Over at DailyKos, Markos makes the observation that in this election "too many unmerited claims of racial insensitivity and sexism have been thrown around carelessly." I'll agree with that -- but I think it's an observation that deserves some further refinement.
Lately I've been told by no small number of men that if I hear something as sexist I'm being "oversensitive" or just plain wrong. When that happens my back goes straight up and all I hear is the patronizing tone of someone who thinks their life experience is superior to mine and that they are therefore entitled to tell me what I hear and when I hear it. Suddenly the discussion gets dragged onto the carpet of who's "right" and who's "wrong" and many distinctions that would allow us to have a reasonable conversation about the subject get abandoned.
No wonder people are desperate for liberation from the problems of sexism and racism and are to willing to sweep them under the carpet and pretend they don't exist any more.
But they do. And Pam Spaulding, writing about race politics, gets to the heart of it:
The subject is too deeply embedded in the American psyche to will it away - remember, Obama doesn't have to "make a big deal of his blackness." He's black, but he's not carrying the perceived "chip on his shoulder" that Jackson or Sharpton have by default. That's what scares white folks, because J&S have traded on race merchantry in the past - where all forms of racism - benign, ignorant, overt and violent, are seemingly the same. This only drives further discussion into the closet.
What I am saying is that the underlying reason for promoting "post-racial" (note you don't see many blacks tossing that around) is more about wanting it to be true so badly so that race doesn't have to be dealt with. It cuts both ways.
Note you will see folks on the right (and the Clinton camp) complaining that they "cannot talk about race" in regards to Obama. No, they feel they cannot successfully use the familiar political dog-whistles that evoke fear without getting called on it.
It all goes back to the fear of being labeled "racist." It's almost as if we need to come up with another term that doesn't conjure up visions of Klan Night Riders, lest whites recoil at the mere thought that they can hold ingrained biases through no fault of their own by growing up in this culture.
I'm pretty sure implicit bias is what drives much of The Bradley Effect, because many who change their minds and vote for the non-minority candidate don't see themselves as racist; they can rationalize their decisions in ways that avoid ownership of that factor.
If this primary has taught us nothing else, it is that people hear things subjectively and view them through a filter of their own life experience. When Michael Eric Dyson said Hillary Clinton was using racist code when she said that she was the best person for the presidency, I was left scratching my head and thinking, "well, that's what every politician says in every race. How is she supposed to run?" And at the same time, it didn't invalidate that this is what Dyson and others are hearing -- an echo of things they've heard their entire lives when people are attempting to be dismissive based on race. Hillary Clinton was just running a political campaign like any other political campaign, but it doesn't erase people's feelings or experience that they are bringing to the table.
And that's where Pam's call for a different way to discuss these things becomes important. Intent does matter -- and to deny that, to lump together the person who just doesn't know how their words are being perceived with the ones who bomb abortion clinics makes the subject explosive and untouchable. People recoil from it, the conversation gets shut down and teaching moments get lost.
There is a lot of sexism in this race, both overt and unconscious, and as someone who writes about gender a lot it's been extraordinarily difficult to address it without feeling like you're just going to make the problem worse. Because the time is coming when we're going to have to reconcile behind one candidate, and the ability to do that to insure that we don't wind up with another Alito on the bench is going to become paramount. We don't live in a time that allows the luxury of going Naderite. And I'm always conscious these days that making the race/gender divide more toxic and polarized is going to leave me poorly equipped to be a voice for that reconciliation, and yet to not address the subjects of sexism and racism when they're such huge motivational factors in this race makes me feel like I'm abandoning an opportunity to drag these subjects out for some much needed daylight.
I think the first necessary act in having a more healthy conversation is to acknowledge that you don't always know what someone else is hearing when something is said. When people say "out with the old, in with the new" about Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, what I hear is that there is no room for a middle aged woman in a position of political leadership. It takes a long time for a woman to accrue political clout in our society sufficient to rise to the top, as it does in business and many other fields, especially when she's taken the time to have kids. She's not allowed to be the young wunderkind that a man is. So she can't be on top when she's young, and by the time she's in a position to make the argument that she deserves to lead everyone is saying "out with the old." In other words, she's allowed to be in a position of power...never.
Which doesn't mean that this is what people are intending to say when they say it, and the tendency to throw labels around and attribute motivation and grand conspiracy probably needs a lot more evidence than most are asking for. "Out with the old" means, for a lot of people, and end to Clinton politics and the Clinton era. Fair enough. And anyone who wants to pretend they can look into a crystal ball and know what someone is thinking in that case is a bit presumptuous.
