While we were caught up in the political news, two separate news reports in the international press recounted the killings of Iraqi civilians by US forces in the past week.
The first told of the continued death toll from the expanded air strikes in residential areas:
The US military has admitted accidentally killing nine Iraqi civilians, including a child, during raids south of Baghdad. In a statement, it said the civilian deaths occurred on Saturday near the town of Iskandariya, 50km (30 miles) from the Iraqi capital.
It added that three more civilians, two of them children, were wounded "as coalition forces pursued al-Qaeda".
Witnesses say 20 people were killed in an US air strike in the area. They said the dead included 17 members of the same family.
In a statement, the US military said: "Shortly after the incident, coalition forces leaders met with a sheikh representing the citizens of the local area. The incident is under investigation. We offer our condolences to the families of those who were killed in this incident, and we mourn the loss of innocent civilian life."
The following day, another report:
An Iraqi couple and their son, 19, have been killed when US soldiers stormed a tiny one-room house north of Baghdad. The US military says its troops killed the two men in self-defence after gunfire came from the house, but local people say the victims were unarmed. At least one of the couple’s daughters was also wounded in the raid, in the village of al-Dawr, near Tikrit.
A cousin of the those killed in al-Dawr (about 175km or 110 miles north of Baghdad) said he watched the killings from his house across the street. Karim Hamad told Associated Press news agency that at about 2300 local time on Monday night US soldiers opened the door to the house and immediately opened fire, killing or injuring its unarmed occupants.
He identified the dead as Ali Hamad Shihab, 55, and his wife Naima Sulaiman, 40, and their son Diya, who was a member of a US-backed anti-al-Qaeda militia. He said the two wounded daughters were transported to hospitals and one of them had died.
AP says an Iraqi police officer speaking on condition of anonymity confirmed Mr Hamad’s account.
These reports – which include rare admissions by US forces of the killing of civilians – were ignored by the US press which instead continues to parrot the Petraeus propaganda that new insurgency measures are the key to sucess – or as David Ignatius celebrated today in his column "Learning to fight the war in Iraq, finally:"
The debate over troop numbers may be missing the point. What’s making the real difference isn’t how many Americans are on the ground, but how they are being used. That’s true at both ends of the spectrum — hard power and soft. And, as commanders learn to use these tools of counterinsurgency effectively, they may also be able to operate with fewer people and a lighter footprint.
Let’s start with the Special Forces: U.S. commanders say they are having increasing success targeting al-Qaeda operatives and sectarian militias in Iraq. "We’re killing a lot of people," is how one top officer bluntly puts it. Senior commanders describe an enemy that is on the run and can’t plan operations easily. But the recent suicide bombings in Baghdad were a reminder that this is still a very potent enemy, even when hobbled.
(snip)
As America looks to 2009 and beyond, it should consider that Iraq and Afghanistan aren’t all-or-nothing propositions. The U.S. is developing unconventional tools for unconventional wars. With this mix of hard and soft power, perhaps there is a way to stabilize these broken societies without the high human and economic cost — and political backlash — of a long-term U.S. military occupation.
Perhaps Mr. Ignatius would like to explain that last tally of the costs to the family of Ali Hamad Shihab?
Update: Dahr Jamail and Ali al-Fadhily have a devastating report, More Bombing Creates New Enemies about the air strikes south of Baghdad which confirms our earlier discussions here, here and here.
photo: U.S. Air Force photo of a "weapons load crew" from the Feb. 8 airpower summary.



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Siun!
Hi Suin! Zed??
And Palestinians are dying too.
I do not want my tax dollars going toward murder in Iraq, Iran, or Gaza.
Will Du join us? GG made an appearance during the Book Salon…!
Gaza is a gulag.
Back in the old days, like 03?, when I started paying attention, it was 3:1, i.e., 3 Palestinians for every Israeli killed. As near as I can tell, in the last year, it’s one Israeli dead, and scores of Palestinians. I figure at this rate the Palestinian pop will still overtake the Israeli. Israel just has to get more efficient at killing. /snark.
More Bombing Creates New Enemies
But, but, they hate us because of our freedom….
Gaza is not a place. It is an old timey rez.
nominate HRC and prepare for posturing of ‘toughness’ on top of the bodies of Iraqi civilians.
phased withdrawal occupation-lite will likely rely even more on indiscriminate airpower.
Nominate Obama & get U.S. involved in Kenyan civil war. Fait son jeux.
And what happens to the ones who don’t die?
If you have any spare change:
International Red Cross/Red Crescent
Doctors Without Borders
Thank you Siun.
The choice is somewhat clear. Come next January a Democrat or a brand new Republican (McCain or Huckabee) will be relocating to the White House.
Evening all …
and special thanks to Laura for keeping us mindful of how we can help.
In the last few months the Israeli government has tried to freeze and starve the Palestinians.
As some folks know I help place items in the FDL front page newsbox. As I search the web headlines I am constantly amazed at how many Al Qaeda leaders we seemingly kill on an almost daily basis.
As long as that meme lasts, I know we are being lied to and on a failed genocidal for oil mission.
srsly? have they got oil in Kenya?
Eureka!
yeah … I think AQ actually must clone leaders or something ..
We seem to have killed several dozens #3s.
And McCains first response to any foriegn affairs problem (GWOT or otherwise, will be more of the same). That alone should sink him.
The public, again, are ahead of the politicians. The public connects that resources wasted in Iraq with financial, fiscal and economic problems in the US. So need to focus on ‘less jobs more war’ McCain, as being a continuation of Bush war crimes, Bush killing, Bush waste and destruction, Bush complete futility and complete failure on terrorism and foreign policy.
