Perhaps it is only scarecrows who tend to be so skeptical about humans that we discount much of what we see and hear and grow particularly wary of claims by self-described champions of "change" and new "vision." But we’re also suckers for hope, not because we believe it will be fully vindicated but because we know deep down in our straws that it’s important for a nation to have hope to have any chance of making progress.
I’ve tried to remain deliberately restrained about any of the Democratic candidates, not because they’re not good people but because I see each of them as possessing only a piece of what we need in the next President. It’s like pretending there could be a person with Obama’s charisma, plus Edward’s empathy and passion, plus Clinton’s wariness and experienced pragmatism, plus Dodd’s courage and constitutional commitment, plus Biden’s knowledge and insights, plus Kucinich’ moral clarity, plus . . . well you get the idea. But there is no such person; there never is.
We have to choose which qualities to emphasize and then hope the person we choose will have the wisdom, maturity and self confidence to reach out to those who can make the Administration whole and successful.
And so there comes a time in every one of these campaigns where I have to decide, to close my eyes, hold my breath, make up a little pagan prayer, gulp and say — "okay, I’m there; I’m ready for that leap of faith. Just close the deal." Tonight’s debate may provide that moment.
The New York Times today is full of stories — news, analysis, opinion — mostly gushing about Obama and explaining the hurdles Clinton and Edwards face. I don’t see how either can escape the corners into which they’ve painted themselves, though there are still lots of primaries and anything is possible. But the main theme of the Obama articles is not just hope, it’s also pride. Many Americans are proud of what happened in Iowa, no matter what happens next.
Whether by luck, logic or innate wisdom, Obama has tapped into the country’s longing for hope. Every bit of anger, every frustration we have with the current malignant regime, with the direction of the country, with the plight of working people, the health care crisis or the economic insecurities of the middle class can be channeled through the message of hope. It may not be rationale; it may turn out to be more image and fluff than reality, and we will almost certainly be at least somewhat disappointed in the end. But the country needs to believe in itself again, and that’s what Obama is selling. No one else is selling that so well, even if they understand and believe it.
I’ll be watching the debates tonight looking for that sense of hope from these candidates. I have no illusions about Barack Obama. I honestly don’t know whether he feels inside but has chosen not to repeat what Edwards is saying, how much he cares about what Dodd has been warning us about, and so on. I don’t know if he’s just rallying the troops with his rhetoric or really is as naive as Clinton would have us believe. But it’s clear he represents the hopes of millions who desperately want to believe in their country again, to believe he can pull this off.
The reporters/pundits tell us Clinton is "retooling" her campaign, planning to draw sharper contrasts with Obama. But if his message is hope, what would a contrasting message look like and still have appeal? What can Clinton say tonight to overcome an apparent Obama surge like this?
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uno!
The poodles and I are cuddled up and watching the TV, ready to go.
you’ll have to narrate for those of us on the left coast… won’t play until 7pm pst….
Oh man, I so wish they had this in split-screen so we could see facial expressions of each of them while one is talking. The outtakes from this would make such an amusing little video…McCain looks like he’s ready to smack Charlie Gibson for his Mr. Rogers act.
1st question:Run with Bush foreign policy or run away.
let’s see… prediction! Rudy says, “9/11! 9/11!”
oh wait – that was way too easy…
Huckabee
we go to war with the army we need, politicians should not be bothering the battlefield commanders with blood on their boots and medals on their chests
They need to debate foreign policy. If anyone bothered to read Obama’s Foreign Affairs piece, it would scare the hell out of them: Bush doctrine plus (preemptive war, unilateral action, military intervention, nation-building, defense spending). I cannot believe we’re electing yet another president who considers aggressive war a viable option, one who sells himself as anti-war no less!
Here, the Washington Post summarized his foreign policy earlier this year: http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..27_pf.html
Listen, as a young (26) voter I’m supposed to be enthralled by Obama, but he honestly disturbs me. I can’t help but see a centrist with right-wing tendencies, especially when it comes to foreign policy.