But not so long ago, you couldn't write anything negative about Bill Clinton online because the "Clinton era" was considered the halcyon days, and the "Clintons" only became toxic and archaic once Hillary started running. So the suspicion that many are hiding some old fashioned lizard-brain sexism behind this new found skepticism towards the Clintons remains.
I don't know how to repair the situation other than to acknowledge that people's feelings are legitimate with regard to what they hear no matter the intent, and presuming malicious intent is a great way to make an enemy of someone who probably really wants to be an ally.
Pam is right -- the need for new language, for a new way of talking about these things is acute.
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Hey Jane!
2?
My heart is broken…
(I know I told Ann in AZ that I was taking myself out of the zed race, but I really didn’t know when this post was coming up.)
Go Biodun!
On this topic. Someone downstairs accused an Obama supporter of being childish because this person admired Obama’s oratorical skills. The comment was not only nasty and stupid, but also greatly lowers the level in which most of us have sought to address campaign issues (and preferences here). Can we try to keep this civil?
It will be civil until someone misinterprets what someone else says. . .which seems to be the point of the thread.
Making political issues of gender and race. I deplore it!!!
HI Jane!
Hey Raven, how’s your Little Bit?
What about class?
The Obama candidacy has a cathartic quality to it. We can now engage constructively on issues of race where we couldn’t before. I don’t believe for one second that the Clintons are racist. Yet I could believe in a heartbeat that they could use race to advance their agenda. There are many on the right to whom I would be less kind. There are people with guns who would threaten Obama and his family and that sickens me. Obama is the Rosetta Stone of race. All that has come before and all that is to come is written on the tablet of his face. The American people are about to face down the 500 year old demon of race in North America. And the people will win. We all shall win.
Obama in 08!!
I’d really like to see the downstairs discussion kept downstairs, if possible.
I love Pam Spaulding. She’s such a voice of reason in heated discussions. I wish I were half as wise as she is.
I’m not done reading the post–I will in a sec, but I want to throw this out there: Yes, we need to develop a new grammar, syntax, vocabulary, lexicon, what have you, for discussing race in the US and the world. The old lingua franca simply ain’t to cut it. Racism in the US is distinct because of its specific history of slavery. And yes, it can’t simply be willed away. We need to calibrate and reconfigurate a new context to engage it.
Fantastic post, Jane — and I concur with Pam’s call for finding a different way to discuss the issues involved so that actual discussion, instead of more toxic polarization, occurs. Finding that path, though, continues to be a difficult search…on far too many levels.
I meant reconfigure…
Everyone has prejudices. Everyone. And some of those prejudices have to do with race and gender.
Ugh, she woke up in the middle of the night Monday just screaming. We took her in and, using the xrays they took to find the bladder stones, they realized she has a lumbar disc issue. So, along with the stones, allergies and cherry eye she has this. I guess it’s why someone dumped her. We have concluded that with us she has a chance and without us she had very little.
thx
Well… if enough people make an issue of ethnicity and sex, perhaps we can succeed in throwing the race to the Republicans.
A well timed and thoughtfully post, thanks!
Let me apologize to the community for losing my temper downstairs. No need to continue it here.
Indeed. This is one that doesn’t get talked about much.
overlaps some with race and gender of course.
I think Americans are uncomfortable with discussion of class because it goes counter to some of the sustaining myths of the nation.
While I appreciate the sentiment and intentions of the post, it strikes me as rather ambitious in a world where the mainstream media is a propaganda organ of the corporations and the White House.
I mean, yeah, sure, try it! Great. But with outright bigots like Glen Beck and Rush Limbaugh enjoying as much airtime as they do, I don’t expect big results real soon…
I’m not sure I understand the question.
I also sign up for the truce.
This political correctness is outrageous. Everyone knows that in America today the white man is the new 1940’s German Jew.
-The Doughy Pantload
I still think that Edwards dropped out too early. Everyone who was going to vote for him should still vote for him on the Tuesday primaries. My gut feeling has always been that Tuesday would show that each candidate would be closer to a 3-way tie than anything. Even if he didn’t come out on top it would be nice to see the whole democratic process play out at the convention where each state’s announcement was actually more than just ceremonial.
Edwards is still the best nominee.
Oh that’s just terrible, I hope she’s feeling better now that you know and can treat her. B
oy you sure came along just in time for her, she’s lucky to have you two.
aww that’s just a shame.
