And here we go again. Tim Dickinson, editor of Rollingstone.com’s National Affairs Daily:
There’s only one thing that makes sense of the Clinton campaign’s clumsy and classless injection of race into her primary battle with Barack Obama. And that is that her victory in New Hampshire — impressive though it was — threatened to transform her into a special-interest candidate.
Hillary would not have won that battle without exaggerated support from women. Despite having campaigned vigorously as a candidate who just-so-happened to be a woman, her lifeline came from affinity voters.
Hello, ladies! You may make up 57% of the Democratic voters in Iowa and New Hampshire, but you’re "affinity voters." Congratulations.
And so, while Obama is being forced to clarify that he is not, indeed, a Nation-of-Islam sympathizing closet anti-Semite, no one is looking much at Clinton’s very real troubles winning over the hearts and minds of male voters.
That’s a good question. In yesterday’s Michigan primary, Hillary Clinton did indeed lose the "single men" vote to "uncommitted" but won every other group (single and married women, married men). Does that mean single men have some special insight into the political debate that women just don’t have? That they are able to look past their own narrow view and be wise, magnanimous and judicious in a way that female "affinity voters" just can’t? Are women being short-sighted and selfish in deciding to cast a vote for Hillary Clinton? I suppose that means married men are just henpecked. Well, that’s just certain to get everyone’s blood boiling on all sides of the debate, isn’t it?
Woo hoo! Let’s have a bonfire.
In the midst of all of it, Dickinson has a valid gripe — Richard Cohen’s specious and irresponsible concern-trolling from the pages of the Washington Post, where he attempts to mainstream right-wing hate mail claims tying Obama to Louis Farrakhan. It’s right up there with Joe Lieberman meeting with Jewish groups to tell them they should worry because Ned Lamont was tight with the African-American community — absolutely reprehensible. There are also legitimate concerns about race baiting invading the campaign dialog.
That tends to get buried the minute you dismiss the majority of people within the Democratic party for voting with their vaginas.
Both of the candidates have indicated they want this spat to stop. In last night’s debate they refused to play the moderators’ race and gender baiting and "gotcha" games. If journalists like Brian Williams, Tim Russert and Tim Dickinson continue to inflame situation, it’s a good indication that they’re the ones who find it advantageous to egg it on — not the campaigns or the public. Both Clinton and Obama looked exhausted last night. But the "affinity voters" aren’t the ones perpetuating this narrow and divisive frame.
There are legitimate reasons to oppose Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama as candidates. But there are a lot of people just use these issues to cover up their own misogyny and/or racism, and polarizing articles like these that attempt to reduce the dynamic to a "chicks and blacks" debate, while media-friendly and aimed at the lowest common denominator (the ideal Chris Matthews frame), give them plenty of opportunity for refuge.
It may get you on Hardball, but it’s not "journalism" and it’s not helpful.
Related posts:
- Late Night: You Know, Perhaps There Are Reasons the GOP Is Having Trouble with Hispanic Voters…
- Arcane Labor Law Counts the Votes of Non-Voters
- Louisiana Justice of the Peace Keith Bardwell Tries to Justify His Racism
- NJ-Gov: Polls Show Very Tight Race Between Corzine, Christie
- Election 2009: Election Night Thread #1; Polls Now Closed in VA
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Wake me on November 3rd, please.
Goodbye Rolling Stone, generation Y jackoff rag.
What % of single men are gay?
Hello, Jane!
Told you I’ll see you at the Lake…*g*
Sometimes being in the southern hemisphere seems just barely far enough away. The Cohen article was absolutely reprehensible, WTF was he thinking?
Thank you, Jane.
OK Jane you jest right?
I have only watched the first series of questions from last nights debate so far but I was shocked at how hard the moderators wanted to steer away from issues to towards a self-destructive spiral of nonsense between the candidates. And I was really delighted about how none of the candidates would bite.
t’s right up there with Joe Lieberman meeting with Jewish groups to tell them they should worry because Ned Lamont was tight with the African-American community — absolutely reprehensible
Well – he may be reprehensible, but at least he’s consistent about it…
Tim Dickinson (no comment on that last name) launches a pro-affinity laced tirade…
Re-Post..but an interesting opinion by Susan Faludi on why “older” women support Sen Clinton. My thought was that older women had more personal experience with gender discrimination; Ms Faludi has another “take”
LaTimes
OT
Just got an email from Senator Dodd. He needs help retiring his campaign debt. If you like the job he’s doing in the Senate, you might throw a few bucks his way.
http://www.chrisdodd.com/contribute
Ah Jane, aren’t you being the gracious one today.
My bold. Journalists indeed. Oh how I long for those days when Hunter S. Thompson was the National Affairs editor at Rolling Stone. and there actually WERE journalists covering the politicians.
I was shocked at how hard the moderators wanted to steer away from issues to towards a self-destructive spiral of nonsense between the candidates.
Actually, I was impressed by the candidates’ responses, which boiled down to: “No. Race isn’t an issue. Fuck you. Next question.”
And J-Lie’s good buddy McCain talking about “Judeo-Christian” values in Michigan.
Wake me when these guys–and isn’t it interesting that they all seem to be middle-aged-plus white males of comfortable means–are actually called out as race-baiters. Next thing you know they’ll be penning articles in Ron Paul’s newsletter.
Helpful. Not. Tim Russert tried really hard last night with the gasoline but came up short. All three candidates comported themselves with dignity. I’m really proud of all three Dems, I tell you. And afterward, Chris Matthews just won’t quit his fuckery. If all this baiting in the media continues, I predict MSM (especially the teevee folks) will fall flat on its face. Americans are getting sick of it. At least the ones I know.
Hey ((((Jane))))!
Who u callin’ a lady?!
We’re ” ” ” and we ‘re not gonna take it any more! ;->
Thanks for the link.
For sure, Hillary’s strong suit is competence. And that alone would be quite an improvement over the last 7 years.
But the MSM denigrates competence with words like overscripted.
what this gender-voting discussion is missing is a mention of, well, hung chad.
