Once in this country a white male voter's feelings toward his fellow humans were between himself and his Grand Wizard. But then FDR came and screwed it up for everybody. For those dreaming of those halcyon days of yore (or better myth), Ron Paul is there for ya’
And today, DeDurkheim from my usual blog and I were at Des Moines University (as was Jane) where future Osteopaths, a few treasonous Chiropractors, a Monkey, a Bear and a what appeared to be Horatio Sanz in a cape, watched Ron Paul lay out his policies of non-governance.
The beginning dealt with Paul's position on the nation’s health care system. Which can be condensed into getting rid of government's involvement in things like Medicare – let the market decide totally – and abandoning those evil Sauron worshipping infidels at the FDA who work on keeping food clean and medicine effective. Paul stated he wouldn’t just do this at once, he’d wait a week or so. For the poor, you know those people who pay loads in taxes now, Paul’s solution was easy to grasp, they’d be able to afford those surgeries or treatments through the money they would save NOT paying the taxes they generally do not have to pay already.
How your average heart transplant or liver replacement was going to drop down to be about $399.99 from its current $75k or so he did not say, but it could be the invisible hand of the marketplace – or at least a finger.
From there, and rather tepid applause, Paul went on to a more popular item with the majority of the audience, except perhaps Terry Brandstad the former Republican governor of this fair state, getting out of Iraq NOW. Further, Paul wants to withdraw all American forces from overseas. This is the pitch line that all of us progressives have heard before and it draws a great deal of Paul’s support from the left, at least half-heartedly. Many are trying to make Paul into a right-wing Bobby Kennedy, rather than what he is, a classic libertarian fantasist.
Paul's strict libertarianism was buttressed by the biggest applause line of the hour. Asked how his position of “guns for everyone” matched up with his pro-life position, Paul uttered the sop of how guns need to be used to preserve life.
Which considering the number of abortion doctors shot over the last thirty years or more was a rather disturbing statement coming from a pediatrician an OB-GYN. But his crowd absolutely lapped it up and roared.
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yo
If I understand Ron Paul’s attitude about getting out of Iraq, then I agree. Other than that, I don’t care for this man’s political positions.
Good Ron Paul takedown, Attaturk - a classic libertarian fantasist…
of course the very notion that the market can decide is obsurd
there are ALWAYS regulations, the very concept of money means there is regulation, the very concept of ownership, of property protection, the concept of intelectual property, crime and punishment
these are all regulations, corporations only want the regulations that help them, they don’t want the regulations that help people
there is no such thing as a free market, without corporate restraint by government economies devolve where big buys small or puts them out of bussiness, where there is no supply and demand there is just one supplier demanding whatever price he chooses, without regulation the conomy will devolve every time into robber baron societies
Attaboy, Attaturk!
Can you give us a sense of what the atmosphere is around Des Moines today? Is it like Mardi Gras? Are people running all around in big Uncle Sam hats?
You fez wearing guy, were there really people in animal costumes at the RP event? Or are you just joshing the prop?
Well put. I think Edwards sees this more clearly than any of other Dem candidates.
(Are you sure that’s a bear? Kinda looks like a beaver to me, but I’m no expert.)
Thanks for going to see Dr Ron Paul so I don’t have to.
Cue flying Ron Paul monkeys in 3…2…1
Those sounds he makes…the way his lips move…all created by the ruling oligarchy’s hand up his butt and solely designed to distract from what is truly important.
Peace, Health and Prosperity for Everyone.
Ron Paul wants America to be independent just like Bush and Lieberman want New Orleans to be independent.
Paul’s wiki sez he’s an OB-GYN, not pediatrician FWIW.
Thaks Attaturk. More people need to see through the libetarian haze for waht is is….an unregulated wasteland of might makes right.
So is Dr Ron Paul a YOYO-ist?
We had a lovely dinner last night with DeDurkheim and Attaturk. Great restaurant, charming companions.
The question for me if Obama wins the presidency, is how much influence, if any, will Mr. Lieberman have?
Jane What are you wearing? Thanks for all the great posts.
Did Mr. Paul mention the great libertarian idea of doing away with public schools? You would think that is the government enterprise from which his supporters obtained the least value.
