In the fine gunboat-diplomacy bogosity tradition that gave our great-great-grandparents "Remember the Maine!" without telling them that the Maine was a battleship loaded with munitions that probably blew up on their own without any outside help, fakery in the service of American Empire has been much in the news lately.
First of all, the latest Bush Junta effort to scare us into bombing Iran is not standing up well under close scrutiny. As emptywheel notes, the audio that’s been grafted onto the video of the tiny Iranian patrol boats tootling around the huge American warships is, well, questionable — and the Pentagon’s been forced to admit as much:
The audio includes a heavily accented voice warning in English that the Navy warships would explode. However, the recording carries no ambient noise — the sounds of a motor, the sea or wind — that would be expected if the broadcast had been made from one of the five small boats that sped around the three-ship American convoy.
Pentagon officials said they could not rule out that the broadcast might have come from shore, or from another ship nearby, although it might have come from one of the five fast boats with a high-quality radio system.
See the picture above? That’s one of the Iranian boats in question. Notice that it is an open boat. Notice that it has no way to keep ambient noise — choppy seas, motor noise, things like that — away from any recording gear that might be on the boat. Notice that there doesn’t seem to be much room for anything, much less high-class recording gear capable of blocking out all ambient noise — or the boxes of explosives that the threatening voice on the tape said would be used to blow up the American warships (but which never appear on the video).
In other fakery news (from McClatchy via TruthOut), it looks like BushCo’s charge that North Korea’s printing bogus US money is itself bogus:
Two years ago, as he was ratcheting up a campaign to isolate and cripple North Korea’s dictatorship financially, President Bush accused the communist regime there of printing phony U.S. currency.
"When someone is counterfeiting our money, we want them to stop doing that. We are aggressively saying to the North Koreans just that — don’t counterfeit our money," Bush said on Jan. 26, 2006.
However, a 10-month McClatchy investigation on three continents has found that the evidence to support Bush’s charges against North Korea is uncertain at best and that the claims of the North Korean defectors cited in news accounts are dubious and perhaps bogus. One key law enforcement agency, the Swiss federal criminal police, has publicly questioned whether North Korea is even capable of producing "supernotes," counterfeit $100 bills that are nearly perfect except for some practically invisible additions.
So, if North Korea doesn’t have the technical chops to pull this off, who does?
Could it be — us?
Klaus Bender, the author of a book on the subject, "Moneymakers: The Secret World of Banknote Printing," said that the phony $100 bill is "not a fake anymore. It’s an illegal parallel print of a genuine note."
"It goes way beyond what normal counterfeiters are able to do," said Bender, whose book first spotlighted the improbability of North Korean supernotes. "And it is so elaborate (and expensive) it doesn’t pay for the counterfeiting anymore."
Bender claims that the supernotes are of such high quality and are updated so frequently that they could be produced only by a U.S. government agency such as the CIA.
As unsubstantiated as the allegation is, there is a precedent. In his new book on the history of the CIA, journalist Tim Weiner detailed how the agency tried to undermine the Soviet Union’s economy by counterfeiting its currency.
Of course, we’re talking about the same folks who gave us "curveball" and faked-up Niger yellowcake documents as part of their justification for invading and occupying Iraq. That this was done by agents of BushCo is not only not impossible, it’s extremely probable.
And all of this is happening as the granddaddy of all trumped-up incidents, the Gulf of Tonkin Incident, has been once again shown to have been an exercise in American provocation that was turned into a pretext for massively escalating the American involvement in Vietnam.
…they’ve just been fakin’ it; they’re not really makin’ it…
UPDATE 12:25 pm FDL time: And now we find that while the Iranians didn’t do anything belligerent such as fling "boxes of explosives", the same can’t be said of the US warships, one of which the Pentagon now admits fired a warning shot at one of the tiny Iranian patrol boats back during a similar incident in December. Boy, Bush really wants an excuse to blow up Iran, doesn’t he?
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Well, as a wingnut at dinner last night said, all it took was a rubber dinghy to blow up the Cole.
But we are makin’ it, right?
Good Morning PW!
Makin’ it up as we go.
They are going to keep throwing shit against the wall until it sticks and we bomb Iran. The boats didn’t work, so now they are back to Iranian IED’s killing our troops.
That makes a great deal of sense. We know that the CIA’s $40 billion budget is insufficient, and that they have routinely participated in the illegal drug trade to get funds for actions that Congress wouldn’t support. So adding counterfeiting to the list would not surprise.
fatuous militarist and msgobama paid military spewman Jack Jacobs claimed the Iranian’s were outlaws
you remember him…the man who said the Brits who were captured should have fought to the death.
I actually find it encouraing that
W’sCheney’s Iran provocations are greeted with a yawn, after a small amount of flap. Seems public has learned to discount anything that the Administration sez on this subject.It’s all so nuts. Why aren’t the democrats screaming bloody murder? Especially Hillary and Barack?
Don’t we have anyone at all in the military who will call out this nonsense? In the CIA? FBI?
HELP!!!
if their lips are moving they are lying. we know that…we just have to keep pointing out the reality and hope some Dems bugle it.
It is completely clear to me that they just create scenarios that fit their agenda…pretty much all of it, and I mean “ALL” of it. Then they tell you a story via the media, so that they can do what they want to do for their own benefit and at our expense. We have to stop believing the myriad of lies. Doubt everything they tell us…everything.
Impeach.
If that is a serious threat to our warships, we aren’t getting much for all the money we spend on our Navy.
The big lie.
The CIA & FBI are willing participants, and no one running for prez will call it out because they all want the flexibility to run dirty tricks on their own watch. It’s pretty corrupt, with no way to stop it.
This country needs a Truth and Reconciliation Commission after the indictment of the criminals. If we do not disinfect with copious amounts of sunlight we are doomed.