I’m still laughing at “voting with their vaginas”. Oh Jane.
Every single one of the repubble candidates is the scariest one I’ve ever seen, until I look at another of them.
As Tweety apparently let slip last night, “WE [!] HAVE NO CANDIDATE!”
How does he even shave in the morning. Oh, wait…
The media has wanted this to be the “black guy vs the woman” from the very start. They couldn’t care less about “Obama vs Clinton”. They couldn’t care less about Edwards. They couldn’t care less about issues.
It was very encouraging to see the candidates NOT take the bait. If anything it made Russert and the boys look even more foolish.
Biodun! Your post yesterday was amazing.
Thank you.
Gov Devol Patrick was on television this morning saying anything the Clinton campaign does is on purpose.
aw c’mon. she’s just a grrrl. heh /s
Hello, I’m mainly a lurker but I badly need some advice on a wildly off-topic situation, except in that it involves an anti-Iraq war activist. I wouldn’t go this far OT but I’m at a loss.
A friend of mine needs to move very quickly. Unfortunately, the option she likes best so far is with this woman. (I’ve edited the name out so that it’s not googleable.)
(Wikipedia article.)
My friend’s two previous experiences have involved sharing a house with the owner as well, and both situations ended pretty badly on account of First Owner’s secret plans to sell the house from under my friend’s lease, and Second Owner being an evil psycho, so her future housemates’ sanity is pretty much her #1 priority now.
It sounds a little like this woman got on the wrong side of the run-up to the Iraq war. There’s contradictory information on her mental competence as well. The Wikipedia article certainly gives the impression that she was treated very poorly when she was in custody. And the articles about the case stop around mid-2006; the case seems to have died down. Still, is it a good idea to rent from her? Can anyone weigh in on this matter? Maybe some of you are familiar with the facts of the situation?
OMG! I’m 60-something yrs YOUNG!?!
And I’ll vote for Edwards in spite of his good hair.
I found the name in less than 10 seconds. And I’m not even very good at searching.
So what exactly is your purpose in posting this?
Dickinson is ridiculous. This is a man who cited the “anonymous” Clinton advisor mentioned in The Guardian as proof of how vile Hillary Clinton was without any scrutiny or basic critical thinking skills. He also refuses to ever hold Obama to the same standards.
Besides, everyone should know that Cohen applies the “Farrakhan Test” to everyone, including Toni Morrisson for speaking at the Million Man March. The man is notorious.
Is it more important to find a place to live quickly or to understand the potential problems with a person you will be living with? My gut feeling is find another room mate even if it might be unfair. Taking care of one’s self
at this point is important.
I hope I understood the question.
Sorry that was supposed to be a response to #25. Not sure how that happened.
The Vagina Monologues, by Eve Ensler, a friend on Facebook.
And Andy Borowitz thinks Timmeh’s head should hold its own primary.
Somehow I think it already does.
As I said, thanks so much for inviting me. FDL is amazing. You and Christy are a phenomenon!
“If journalists like Brian Williams, Tim Russert and Tim Dickinson continue to pour gasoline on the situation, it’s a good indication that they’re the ones who find it advantageous to egg it on — not the campaigns or the public.||”
Additionally, if they choose to exacerbate this potential division, and ignore the matter of potential disagreement between religious fundamentalists and admirers of the Gilded Age, it says something about their partisanship. They can’t claim that they are just after interesting news (yellow journalism) but are non-partisan.
Good grief.
My sentiment exactly.
If Edwards were to out himself as gay that would fire up the punditocracy’s interests. They could then create the woman vs the black guy vs the gay guy! Cage match!
OK…I’m sorry but while I can imagine (sadly, and thanks a lot!) voting with one’s penis, I just don’t see how the mechanics would work for vaginas.
Great post Jane. I really like your focus on the misdirection of the punditry and unbiased view of the candidates.
What if he just starting shouting I AM NOT GAY!?
So that’s where we are, huh?
8 yrs of chimpy has yielded a media that trashes any candidate who can remember more than one sentence at a time.
Reporterating is hard work.
Jane Hamsher:
You say, “Richard Cohen’s specious and irresponsible concern-trolling from the pages of the Washington Post, where he attempts to mainstream right-wing hate mail claims tying Obama to Louis Farrakhan. It’s right up there with Joe Lieberman meeting with Jewish groups to tell them they should worry because Ned Lamont was tight with the African-American community — absolutely reprehensible.”
This column wasn’t a “right-wing hate mail attack” — it was, as you yourself say here, an attack comparable to Lieberman’s attacks on Lamon, i.e., an attack from the Lieberman-Clinton wing of the party. The last paragraph of Clinton’s, er, Cohen’s column makes this pretty clear, as he echoes the attack on Obama’s “voting present” in his legislative career.
Ding ding ding.
The MSM is Stockholm Syndromed. They can’t bear having their master of the last seven years made to look bad.
But the “competence” issue is also gender related. Men may or may not be good at their jobs, but women must always be competent, otherwise they are a disgrace.
Excellent point for an excellent post.
I did not watch the debates but I did go back and read comments from last night here at FDL. It’s clear the press are no longer referees or guardians of the public interest.
You would think that if those whole affair–that the press started by willful misinterpretation and sadistic glee–was truly disadvantageous to Obama, that his supporters wouldn’t dare risk inflaming it, especially a high-ranking one that wouldn’t speak out without Obama’s approval (Patrick and Obama are very close). The moment I saw Jesse Jackson, Jr. spewing nonsense on TV–the day after NH–is the moment I knew this would be ugly (Axelrod will take advantage of anything the press will allow him to and Obama himself said to get ready for “rough and tumble” politics just days ago).
Note: I’m not saying Clinton’s supporters hands are clean (Johnson, Mark Penn), but to hold her personally responsible for even supporters and not Obama for even his staff makes it all the worse. Just before this, she seemed to have been riding post-NH momentum to closing the gap in South Carolina, too. My political heart still beats for Edwards, but this whole thing has been a damn shame.
