Good morning Christy!

Christy

Zee

Your modern Republican party: snipey, juvenile, self-absorbed, rambling, goofy, and mendacious.

And if the Iowa caucus turnout for Republicans vs. Democrats is any measure, thoroughly uninspiring. Only Huckabee has a built-in base, and the fundies alone aren’t going to be enough to win him any elections.

short of having all of ‘em on stage at the same time, I liked the debate format of having them back to back…

Have CNN on mute …. can’t listen to old Fred…. the gov’nment ISN’T required to take care of the people…. WHAT is it for then?

Gooper candidates are beginning to understand that even it’s own voters are not keen on another eight years of GW Bush type politics- so they have now all become agents of “change”- but they’re too chicken shit to say what they are changing from or what they are changing too.. It’s pretty fuckin funny.

Have CNN on mute …. can’t listen to old Fred…. the gov’nment ISN’T required to take care of the people…. WHAT is it for then?

It exists to help the rich line their pockets. Republican Politics 101.

Thanks for the Three Stooges, Chrisy. And for the Monty Python, LS. I needed that.

Christy. Y’all mean what I know.

The Three Stooges YouTube up top is the best pie fight scene…ever. *g* So enjoy it…

Redistributing wealth upwards.

We still have the big gooper conundrum—-none of the gooper candidates can win the nomination- but one of them must…..

Well, it is certainly true that the juxtaposition of the two debates would make a sane person think that there is no political contest in any regard. Unfortunately, it is the hallmark of those who are subject to an authoritarian mindset, who have fed on the honeydew and should are, literally, full of holy dread…these poor souls are quite incapable of admitting a wrong; much like their brave leader. There will be no sanity from the true kool-aid drinkers. They simply need to be buried with overwhelming opposition. And, if there is any sanity with the rest of us, they will be.

I’m not usually a fan of the Stooges, but that is one damn good pie fight.

Pillaging. /s

I love the woman screaming in the first video! Hysterical.

Amen.

I wonder if they will go all the way to their convention?

Which is why Bloomberg keeps turning up like a bad penny.

It’s amazing, the contrast. The worst of ours is way better than the best of theirs (conceding that there even can be a ‘best’ in that pathetic field of Repubs.)

Great Post Christy, made my morning!

Gooper establishment hates the Huckster- so he can’t win- and there aren’t enough states dominated by the snake handlers to push him over the top.

Rudy looks and acts like the devil and is hated by his own family- he’s also been in favor of fetucide and gay groping- so he can’t win.

Romney can’t get spare parts since they shut down the plastic mill- so HE can’t win.

McCain might win- but he either kissed Bush’s ass too much- or not enough- depending on your point of view- and he would show up for the general election pushing walker- so he can’t win.

So what’s gonna happen?

Beats me!

This from Rich’s column today:

The NBC News analyst Chuck Todd may be on to something when he half-jokingly suggested last week that there was a 5 percent chance that the G.O.P. may have to find a nominee not yet in the race.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01…..ref=slogin

all the “protestors” in the 3 stooges pie fight remind me of Bill Richardson last night trying to stop the discussion!

Interesting observation from Carpetbagger;

” Charles Gibson’s hosting of the event was relatively inoffensive, until, about half-way through the debate, the candidates actually started to have an almost-substantive discussion about healthcare mandates. Gibson intervened: “We have an expression in television: we get into the weeds. We’re in the weeds now on this.”

Yes, it’s important to curtail a policy discussion before the candidates actually share some pertinent details with voters. Heaven forbid.”

http://www.thecarpetbaggerrepo…..14145.html

If you get a chance, check out the Repukes debate through the eyes of a 9 year old, it is hilarious:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/…..751/431492

Never thought I’d be giving the blessing to ABC News! Lord, what a pack of fools.

I think Gibson made his weedy comment when Romney was filibustering on why his ideas- self contradictory as they are, are really the only solution.

Very interesting. I usually can’t stand to watch debates because they are too painful. So thanks for bringing that up. Since I don’t watch TV much I though that was only a thing they said about our very own Marcy.

So what’s gonna happen?

Beats me!

Fred Thompson wins by default!

What else could you expect from the inheritors of the mind and wisdom
of Ronald Wilson Reagan, aka Bonzo. When a nation can take that seriously
it cannot age well for 28 years. It is over. Something else slouches
toward DC now, God only knows what it will be.

My favorite moment came when McCain denounced Big Pharma, only to have Willard Mitt defend the drug companies as the good guys.
The drug companies!
What a fool in fool’s clothing he is.

I believe there’s a fable to this regard. Something about a boy, an emperor, and clothes, or lack thereof. Precious. Thanks for sharing.

It’s the Huckster!

And making sure the riff-raff doesn’t get out of line. They must be made to keep their place!

so glad you said that ’cause I was thinking it. If all else fails the impossible is the answer.

I woke up this morning humming a tune from Sweeney Todd. Couldn’t figure out why, but then I remembered it was Sunday and time to hear the spin.

There’s not much of a tune, it is more of a rhythmic stomping to the chorus, but I thought you guys might like to join in:

There’s a hole in the world like a great black pit
and it’s filled with people who are filled with shit!
And the vermin of the world inhabit it!

so glad you said that ’cause I was thinking it. If all else fails the impossible is the answer.

But of course, Fred couldn’t even inspire lethargy, so he’d be toast in the general.

My favorite part was when Gibson talked about oil company profits/the cost of gas. “Shouldn’t we do something about this?” he asked Fred Thompson. Fred replied “Like what?”

