![]()
It is conventional wisdom that any Republican hoping to become President must obtain the backing of the most discredited and extremist elements within the Republican Party. And so we saw Mitt Romney and John McCain dutifully humiliate themselves in front of those whose catastrophic policies as implemented by the Bush/Cheney regime have earned the contempt of a large majority of Americans and the hatred of much of the world. Why would anyone do this?
Romney's pandering exodus statement could not have been more insulting to the American people. He essentially argued that if he did not withdraw and leave a clear field to McCain, the American people would elect a Democrat and thus give the terrorists a victory over the United States. Never mind that nearly 80 percent of the country believes the conservatives have set the country on the wrong course, and a large majority believe the country would be better led by Democrats on virtually every issue including war and terrorism. Is the man really that delusional, or is this just more pandering?
Even more astonishing was the weeping and chorus of "No! No!" that greeted the chameleon Romney's withdrawal. It was as though the CPAC delegates had no clue that the man who had pandered to them for months and laid claim to Reagan's legacy had conveniently acquired his conservative views only yesterday, it having been inconvenient to espouse such notions in his prior habitat.
But the award for delusion must go to McCain's appearance. McCain was greeted first with enforced manners as he promised to consult with these faux conservatives, but that devolved into boos as soon as he spoke the words "illegal immigration."
What must John McCain have been thinking, as he stood there, smiling, waiting for the booing to end? The man is and always has been one of the most extreme and pure "conservatives" in the Senate, yet there he was being booed by people who claimed to be extreme conservatives but who were in truth only extremely radical.
The clowns who booed McCain for once having been insufficiently mean spirited towards immigrants had for seven years allowed America's image to be trashed by men without honor. They supported a lawless regime that destroyed respect for the Constitution, the rule of law and the notion of personal accountability. They cheered as the regime used unchecked executive power to undermine individual liberties, violated treaty promises, openly sought destructive foreign entanglements and allowed corporate greed to corrupt competitive markets. There was nothing conservative about this crowd, and yet McCain was there to beg for their acceptance.
McCain's presence gives the lie to the media's virtuous image of this confused man. Have they not thought of why he would so humiliate and degrade himself by appearing before such a group? It is not enough to say, "McCain just wants to be President and this is what he must do." No, the psychological drive is not just ordinary political ambition.
John McCain will lead the Republican Party to defeat in November, because no matter how he frames his candidacy, his platform will be to continue the two colossal failures of the Bush/Cheney regime: (1) a deeply immoral economic and social policy based on distorting taxes to further enrich the rich at the expense of everyone else and (2) a deeply perverted conception of America as a never ending military empire. McCain will promote the first because he simply doesn't know any better; he may actually believe there's something conservative about policies that decimate the middle class and working people. But he has embraced the second because he's still a tortured prisoner in a cage in North Vietnam.
In his quest for redemption McCain sees himself as a true patriot, so he will keep America bogged down in Iraq because he cannot come to terms with America's loss and his personal tragedy in Viet Nam. His/our humiliating torture must be redeemed in Iraq; it is inconceivable he could accept anything that could be portrayed as another American defeat. The thought of a Democratic President withdrawing troops simply because the American people want no more of Bush/Cheney's aggressive wars angers John McCain.
McCain's odyssey is less about America; it's more about him, and he would keep surging troops until we win and someone sets him free, even if it takes a hundred years.
Login Here
Spotlight



Support this site!
Keep
up with news
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About Firedoglake
Advanced search


RSS/XML Feed
Caw Caw! Good morning Scarecrow
zed…McCain for President!
I had a feeling Hillary wasn’t broke.
http://www.abcnews.go.com/Poli.....038;page=1
Good morning Scarecrow.
I am afraid I have to disagree with you. If clinton is the Dem. nominee she will be buried. Independents will go overwhelmingly to McCain as it will be an “anything but clinton” fest.
Scarecrow unleashed again!
caw-CAW
Both speeches were replayed this morning on CSPAN before Washington Journal. Yikes, that is one scary crowd.
Yes, beware of bloggers with straw for brains.
Good morning everyone. A light snow here in Cambridge. It’s quiet.
Nomolos: your scenario is how the Republican hope this will play out, and you’re right about the ABC crowd — lots of em out there. But I don’t think McCain can run and win as Bush III, and that’s how the Democrats (and we) will label him, starting now.
Morning.
Can’t say there’s anything good about it after yesterday’s embarrassing performance of the dems. I’m beginning to think that we have a Manchurian Congress.
Even more pathetic yesterday—I inadvertently left one of the Spans on for a while and it was showing Darth’s pep talk to the cultists. We don’t live in the same country. period.
Today I will withdraw into the world of chocolate—comfort food—as I prepare a sermon on the delectable treat for Sunday. I can’t take anything else right now.
here’s what needs to be done by the democrats though
EVERY time a republican makes the SLIGHTEST indication a democrat will leave this country in more harm the democrat MUST laugh in the face of the republicans and THEN ATTACK
“Americans that want their nations security protected will NEVER VOTE FOR A REPUBLICAN AGAIN”
and follow with something along these lines;
“these republicans have done NOTHING but let us down, they abandoned our miliatary and now it’s in a state of exhaustion, both personel and equiptment where now we have to PURCHASE our militia
THE DEMOCRATS WILL REBUILD THE MILITARY REPUBLICANS HAVE DESTROYED
contrary to wthe republicans, WE will support our returning heroes, WE will return states militia assets to where they befolen and WE will return then force and honor back to the armed forces of the unites states of america
the republicans have SOME nerve making believe they have done anything but bring RUIN to our national security
and I repeat, Americans that want their nations security protected will NEVER VOTE FOR A REPUBLICAN AGAIN”
Definitely agree with you on this point. McCain also has his *story* too well imbedded in the MSM talking points and Amurrricans minds to be able to put much dent in it and, Dog knows, the dims have no skill or stomach for a well-planned swift-boating campaign.