General Petreaeus just announced that the Iranians have been increasing the number EFP’s in Iraq this year.
So we now have the top general in Iraq alleging that Iranians are killing Americans.
In a related story the Iraqi government is letting Saddam’s henchmen back into the fold.
Also, as we sink into recession, wouldn’t it be nice if Americans could recieve a $300.00 monthly stipend fromt he US government just like the former Saddamists, Baathists and dead-enders receive.
We have become Saddam.
-G
With the revevlations of the bogus elements of the tape, I keep thinking about the timing of this speedboat story coming right before the GOP debate as them being given an opportunity to chest thump about security. But to do that, they need to prime the pot of emotions of voters with a boogeyman and a scary story. Bin Laden and the quagmire in Iraq? not so much.
Also, this jumped out at me just this morning in an article:
“The top U.S. commander in Iraq, Gen. David Petraeus, told reporters after Bush spoke that the overall flow of weaponry from Iran into Iraq appears to be down, but attacks with “explosively formed projectiles” tied to Tehran are up by a factor of two or three in recent days. “Frankly, we are trying to determine why that might be,” he said.”
Does this strike anyone else as a deliberate attempt to create the impression of escalation from Iran tied to the bogus speedboat story? WTF. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200…..sh_mideast
If we are lucky enough to get an honest Dem president this go around, they need to purge all of the CIA and FBI leadership and start over. Remember, Bush41 was head of the CIA and most of the people in our government have very bad historical connections to criminal behavior (Watergate and Iran Contra).
The fact that this country has slid into this abominable situation is outrageous. I am glad, though, that the net has given us the chance to examine these activities publicly and put a lot of good minds together to unravel the web they have created. We need to keep on top of everything they do and call them on everything until they are gone and perhaps convicted of betraying the country once and for all. They are traitors – pure and simple.
The boats didn’t work, so now they are back to Iranian IED’s killing our troops.
That would be the same IED’s that the Boosh government claimed the Sunni insurgents were using against us – until somebody finally remembered that Iran Is Shiia, so it must be the Shiites that are using them against us, right?
The best book I have read on the spook business is The Second Oldest Profession by Phillip Knightley. Besides being a history of MI6 and the CIA, it offers useful insights into why spying doesn’t work. Mainly because it is secret, which means no mechanism to keep it to its mission. No accountability.
We created Saddam and OBL and Musharraf.
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
-G
Ahem, the country has ALWAYS been in this abominable situation. Proxy wars, drug running, assassinations, coups (remember JFK) have been part & parcel of U.S. foreign policy since forever.
We have met the enemy and he is us. Pogo
Is it possible that Mukasey has some integrity?
Michael Abramowitz had an awful article in the WAPO today on Bush’s claims of success in Iraq; reported from Kuwait.
I sent him this email:
would it have been too much work, while quoting Bush about the success of the surge, to have mentioned in passing how many Americans, Iraqis have been killed in the past year, and how much the US has spent on the occupation?
You leave this out? No context for the claims of success. As a 30-year reporter–now retired–I don’t understand what you could have been thinking when you wrote this article?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..id=topnews
I’m going to throw this out there one more time. The operation they are conducting in Iraq right now is Operation Phantom Phoenix. Phoenix operations are historically assassination missions and evidence destroying missions. I have a suspicion that the strike in Syria and the strikes in the Baghdad area may be strikes to eliminate “camps”…i.e., torture camps and/or opposition to the government – not Al Qaeda. They destroyed the torture tapes. W made the comment that Auschwitz should have been bombed. Why??? Because it would have destroyed the evidence of what the Reich was up to – that is why.
BTW, something is being rebuilt at the Syrian site.
Any news on catching the post 911 anthrax killers, while we’re on the subject?
Agreed. It just seems worse now, because we are more aware of it in greater numbers.
Reporter was probably thinking he’d be the recipient of juicy leaks if he flattered W et al.
OT
Hilarious!
Bill Maher’s first show back for 2008.
Tony Snow confuses “Voter Fraud”with “Election Fraud”
http://tinyurl.com/27zrol
My my. You’re as much of a bright little sunbeam as I was previous thread.
Sorry dawgs. Sometimes, often lately, it’s hard to get outta bed in the morning and not just feel like crawling over into a corner to curl up in a tight ball, sucking thumb.
Christy and PW et al. Thanks for yanking us back to reality on a regular basis.
We WILL be joyful, and we WILL be realistic, and those are not necessarily incompatible feelings. It’d be nicer for you if some of us would just hush, if we can’t run properly on scent with the pack. Apologies…
that mukasey stuff is inevitable for someone with a beating heart. he is rock-solid cheney man on FISA and torture though. and you wont see any independent prosecutors or cooperation on prosecuting Congressioanl subpoenas.
dont take a penny on a dollar for repayment.
“They” just need to be impeached and convicted. All leads led back to the government.
I will let you know if he answers…maye I should send it to their omudswoman.
Remember the Maine, to Hell with Spain!
Well, it’s been a long time since the U.S. invaded & occupied another country unprovoked & uninvited. So that part is worse. But all the other actions seem in line with the historical pattern. One other difference: W et al, being incompetent, seem to be conducting them exceedingly clumsily. Geez, I thought any graduate of pre-K could have done a better job cutting & pasting on the Iranian cigar boat incident than the Pentagon did. Ditto the forged Niger documents. Ditto Curveball. All pretty transparent hokery to the alert outsider.
I just love that! Thanks! Any hope they’d have the guts to print it? They should!
The only people who will “successfully” run on the presidential ticket will be those approved of by the CIA, NSA big chiefs et al. It like being in a Woody Allen flick.
Good morning all. Thanks again PW.
Yeah, antrax perps. I hope I live long enough to find out who did that.
Thanks PW. As per usual, I thought your analysis was spot-on.