I edited out the name because I didn’t want my post to be found in case she googled her own name. I wanted to see if other people could interpret the situation better, since it’s not your usual renting-from-a-person-standing-trial case. I don’t think it really warranted such a snippy response.
marymccurnin @ 30 – Thanks. Finding someone reliable is the highest priority, I think.
Well Jane, I am Jewish, but no way would I vote for Joe Lieberman for any office. Female too, but not voting for Hillary in the primary.
Yep. And as we all know, only the poor folks making less than $100k per have to work hard at hard work. Reporterating that pays millions and millions of dollars means “I don’t has to go hard anymore, I can just take strnography and be done with it.”
- and others…
do i gather mods removed a post? & i got stuck with the offending ##?
weird. *sigh*
Totally! And with stereotypical costumes to make it easier for the crowd to identify who’s who.
No its still there – so who knows.
41
In response to Praedor @ 38
What if he just starting shouting I AM NOT GAY!?
_______________
if he does it with a rather wide stance the Republicans will believe him …..
I agree with everything you said
On Cohen and Clinton: The elephant in the room is the Iraq (and Iran?) war and AIP*C’s concern that the anti-war movement in the U.S. will have success in countering current US M.E. war commitment, hence the support for Hillary among core supporters of this group because she has been very supportive of the Iraq and other war iniiatives here.
While this was framed in terms of Farrakhan, the wide spread dissemination of the nasty email about Obama clearly was only part of the story. It was terrific that Je*ish leaders came out condemning this email attack (and Cohen’s related Wash Post piece) and hopefully that will be the end of it.
Maybe this will signal the turning of a new page for faltering black and Je*ish relations here which have changed dramatically from the close ties in the 1960s civil rights movement (when leaders of both groups pressed together to bring about core changes in discrimination impacting both. Alas, tensions built in years following with the movement against the apartheid South African government (and Isr*el ongoing support) seen as an anathema to many African Americans, followed by the growing Palestinian crisis and black support for that community. It would be great to put this behind us too (and hopefully the new US President can negotiate a real peace in Isr*el/Palestine) allowing black and Je*ish communities to work toward positive interactions here. This will be critical not only for the Democratic party but also for the country as a whole.
Well, then they’d brand him a Republican…
So, in your opinion, would it be best for people who want to defeat the Republican candidate for President in 2008 to try to put aside this divisive issue, or insist on sticking with it until we can reach a consensus on establishing blame?
Hello M,
Since it was your first post and touched on a delicate matter, I think some readers may feel self protective. There’s been a lot of trolling during the primaries.
I too was a little puzzled by the editing and inclusion of a wiki link. But now I understand. Unfortunately, I have no advice, but good luck to you.
Hi, Jane!
Calling these people journalists is like calling Taco Bell Mexican cuisine.
This column wasn’t a “right-wing hate mail attack” — it was, as you yourself say here, an attack comparable to Lieberman’s attacks on Lamon, i.e., an attack from the Lieberman-Clinton wing of the party. The last paragraph of Clinton’s, er, Cohen’s column makes this pretty clear, as he echoes the attack on Obama’s “voting present” in his legislative career.
______
Cohen gives nerds a bad name ………
Why a * in the middle of Jewish?
Edwards as the last-minute savior for the R prez race! Love it.
Jane – great post: I didn’t hear it but the call out from the audience that the questions were race bating was interesting. Hopefully that will send a signal too, that enough is enough.
Maybe we no longer need the * – for a while in the past, I was told things would get stuck in the back room without it. Great not to have to do it anymore!
Evidently it is a filter catcher. I’ve not quite figured it out.
OOOOHH — I hadn’t thought of that aspect of it!! Quick, does anyone know somebody on his campaign staff? I think we have a winning strategy here for him. Who said strategerizing was hard?
pretty sure that was for the organization a i p a c, not the words Israel or Jewish.
LOL, true!
While I’m thinking about it, I’m a big ACLU fan, but WTH are they saying about people ########## in a public stall expect some privacy???? And how about (no surprise here) Britney coming out of a store changing room completely naked and she and her BF getting it on right there?
Excuse me, but I have an expectation of being public while walking in public places. Get a room!!!
As I said, Timmeh tried hard last night:
See how netroots working together can be brilliant! *g*
Well obviously you are correct :-) – and thanks!
Here’s the real dilemma. Women ran to Hillary’s defense? They felt sorry for her? Since when have women voted (or done anyhting else for that matter) as a block? I’m not buying it. Something’s fishy here and I can’t put my finger on it. Leave it to the rags to blame Hillary’s coronation on women. She stinks. So be it.
Thanks Fern.
It wasn’t on my machine, but all the responses were.
It’s now showing, since I just refreshed the page.
Very weird indeed.
For awhile, probably still(?) there were at least 3 responses to ## that, on my machine, held my comments, but none of the responses referred to anything i was saying. help! the toobz have fried. nooooooooooooooo….
Cohen is also an errand boy for Hiatt in a way that the rest of the neocon stable there — Krauthammer, Will, multiple Kagans — aren’t, as he has no viable journalistic existence outside his op-ed perch there. Hiatt tasks him with particularly noisome, unscrupulous work, such as his Libby columns.
I want to go back and read that link to Susan Faludi, but I first wanted to comment on the interesting phrase that we “vote with our vaginas”. I view that as a sexually ojectifying phrase. Used to, it was our uteruses (uteri?) that “caused” us to vote the way we do. A sexual partner has access to the vagina, but not the uterus. I think there is a graduate paper in there somewhere.
Combine that with the FU Frank moment from the Paulinistas and we at least have a revolution against the MSM on our hands. Not a bad thing, imo.
Maybe that’s a strategy: demonstrate against the networks and the competing networks will report it…
Absolutely!
Taco Bell is Mexican cuisine, US version. So then they are journalists, US version…*g*
Try quiting the web browser and starting fresh.
Yup!
The graduate paper is where?
Ditto. My take as well.
Anywhere you can find a “gap” in the research.