I hope to see lots of ads with McCain humming ‘bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran’ That would drive the point home to people: less jobs more war.
From the Jerusalem Post today:
‘IDF should wipe out parts of Gaza’
Hey, eCAHN, weren’t you the one pestering me about being in the Hillary room at DKOS2??? I’m still hoping against probable hope that Hillary can get the nomination, but I also hope that if she has to give up, Obama will ask her to be VP. And that she will accept.
Typically, Israel cuts off water sources and food supplies to Palestinians. These acts are seldom reported.
Dropping bombs from plans is so cowardly.
So much for the brave US military. They do their killing long range.
Not to mention, a violation of international law.
This is what we have become. A nation that occupies another country and plunders it. A nation that tortures. A nation that lies. A nation that commits war crimes. Not pretty, is it?
I don’t like either Hillary nor Obama. But I dislike hime more than her. I find him an empty suit, with no there there. Depends on what your choices are. Edwards gone, so lesser of 2 bads.
Iraq will never forgive us. Nor should they. Imagine if some foreign power came here with shock and awe. And took our clean drinking water and our electricity. Killing entire families and having to stop at road blocks to a foreign power. Just stop. McCain will never be elected.
I wonder if those who voted to attack Iraq have any idea how many children have perished in that country since that vote. Well… you know… it does, after all, ‘take a village’.
Mosul people getting prepared for a battle (Iraqs third largest city)
so many words about Hills Iraq vote,but why wouldnt she have done anything she could to stop a war. There just doesnt need to be anymore killing fields. A nation’s children gone. How can any who voted for it sleep at night?
But…but…all our wars are Just Wars.
How can we tell?
All the Senators for Prez just keep on funding them.
we are a killing nation. 4 to 5 million in iraq during the clinton and bush admin.
“We’re killing a lot of people”? Such are the fortunes of war. And how many American soldiers are dead now as a result of the Bush oil war follies?
Thank you Siun for your reporting on year five of The Hundred Year Neo Con War. Here is another example of Nancy Pelosi terrorizing a Democrat, Dennis Kucinich. If you are a child molesting war monger Republican, such as Mark Foley, Nancy will protect you. This Holy War against Islam is for Oil and Isr**l.
The sad truth is that McCain has a fair chance of being elected or getting within range of being selected by Diebold and E&S(sp). With Hillary or Obama as our candidate, we will face a very competitive race. Too bad Edwards was blacked out. Edwards would have creamed McCain.
Look, we can fight over Obama v Clinton 24 hours a day and apparently not change each other’s opinions.
If folks would like to share substantive differences of opinion from each of them, feel free but please include links not hearsay.
But I’d love a vacation from the image wars which so rarely reflect the reality of either – I almost lost it when I saw one “reporter” at another site criticize one candidate for not detailing a plan for something after said “reporter” described how he had only seen a soundbite on tv. I was ready to scream – didn’t anyone ever hear of looking at candidates websites and actually reading their speeches to see what they actually said? or using the google to see what their positions and votes have been?
so include links for any candidate debate comments tonight please … just for my blood pressure
I always figure I just dont understand. But there is no excuse to be shelling a nation on its knees by air.
One thing which goes to Obama’s favor. He sopke out against the vote to go to war in Iraq.
Apropos Mosul, y’all might find this blog interesting: livesstrong“Sunshine” is a 16 year old girl who lives in Mosul (she reminds me muchly of our own dear Cassie). Her 2/8 post reflects recent events in Mosul, including that horrific explosion that killed so many people. She puts a very human face on the situation.
And, in a parallel vein, if you are moved, would you consider leaving a comment? I know from my own experiences with Iraqi writers how much even the simplest of words means, as it is proof that someone(at least) is listening. Please, if you can, honor their voices.
The use of an air war is actually very sensible – if you want to take an occupation out of the picture back home. Air wars decrease your own casualties so you can claim the surge is working – and none of the US press covers the deaths of Iraqis except for suicide bombings which are used as just another excuse we “need” to stay.
Yes he did. Due to factors like Lieberman being his mentor and his non- specific feel-good bipartisan campaign rhetoric, I trust him about as much as I trust Hillary. And that ain’t much.
Reality is, we need to beat the hell out of the Republicans. And to that end, we, in this house, will vote for Hillary or Obama or both, come next November.
Laura – I haven’t read Sunshine yet but will this evening – and will leave a comment. Hope lots of folks do.
The Mosul “buildup” in interesting in a weird way – Maliki has been announcing it and talking about all the forces he’s sending there for three weeks now … they don’t ever seem to arrive.
I understand what you are telling me. ;0)
Still can’t get over how Conglomerate Media mavens just overlook such plain simple truths about all this killing.
Ignatius reports “killing a lot of people” with childlike glee. Never mentions binLaden and Saddam were sworn enemies. AQ had little to no presence in Iraq prior to the Republican/McCain Invasion, and I seriously question how many are there now. The fighting has been Iraqis fighting each other (Civil War) and Iraqis fighting US forces (defending their country from uninvited Invaders). Now who exactly are all these people McCain and friends are killing a lot of?
Another common one that people like Timmeh Russert simply ignore, and have for years now when they’re asking their supposed “tough questions” is, WTF does Iraq have to do with 9/11?!? There’s still no reason whatsoever for the Republican/McCain Invasion in the first place. Yet, they drone on for years and years about al-Qaeda “in Iraq” and purple fingers and so on. Meanwhile thousands upon thousands keep piling up.
I just put our 3 year old to sleep. I’m watching her sleep…so innocent…every tiny little breath is a treasure to behold. Now I try to imagine a bomb landing in our house and her getting covered in rubble, only to die slowly….then I start losing it.
