never-ending-speech version of a filibuster was ever called for after Reid made his decision to use the IC’s bill as the base.

I just don’t get it. What’s so hard to understand? Reid got played (again). There’s nothing Dodd or Leahy or Feingold can do with him running the show. And it’s not the way of the Senate to go hissy fit.

Wow, losing our rights as American citizens really does fire up some passions, don’t it?

Not that it shouldn’t.

Hey, Oaxaca girl, you around?

Great letter Kirk!

John!

Any port in a storm?

Forgive my ignorance, but, I’m watching this and there are ALOT of empty chairs. Where is everyone? Standing in the back?

thanks spocko - praise from you is high praise indeed.

thought of you this AM when I saw five more advertisers showed Savage the Love - and pulled their ads.

thanks for showing the way.

What Kirk said… hope she listens Kirk… I did send her a note last evening @ her speaker bog.. not much hope it will do any good..but I just had to do something, other wise..
It is just giving up without a fight or protest…
Well worded Kirk, thanks for you effort!

???

Any chance we could stop with the kabuki and call it what it is, “bullshit”?

Seconded!

Stormy Weather

I think the moderating is doing just fine, BTW. (Thanks, RBG)

(Deep breath 1; Deep breath 2 . . .)

Thank you thank you thank you! I hate buzz words.

I think he’s just saying whatever works for you…

an american public who refuses to look at corruption no matter where it comes from deserves what it gets. for crying out loud, johnny q is in need of some tough love. i’ll see you in the gutter.

“And it’s not the way of the Senate to go hissy fit.”

It is their constitutional oath to uphold the Consitution…the telcos and Bushco have illegally violated the 4th Amendment of the constitution and that is an impeachable offense..if they give immunity, they are complicit.

I’m listening to head banging music myself

Did they or did they not have to ask for UC on the IC bill?

If Leahy’s was worked up about the IC bill, did he or did he not agree to UC?

Hmmm …. Trying to remember. If they did, couldn’t that be your answer JTM?

Johnny McCain: many of us want to hardly know ye. Mike Huckabee: Lord save us from his potential tyranny. We like Obama, but will vote for, and support Senator Clinton if she is the nominee.

People try to put us down
just because we gggg get around

I think he’s just saying whatever works for you…

Oh. Then I’ll just recork this bottle of 10-year old Ruby Port I just opened here.

On second thought . . . I need something to ease the pain of witnessing today’s execration (is that a word?).

AP - The Bush administration has instructed U.S. diplomats abroad to defend its decision to seek the death penalty for six Guantanamo Bay detainees accused in the Sept. 11 terror attacks by recalling the executions of Nazi war criminals after World War II.

Rage Against the Machine?

is Obama still there?

Did you mean excretion, because that would certainly apply.

Thank you LS.

As the Senate has shown them abjectly unworthy of showing the truth or shining the light, I find no eason to honor their ritual procession to desecrate the Constitution.

Fuck “their way” -we’ve had two years to see it for the miserable abject failure it has proven to be - with Dirty’s Harry’s willful sabotage as exhibit A.

Give us OUR Republic.

George W. Bush is one blood thirsty mother/father fucker.

Did they or did they not have to ask for UC on the IC bill?

If Leahy’s was worked up about the IC bill, did he or did he not agree to UC?

Hmmm …. Trying to remember. If they did, couldn’t that be your answer JTM?

IIRC, they did agree to Unanimous Consent. So that would make Leahy on board with 99 other Senators. Including, say, Senators Dodd and Feingold, and a couple others too. So, given that, I guess I don’t understand why Leahy is today’s villian. Why aren’t we screaming about Kennedy, Obama, or Feingold, or - fill in the blank.?

They are addicted to killing. Shudder.

yes, he prefers them dead BEFORE the war crimes trial begin against him and his boss, Cheney.

I agree that what the Senate is doing this very minute could easily be seen as a violation of their oaths of office.

But that doesn’t change one bit my point: this is not Leahy’s fault and to blame him for it is a smear. And I don’t like cheap shots against the few good guys that are left.

Only when there’s no risk to himself, his family, and his friends.

My Generation

Making a noun from execrable. But you’re right; the result nonetheless is a pile of excretion.

I hoped I die before I got old, like oh well!

Thank you, nahant. Gramma Nancy and her ilk are leaders worthy of eternal memory…so all those who come after may avoid the path from accomodation to abject appeasement.

That’s the one valid point (so far) against all of them … Leahy, Dodd, Feingold, etc. The UC agreement on the timing of amendments and voting.

If that is what was meant by “el foldo,” then I can only quibble about the extremity of the label and ask why it was aimed at only Leahy.

Was that your point, Jane?

