zeddissimo

Good Morning Christy

zedamondo

and a very Good Morning to all.

good morning all. Beore i lay down to sleep (night worker)i wanted to share my dream.
Its that the two factions of the Democratic party mutually agree to focus all their energy against the Republicans and the current administration. When asked about each other Hillary & Obama can say gracious things and refocus outward. Lead by example. Don’t do the one upsmanship.

and with that, I sleep

Anyone know the best source of analysis of Dem. delegate counts with methodology of count explained. CNN drove me crazy last night as they created a lead for H in order to have O catch up w. her. It was in a restaurant, so I could see but not hear. I was wondering if they had included her MI/FL delegates to get her there. So how to do they do it beside using bias and incompetence?

Morning all. Need more coffee…

BlueState — No idea on the delegate count. Still rubbing the sleep out of my tired eyes. But if you have a link on something, I’ll take a peek.

Morning Elliot. 200 days or less till our FDL Marionnaic Savannash post election breakfast bash. I have a note on the PDA to get serious about it around late August, if we want something downloadable. What thinks you?

have you tried Larry Sabato’s Crystal Ball?

Back in a sec. with last nite’ best count.

According to this, Hillary still leads Obama 1118 to 1093 in total delegates, including superdelegtes.

I’m looking forward to Brazile discussing or just plain cussing the McAuliffe/Clinton hijacking of the nomination process.

I don’t think that you can technically count superdelegates, honestly. They may make early commitments, but they aren’t bound by them — and often shift in the wind as public opinion moves through the primary voting. (See, Kennedy, Ted, the year he ran against Carter.)

“Hijacking” in what sense?

…or the Magic 8-ball?

The bottom two pie charts at the linked-to page give the breakdowns in terms of pledged and total delegates.

my DD and open left have done a pretty good job with the delegate thing so far…go see them.

In the sense that McAuliffe, Clinton’s campaign chairman is responsible for the current mess including Michigan-Florida.

Good morning firepups. -10 with windchill gusts up to -54 here in the frigid northland. Edward Tellar is right…snow makes a different sound at -30.

Good thing the water is always warm here at the Lake.

We Iowa Firepups need to protest Rove’s $40,000 fee to speak at our public University of Iowa. He’s called th”Architect” . Irony even in the billing.

Unindicted co conspirator and in contempt of the Congress…Asshole

McAuliffe has been manipulating the DNC nominating process for a long time to give Hillary the unfair advantage and it has backfired to a certain extent. If Hillary wins the nomination by illegitimate means, “There Will Be Blood”, so to speak.

Funny story about that photo: I was driving in the refuge and spotted it, and just took three quick pictures before it flew off. Then I went back to pick up my sweetie from her walk, and told her I’d found a Loggerhead Shrike and I jokingly said I’d find it for her again when we circle back through. Mind you, it takes over 20 minutes to circle through the refuge, so the odds of finding the same bird again were slim. Well we’re driving through and I keep seeing bits of reeds and thinking “was this were I found it… no, that’s not right…” and then suddenly I looked up and it was right there, on the exact same reed I’d seen it on before. So I took a bunch more pictures and got to share my shrike :)

Also funny thing is that I’ve never seen a Northern Shrike, even though they’re not rare birds up in Vermont. I just haven’t managed to find one yet. So my first Shrike was over 2000 miles from home :)

Rove story link for fellow firepups.
http://www.bleedingheartland.c.....iaryId=989

i wish donna brazille would just retire and spend her days with her good pal, karl rove. her leadership abilities have done enough damage to the democratic party.

i wonder how that rebuild louisiana committee membership bush put her on is coming along….

Bobzim — (1) All politicians try to manipulate the process to their own advantage. (2) No decision has been made as yet on Florida and Michigan changing at all, so it’s a bit premature to start talking about a scorched earth strategy. (3) McCaulliffe has always been a smarm merchant, so that’s not exactly news to say he’s acting like one at the moment. And (4) if you think for a moment that Howard Dean is taking any marching orders from McAulliffe, then you haven’t been paying attention to their animosity and mutual loathing.