Do you think it is a bad idea to make and issue out of class?
Trained Monkey Bernanke drops rates, trained monkey’s on Wall St. dance, fling pooh and reach for more bananas.
-G
Suspicion? It’s a fact. The more that I have thought about it, the “Clinton Derangement Syndrome” has always been about Hillary. In the early 80’s she was the lightening rod because she wasn’t acting like a woman should. She was attacked because of her looks, the way she dressed, the fact that she kept her given name (that was a real threat), she worked and was a bad mother..blah..blah..
There are a lot of real reasons to not like Hillary or to not want her to be President…But I think the “tone” of a persons dislikes of Hillary is usually a good indication of the underlying psychology. Misogynists and lizards brains inhabit the spectrum of political thought.
All the more reason to treat the post as sketch pad to constructively deal with divisive issues.
Nice post, Jane. I agree completely. But I am still in shock about Edwards. I saw the three Democrats as potential presidents, not as objects. Now I see a drastically lessened field, because of the popularity contest that is the American presidential election.
Hope this post causes much introspection in its readers.
The fact that these campaigns are causing these discussions is very exciting. America needs this to happen in order to make progress on the racial and gender fronts.
Yea, she was just starting to get really active, which may have made it worse, now it’s a month of restricted activity and anti-inflams. But she remains a sweetheart and the bohdisattva is warming up to her!
Hi Jane, While this is being framed in the media (and elsewhere) as race versus sex/gender, there is also a key factor of religion at play, and in some ways this is also a large elephant in the room, framed in part by the issue of the war, and fears (in some Democratic circles, and certainly Republican ones) that the U.S. will change our current M.E. war policy. I thought the Haaretz editorial recently saying that Obama and Hillary had similar views on the Middle East was an important step in putting some of this to rest http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/p.....mNo=949364
This may go some way toward discrediting those nasty emails circulating about Obama being a Moslem etc which were being circulated to Jewish listserves and others (a tact, some have claimed on the web, may actually have been undertaken at the mehest of one of the Dem candidates now running). Dershowitz has been especially nasty on this, and his support of Hillary is troubling.
Edwards was a voice for my issues…having said that he was not winning by any stretch but as long as he ran I ran with him…I want to hear what his BIG statement will be today. A lot of people will be listening. He did promise to go all the way…but then we did not support him enough. $200 million versus what little he has for adds, phone banks etc. He also did not have troops on the ground (local organization. I could not find a local number to call to be involved. I am not at all surprised he dropped.
He is still a main stream politician that can do a world of good for the forgotten and left behind. It is a solid message that equates well with the values that many earstwhile Christians have abandoned in practice…a helping those less fortunate yoursel. And I might add they are the ones who are losing the great pleasure of loving your neighbor.
As a woman who spent nearly 30 years as a professional on Wall St., it doesn’t seem possible to reconcile with the misogynists.
So, your next move?
And, while we are on class, there is also the issue of age (the youth vote versus elderly vote). To date that has been even more of a factor.
Huh, I can’t hear you! :)
Are you meaning in terms of economic class? Or social class? Or both?
I saw Eric Dyson speak at UNH last night. He is quite the speaker and has quite the strong message.
It should be noted that he supports Sen. Obama and his wife supports Sen. Clinton.
-G
lol
I guess I see them as the same.
I’m retired. Did what I could. Out of it now.
he’s troubling so as it is
As a white male, I have tried to be honest about my feelings about the political contest and my potential hidden biases.
Am I racist? Outwardly no, inwardly occasionally (maybe). Frankly, I am not sure. I would like to see Obama break the glass ceiling.
Am I a misogynist? I have a daughter and I am married. I think men and women are different. I think both men and women should have the same opportunities to do what they want to do, and realize that they may tend to group together (and collectively complain about each others stereotypes.) I would like to see a woman break the glass ceiling. I am not sure I trust Hillary. I would support Hillary over Romney or McCain. The main reason I would want Hillary to win is that I would like my daughter to have tangible evidence that women can succeed.
If Obama wins, will there be another woman in the next 12 years that can garner the win the political version of American Gladiator? If Hillary wins, will there be another African American that can do the same within the next 12 years? This is the fracture line in the democratic party. This is also, I believe, why Edwards never gained any traction as the candidate with the most progressive platform.
Jane, you are absolutely right. The most important thing is that the channels of communication are used appropriately and are not shut down by bickering and backstabbing. Democracy needs dialog to succeed. Fascism says “trust us” and “stay in your place.” We all know where that leads…FISA or not.