It’s been interesting listening to the spin put on the booing during mccain’s speech by the thugs, so-called news mouths and pundits since yesterday; a foretaste of things to come.
The crazies will be pushing the “clinton 2″ meme and with great effect I fear.
I do not believe that the crazies have a ready answer or attack scenario for obama not that I support his candidacy but I do think he is a “safer” choice for defeating the goopers. Of course, as many have pointed out, the Dem prez. will be four and out as he will have to increase taxes to pay for the bushco disasters.
RE Hillary vs McCain: Here’s the twin themes I’m talking about:
Howard Dean made the same two points a couple nights back.
McCain really thinks he’s going to be President, he can just taste it!
How to win in November.
Call a meeting today between Clinton and Obama.
Promise Obama that he will be the candidate in 2012.
Agree on a Clinton/Obama ticket.
Fuck the Republicans starting today on a united front.
I can dream, right?
McCain will surely reap some benefit from all the time he spent chatting up the media on his bus while his campaign was tanking. No way to measure that.
I’m still agnostic about which Dem candidate is more likely to beat him.
Listening to the R’s one wonders if they inhabit a completely different world. How can the facts be so different?
This leads to the conclusion that what we are presented with by all pols is a sort of spin of what they want the world to look like to support their “agenda”.
I like to think that my view is more fact based and when I hear a speech such as Mitt of Mc I simply think these people are delusional or liars or both. And the MSM is simply not getting the truth out, content to spin the world of illusion.
The USA has been involved with torture for decades. In latin America right through today. Where was the outrage then? Why can’t we have a reality based conversation about the world?
People in the EU pay 2x for gas, hold one job per family usually, have 6 wks vacation, free health care, free education, little debt, good pensions and…. we have a better system that everyone is dying to come here to live? Hellooooooooooo????????????
We are now dragging the entire world’s economy down because of our “premier” financial institutions and their “investment” strategies and we have bailed out huge corporations and continue to do so. Our infant mortality is nothing to rave about and we are 19th in the world in literacy. Hellllooooooooooooo?
Reality check. America is in the tank.
Good morning from L.A. Some excellent observations up there, Scarecrow. I always appreciate the clarity with which you lay out your points.
Personally, I’ve always felt that John McCain was tortured equally in spirit & mind as by the physical cruelty that left his body broken. He returned w/both spirit & thought process warped.
Can’t refight & win Vietnam in Iraq. Good meme to put out there, because so true.
McCain hugging GWB= devastating, disastrous war in Vietnam embracing devastating, disastrous war in Iraq.
And by the way, how come no EU nation feels the need to spend $.5TT on defense to protect their “assets”, their “homeland”… their people… their democracy… their country? Why do we need to spend so much on the DOD? WHY?
I’m beginning to think the hard-righties are among the most gullible Americans yet. They bought Mitt Romney’s claim of conservatism when his very recent history belies it. Why? Because the clip-art salesman said what they wanted to hear.
It’s like having terminal cancer and then believing any doctor who will tell you that you don’t.
Scarecrow, where did you get the 80% statistic from?
‘morning all… coffee is ready…. welcome to Friday!
I thought Mittens, when he made his terrorists/Clinton/Obama statement was implying that Clinton/Obama WERE the terrorists….
but I don’t put anything past ‘em…
On Issues of Romney’s departure and Hillary vs McCain this from the WSJ today: http://online.wsj.com/article/.....mmentaries by, well, Bobo’s Mom, Nono.
“Promise Obama that he will be the candidate in 2012.”
Promises in the political arena are of less value than our dollar is right now.
I don’t think this is acceptable to Senator Obama.
follow the money.
Like my grandpappy always says:
“If it was good enough for the Khmer Rouge…it’s good enough for US!” http://patriotboy.blogspot.com.....rimer.html
Of course WE know that we are having our tax dollars sent to corporations for nothing more than profit producing useless war and war things.
But why isn’t this concept being discussed. It is assumed that we need the military… a strong military… a better military… Why does no one ask WHY WHY WHY???
They bring some budget with procurement requests and don’t argue about the request, but about the AMOUNT as if it is a priori necessary. Who says?
On democracynow, the guest from Nation magazine just said that Obama’s economic advisors recommend the partial privatization of social security.
You are probably right but I’m a desperate man.
If we lose to the Repugs in 2008, I’m leaving.
Obama is young and I hope he has the foresight to perhaps
put the Party ahead of his personal ambitions (I’m dreaming again).
Let’s face it, can you deal with a Republican in 2008?
I can’t.
Look, we have two good candidates, let’s not blow it…
Jeeze H christ!
Who are these econ advisers?
I don’t think this will wash. Wall street has proven for decades that they are completely incompetent with managing money and rating “investments” and performance of corporations… Enron and WorldCom come to mind… Mortgage anyone?
Whoa!
privatization is such a sinister word
Could we actually include things other than heresay at FDL please -somebody said, somebody said, somebody said…. Whether it is health care or socal security, it is Congress that will have a key say in the final product. I don’t know which of the two is better positioned to bring together Republians and Democrats on that, but I do like the fact that Obama has promised to hold related discussions on C-span.