I’m looking forward to the commentary on the debate by our Elite Media Pundits. They are always so thought-provoking.
We won in Afghanistan per Grandpa
Fred Thompson beating up Huckabee. Sounding like McCain Jr., not enough troops, surge going great, etc.
You are incredibly reasonable bro, I guess we HOPE for a better world even though our experience may tell us otherwise.
Rudy likes the things that Bush has done. Electronic surveillance, Patriot Act, War.
Is it me, or does McCain look like he wants to tell Giuliani he’s full of it and to just STFU?
Hi Scarecrow -
Hope is one of those “stretch it to mean whatever you want it to be” terms. For me hope is my hope. It is NEVER hope in another person to save me. Hope to me is refusing to be daunted no mater how bleak things look. Hope is active force to me. Passive hope is hopeless.
where is this crap? I’m watching football but I can kick in the picture in picture.
Some people are easily bought. “I still believe in a place called Hope” ftw.
I’m looking forward to the commentary on the debate by our Elite Media Pundits. They are always so
thought-provoking.*g* I fixed it for you, Thers.
Yes, I know Kagan wrote that article. I swear, read Obama’s Foreign Policy essay and you’ll see he does make the same critical points. His foreign policy is hawkish.
Raven, ABC
Is there a place to watch the debate online?
Fred must have done some good napping today.
where is this crap? I’m watching football but I can kick in the picture in picture.
Wish I could. this is just cruel.
First question teeing off Bush foreign policy and Huckabee’s comment about “arrogant, bunker mentality.” Thompson says Huck is backing down, and everyone else is saying Bush got it mostly right — Giuliani — he put us on “offense.”
Ron Paul says he agrees with what Bush said it would do — humble foreign policy — but that’s opposite of what Bush did. We’re starting wars.
Hey Jane
Check out my movie from a Alpaca, Llamma, doogie, kid party today. Ignore the typo, I was in a hurry
The debate is on ABC.
I like that they are sitting at a table instead of standing at podiums
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QccijzjtKW8
McCain is fluffing Chimpy hard.
-G
There is a reason you can’t follow the youth culture in political decisions. You are wise beyond your years.
I hope this is true, but I’m far from discarding my pessimism.
Mitt says we owe Bush a debt of gratitude for keeping us safe.
I don’t have any doubts about Obama, and when I read questions like yours, I think “wow I know all the answers, I know almost exactly how he will govern”
Then I remember that I read “Dreams From My Father”. I don’t know if any presidential candidate has ever had such a public and well-written autobiography out there, from *before they entered politics*.
Anyone who’s leaning toward Barack but still has questions should pick that book up (and among other things you’ll realize that this guy is utterly unfairly multitalented, he could have easily had a career as a writer).
Thanks, I guess the play by play from ya’ll will be good enough.
No debate in SF Bay Area ABC affiliate..
If McCain starts to gain momentum, I predict we’ll be seeing the “Bush hug” photo a lot.
Romney smirking, laughing at Ron Paul.
I think it’ll be shown at your 7pm
the debate play in each time zone starting at 7pm/6 central… west coast does not benefit from a live performance.
Freddie in favor of preemptive attacks (only in the “right” situations, of course).
It’s too bad Kucinich & Dodd couldn’t be on FDL tonight debating the debaters on the tv! ;-)
Romney digging out Qutb(called him Q-tip)….Qutb died in the 50’s I think.
-G
Rudy
our foreign policy totally irrelevant to 9/11 and other Islamic terror attacks
and Mitt too, he’s going to cure those Muslims
Is Robert Kagan really the best source for an analysis of Obama’s foreign policy…?
I thought Ron Paul was supposed to have been cut out of the debate.
As it is, he’s presently fulfilling the role of punching bag.