Many Libertarians are Libertarians when it suits them. Most sane people think government is essential in civilized society. I’m not quite sure what that says about Libertarians.
Well, that sounded kinda silly. What I meant was what are you wearing to keep warm?
BINGO! My contempt for Joe Liar knows no bounds. I could never support Obama unless he totally repudiated Lieberman.
If he’s the nominee, I hope people will put his feet to the fire on this issue.
Jane,
Where did you dine? If you get a chance, try the Latin King on the east side of Des Moines. (Across from the Cow Statutes at the Dairy). Excellent Chicken Spidinii
Oh, so these were the fez guys and not the white robes with hoods. I couldn’t decide.
looks like horatio’s cape was at the cleaners and he’s making do with a pink towel. um, what kind of superheroes use pink towels?
no public schools, privately owned bridges, roads, water works, no public beaches or parks
no
nothing
for anyone but the wealthy
Was Attaturk en-fezed at dinner?
For some reason, I find Ron Paul less frightening than the Huckster.
Wow, Twain, you really had me there for a minute! Thanks for the amendation. *g*
Libertarians are dishonest kooks. They act like they can live without the government but are just as dependent on its services as anyone else. They think that roads will just pave themselves. Electricity will flow to their homes spontaneously. There will always be a doctor near to hand. Epidemics will never happen. They remind me of selfish seven year olds.
Wasn’t it Lyndon Larouche who used to campaign as a Libertarian? What ever happened to him? I guess Ron Paul decided to join em instead of beat em, huh?
He did bring it along just in case I had trouble recognizing him.
Sometimes I quit before I’m finished.
Hey, where’d you find the heart transplant for $75K? My quadruple bypass cost six figures plus for the hospital alone, not to mention DRs.
Nothing was mentioned in the post about the fact that Paul wants to get rid of the IRS as well as the income tax. He would replace the lost tax $ with, maybe (he says) a sales (or consumption) tax. Wondered how people feel about that, considering that it would be hardest on the less fortunate among us.
Great post, Attaturk!
I have a good friend, a retired teacher for God’s sake, who claims he’s a libertarian. He’s big, of course on the 2nd Amendment, on going back to the gold standard,and shit like that. Yet he was talking about some “legalized abuse of credit cards” and said, “my government want do anything for me.” He loves Ron Paul.
Okay, I’ve got my list of Edwards supporters that need a ride to the caucus, I’ve stood in the snow with the vaccum and done a cursory cleaning of the minivan (sorry, but it’s just too cold to remove all of the dog hair and stray french fries), and I put on my lucky turtle socks. They’re not warm, but they’re lucky. Unfortunately, my laptop died, so I won’t be able to report from the caucus, but I’ll get back ASAP and tell you all how it went down.
The presupposition from whence I start is this: I don’t want any new president who has any past or present connections to the GOP, the Bush family or Joe Lieberman.
You’re right, thanks.
Larouche went to prison for something or other. But his followers are still out there.
Go kristine!!!
I had the Fez at the ready, but didn’t need it.
For who asked, we dined at an excellent east-side restaurant named “Lucca” and it was fabulous.
Hey Kristine, stay warm!! And hijack I mean borrow someone’s laptop. We love hearing from you.
Remember his supporters at the Lamont-Lieberman debates yelling sig-heil?
I meant I used the vacuum. The one with two “c”s doesn’t work. ;)
Arizona roadways are littered with small Ron Paul signs, some printed, some homemade. The other day I was driving on a major road by an empty lot where a long row of Ron Paul signs were stuck in the ground approx every three feet.
Between two of those signs was a black man, sitting on a military duffel bag, wearing old tattered military coat with his shopping cart full of his worldly goods with a sign “Homeless”
There are times when you wish you had a camera or a chance to catch that scenario just because it explains exactly what Ron Paul’s positions and policies are in raw visual and gut ripping scene.
Ask that man… “Let the market decide?”
We’re proud of you, Lady. If you were in Chicago, I might could ask you to vote once or twice for me.
THANK YOU kristineIA !!!
(yes I am shouting!)
I supposition here is that every so called Libertarian had better damn well have their own fire truck. Among other items. Like armies and policeman, etc.
If MSM think Edwards is “angry”, what is Ron Paul?
Tweety and crew…if Edwards doesn’t win in Iowa, he’s finished, he can’t go on…even if he ties….WTF????