A new Democratic president come next November. A new Speaker of the House and a replacement, shortly there after for Harry Tired Reid. I’d thunked I’d died and gone to Heaven.

I like Leahy too.

I’m not sure what he, as an individual could have done because I don’t know the “rules”, but I would say one dang thing, and that is the fact that Congress has not gone fully viral and nuclear to yank this administration from its “appointed” power since 2000….and in light of all of their crimes…

Karma is a bitch, and sooner or later….

Oh Well

We are watching the death of the 4th Amendment here. We are witness to the free est nation in the world decidedly turning into a police state. they are doing this in OUR NAMES. we gave the majority to dems in the Senate to STOP THIS FROM HAPPENING, and they have helped it along in every single way, but FOR A FEW. this is sad. this is like witnessing a car wreck. only sadder, far more victims.

Senate Rule 14 sec 4

4. Every bill and joint resolution reported from a committee, not having previously been read, shall be read once, and twice,

if not objected to,

on the same day, and placed on the Calendar in the order in which the same may be reported; and every bill and joint resolution introduced on leave, and every bill and joint resolution of the House of Representatives which shall have received a first and second reading without being referred to a committee, shall, if objection be made to further proceeding thereon, be placed on the Calendar.

“If not objected to“

What happens if it is objected to?

Actually a new speaker and Senate Majority Leader would come before the new president in 2009. But I think Steny Hoyer would be that much worse as speaker myself, hard as that might be to believe.

AP - If six suspected terrorists are sentenced to death at Guantanamo Bay for the Sept. 11 attacks, U.S. Army regulations that were quietly amended two years ago open the possibility of execution by lethal injection at the military base in Cuba, experts said Tuesday.

No matter what these clowns think they are getting away with, this is still our country, and our Constitution is still our Constitution, and no matter how many “bombs” they throw….or flag is still there. So they can just suck on that.

Hoyer is horrible. Too. I believe there are alternatives. If my party has the guts.

I’m not sure what he, as an individual could have done because I don’t know the “rules”, but I would say one dang thing, and that is the fact that Congress has not gone fully viral and nuclear to yank this administration from its “appointed” power since 2000….and in light of all of their crimes…

LS, I would like to see this happen too. My defense of Leahy should be construed as complacency at what is happening to this FISA bill. I am beyond enraged at the lawlessness of this administration, and the inability of Congress to rein it in.

OT - Just received this e-mail from Harry Reid

Dear Eureka Springs,

Tomorrow, I will bring the Intelligence Authorization Conference Report to the floor of the Senate. Section 327 of the bill establishes one interrogation standard for the entire U.S. government. This would effectively end torture by requiring that the intelligence community abide by the standards articulated in the Army Field Manual.

In order to attempt to block the ban on torture, Republicans may filibuster the bill or raise a point of order, claiming the torture provision violates the rules of the Senate. If the Parliamentarian agrees, we will be forced to try and waive the point of order. Either way we need 60 votes.

Already some Republicans have signaled they will side with us - however we need more.

Take a stand against torture

Every Senator will be forced to answer a simple question: do they support torture?

Do they support torture even though they know it is morally repugnant?

Do they support torture even though they know it puts our own Soldiers, Sailors and Marines at risk?

We are a nation at war — a war in Iraq and a war against terrorism — but this war does not give our leaders the authority to cast aside the laws of armed conflict. We need to restore our nation’s moral authority, because the most effective way to fight terrorism is to harness all of our power - military, economic, and moral. When we do, the world will follow our lead once again.

It may take years, but we can start by declaring loudly, and with one voice: America does not torture.

Take a stand against torture

Fricking Inouye voted Aye…

Why does it have to be Hoyer? The Democrats are determined to return to the minority so you’re probably right.

Petty covers that on his 30th Anniversary DVD and I had really forgotten about it. Mac before they were a lady dah girl group!

They already built the chamber I believe, a couple of years ago…I read it somewhere a long time ago. This has always been Bushco’s plan.

I have all but forgotten what “leadership” and statespersonship is.

What Leahy chose not to do: oppose unanimous consent.

He professes to understand the risk he professes to oppose the outcome - and caved on using his real power to stop the process.

And he is the Chair of the Senate JUDICIARY Committee.

That’s the reason to single out Leahy - he’s derelict in his leadership duty.

(in addition to being, as stated above, the Dem version of Specter - talks big about what’s right - and votes for what’s wrong in the clutch).

No amount of hagiography will wash that away.

As the wingnuts are fond of saying, “Freedom isn’t free.” That may as well apply to our lawmakers, as well. This will be a long struggle and we have many tools at our disposal. This ain’t over-not by a long shot.