Mitt the Robot takes on Ron Paul. Then Fred Thompson jumps in. Then Huckabee jumps on Romney.
Very funny.
Huckabee: “I’m not running for George Bush’s third term.” Heh.
Is there a Dem debate in New Hampshire before the primary?
It was a good line, well delivered.
Immediately following this, I believe.
Up next.
-G
Jesus when Rudy smiles it looks more like extreme constipation.
Fox’s debate.
-G
The debate is delayed on the west coast, to begin 7:00 p.m. your time.
Is Fred the Kagan Mitt just talked about.
cat-fight!!
Rudy: “Don’t criticize my policies.”
Huckabee: “Which one?”
Oooh, burn…
thing is, and i’m no supporter, ron paul is the only one making any sense, hence his voter appeal. these guys are all clone bozos on the short bus.
Mittens has this creepy little smile that pops up at all the wrong times.
Did Romney just lose his train of thought in the middle of trying to make a point?
1966….Fact checked by Rev. Huckabee.
-G
Oh man — this is gonna get ugly fast. Mitt’s tone is getting clipped, and Huckabee has that shit-eating little grin starting on his face, and Rudy’s feeling ignored….
Tape delay seems like a fascinating way to disenfranchise the bloggers who like to watch as a group.
Good for Rudi that ABC started on his turf, which apparently is foreign policy. Interesting turf for a mayor, when you think about it.
cat fight!!
Really, Robert Kagan is advising Obama? Hadn’t read that. Is that the same “Kagan” family that was talked about on the last thread? ohmyohmy
and yet, it’s the clone bozos that the lgf’ers admire…
curious.
Rudy has conflated all attacks with all Muslims.
-G
pass the popcorn!
hey, what was that ten million dollar check from a saudi prince rudi mentioned before? to pay for the towers. he sent it back?? just tossed it off there like it was nothing. rudi rudi rudi. dumb dumb dumb
owe me a coke!
whoever said Rudy has ptsd recently is correct…
Boy they hate Ron Paul, because when he says this stuff they can’t dismiss him as a “liberal.”
See what happens when the MONKEY WRENCH (Ron Paul) is thrown into the mix? It makes it so the blowhards have to defend their ludicrous philosophies!
Any Republicans or Democrats gonna connect the dots between our foreign military adventures and our domestic economic situation? Any candidates gonna even mention war profiteering?
Mr. ReddHedd just said, “I think Thompson is winning at this point, because he’s said the least and, at the moment, that’s a very good thing.”
the audience is so quiet…
Running for president and being president are two different things. Both involve making it up as you go. Obama, in the beginning, decided he needed to appear tough and so the threat to bomb Pakistan to get Osama. I doubt (hope) he would not give that order. If he gets the nomination, he’s the only game in town.
As for the experience factor. The claim is he’s never run a business, met a payroll, etc. Our present president was involved with a few businesses all of which went belly up. Obama can’t (and won’t) be worse than what we have.
ok – back and forth – football and debate:
harder blows landing in the debate!
mc cain is on quaaludes
Paul might.
*slapping five with Mr. ReddHedd*
Ron Paul fucks up their circle jerk bigtime.
Charlie Gibson asked for no applause.
Repubs, they are under orders!
audience is…. reverent even
I was gonna say “he’s trying to sound Presidential” but I think you said it better.
Yes he does. It was all fun and games until he showed up….again! LOL
Kucinich has the same effect. Love that.
mitt talks about his ‘five sons’,, ooohhh virile Mitt!
Sorry, war profiteering is so … well … profitable. Campaigns run on money. So.. therefore … Simple answer – NO
damn – it’s sanctimonious time.
If this doesn’t get back to a decent fight, I’m going back to football.
Uh Mitt? We had a great economy until the country realized that George Bush was coming to town in 2000 and then in 2001 when he was chosen by the US Supreme Dumbasses, it got worse from there!