I worry about Obama’s SS plan and I worry about his health care plan…
Our democracy is on life support… we need a fucking miracle.
You wonder why I spend quality time on my fantasy Baseball league?
No, I can’t deal with McCain as president. I will leave too. I’ve been pondering that possiblity for many years now. I have a responsibility to my family until 2010/11. After that, I’m free!!! :) I love what my country once was, but its deterioration has left me longing for something different than what it has become. If I leave, it will not be a happy or satisfying departure.
Kuttner doesn’t like Obama’s economic advisors either. “You must wonder about the company he keeps.”
NNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooo_______________
JFC.
and clinton’s “retirement plan” looks like a stealth version. is the only way to protect SS to elect an R or the D might actually be motivated?
did you watch our congress yesterday?
Top of the morning to crow ,
Never misunderestimate the average american.
I had a post in Super bowl Sunday that said”What about the 1 million Iraqis we’ve killed?”
Bumped into someone yesterday who asked “what was the rest of the story the paper must have left off?” WTF?
I told you who said it. Just replay democracynow when they get it up later today. The guest is a reporter from Nation magazine who has studied the economic advisers & program that Obama is propounding.
Whatever congress comes us with will start with the prez. If it’s off the table for prez, congress most likely won’t go there.
Juan Cole does a comparison of Nixon’s 1969 “Silent Majority” speech w/a typical McCain stump speech & finds eery similarities if you substitute “Vietnam” for “Iraq” & vice versa:
McCain as Nixon?
Agreed. Manchurian Congress. It’s my new meme. Try it on for size.
democracynow (new one) sez both Clinton & Obama suffer from influence peddling from nuke power industry.
If egregious weren’t sleeping, she’d recommend homemade cookies, maybe ones like these
I didn’t, but I read about it. This is why, in part, I fear that because Hillary (like Bill) is so polarizing (or said another way, so unifying for the Republicans) that the whole time of her presidency they will do what they can to thwart every Dem option.
You in fact may be leaving but not where you think. Google FEMA camps to check your new accommodations,the intake lobby looks quite inviting.
I did and it was disgusting.
The 110th Congress is an embarassment.
Reid and Pelosi must go.
Feingold and Barney Frank must come in.
How many times are we going to be kicked in the balls.
Our nation is in peril, unless we unite and unite quickly.
I’m fucking sick of Tweety and MSNBC with these primaries.
How much can you take? Night after night. Overkill!
The issues are great, but our Republic is sick.
I wonder about the company Kuttner keeps.
Church having the Feast of Decadent Chocolate this Sunday after service. I may try them. Thanx. Figuring out what else to make. Lots of choices.
EPU’ed from down below.
n response to Marion in Savannah @ 41
People were asking after you c. midnite. It was a gesture of pure friendship at a time of rather testy exchanges inter and intra-blog. So with emotions running so high, the pups showed that first and foremost after the constitution and the rule of law, they care about eachother. it was neat.
Jane would want me to say Blue America, but for me people comes before anti party.
Anyway , did you hear it?
Yeah, that possiblity is frightening. I can’t decide if it’s plausible or just fear-mongering. Obviously, I don’t want to risk it being the former. Having said that, I guess the fear-mongerers have succeeded where I’m concerned. I hate that!
but but but the primaries have been a Great! bright shiny object.
Remember, it’s in the interest of the Jihadi’s to have these dopes in charge and they’ll to what they can to “scare” the sheepy ass Americans. . .it’s comin.
They WILL stay, alas. And, the worst of the bunch are the DCCC group and the big business pro war advocates (and money recipients)- Rahm, Schumer, Hoyer, Clinton, Lieberman etc. This is where the problem lies folks. And this is why Obama’s candidacy is so threatening to them (and others) because his college Joe and Jane supporters are funding his candidacy with donations of less than $100 apiece.
ah, LibertyLee…
wrong again.
What does that mean?
Edwards candidacy was the big threat to the establishment. Obama? I doubt he could have gotten this far if he had not had the backing of the establishment. They would have done to him what they did to Edwards.
I’ll vote for whomever gets the nod. But I don’t trust either of them.
Today we have both Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter (on the Today show) pledging support for Hillary. Considering the usual misdirection, that must mean they want to run against Obama.
BTW, Coulter apparently finally decided to wash that little black dress but she still looked like a conservaslut.
Good point, but we MUST unite…
A Clinton/Obama ticket would be unbeatable…
Folks, do you want to hear anymore debates?
Hell no. We know where we stand.
The rhetoric is deafening.
Watched Morning Joe - Joe and Pat are already on the Democrats will surrender bandwagon. Shuster is filling in and cut off Joe to go to Pat to get his take on the Romney Democrats will surrender statement. Joe scolded Shuster explaining to him that the only reason he is in the chair is because he allowed him to be there - pathetic egotistical B.S.
Shuster raised a point - the Republican policies have help create more extremism and Iraq has caused us to take our eye off the ball in Afghanistan. The Republicans are going to try to make this about protecting us from terrorists because they think they can win on this. I guess they forgot 2006. They believe the surge is working so that will let them win. I think the are delusional.
well, if privatizing SS in on the dem agenda, one can only hope.
i don’t care that the clintons are polarizing - i care about the things they did that helped bring us to the place we are now. and i fear that both our choices for 2008 will be more of that.