I took the v with v remark as a nice alliterative revision of the vote with your wallet phrase. My grad paper will come from the English Dept. *g*
I finally got a chance to read the intruding comment.
Frankly, I’m suspicious. Sounds like an attempt to drag FDL folk into linking wildly to stuff that will light up switchboards somewhere.
But then I’m just an overly cautious old lady….
I’m just not going there, myself.
There’s probably good reason why single males skewed against Hillary. Some of them (at least the older ones) are probably single for a very good reason.
RollingStone’s readership is largely white male. That’s who their advertisers target. So, think about it.
So, under that theory, a teenage boy would be what, a prostate with ears?
Single white males?
That image works for me.
So, under that theory, a teenage boy would be what, a prostate with ears?
reply
Aha! A backdoor slap at the University of West Virginia “eers”!
awright… hysterectomy
see you & raise 5000
Should I be speaking for the prostates with ears, for they have no voice?
Single white males?
Was at one time. My guess is that their readers are aging and marrying.
They’re also like a bunch of yapping chihuahuas.
It is kinda a strange frame. On one hand it hardens those who are actually skewed and on the other, in a liberal baiting sorta way, challenges those single males like myself that dislike Hillary for her policy.
I’m not touching this with a ten foot GOPness.
If distant memory serves me, they don’t need no stinkin’ voice.
ohgawd it’s tempting, but no…. and yet i just had to click & type, didn’t i? you trolled & you can just call me a marlin who rose up & tapped the bait just once, lightly. bye.
this conversation is cracking me up…
carry on.
OK, I am back. You kids need to settle down. And yes, for us “older” women, I highly recommend the Faludi article. She hits the nail on the head.
RollingStone demos:
http://www.srds.com/mediakits/…..phics.html
you folding?
no more chips in the pot?
geewhizzyizzy, my braaiiiinnnn issssssmeltinggggggggrrrgggg…….
Please read the The Vagina Monologues, by Eve Ensler. See link in my 31 above. That’ll help you a little bit.
Oh, then it’s time for the Frito Bandito!
I’ve seen it on stage.
OK so why are we talking about teenage boys? Is it my fault for the larry craig reference? are they even old enough to vote? what are we worried about again?
LOL!
I read it yesterday, and really enjoyed it.
ouch!
ick!
Biodun, I am not sure what your point was – my comment was coming from gender and womens studies, essentialism and all that.
I wouldn’t know where to begin to offer advice. The best I can do is offer sympathy for the anti-war activist.
The U.S. government is a pretty shabby affair at present. The story you related reminded me of this absolutely bravura oratory delivered by the UK’s George Galloway defending himself against a series of spurious charges being level by the oafish pothead Norm Coleman in what has to be one of the most embarrassing events in the long and tawdry history of embarrassing events in the U.S. Senate:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrdFFCnYtbk
Good luck with your efforts.
Did the professor in me come out? It is a good thing I didn’t have to throw an eraser at you. *g*
there’s something off-putting about all of this anal, pouring-over-all-of-the-demographic-polling obsessiveness. it’s somehow a bit like the ratings in NCAA football. it’s arguable, essentially meaningless, inconclusive, a waste of time and booooring. i couldn’t give a rat’s ass if single white males didn’t vote for Hillary nor do i care what it means.
Susan Faludi’s piece in the LA Times was spot-on, though.
Re:
I’m shocked, shocked I tell you. Professional politician acting professionally? Why that’s unheard of!
And…you still think the V-word is not appropriate? *g*
In my generation we never used the v-word, and I don’t intend to start now.
2nd childhood is a beautiful thing.
my only excuse, & admittedly a shabby one.
striking terrah into the hart of chimpy’s world, I. ALWAYS. VOTE.
Biodun January 16th, 2008 at 10:05 am
118
In response to Gnome de Plume @ 107
And…you still think the V-word is not appropriate? *g*
________
being from another age, i just can’t get past the title. i don’t wanna know ……
If you do this demographic analysis long enough and hard enough, it will really help you not be able to figure out who won & why.
Yeah, even this femblog commenter has a list of words not to leave this foul mouth.
v with v is a cliterary device. :~)
(ducking for cover)
You guy’s are slippin’.
jane offered to build a bonfire and not one of ya’s offerd to make smores, bring marshmellows. or sing Koom Bah Fuckin’ Ya.
I’ll get the gas.
:)
Melba and Mabel resemble that comment lol
HEY! Everybody outta the [gene] pool!
Someone stole the chalk and we were playin’ billiards.
Now rack ‘em up.
You have to get an Obama supporter for that.
Re:
Not likely. It’s more like they have been “read into the program”. Face it, the U.S. Government today is a toadie for corporate chieftains who dominate our culture. You might more correctly think of government bureaucracies that have become the Patty Hearsts of predatory capitalist America.
it was Senor Bandito that was calling the US Navy in the straits of Hormuz last week imo
My late brother’s name was Gene and he built swimming pools.
i hope this isn’t too OT, and nobody needs to respond but i suddenly started wondering today if Michigan and Florida democrats may be pissed about not being included in the convention this summer and just sit on their hands come November thus enabling the Republicans to take those two states? i haven’t seen this matter addressed as of yet. think about it and bring it up tonight, or some poster post on it maybe?
I’ll get the sticks
Give that man a cigar!
Re:
The MSM is talking its own book. The public have no one to represent them except this army of Liliputians here on the Intertubers.
No, no. It has nothing to do with that. It actually caused a flashback to a fantastic course I took from a fabulous philosophy professor in 1992. That is where the graduate paper comment came from.
What the phrase said to me was that the writer, Dickinson, thought he was using a word that would equate with penis and thereby appear non-sexist, or equal when what it did was make it more sexist. Maybe that is what he meant to do.
punaise January 16th, 2008 at 10:08 am
124
v with v is a cliterary device. :~)
(ducking for cover)
just don’t get caught between the two Vendetta ………..
Susan Faludi’s article captured it for me. Competence is huge.