Let’s not get all up in arms about something before a problem actually crops up. We have enough crap going on in real time without manufacturing more animosity over something that hasn’t even happened yet. Let’s hold off on the circular firing squad and let the voters have their say for a while first, shall we?

Instead of press conferences, Bush is just gonna go on Fox News Sunday from now on.

Why in the world would anyone in their right mind listen to a thing Tom DeLay has to say? This individual hasn’t a shred of a thread of credibility. Good gawd. The best that can be said of Mr. DeLay is that he is an embarrassment. The man needs to stick with what he seemingly does best. Killing bugs and breaking the law.

I don’t think that any delegates are bound to vote for anyone. I suspect it’s a rule or principal which is there for the breaking.

Where are the Edwards delegates figured into the latest tally?

Delegates from primaries are bound to the candidates for which there is proportionally elected representation on the first ballot. Superdelegates are not bound to a particular candidate, depiste verball assurances, per the rules for the DNC.

The White House now admits that President Bush authorized CIA waterboarding of detainees and would consider doing so again.

Common Article 3 of the Senate-ratified Geneva Conventions prohibits all cruel treatment of detainees, including torture, which the Senate-ratified U.N. Convention Against Torture defines as “any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession …” (Training exercises, for example, won’t qualify as torture.) Article VI of the U.S. Constitution makes Senate-ratified treaties “law of the land,” and the War Crimes Act of 1996 makes violations of Common Article 3 federal crimes, which are triable in federal courts.

I don’t think that anyone would deny that waterboarding constitutes cruel treatment. But Bush might be able to use the many bizarre provsions of the MCA to avoid prosecution. It would be interesting to see an analysis by someone with legal background. Here are two good analyses of the MCA that I’ve come across:

- http://www.asil.org/insights/2.....61114.html

- http://balkin.blogspot.com/200.....ought.html

Neither of them get down to the question of how the MCA might affect this particular case, were it to go forward.

More of the same here: Sunny -11°F Feels Like -33°F

Something was bouncing off the house last night, either tree limbs or lumps of frozen snow/ice. Need to bundle up and go check soon.

I truly hate the super delegate idea. It’s basically a bunch of people who have been assigned by party elders to keep the insurgent candidates out. It’s very DLC and very anti-democracy.

It’s a another glorious Oklahoma Sunday morning. Democrats: unite for the coming victory (please). We will throw the blackguards (Republicans) out on their ear. Come this November. Vote Democratic, if you will.

Sorry, Christy, but the powers-that-be need to hear that we’re not going to put up with that sort of thing. I could be wrong, but I feel that silence would be taken as tacit approval.

I also believe that citing examples of it happening in the past is not justification. Preventing the re-occurrence of these things is one of the reasons we blog.

In this Democratic home we absolutely detest the DLC. Good Sunday morning to you!

Can’t imagine -11 deg. Where would that be?

The good thing about it — if I can even say “good” in this context — is that a large number of them are elected officials. And thus, they know they are answerable to the public in terms of ultimate accountability. Most of them are very good at putting a finger in the wind and, if there is a strong public support for one particular candidate, they will most likely lean that way. They generally have and, since their votes aren’t even tallied until the convention, it’s way too early to start worrying about swaying that one way or the other.

IIRC, could deadlock with none of the candidates under consideration able to achieve a win. In that case, they sometimes bring in another candidate, a so-called “dark horse,” who would break the deadlock and possibly get the nomination. (So maybe there’s still hope for Edwards.)

I only want to “sway it” towards fairness. If Hillary wins it fair and square, so be it. But if her nomination doesn’t pass the smell test, I will not vote for either presidential candidate.

Christy– I agree with you. There’s no cause for alarm. For me, this is just in principle at this point. It’s an absurd and pathetic idea that I just find disgusting, whether or not it supports the outcome I desire.

North of Green Bay

So you’re saying we should wait ’til the deed is done and then complain?