McCain is CrazyTrain, I’m supporting our nominee, too!
You are absolutely right, he does have the support of the establishment in Congress, but not the DCCC establishment group. I think the leaders (and the media) thought he was a more viable candidate than Edwards because they figured out that the country was in a place to want to ratchet down the polarizing and polemic, and Obama was all about that, and Edwards was stoking that fire.
A key change recently (and germane to this post) Rush Limbaugh, ratcheter in chief, has just been shown the door by most of the Republican voters (his listeners) and the media. That is BIG. And, it is all about (I think) the fact that we have MAJOR problems now facing us due to the war costs and others, and we need to come together as a nation to try to address them or we are really screwed.
No, they want to support her, because they know they have a much better chance of beating her. More on Hillary and this group here: http://online.wsj.com/article/.....mmentaries
yeah, but if McCain gets into office and goes nuclear it’d be the end of neocons for sure!
No surprise there. We have been given the candidates they want us to choose from.
I want to go to RevDeb’s church for chocolate. Sounds better than St marymotherofmadeleineinheaven
Sums them up well, RevDeb. I listened to most of the HJC hearing w/Mukasey @ work yesterday. Can’t describe it w/out using words I vowed to never use on this blog.
I guess “nauseating” will be my summary description of it. One example-Conyers seemed completely unconcerned @ the end if Artur Davis’ devastating questions on the Sieglman prosecution & the fired USAs went unanswered; more important to wrap up the hearing & ass kiss Mukasey a little more before letting him slip out the door & off the hook…
This is B.S. it is not ON the Dem’s agenda. That was a crap reference that Ecahn put out there - someone said that someone said that someone said that one of Obama’s advisors wants to. Come on. We are smarter - and less intellectually lazy than this.
oh.my.god.
i want those cookies.
and i have all the ingredients in the house.
thank you - you may have just made it possible for me to watch another day of c-span2 without my ibook ending up thrown against the wall.
Why is it that nothing is more important to conservatives than rigid adhearance to conservative dogma? It’s like it’s a religion. Bush has shown that you don’t have to govern conservatively so long as you pretend to belive the dogma.
Changing coditions require an ability to adapt. That’s why governing as a conservative is doomed to fail.
That is porn!
Meaning Elliot’s cookies at 45
i’m not taking it as fact until i check it out for myself. but, in my experience, democracy now! is the absolute best source of news - and ecahn doesn’t bullshit. i’m not going to dismiss it either.
Please excuse me if I don’t by Peggy Noonan’s take…
Imus took a shot at Limbaugh and Hannity this morning…saying they’ve said nothing on behalf of the troops and the wretched treatment they get. Lousy equipment, and citing guest Lee Woodruff’s mention that 1 in 4 Iraq vets are now homeless. The rehab center in SA is maxed out already.
This is an important issue that doesn’t get enough attention. This is the Republican face of warmongering…
Wonder if Limbaugh is still profiteering off his newsletter for vets scam?
has this been discussed here?
http://echidneofthesnakes.blog.....9377149511
Once I stop being so pissed off, I’ll be sending an email. grrr.
Thanks for letting me know about that. I’ve always known that FDL was a community/family, because even when we disagree we care about each other. I didn’t hear the explosion because I’m on the east side of town and it was to the north. Some of the folks in the office live near there and they said it was just horrific. A man who lives about 1/4 mile away was on the TV this morning saying he estimated the fireball at about 200 feet high. They canceled medical grand rounds at the hospital this morning — I surmise they’re still trying to stabilize some of the wounded.
Well than let’s not circulate it as fact. Her source was someone from the Nation who purportedly said that this comes from Obama’s advisors. Could we not find out from Obama himself? Do we believe everything his (or Hillary’s) advisors say? Again, this is becoming a trash site more than a thinking site too often. On Ecahn, like all of us, sometimes she is on target, and sometimes she is not.
By the time this thread is done, Barack Obama will be voting for the repeal of the entire New Deal. Must be something in the cookies. Get a grip, folks.
Nor do I, but it is the/a Republican take, which is what I said it was at the outset (i.e. my earlier comment about Bobo’s mother, Nono.
Oops. That’s an OT btw.
Shuster accuses Hillary of “pimping out Chelsea” and then LAUGHS. God, I’m so irritated by all this sh*t right now.
Sorry for the OT, though.
1968 Redux theme by Juan Cole sent chills down my spine. I feel like we are trapped in GroundHog day and are cursed to refight the same battles.
Pissy Pants is down to 30% and Congress is down to 22%. Jello Jays and Lamar Smiths-all of them.
RevDeb…I can relate to your pain. Yesterday on Stimulus/Fisa was a nightmare kabuki. I am tired of calling but will answer the call cause to do so means THEY have won.
Scarecrow - did you see that cookie porn? Mods, where are you when we need you? :-)
I think Max Fraser was one of the two guests on the subject of D candidates economic programs on democracynow this morning. Here’s a link to his article in The Nation, which was about Obama & subprime mess. The discussion on demcracynow ranged beyond that topic to Obama’s economic advisers, and it was in that context that Fraser made the statement about soc sec.
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080211/fraser
ahh the voice of sanity,
I’ll get a grip
and then a grip on some cookies, too tho
I tell you it is no accident that the Coulters and the Limbaughs are howling about the “liberal” McCain at the same time the country wants a liberal.
Clinton will be the bitch. Obama will be the inexperienced (and slightly scary) brown person. McCain will be the “liberal” that will ride in to save the day.