Thompson polling 1% in New Hampshire- he has a ways to go. He was hoping to poll 1% in Iowa so he could turn all his supporters (both of em) over to McCain and get the fuck out of Dodge- since it’s so fuckin cold and all- but voters decided to keep him in double digits (barely) so he must trudge on for a while.

Did Willard say Bush isn’t arrogant and deserves credit for keeping us safe? I heard wrong, right?

It could be true, they could be the good guys…and there were these golden plates of Nephi on a mountain in upstate New York…that could all be true too! You simply need faith, and that’s all you need, damnit!

Heh! Did Wrinkles really say the Constitution has 10 Amendments? I missed that part.

Freddie says :

“This campaiging shit is hard work”.

I said to egregious and Mr. ReddHedd last night as we were watching the debate that Fred Thompson spent the entire debate looking like he wanted nothing more than for it to end so he could get a double scotch (on the rocks, I suspect) with a good cigar. Somewhere quiet. Very, very quiet.

Frankly, I could see the appeal after subjecting myself to the entire show myself. Blergh.

i lasted one minute thirty two seconds on that clip. just could not take mitt’s condescension, even if it was to ron paul. these guys really are insufferable.

I missed the ‘tell me something I don’t know’ segment. Anyone catch it?

Proving that the Faux style petitio principii question doesn’t work outside of a bottom screen crawl…thanks Fred!

Was it just me or did St. McCain start to show his nasty streak last night?

Chrisy, you’ll have to post the image of you with the conciliatory stogey!

That is why I watched the 3 stooges and not the debate. I loved the 3 stooges as a kid.

I’ll admit that I skipped it. Not that it sounds like there were any great surprises.

I have heard that he has a nasty hair-trigger temper which makes me feel unsettled about the possibility of the prez.

You just saw a burned up alky, just like Junya.

All Republics try to be Reagan. Hollywood Fred unfortunately chose senile Reagan as his role model.

Was it just me or did St. McCain start to show his nasty streak last night?

I was surprised at how cranky Thompson was.

Did Willard say Bush isn’t arrogant and deserves credit for keeping us safe? I heard wrong, right?

No, I think that’s a pretty fair representation of what he said!

He was up past his bedtime.

I think McCain could win. He’s the only Repug i think could win the general and he might even be a favorite. Too, too many people have bought into the “we’re winning in Iraq, now” bullshit and he might ghet by with painting a dem candidate as a cut-and -run. wnating to lose the war we’re winning type. ‘member when he was written off as not Ok with the JF’s? Well, he’s kissed some ass in that dep’t and in a general that’s something that could help him.

Someone on Matthews just said the repubs may have to find someone other than the current field to run for prez.
Jeb?
Newt?

McCain also has a hair trigger brain- which may be of more concern…

I liked it when he decided to be Reaganesque in dissing Romney- saying- “Well we may disagree about a lot of things- but I sure agree that you are the man of change—HAR HAR HAR (Romney stares coldly at him) har har har- (less enthusiatically- eyes go sideways as he tries vainly how to END this thing)

McCain lacks TIMING- he was even BORN too soon.

On Matthews? The only one I remember is Dan Rather saying Bill Clinton must be much less visible.

This from Josh

To say Mitt Romney had a bad debate last night is an understatement for the ages. Some of the best moments came when Mitt was getting so knocked around that he seemed to forget which side of the argument he was arguing.

I didn’t see the debate, but I suspect that Mitt has flip flopped so much, he REALLY doesn’t remember which side of the argument he’s supposed to be on.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/062827.php

And tonight the repubs are on FoxNews for round 2, correct?

The Edwards are on CSPAN 1 now, live event – town hall

The real problem the Repubs have is that their coalition is breaking up. A new candidate won’t help. Besides it would look like a desperation move.

The actual choice will be made by Permanent Vice President Cheney. He must decide which one makes the best puppet.

I thought that’s why Thompson was in. The only one who worries me much in McCain. I think Newt likes bein’ an intellectual.

Mitt has been advised to stay home for the next debate and just send his hair.

Jeb and Newt would be just as bad as what they already have.

Bunch o’ fascists splitting hairs over the cause and the enormity of the threat of Islamofascism. Romney will not fall prey to split ends. Like a werewolf from London, his hair is perfect.

Only way goopers get a chance to pick a new player is if the convention deadlocks- which could happen. I think the primary filing deadlines are largely over and the ballots have been sent out in most states.

Besides enjoying the Republicans mud wrestling, I thought the ABC format for the debates–hold the applause and get the candidates really talking to each other was much improved.

The actual choice will be made by Permanent ViceActing President Cheney. He must decide which one makes the best puppet.

Fixed it up for you.

Newt likes whatever Newt thinks makes Newt look good.

Agree that the debate format was the best yet- but there are still too many participants to sustain a discussion.

Newt likes Newt. Do you really think anyone else is included in his circle of friends?

A brokered convention would be a dream come true.

If you didn’t see the debate, use this image: As if a guy who never played football had picked up the ball, didn’t really know where the goalpost was (for sure) and everyone piled on him. You could see the pile-on better than the Mitt.

McGovern out with an op/ed piece advocating double secret impeachment. Where was he a year ago when it was still viable?

Must leave to get ready for some football. See all later.