Unfortunately, I think the person after Steny in the chain is Rahmbo. They seem to get progressively non-progressive and worse the further down the list we go.

damn right karma’s a bitch. you can’t escape from it. that’s why the rupublican’s imploded on themselves last election. it certainly wasn’t the democrats holding them acoountable. at some point in the near future, i’m sure we’ll see another fantastic karmic implosion.

Give me liberty. Or give me the Republicans.

Does FISA trump the Constitution?

What Constitution?

And the karma of the chickenshit democrats?

apparently.

We need to break apart the so called “system”. Or perhaps form a third and powerful political party.

I think it’s my favorite Mac song of all. I’m also one of the few who prefers the two earlier iterations of Mac than the one that became the so-called super group.

Kit looks like he’s gloating…

Hey Mary send me an email (can’t find your new email) so I can let you know who our special guest at the next meetup is - don’t want to say out loud and jinx it ;-)

(CNN) — He’s aggressively targeted John McCain ever since the Arizona senator began his meteoric rise in the polls, but conservative talk-radio host Rush Limbaugh said Tuesday he may actually be the Arizona senator’s “most valuable asset.”

Commenting on the mainstream media’s fixation with his feelings about McCain, Limbaugh said there may be more to his criticisms than meets the eye.

“If I really wanted to torpedo McCain, I would endorse him,” Limbaugh said on his radio show. “Because that would send the independents and liberals who are going to vote for him running away faster than anything.”

“What people don’t realize is that I am doing McCain the biggest favor that can be done for him by staying out of this,” he continued. “If I endorsed him thoroughly and with passion, that would end the independents and moderates, because they so despise me and they so hate me.”

Peter Green was a killer.

behind the dial-up curtain here - but I still have my (second hand) Future Games LP….

I had a dream last night
and oh the future came

Guess it’s a good thing none of could see how hellish that future would become.

He is..period..

http://www.progressive.org/mag_rothschild0308

digg it

Too disgusted to make sense, am going to pick up my frankenstrat now-music is always the best and guess what-that’s what we are made of.

What Constitution?

I’ve got mine right here, I have not given it over.

That’s Rush admitting that he’s disingenuous.

And how many each of the pink, and yellow, and white, and green pills have you taken today, Rush?

f10kin’ a

I could bullshit Madam McConnel..

Digging …

Senate Legislative Process

I am not going to go down without a fight. Do you hear me Hoyer, Rahm, Pelosi, Reid, the DLC and other artificially flavored Democrats. Assuming my party wins next November, they damn well better behave like Democrats.

now after blowing Bond and McConnell and Bush for two weeks, Reid is about to get punked again by the Gooper leader, who now will oppose his effort to get another two weeks so the House isnt pushed against a deadline.
The Reid man must be taking acid or some shit to think after he bent over for these folks that so-called comity would persuade the Goopers to not fuck him up again.
what a tool.

sad sad day!
I am with you, kiddo. NOT GONNA GIVE ANYONE MY CONSTITUTION!

don’t kid yourself, the dems in on this shell game. do you suppose there’s no oversight because they might be implicated? i’d bet the farm on it. i’d say allin so fast it’d make your head spin.

I have to say I have never been a Leahy fan. And I remain, at this point, committed to that position.

yeah, and BENDS LIKE A BREAK REID
JUST DID send me an email, asking me to stand with him against the torture bill coming in the Senate soon.
I responded:

Considering the current crash and burn of the 4th Amendment that I am witnessing as I type this, shouldn’t you change your name to “Give ‘em EVERYTHING THEY WANT Harry”, Harry????

It SHOULD HAVE BEEN the Judiciary Version of FISA, HARRY!

You just betrayed us, We The People, your country, your party, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights in one fell swoop.

WE ARE WATCHING, and believe you me, WE WILL NOT FORGET THIS DAY IN YOUR SENATE!!

Yup, Harry, THIS will go down in history, in infamy. What you did to American privacy and FOR illegal corporations and the Bush “crime family”.

Thanks for nothing.

Reid chose the version of the legislation most likely to favor Darth and the telcos because that is the outcoome he chose.

Reid isn’t being punked or rolled - he’s being of service to his party.

The corporatist party.

Not a Ron Paul guy-but what do you think-got good shoes?

Front Runner Ron Paul Calls for March on Washington DC

RTR Washington, DC - In a recent video posted by the Ron Paul Campaign, Presidential front runner Ron Paul calls on his supporters for a full scale march on Washington. Reinforcing his presidential bid he instructed his base “…Stay engaged, stay active and do not be disillusioned… we can’t drop the ball right now.”