I not exactly sure what you think would be “unfair.” Every delegate gets a vote, including super delegates so its possible that a candidate could win a majority of pledged delegates but not get the nomination. Would that be unfair?

Totally agree on the fair end of things. But it’s good to note that public lobbying and actual decisions are often two very different things. and McAuliffe has a tendency to play “throw spaghetti against the wall and see what sticks” with his ideas, but that’s a far cry from something actually sticking and, I think in this context, that’s all he’s going to get.

At least, from any rumbles I’ve heard thus far anyway, which isn’t much.

And didn’t I read that BUSH would authorize future torture?

How about this ticket? HRC/WJC. Good lord (I’m lounging in snarksville this AM). It won’t be long and the VIP (L) will come bounding down the stairs full of ideas. And I’m making breakfast. Or brunch (French toast, or is that Freedom toast? And bacon. And virgin Mary’s.

So you’re saying we should wait ’til the deed is done and then complain?

Since the superdelegate system was devised quite some time ago, it seems impossible at this point to complain in advance.

The unfair part comes in where McAuliffe rearranged the order of state’s primaries to give Hillary the advantage. When Florida and Michigan bucked, they tried to punish them and it blew up in their face. Now that Hillary has real competition they are trying to undo what they’ve done just to benefit her.

Sorry. life happened and that was a long sec. Here is the best there was last night at midnight.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/.....526#graphs

One suspects that Donna Brazile is PO’d because Hillary didn’t offer her a (high enough?) campaign position. She, more than any other establishment democrat, was responsible for the swift-boating of the Clintons on the race issue…

Re: Michigan and Florida — Nebraska just gave Hillary all the ammo she needs to get MI and FL seated. According to various news reports, the caucus rules were thrown out the window in a lot of places — this will give the Clinton campaign the ammunition it needs to justify seating the states hat she wants.

Not constitutional.

Good Christ. I’ve got this guy John Hagee on the tube. What universe did this being come from?

We keep hearing about Lahoma– why doesn’t she comment herself? Get her a laptop and have her join in!

Wow, Hillary tied “unallocated” last night.

Heard/read that Dean said he will organize negotiations to prevent a brokered. Come April/May.

This is from the front page of the Feb 7 LA Times:

Fratto said the nation’s top intelligence officials “didn’t rule anything out” during congressional testimony Tuesday on CIA interrogation methods, and he indicated that Bush might consider reauthorizing waterboarding or other harsh techniques in extreme cases, such as when there is “belief that an attack might be imminent.”

Time to make breakfast and freshen up - then check what was bouncing off the house last night. I’ll check back in when I thaw out.

So according to the constitution a former president cannot become a VP? Thanx for the info. ;0)

Planet Zion Apocalypse.

Good morning
Who is on FTN? Americablog is showing

CBS’ “Face the Nation” — Former Gov. Mike Huckabee, R-Ark.; Joe Trippi, former John Edwards campaign adviser; Karl Rove, former deputy chief of staff to President Bush.

I want to see what Trippi has to say about Edwards.

Caucus rules were unworkable because of enormous turn out that overwhelmed organizers and snarled traffic. Read FDL last night. If Clinton can turn thousands of people adhering to the rules into a cover for her breaking them, then we have a foretaste of what her white house will be like. And it’s sour, not make that bitter, as in bitterly disappointed.

My wife, Lahoma, is all around the ether. Commenting. She sometimes says a few words here. Hope you are having a great Sunday morning. ;0)

According to the constitution, no one who is ineligible for the Presidency can be the VP… …sorry Bill.

Can a Veep exceed terms limits, like Cheney for Rudy’s Veep, as the Rudiculous one proposed?

So the implication is that Bush specifically authorized torture in the past… …well let’s get the man in a cage dammit!

It drives me nuts that Bush can publicly confess illegal spying, and now torture, and the populace yawns!

Hagee is Lieberman’s buddy. Lieberman attended and addressed the Christian Zionist convention last year.