Faludi really lays out the missing piece of the equation for the media. For me it is definitely about competence. That is what I keep coming back to, she will do the job, she will clean up the mess Bush has made of this country, even if it means doing the tedious work. Hillary knows where she is going and she is going to take charge and make it happen.
Incompetence is what drives me crazy about Bush Jr. If he was at least competent, I would still disagree with him, but at least it would make some sense; he would be doing the wrong thing, but accomplishing some result. Instead, he is totally incapable of accomplishing anything.
Worse than that, he screws up everything he attempts. Bush on a trip to the middle east is giving me nightmares.
Faludi:
The correct Hillary Clinton stereotype
Forget the ‘mommy’ image. Female voters see bedrock competence.
From the numbers I’ve been seeing, it won’t matter.
The Pukes are DOOMED.
BWAAAHAHAHA HAAAA
My comment was coming from gender studies and postfeminism… pace: Amelia Jones, Postfeminism, Feminine Pleasures…
Hmmm. Deliberate or knee jerk emotional reaction. The fact that MSM becomes so defensive when critized or so excitable when W is critized makes me think the latter. If they’d been “read in,” wouldn’t they have clever talking points to counter criticism?
Don’t have strong opinion one way or the other. Just speculating.
GET. OUT!!!!
Although the DNC is penalizing MI and FL all their delegates for breaking party rules, the RNC is penalizing SC, NH, MI, and FL half of their delegates for the same infraction, that is holding primaries prior to the party mandated dates. Granted it is not quite the same, but still, I don’t think the Rs will really and truly make that big a fuss over the penalty.
imo…they are not incompetent,venal yes
they have scored big beyond their wildest dreams….that is how great crimes are commited…diversions
I live in michigan and i still intend to vote in the general. I was just miffed about the Primary idiocy. They can’t mess up the general too much, at this point in this state. The question is going to be just how pissed off the large number of voters will be at the Shrub’s admin.
Michigan is decidedly quirky in terms of how it votes. We went democratic the last two general elections. May do so again despite the primary idiocy. Which was the fault of our own Legislature being stupid. *shrugs* For all i know it may go Rethug this time around, but i hope not. Mostly because i live on the west side(and very GOP territory) of the state, and even here? Majority of the citizens are right pissed off at ShrubCo. We just might go Democratic again. *grin*
It seems to be enlarging.
anytime GIGANTIC fortunes are realized,it is NO accident
I probably should too at this point. On va laisse-tomber tout ca...
Uh oh. Does this mean that you and I need to go off and have intense conversations of our own? Too bad you are in Michigan and I am in Texas. If you need to get warm, you could come down to one of our FirePup picnics. Trouble there is that they never last long enough for you to get to talk with everyone the way you want to.
I agree with this opinion piece: “The correct Hillary Clinton stereotype” http://www.latimes.com/news/op…..-rightrail
Makes a lot more sense to me than the mime that they were suckered in by her huge crying jag.
There’s that old joke about the only female in the medical school class, with the punch line: Boy are you going to be disappointed.
somebody said to me that DARTH went to Saudi,a week before boychimp…WHY ,i wonder
i’m not looking over my shoulder but Florida and Michigan have a good number of electoral votes. many things could happen between now and November…….
cried? someone cried?
Oh. You must mean Patty Buchanan last night. poor thing.
V word = clown car
OK, I am back. You kids need to settle down. And yes, for us “older” women, I highly recommend the Faludi article. She hits the nail on the head.
And for us boys her “Stiffed” is really good.
This is part of the plan for the Norquist-wing of the Republican Party: make the government so incompetent that people begin to believe the lie that government per se is the problem, rather than the sick fucks running it.
my sister lives in East Lansing. i know whereof you speak. i’ve seen the billboards ……
forgive us Jane, for we know what we do…
Unless I’m mistaken, that phrasing is Jane’s and not Dickinson’s…
forgive me, too, please. I cannot help myself.
I’m in Minneapolis, MN. And yep: It’ll be good to have a discussion of all this over glasses of red wine…Which I do. A lot.
And a very competent plan it was. It almost worked (or maybe it still will).
Anytime Punaise is in the conversation it is “Laissez les bon mots roulez”. No ducking required. We are all quite prepared with our groaning belts buckled tightly to our sides.
Actually i’m a bit farther west. Grand Rapids, in fact. I have to put up with Rubber Stamp Ehlers. Bleagh! (At least he’s not insane Hoekstra though. YIKES!)
I have an appointment to get to. I’ll be back in an hour or so. *waves and runs off*
Wait, isn’t Obama also welcomed by AIPAC? Also, his foreign policy is damn near identical to Clinton’s on Iraq and Israel/Palestine, no?
I thought that’s what they say in Noo Orelans…
I’ve been doing some detailed analysis concerning how deep into the various Federal agencies competent career experts have been replaced by right-wing partisan hacks. It is not a pretty sight, and some agencies could require a decade or more of nurturing to be restored to their previous level of competence and expertise. And, of course, the hackfucks they have been infested with will be doing everything in their power to resist this restoration project. The next President–assuming it’s a Democrat–is going to have a very difficult task ahead in this area.
I will be posting the details of my analysis at my own blog soon.
Part of the DLC caucus of policy continuation.
How about a quote from this Dickinson to clear the mind?
Emily Dickinson
Kind of relevant to the Edwards coverage………
oops. I beg your pardon. I knew it was one of those cold “M” states. *g* (I am from one, too, so I don’t hold it against you.)
I think it was Dickinson who said “voting with their vaginas” since the phrase was in italics.
A couple of good OTs at TPM.
1. A video of Hucksterbee talking about frying squirrel in a popcorn popper when he was in college.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/063883.php
2. Murdoch goes negative on Rudy.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/063870.php
A sample
It’s interesting that the MSM labelled the efforts of Dr. King and Malcolm X as “identity politics” and tried to imply that there was a zero-sum game involved. When they began to point out that economic and political issues were NOT zero-sum, but affected members of all depressed classes (in fact that race, religion, and other factors were used to divide people with mutual needs), they were eliminated.