IMVHO, the Iranian weapon of choice in the Straits of Hormuz would be their short-range, nuclear tipped, Russian made anti-ship missile coming in at over Mach 2. The (Sunburn) skims the waves to avoid radar detection and then loops high and comes straight down. US claims it can knock it out, but the world’s militaries probably want to see it, to believe it. The Chinese have also bought Sunburns, because they would work well in any fight with us over Taiwan.
Also, fwiw, the Straits are the worst place for US Navy, capital ships. The Straits are two, very shallow, one-mile wide channels, through which 25% of the world’s oil flows. Sink a couple of super tankers (or US destroyers) in the Straits and it’s a world-wide depression.
OT, the geography is what drives our relationship with United Arab Emirates (Dubayi). They are right across the Straits of Hormuz from Iran.
Marcy is on it.
LOL – the corrupt gang that couldn’t shoot straight!!
ya just KNOW it’s home-grown-groan.
It’s so obviously fake on purpose — those miscreants in The White House are sending a signal to their supporters that it is indeed them, the miscreants in The White House, that are trying their hardest to start another war.
yes, I’m perplexed by the apparent lack of interest in locating those perps
no discussion of our intel apparatus is complete without a look at the Sibel Edmonds case. I’ll link to the authority on the subject – lukery:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..854/431373
don’t miss the link at the bottom:
http://letsibeledmondsspeak.bl…..tures.html
Waxman – jesus h. christ – have a hearing, fer chrissakes!
They don’t like investigating themselves. /s
They only targeted Democrats and the media and they only killed government workers.
No harm, no foul in the Bush/Coulter Army of Pod People.
-G
Not in Iran’s interest to cut off Straits of Hormuz, because that would damage their ability to export oil. They might be forced to if U.S. bombed them, but otherwise not.
More like the 5 small boats in a bathtub lie.
and those postal workers got little if any recognition for the lose of their lives, which happened in the course of their daily job.
IANAL but isn’t that felony murder?
Wasn’t that David Naughton who sang the cheesy tune Makin’-It?
By jove.
-G
To the Dems, they had to be taught a lesson and as for postal workers, like any other worker, they are expendable.
Funny their families weren’t given multi-million dollar payments for their deaths.
Only the 9/11 victims.
-G
See you guys later. Going to take a nap in the sun for a little while.
The anti-ship missiles you speak of would not be nuclear tipped because Iran has no nuclear weapons or even a program at the moment.
The Strait is 21 miles wide at its narrowest point. The shipping channel is 6 miles wide, 2 mile lanes for traffic going each direction and a 2 mile median between them.
Good morning, everyone!
Sorry I’m late — I think I might have a touch of my hubby’s cold. How are you all today?
Hi Phoenix Woman,
Re:
Respectfully, I disagree. The largest false flag operation in American history certainly appears to be 9/11. I won’t go into great length to debate this here, but I will say that I have spent over 2,000 hours researching the topic, and I consider myself an something expert on the matter, and better informed than about 99.999% of the population. I’m not bragging. I wished there were more people paying attention.
Last night I brought up the fact that the minority political party in Japan has commmenced to discuss 9/11 as a fraud in the Japanese Diet, their equivalent of our Congress. http://www.911blogger.com/node/13340
By the way, we are still seeking a translator for these videos.
More and more professionals are beginning to get over the shock & awe that 9/11 imposed on most if not all Americans. Here’s a fine example of the new and improved 9/11 truth community websites that are springing up with exceptionally well researched articles questioning the official mythology about 9/11. http://www.ae911truth.org/
Food for thought…
PS; If you google these four words (american media boca rudy), there is a pretty good story from the website newswithviews from last March. A lot of Guilliani involvement with the Boca building. Anyway, later.
Any of us could have cracked the anthrax case. Just one little problem, we would never have lived to see it hit the press. Accidents happen so easily.
Re:
And inflation is the sincerest form of flattening an economy…
Re:
The thought crosses my mind that Abramowitz knows perfectly well that he is a paid propagandist.
Left you one in the loft: http://firedoglake.com/2008/01…..nt-1199521
Ray, you’re wrong and you’re off-topic.
I’ve just edited the post to include Glenn Greenwald’s mention of the fact that, contrary to BushCo/Pentagon assertions, no boxes are seen being thrown from the tiny little bass boats.
The Iranians and the Chinese bought it from the Russians. All the links I have on it, say it’s got nuclear capability. I hope it doesn’t, but I don’t have any links to refute that claim.
You’re right, my bad.
OT…
Link
Jeebus..What Dem would want an endorsement from Ben Nelson?
Concerning the speedboats in the Persian Gulf:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01…..038;emc=th
Now I know that the Times has biases toward the Administration, yet in a world made up largely these days with much conflict, whatever else, a military expedition must understand the tactics likely to be employed by the adversary.
It’s too bad that any whitewash needs application in this matter.
So, we either get out of the Mideast, or come prepared to take care of ourselves.
What do you think of Prof. Steven Jones’ paper,
Why Indeed Did the WTC Buildings Collapse?
Re:
One of the best tools on the Web for researchers is the Center For Cooperative Research. They maintain “The Complete 9/11 Timeline”. Here’s the entry for the anthrax attacks
(QUOTE)
September 16, 2005: FBI’s Anthrax Investigation Has Gone Cold
The Washington Post reports that four years after the 2001 anthrax attacks (see October 2001), the FBI investigation is growing cold. [Washington Post, 9/16/2005] A New York Times article from the same day also concludes the investigation has stalled. The FBI has found itself on the defensive amid claims that they publicly smeared Dr. Steven Hatfill when lacking other viable suspects. [New York Times, 9/16/2005]
(END QUOTE)
I’ve more or less got the impression that the FBI doesn’t want to solve this one. Along with a lot of other crimes that are perpetrated by those at the nexus of our military, intel community (an ironic term if ever there was one) and some of our spooker privateers.