His proposal for a march on Washington began, “There is something we ought to do, I think we ought to have a grand display… we should have a true march…”, Paul stated before cautioning his supporters about the risks of such an action. The leading contender for the White House alluded that a march on Washington could send as powerful a message as the money bombs forcing the media to take notice once again. Paul cautioned, “…at the same time if nobody shows up… it might mean that there are not enough of us, that we don’t have the energy… maybe we didn’t want to go to Washington.”

Full Story: http://www.restoretherepublic......ew/260/71/
sent from:

RestoreTheRepublic.com, 3149 Dundee Rd #176, Northbrook, Illinois 60062, USA

Damn Doc, why did I think you were younger?

I think that was my point!

That makes at least three of us. You, kiddo and me.

Lahoma.

Senate just voted 68 to 29 passing the wiretapping bill. Now it goes to the House. Reid asked for a 15 day extension; McConnell objected, saying the passage of the bill overwhelmingly meant the House would move quickly to agree and send it to Bush before Saturday when the FISA law susnsets.

I signed the petition to be sent to the House, sent it to ten others, and sent my rep Ciro Rodrguez an email.

HRC will be in SA Wednesday 5:30 pm at St Marys University; maybe I will see Ciro there.

Concentrating on Noriega’s US Senate campaign (primary first) to oust Cornyn.

OK
Signed the petition. Sure are a lot of assholes in congress.

i know… it was meant for people who still think that their democratic party is just gutless.

add me

Paul said today that McBush’s stance on the endless Iraq occupation is un-American and is criminal.

-G

Replied to Harry Reid’s plea for support on his little torture bill:

You must be joking if you think I will ever support anything you propose ever again after witnessing your torture and execution of the Fourth Amendment on the floor of the Senate today.

You are a joke, or a criminal, or both, sir.

Teddy

I respect Mr. Paul. I perhaps do not agree on his domestic libertarian views, but this man seems to talk some sense on foreign policy. Yes… I think it fair to say, I respect Ron Paul.

bling bling teddy

…I’ll see your Dan Lungren and raise you the execrable Lamar Smith, Ranking Member of the HJC…

I can beat all of youse guys. My rep is Henry Brown of the 1st District, South Carolina. Never heard of him? No one has because he doesn’t do anything but pull the lever when the big boys tell him to. I’m willing to bet his is the safest seat in the House.

Now I’m getting mad just thinking about him…

’bout a third of the way down

… Complex unanimous consent agreements establish a tailor-made procedure for considering virtually any kind of business that the Senate takes up. They are commonly brokered by the parties’ floor leaders and managers. Two fundamental objectives of these accords are to limit debate and to structure the amendment process. As two Senate parliamentarians wrote in the Senate’s volume of precedents: “Whereas Senate Rules permit virtually unlimited debate, and very few restrictions on the right to offer amendments, these [unanimous consent] agreements usually limit debate and the right of Senators to offer amendments.”

Since debate was limited to only four hours, could Leahy (nothing against him) have objected to the UC agreement?

Added.

L.

Rumors that Huckabee is giving McBush a run for his money in Virginia.

-G

RIGHT ON! to all of us, kiddo, lahoma, maddy and me, and I’m sure others have done the same!

Passes 68-29. 29!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Traitors!

I’m afraid to ask, but, are bucket warrants allowed in the bill that was passed?

Durbin up

GOOOOOD ONE!
I respond to these emails and email these folks all the time. do you guys do that too?

of course.

McBush is only five foot seven- but he’s bein eaten alive by an ankle biting Huckleberry…should be gnawed within an inch of his life by convention time.

Jesus Christ. This, the coming show trials with evidence garnered by torture.

We are Evil Empire.

-G

When Schumer caved on Mukasey, I put up several flaming comments on the DSCC blog. I might just wander back over there soon and see if they still have comments enabled.

well, to confess, I bought it as a UCSB freshman in 77 or 78 - and I think the vinyl had lost a few grooves even then….

I’m merely a middle-aged fart of (snif) 48.

(even five years ago, I overheard the young activists at Ruckus camp one evening…saying they’d bring the boo-bo du jour to the med tent “and se what the “old doc” has to think…

snif.. *g*)

Fortunately, the Goddess chose really long-lived parents with really long-lived relations for me to be born to.

I look forward to spening the next forty-eight years opposing the corporatists and their servants -

as well as taking the piss out of those who excuse, obscure, or advance their work,

So glad to find so many equally defiant souls here at the Lake.

A possible problem with a new law outlawing torture is the presumption that it was legal before and therefore any prosecution of the documented torture that has already occurred would be blocked due to ex post facto considerations. I don’t want war criminals who violated the Geneva Conventions to get off on a technicality.

I think Unanimous Consent means no Senator objected.
That would make Dodd and Leahy and the rest of the “heroes” complicit.