Romney “each of my 5 daughter-in-laws” Like fingernails on a chalkboard.
translating Mitt:
“A strong economy and a strong military” (to protect all the money at the top)
Imus has been killing Mitt for his bullshit story about pulling his car over and crying when he heard the Mormon’s we going to allow A-A’s in. He also wondered if he pulled over and cried after Iowa! (This is not intended to start a conversation about Imus)
I think he’s talking about his “five sons who still speak to him” unlike Rudi’s.
It’s an attack, no it’s a contrast.
His 5 sons that are all here, and not in Iraq.
Those 5 daughter-in-laws are married to the Romney Five Who Are Serving The Country By Riding Around The Country In A Cool Tour Bus! See? He’s proud of them all. Spit.
Seattle up 28-14 4:04 in the 4th.
How come NoONE ever challenges the tax thng?
They mean ‘reduce taxes on the wealthy” when they say reduce taxes.
that is sooo underexplained to folks.
Yes, and wouldn’t ABC want their West Coast viewers to watch?
Three hours later, this thing will have been picked apart like a too-small turkey at a fatty convention.
Rudy, you are no Ronald Ray Gun.
Charlie calling them *all* flip-floppers (except Paul). Bravo!
(maybe I should have said – he accuses all of them of being dishonest in their campaigns.)
egregious, you know that they are serving the country by getting their father elected. same dif
huckabee’s really got the preacher thing down
he’s good
Okay, okay – I’m trying to get settled…..has anyone ever used provolone on pizza?
thanks!
Oh yea, these motherfuckers are gonna die for what they believe. Well, they would have but they were in college. Cept fly boy of course.
i don’t think huckabee;s wife looks that much like janet reno
if you can grate the provolone it’ll work
The football game is essentially over. Seattle just needs to run out the final two minutes.
Ooo – double post.
Sooo – the ddoggamdned debate has started? I’m on Mountain Time and it’s scheduled at 6pm – 18 mins.
Republicans praising the constitution. Bunch of hypocrites.
some people do
Pass the jelly, skins are toast.
I didn’t know you could pronounce inalienable in 3 syllables, thanks Huckabee.
“in ale bul”
Avert your eyes.
i totally support ron paul’s thng on the federal reserve bank. that’s a real third rail.
Uh oh. Ron Paul is making sense again. Gawd! The heads are exploding right now on the stage!
The Republicans are on stage now, asserting how they will put a Jesus in every pot and how long (forever) they intend to keep the slaughter of Americans and Iraqis and loss of treasure going–at little personal cost to themselves.
The party that brought you a pissant who panicked as Americans were being burned up by reading little kids a book about little goats and then hopping in a plane and running away, and whose vice-president’s orders were promptly ignored by FAA, and whose FAA ran out of the room when the buildings got hit and the transcript from these defenders of the country was “Oh God Oh God”.
Security security is being screamed by Rethugs who don’t know the first thing about security but are all capable of getting a lot of people killed. Rudy specialized in firemen deaths.
McCain’s kid may go there–Romney’s sons are quintissential for American Chickenhawk offspring.
One interesting facet of the Democratic debate tonight on ABC:
There are only four and the format is better. Applause forbidden and they are encouraged to talk to each other–although we never really have classic debates–they’ll always be sound byte pushing.
Democrats debating tonight after Republicans:
Edwards
Obama
The Nation’s Newest Obama Girl Hillary Obama Girl Clinton–”I gotta findout if change was discussed at Wellsley–anybody got a dictionary—cause I’m Hillary Change Change Change Clinton. What does change mean?”
Richardson
did huck just invent that we are all endowed by the creator to be treated equally?
Ohhhh….hmmm – it’s sliced, thinly, but still sliced. I just thought I’d try it.
Thanks!
Go have to love the naughty audience member who just applauded Ron Paul…
Ron Paul sounds sensible in comparison
Well GOT to have to love…etc.
next game is the important one for Colts fans, need to see Jags beat Steelers.
sorry – no more football from me on this thread.