Only goddamn monsters can overlook these realities of what’s happening in our names and with our tax dollars. They use these people’s lives in Iraq as political football as they fatten themselves on cocktail weenies and back slapping on the golf course, while pregnant women, babies, children, and others get blown to bits FOR YEARS now, and for no justifiable reasons whatsoever. These sick animals, and their enablers must be stopped at all costs. Every single one of them. Forever.
It’s fascinating, isn’t it, how certain concepts–such as that we are an occupying force, and that we are (daily) committing violations of international law–are missing in the discourse?
(Thanks for stopping by Sunshine’s.)
Well here’s something from somebody known to a lot of people on FDL currently in Irak and who knows that part of the country very well
Dubhaltach:
TO the best of my knowledge we’re the only ones who gave the name of the village right.
PS: Before you ask the twins can’t sleep which means neither can I.
Obama Wins Maine, Giving Him 4 Victories in Weekend
If Obama is an empty suit, we need thousands more kids to grow up as empty suits.
Sunshine is wonderful but the comments are very American political…why? Doesnt seem right to me.
The trouble with air wars, among other things, is they generally increase collateral damage. And they make war more acceptable to our populace. And not incidentally, air wars tend to incinerate people and blow them to bits.
Precisely.
I was shocked – genuinely shocked – when Obama during the debate used the word “the dysfunctional government we imposed on Iraq” …we need more of that from all candidates and in the media.
I heard Phil Donahue give an internet interview the other day, and he laid it out -he was canned because serious discussion of current affairs on his show was bad for ratings when other shows were doing jingoisitc warmonger schtick. Truth, real debate over national security and true national interests was not considered important.
So, in reality, Russert, Matthews, Brooks, Dowd, et al are show business clowns. Using the term clowns is not an insult, but an objective description of what they do. Their programs like sitcoms, and they play stock sitcom characters. The goal is not to inform, but to keep the audience comfortably engaged and tuned in between commercials.
So, I propose we call them all Clowns, just for accuracies sake. Depending on one’s viewpoint, one can call them depraved clowns, or ignorant, or callous, or deluded clowns. What kind of clowns they are could be subject of interesting discussion.
But they are true clowns. Professional clowns. I will refer to them that way from now on.
You and I are in the same boat. I clearly recall your early opinions and comments. I have always maintained that it is essential to vote for the Democratic candidate no matter. People like Alexander Cockburn with Not A Dimes Worth Of Difference are wrong. There were many dollars and lives worth of difference between Dubya and Al Gore. And between Dubya and Kerry.
I’m ruling out the “empty suits” or the opposite for tonight …
substance of positions or let’s leave the candidates outside tonight
It seems somewhat obvious to Lahoma and I that we are building to some sort of nuclear assault in the Middle East.
lovely comment Bonkers … its so important that we make that connection between our kids and dear ones and what is being done to children and moms and dads in Iraq
just as seymour hersh reported last year, the surge means bombing the shit out of iraq. air sorties are way way up and with that untold indiscriminate deaths. i wonder how that works to reduce anger and insurgent recruiting.
Different posts of hers have garnered responses from many different countries the world over. I’ve noticed both anti-war folks and those who seem to see the US occupation as a good thing. Can’t say why they’re more moved to write….
What drives me a little up the wall is that when you mention Iraq to people who call themselves Republican or now the new thing with people I know who have always voted Republican is to say “we aren’t Republicans because McCain is the nominee but Conservatives” is that they all have a cookie cutter, non-nuanced response to Iraq that has nothing to do with the situation there–
that “we’re keeping terrorists from coming here by being there.” If you try to get into specifics they aren’t hearing any of them.
We’re not only killing so many people (ours and Iraqis, we’re cauing tremendous misery and morbidity and angst in the best years of their lives).
Great post.
My lady seems to be worried about how events in the Middle East are playing out. When she’s worried, believe me, I’m worried. My wife knows more about what goes in the world than I do. Plus she’s smarter than me.
Agreed. I think people are getting too wrapped up in specific candidates, and losing sight of the big picture. Same for people demanding that the convention decide things according to their own viewpoint, or they just might go home and mope, rather than work for the Democratic nominee.
Both Obama and HRC (and Edwards, for those like me who were for hm) are imperfect human beings and candidates, they are not saviors. The Democratic nominating process is roughly the same as it has been in previous electons, except the nominiation system is even more confused and broken with each state trying to maiximize its own advantage without a thought to anything else.
It is silly for people to think that things should suddenly be perfect according to their own preferences and prejudices just because they really like one candidate or the other.
People need to think of the big picture. And for presidency, the big picture is to keep McCain away from presidency. He will preside over another four years of warmongerning, counterproductive aggression, militarism and war crimes. Doing even more immense damage to national repuattion, and interests.
I prefer to call them Death-lovers instead of clowns, since they know damn well what they’re doing. They are advancing storylines onto the electorate to ensure people keep “voting” in politicans that won’t rock the war profiteer boat. It’s really that simple IMO, and people have been warning us about these Killers for many, many years, yet few ever listen, or hear it in the first place, going back to what my previous sentence said.
http://warisaracket.com/
(From EPU-land)
My accout of a Maine caucus.
When you place an idiot and a crook in charge of a country with the largest military budget in the world and let them loose in the Middle East, you should be very worried. I know I am.
We need to understand that some children are qualitatively better than others. Hence, as to the murders of Iraqi children, their deaths really don’t matter all that much.
That is fine. I was speaking in terms of their professioal roles, which I still maintain is that of a professional clown.