Here’s a 2 hour radio interview title “9/11 and the Deep State” that might interest some of you.
That’s right Phoenix Woman. They think we’re stupid? Yep. Well, not all of us are, of course.
http://whitenoiseinsanity.com/…..-voice-is/
Or it could be this guy! LOL…
http://youtube.com/watch?v=j6yoWar72YU
With George Bush’s Navy, we’ll never know.
Exactly. The “Bush/Israel blew up the Twin Towers” stuff hinges on willful misinterpretation of key evidence. My own favorite is how they pretend that WTC 7, which they claim was not seriously damaged, was deliberately destroyed to hide evidence of the Evil Plot — except of course that it WAS seriously damaged and what was left of it had to be pulled down so it didn’t affect any nearby buildings (this is frickin’ Manhattan, people, where skyscrapers sit cheek-by-jowl).
notice that Hillary Clinton has not apologized for or clarified her vote for the Kyl/Lieberman amendment laying the basis for wara against Iran.
also note
from http://jtaplin.wordpress.com/
so a vote for Hillary could be a vote for the neo-cons next war against a country that poses no threat to the USA.
I woulnd’t want that on my conscience. But if opposition to imperial adventurism is just a wedge issue for 2008 to use against the (R)’s, then of course there’s no problem.
I must say that I am consistently amazed that people here, who otherwise would never even consider taking, at face value, the word of the Bush administration on anything… consider it heresy to question the official 9-11 story.
Truly – I don’t get it.
Re:
Respectfully I disagree. Never before the Bush Administration was it the policy of the United States to engage in preemptive war as we did with the invasion of Iraq. That was totally a war crime, no ifs ands or buts. The U.S. is in violation of international law, and the reaaon we can flaunt it is that there is no effective counterforce to America’s military.
Additionally, a part of our awareness has to do with the fact that number of countries that we have unilaterally attacked continues to grow year by year.
William Blum’s “Killing Hope” documents interventions by the U.S. in 56 foreign nations since 1945. http://members.aol.com/bblum6/…..ocaust.htm
For those who are interest, Mr. Blum will add you to his monthly emailing of “The Anti-Empire Report“
that’s a good point, the 9/11 Official Story is supposedly the one thing the Cheney cabal tells the whole truth about. amazing. It’s as ludicrous as the Menendez brothers saying “pity us, we’re orphans!”.
and feel free to flame away – I gotta run for now – but will check back in an hour or two…
Close but not quite. Never before had the US overtly engaged in a preemptive war. But the Mexican, Spanish-American, and Vietnam wars were all started by suspect “incidents.” And that does not account for all the brush fire wars in Central America in the 1920s.
Well, if 9/11 was an inside job, it was run out of Cheney’s office without anyone on W’s team being aware. No one could fake the look on W’s face when the attack was whispered in his ear.
I maintain an open mind because so much surrounding 9/11 has been hidden from us. But that’s also why I haven’t decided it was an inside job. There isn’t enough information to be convinced either way.
One quibble. In VN, the U.S. military was invited by the existing govt. Of course, when that proved insufficient, assassination & made-up incidents did the trick.
Meanwhile Clusterfuck is in Kuwait doin another mission accomplished swagger speech. The surge was a brilliant idea- peace and freedom are coming to Iraq- and American will be there WAY past his term…
Little fucker’s full of shit as usual
I have one question;
how do we know there are any counterfeits at all if they are just extras of our own prints?
I am not following here at all…are there duplicate serial numbers?
Re:
I’ve correspoded with Dr. Jones and I’ve presented a video of one of his lectures at a public screening here in Bend. I’m open to Dr. Jones suggestion that some variant of thermite/thermate residue is indeed showing up in his mass spectrosccpy analysis of some of the dust from the vicinity of the WTC complex.
Rather than engage in speculation, I’m in the camp that included several of the widows of 9/11 victims who were interviewed in the video “9/11: Press For Truth”. Basically they and I argue that the 9/11 Commission failed to answer 70% of the extremely intelligent and thoughtful questions the “Jersey Girls” et al presented to Lee Hamilton and Tom Kean at the start of their utterly failed commission and in their ridiculous report.
Here’s an important article that first appeared in Harper’s Magazine about the Commission Report entitled “Whitewash as Public Service“. The title pretty well does say it all…
I concur. For openers, the way the two towers collapsed needs a real time simulation taking into account non-linear systems theory. I have not read much lately, but the proponents on both sides left me wanting more a couple of years ago.
The real fly in the ointment is the precipitous collapse of Building #7. There seems to be no initiating event derived from the attack of a magnitude necessary for that building to go down as it did, when it did.
On the anthrax case we’ve got marcy
Journalists Name Former DC USA as Hatfill Leaker
Clusterfuck tryin to figure out what sorta tax cuts to use to prop up the economy cause he obviously hasn’t done enough taxes on account of the economy is tankin…..
Problem solving is so simple when ya only have one fuckin solution.
That reference should be post 81.
ecahn,this is the first time I’ve seen anyone think that look was surprise
most people I know think that look on his face is
:well we’re actually doing it and people are ddying, here we go:
as far as I am concerned he looks guilt ridden, that combined with the the fact that he was informed we were under attack while he was on the way to the school, it was reaffirmed while he was in the classroom and that’s what you’re seeing
Just a little not correction but note. Those boats are plenty big enough to be dangerous and can hold plenty of explosive. The wind noise points are very valid, but no sensible commander in the navy is gonna let those speed boats get too close.
I’ve read several blogs mentioning the transition quality of the Iranian boats being to high quality for Iranian capabilities. 1) Noise-canceling microphones have been available for more than 40 years & don’t require high tech electronics to operate. 2) Just because they’re radical muslins doesn’t mean they’re incapable. Please don’t repeat inaccuracies from article to article. Leave that to the wing nuts.