Competing with Chimpy…
Margaret Carlson needs new glasses.
She said Freddie Thompson was haaaaandsoooooome….
-G
ok is somebody gonna mention there at our taxes pay 75% of these gubment guys’ health insurance? that really pissesmeoff.
And if THAT isn’t a scary thought I don’t know what is. But you’re absolutely right.
The only way to secure America is to get rid of the neocons. Agree?
i have to meet you some day, thanks kay. laughed right out loud.
She was after him big time when he was single.
way to frame the health debate with insurance :/
I didn’t know you could pronounce inalienable in 3 syllables, thanks Huckabee.
Competing with Chimpy…
And making the base swoon. “This goober is one of us”!
Gibson ? If we can afford a trillion $$ war, why not health insurance for everyone?
Giuliani — we have the best in the world. Need free market — mass consumer demand will bring down costs.
Rudy…we have the best healthcare system in the world…Dems want socialized medicine…
They’re getting caught a little on this one….
Buy your own damn health insurance….but let us spend the money to kill others and your sons and daughters…Love them Repubs’ logic…
Q: If we can afford a war in Iraq, why can’t we afford health care for all?
A. Because the war in Iraq benefits the aristocracy, and health care for all certainly does not.
Yes Kitty! We should definitely meet! It would be a laugh fest. LOL
So you pups are watching this so we on the West Coast don’t have to?
MAJOR KUDOS FOR THE MODERATOR ON THE COST OF HEALTH INSURANCE!! wow. i can’t believe it.
Rude-E – Health Care would be just fine if more people bought their own private insurance. Deep thinker, that man is…
Buy your own damn health insurance….but let us spend the money to kill others and your sons and daughters…Love them Repubs’ logic…
Whose sons and daughters?
Yeah I got some relatives that pronounce “interesting” in 2 syllables. They might vote for him.
Doing the same thing jayt. I need more BP medicine. Oh wait, I can’t afford it!
In real life (apart from his working for ABC *g*), Charlie is a good guy.
I’m watching Antique Road Show…
Edward — I’m in California — use this link
http://www.wmur.com/video/14986153/index.html
I couldn’t get it to work in Firefox, but it works in Explorer.
Mitt says he solved it in Mass without raising taxes. But he hasn’t explained how he’ll pay for the $150 million in unanticipated costs, as folks shift to the health insurance pool.
Yes he does, and he always has.
Rudy 912 complains only 17 million buy insurance in the U.S.? Is he planning to give his ill-gotten gains from clients who try to destroy America to the poor among the 301,300,000 or so Americans?
Oh yes he is. He’s just like Tom Delay….more guns on the streets would mean less violence/deaths with guns! See? It’s neocon thinking. Very dangerous.
is there a live feed on teh tubes?
McCain and Thompson?
-G
no hillary care?? we want CheneyCare!
Drive by …
Hey QuakerGirl,
Just wanted to say, I’ll be in your neck of the woods either next weekend or the weekend after that to go canvassing for J.E.
Maybe I’ll see you there
Gotta go clean up my yard some more before the next storm
L8r
Some of these infidels are watching f**ball. :)
Mitt — we don’t need government or socialized medicine.
Ron Paul — we can’t afford universal health ins because we have a trillion $$ war.
34-14 Seahawks. Two Collins interceptions…
LOL No different the republican debate right now. Bunch of antiques…
Mighty white of ‘em to do so… *g*
I”m now watching via Hawaii’s link.
Good gawd girl! No! *giving you a V8 juice bonk to the forehead*
Really laughing at Ron Paul. Mocking him.
Fred Thompson, smarmy douche-bag.
Go back to B-rate acting gramps.
-G
Grampa Fred is going try to break it down so he can understand it. He’s the GOP debate jester at best. Hope he’s gettin’ paid well.
I only get the home page, how did you get to the debate?