Would,have been nice if the candidates addressed real issues. Mitt and Mass Healthcare fraud, what teally went on… HRC and “mandated Healthcare,” Obama and “the ability to pay” and Edwards “…take the power from the corporations.” See what is really taking place behind the scenes!!!

http://www.guaranteedhealthcar…..hcare-scam

In Massachusetts “….continue to boycott the insurers and the penalty the second year goes to half the cost of the cheapest health plan, at least $1,200, an amount almost certain to rise.Despite this growing fiasco, a lot of politicians and some advocacy groups who should know better continue to tout the Massachusetts plan as the archetype of reform. In California, for example, Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger has proposed a plan based on the Massachusetts experience, and is lining up corporate CEOs and some legislative leaders to help him pass it.Ultimately, the Massachusetts sham shares a lot in common with other market-based approaches to healthcare reform. The common denominator is expanding and entrenching the role of the insurance giants who are largely responsible for the current morass by transforming our nation’s health from a system that delivers care to one that has become a funnel for higher profits, usually made by denying care.It’s time to stop expecting the insurers and the market will solve a crisis that continues to financially benefit them. Only one solution guarantees healthcare for everyone, ends insurance industry interference with care, and actually does share responsibility with fair share costs on employers, government, and individuals alike. It’s the approach of a form of expanded Medicare for All type system taken by every other industrialized nation, represented in HR 676 in Congress or SB 840 in California.”

Rose Ann DeMoro is executive director of the California Nurses Association/National Nurses Organizing Committee

Newt likes Newt. Do you really think anyone else is included in his circle of friends?

Or vice versa?

Newt look good? That explains the impossibility of Newt EVER getting
anywhere, one ugly bastard.

Christy … you deserve better, many hardworking bloggers deserve better, but the American people as a whole? I don’t know. They got what they deserved in ‘00 and ‘04.

CNN is going to rerun the debate today. I did not get the time but was surfing through and they said they would replay it. Now I need to watch it though that kids eyes…. Bunny ears… Oily… wow….

To do that, he has to win NH (good chance) and also Michigan.

There would be weeping and wailing and speaking in tongues and probably fistfights. I love it.

Little old lady got mutilated last night.

San Diego Chargers take on the demon spawn Tennessee Titans today in lovely San Diego. Half an inch of rain expected. San Diegans, who despise wet hair- likely to stay away in droves- so we are going to be treated to nut kicking football in an oil slick with no one in the stands cept the hot dog man.

Joe Bob says “Check it out”.

I agree w. an outside candidate possibility, esp if the nominee is someone other than McCain or Guiliani. Interesting show this morning @ 10:00 (somewhere) on Huckabee, and his wife doining these “teas.” This is a group (in the south and elsewhere) who won’t support Romney. And Romney looked like such an Ass last night that I think his support even among the more mainstream Rethugs is going south.

Still, I am impressed with Huckabee. He is smart, articulate, engaging, and willing to frankly address the situation for many around the country. The problem is that outside of taxes (he wants a sales tax) and the evangelical stuff (anti-abortion, anti-gay), he sounds alot like a populist Dem.

Probably the only one the Repubs could put out there that would have his appeal is Jeb. But then, you get the bad Bush name at every turn.

In short, the Rethugs are cooked.

Fred Thompson: We could be attacked by a biological weapon and not know it.

Hey Fred- We were attacked by a biological weapon (anthrax) and do not know who did it.
How secure does that make you feel?

Oh dear, Mr. Gnome is off to see his alky sister for her birthday, the Patriots are not playing, I cannot stand to watch/listen to debates, so I don’t know which game I should put on as background sound as I clean up after an onslaught of kids with play-dough.

The Independent vote in NH is 44%. I think most of them will go with McCain, and help Obama win there as well.

Is it only me, or has everyone gone gaga over a group of sycophants trying to get your attention while the government rapes the country and sells it to the saudis?

I am getting disgusted that blogs that typically talk about the issues and the crimes that need to be dealt with in the 11 months before we have another election

It is like children vying for a place on the team, and it is beneath this site to concentrate on BS in lieu of the real stories. What is everyone thinking?

WAKE UP PLEASE, get back to actually noting the carnage of real people dying rather than plastic leeches that would like you to ignore that man behind the curtain. If you continue to concentrate on these ridiculous egomaniacs, there will be no elections.

For the sake of shit, look at what Sibel Edmonds said today, no mention of it on this site? What have you all become?

or is it just me?

In short, the Rethugs are cooked.

You underestimate the power of the darkside. Where there remains fear and Diebold, there remains a chance.

I think they dance with what they done brung at this stage of the game. It’s awfully late for an Independent or new person to gain traction. I don’t see Bloomberg getting in as an Independent, and I don’t see how anyone else can get in at this point, raise the funds to take on the inevitable Romney ad blitz to Super Tuesday Feb. 5.

Lord Cheney agrees with you.

What did she say? Got a link?

what did sibel edmonds say today? and where and to whom?

It’s just you. Given that we have a shitload of posts on a weekly basis about legal issues, constitutional crises and such, Marcy has spent weeks deconstructing the CIA tapes alone, and we are constantly trying to pick things apart on a piecemeal basis…it’s pretty much you on that one, I’m afraid.

This blog cannot cover every damn issue that every single person ever in the history of the universe has ever wanted to discuss. We are human beings who occasionally get to sleep and spend time with our families and, once in a great while, get up from in front of the computer and have fun. And we can only cover so much at once…what we do cover is a whole helluva lot of issues across a broad spectrum of information as often as we humanly can do so.

She has been gagged for so long and has spoken so little, where is the
statement, very interested to know.

I wish Ron Paul had been a bit more prepared to give details when they challenged him on his claim that we’ve imposed and/or propped u (with money, arms, training, intelligence, military presence, and/or meddling by the CIA) repressive regimes throughout the Middle East:
– an apartheid regime in Palestine
– the Emperor of Peacock throne in Iran
– the House of Saud in Saudi Arabia
– Saddam Hussein (to whom Reagan sent weapons and a personal ambassador)
– The monarchy in Jordan
– The monarchy in Kuwait
– Emirates in multiple gulf coast states.
Don’t Republicans ever read beyond the buiness page?