I welcome better informed information….while I am out in the teeny tiny orchard finishing the pruning of the last peach tree.

Teddy!

You rawking bear - can’t wait to shake your hand (paw?) in person.

Start with “Not one dime” will I give to support this Club of spineless … spineless…. oh can’t think of a nice word to use vs @#$#@

GOOD IDEA AND GREAT MOVE, JimWhite. I typed my little fingers off on that one, and wrote off Schumer and added ANOTHER OF THE MANY REASONS to write off his cohort from SanFran.

and where did poor harry make his plea?

Again, as time goes on there is less and less worth saving in America.

We are also on the threshold of the new terrorist threat roll-out too. Looking forward to all of the breathless reporting by Wolfie Blitzer and Barbara Starr.

-G

If you were forced to choose. Who would it be? Johnny or Mike?

We will vote for Obama or Hillary. Or perhaps both. Come next November. Obama/Clinton. Clinton/Obama. The winning combination.

JTMinIA where did you go?

Does your silence say I’m on the right path?

If I’m wrong put me on the right one

email. from “Give em’ hell Harry”. of all the nerve, in the last few seconds (last throes of the bill of rights) of the FISA vote.

good for you Teddy, looking forward to meeting yo at Suzanne’s meetup next month. Keep up the work that must be done, for if we don’t no one will.

John- Hey! Tried to reply to your invite. Is this your correct contact?

frisian320i at hotmail dot com

Seems to be a problem with my system recognizing it.

There are Leahys. And there are Dodds.

…I’ll see your Dan Lungren and raise you the execrable Lamar Smith, Ranking Member of the HJC…

I can beat all of youse guys. My rep is Henry Brown of the 1st District, South Carolina. Never heard of him? No one has because he doesn’t do anything but pull the lever when the big boys tell him to. I’m willing to bet his is the safest seat in the House.

Now I’m getting mad just thinking about him…

I’ll see you your Henry Brown - my district was dealt the Gramma Nancy card.

(I’d raise the ante with the Constitution, if it were still worth anything)

What’s this torture bill talk?
I ask because a lawyer here said that such a ‘new’ law would imply that it was previously not illegal. And, you just know that that is probably the intent.

Ah, I already unsubscribed from there a quite a few performances ago.

Jesus Christ. This, the coming show trials with evidence garnered by torture.

We are Evil Empire.

-G
reply

I was explaining parts of the movie Michael Clayton to three teen age boys that I dragged to see it. They youngest said, “Not enough explosions” the two others didn’t understand what I was talking about when I mentioned Clayton’s redemption moment. I said, “You know that scene when Vader throws The Emperor over the railing? He finally does the right thing in the eyes of his son? That is why Clayton did what he did, even though he might have had money and power, but he was tired of serving evil.” THEN they understood.

The American People are tired of serving evil. It appears a lot of Senators haven’t had that moment yet. Some may never.

I like to talk to them. I LIKE to speak my mind, and the timing on this one could not have BEEN more perfectly inappropriate. I always hit the return and let fire! screw em. it’s a tiny little thing in the face of all they are doing to us.

Yup that’s one of them. The one I check most often ;-)

And we have Tom Coburn and James Inhofe.

Leahy, Waxman, Conyers et al are nothing more than posers. They try and pass themselves off as principled politicians when in fact they are nothing more than members of the “club.” Who really cares about the Consitution? The constitutional republic is eroding away and yet there is nothing but bluster. Sound and fury amounting to nothing. It seems to be approaching the point that the only way to restore constitutional democracy is via a revolution but then revolutions only occur where there is an outraged citizenry. The U.S. no longer has citizens but rather consumers. Consumers could care little for democracy as long as the shelves are well stocked with foreign goods on the shelves of Wal-Mart.

I got Salazar here. he’s a disgrace. he’s ALWAYS on the wrong side of the BIG ISSUES. he SUX. i’m not represented there in my Senate, though he promised I would be when he ran. same ol same ol.
i wrote to him to “Take the boat out with Fredo” when he voted FOR the MCA.
asshole!

[Mod Note; FWIW, we hear the Feds frown upon talk like that.]

I raise you with a McCain and Kyl…

I think Unanimous Consent means no Senator objected.
That would make Dodd and Leahy and the rest of the “heroes” complicit.

That would be true; unanimous consent is just that and is not granted if a single Senator objects.

I almost hate to bring this up, but we now are outside the UC agreement, as all elements of it have been fulfilled. In his blog Holdfast, Matt Browner-Hamlin brought up that Dodd intends to make one last try at blocking immunity when the conference report (if one happens; cboldt is convinced there won’t be one) comes up for vote. He apparently said he would use “all the tools available to a single Senator to delay this”. Glenn agreed that Dodd did say this on the blogger phone call and that Dodd sounded pretty adamant about doing what he can then.