If war became unpopular, and their militaristic corporate sponsers decided to press their interests in another way, then the clowns would mofify their acts and conform to the new orders.
Recently, they have been death loving clowns, I will admit that.
Plus the Defense $ go to friends and families.
That’s the Republican way of thinking. Sad, but true.
important point Mack!
Pelosi has me fooled up until last Autumn, but I’m thankful we have a choice to end the madness.
http://cindyforcongress.com/
Here’s a textbook example of how to handle the Death-lovers, where Cindy absolutely destroys Tweety Matthews and the entire sham of our public discourse. (even throws in a few Smedley Butler references for good measure).
http://youtube.com/watch?v=NT_faGwBr1Q
Absolutely mind-blowing interview.
If we want better, we must demand better.
good old smedley. we need another one of those.
I resent the callous disrespect the Republican Party has shown toward the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Iraqi people and our own dead soldiers. We must stop McCain and Huckabee. In this house we will keep our eyes on the prize. The WH.
Siun a comment on that killing from somebody well known to you and to many FDL oldtimers, currently in Irak:
About Mosul – on tonight’s posting 3rd headline down:
(انفجار سيارة مفخخة يؤدي إلى انطفاء تام لمنظومة الكهرباء الشمالية الشرقي)
A massive bomb attack has knocked out the entire northeast including Yarmouk – that’s 400mw just gone. The GZG are claiming the target was a market but it’s too far away.
Sad, but true – I mean the way they think. I believe, as you do, that the life of an Iraqi child has as much value as any child – Muslim, Christian, Hindu, Atheist or otherwise. Even Mormon.
Right On, Brother. I resent it like hell.
Thank you for that, Laura. Imagine such a life at only 16. She seems surprisingly centered for all she is living through.
Yup, families
Thanks for the link to your site and the info Gordon.
For me, it’s helpful to get beyond the abstract and see the people
And, too, to do what I can on a daily basis, be that walking instead of consuming oil, writing a letter to the editor, commenting on a blog, donating when I can, helping educate people who don’t see what is happening there to be something that is their personal concern…. I can’t change everything, but I can change what I do.
And, I think it’s more than change in the White House that we need. I think we need change at a cellular level….
We have one right now as a Blue America candidate!
http://firedoglake.com/2008/01…..son-fl-08/
Everyone of us reading this can have a tremendous impact in stopping the killings of innocent babies right now, and in the future by supporting people like Alan Grayson and Cindy Sheehan. Now.
Lahoma is telling me that once again she thinks I am thinking and worrying too much. She asks if I have given any thought to the concept of Swiss Miss with marshmellows upstairs. She says she would like to read to me out of one of our favorite books.
Good night decent people.
okk and Lahoma
With luck, Sunshine will be Prime Minister of Iraq when Cassie is Pres. of the U.S.
Love to you and your dear wife, okk.
Guides! thanks for dropping by in the middle of the night!
And regards to mfi!
hope folks check that link …
Do you have any sense of what’s going on re Mosul … the ongoing “we’re going to send all these troops to Mosul” line from Maliki is sorta strange telegraphing?
It’s that most of the regiments are in fact peshmerga and the KRG are afraid that they’ll get their clocks cleaned.
back before the ‘preemptive strike’ invasion, i asked the question
“why are we doing this – there cannot be enough money in a short-term war for war profits to be a significant factor”
what did i know?
this ‘war’ has been ‘mismanaged’ in a very profitable manner
don’t know if this is by design, but at avery juncture, accountability is missing and contractor’s profits are astounding
the only consistant factor in Defense and Energy is profit
military and civilian life is irrelevant to these interests when there are no fiscal consequences
Laura – great video ! wow – thank you!
and very good advice!
Smedley Butler was a Republican for most of his life, I think maybe a life-long Republican. What has that party turned itself into? It has sold itself to power and nothing else. Used to be a big tent party.
When I think about the issues in Siun’s posts, the real goal for me is reformation of US politics and worldview. Whether we run Obama or HRC, or whether upcoming Democratic convention does things exactly the way I want, is secondary to that overall goal. Thousands of lives, both US and in other countries, are at stake.
scanned it. interesting.
Yes, it is. Without a doubt. Facts and history prove it.
Good post — just read it. Thanks. Yes, I think the answer to your question is that indeed transformation looks like “new” — and that is the underlying tension. New vs. establishment in whatever arena. Fear of being supplanted by a shift that one has no traditional standing/power in.
Siun — howdy! Thanks for always keeping your sharp eye outside the bubble of the homeland. Appreciated.
ah ha!
I had seen the first mentions of the plans to attach while scanning newsnow (thank you mfi) several weeks ago … and it was puzzling to see them re-announcing this exciting new plan every few days
effin GZG (that’s in honor of mfi!)
whoa! sister! so glad to see you here…
thanks!
OT, but I like this headline from Thinkprogress.
Bush: ‘The Experts Will Tell You We’re Not In A Recession’
Yeah, way to go Grand Old Nutcase Party. I guess after all these years of criminal and lethal oedipal horsing around by Bush Jr., he will follow his daddy’s fatal line on the economy during an election year. ‘You are just a working stiff, you’re an average f*ckh**d chump who’s stuck having to meet a budget and feed the kids and work 50 hours a week, or more, wadda you know about the economy? My very well paid well heeled experts say everything is peachy.’
Like it when the fraud of the everyman’s plain old common sense party cowers behind their pointy headed intellectuals when they need cover for their failed policies.
I hope he keeps it up. More trainwreck ahead.
Can’t wait to hear which bogus experts Bush can name who will assure us we are not in a recession. I can’t think of reputable macroeconomists who would assure anyone of that. But Bush Jr. surely has some lackies who will say anything.