Bloomberg can skip the primaries and jump straight to the general- so his clock is still ticking.

Good morning from L.A. Watched Repub debate on TiVo when I got home late last night. Possibly the reason for heartburn this a.m., or was it the four alarm curry my daughter dared me to eat down @ Gunga Din’s…

Great pie fight vid, Christy. Somehow when I was watching the Repub candidates, I flashed on this scene from The Band Wagon:

Triplets- Fed Astaire, Nanette Fabray, Jack Buchanan

My take on the Dem side (which some will hate):

Hillary made me realize she is really good at what she does – serving in the Senate and brokering compromises to get things passed -some good, some bad (the flag bill for example). But she is SO good and hardworking in this, I think she should stay doing it.

Edwards got me to think that what he is really good at is fighting big buys and winning cases. In some ways in our system that has the longest and deepest impact on companies’ policies. I think he would make a brilliant attorney general.

Obama I don’t see as a great Senator (what has he really accomplished other than getting in and signing on to others’ bills, and voting (or not) on various tough issues. What he IS very good at is organizing people (he did that in Chicago) and inspiring the same. I think this is what makes him -like Howard Dean – a great party leader. He is someone who can help get young people and minorities active and more and more Dem congresspeople elected around the country. Which we need especially in the Senate and with demographics moving more seats to the south. But Dean already has that job, so in some ways being President is the next best and closest thing.

Here’s the Edmonds information for anyone who is looking…from the TimesUK.

Is it only me, or has everyone gone gaga over a group of sycophants trying to get your attention while the government rapes the country and sells it to the saudis?

I am getting disgusted that blogs that typically talk about the issues and the crimes that need to be dealt with in the 11 months before we have another election

It is like children vying for a place on the team, and it is beneath this site to concentrate on BS in lieu of the real stories. What is everyone thinking?

WAKE UP PLEASE, get back to actually noting the carnage of real people dying rather than plastic leeches that would like you to ignore that man behind the curtain. If you continue to concentrate on these ridiculous egomaniacs, there will be no elections.

For the sake of shit, look at what Sibel Edmonds said today, no mention of it on this site? What have you all become?

or is it just me?

Actually, my experience with this site while understandably watching the early voting contests, closely in threads does a fine job of getting under the hood with major issues that the media misses. Christy and Jane, EW, Tbogg and others and the others are very vigilant in bringing up just those issues you mention. They aren’t missing important issues at all.

They’re being dissected in depth actually. Look at the topics over the past two months.

If you check out the archives, you’ll see that’s true.

Re those videos. . . One was ridiculuos immature and not at all funny. I did like the Stooges though.

I knew you would take care of it Christy. Thanks for being more eloquent than I am this morning/afternoon. Marcy has been doing some great weed-work.

That is the point of the Bloomberg/Boren/Nunn lovefest at Norman, OK
Monday… they are already cooking up a faux bipartisan solution for the
recent unpleasantness of contemplating total defeat.

Have at it…

Of course there is that too. But there is now a new AG in Ohio, and in some ways we are onto the game. Alas, there is also the national disaster issue (a new anthrax, or other attack) and the damping down of everything with Blackwater serving as the main police force.

I think it’s Florida’s turn to be a pain in the ass electorally speaking.

I think Florida has done this enough already -thank you :-)

You underestimate the power of the darkside. Where there remains fear and Diebold, there remains a chance.

While I agree there is a danger to underestimating the enemy, I still maintain that when there is a groundswell, as this election is shaping up to be, it is much harder to steal the election. When it’s a close race, it’s easier to conceal a few votes switched on either side. When the number of votes has to turn completely upside down, it’s becomes nearly impossible to conceal irregularities. There will be little doubt that the election was stolen when compared to exit polls, and people won’t be so willing to say the exit polls were wrong, or the people lied about who they voted for.

How close is the connection between Obama and Lieberman these days? Is Lieberman still Obama’s mentor?

If Obama sits in the Oval Office, will Lieberman be the real President: his Cheney?

Lots of great links and posts at NakedCapitalism today — some that are totally on topic:

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/

“Is too much respect given to fundamentalist/literalist clap trap?”

Why is it that no one in America seems able to say … that we Americans are far too timid in dealing with right wing extremists? Does being liberal in America mean you can’t point out that someone’s beliefs, in this case Huckabee’s, are kooky?

Actually, “kooky” is far too kind, since that implies mere eccentricity. As Buiter reminds us, fundamentalists are hostile to a tolerant, open society, which are values embodied in the Constitution.

How to Remember 1968 Todd Gitlin, Los Angeles Times

Why the Weak Relationship Between Income Inequality and Redistribution Efforts?

Lieberman is a dead man walking. He couldn’t get re-elected in Connecticut if he OWNED diebold. He’s just playin out the string and hopin for a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. Ain’t worth the powder ta blow him ta hell.

I agree with your take on Hillary.

Re Edwards, this is the man to put in charge of Health Care!

Yes, Obama can inspire and organize. And I’d like him in the executive office. With feet held to the fire!

I hope someone tells Obama that. Obama is said to listen, so someone needs to bend his ear on that front.

Here at FDL there are intelligent, well reasoned people who make excellent arguments like yours. Out there…in the big world…are people who are more worried about Brittany spiraling down the toilet; and these unenlightened folk will decide not to vote for a candidate because of his or her sex, or skin color. Sadly, these people do exist, in murder upon murder and they are the majority of this nation. These fears and prejudices are easy to prey upon and the main element, the corporate media, remains unchanged.