Well, it looked like surprise to me at the time. I wasn’t blogging then, so I didn’t have the benefit of other minds second guessing. However, even after your input, I still remember it as surprise, not guilt. Perhaps if someone has a link to the video, I’d review it. I would hate to be remembered as being naive. *g*
But nothing got blown up in this incident
Yeah, like when he watched the first plane hit on the teevee…uh, huh.
I think he knew something was going to happen but was kept out of the loop on purpose…as he’s been kept out of the loop regarding other events or decisions, so he can plausibly deny any involvement.
And remember the Cole, and my comment @ 1.
Even the best cancelling mic’s will leave a clear audio signature, so this is a testable thing, but even the best would not allow a crystal clear transmission from a speeding boat
The point being, that the U.S. ships didn’t KNOW that until after the fact in the current case.
I find it hard to believe any of our secret agencies and Bush and Cheney are so clever (beyond brilliant) as to mastermind the 9/11 conspiracy theories. I have no doubt that the planners of the attack did all the things they did. They hijacked commercial airplanes and crashed them into buildings.
Here is where I’d like to see more investigation. Why did Bush sit on his a.. for seven minutes after being told the WTC was attacked? I sat for seven minutes to understand the length of this passage of time. It is loooonnnng. Why? I timed how long it takes to tell young children he needed to take a call. “Excuse me boys and girls. I must take this call” Less than two seconds. It doesn’t alarm the children. He exits and the kids continue with their story. No problem. I need to know why he sat and sat and sat.
How did seven hijackers manage to steal several plans? This is hard to do. One, OK. This tells me we had the intelligence and allowed it to happen. It is perfect. Reality TV for all of us to witness.
The conspiracy isn’t planned explosives and fake crashes into the Pentagon, it is the countless warnings, evidences of an impending attack, lack of any security to facilitate it, the interference of a true investigation that tells me Bushco knew and allowed it to happen.
When you know something that has been planned and is actually happening, you can sit there for seven minutes, unmoved and let it unfold.
The US has satellites 24 hours a day over the straights of Hormuz. They have the capability of seeing a wart on a soldiers nose for chrysake. If they really had a fleet of dinghies attacking them they would have clear film of the incident. It is bullcrap, just more bullcrap from an administration steeped in it.
here ya go
http://video.google.com/videop…..9630026967
there is the kind of equanimity one so rarely sees in these discussions.
cheers to that.
I was jogging on the East River around 60th street when the first plane hit. I saw a massive plume of light brown smoke blowing eastward over the East River much farther south & instantly heard scores of sirens screeching south. It took me less than 7 minutes to get back to my building. Asked the doorman what was up & he said a plane hit the WTC. I asked: “Accidentally or on purpose?” thinking for not a second that it was an accident. So you’re right. Seven minutes is a long time & plenty of time for action & thought.
Excellent point.
Remember the USS Liberty. For that matter, remember the Alamo. Talk about rewriting history. If you wait long enough and eyewitnesses are no long on this planet, you can recreate the myth.
I also want to know more about how and why the Saudis got out of the country so fast. None of the rest of us could have left if we’d wanted to.
I do not believe any of our agencies planned or executed the attacks. I suspect that laundered money was paid to hijacker’s families to get them to do it. I believe there is a definite link to Pakistan in the planning and execution of those events with the financial backing and a wink and a nod from somebody in our government. There are too many oddities that facilitated the attacks that day that involve our defenses…the simultaneous hijacking training operations that day. The fact that Norad did not go after the planes. The precision flying of huge airliners by pilots that couldn’t even land small planes, and had only perhaps taken a course here or there in a simulator. The fact that the FBI seized evidence that Atta had been on a Sun Cruz boat (Abramoff’s) in the days preceding 9/11. The put options on American and United. The fact that Dick was at the controls in the Sit room and his “chat” differed from Mineta’s testimony. The transponders were turned off on all of the planes. For the first time in history, 3 steel frame skyscrapers collapsed. For the first time in history…4 passenger airplanes vaporized. There was no wreckage at the PA site. Those are a few of the bizarre events of that day…there are tons more.
bush and Cheney wouldn’t be the master mind, they would be a party to it
here’s the bottom line;
they were given precise intel telling them where, when, the targets, the methods, the weapons
intel that precise is almost impossible to come by yet they had it and they did nothing, they refused the actions taken the CIA wanted to take
this alone speaks volumes
Hi dakine,
What I was referring to is the National Security Strategy of the United States, first revised under the Bush Regime on Sept. 17, 2002 and then subsequently revisited.
This is the first time in the history of NSS that the explicit directive to preemptive action was verbalized.
And guess who wrote the document? Amazingly it was Condy Rice’s writing partner Philip Zelikow. Who you might recall was introduced to the public as a neutral and unaffiliated academic as he was hired to lead the investigations and write the final report for the 9/11 Commission.
There’s a funny story about Zelikow and “public mythologies” I can share if anyone has any interest.
Look at the photo posted. The only shadow lies straight under the boat. Look at the water color and the general lighting of the scene. Conclusion? Cloudy day. Ergo, no satellite photos except infrared perhaps, which would be inconclusive as to what was coming down.
If I wanted to launch an attack like that, I would take what ever cover I could.
No shots were fired, either side, AFAIK.
Please share.
Musharraf warns the USA not to attach al Quaida unilaterally:
WASHINGTON — President Pervez Musharraf of Pakistan warned in an interview published Friday that any unilateral attacks by the United States against Al Qaeda and Taliban fighters in his country’s tribal areas would be treated as an invasion.
But Mr. Musharraf also left open the possibility of American and Pakistani forces working together in broader combined operations to kill or capture senior Qaeda leaders believed to be hiding in the rugged border area near Afghanistan.