Dershowitz jumped the shark on torture.
I have no respect for him.
-G
Obama will have my vote if he is the nominee not because he is black or a man, but because Hillary cannot win convincingly against the GOP. It doesn’t matter against who, but seeing that McCain will likely win the nod, especially so against him.
It was a couple of weeks ago, but I especially enjoyed Susan Faludi’s column “The Correct Hillary Clinton Stereotype”. I think it fits nicely with what is being said here.
http://www.latimes.com/news/op.....4707.story
Isn’t he some pro-torture neo-con academic? Or am I mixing him up with someone else.
Calling them misogynists doesn’t help anything. One of the key factors in the race issue is that the greatest beneficiaries of affirmative action in universities and the work place have been women (not blacks). Think about the changes in 30 years in terms of the numbers of women who have gone to law school, medical school and who have become university professors, to say nothing about changes in ivy league student make up. As a result some of the frustration by white men in terms of opportunities drying up is based on these changes. And, because women now can hold great jobs, it also means there is less societal pressure to keep jobs more generally because in most homes you need two wage earners, and often now at least one has a job even if the other is without. (I have no stats for the last point, but I think it could be made).
This is from a project that I’m writing right now, and I think it’s pertinent to this thread:
The individual, or subject, is always dispersed. Then we have subject-positions that an individual or person occupies, positions that have their own discourses or histories, some of which a person was born into, and others that that person has chosen. These subject-positions are sometimes contradictory and never cohere to form a complete “individual.”
For example, one “person” or “individual” can be fractured by subject-positions of: Ethiopian; Jewish; mother; lesbian; physically handicapped; conservative environmentalist; radical economist; and leftist progressive political blogger or columnist. One person can be all those things…
LOL, Whaaat were you saying?
Well, there is the old, for lack of a better term, genteel poor. I.E., those from supposedly good breeding/families but whose money slipped away over the years. A supposed higher social class but lower economic class.
Racists, feminists and mysogynists share one major characteristic…tunnel vision.
Nuance! Nuance and range of detail is a sign of perfect exposure in photagraphy, but the white hot glare of political theater in this country will make nuanced thinking like this very difficult.
race and gender discussion elides the fact that these are 2 DLC, corporate-owned candidates who will not substantially reverse much, if any, of the grave damage of the last 7 years.
Have you ever seen the picture of the Wal-Mart board with 39 yo Hillary sitting next to Sam and everyone else is an older white male? Didn’t look like the Wal-Mart board was a bunch of laughs for the Hil.
Yup!
When I was in grad school, just 10 years ago, an African-American classmates was constantly raging about America, men, African-American men and all kinds of other issues. I finally said, “If I saw the world like you I’d pick up a gun and start a revolution”. She said, “That’s typical male bullshit”. I said, “What about the Viet Cong women”. She said, “They are not women of color”. We had a serious communication gap.
ps, she graduated before I did, got a faculty position, and ended up on my comittee.
Smart. Good points.
yes, there’s a decided youth support for Obama as evidenced in the exit polling done.
Deval Patrick.
Does that suggest that there are many people for whom sexism is even more deeply ingrained than racism?
Um, well, it calls them what they are. I think truth telling accomplishes something, but perhaps you dont.
The Clintons are sandbagging the sexism issue. And it seems that on this site if you come on strong about not wanting the Clintons to be re-elected, you can be stereotyped as a Clinton hater. So how to deal with the insideous, in my view, Clintons. Novak reported that the Clintons had the goods on Obama, Sheehan then stated that Obama had drug issues, Bill Clinton then says that Obama tells fairy tales, the BET guy then says that Obama has drug issues, Bill Clinton then says Obama is like Jesse Jackson.
And I say the Clintons don’t give a damn about doing the right thing. Never have and never will. What do the Clintons care about? Got a clue? Big house? Big plane? Getting rich?
Obama is no Bush or Dole or Rick Lazio. He is a credible worthwhile candidate and the Clintons are finally being outed.
The Clintons have no potential for conducting a successful presidency. Obama does have that potential and it is as simple as that, for me.
I think it’s tricky, both because because of the national myths Fern talked about, and because people in America don’t think of class the same way as in parts of the world where class is a more explicit part of politics. Virtually anyone who isn’t poor considers themselves to be middle class. I can’t remember if it was Franken or someone else who said that you can tell that Bill O’Reilly’s claim to have grown up working class is a lie because working class people in America don’t refer to themselves as “working class,” they call themselves “middle class.” This is also (I believe) the reason why Democrats these days use the term “working people.”