I know alot has been said about Lieberman-Obama here. I am less sure. First, I don’t know how the choice was made (sometimes mentors are pre-selected by party leaders) but if it was a free choice, at that time, Lieberman had just been the VP candidate (and even then Obama had presidential aspirations), plus both are from relatively urban areas and both are quite religious.

But there have been other actions which suggest they are not (will not) be close. Obama did NOT vote for the Iraq war, which was next to heresy by Lieberman and the neocons. That was a tough decision. And, Obama did not actively campaign for Lieberman. Morever, after Lieberman lost the Ct. primary, Obama did NOT say anything about him positively, nor did he go to Ct. to bring in voters for Lieberman (unlike Clinton). Without Clinton Lieberman probably would have lost.

From Sibel Edmonds UK Times story:

“Following 9/11, a number of the foreign operatives were taken in for questioning by the FBI on suspicion that they knew about or somehow aided the attacks.

Edmonds said the State Department official once again proved useful. “A primary target would call the official and point to names on the list and say, ‘We need to get them out of the US because we can’t afford for them to spill the beans’,” she said. “The official said that he would ‘take care of it’.”

The four suspects on the list were released from interrogation and extradited.”

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/t…..137695.ece

Edmonds also claims that a number of senior officials in the Pentagon had helped Israeli and Turkish agents.”

Jees, this is so disgusting. All of it.

Who wins the nomination if Edwards drops out? No Edwards means lots of open field running room to the left- which candidate would break for daylight? I suspect Hillary.

What is going on in Florida. I live here and I don’t unnerstand it. Delegates, Democratic boycott, lawsuits, primary dates, tons o crooked rethugs – how will it play out?

Pre-election discussions are one way a blog like this can have some degree of influence toward fixing those problems you mention. If you believe the six-degrees of separation hypothesis, these discussions are contributing to a climate of opinion that has some degree of effect on almost all voters. Obviously, that degree is not decisive in most cases, but it will be in many cases. JMHO

Which “important issues” do you feel haven’t been covered here? And by the way have you hit the book tab? Beverly and others recruit authors to come here every weekend and on Saturday Craig Unger spent over three hours here answering questions about the Saudi relationship and the influence of the religion on foreign policy–one of the issues that concerns you that you mentioned:

House of Bush, House of Saud: The Secret Relationship Between the World’s Two Most Powerful Dynasties (Hardcover)

http://firedoglake.com/booksalon/

I’ll give you an example of a high quality post that highlighted a terribly important issue that I see as a metaphor for this administration that was done last week and this happens all the time.

The quality of legal analysis and Congressional analysis, and the ability to watch DOJ operate at this site is commendable. There are a lot of people here with the experience to do that, and in addition they are monitoring a wide range of other blogs. I don’t know how they find the time.

Christy highlighted the situation that the DOJ has not released the transcripts of Pat Fitzgerald’s interviews with Bush, Cheney, and Rovein the Plame/Libby situation, and they should and also that Gonzales tried to freeze Fitzgerald out of some policy making at DOJ because Fitzgerald is too fair and too honest for this Bush administration.

This Administration’s actions in the Valerie Plame outing was egregious and reprehensible and goes right to the core of their arrogance and approach to everything legal–they feel they are beyond good and evil ragardless of the consequences of their actions to the people of this country.

I think that’s a terribly important issue that the MSM has missed, and you’d never hear covered on TV for example.

You’d expect Jeff Toobin to make an issue of it. He should; he knows it’s happening. You’d expect Jan Crawford Greenburg to do it. But she hasn’t and I know she won’t, if it’s even on her radar.

Christy nailed it beautifully in an excellent post here. And check out other blogs. Considering the volume of issues to cover, I think this place does an exceptionally fine job.

The post I refer to as an example is here, and EW is all over issues like this as well:

Memo To Mukasey: Release The Transcripts

Richmond

Agree with your main point- but as I recall Obama didn’t have to decide whether or not to vote for the war cause he wasn’t in the senate at the time.

Plus, isn’t Lieberliar lately to be seen sniffing around McCain? Angling for a veep nom if McCain gets the nod, no doubt. What a great team they would make.

Hack

That could end up being significant if goopers (or- less likely- dems) go into their conventions with no clear leader.

The Florida delegates and what to do about them then become not a normal housekeeping issue but a deadly serious political one. Could be VERY interesting.

Edwards on Cspan and clearly stated that he is IN the race until the DNC Convention. Elizabeth said they will continue until then.

Re: Edmonds

Senior State Department official…my guess Armi….
Was this the nuclear prolif stuff Plame was onto??
Was this the real motive for outing her??

Katy

Thanks- hadn’t seen that- of course candidates have been known to change their minds about such things.

With McCain’s new found crankyness, they could bill as, “The Pill and the Shill,” now in concert!

Yep. His comment last night is proof that our country will never be 100% safe and there is no way to combat this. Blowing up people in an illegal occupation isn’t making us safer, it’s just pissing more people off. I still like John Kerry’s idea of treating terrorism like we do drug dealers & prostitutes/Johns: put the carrot on the end of the stick and they will come. Our FBI could be doing that here while our CIA does it abroad. I would feel a hell of a lot safer if they treated it as the “nuisance” it is.

This is why I REALLY hope Edwards stays in and Hilly drops out. In SC he has a real shot. In any event after Feb 5 it will probably all be over.

I watched Russert today – the round table only. What struck me here (and last night during/after the debate is how giddy (up) the MSM talking heads are about Obama – even O’Liey was practically begging for an interview. I think MSM guys love Obama.