You may think America is not stupid enough to buy it.
I thought America was too smart to buy Iraq, too.
I heard that Barack forced Michelle to carry BOTH of their children to term!
I don’t check out cookie porn sites; NSA is watching. I buy Girl Scout Cookies, three boxes, yesterday, at the T-stop (subway).
LOL-go crimson.
Thank you. I’d be surprised if anyone’s economic advisor didn’t offer a list of recommended ways to deal with our nation’s current and future massive budget shortfalls that DIDN’T include some sort of tweaking of the SS system. Just because somebody’s experts suggest something doesn’t mean it’s immediately an awful idea or it’s going to get done. Jeez.
uh, no. actually, i can’t.
but i’m not disagreeing with you that i have a responsibility to check it out before repeating it as fact.
but after seeing what bill clinton did during the ’90s and seeing what out dem congress is doing - nothing, and no one in dem party leadership (especially our presidential candidates) gets teh benefit of the doubt.
… maybe tomorrow i’ll feel a bit better, but yesterday’s HJC hearing and the actions of the senate re: fisa have hit me hard. and i don’t think i’m the only one…. i think that is true of everyone who watched the events live.
Yes, but then you have to eat them. I remember my Mom buying dozens of girl scout cookie boxes and storing them in the basement freezer, and we kids would sneak down stairs and steal the boxes one by one.
of course, after his stunning defense of the rule of law and the balance of power in government yesterday, i don’t see how anyone could think that he was capable of that.
mmmmm….cookies…. :)
Uh huh. And you probably thought all those years your mom had no idea you were doing that.
Hard. You’re not the only one.
On this we agree. But this particular point was put out there, I believe, as partisan primary politics - not as a matter for us to address thoughtfully by comparing different stands, points of view, etc.
I had the distinct impression Michelle Obama has put the kibosh on Obama running in 2012, on the basis of they will be somewhere else in their lives by 2012. It seems she runs a tight ship, and it appears that when she says jump, he must ask how high! One wonders if he will be President, or if his wife will actually call the shots, but he will be the mouthpiece.
OTOH, Clinton is a uniter. She will unite the Rethug’s party and get them to the polls on time.
I can almost see our chances slipping away, although I hope your scenario plays out, because it may be our best chance.
That would be “Siegelman” up @ #68. Wake up, Marie.
Guess Mukasey’s arrogant indifference to investigating Don Siegelman’s phony Rove-ordered prosecution angers me to the point of not being able to spell his name.
http://www.harpers.org/archive.....c-90001359
Well, I actually think she forgot she put them there. Or maybe, she thought it was better to have a bunch of stealing brats at home, who wouldn’t go out on the street later and do it there. Don’t know, but I have funny, soft spot for girl scout cookies.
Given the mood in the Dem party as of late, this chocolate fix may be more appropriate…
Scarecrow, back on topic. I really like this post and it reminds me that we will need to be very careful about how we as a party craft our messages about Senator McCain. I think he’s something a bit more than a “maverick” (scary is a nice term…I’m practicing diplomacy today) in his positions, but personally, he has given and suffered for this country. We will need to draw very distinct boundaries between these two.
especially just out of the freezer. hmmm.
This is crap. We have no idea what Michelle is thinking on this. You are saying Obama is hen pecked. That is simply nasty. (Neither is Hillary, spouse-pecked - if there is such a word - but she has far greater spouse problems most everyone would agree).
of course, after his stunning defense of the rule of law and the balance of power in government yesterday, i don’t see how anyone could think that the front runners are capable of that.
the COLD chocolate crunch, sound, smells, nefariousness of it all.
absolutely - thank you for the correction.
Jim are you still around? Did you see where the University of Iowa is paying $40K to have Rove give a speech? I am trying to find out if any of my tax money is going toward this. If it is, I will be loudly protesting. DMREGISTER Link
np, the fact the executive overreach is completely ignore by the dem “leadership” is woefully wrong.
FWIW, if you have been around FDL for any period of time, you would know that eCAHN is NOT a booster and partisan when it comes to Senator Clinton.
senate is up on c-span2 for fisa debate.
i’m heading to the kitchen to whip up some chocolate cookies. many thanks for the recipe.
good luck to all who are following the primary elections… don’t know how you-all can do it, even a few minutes of it makes me want to scream.
peace to all.
later.
Yes. The Dems need to think through how to go after McCain, without it becoming characterized as swiftboating. He’s embraced the Bush tax cuts, and has no way to offset the revenues except undermining entitlements and government programs that Americans generally support. That is exactly what Bush proposes is the budget that just got universally panned. And wrt to the wars, McCain is Bush/cheney on steroids. If we can make McCain wear those albatrossi, I think he’ll lose to anyone.
Whether it will be easier for Clinton or Obama? — the CW says Obama, but I’m not sure we’ll know until next fall, when we know how Obama and Clinton stood up under the next few months of contests.
I have been around FDL for quite a long time, and I know she has been a long time Edwards supporter, but, where her support is now I don’t know. None-the-less the particular comment she made at the outset of this post was not the sort of thoughtful, well researched, provocative comment I usually read from her. And, so I called her out on it (and others who took this and ran with it)
Good morning Scarecrow, pups!
Why is it conventional wisdom that McCain has to appease and pander to his party’s conservative base, but it is not conventional wisdom that the Democratic nominee must appease the Democratic party’s liberal/progressive base?
Hi Egregious. Chocolate porn morning!