Fred — need to make the health care market work better. Consumers need to be better shoppers for insurance and health services. But if we lower costs, more people will want care — and we’ll never get to universal care.
Linky? Please!
http://www.wmur.com/video/14986153/index.html
Every time I see the Republicans on stage, and remember people are warning about Rove dirty tricks, I have to laugh. These guys are awful.
What a pitty that the four Republicans in contention can’t debate the four Republicans in contention tonight.
Oops – no I’m not; I’m watching via WMUR.
Fred Thompson sez we need a Walmart of health care.
arrrgh people who an afford health care s]choose not to buy it?? and why would they do that. and how is ti these guys don’t get called on some numbers to back up their crap, EVER.??
Freddie trying to crack on Paul. Freddie needs to realize that he is less able to “do” condescending than even GWB is…
“A good number of people can afford to buy health insurance and *choose* not to do so.
yeah, I see that all the time…
What a pity the 4 Dems can’t debate the 4 top Republicans tonight.
They really are debating for the top 5% of this country, aren’t they? It always feels like that to me.
Mitt — if you can afford insurance, you should have to buy it, or go without care. Government shouldn’t allow you to free ride.
Fred says Mitt’s plan does have a mandate and penalties, but Mitt is ducking that.
http://www.wmur.com/video/14986153/index.html
unfreakin believeable
Amazing the thought that health care is a “want” not a need.
Guess you can think that way when you’ve always been able to afford it.
Mitt just conceded that anyone below 3X poverty level is entitle to govt subsidized insurance. But he obscured it.
“choose not to buy health insurance”
the tucker carlson theory of young people…why should healthy young people be foreced to buy insurance. possibly the dumbest friggin jerk on the face of the earth
I’d like to see his documentation for the droves of people who can buy or get insurance any way but ***choose not to get it.
I guarantee you Freddy hasn’t spent any time trying to deliver health care to the cast of Law and Order or anywhere else.
no hillary care?? we want CheneyCare!
I’m not so sure. Those shotgun pellets hurt, and it costs a lot to have them taken out. And then you have to go onto national TV and apologize…
mods – please remove my #165 – was supposed to look like this one. I hate it when I blow punch lines, etc.
It wouldn’t kick on in Firefox, so I opened up Explorer and it worked there:
http://www.wmur.com/video/14986153/index.html
not working in either Safari or Firefox on Mac…
:-(
Is poor Charlie Gibson going to have to try to do the Dem debate after listening to this sophistry-fest for a couple of hours?
Mitt: If you can afford health insurance, and you don’t buy it and you show up at the Hospital…Drop dead!!!
Fred Thompson doesn’t like raising his hand and doesn’t like the word “mandate”, oh….but when George Bush was elected in 2004, I bet he raised his hand and loved it when Georgie said he had a mandate! Isn’t that right, Freddie?
that’s what I would like to see…
Paul blows ‘em away with the trillion dollar war sucking up health care solutions. And that of course is completely ignored because they’re (esp. McCain) in loooove with the possibility of a hundred year war.
Mittens: “…go to the hospital and need a repair of something that costs $1000…” Um, that would be perhaps getting stitches or having your child’s broken arm set. What world to these people live in? Reminds me of Poppy Bush not knowing how a grocery store scanner worked.
dems can’t debate repubs on same stage like this cause all their heads would explode. and the poor audience would have to clean up the mess, and be left to wonder why.
Huckabee says health care system is upside down — it’s a disease care model, not health care. Need to change to prevention, not intervention. [those of you with pre-existing conditions, move to Candada]
Romney’s voice sounds like he went to a voice coach. I feel like he’s trying to hypnotize his listeners.
excellent point
not working for me in ie
Yeah, he is. I didn’t expect that of him. Not coming off well at all.
Mayor 9/11 says we solve this with health saving account.
707!!