How is the Kurdish region going to be affected by what is likely a larger than usual Turkish spring offensive?
-G
“the bubble of the homeland” is really astonishing, eh?
this week it was so striking as BBC, IHT, Canadian papers, etc covered these murders of civilians … but here nada … and too often our view of the world is shaped by NYT/WaPo even when we know they distort our own news
I look forward to Sunday nights. I say this svery Sunday and I know I sound like a broken record but I just can’t believe that we’re getting nothing about this stuff. Not, we’re not getting enough. Not we’re not getting the truth (don’t expect too much of that). We’re getting nothing. From anybody in the msm.
Thanks again, Siun.
It’s like them announcing their curfew of Mosul and then saying they’re not going to curfew the city only most of it. Or the Americans denying that they raided the dentristy faculty of Al-Mustansirya and in the process trashed a lot of it’s equipment and quite a few of the staff. And then admitting it. And then denying it again. It would be funny if weren’t for all the dead people and orphaned children.
I agree with everything here, just want to point out that the LA Times generally does try to report on civilian casualties.
As a veteran, fortunately, I did not participate in it, I would disagree with that premise! But, I do hate and hold our Maladministration fully responsible for our atrocities that have befell the Irakis…
Well, it just wouldn’t be nice to ruin that wonderful narrative about how effective the Petraeus Permanant Escalation has been.
It would mean the media would have to do more work and it might mean incurring the wrath of St. John McCain too.
-G
They didn’t do that yet? Hope they aren’t waiting for the American surgers to join the party. They got other stuff to do.
it’s not about the party. this is about elite wealthy families who have been playing risk with worlds resources. bilderberg group
They’re going to get stomped. Hard. Don’t forget that the Iranians and the Turks work closely together on this. How many people know that the Turks are allowed send regimental size forces into Iranian Kurdistan whenever they feel like it in pursuit of PKK fighters. With the full knowledge blessing and cooperation of Tehran.
Gordon – great post at a great blog!
I happen to love the caucus method – then again I was a NH person who loved Town Meeting. I like it when neighbors get together and discuss with each other. It just seems like what democracy should look like – always has.
Sorry for more OT, but gotta go, so this will be my last for awhile.
More GOP trainwreck. Looks like Washington state GOP tried to steal their caucus for McCain.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/177859.php
We Been Robbed
02.10.08 — 9:24PM By Josh Marshall
Here’s a press release just put out by the Huckabee campaign …
The Huckabee Presidential Campaign will be exploring all available legal options regarding the dubious final results for the state of Washington State Republican precinct caucus…
“The Huckabee campaign is deeply disturbed by the obvious irregularities in the Washington State Republican precinct caucuses. It is very unfortunate that the Washington State Party Chairman… chose to call the race for John McCain after only 87 percent of the vote was counted…. the difference between Senator McCain and Governor Huckabee is a mere 242 votes, out of more than 12,000 votes counted-with another 1500 or so… apparently, not counted. That is an outrage.
“In other words, more than one in eight Evergreen State Republicans have been disenfranchised by the actions of their own party.
The Rove Fantasy ‘man of the people’ his hiding behind the opinions of those in the ivory tower.
-G
Siun,
maybe links to BBC and other international news organizations could be a permanent part of the sidebar at FDL. many of us don’t think to look there on a regular basis, but we probably should. is possible?
We must call this insanity the Republican and/or McCain Invasion. None of this happens without their constant support, and shouting down of any opposition. Their debates have been horrifying how much they thirst for blood and profits. Absolute freakshow (no offense to freaks).
It’s not the Bush Administration’s Invasion…it’s the Republican Invasion of Iraq.
akak – thank you! I had missed that coverage and they deserve credit for that report. This section struck me:
The neo-con morons are creating polar opposite reactions among the nations in the region.
Saudi Arabia and Iran are moving closer to each. Ditto Egypt. Ahmadinejad is heading to Iraq in March to a visit too….I imagine that there will be some well timed incidents to knock that story from the news.
-G
Sadly Americans not only don’t support this war and occupation, but they are ODed and fatigues about news and so the MSM simply turn the radar off and the killing and the stealing and the chaos goes on.
The warmongers know that the ME is totally in chaos and not a threat and less of a threat the more disorder they create.
They want the disorder so that they can secure the resources will the insurgency picks our soldiers off one by one. They don’t care about soldiers. Soldiers are there to die. it goes with the territory.
The people have stolen our money, have killed out soldiers have destroyed a country, have killed a million Arabs. Lovely. What a legacy, all the make a few thousand people multi millionaires. Anyway, brown people don’t count as people to this crowd. All they do is use up air, water and food.
Anyone who supports this regime, this war, and occupation is a war criminal as far as I am concerned and that includes the little ladies who work in bomb factories. All complicit.
There is no justice in this world.
The Kurds are the largest ethnic group without a nation-state of their own! That is shocking that the Iranians allow such manuvers… Even the US looks the other way, or rather aids and abets Turkish reprisal…!
This is an outrage, indeed! Only Democrats are supposed to be disenfranchised!
“opinions of those in the ivory tower.”
weeellll.. being an ivory tower person myself…. I would perfer to say
“opinions of those in HIS ivory tower.”
Some of Bush Jr. economists have set new lows for professional integrity, and some of them have been well regarded economists whose service in the Cheney/Bush administration have shown them to be, deep down, really crude and antiquated ideologues, still fighting the free-market/pinkie commie frog and toad battles from 25 years ago. A sad sad bunch.