Some crap just doesn’t go away. When the haters like the Dobbs amd Limbaughs the Becks belittle others it gives cover to sh*theads like this.

LA Times

Fire Destroys Tenn. Mosque; Arson Eyed

By Associated Press
9:44 PM PST, February 9, 2008

COLUMBIA, Tenn. — A mosque was destroyed Saturday by a fire that federal investigators say appears to have been caused by arson. No one was injured.

Investigators found drawings of swastikas and other graffiti at the Islamic Center of Columbia, said Special Agent Eric Kehn of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

Daoud Abudiab, president of the center, said authorities told him the fire probably started around 5 a.m. The graffiti included the words “white power” and “we run the world,” Abudiab said.

“We have not had any trouble,” he said. “This is the first incident.”

…

There are no term limits for vice presidency.

We in this house hope President Clinton or President Obama would nominate John Edwards to be AG, with an eye to the SCOTUS.

Be careful. He confessed to authorizing “waterboarding”. But his Attorney General insists that the question of whether waterboarding is torture is “unresolved.”

My point is that Common Article 3 prohibits both torture and cruel treatment, and it is even clearer that waterboarding is cruel.

But such discussions quickly become a Humpty Dumpty game:

When I use a word,’ Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone,’ it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less.’

‘The question is,’ said Alice, ‘whether you can make words mean so many different things.’

‘The question is,’ said Humpty Dumpty, ‘which is to be master - that’s all.’

From Through the Looking Glass.

Poor Colin Powell. He could’a been a contender. He could have been someone. Wadda chump.

I see a few things here on the dem side. There are a whole bunch of people who are not thrilled with either Hill or Obi but will support either in the general because they want a D pres.

I see a segment who are strong advocates of Hill or Obi and are starting to get nasty and that level of “agression” should be directed at the Rs.

There is a perception that Hill is the insider and has all the big Ds pulling for her and will use all sorts of trump cards to win even if there is a growing groundswell for Obi.

There are some who say they won’t vote for the other candidate if their one does not win. The kind of principal that weakened support for Kerry and let the election be as close as it was.

The dems need to harness all the enthusiasm and get the people behind their candidate and selecting said candidate fair and square will at least help in getting everyone on board. No one likes back room deals. We don’t like favoritism and special interests running any deal… especially our nomination process.

If Obi continues to gather momentum, Hill and the super delegates SHOULD see what is there and step aside and support Obi enthusiastically.

If the popular support is equal after the primaries are over, then the two have to get together and work to get ONE of them elected. Waiting to the convention to decide may be wasting campaign time… unless they agree to each campaign until the convention ONLY against the repubs and not attack each other. I see a bit of that as the repubs seem to have moved to McCain. He’s vulnerable and he should be the DEM target as a party and our eventual nominee will then advance the dem agenda. First up, defeat the R’s.

LOL! One of the greatest lines in cinema.

We will support the nominee of our party.

I just finished watching his U.N. performance on CSPAN3. An amazing compendium of lies.

Powell is a complete tool, liar, and military flack. And his spawn is worse.

But his Attorney General insists that the question of whether waterboarding is torture is “unresolved.”

And I insist the White House is really painted pink!

Unresolved! How can anyone not laugh at that argument? It was pretty resolved when we put people through war crime trials for waterboarding!

Good Mornin’ All.

It’s sooooo cold and windy here, especially compared to yesterday. I’ll be staying in ‘the cave’ today trying to stay warm.

I have a question: does anyone have any exit numbers on the youth vote yesterday?

I’m tellin’ ya, the youth these days are so amazing technologically. I’m a little envious, but when I think about it further, I realize all us folks older than them have such a great chance of being the beneficiaries of their skills.

“compendium of lies”. I like that! I adore sharp language economy. ;0)

There is, to me, something inherently offensive at the term and concept and existence of a “Super Delegate”. It flies in the face of “All men are created equal”!

It offends me!

Well said.