I think it was pretty clear last night what was going on at the debate with the utter avoidance by the so-called “moderators” (actually inflamatory hacks) conspicuous avoidance of any questions about policies that relate to class…health-care, the sub-prime catastrophe (okay one question that, as stated, avoided fingering the real culprits), inflation, cost of healthcare and college, the collapse of employment opportunities, stagnation of wages, the deterioration of the infrastructure, and the malaise by most people that our nation is no longer progressing to better things as the wealthy gobble up everything and funnel it to their estancias abroad.
The fact is the Media is either complicit with such oppression, or willfully unqualified to present information outside of the framework of a cheap tabloid magazine. Do they really think that people can’t see the price of milk and gasoline, evictions and tuition that are affecting their lives.
I bet all these guys have their mileage and meals placed on MSNBC expense accounts and don’t even think it’s a problem.
Get the candidates talking about ISSUES and policies and you’ll have a unified Democratic party (even if there are different pathways these candidates have to solve our problems). Gender and racial politics evaporate, because on the tangibles it all gets down to class, and the capability of people to securely and confidently rise out of their current status if they make an effort. The Bush Administration and the Republican party is all about eliminating OPPORTUNITY.
BTW I am a single, white male and while I don’t consider any of the top-three Democratic candidates as ideal (and have serious problems with their approaches to Middle East policy), but I think that they an order of magnitude superior to the BEST of the Republican candidates on POLICY. Rolling Stone today is really not much better than Timmy Russert…who, as I recall attended Woodstock in a Fu Manchu. It’s read by those former frat boys who think they are cool because they know something about Hootie and the Blowfish and John Mayer. Notwithstanding Matt Taiibbi (sp.), it became a mouthpiece of the conservative/libertarian wing about the time it replaced Hunter S. with P.J. O’Rourke.
Now all one has to do is wait for Chris Matthew to start spewing about Clinton supporters believing men are stupid (”The battle ax supporters are playing the ol’ gender card again!”) and, hell why not, accusing Clinton herself of not only being man-hating but perhaps (just for fun) racially insensitive (”My God, she believes blacks are lazy, doesn’t she?!”).
touche’
Re:
Yuck. Taco Bell is to Mexican cuisine what chop suey is to Chinese cuisine. I.e. a grotesquely uninteresting substitute for the real thing.
Most of us on the West Coast call Taco Bell and the rest of the fast food stands “CalMex”. As opposed to the very tasty and authentico cuisine of New Mexico, or the almost-as-delicious TexMex of the barrios of San Antone and parts south.
OT, I am the West Union Iowa question on Froomkin’s Live chat where he predicts the Dems will cave on FISA renewal, so far a “safe bet”
Cmon, firepups, let’s help Dodd and others prove him Wrong!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..02800.html
Arrgh! This isn’t a pop-goes-the-weasel urban myth is it? Now I have to go look. ew.
Did you pick up this one? It’s a harbinger of more of the same I think.
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/…..ransition/
I just put one up at my place on one certain example of that.
/Blogwhore
Thats the one
.
lol. more like whiplash me going all high brow in sixty seconds after rolling in the gutter this whole thread. *g*
I knew Giuliani was sunk within the GOP when the NY Post started running headlines mocking him for constantly beating the 9/11 drum. Talk about Pot-Kettle-Black. Apparently, the masters of the GOP universe just decided to kill Giuliani, and Murdoch put his henchmen on it.
Austin is the capitol of Tex-Mex. San Antonio is the Capitol of Northern Mexico so its food is slightly more Norteno.
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Yes, IMVHO the effect is far too close to fingernails-on-chalkboard screechiness.
You’re right. I just refreshed. But it wasn’t when the post went up. Mods can confirm that. All right, then. Much ado about nothing. But then that’s Shakespeare, isn’t it?
Yep. And DHS doesn’t really even do much of actual value, so doing it incompetently is not that big a deal. Agencies that the nation has relied on for many, many decades to do things like protect us from dangerous food, consumer products, and pollution, keep people healthy, keep mines and workplaces safe, take care of veterans, enforce federal law, are in a shambles. Other than Iraq, this will be the biggest lasting disaster brought on by the Bush regime.
Don’t get me started on this. Edwards also falls right in with the pro-Israel at any expense crowd. I don’t even think that Hillary has gone as far as asserting that Shamir was “courageous” and a hero…and suggested that Israel should be admitted to NATO.
Edwards’ Herzliya Speech verbatim just one year ago is about as close to Lieberman’s position as you could find. And in that speech you’ll learn that Edwards has been visiting Israel for years, and receiving “complimentary” helicopter tours run by AIPAC-linked groups.
Last year Haaretz ranked him last of the (then) seventeen candidates for how “pro-Israeli” his voting record was, “pro-Israeli”, according to Haaaretz, consisting of certain objective criteria, as opposed to just being the jingoistic epithet you see from U.S. politicians and press. I bumped into this factoid in a Hill article about Obama’s support of legislation against cluster bombs (remember Lebanon?).
ooh – no-fault blogging…
Come on now, there’s no need to smear Clinton for Cohen’s remarks. Unless you have evidence, it’s just speculation.
And Obama himself isn’t exactly spurned by either Lieberman or AIPAC. Not to mention his foreign policy is virtually identical to Clinton: hawk.
One aspect you might want to take into account is those agencies which no longer come under Office of Personnel Management; FAA and DOD,that I know of. Under the guise of promoting a “more business like, performance based,” operation, they were removed from OPM. At least in the FAA, one of the results involves the widespread contracting of staff functions. Jobs that were formerly civil service are now private contractors. As a result, many Hatch Act restrictions on civil servant political activity would no longer apply. It is similar to the Blackwater military contractors, but would involve other agencies. It seems to me to be a threat to the principles of the Pendleton Civil Service Act which ended the spoils system, guaranteed a continuing civil service with administration changes, and precluded a politicized civil service.
I’m not sure I would go that far, buster. But you do lighten things up when you appear.