And it’s further muddled by cross-party definitions. I used to believe that Republicans were just lying about their policies (tax and otherwise) helping the middle class, but I came to realize that while some are lying, there are a lot of them who honestly believe that the middle class are people who make $200K or more, and everyone else is “poor.” Add in the national myths that there’s a lot of economic mobility, and that anyone can become rich, and the field is ripe for deceptive conservative rhetoric.
Been at plenty of meeting like that.
Haaretz gives the remaining candidates the following “Israel Factor” ratings:
7.75 McCain
7.50 Clinton
6.87 Romney
5.12 Obama
Patrick is not the same kind of orator, and the Democratic legislators here are doing everything in their power to muddy the waters. Plus, frankly, some of the things he is doing are less than brilliant.
The next para to my 53:
This person, whom I call a nomadic subject, will occupy all these various positions every day in discourse and society (with respect to institutions and people and events) and will have to negotiate all the tensions attendant to these positions from day to day, depending on the context. And this is how and why race and gender can be part of someone’s identity and not be defined by it…
So who are you voting for? /s
Well… we have the Kennedy’s who are wealthy, well educated, and progressive and could perhaps be considered “upper class”. And we have the Bushes who are wealthy, well educated, “upper class” and fascists. So I don’t see how one’s socio-economic class necessarily determines one’s political outlook. The short answer to the question ‘do I think “class” should play a part in considerations one makes in terms of voting for a particular candidate is no.
Yea, and I guess that is one reason JE’s message didn’t take hold.
Truth telling can help. Name-calling, not so much.
Truth?! Every male?! I also believe in speaking truth to power, and I am VERY politically active where I work, but you have to pick the good from the bad and begin there.
Obama on the 5th and hopefully in the general
I had lots of fun at brunch with you guys last weekend. I would like one of those “Irish breakfasts” again right now…don’t tell Howie!
Ahem. I didn’t say every male on Wall St. was a misogynist, nor every male. Just said I didn’t think it was possible to reconcile with those who are.
But then, my experience probably doesn’t count for anything.
It must have been exhausting.
I don’t think of the Bushes as upper class, just rich.
There is a cultural element to class as well.
One of the most infuriating things I ever read was an op-ed in the early 90’s (may even have been the 80’s) by the head of the National Association of Manufacturers about how it didn’t matter that individual wages weren’t going up because most households had two earners and household income was up.
Nicely stated.
When I look at Clinton and Obama, my first thought is Iraq. Then I go on to other political issues which separate these two candidates. One of which I will be voting for come next November.
Hillary gets a lot of heat about being the “evil” corporate lawyer on the Wal-Mart. In 1986, do you think it was socially “useful” for her to be the “token” female on the board? As is typical she was put in charge of the diversity committee.
Shark-fu, the Angry Black B*tch, offered some thoughts on these matters as well, back before the 06 elections:
There’s plenty more where that came from, if you care to click through.
Toleration may be better than overt abuse and attacks, but acceptance beats them both, hands down.
Thanks for the post, Jane.
Mmmm, me too. I have meetings after work nearly every night this week, so I haven’t been getting real dinner.
Zactly. He was essentially making a class based argument (though that of course was not what he called it). Though he was still honouring the dream that in America, everyone could become middle class - ie. one America.
As regards attitudes to class, Americans have long been saddled with a cultural myth from the last century and the one before that, that class boundaries do not exist as uncrossable divides here. There is the Horatio Alger narrative, that by hard work, smarts and a little luck one could cross the class divide, and the poor boy from the slums could end up wealthy and respected. The fact that this has, in what turn out to be statistically rare occasions, actually happened, keeps this myth alive, whole the actual class divides remain alive and well, increasingly rigid and the antipodes increasingly far apart.
The rise of the great middle class over the last 75 years also served to blur class distinctions as the lower class became the middle and gained increasing wealth and comfort. Now, of course, that is all in reverse as the middle class gets decimated and the wealthy increase their wealth by orders of magnitude.
Nonetheless, the idea of class mobility had kept this idea of a classless society going in the face of all contrary evidence, along with the deeply held conviction among many that they, too have a shot at the brass ring. Why criticize the rich when you could become one of them? This accounts for things like the hostility among those whom it would never affect towards the estate tax.