I’m so sorry! I FEEL for ya’, kiddo!

Ive got Bob Corker!!! And a stupid weasel, David Davis.

Hmm! I’ll try it again. But had a problem. Here’s mine.

piltdown at saclink dot csus dot edu

Specter

I don’t think I have ever been this disgusted with my country. The apathy of the American people will end up destroying us. For seven years we’ve watched the very fibers of this nation be shredded and yet nothing changes. Too many American’s just don’t care. How is it that 70% of the people are against this war and against telecom immunity and yet our government continues on it’s way, Democrat’s and Republican’s hand in hand.

And Obama claims to be able to bring us together. If this is what togetherness entails, I want no part of it. We need a fighter going into the White House because the Republican’s don’t understand anything else.

I was doing that too until the primaries rolled out as a Bright Shiny Obstruction and starting unsubscribing form a lot of lists. If nothing else the 110th incombination with the primaries have thought me that I am not a Democrat.

Drive by from work. Signed the petition, mailed it to everyone in my address book. Cannot give in w/out a big damn fight on this. Have moved beyond disappointment in the Senate Dems to utter disgust today.

Some great music up there, guys, thanx- have to watch & listen later, though.

yes, I see that Dodd and anyone else (ANYONE OUT THERE!!!!) can join him to filibuster the conference committee measure of the HOUSE folds.
I would hope and expect it. I think that Dodd may have figured that into the UC that he agreed to.
I would hope for some fireworks still on this.
It is a disgrace. Even the NYT email hedline says:

Senate Votes to Broaden Government’s Spying Powers

By a vote of 68 to 29, the Senate gave final approval to a
bill that expands the government’s spying powers and gives
legal protection to phone companies that cooperated in
President Bush’s warrantless eavesdropping program.

—-
We need to break apart the so called “system”.
—-

At least now we know who’s at its gooey center.

- Tom

Your in PA? I have craptastic bluedog Casey.

The apathy of the American people will end up destroying us.

The American people fiddled while the Constitution burned.

Here’s the official tally:
YEAs —68
Alexander (R-TN)
Allard (R-CO)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Bond (R-MO)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burr (R-NC)
Carper (D-DE)
Casey (D-PA)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Coleman (R-MN)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Dole (R-NC)
Domenici (R-NM)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Inouye (D-HI)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lieberman (ID-CT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lugar (R-IN)
Martinez (R-FL)
McCain (R-AZ)
McCaskill (D-MO)
McConnell (R-KY)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Salazar (D-CO)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Sununu (R-NH)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)
Webb (D-VA)
Whitehouse (D-RI)
Wicker (R-MS)
NAYs —29
Akaka (D-HI)
Biden (D-DE)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Brown (D-OH)
Byrd (D-WV)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Cardin (D-MD)
Dodd (D-CT)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Harkin (D-IA)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Kerry (D-MA)
Klobuchar (D-MN)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Menendez (D-NJ)
Murray (D-WA)
Reed (D-RI)
Reid (D-NV)
Sanders (I-VT)
Schumer (D-NY)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Tester (D-MT)
Wyden (D-OR)
Not Voting - 3
Clinton (D-NY)
Graham (R-SC)
Obama (D-IL)

Have fun at Camp Reeducation!

What was Leahy supposed to do when Reid chose the IC’s bill as the base?

for one thing, he could have objected to the UC ON 1/31 (any of them could have).

just because a senator is better than most, does not make him perfect. and jane is right to call him out when he’s pretending to do something that he didn’t do.

Ha! Same age as my baby bro. He went to Sac State and UoP McGeorge Law. The dude loves music maybe even more than me!

thanks CT

Thanks. My bags are packed.

(((RevDeb)))

Read Naomi wolf’s book; The End of America-Letter To A Young Patriot.
Explicates the process very well.

the new day Franklin’s, Paine’s, are among us-
Can I say Mahalo from the mountains of Oregon

My sister lives in VT long ago she and warned me about looking to Leahy for anything of substance. Her words are just as true today as they were 4 years ago. Leahy is “sound and fury signifying nothing” as far as I am concerned. Him and nearly all the rest of them (I know there are a few good men …and women. but onl a few.)

Actually it’s still a product of the House Restore Act and the Senate now.

Cboldt:

I don’t believe there will be a conference at all. I’ve expressed that point of view for a couple weeks, and really firmed up my speculation after researching the “form” and historical application of conference committee.