Sleeping in late, again, I see. While you were asleep, we’ve made chocolate martinis, eaten six boxes of frozen Girl Scout cookies and decided Obama will repeal social security. RevDeb has been trying to cheer us up.
I actually think that that is happening on our side too. The DCCC doesn’t want to admit it, but, all the Dem candidates have come out against the war. Compare that to what is happening in Congress. I think the DCCC folks are more afraid of the progressive Dem movement than the Republicans are - hence also their fear of Howard Dean and the 50 state strategy which in essence gets the whole country on board making key changes.
No school today. Parent teacher conferences. I want to take this opportunity to say, please take care of our schools. It’s the same thing as taking care of our kids.
You folks need homemade cookies, not the storebought kind. I’ll get right on it.
My car arrived last night so I have plenty of happiness to share!
ILY - Very apt - and funny. Crows are partly carrion eaters, as I recall, is that what keeps you so chipper. (Maybe we need you to make a post-post comment that you can put up at the top of each post towards the end of its run!
Most of the Dem candidates skipped a DLC event last year and instead appeared at YearlyKos.
Mr. McCain and Mr. Romney. Who is the bigger nincompoop?
I think you’re spot on about McCain’s psyche on the war, Scarecrow: “Victory or forever, whichever comes first!”
Redshift, what’s the word about the Virginia primary?
Now is the time folks. To come to the aid of your party.
Clinton is on an equal footing with McCain, politically. Their agendas are identical, if perhaps from entirely different motivations. The outcome would be the same.
Obama has the charm of Saruman the White and very likely the same aspirations which are not likely to agree with most Americans, I expect. With these remaining contenders, change for the better is not in the cards. Someone of integrity and honesty needs to step forward. It’s otherwise a very bleak field in the presidential race.
It is a toss up. McCain is wider; Romney is taller. McCain ditched is first wife for a 20 some year old fashion plate; Romney has stayed true (but who knows how many wives he has out there in Utah.
Scarecrow, just so you know? Whenever I see you post on FDL, I know it’s a well-thought-out, well researched, reasoned piece. You do not disappoint. The photo? We need to have it tattooed inside all Americans’ eyelids for constant viewing. McCain = Bush Term Three.
Now back to read comments.
And so good at going after the Republican Party! *g*
It was a great relief to see her show up this morning with the NYT and breakfast. *G*
AP - Without naming John McCain, President Bush marshaled the conservative wing of the Republican Party on Friday to back the presumed GOP presidential nominee for the upcoming battle against the Democratic Party.
His “wars forever” stance terrifies me.
I too am unsure about who will be stronger against him, but I do believe that the contrast with Obama–future versus past–would be undeniable. Visual, verbal, metaphorical, political, and demographic. I also cannot bear the thought of the right wing sleaze machine recycling all the Clinton crap. Of course they’ll find new stuff to slime Obama with, but at least it will be new. Gosh, isn’t that a sad comment?
Oh boy, are you ever right on with that comment. Most Americans really were convinced those WMD’s were hiding in the basement somewhere in Iraq and that Hussein intended to bomb the United States into a slag heap. And most of us stood up and cheered when that statue fell. In the ensuing years, my brain has actually started to function and I’ve worked out in my head that the only reason Hussein did not hand over was the WMD’s was that he couldn’t; he never had any. No other explanation makes any sense even in a world gone mad. So Bush has his “legacy” war, we are nearing 4000 American troops dead, and now we are expected to elect a yellow-bellied coward who couldn’t cut the mustard as a POW and is determined to show how tough he is now. I’d like to personally buy these righteous bastards a one-way ticket to hell.
*g*
Bush claiming to rally anyone is a stark reminder of the delusional, grandiose, detached, megalomaniacal nature of the Current Occupant.
We support the winning ticket. Clinton/Obama or Obama/Clinton. Edwards for AG. Dodd for Secretary of Defense.
Right as rain as usual, you mean…John McCain will bring well needed MILITARY knowledge to dealing with Iraq, Iran and Afghanistan, not to mention Lebanon, Hamas and North Korea…Finally, we can totally destroy and totally break the back so they never return the Axis of Evil.
Don’t want Dodd out ofthe Senate (we need him there).
I haven’t heard anything solid about the VA primary, just what the talking heads say. My view from close to the ground in Fairfax is that Clinton has somewhat more support from the longtime party people (though Obama has the governor) and Obama has more volunteers and enthusiasm, but who knows how that’ll translate into results.
I went to help out and recruit volunteers at a presidential forum at a local high school last night (campaign reps speaking.) Our Obama table had about three times as many people clustered around it as the Clinton table (though we were also closer to the door.) The Paulites were the only Republicans who bothered to send anyone. *g*
You know, I expect to have lots of critical things to say about McCain and his world view, but disparaging the behavior of someone while he was being tortured is not something I’ll do. No one knows what they would do in those circumstances. I’d prefer we not go there, but that’s just me.
“And so we saw Mitt Romney and John McCain dutifully humiliate themselves in front of those whose catastrophic policies as implemented by the Bush/Cheney regime have earned the contempt of a large majority of Americans and the hatred of much of the world. Why would anyone do this?”
… because members of organized crime must always show deep respect for their dons?
“and laid claim to Reagan’s legacy”
Repeating their frames is not helpful. Reagan and his policies were a disaster.
That fits with what I’m hearing about Virginia. Should be interesting!
stark but true
.