If Obi continues to gather momentum, Hill and the super delegates SHOULD see what is there and step aside and support Obi enthusiastically.

It would be disloyal to all of her supporters were Hillary to “step aside,” simply because Obama has “momentum” but fewer total delegates.

But the rationale for having super delegates in the first place to to consider the long-term interests of the party in cases like this. They are there to make subjective last-minute decisions and they could take Obama’s momentum into consideration when they cast their votes.

There is sure to be a lot of lobbying of super delegates between now and the convention.

The point I’m making is that the rules are the rules. And Hillary would be perfectly justified in saying that she’s happy to allow the Nebraska delegates to be seated despite the fact that the rules concerning delegate selection were violated in wholesale fashion — and then point out that Michigan and Florida are far more important to the party than Nebraska, and denying their delegates because “rules were broken” by the state legislatures which actually scheduled the primaries (this is especially true with regard to Florida, where the state legislature is GOP controlled. In Michigan, the State Senate is controlled by the GOP, the House by the Dems.)

It is pretty darn undemocratic isn’t it?

There is a perception that Hill is the insider and has all the big Ds pulling for her and will use all sorts of trump cards to win even if there is a growing groundswell for Obi.

I’m not so sure that perception on your part is accurate. I haven’t tried to count them up but it seems like a lot of “big Ds” have already endorsed Obama, such as the Kennedys and Daschle. In fact I got the opposite impression you did. Maybe we see things differently because we’re different sides of this issue.

I’m not wild about Hillary but I just think if Obama is already tacking to the center during the primaries then we can expect him to tack way further to the right during the general election, if he wins the nomination.

Which brings me to your last point– “First up, defeat the R’s.” I don’t see the point in defeating the R’s with someone who isn’t a real Democrat. I sympathize with the conservatives who refuse to vote for McCain– why vote for someone you despise? And I despise people like Lieberman, Daschle, Bob Kerrey and Obama who are conservative Democrats way more than I despise conservative Republicans.

Powell made the mistake of lying down with dogs and now he’s loaded with fleas. Unless he comes out and publicly admits to either his culpability or his being played for the fool, the best thing that can happen to him is to just fade away..

I was flabbergasted to read this morning that Clinton is rationalizing that Obama’s successes yesterday are due to his flooding the airwaves with ads.”Well of course he won — look at all the advertising he did!”

Um, why was he able to do so much advertising? Because he had the money! Where did he get it? From 335,000 donors, many of them small givers like me.

That’s not an excuse for losing, it’s a reason why he’s winning. Rethink that spin, Clinton camp.

I wonder if these two egos (HRC’s and Obama’s) can get it together and come to aid of their party, not to mention the country and perhaps the world?

Howard Dean took over as chair of the DNC in early 2005. Most all the set-up for the rules for 2008 have been done since Dean took over.

Good morning from L.A.

What’s catching your eye on the blogs or in the news this morning?

From the Seattle Post-Intelligencer:

Obama, McCain Win State Caucases

What really caught my eye- click on “Scenes from the Caucases,” 1st entry in the Photo Gallery- 39 great pix of Democracy in action.

Exactly. Also, I read somewhere of a Sheriff in Texas who was convicted of something or other for waterboarding a prisoner.

So there is precedent in American jurisprudence that holds waterboarding to be torture.

Also, General Yamashita was executed by the U.S. military for failing to prevent war crimes. It’s called the Yamashita Standard in the Doctrine of Command Responsibility. People in a position of responsibility can be executed for failing to act. Please tell Pelosi and Conyers.

Morning Christy, morning dawgs.

Man, I was here late last night. Still groggy.

FDL Marionnaic Savannash post election breakfast bash

What’s this now?

We voted for Obama in our Feb. 5th. primary. But Senator Clinton carried Oklahoma. We are not disappointed with that result.

He already has. Powell is a good man, I believe. His kid, not so much.

I watched Hillary’s address to the Jefferson-Jackson Convention last night. She sounded the most presidential that I’ve heard her. It was very good for that kind of address.