These people live in a world where
THEY NEVER WRITE A CHECK OR BUY A HALF GALLON OF MILK.
never
Freddy is trying to be like Ronnie RayGun. Not working at all. He’s annoying as hell!
Really, I’m in Firefox and it’s working fine….?
It’s working for me in FF in Win XP…
Here is another link to the main page:
http://www.wmur.com/index.html
It has a link to the live feed; maybe it will work if you go through that???
Link For Facebook to Debate: Ask your favorite Rethug your question
not “rationale”… “rational”
The Obama thing is not about the words, it’s about the feeling, the emotional vibration, the poetry.
Reagan had a certain poetry. Hucklebee even has a little of it. Bill Clinton had a certain poetry too. Hillary lacks it. Edwards pretty much lacks it. Romney is obviously a robot. McCain has a little poetry…. but only sometimes, and not consistently.
But Obama is poetry. Sure it’s boring repetitive poetry… empty themes… empty words… .hope… unity… blah blah blah. But it’s not about the words folks. It’s not about the reasons. It’s not not about the logic. It’s not about the resume.
Obama has charisma, and it just doesn’t matter how badly Hillary Clinton wants to be President, or how true Edwards critique of corporate fascism really is. The average person is listening to the music, not to the words, and Obama is making beautiful political music.
Is that sad? Maybe. Is Obama clever for recognizing that people want poetry and providing it to them? Sure he is. Just like Reagan was, as dumb as he was. Obama mutters sweet nothings. He points in general directions that seem right to the average man.
Will his street roots guide him? Or will his Harvard upper crust lawyer self be his guide? Or will his Hawaii dude self be his guiding star? Or will Michelle Obama be the real power behind the thrown (that doesn’t sound too bad does it?) We don’t know. But he’s singing the song people want to hear.
It was nice to know you John Edwards. Goodbye Hillary… your sense of dyanstic entitlement always rubbed me the wrong way. Welcome Barack Obama. I think we can all see where this is likely to go.
2 stiches this summer……over 1K.
Now I’m delinquent.
-G
Is anybody going to facebook?
great mc cain, nowo we’re gonna have no MD left behind for health care. results testing for doctors. if your patient dies yo don’t get paid???
radiation from planet X
What’s going on at facebook.
McCain – boost “home health care”. IOW, get people out of the hospital faster.
Cue the Guiness guys – “Brilliant!!”
We pay enough taxes in this country, the richest country in the world, and we get ripped off so they can pay for their war-profiteering, expansionist wars…..give us universal health care like every other civilized industrial nation in the world.
A**holes!!! I hate them. They are vile and full of it. They are heartless and greedy!!
Mitt now defending big pharma against McCain, who says they’re part of the cost problem.
Does Mitt have stock in Big PHarma?
Sorry that you had to prove my point.
hate to admit it but i think you maybe right. most people aren’t listening to the lyrics, just the melody.
jeez, poor gibson needed a breather. he’s not doing too bad a job considering the intense ego vibes confronting him.
pompous asses all of em
i do get a kick out of paul though
i think he’s an honest broker for her pov, not in it for the $ like the others.
giving that a shot but it doesn’t want to load, just “waiting”
will read what you guys have to say
I take your point which is being made in droves since Obama has really gotten on the radar with Iowa, but Obama is far more than poetry.
If you continue to believe Obama is all fluff, you’re going to be very disappointed. He’s going to win, and he’s susbstantive and you’ll soon realize it.
You need to concentrate on getting some Dems with a spine into the Senate to support President Obama, not Bush supporting Dems like “Hillary Change Change Change I know it’s in the dictionary somewhere” Clinton.
I think Mario Coumo is famous for the line that politics is poetry and governing is prose.
For Bush governing has been smoke and mirrors.
Exactly so:
I keep hoping that it is all very clever strategy…. but I also know that if you win by running to the middle, you’ll be hard pressed to govern from the left.
I’m watching on IE.