-thank you Scarecrow
I would like to hear more about Obama’s economic advisors. I just voted for him, but I did hear that he’s got some Chicago School (or at least University of Chicago, where 70% of the economists are “Chicago School”) economists advising him, which is a red flag to me.
Ye shall know them by their advisors.
Many hundreds of Americans have undergone imprisonment in camps that made the one McCain inhabited look like Club Med. Many of them were tortured to death without ever condemning their country. So McCain underwent some serious discomfort and decided maybe it wouldn’t be too bad to read a prepared statement. You said no one knows what they would do in those circumstances, but I submit to you that those dead Americans had the right stuff. McCain didn’t, and has put in quite a few years and even a little tearjerker movie trying to prove he’s an okay guy. I don’t buy it. The real tragedy to me here is that most American voters are going to have to once again go with the lesser of the evils.
I jumped on the language of a retort because I agreed with the content. I’m not ready to fall lock-step in a supportive role for the Dems when they are ignoring executive over-step.
Good post on McCain tho! I agree.
I strongly oppose McCain politically, but just out of curiosity:
Were you ever in the military?
Have you ever done a tour outside the United States?
Have you ever been in combat?
Were you ever captured by the enemy?
Were you ever tortured?
Were you ever confined by yourself for more than 2 years.
If it’s not prying, how old are you?
Pretty lame framing there. You sound like the GOP-ers that claim water-boarding is a ‘little water in the face’.
Whatever John McCain’s current incarnation is, his experience in Vietnam was not a cakewalk.
-G
Absolutely disgusting trollery.
The answer to all your questions is no, of course not. I am a 62-year-old mother of 5 and a flag-waving patriot. If I had been male, I probably would have fitted neatly into the Vietnam blood bath. It’s unfortunate that you seem to feel a person has to have walked in those shoes to express an opinion of what pain and deprivation can cause in a person. McCain has my respect on one count; when he was called he answered and served his country. A lot of the politicians at this time are from the Vietnam area, and a lot of them did NOT answer.
Getting back to the political issues, we are looking at a lineup of candidates that I’d prefer to see in another sort of lineup. Won’t somebody please tell me if there is anyone at all running who is honest and just, and who would lead this country into a more sane relationship with the rest of the planet??
Evidently McCain learned nothing about the Vietnam War by being in it
or a POW because he maintains that it could have been “won” which is
why he has condemned another youth cohort to “victory” in Iraq, “My Friends”. He was a hot dog navy pilot, never saw Vietnam from the ground
until he was shot down. No cake walk, but he wears it too prominently
or the press makes too much of it for him. He is a George W. that saw
active duty, same personality, serious alky, borderline nut case.
I’m 64 and did serve four years in the military during the Vietnam era, from 1965 to 1969. I was fortunate in that the computer did not send me to Viet Nam. I really find it repulsive that people who have never even been beaten around in a football practice have the effrontery to criticize someone who, for heaven’s sake, has been tortured and held in captivity for 51/2 years. Frankly, it’s lower than the swift boat weazles and the chicken hawks.
I want to beat John McCain and believe it can be done by either of the two Democratic candidates. However, criticize him because he is wrong on the issues. The other kind of hyypocrisy doesn’t help the effort.
Again, I think your wrong. I oppose McCain, but he is not Bush. Actually, McCain’s crowd would have probably beat the crap out of a blowhard coward like Bush. And, McCain did spend 5 1/2 years on the ground in Vietnam.
It’s really unusual for me to defend him, but it would be an absolute mistake for any Democrat to run against him by attacking his military record. Moreover, I would discourage any any Democratic swiftboat pygmies from climbing out from under their rocks. It would only do harm among honorable people.
McCain is all for bombing innocent people in both Iran, Iraq, and beyond; and he is also all for occupying sovereign countries forever. The fact that he was tortured for 5 1/2 years and is against torture is logical. What is not logical about his thinking, is that he condones killing en masse. The only thing I can surmise from that skewed logic, is that he holds deep-seated anger toward any perceived “enemy”, and will gladly (given the opportunity)kill but not torture, because of his personal experience. He seems vengeful, and taking it out on other countries, because he is unable to get back at those who actually tortured him, shows that he is not rational on some level and is driven by misplaced emotions. That makes him dangerous and irrational, in my mind.
JMHO.
No swiftboat pygmie here, just a realist who has more than Vietnam or football practice or Texas for a frame of reference for important matters.
McCain should not be swifted, nothing to swift him about, it is just that
the boomer obsession with Vietnam or “toughness” seems to be touted as
some kind of solution to the repeat madhouse performance by another Texan
president trying to prove he is a man sitting in a 55 room mansion with
Walker Texas Ranger as some kind of reality. The real frame is 1968, with
the myth of traitors opposing a phony war with vets the only people with
a say in how it should be fought/stopped. It is a dead end street, literaly
this constant search for a hero savior. Duke Cunningham took a Medal of Honor to prison with him, it is no predictor of performance in another context besides war. No rock here, sun is out, beautiful day, hope it is for you as well.
I’ve got you guys all stirred up, I see. Timbers, have you ever spent 34 hours giving birth to an 11 pound baby without benefit of any pain medications? Has your husband ever beaten you almost unconscious to the point you were ashamed to go outdoors for weeks since everyone would see the bruises? Have you ever undergone any of the atrocities that members of your gender commit on members of my gender day after day after day in this great country of ours? I guess I’m the only female on this post, but don’t go hosing down the decks with testosterone or tire your fingers out defending a jerk who has already stated publicly that he basically intends to attempt to take away many of the rights women have worked so hard to possess. At this point in time his political platform is what needs to be yanked out from under him, and in my opinion his “spin” on his lengthy stay in the POW camp is a really weak plank.