And Obama’s comment last night that he hadn’t really watched the Rethug debate because he was watching football – and pointing out to Gibson that the skins had lost – made Obama again a very everyman kind of everyman. Plus it gave a sense of how calm Obama is in it all. Clearly he did not have lots of campaign advisers around micromanaging. Nor did he feel he had to hear everything and micro-manage it all. In some ways he seems a bit like the Patriots – thinking only about one game at a time.

Oh, and FYI gang: Jane’s going to be on Sam Seder’s Show on Air America today.

Thanks for the evaluation. Someone stated to me yesterday that Lieberman would be the actual President is Obama won; that person, although she does not follow politics at all, is astute in personal relations, and her certainty brought me up short. I began to wonder how strong the back-channel relationship would be. Obama to me seems more Clintonian than Bill Clinton, walking with one foot on each side of the fence, preferring to campaign for votes from the right than energize the progressives of his nominal party. Liebermanesque.

Within the past two days I’ve seen McCain saying that he’d like to see Lieberman involved in this nation’s security/defense activities. It was speculated by whomever that McCain might have been hinting at Secretary of Defense. (It was probably at TalkingPointsMemo.)

My bad. What was the war vote he/they keep refering to then?

LOL

Word has been that he’s angling for SecDef. Just what America needs, eh? Blergh…

edwards done speaking
i think he tells the truth
and i’m such a skeptic most of the time!
ain’t democracy grand?

Re:

look at what Sibel Edmonds said today

Hi oldtree,

I’ve been a 9/11 Truth research since November, 2001 so I’m pretty aware of Sibel Edmonds story. And her interaction with Curt Weldon.

I read the Sunday Times writeup and I have to wonder what it was about that article that piqued your curiosity? The Edmonds story has been one of the greatest teases I’ve come across in this type of research. She’s always got “a secret I just can’t tell you” but she just keeps right on talking about what she cannot talk to us about. It’s very frustrating and I’m to the point of not caring what she has to say. If she ever does get around to saying anything important, it’ll show up immediately with corroborative detail at 911blogger.com.

Re:

What have you all become?

or is it just me?

Speaking only for myself, I’ve been a very aggressive anti-war activist and radical educator in my local community since 2002. After my massive efforts, I’ve collected a listserv of about 0.0016% of the county’s population who actually give a shit about the world they live in. So I would say that it’s just you. Really, almost no one on the planet gives a shit about what is going on any longer. Trust me on this, I’ve done my research.

If McCain won, and he won’t, but I believe he will win New Hampshire but not after that, and Obama wins, and I think he will, and McCain brought Leiberman onto his ticket it’d be the kiss of death for enough reasons to get a master’s thesis out of the subject.

Out there…in the big world…are people who are more worried about Brittany spiraling down the toilet; and these unenlightened folk will decide not to vote for a candidate because of his or her sex, or skin color.

Yeah, I know, but the evidence is that the number of voters in Iowa nearly doubled since 2004 when GWB was elected. A great number of them seemed to have done so very consciously and purposefully. Many of these voters are younger and many are woman who didn’t feel fully enfranchised before. In addition, most of the new voters voted in the Democratic caucus, not the Republican caucus and they wore their hearts on their sleeves as they did so, IMO.

I believe this is the year the electorate once again sends a distinct message to the pols that they are sick and tired of the direction the ship of state is taking and they’re not going to take it anymore. I believe the ones that would vote against someone due to their race or their gender will be greatly outnumbered by the voters who have decided to take back their government.

Richmond

Yeah Obama’s a journalist’s dream. Everytime he coughs he makes history. Careers will be made out of his candidacy.

He’s hoping that he can win and still stay vague- as Clusterfuck was able to do in 2000- that gives him lots of manuevering room in the general. He looks very tough at the moment.

I keep repeating myself, but Joe endorsed McCain and I think said that he will campaign for him.

he just sounds truly interested in people in his asides to the crowd as he leaves.
he’s tireless
maybe we need a pres who isn’t ready for his jammies at 10 pm
(although lyndon used to get in his jammies every lunchtime for nap)

Gag me with a spoon. Really REALLY! I see why McCain would try to get that out there. But, Lieberman would have to give up his senate seat and all those nice $$$$$ that come into his family through bigPharma and his wife. Plus, the Senate is a potential 4-ever salary – though Lieberman is quickly getting Ct. to want to take back the vote. I forecast that the Greenwich dog catcher could beat Lieberman here next time (and he won’t have many big Dems on his side!).

The same one you are thinking about that Edwards apologzed for and Hillary refuses to ackknowledge as a mistake. Obama is being a disingenuous political opportunist by stating that he did not vote for it. He didn’t because he couldn’t.

Yup! Plus, he has aa good sense of humor!

Liebermann is the reason MrsCO voted for Nader & not Gore in 2000. He truly is poisonous.

Have CNN on mute …. can’t listen to old Fred…. the gov’nment ISN’T required to take care of the people…. WHAT is it for then?

Why, gov’t is for Big Business, of course.

Bob in HI

Lieberman stands as one of very few – perhaps the only – Democrat that Republicans admire.

repub lady calls in to cspan and sez she’ll either vote for ghouliani or obama

and there you have it

I listened to the Edwards, and I found Elizabeth’s account of problems with insurance coverage and insurance company recalictrance for many medically serious situations touching, and poignant, and also medically completely on point.

I believe the ones that would vote against someone due to their race or their gender will be greatly outnumbered by the voters who have decided to take back their government.

I hope you are right, I truly do. But Iowa is north of the Mason Dixon line and I know a little bit about the South. The religion is a thin patina for prejudice down there; but those two ideas are sold under the same bill of goods.

Lieberman: mentor (ex-?) to Obama, courted by McCain — D? R? I? Why did we think we were about to see the last of this guy?