House and Senate differences can be settled by passing amendments back and forth (usually with backchannel communications so the back and forth isn’t done in the dark), but if the House is firm “no immunity,” and the Senate is firm “immunity,” then there is a legislative impasse. A conference doesn’t settle it, unless one body capitulates in conference. Meanwhile, PAA gets extended as necessary.

My magic 8-ball says “Senate passes immunity, House does too.” 50-50 odds on the House making enough noise to embarrass Reid on his scheduling prowess and provoke a second 15 day extension. But even if there is another 15 day extension, or more, the ultimate result is immunity roughly as expressed in the Rockefeller bill.

They’re both in the equation. There isn’t going to be a Conference Committee in all probability.-People like Leahy who have postured at the eleventh hour with hollow words who were mum during the FISA fight these past few months aren’t fooling any of us. Leahy could have led a movement as chairman of the Senate Judiciary committee for Reid to bring their bill to the floor. I sure saw a lot of Jello’s face on the floor–I didn’t see Leahy until the end and Jello has no more primacy with his committee than Leahy does with with his. So Leeahy was Jello Leahy as he often has been with important votes in his own committee.

We have the Blue Dog Democrats–and now we should have a permanant coalition of the Jello Democrats. It would be a big bunch of people.

From Cboldt’s Blog:

Looking ahead, neither chamber has an obligation to agree to a request for a conference, even if the other chamber makes such a request. Further auguring against a conference committee ever coming into being, insistence on its amendment and requesting a conference is a debatable motion in the Senate. Being debatable invokes the possibility of delay due to objection to voting, cloture, etc.

Possible outcome from Cboldt:

Impasse between House and Senate, or Senate capitulates.

Or, the outcome that I think is most likely, the House adopts the Senate bill after allowing the objectors to voice their objections.

I fold.

(can I be a Senator too, now?)

he’s just like arlen specter. magic bullet

Letter from Conyers to White House Counsel Fielding on Amnesty

H/T The Daily Kos:

Full Text of Conyer’s Letter

(can I be a Senator too, now?)

I’ll back you over Feinstein any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Hey, we still have our humanity, that magic bullet would be of no use, he is already filled with dust.

Any country that sits idly by as it’s constitution is trashed and that allows torture as part of the judicial process and billion dollar elections is not deserving of security but in need of liberation.

Specter/Leahy/Specter/Leahy… it’s a twofer.

I am exhausted from the massive disappointments of the past 8 years. I am not certain my immune system can tolerate much more.

I’ve been fighting some systemic viral thing since the beginning of January and finally took time from work today to see a doc. Personally I don’t think it’s a virus. I think it’s Congress.

That would be novel, sad day when the system has been corrupted to the point that POTUS can simply ignore all requests and is permitted to get away with it.
Get A few behind Mr. Conyers…is this the ticket? or just more bullshit.
Whadda ya think?

Signed, and thank you very much Christy and Glen for all of your hard work on this.

John in Sacremento -

I had to go pick up my kids. If you worked for AT&T or the NSA, you would have known that already. tee hee

You are sort of on the right track WRT UC agreements, but you need to back up a bit to get the whole picture.

Once Reid opted to make the IC’s bill the base, it was a huge uphill fight. As you saw, it meant that all the work they’d done in the JC had to be done again by amendment. Leahy tried to just get the JC’s bill substituted — did you get that part, Jane: he did what he could to counter what Reid had done to him; he asked that his good bill replace the bad one — but this failed. This seemed to embolden McConnell, who then overplayed the situation and filed for cloture immediately. That was too much for even the pro-immunity folks, since it’s a huge break in protocol, so cloture failed. (Cynical types could say that many people voted for a filibuster when they voted against cloture at that time, but anyone who knows what a real filibuster is would not.)

With no cloture, the amendments would have to dealt with piecemeal. The question was how many votes would be required: 60 or just majority-present. If the pro-immunity folks went hardball, they could force 60 on all, but then the bill wouldn’t get anywhere. Reid thought he was being smart by negotiating for majority-present on the important ones (in his opinion), in return for limited time and a final vote today. Every else agreed (as is typical when the ML works out a UC agreement) and the stage was set.

What Reid (and maybe others) didn’t realize is that the anti-immunity folks had enough votes to block even majority-present amendments. Plus, they did some neat tricks to get their way, such as DiFi’s junky amendment that needed 60. This way, Dems that needed cover could vote for DiFi’s amendment, which still wouldn’t make it, so they could go home and claim that they tried. With everything in place, we got what we got today.

Who is to blame. #1 is Rockefeller, but he’s a lost cause, anyway. #2 is Reid getting played by McConnell AGAIN, even after McConnell made a huge misstep by calling for cloture so early. (Even when they screw up, Reid still loses. He’s impressive that way.) #3 are the Blue Dogs. #4 are the silent Dems who were against this, most especially Clinton who didn’t even show up. Way the heck down the list are Leahy, Dodd, and Feingold for letting Reid screw them over (again).