This works for me. Maybe I can watch a movie later.
Um, does anyone else think this delay on the W. Coast has anything to do with advertising revenue?
I see that comment that Obama is running in the middle, but I fail to see that he is doing that issue wise.
I hate to be cynical, but I’ve watched a lot of Presidents as they got chewed up by an inert self-serving greedy House and Senate, and I rarely see a lot of campaign promises reach efficacy on the streets once they get into office.
Bush was a “uniter not a divider” and he continues to suck up to the totally wacky borderline delusional evangelical right.
Discussion in real time on the debate. You can ask questions of the candidate, I think. Lots of stuff. Someone published a link just a few comments back. Try it and see!
I think Demi the delay on the West Coast is to have it air in prime time.
McCain: “We’ve got to take trillions to make Iraq secure for a hundred years if we have to for them so ANYBODY can get jeans at the Basra Gap just like I did. So don’t bother me with this health care shit, ok?”
new thread
I see Obama inviting the very corporations that are destroying this country to the table to try to solve the problems that they are creating.
I call that running to the middle. It’s reassuring to people who have corporate jobs, and it sounds all consensus like and friendly for people who don’t like conflict… and if he really does it, he’ll turn out to be another Clinton and sell out the interests of the people.
The contrast with John Edwards who proposes to take on the corporate lock on our system could not be clearer. I have my doubts about Edwards left credentials, but he is at least talking a serious game.
I’d like a helping of that Cheney care – but no thanks to the side dish.
Shooting an old man in the face would be bad for my karma.
Dept. of Irony.
McCain said Lieberman said “Anyone who says McCain is for amnesty is a liar.”
This from perhaps the premier liar of our era….who’s brought lying to heights previously unheard of.
Baloney, or Cocktail Weenies! This tends to diminish your arguement. The First Neo-Con President Ronbo with much blood on his hands deserves no compliments-other than for imperialism, oppression and racism.
I agree that Reagan is monumentally overrated. He had little to do with the wall coming down. Economics did that.
Democratic NH debate live.
From LindaR @ 147
http://www.wmur.com/video/14986153/index.html
Working for me in FireFox. Not one of the major networks, but Internet broadcasting. Had video, now only audio.
You seem to be saying the difference is between listening to a performance and a discourse. You may be moved by the drama of the performance, but if there was no content, the performance isn’t going to solve your problems. If you have real content in a discourse, even if you may lack eloquence, those who are looking for some sinew to build policy on might find it. The voters can seek details and elucidation during and after discourse. With mere performance, there’s little substance to respond to. You might walk away feeling uplifted, but when you go back to recall how you will accomplish the goals so eloquently espoused, you have nothing to work with.
But there is no such person; there never is – Scarecrow above.
Aye, there’s the rub and we need to come to terms with that. Repub debate interesting and looking forward to the Democrates. Glad Ron Paul is included in first, angry that Kucinich is not in second. They were most interesting on Moyers last night.
Blessings,
If it were a football game what Bush did would be like attacking the cheer leaders or the waterboy and leaving the other team on the field unopposed.
‘mass consumer demand’ for health care?
What’s he calling for, massive injuries to people or massive numbers of people with diseases?
That’s what they consider debate.
They can’t think of anything good, but they certainly feel arrogant, derisive, angry, etc.
I cannot believe that FDL is running an ad on this site for Ann Coulter.
WTF???!!!
Click it, quick! her publisher pays FDL for that!
I guess he’s never heard of a children’s hospital.
‘dumbest friggin jerk’ might be harsh. I’ve read some pretty stupid stuff by Repubs on blogs.
On the Edwards blog tonight there is an entry about Obama plaigarizing from a movie named Man of the Year, starring Robin Williams. There is also some talk of making an ad showing Edwards saying something (with the date) and then showing Obama repeating it verbatim (again with the date).
They aren’t too happy with Obama copying poetry being written by John Edwards.