The USS Liberty cover up.
http://www.gtr5.com/
http://home.cfl.rr.com/gidusko/liberty/
It has been trivialized to a “mistake”. A mistake is something a 4th grader does on his math work sheet, erases it and corrects it. The word “mistake” is hardly fitting for the USS Liberty and those who lost their lives.
So who paid the consequences for this “mistake”. From Israel we got an “Oops” apology. Where is the justice?
Thanks. I looked at it, but at the telling moment, when Card whispers in W’s ear, the camera is not on close up. I must have seen a still photograph taken at that time that more clearly showed W’s face. I can’t get any impression one way or the other from the video.
But QG’s point about the 7 minutes comes across very well in the video. W sat there in seeming perfect equanimity after being told the U.S. was under attack.
As an aside, if that’s the kind of reading program they’d had in my elementary school, I would never had read another book. The outloud drill seems dreadful to me.
Why was bin Laden allowed to escape Tora Bora?
Why on earth would Iran send speedboats out to attack US warships. That is completely suicidal. Iran does not want war. The speedboaters act like that frequently in that area of the Gulf…they were hot-rodding and driving their boats over the wakes of the ships – that is all it was. The rest was sheer BS.
Bush is dying to attack Iran, and he will.
Here is the weather and visibility for the straits of Hormuz on Jan 6th.
http://www.wunderground.com/hi…..atename=NA
As you can see there is about 3 mile visibility throughout the day. Beyond that the spy satellites are not hampered by a little cloud cover.
Me. Me. I know the answer to that one!
Because he was small potatoes & W was goin’ after Saddam, the big fish.
(Plz forgive the mixed food metaphor. The devil made me do it.)
9-11 Inside Job Discussion, excellent. We do not even need conspiracies anymore. Saudi Arabia and Pakistan did the financing (including Bush Bandar and Busharaff). Oh yes Benazir Bhutto was the latest victim, as Busharaff and Condosleeza Rice cover up it up. Of course the CIA interrogations (torture) tapes, were supposed to have been given to the 9-11 Commission. (Zelikow you rascal.)
If Rudy Giuliani wants to run on his response to 9-11, great. The poisoned air of New York is still killing people. We can also let the NYFD tell their stories. Of course, the forensic evidence of the WTC steel was sent to China. This is the same as Busharaff washing off the forensic evidence of Bhutto’s murder. And so on…
Good question.
1. He didn’t, because he was/is dead….or
2. Because it benefits Bushco to keep him “alive” at least in the eyes of the world to implement their oil stealing agenda…and
3. If he is alive, Bushco will want to produce him toward the end of their terms in office.
Sure, share away. I’m interested.
Events: Rain, Thunderstorm.
At any rate, so far as small boats vs big ships, please read the NYT article posted today.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01…..038;emc=th
Article in today’s NYT about 02 war games in which Blue Team was “swarmed” by small boats of a ME country (Iraq-Iran composite, according to the article), and the U.s. lost the encouter with some astonishing loss of ships.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01…..ref=slogin
Jinx.
Same article eCAHNonomics.:-)
Hijinx!
eCAHN, are you home, or still on vaca.
our reading lists must be the same…
one little bit brought forward by madcow – the supposed pilot of the plane that executed a perfect 270 degree turn and put the the plane on its course for the Pentagon, keeping it nearly at ground level – phenomenal flying – was booted out of a flight school for being unable to even master the ability to pilot a little Cessna 150 (I believe that’s the right training plane). The air traffic controller saw this maneuver being executed, and assumed it was a military jet by the competence and difficulty of the maneuver.
And of course there remains the fact that the hole in the wall of the Pentagon is circular – evidently the wings and tail simply disappeared – they didn’t go through the wall, and they weren’t found outside…
THe Synthetic Aperture Radar can penetrate the cloud cover anyway, can it not? If they admit to using it to map wave heights of 28 mm, I am sure they must be able to use it in other more covert applications. Not to present myself as an expert on SAR.
If you and I were on kidney dialysis, on horseback, at high altitude, traveling over steep terrain and living in caves, would we be here today to blog our story? I think not.
Did you read where the Generals cleaned up the game and the next run, Blue team won?
Why is a General running a Navy exercise anyway?
Here’s an important article that first appeared in Harper’s Magazine about the Commission Report entitled “Whitewash as Public Service“. The title pretty well does say it all…
bookmarked for later reading. thanks.
Well, that would have to be because Iran/Iraq would want to see their countries completely ruined by the ensuing airpower retaliation of such an event.
They don’t. It is Bushco that wants to destroy them so they can get their hands on the oil using any excuse they can.
Iran provoking war is completely illogical and irrational. They are not stupid.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S…..ture_radar
ecahn, while we couldn’t see his face as he was told, watch his face as we do pan in to see it, looks like one guilty charachter right there to me
Apparently the simulations were conducted in 2002 so the administration should read the report soon
I am still waiting for the satellite photos/film and I do not believe that sleet nor snow nor dark of night will blind the spy satellites.
Still at Alta. Skiing after lunch with an acqaintance.
And…the portion of the Pentagon that was “hit” was newly renovated and reinforced and sparsely occupied..sure picked the perfect section to “crash” into. You can see how that plane just pinpointed that section on its approach and impact in all the videos (that no one has ever seen that were confiscated). /s
I would also like to see them. Problem is we won’t likely see them as it would give away just what they are capable of.
They don’t. It is Bushco that wants to destroy them so they can get their hands on the oil using any excuse they can.
BushCo doesn’t want the oil so much as they want to control the oil. i.e. make sure that production is sufficient to cover U.S. needs, but kept low enough so as to be sure that demand slightly exceeds supply, keeping prices, and profits, high.
Oh, for sure. The interest of the exercise & the article is that the U.S. navy now thinks that it can suffer grievous damage on first strike of large number of small boats with suicide missions. And thus is trigger happy and scared to death. Why I-I would do this in the first place was never part of the exercise. So much for war games! Leaves out the most important part. But I suppose that’s intentional. The military, you know, must follow civilian orders without thinking.