That’s my take on the whole story. So, can we get in Leahy (and others’) face about letting the UC agreement through? Sure. But given the way the Senate works, if they had objected, it would have ended up the same (since the anti-immunity folks have more than the 60 they need to get cloture) and the Democrats as a whole would have been weakened even more.

That’s why I objected to the “el foldo” label. It’s a smear. Worse, it suggest that Jane doesn’t understand what happened over the last week or so. It’s a sound-byte cheap-shot. It’s below her.

Now, if you’re still reading, there is one other argument you could use against the smart guys who let the UC agreement go through (separate from the fact that it wouldn’t have made a difference to FISA): this was a chance to destroy Reid. If you want to argue that the importance of this bill offered cover to Democrats who might want to kill his leadership by going against UC agreements that he worked out in private, then I’m actually with you. I want to see a revolution inside the Democratic Party. I want Reid gone. I want someone who can at least play McConnell to a tie.

For Oldies but Goodies’ sake, these were the votes on the FISA bill in the House:

House Judiciary passed the Restore Act 20-14.

The House passed H.R. 3773 by a vote of 227-189

Final Vote HR 3773 House Restore Act

I raise you a Blunt x 2.

well i’m exhausted also. the people have let their country down.

My sister lives in VT long ago she and warned me about looking to Leahy for anything of substance. Her words are just as true today as they were 4 years ago. Leahy is “sound and fury signifying nothing” as far as I am concerned. Him and nearly all the rest of them (I know there are a few good men …and women. but onl a few.)

I emphatically disagree. Not a “Vermonter” but I am a yankee who has lived in Vermont for more than 25 years. I voted for Leahy in the first election I ever voted - 1980. He’s been my Senator for nearly 30 years and though I have not agreed with every vote he has cast, I’ve tried to reserve judgement until I read the letter he sends explaining his vote and the rationale for it. Invariably, I understand his choices. He is an honorable man, and a champion of the Constitution.

how come you have such clear insight on this, are you an ex-staffer?

JTMinIA February 12th, 2008 at 4:24 pm
Thanks,
Jane can certainly defend herself, but I think her take was looking at the whole picture and the absolute abdication of responsibility to the oath they swore to uphold by all, they did not stand tall enough, the fourth amendment was trashed. I am not anywhere near as tuned into the political machinations as you, just my take, but not meant as anything but an observation and mho. Peace, we be on the good side and it is herding cat time as always.

I’m nobody special. And more than half of what I know about Senate procedure came in the last week or so from cbolt and others on emptywheel, which is what made the accusation of being a troll and/or a newcomer to FDL somewhat amusing. But I’ve always been against simple sound-bytes. And I don’t like cheap-shots (unless I’m the one doing it!).

The big picture doesn’t come close to supporting an attack on Leahy or Dodd or Feingold. If you want to attack a Democrat (who isn’t an obvious jerk, like Rockefeller, or an irrelevant DINO, like Landrieu, Pryor, or Nelson), then one person you should be going after is DiFi. She’s done more damage in the last few months than most Rs. Mukasey. Her worthless amendment last week that ended up providing cover for Blue Dogs. Cuddling up with Jello. Yuck!

Specter has been better than she has for a year or more. And as someone who just left PA last summer, is now an Edwards county-level delegate in IA, that says quite a bit.

DiFi doesn’t finish well does she…and by the way you are no troll and I would hope within the bounds of propriety that we can always have open discourse, if we can’t we have become what we fight, but I still don’t think it was a cheap shot, and if we ere it is that we are so goddamn angry and frustrated.
This side of the fence is where all the (cool) cats hang and like I said above you know what that is like.

That last sentence will be my death knell(sp) if I don’t say it correctly.
This side of the fence is where all the (cool) cats hang and like I said above you know what herding all of us cats is like.
Whew!

Oh, heck. If Jane was just lashing out in anger, I could totally understand. So far I’ve tripled my daily dose of nicotine, failed to use the correct voices when reading Junie B Jones to my daughter, and didn’t even smile when chocolate milk started leaking from my son’s left nostril at dinner (even though it was hilarious in an “it’s-laundry-night-anyway” kind of way). But that doesn’t seem to be the case. Using a completely out-of-context quote to back up the idea that Leahy folded was uncool (Fox-like) and too calculated to count as lashing out. That’s a smear.

They consider themselves ruling class not our representatives.

Hat tip to your comment Teddy

I’m merely a middle-aged fart of (snif) 48.

Precocious auld thing - you

(too good to pass up, ;-)