Obama economic advisors:
Austan Goolsbee: U. of Chicago neoclassicist and “Sicko” critic
David Cutler: Harvard economist who believes that high health costs are good for the economy
Jeffrey Liebman: Harvard economist and former Clinton adviser who favors privatizing social security
Lessa, this is not about competing to see who suffered more [3 childbirths, one without any anaesthetic].
I think we all pretty much agree that McCain would be a disaster as president, seeking military solutions for problems that should be handled by diplomacy.
However, there is a valid point that his military service—not his military inclinations as president—is to be honored. And further that any attempt to swiftboat him by the dems will backfire hugely among people in the midwest and south, where protecting your people by joining the military is still seen as a good thing.
Doesn’t look good, neocon all the way, U Chicago and Harvard ghosts of
what they once were.
I don’t disagree. However, I think McCain’s postion is more based on the fact that he was part of a generation educated on WWII and the Cold War. When I majored in history in the early 1960’s, the primary lesson taught was: the US was unprepare for both WW1 and WWII. The democracies almost waited too long to draw any line Hitler shouldn’t cross. Communism a monolith and would expand by every opportunity through surrogates (ie, Eastern Europe, Greece, Finland, early in the Cold War). Accordingly, the Truman Doctrine, or containment, was that you oppose expansion early and almost everywhere. Moreover, John Kennedy ran on the need to develop more conventional forces to oppose USSR by conventional means rather than continued nuclear brinksmanship.
That’s an oversimplified summary, but I really think it has more to do with McCain’s positons than any John Wayne imitations. I only feel he should be opposed because his ideas are wrong, not his character.
No, my wife has given birth and I have’nt, but I don’t belittle child birth or call women whimpy cowards if they have difficulty. I haven’t been beaten by an abusive husband and haven’t beaten my wife, but I don’t criticize women who stay in abusive relationships because I know I have no means of understanding or judging their actions. I may disagree with both pregnant women and abused women, but it would be supreme hypocracy for me to judge them on their behaviour in areas I never have been or will be subject to.
Agree. My historical studies from the same time period were the same
storyline, graduate studies added depth to the standard cold war line
with some significant qualifiers, Ho was a nationalist first, anti-Chinese
as any Vietnamese would naturally be and a communist last. Kennedy did
not want nor believed in a military solution for SEA, LBJ had a different
view, privately thought war unwinnable from the outset, fought it anyway.
Revisionist view today is of winnable Vietnam War which is McCain’s expressed view. If he can make the war his issue, as it appears he does, he
has a way to go to sell it to a nation falling apart around him and a broken army in the field. Whoever takes those tasks on has a huge uphill
climb to make.
MaCain is really just the frame the GOP will use market the Dems failing in the Middle East.
To both Egregious and Crosstimbers, the examples I served up of what women go through was simply to point out that women also go through versions of inexpressible life difficulties. I would also point out that I have seen many women give birth as stoically as any Spartan, while others scream their lungs out cursing the men who put them in the predicament. There is no gender line that divides pain. McCain is a deadly threat to this country and must not be elected. At this point, to oppose him there are only a much-abused, much-vilified, and maybe a little insane woman, and a dark young man who seems to have a good heart but is naive and seems to listen to spiders sitting on his shoulder. I’m not at all sure I can support either of them, but the alternative is to sit home on election day and that just goes against the grain.
Merk and Lessa,
I have to leave to drive to Austin, but I believe we generally agree. Lessa, I don’t view either Hillary Clinton or Barck Obama as critically as you do. I think they are both very capable people, and unless we allow the Democratic Party to split, I think there is a good chance we can take the whole governmentment in November. Then comes the work of trying to repair the damage, which is where I become a little depressed. I am encouraged that neither of them are dumb, and they both think they can, at least start.
Be careful on the road compadre, “we must hang together or surely we shall hang separately” has resonance for this election… I watched people
dump the hump and we all got Nixon as a reward.
And these are the people that Barack Obama expects to join hands with him for the good of America. Alot of these same people are just like those that he is appealing to through his gospel circuit church sermons. If he thinks that he is gonna be able to work with their support he is dreaming. And if as he says that his campaign is all about “you” and “you will be the gov’t. Sorry, but these people are why we can’t let every citizen run the gov’t. Some people need to be ignored not pandered to.
Glenn, you make an excellent point there. Americans have proved over and over that we are not competent to govern ourselves. We’ve elected officials by the thousand who shouldn’t be elected manager of waste treatment plants, and see where it has gotten us. As long as we continue to elect these clowns based on what little solid information we have on them, we are going to be in the same sinking and stinking boat. I actually believed that the Democrats having a congressional majority was going to make a difference..so far they’ve only embarrassed themselves by being totally ineffectual. I live in the stone age (Mississippi) where local officials are elected based on how many signs they can plaster the roadsides with, and state and national elections still split right down the color line. Ya think we need a king?
Is it not frustrating perris, to see the obvious, to see some of the solutions, and watch everything take the opposite tack aaargh.
I agree. We can debate McCain’s positions on their own merits. It is extremely insensitive to debase a victim of torture by condescendingly saying he has not come to terms with it (!) and using that claim to discredit his politics. btw, I don’t like him or his politics either, and I resisted both the Vietnam war and Iraq war from day 1.
You cannot further debase a man who has already thoroughly debased himself.