On the other hand, no matter how hard one worked, how smart one was, or how many lucky breaks one got, you could never become male, or white if you weren’t born that way. Therefore, in the eyes of many, even when not so in a practical sense, lines of race and gender are more inflexible and more strictly drawn than class.
That is highly likely. However, my point is that Hillary is such a divisive personality that many independents and Democrats may not vote at all or reluctantly for McCain because of their dislike for her. I will vote for any Democratic Candidate, but many won’t because of sexism, because they hated Bill Clinton, Because they hate her, or because they do not trust her. That combined tells me she will make a tight race when it should be a blowout.
Not so sure that Clinton “hatred” has always been about Hillary.
Myself and many of my friends were happy to have Bill get elected in 1992, even though I campaigned against him in the primaries. After Raygun and Shrub the First, we were happy to have any Democrat (in theory at least) in the White House.
After a few years, it was becoming quite obvious that we’d been “had.” I started becoming upset with Bill and his actions, and in fact used to say Hillary should take over because of her supposed work toward better health coverage and “it takes a child…” stuff. The DemocratIC Party rapidly disintegrated into a tool for BigMoney to keep us Liberals from actually getting anything accomplished legislatively. Then, Bill gets a BJ in the White House from an intern and lies about it under oath, completely embarrassing the DemocratIC Party and giving the Noize Machine enough ammo, justifiable ammo at this point, to tar Al Gore enough by guilt through association.
Those reasons and their long history of dirty campaigning are why I and many I know dislike The Clintons. It started with Bill, and Hillary has done very little too show she wants to do things differently.
At the risk of revocation of my progressive credentials, I must say that I don’t give a flying fuck about any of the identity-politics squabbling in this campaign season. Not Chris Matthews’s sexism, not Bill Clinton’s conflation of Jesse Jackson with Obama, not the complaints in some activist circles that Obama is insufficiently black. I don’t give a shit about any of it.
One bigotry ought to overshadow all political discussion, and that’s the presumption that Americans (Israelis too, but that’s for another post) have the right to violate international law and invade countries that have neither attacked nor threatened us, and kill and maim and displace their inhabitants at will.
The illegal invasion of Iraq has precipitated the untimely death of approximately half a million Iraqis, and in my book every one of those deaths was a lynching. Democrats will allow the leaders who perpetrated this crime to go both unimpeached and unprosecuted.
Sure, the Republicans are spectacularly worse. But the daylight between Republicans and even nominally progressive Democrats is the difference merely between embodying and enabling this bigoted, triumphalist, neocon agenda, and I’ll be damned if I let anyone tell me that this state of affairs shouldn’t nauseate me to the core.
Whether or not Hillary is hobbled by misogyny or Obama by incipient racism — these issues might have had traction for me at some more idyllic time. But their complicity in and/or insufficient opposition to world-historic — and yes, racist – murder overshadows all.
I was speaking basically in terms of economic strata (class if you will). Now as to the question of is the Bush gang ‘classy’? The view in our home is a resounding no.
Not particularly. It was so routine.
But I did witness a funny one. Female Director of Research of large NYC money manager was speaking at Financial Women’s Assn breakfast. I invited the salesman who covered the account. We arrived separately & hooked up during the meet & greet. He was beet red. Said he thought he was the only male there. (Out of about 100 attendees, there were probably a handful.) I said: Well now you know what it’s been like for most of my career. I think he got the point.
From what I’ve seen from them to this point, I’d very strongly support Donna Edwards or Darcy Burner over Obama. Given Obama and Hillary, I’m picking Obama.
Am I sexist?
DingDingdingDingDing!!!!!
I used to claim being tolerant and then realized that in fact I was being arrogantly judgmental. I.E., “I have judged you and found you wanting but in my magnanimous exercise in goodwill, I won’t say anything.”
Acceptance is much harder to bring about.
Great story ….. and a terrific way to have made a point.
Sounds like my degree program in Adult Education. There were far more women than men in the program and one night a mom brought her young son to a seminar class. Afterward he said top her, “why are the men so quiet in there”?
So has Mukasey now:
So, per the Attorney General of the United States of America, it’s not “torture” and not a crime, if you obtain sufficiently important information.
The obvious next question is whether Bush and Cheney have obtained sufficently important information that they are not criminals? If the information that they’ve waterboarded out of their victims is of insufficient value, I recommend that they be immediately impeached and imprisoned without bail. Flight risk you know. I understand that one of them recently purchased a get away in Paraguay.