But, I do hope Bush Jr. keeps it up. He can still do some valuable service to his country if he messes up ‘less jobs more war’ McCain.
Good idea. I’d be happy to see a bit more of an international perspective – and not just international perspective on the US.
Is there anyone assoociated with this unGodly cabal that have not become moral lepers?
-G
There are many decent soldiers who think they are “defending” US and serving their country. If they are in Iraq, they are completely wrong. And like Watada they should refuse to participate.
When we are attacked for real, or there will be no problem getting people to defend the nation.
Our military is used for aggression. Not defense. When you join in, you sign on to THAT mission. That’s the sad truth.
OK
I gotsa know.
Which side are the toads?
You’ll have a hard job convincing Iraki of that. For the record Mohammed is a moderate. Also for the record some US soldiers shot his grandfather literally to pieces in front of his eyes when he was 13 and then hauled him off home covered in his grandfather’s blood – they didn’t even have the decency to let him try to pick the pieces of his grandfather’s flesh from his hair. I invite you to reflect on his mother’s reaction and how he feels about the people who did that.
This is not how you win friends and influence people.
Neither is creating 5 million orphans.
Or more than a million widows.
Or using starvation as a weapon.
Or sponsoring death squad.
There’s a reason why the US can’t get it’s allies to choke up more troops for Afghanistan and it’s because junior officers like me (bomb disposal officer captain, served both in Afhanistan and Irak before you ask) have passed on the horrified reports from our NCOs and men, together with our horrified reports to our superiors, who passed on those reports, together with their own horrified reports, to their civilian masters.
I was at the German war academy a few weeks ago for a course. Officers from all over NATO comparing notes.
You mightn’t like hearing it but I’d be nowhere near as polite as “death squad in uniform” in my description of them. That’s a broken and festering army you’ve got there.
There have been no sightings of non-morally bankrupt individuals thusfar. All have apparently sold their souls to Dick’s Cheney.
OK, we’re over 100. (And sorry, this was a great post, Siun, I’m just a bit distracted).
I have a theory, that so far I only applied to the D side. It was that the voters were saying “FU” to the media. Works for Iowa (HRC was “inevitable”), works for NH (Tweety’s assinine comments), works for SC (HRC is back). And it’s worked here in ME (where HRC was supposed to win, despite no damn polling).
But it’s alos beginning to work on the R side. Huckabee is cleaning up, once the media declared McCain the obvious winner.
Now part of that is purely the media – since the repeal of the Fairness doctrine, they have come to think they get to call the plays. But even among FOX Noise viewers, it’s common knowledge (somewhere aroung 2/3rds) that they’re getting biased, shitty coverage. (They just like that things are dumbed down to their level).
But another part of that is that your Joe SixPack has come to the conclusion that the only way he can make a difference is by voting the opposite way from what he’s been told. And, D or R, what he wants to do is make a difference.
This is HUGE. The media has been playing this as “chop”, tiny waves (Bush I v Clinton v Bush II). But it’s not. It’s huge swells. It’s the crashing of the John Birch Society, Goldwater, Reagan, Bush wave.
CT, it is not shocking at all. Iran has a chunk of what is ‘greater Kurdistan’ so they, like all nations don’t want to be diminished by losing part of their nation to a separtist group. Hence the cooperation.
The whole Middle East and the horn of Africa and Afghanistan and Pakistan are set up for a collosal melt down this spring.
-G
You knowwhat also strikes me? We have bombing north of Baghdad, south of Bahgdad…….. It’s all over the place, isn’t it? I mean, I could at least understand if it was a few raids in one area and we killed the bad guys (if we’ve figured out whop the are yet; or at least which one s we want to kill and which ones we want to pay). But this bombing just seems to be ongoing all over the place. Nothing is under control.
But on the bright side, I see that the Iraqi’s have adopted a flag. Benchmark? is that the “political progress” I’ve been hearing about? The Kurds are mad, though that the flag doesn’t have yellow in it. And some of the Sunnis wil still fly the old ones. What do we hope to accomplish in this nuthouse of a country?
Yes, me too. I think there is an inordinate amount of space given to military types to pontificate and justify their tactics. who can really believe dropping 500-pound bomb is a “precision” strike?
Hi foxman!
I know the wonderful folks who update our Newsbox try to keep an eye on a range of sources … very valuable links there.
And I always recommend at least scanning Al Aswat each day – http://66.111.34.180/look/engl…..rSection=1
and checking GorillasGuides
No.
Any other questions?
Today, I would concur with that, however, that has not been the rule…
to LAT credit, they also reported this
Amen. And our broken army is taking broken people, in order to stave off the wholesale revolt of the middle class that would occur if the administration imposed a draft. Folks tolerate the occupation now without thinking enough about it. They’d riot if their children were sent.
So who goes? The poor, aged-out foster kids, and kids with emotional problems. This last group, I believe, is a very frightening one.
We’re back to Confessions Of An Economic Hitman, Smedley Butler and Noam Chomsky’s Hegemony Or Survival.
Du …that is important information … the press here just makes it sound like “our” “allies” are lazy … very interesting to understand that our allies’ own soldiers are reporting back – no thanks to more of that!
Unfortunately, you are right, much to my shame… It is truly disheartening to see what has happened to both the Irakis and the military… We’ll be paying the consequences for many years, here and there… 8-(
Yeah. I’ve painted with a braod brush in criticizing msm for not giving us anything. Credit where it’s due.
Also warnewstoday, middle east online as well as Reuters and IRIN (I don’t think I can link more. But, there’s teh google….)
Really? I think the last time people joined with any sense of defending America was after Pearl Harbor.
But we showed em, we dropped 2 nukes on two cities crawling with combatants.