You Got It.

If you google you’ll get a lot of hits, e.g., this one, which quotes McCain:

I would definitely want Joe Lieberman to play a part — particularly in national security issues — in my administration.

It also notes that: “Additionally, in 2005, both Andrew Sullivan and CBS News’s Bob Schieffer suggested Lieberman as Secretary of Defense.”

Because he’s become politically irrelevant. The vast majority of Democrats are beginning to hate Leiberman, and he is not a vote getter for the Republicans. I know he wants badly to be SecDef or AG, or on the S. Ct.–Paris Hilton has the same likelihood as Leiberman to get to any of those places.

They should make O’Lieley beg. Sit up and beg like the dirty dog he is.

Will never happen. Either McCain beyond Michigan or Leiberman in a cabinet. Also the Republicans aren’t going to be in the White House for at least the next 8 years after 2009.

I think he’ll win NH preety well. If that effecrtively KO’s Willard, who’s gonn abeat mcCain. I don’t think Huck and I I believe Giulianni just played his cards wrong. That leaves whom? Thompson and Paul? I can easily see McCain being the R candidtae and I don’t like it. He could be trouble.

Well, I hope you’re right. It’s as thought the guy were actually working for a. only himself or b. someone else, and had decided/been told to maneuver himself into a position where he would be close to power no matter what party assumed the Presidency or ran Congress.

Nut.

He truly is, and he gets way too much attention as a threat from firepups. He’s toxic on any ticket, and no one in a position is giving him a significant post in any administration.

Fortunately, come 2009 Republicans won’t be appointing cabinet posts, and Obama or Edwards would not appoint Leiberman.

not really a nut, actually thought she was typical of many voters. she loved obama but was a repub and felt torn by that. really praised obama to the hills. typical woman though, much like my mom was, tends to heroify people like ghouliani who keep her feeling safe with their tough thing. Now my mom ADORED JFK. so go figure.

Lieberman figures that the defense industry or SOMEONE owes him a few million dollars for his dotage- and he aims to collect it.

oh here comes ol humble bill on cspan, shakin his chin at the ground, lookin very very tired i must say. eyes like slits. could use some rays too.

I just saw the Edwards thing, too. Thougjht it was good. When he says he’s in it “to the convention and the White House” is that just a way of stating confidenc, as he must, that he will be the nomonee? or is it a statement that the campaign will continue beyond the convention and fuck whomever is the Dem nominee if it isn’t Edwards? I don’t think the latter. I think he’ll ebdorse the nomonee if it isn’t him. But did anyone else think about edwards doin’ an independent run?

uh …. lookin kinda…. at that female speaker of NH house

yeah, my son asked me about that when we heard edwards make that statement he’s in it to the end. can he run as an independent if he loses the dem nomination??

I think he’ll win NH pretty well. If that effecrtively KO’s Willard, who’s gonn abeat mcCain. I don’t think Huck and I I believe Giulianni just played his cards wrong. That leaves whom? Thompson and Paul? I can easily see McCain being the R candidtae and I don’t like it. He could be trouble.

I don’t believe McCain can take Michigan. If he could take Romney in NH, (with 44% of Independents comprising the vote I believe he will) and beat Romney in Michigan, then Romney is gone. But I don’t think he can win Michigan (1/15), Nevada, and S.C. (1/19) and Florida 1/29.

I don’t believe McCain has enough Republican backing, due to his immigration stance alone (which is realistic in contrast to the Republican base).

points to bill, nod to the band

The Edwards are terribly smart and they know that any Democrat is a different world from a Republican administration. Also if Edwards doesn’t win the nomination, (I think he won’t and Obama will but I’m just a guy with a keyboard and mouse), I think it’s a strong possibility he could be on the ticket as
VP, or certainly could be considered for an administration post if he wants to do that at that time.

Ya think? I guess you’re right. It’s just the many of the people I know who liked Giuliani did so because he was the anti-David Dinkins and thank God a white guy was mayor again and was jest lettin’ the cops do their jobs , ya know. None of thos epeople would consider Obamma. But I guess nationally, people are drawn to Giuliani less by racism (there are so many others to chose from) and more by that security thing. Still, it strikes me as an odd choice.

bill: young people have a bigger stake in this election than anyone else because they have more tomorrows than anyone else.

this is how a god mind works. and i’m not a fan, but he is really good. sez he’d be campaigning for Hil whether or not they’d ever married.

i mean gooood

yeah but you’re in jersey and this lady was calling from … jeez i ferget

That’s true. They’ne never forgiven MCCain about immigration. Willard says McCain-Feingold “hurt our party” too, so alot of people don’t like him ’cause of that. But I think he has that populist thing goin’ in places where Huckabee is regarded as a doofy bumbkin. Florida could turn out big. Huckster is really eating into Rudy’s lead. What if Rudy loses FL? If Rudy’s dead and Romney’s dead that’ll leave Huck and McCain. I dunno. It’s gonna be interesting to watch. Hard to predict because we’ve never had so many delegates up for grabs so early. I just hope McCain doesn’t emerge from the wreckage.

He is incredibly good — best I’ve ever seen work a room in person in my life. And that’s including every trial lawyer I’ve ever in seen in action in court. He’s that good.

I don’t always agree with him on policy issues (no shocker there, I don’t always agree with anyone on policy issues *g*), but he has a knack of making you feel like you are the only person in the room when you are speaking to him, even in a crowd. It’s a gift that you are born with, can’t be trained in I’m afraid, and he has it in spades. Even people who can’t stand him loosen up and warm to him. It’s brilliant to watch unfold in terms of human interaction. The closest I’ve seen in person is Elizabeth Edwards…she’s very good at working a room as well.