I believe Bhutto meant exactly what she said to David Frost. She was a precise speaker.
Oh my, look what Taylor Marsh is up to:
Clinton’s back in Las Vegas today and I’ll be covering her this morning. This afternoon I’ll be listening in on and covering a foreign policy discussion with Valerie Plame Wilson and former ambassador Joesph Wilson. I’ll post when I can today, so let me know what’s the buzz, because I’m going to be out working most of the day.
Bingo. They have to issue reports as told too.
Why is only important in retrospect. If I see someone levelling a gun at me, thy last question I would ask is “Why?”. Because it would be my last question.
“Wh…..
Besides, I had to spend some quality time with friends this morning. I was completely surrounded by wingnuts at dinner last night, and it has taken some time to recover.
Remember Rove’s comment….HRC is a fatally-flawed candidate? I’m wondering if Bill’s aboutface in his assistance of her election has to do with something the Pukes have on him that he doesn’t want to get out. Not personal stuff…probably some other kind of serious fuckery they’ve got their hands on.
I want to point something out that is hardly ever discussed regarding the attack in september;
the president was informed we are under attack, the cia knows we are under attack and his personal guards know we are under attack
yet he remains in the event he was advertised to appear, he is not whisked away, he remains for some 45 minutes.
there is not a worry in the world that where he is might be a target
not a single worry
hmmm
I’m sure you heard some astounding bon mots. Do tell.
I have not researched the Pentagon attack on 9-11. It is obvious that dozens or even hundreds of cameras must have recorded the attack. Hey, those are our cameras and our pictures, let’s see them please Mr. Gates!
Allegedly, the hijackers circled around so they would not hit Donald Rumsfeld’s office. What a lucky break. Without Rummy how would we have gotten “Mission Accomplished” in Iraq?
I think LS’s point was, why create a war game that has zero probability of being a real life situation to begin with.
For some reason, on that day….there were missiles or something around the school to protect W. It was the first time that had ever happened when he went somewhere. Also…Jeb issued Martial Law orders for Florida in the event of a terrorist attack, on September 7th (I think).
I’ll bet!
It wasn’t just Pentagon video that was deep-sixed. They got security-cam videos from a gas station and from a hotel across the street too.
Damned near immediately.
At the lodge, they has a “Wasatch table,” named after the mountain range. It includes all guests who want to dine with a group. I’d made my politics clear to several of the repeats in earlier evenings, but the new guest had gone to Iraq in May 03 to arrange CoDels (some 275 members of congress visited in the first year), and for his service in Iraq, he was appointed Ambassador to Belgium, from which he is now retired. (Ambassadors usually are appointed for 3, 3, 2 years during an 8 year prez.) Just a lot of passive-agressive remarks from a repeater about how the new guest would be better off in the fireplace than sitting next to me. Quite unpleasant.
and they friggin shred the conversations from air traffic controllers
let’s say that again;
they shred the conversations from the air traffic controllers
OT: Off Topic
Re:
I’m concerned that you would bring up Israel in this context. I certainly did not. Why would you do that? I’m very, very careful not to engage in what can be interpreted as a slur upon any ethnic group w/r/t 9/11.
It should be noted that the Zogby pollsters questioned a broad sampling across America and for the past two years they have reported that 36+% of the Amercican public have doubts about the veracity and honesty of the Kean-Zelikow 9/11 Commission Report. This past week both Lee Hamilton and Tom Kean came out with an admission that the CIA was hampering the Commission’s investigations. Here is a direct quote from Kean and Hamilton’s recent oped in the NY Times: “(T)he recent revelations that the C.I.A. destroyed videotaped interrogations of Qaeda operatives leads us to conclude that the agency failed to respond to our lawful requests for information about the 9/11 plot.”
***
On a slightly different track, I notice you cited the Debunking 9/11 website. I’ve looked at that website quite a while ago and found it lacking in logical consistency and engaged in the same sort of selective fact-grabbing that some accuse the truth movement of engaging in. A very elegant book inelegantly titled “Debunking 9/11 Debunking” would be a suggested read for the curious.
I should probably clarify it a little…it is a probability that there could be such a situation…but only because the US started it. If the US was involved in such an ordeal, the next move would be to completely destroy the country(ies) involved by air attack. Therefore, a country attacking the US in that manner virtually guarantees total destruction of their country. They would not start it…but the situation could play out if the US started it. Does that make sense?
While I don’t know what happened out there in the Straits of Hormuz, I do know that it takes a lot more than a very small boat to blow up a U.S. military ship(s). It takes the political will to do it and live with the consequences. That’s what those who have posted here about the Cole (or NYT article) seem to miss, and what the Pentagon and Bush Administration hope the American people miss (certainly the media reporting it doesn’t care). It would be an act of suicidal insanity for the Iranian government to try to blow up an American military ship – or probably any American ship. Yet, there’s no evidence that the Iranian government, even the current prime minister, are that crazy, or even close, or would be served in any way by such an action. OTOH, there is a large body of evidence of U.S. military aggression in the Persian Gulf, from shooting down civilian airliners to aggressive military exercises, violations of international law, and other provocative tactics. That alone, along with the coincidence of the announcement coming just as Bush was headed to Israel, reportedly to discuss Israeli plans to ‘take out’ Iran, suggests a high degree of caution, if not outright skepticism, about the Pentagon’s and Bush Adminsitration’s claims.
I agree with you on this…except one point. The charges that brought down WTC-7 had to already be in place. You can’t create a controlled demolition of a building – especially in a place like NY where the buildings are that close together…in a matter of hours. It can’t be done.
My responses were centered around two points;
1)The War Game
2) The Weather that day.