“fade away” my backside! He’s just as guilty and as culpable as the rest of them. A lesser sentence for cooperation with war criminals and crimes against humanity, perhaps. He bald faced lied to an entire nation, for crying out loud.

Forget his salad. He’s just as guilty as the rest of them.

And this is where I say,

Let’s get the man in a cage dammit!

It drives me nuts that Bush can publicly confess illegal spying, and now torture, and the populace yawns!

Excuse me while I beat my head on the desk for a while…

People are starting to arise. And I hear the pattering of little feet upstairs. My lady uses size five shoes on a 100 lb. frame. Time to go to work in the kitchen.

You must not have read my link. Here it is again.

*cooperation with the conviction of war criminals and crimes against humanity* is what i meant
not enough coffee yet,
i’ll shut up for a while
:)

Goes back to post Iowa. Plan for recipe book so that the pups celebratory morning after election nite virtual brunch inspired by Marion’s daily postings of her always generous morning menu to wash away the yuk taste from the NYT columnists that she also decribes. We have a couple of suggestions already, from Elliot and others.

Going to work. that’ it till tonite.

Since Edwards was forced out of the race, due largely in part by the fear he engendered in the MSM, I’ve been vacillating between supporting Obama or Hillary. Today, I’ve made my decision. We all know what Clinton is, a gifted politician that is far to wedded to the old guard in the Democratic Party. Obama, though light on policy, represents a new path for the party. It’s time to take the fork in the road. Bill Clinton gave the Bush/Reagan administrations a pass on Iran/Contra. Hillarly would likely give a pass to BushII on his crime spree.

And right on cue come the pattering of little feet down my hall!

Powell wasn’t a candidate for sainthood, even before he got involved with BushCo: http://www.salon.com/opinion/b.....aq_powell/

Is it open to the public? Why don’t you go? Bring a pie.

A few points about delegates and super-delegates if I may be so bold:
Currently the total number of delegates is 4049. This includes the “super” delegates but does not include FL and MI. It takes 50% plus 1 delegate for the nomination. That figure is 2025. It is a mix of formally pledged delegates and super delegates to reach this figure.

Super delegates came into being as a response to the McGovern and Carter campaigns in the ’70s as both were basically insurgency campaigns against the insiders. In ‘72, Muskie was the party leader’s choice while Carter was just an obscure, one term southern governor. Elected officials who did not back the McGovern or Carter campaigns wound up not being selected as delegates to the Democratic Party Nominating Convention those years and did not like the idea. They felt that the elected officials should automatically be delegates, hence the invention of the “super” delegate concept.

If you disagree with the rules for how the Democratic Party sets up its process for selecting delegates and organizing its nominating convention, it is pretty much too late for 2008 but you are absolutely free to start getting involved at your local level for the precinct/town/city/county/congressional district/state.

Or try to establish your own political party with rules that make you happy and get your own candidates on the ballot and elected.

The apple never falls far from the tree. Have you forgotten Powells attempts to cover up the My Lai massacre. Colin Powell a good man? Not so much.

The New York Times did a pre-primary story about Columbia, Tennessee recently. Foreshadowing?

White men, in particular, expressed general fearfulness — over a possible terrorist attack, over an unnamed threat from Muslims, over Hispanic immigrants and over the weakening economy. These fears led them to reflect positively on Republican candidates, perceived as more hard-line on most fronts.

Read Marcie EW on the clusterfuck of the MI primaries. Can we just enjoy the turnout beyond wildest expectation pleasure for democratic processes for a day. Cause I cannot manage to fit rage about cirucular firing squads into my schedule today. I cannot even manage to spell it. must be like Nuklear.

Think I’ve answered everyone. bye pups.

Did Clinton really give Bush/Reagan a pass on Iran-Contra? I thought their options were limited because Bush pardoned all the top co-conspirators on his way out of office.

Also, do you think Obama, with all his talk of bipartisanship, will go after Bush/Cheney et al for war crimes? I can’t picture that.