Yeah. I guess I have a different take on Rudy than some people other places. Oh yeah, I’m from Jersey but I’m in The City Beautiful now for 2 & 1/2 yrs.

Dan rather says on Mathhews today that they need less of Bill on the campaign trail. Too much a reminder of the past when the theme is change and all that.

Yeah. I agree. I was just throwin’ that out there. As for them bein’ “terribly smart”, the other side really does belive that smart is terrible.

And too much a reminder of NAFTA. Why would any informed union member ever vote for Hil? Why wouldn’t that same person vote for Edwards, exclusively? They didn’t in Iowa.

I don’t get that either.

Repulicans the party of War
Democrats the party of peace

That what I get from having only watched the Dems yesterday and the Rs today

That was a great idea to hold the two debates back to back, except everyone was watching the Steelers-Jaguars game during the first two thirds of the Republican debate. They sure beat up on old Mitt Romney, same with Hillary but there is a line they won’t cross with her.

The fundamentals are shtrong!

-George Herbert Hoover Bush

Here is a possibility for a Foxnewsiness Republican debate moderated by Billo-the-Wimp O’Reilly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqdZOGEU1qw

But she is SO good and hardworking in this, I think she should stay doing it.

Yeah! She has what it takes there, but otherwise SO MUCH baggage — including you know who.

Edwards … I think he would make a brilliant attorney general.

Absolutely. There he could put the teeth in the fight he wants to fight. And he could run again in eight years after he established a really good public record.

Obama … What he IS very good at is organizing people (he did that in Chicago) and inspiring the same. I think this is what makes him – like Howard Dean – a great party leader.

Look, a President is just the tip of an iceberg. But he or she has to be the tip we believe in. Obama has the style to do it. But there has to be the mountain under the water. I don’t see JE putting that together, and I don’t want HRC putting the same-old same-old together again. We NEED a reconstituted party with party goals and party loyality.

Richardson? Another cabinet position?

Who’s VP with the big O?

I am sorry about Biden and Dodd, but they can remain big in the Senate.

It would be exciting to see Edwards as AG and he would make a fine President. I don’t know if he’ll accept the VP tier on the ticket when Obama wins the nomination.

As to AG, the situation could not be worse in DOJ. Thousands of attorneys would be much better than Mukasey, but he’ll keep the DOJ in Katrina status until 2009, continuing the tradition of a Unitary Executive DOJ butressed by signing statements that says the DOJ can break any laws it wants to.

You just don’t know where to start with the cast of complete clowns they’ve paraded before us–Hans von Spakovsky, the DOJ twit brigade where an idiot like Goodling with a terrible legal education and no litigation experience whatsoever rises to the top echelon of DOJ vetting lawyers to be Immmigration judges who have had no federal or immigration litigation experience, screwing immigrants enmeshed in a broken bureaucracy, INS, also part of DOJ that is a wreck, Rachel Paulose who took down the Minnesota’s US Attorney Office who still remains employed at EOUSA doing who knows what, scores of torture memo writers including the Nahmias couple and Yoo, a totally dysfunctional OLC, an ineffectual IG office, and a joke for OPR.

In short, while of course in 93 districts there are some fine career attorneys who are superb litigators, appellate and trial lawyers, DOJ is systemically a wreck and will remain that way for years in concert with a judiciary that has an agenda (240 federlist groupies on the bench now by Bush and complicit drooling Democrats in Congress along with complicit drooling Republicans who controlled SJC prior to 2006 and still effectively control it).

Mukasey will continue in the tradition of Fredo Gonzales, using DOJ as a Soprano family to cover and obstruct for the Bush administration inconcert with the Bush firm of Addington, Fielding, Gillespie, and Mukasey.

” Charles Gibson’s hosting of the event was relatively inoffensive, until, about half-way through the debate, the candidates actually started to have an almost-substantive discussion about healthcare mandates. Gibson intervened: “We have an expression in television: we get into the weeds. We’re in the weeds now on this.”

Yes, it’s important to curtail a policy discussion before the candidates actually share some pertinent details with voters. Heaven forbid.”

Yep. If people were really allowed to talk on t.v. then they might actually do it and then who knows what might happen. We might end up with real Democracy and none of the Rich wants that.

That’s why the evening news is only about 15 minutes of ‘news’ and 15 minutes of commercial advertisements. They also waste about 25% of their show on garbage stories which aren’t news.

I remember an anecdote along these lines. I believe it was Gore Vidal who said he’d been invited by Peter Jennings to be on some kind of special show, not the evening news, and he’d accepted. Later ABC called Vidal back and told him the event had been cancelled. He found out why — they were afraid he’d say something.

Obama did NOT vote for the Iraq war, which was next to heresy by Lieberman and the neocons.

Obama wasn’t in the Senate when the AUMF came up for a vote. But, to show his fealty to Lieberman and the neocons he voted repeatedly for reauthorization and money for the war.

It’s called flip-flopping or fence straddling and he’s got long legs with which to do it.

Look, a President is just the tip of an iceberg. But he or she has to be the tip we believe in. Obama has the style to do it.

I’ve never heard a Democrat talk this way about the qualifications needed to be president.

OTOH, this is the way Republicans talk. They expect the presidential candidate to be like a walking advertisement and the ‘face’ of the administration, but that the bulk of the work is done by other people.

The big question is, who is behind picking all these people and putting together the agenda? If the presidential candidate is just a ‘face’ for the campaign and isn’t really the one in charge, then who is?

Republicans aren’t honest. They’re about manipulating people for their own Machiavellian ends. It isn’t Democracy they want.