Re:
He managed to sneak about a trillion dollars into the hands of his cronies in the military contractor business in the past 7 years, saddle the public with interest payments on an additional $3 Trillion paid to the bankers and has made the oil corporations the most powerful and profitable force on the planet.
I don’t know what you been smoking in order to see Bush as incompetent. But you might want to come up for a sober look at reality from time to time.
Frankly, I’m totally disappointed that so many progressives/liberals have adapted the meme about “Bush’s incompetence” that Karl Rove helped to create when he started coaching Bush on his “everyman” persona. That schtick has worked all too well. As Boosh says, “you can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones to concentrate on”. Keeep reading about George’s malapropisms and think he’s dumb. Bush is laughing at you for the fact that he’s gotten away with deceiving you. He sees the liberals who consider him dumb to be naifs. Simpletons who can’t see his act. And he’s laughing at you behind your back every day.
In Edwards’ defense, he can’t afford to make enemies of everyone. I care less about what he says at Herzliyah than the position he takes on the war, which is a better one than Clinton’s, although his AUMF vote should have disqualified him in the first place from running for president.
Damn it. I think he’s reflective of our basic foreign policy assumptions being flawed; worse, we’ve endangered the Israelis even more so with the Bush doctrine, which our candidates refuse to reject coldly (Preemptive strikes anyone?). I believe during one of the debates, Edwards was also a bit hawkish on Iran as well.
I doubt it, democrats will be interested in supporting the candidate. To include them would be hugely problematic on many scores. To me the fact that Hillary did not remove her name from MIchigan shows how willing she is to do illegal (morally problematic) acts if she thinks it will help her. I feel the same about the teachers’ suit in Nevada.
Oh, I could’ve sworn he delivered a well-received speech at AIPAC. And again Lieberman ties unnerve me.
Obama came out before the Iraq war to say he was against it which is one big difference.
Absolutely true, Taco Bell is the “White Castle” of “Mexican Food”. Interestingly, one of my favorites of Border cuisine is the burrito, which is pretty rare in Mexico south of Chihuahua or Sonora. In fact, some Mexicans I’ve met deny it is Mexican at all. But it was supposedly invented in Juarez about a century ago, and spread north with the immigrant worker communities. Burritos are almost “burros” today. They are full-meals, with the exception of those chi-chi things called “wraps”.
And when they’re too obviously competent, they’re “pushy.”
(Don’t ask me what too obviously means, heck if I know.)
Re: “If they’d been “read in,” wouldn’t they have clever talking points to counter criticism?”
Reflect back to the autumn of 2002 and spring of 2003 during the run up to the invasion of Iraq. The MSM was in lockstep with Cheney’s propaganda machine. The percentage of commentators on the MSM in America were 97% in favor of war. It was even more pathetic at the BBC where a mere 1% of the comments were in opposition to the war. In spite of the UK population being overwhelmingly opposed to the lapdog Tony Blair and his master Boosh. So the major thrust by the media is to censor criticism off the air/print/etc.
As far as the sideshows involving the public ombudsen at the WaPo and NYT, these are just clever “pressure relief valves” that serve the same purpose as the “Cafferty Files” on CNN’s Situation Room. These are designed for people to simply blow off steam and then accomplish absolutely nothing with regard to the solidly pro-imperialist positions of the media.
I will maintain that the MSM has been “read in” to the imperialist scheming of America’s elites, and there’s every reason to believe that a war profiteer like General Electric will use its bully pulpit at NBC to toot its own horn for perpetual war for perpetual profits. The “war on teror” is a perfect scam. The American public are too dumb to see through the scam, and those that do are either unwilling to risk their status in society by stating what an obvious crock of slop this game is, or else they are like you and me, marginalized into an intellectual ghetto where we can talk all day to each other and never get close to the levers of power.
And so forth.
“Le secret des grandes fortunes sans cause apparente est un crime oublié, parce qu’il a été proprement fait.” –Honore de Balzac
Translation: “The secret of a great success for which you are at a loss to account is a crime that has never been found out, because it was properly executed.”
This is sometimes oversimplified and distorted as “Behind every great fortune there is a great crime.”
Again read the Herzliya speech of Edwards. If one is going to discuss Obama and Clinton, its wrong to suggest that Edwards is an alternative.
And Lieberman isn’t exactly out there campaigning for Obama. He’s (absurdly) trying to get Democrats to vote for McCain. I never really understood this “Lieberman is Obamas’ mentor” thing. Other than people constantly repeating it I have never seen any tangible evidence of a relationship beyond a few fundraisers where, in fact, Obama often says things about their distinctions on foreign policy.
Just curious? Because when I hear that someone is a “mentor” I think of a tangibly close association that goes beyond platitudes. Was Obama a ever a member of Lieberman’s staff, or did he replace Lieberman in a political position? Was he appointed by Lieberman to positions in study groups? Did he even come out to Illinois and campaign for Obama against the Democratic incumbent in the primary? Why didn’t Obama go to Illinois rather than stay in the Northeast, where Joe is at least somewhat influential, if Obama was his acolyte? The Illinois Assembly is about as an unlikely spot to be for a Lieberman myrmidon to be as can be imagined. I don’t think that Joe-Mama is particularly influential in the black urban communities of Chicago.
So where did this meme emerge?
I guess I see his incompetence in tragedies like losing an entire American city, bankrupting the country and giving China leverage over us with the ballooning deficit , losing in Iraq because he failed to send a large enough force to occupy the country, failing to understand the culture and politics of Iraq (deBaathification, Sunni vs. Shia conflict, failing to understand the implications of looting and lawlessness…), ready and willing to start a 3rd war in Iran…
I don’t see abdication of his constitutional responsibilities to the American people as competence. I don’t see competence in his criminal behavior. Apparently you do.
He was elected to do a job competently. That job description did not include gutting the constitution or enriching his cronies.
Thank you cinnamonape- well said. And, I agree with you completely. I think, however, that the “meme” came about during the Lamont campaign and the frustration that the large majority of the Dems (including Obama) did not come out in support of him against Lieberman. But, Obama, unlike the Clintons (Bill Clinton) did NOT go to Ct. to support Lieberman.