So far as the little swarms are concerned, WWII had both PT boats in the US Navy and the Kamikaze from Japan. The footage I have seen limited for sure, says to me that the Kamikaze were scary. Very scary. But very educational for sure.
USS Liberty: Dead in the Water (2002)
Have a nice day!
As well as large SAR aircraft such as the E-8 Joint Surveillance Target Attack Radar System (Joint STARS), whose AN/APY-3 radar has multiple modes including ground moving target indication, the US has highly classified radar satellites. Quill launched in 1964, was the first radar satellite, essentially a prototype. A system originally called Lacrosse (or Lacros), Indigo, and finally Onyx appears to be the only US radar satellite system, using pushbroom scans and “spotlighting” SAR[12].
Given that the E-8 is a large aircraft that cannot defend itself, (DayRadar) describes US attempts to move the E-8 capability into space, under a variety of names, most recently a simple “Space Radar”. In an era of budget demands, however, this extremely costly new generation has not been launched.
ISAR can produce actual images, but the discipline is generally called MASINT rather than IMINT.A much more modest ISAR capability is on the Navy’s [13] SH-60 multimission helicopter, carried on destroyers, cruisers, and aircraft carriers. If budgets permit, the proposed E-8 aircraft, the replacement for the P-3 maritime surveillance aircraft, will carry ISAR[14].
P-3 aircraft carry the AN/APS-137B(V)5 radar, which has SAR and ISAR capability. This is part of the general upgrading of the P-3 to make it a capable land surveillance platform.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radar_MASINT
What a bunch of $#%#@%#. Three big warships being frightened of a couple of speed boats. I know you will say Cole Cole Cole, but that ship was tied up in port with most of the crew stood down. This was in operational mode in near hostile waters.
And by the way, these ships were in international waters, as were the speed boats, but do not forget they were cruising just outside Iranian territorial waters. In view of that, who is provoking who?
[RBG Note; edited to revise term that is generally not used at FDL]
Re:
As a 9/11 Truth activist I’m part of the community that is attempting to understand this psychological phenomenon. I think the best we’ve come up with by way of understanding this is to suggest that subliminally and subconsciously those who are in denial that the government would be capable of murdering 3,000 of its own citizens for the sake of imperial policy do so because there would be a tremendous cognitive dissonance for them to on the one hand admit that our federal leadership are murderous thugs and on the other hand would feel obliged to do something about the situation to defend the nation against domestic enemies. In other words, people would have to get out of their comfortable chairs, out of their comfortable homes and out of their comfortable cars and risk their comfortable jobs, benefit packages and pensions for the sake of patriotism. When you look at it this way, it’s perfectly understandable why a huge percentage of the population chose to lie to themselves about what they sense in the zeitgeist.
Upton Sinclair said it more succinctly: “It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it.”
Reply
eCAHNomics January 12th, 2008 at 9:57 am
81
In response to sporkovat @ 78
Well, if 9/11 was an inside job, it was run out of Cheney’s office without anyone on W’s team being aware. No one could fake the look on W’s face when the attack was whispered in his ear.
I maintain an open mind because so much surrounding 9/11 has been hidden from us. But that’s also why I haven’t decided it was an inside job. There isn’t enough information to be convinced either way.
_____________
it would not stretch credibility a millimeter to believe that the Cheney Administration didn’t tell fuckwad and his bozos aheard of time (i don’t know about any of the physical details of the actual events and have no opinion about them,)
whatever the facts are about 9/11, both in NYC, DC and Pennsylvania the stonewalling by the Cheney Administration, their paranoid, obsessive secrecy encourages speculation. i imagine they take a kind of twisted, disdainful enjoyment in watching people attempt to come up with a plausible explanation.
Hmm…people seem to use all kinds of expletives here without objection. What kind of term is generally not used here?
I call it “the mortgage syndrome!” They have too much invested in their ‘reality’.
Conyers does NOT care about Wexler’s Petition to start Cheney impeachment hearings!
Read the transcript from Democracy Now.
http://willyloman.wordpress.co…..-petition/
View the video of his speech from September.
http://willyloman.wordpress.co…..peachment/
He will NOT allow impeachment hearings to take place.
Conyers knows that Pelosi will undercut the efforts of impeachment rather than helping to build a bi-partisan coalition to impeach.
Conyers knows that Pelosi will again be Speaker of the House next year and she will take him off the Judiciary Committee if he goes against her wishes. It’s a “lose-lose” for him and impeachment.
Let’s help him and the rest of the members of the House of Representatives by removing an obstructionist Speaker. It can be done and must be done to start the impeachment process.
http://www.petitiononline.com/…..ition.html
Without going into great detail, can we leave it that sexist and racist terms are generally not acceptable?
My bad. I was honestly thinking of scaredy little cats.
I’m European – so we are not so PC alert.
Shit. I hadn’t fucking thought of that.
Completely understandable. The double meaning of that one can make it tough for the mods to deal with.
Damn, all this discussion has taken my mind off politics.
That can be a good thing right now.
Thanks for the reference.
That article covers more than satellites. I well understand the march of technology in matters like this since I participated in technology at a pretty good level. I am simply pointing out that, given the choices at hand, covering your ass when doing anything like the Iran sailors were purported to have done would be prudent. I certainly cannot conceive of a large body of Naval vessels without air cover and electronic surveillance!
Hey, who u callin’ batty/old bat?
Serious-like, i left another twd the outer edge of the loft: reading material u might find handy preachin’ to da’ preachers.
I’m familiar with Blum’s “Rogue State,” which was written at great personal cost. Not many like him these days.
Take a look at thinkprogress.org today. There’s a post that around the world, people are eager for Bush’s term to end with a photo of him going out the wrong door – was it in China? Perfect visual for the story. Lots of coverage of the U.S. primaries in the UK press.
Is that picture THE Iranian boat that supposedly did this? Or an American boat, as the caption suggests?