We’ve been bombing and napalming ever since. Since you’re too young to have been in WWII, what were the guys in your “unit” defending (against)?
IOW, the US has always maintained a superficial good guy story as it plundered the resources it coveted from its invented adversaries.
In general, agree with you — except for brown people with money. Brown people with money do matter to the elites of any stripe. Otherwise, how do we explain all sorts of USofA enterprises such as museums, universities, theme parks, to name just a smattering, flocking to Qatar, Bahrain, the UAE — tiny jewels rolling in money? It’s not as though Islam is not the dominant religion there, or that Arab dialects aren’t spoken, or that the people aren’t brown.
When was the last time the US army was used defensively?
Gorillas Guide, thank you for your instructive and horrific report…as well as the reports you filed about them.
Thanks also for the reports on how we are
seenknown.I’m glad that the professional soldiers with whom you serve have no illusions about our armed forces’ crimes in Iraq.
I wish our populace were half so well informed.
We do cluster bombs, DU, and we won’t sign the bio and chem weapons ban treaty either. Cute. Nor commit to no first use of nukes. Lovely.
Yea, but we need their oil and their loans don’t we?
Indeed we do, to float our boat in more ways than one.
Yeah for the good old days, when we could even do that right.
Grenada was clearly a threat to America. They were building a massive military machine and were going to corner the nutmeg market too.
-G
thanks for your links Siun.
the info is brutal but I think we need to know.
The wind is howling in NYC.
I loved to hear Alan Ginsberg reading Howl tonight.
NO!!! Not the nutmeg market!
And the mighty Panama… was that a Ronny or a GWWB adventure… I forgot.
go amy winehouse
GHWB..I can’t type worth a damn.
Yeah, a few tens of thousands of marines to shut down a handful of Marxist nutcases. Then we left the island in shambles, so they had to turn to drug smuggling to survive. Go Team America!
go away amy whinehouse
The nutmeg market — at last, riddle solved!
And the US response to this problem is to run around lecturing and threatening NATO members.
Gates is looking worse and worse by the minute as far as I can see.
-G
I will not be goaded into a spitting contest with ya, I served twenty honorable years without having to fire a shot in anger! Suffice it to say that we were trained to uphold the Geneva Conventions and I made many foreign friends whereever I was stationed, which includes Europe and Asia…
And then we did Haiti which had an elected government and was the first democracy in the western Hemisphere.
Thanks and good night, Siun.
(Greetings and my best to you and yours, Du)
Poppy Bush.
When a thug falls out of the US orbit of control they destroy them. I remember the reports about ‘cocaine and pornography’ found in Noriega’s residence. I don’t know about the porn, but the cocaine turned out to be tortila flour.
-G
I am not saying you are not honorable. I am saying that good people join the service and think they are defending the USA. We are not under attack. We are the attackers.
We don’t supply troops to the UN and we don’t defend the Geneva conventions. Now a days we are proud to step on them.
Yes, the List goes on only most memory banks don’t. Too much TV?
akak … in one of the links at the end of tonight’s post, there is a youtube of a 500 lb bomb … it is very instructive … and clearly not precise at all!
good night, Laura – sleep well!
(yay for the North Bay’s sunny weekend!)
And Fidel was another threat.
So we got posada carilles to blow up a plane with civilians on it after we flubbed the bay of pigs.
There’s a comment for you over at our place Laura
We did in Allende an elected marxist because he wanted to kick out Union Carbide and ITT and so forth.
I think a 500 lb. bomb would destroy my 4 bedroom house ..even if it didn’t explode.
We backed Marcos… he slaughtered millions but rented us Subic Bay to act like world cop down there.
Thanks, Du, I caught it–and eventually read it, through tears.
If you want to know about the porn, google “larry king boys town”. (That’s not CNN’s Larry King, BTW). Oops, wrong guy, sorry.
And of course we supported SA with it’s racist policies and Mobuto Seze Seko and the list goes on and on and on and on.
We really have a great reputation around the world for supporting democracy and the “geneva” conventions.
ah Grenada! such a worthy enterprise …
George I
SanderO .. thank you. We forget so easily our own history!
(and whineshouse, yeah but we got some good Herbie!)
He’s a good chap – known him since shortly after he was born and he sometimes has that effect on me too. I’ll drop you a mail during the week.
I forgot to mention we even bombed out own ship the USS Liberty in the Med to spark the ^ day war as part of a false flag operation. We almost sank ON PURPOSE one of our own ships!
I forgot… Vietnam was up our ass and we had to kick them down.
If I’ve never said it, well, Thanks.
B-b-b-ut, we had to rescue those medical students.
I read an article – I think in the NY Times Mag – once which said some governmenmt type had gone to the med school to see that everything was alright there. the students thought evrything was ok.
You have an excellent command of the list! Let’s not forget Mossadegh, democratically elected in Iran. I do believe our little CIA was involved in that overthrow, too, no?
First, we did supply troops to many UN efforts, under American leadership, we did defend and uphold the Geneva conventions, but, this Maladministration has seriously jeopardized our troops from here on out… Powell has recently mentioned that fact, I just wish he had stood up to Cheney’s BS back in ‘03…
keep going
I always look forward to hearing from you, here or anywhere.
Those who have been in the anti war movement for 4 decades have seen this again and again and again and again. The same patter of aggression.
And when a regional conflict breaks out. WE ALWAYS SUPPORT the wring side.. the powerful over the powerless.
We did it in Nicaragua, in Hongdurous, in Guatamala. and of course in Argentina where we supported the war waged by the generals on their own people.
For all of the rah-rahing about Ronald Reagan, he was a piker compared to the Bush Killers.