Obamas AIPAC Speech
What amazes me is the tissue thin differences between the speeches of Edwards, Obama and Clinton in the way they present things. I also note that Obama was, like Edwards, taken up by helicopter to Kiryat Schmona, which appears to be a sort of Potemkin Village, where buildings are left unrepaired for the benefit of American politicians. Standard propaganda tour. Unlikely they were escorted into the West Bank or Gaza. Or made a tour into Southern Lebanon.
Comparing Obama’s, Edward’s and Clintons statements to AIPAC and I find very little separating them, quite honestly. Obama does state that he opposed the invasion of Iraq from the beginning, which may have been something that those in AIPAC strongly disagree with. But like Edwards and Clinton he isn’t for full withdrawal or a removal of other US forces in the region – the code word is “redeployment” (i.e. to Kuwait, or perhaps Oman). He also did not state that “NO Options are excluded” with regard to Iran. His approaches are principally negotiation and economic pressures.
But wouldn’t that mean that the vast majority of Democrats were equally “mentored” by Lieberman? No one says that Bill Clinton was an acolyte of Lieberman (although the relationship between them is probably much closer than Joe-Lies to Obama). It seems that this is really selective assignation.
Oh…and just to demonstrate just how much bulldada gets out there that is uncorrected….
Obama DID IN FACT campaign for Ned Lamont against his former “mentor” Joe Lieberman.
Obama Campaigns for Grassroots Lamont
Sending an email message of “support” is a far different thing than having boots on the ground, side-by-side campaigning in support. Edwards did the latter which is far more effective than an email of praise.
Bluest Blue,
I thought I was pretty blue, too. But I guess not. We don’t seem to see the world a’tall in the same way…
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When George Bush told the FEMA head “Heck of a job, Brownie” Bush was speaking in code. What was accomplished with FEMA’s willfully inadequate response was to impose shock & awe on the poor of New Orleans. Republicans for decades had been trying to find a way to take over Louisiana’s political machinery as it had done with its “Southern strategy” across the rest of Old Dixie. But the enclave of determinedly Democratic voting blacks in New Orleans had proved an impedidment to the GOP’s hopes. The relocation of New Orleans poor is a dream come true for strategists like Karl Rove and Bobby Jindal. Louisiana crossed over into Republican hands last year, and look to hold the state for a good long while. As far as New Orleans is concerned, the businessmen in that city were always largely Republicans and very interested in ethnic cleansing for the sake of creating the first American City as theme park. The Disneyfication of New Orleans continues apace, and the blacks ain’t never going to be invited back. George Bush’s handling of the matter is a record of complete success for his constituency, rich white businessmen.
***
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Well, not the whole country. Just the part that Grover Norquist doesn’t like, i.e. the entitlements programs of the Federal Government which will become “too expensive” to maintain if the profligate Bushies have their way. That bankruptcy thing is a slippery concept. What’ll probably happen is that the Bushies will debase the currency, stiffing everyone on a fixed income or the holder of U.S. bonds and just walk away from the debt.
***
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U.S. policy is not to create a stable country in Iraq. Our policy is genocide, pure and simple. And we are accomplishing this incrementally, so that the rest of the world doesn’t overreact to our depredations. We haven’t “lost” Iraq. In fact, we’re stealing it oil well by oil well.
***
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I see it as the most brazen act of criminality in American history. The competence is that Bush has so utterly and completely checkmated any opposition to his tyranny. For George Bush, the Constitution is something you wipe your bun on after a satisfying bowel movement. He’s no more interested in the Constitution than he is in the fate of the convicts he executed while Governor of Texas.
And so forth.
Can we agree on incompetence in effectively governing a democracy and competence in criminal pursuits?
True. But, to throw Clinton and Obama in the same boat on this is disingenuous.
Re:
Yes to “competence in criminal pursuits”.
And no to “incompetence in effectively governing a democracy”. First of all, we are an Empire now, and talk of democracy is silly once you get beyond the local or perhaps county level of governance. And what Bush is doing is willful and deliberate destruction of much of our domestic infrastructure be it transportation, energy grids, education, social services, etc. The troubles that Bush are creating are willful, and not due to incompetence. They are insensitive and defiantly aristocratic in their disdain for the welfare of the master’s subjects. There’s no incompetence involved. It pure mean-spiritedness.
I agree with you 100%. Well put..:)
In addition to questioning the merits of this list (is the long term interest of peace in the region supported in this), it sounds a bit like Naral’s decision to support Lieberman, i.e. a decision was made .
It’s obvious the producers of last night’s debate wanted to turn it into a reality show about personalities rather than a discussion of the issues. They wanted to see fists flying across the table to make good TV. It shows the MSM is more interested in ratings and advertising revenue than informing the public about the issues and the candidates discussing these issues. The MSM is doing a great disservice to the public trying to turn the election process into a novelty of entertainment.
Hopefully Lieberman is Obama’s “mentor” in the same way that Hyman Roth was Michael Corleone’s.
Great post, Jane. Hillary simply as a candidate is empowering!
Below is the name and adddress of the fellow who has been sending out the nonsense to editors – about how John McCain is not a war hero – not an honorable man. I am a Democrat – and don’t agree with McCain on a lot of stuff – but find it truly appalling that men of valor and honor are exposed to the rantings of rat bags like this guy.
Unfortunately from what I saw tonight, PBS Lehrer, as well as the MSM continued focussing on the race- & gender-baiting & ignored Edwards almost entirely. Maybe Edw. was the lucky one, because all the stuff I heard was blaming candidates for all the stupid questions posed by TimR et al.
Dang! The voters WILL have their say, in spite of these guys!
I would comment in depth, but I’m getting sleepy. Suffice it to say nobody north of San Antonio knows how to do Mexican food. Austin makes nachos by piling sour cream on a mountain of tostados with a few peppers thrown in. Come to SA and I’ll take you to some real TexMex…you’ll never go back.