Reagan lobbed some shells at Iranian oil platforms.
He strafed a tent in Libya and killed an infant and some pilots.
Did some funding of goons in South America and Afghanistan.
Shelled Lebanon.
Invaded Grenada.
He really just slapped around a bunch of tiny nations.
The Bush’s? They’ve killed hundreds of thousands in massive ground invasions.
-G
Oh absolutely … in fact my family knew the family of one of the students and the dad spoke at the rally against the invasion we had on the New Haven green … there was no problem at all
Iran had a democratically elected leader who we had assassinated with the help of a one Mr Roosevelt which such a fine family name.
Thank you for everything, Siunshine.
I am going to bed and listening to some classical music or opera.
The world is a miserable place for most people.
Most people live to suffer only to die a painful death.
i thought the israeli blew it up.
GregB – Reagan was small compared to the crimes of Bush but read the section of Robert Fisk’s Great War about the bombing of Libya … it makes me cry
Good night to you, too, Kirk. Hope to meet you in person at Suz’s.
(Hi ES! hi Newton!)
we must start calling out the source which really started with the attempted 1932 or 33 coup. all those players are still in the game.
Notice I didn’t say that Ronald Reagan ‘won the Cold War’.
The war was called off by Mikhail Gorbachev.
-G
Evening Miss Laura!
Sander … good night …
remember, that’s why we – who have the privilege of comfort and all -have all the more need to stand up for our brothers and sisters
The US finally released the report which was classified for 30 years… We attacked the Liberty. It was a flase flag op and was intended to be our excuse to enter the war on the Israeli side.
Good night Sander
I want to thank everyone for moving beyond the candidate stuff tonight and having such a good conversation … we always need to remember what we are really fighting for.
And you do such a stellar job reminding those who may forget and those who may not know it to have forgotten.
Others live so poorly so we can live so well.
false flag
perhaps 911 was one of these
Not much to add, but Siun, I love your work, and always look forward to your work.
Regards to you, and markfromireland as well.
Ronald Reagan was model for the ‘Ledeen Doctrine’ of slapping around tiny countries for maximum effect.
Bush the younger thinks that getting the US mired in two disastrous, costly wars for years on end thinks that makes America look strong.
Having the Sec. of Def. reduced to going around hat in hand lecturing and chastising erstwhile allies makes America look like the flagging empire in decline.
No one thought Afghinstan made Russia look strong.
King Reverse Midas is almost out of chess men but still well stocked up on bullshit.
-G
Yup, call it the anti war movement, the dissent movement, the aware and mad movement, all the movements — if you’ve cared, you’ve dug below the surface. And if you dig below the surface, you get the patterns.
Meanwhile, euros are now being accepted in some East Village (NYC) stores in place of dollars. Fiddle, fiddle.
Siun — you always get interesting comments from your posts. It’s good at the Lake tonight.
Good because it’s not worth it. Honour is honour and people who served honourably know they served honourably.
For the record as I’ve remarked before I’m married to somebody whose grandfather was a Jew smuggler and who got chucked into Neuengamme when the Germans caught up with him. I only barely remember him but I remember the number tattooed on his arm very clearly.
There are lots of Danes born after the war with names like Andy or Ike or Monty because we do remember and we remember too that if it hadn’t been for an American general and a British one driving very hard and taking risks that we’d have swopped one tyranny for another. Because that was the deal the politicians made with “Uncle Joe”
Link?
I’ll pass on your good wishes to dad when we’re in touch next week ROnD :-)
Looks like a real possibility.
just google gulf of tonkin false flag
RIght on sister!
I really look forward to the conversations we all have sunday nights … everyone brings such great info and links that I learn so much!
google operation northwoods and operation phoenix
http://www.jonesreport.com/art….._flag.html
I’m familiar with the Liberty case, as well as Tonkin, and so on…what I’m asking for is a link to a report from a US agency that says the US did it…I will accept it may have been attacked for the purposes of a pretext, as you describe. But those planes and patrol boats that bombed and torpedoed the Liberty were Israeli. The question is, did Israel attack the Liberty for its own reasons, or at Johnson’s behest?
GVBV, I’ve written at length about all those cases, as well as gladio and a lot more. A US report that says the US did it. This declassified report…what I heard was that the investigator 30-odd years ago had gone public with their orders to falsify the results.
Yes, we do. Thank you Siun.
(totally ot – I adore Herbie Hancock .. what a joy to see him honored!)
Yes, thank you, Siun. Been reading the comments for the last half-hour, looks like everyone’s moved upstairs now. But this discussion needs to be repeated again soon. I feel so sorrowful of what is being done to Iraqi citizens in our name, and our politicians do nothing of any substance to stop it. I’m sure it is truly terrifying to have a 500 lb. bomb destroy the house ‘next door’, and this happens day after day, month after month. Who are the terrorists? We are creating generations of enemies. And Ignatius writing about the ‘political’ backlash of a long-term occupation? That is ludicrous, does anyone really think that it is just going to be political. Iraqis will continue to attack and kill the occupiers until they leave.
well said
Folks like Ignatious forget that people do fight back when you bomb their houses – see the link from Dahr Jamail and Ali al-Fahdily … it should be read by every senator and congressperson
That’s a great idea since they only seem intent on sending Qassam rockets to kill defenseless Israeli children.
Have not read any comments and as usual I get to the party late-my MO.
Thanks for the post Siun. I get beside myself with rage at the utter horror that our country has created. I get so sad, and fell so helpless, and as a man who feels it his job to protect his family I am failing because this is going to come home to kick our ass someday and I am powerless to stop it.