Ditto that here. I am a Co-Precinct captain for WDM-115. I am bringing cookies and tarts. I so hope John pulls out a Victory. He deserves it.
Personally, I find Duncan Hunter really angry. And the other one — Tancredo. They are like angry little TweedleDunc and TweedleTom.
man, they really want him outa there
he ain’t leavin
we’re getting down to it now… I’m on pins and needles!
I hope so too, Jim. Thanks for going.
Awesome! Kudos to both! But, didn’t they ban all food from the caucus sites…?
I am already seeing some sporadic calling the caucus for Obama. I sincerely hope that is not the outcome.
Yeah, how best to encapsulate into a tasty sound bite that there is a difference between angry temperament (Duncan, Tancreepo) and passionate anger with cause (Edwards)?
Advocacy?
Anyone?
Attaturk, any sign of that blimp?
I’ve got a couple of deceased aunts and uncles that can probably hook you up.
I’ve quit watching Tweety for two reasons:
1. He won’t give JRE credit.
2. His weird man crush on Ghouliani.
I get my Shuster fix on KO.
Before they are done, they will say that Edwards didn’t win Iowa by enough to continue. Douchebags
Me, too!!!1!!!!1!!
Ditto that, diablesseblu.
He just makes no sense whatsoever.
Are we there yet??
Ron Paul doesn’t appear angry. He would just smilingly and dodderingly undo four or five centuries of human progress.
Dropping the rugrats at dad’s(oxygen-bound), bringing my 12 year old for the civics lesson and gonna give em hell for Edwards. I will check in after the forum and try to give the local flavor.
Have I told you lately about how much Edwards reminds me of RFK?*g*
I heard he never smiles. Attaturk, can you add some insight? Does he or doesn’t he?
That would work. Does Illinois have a primary. LOL
Not that I am aware of. IT is in the John Edwards Precinct Captains manual. My Co-Captain is bringing water. I don’t know why they would.
The double standard of the corporate media is so blatant. We have all these angry Republicans, now and for the last however long Limbaugh has been nurturing it, and not a critical word from the media. McCain even brags about being angry on his closer ad. What a bunch of crap.
I already told you, twenty minutes! Now stop poking your sister! TEDDY!!
Ron Paul’s economic policies are Reaganomics on steroids. Somebody need to give the voters a real picture of what they imply. (But perhaps Naomi Klein already has.)
Illinois’ primary is February 5th.
I think they even eluded to that too. The corps are really pissed at him. Maybe that’s a good thing, because they can’t stop him no matter what they say.
Oh, no, he ran for president when he was in prison! (I should check Living Room Candidate and see if they have his “this is Lyndon LaRouche, speaking to you from prison” spots…)
I’m pretty sure he’s long since out; I think he just got too old for it. I haven’t heard much from his followers lately; I remember them driving a loudspeaker truck around Nashua during the ‘04 primary season.
If you were robbed and the police never came to help you or to catch the robber, would you get mad?
If you were hurt and a doctor refused to help you, would you get mad?
If you saw someone murdered and nobody did anything to stop the killer, would you get mad?
John Edwards wants to set things right.
Edwards for President — Leadership from the heart!
Remember 1994 and the year of the angry white male. It was a badge of honor.
We’ve had 7 years of Busho-fascism shoved down our throats and suddenly it is time to get along.
-G
Yes, we’re there. It’s just a very long driveway.
Something about one of the campaigns’ staff arranged for catering and it blew up in their face… I don’t have a linky, I’ll see if I can find it…
That’s right. Forget bi-partisanship tell they’re ground into the mud from which they’ve sprung.
BREAKING USA related.
The Justice Department is replacing youth with experience, naming veteran prosecutor Frank Magill to take over for embattled Rachel Paulose as U.S. attorney for Minnesota.
Just in time to assure free speech during the Repub convention.
Anyone know the guy?
I know that CIA tapes trump last year’s scandal, but this coming on top of Hans von S. throwing in the towel is a sign of your that y [you EW]+ and our role in keeping the light shining on the USA scandal. Yea
http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/005017.php
cross-posted on TNH.
When white Republicans are angry, they must be justified. When Democrats are angry, they must be crazy. (And “The Heartland” is always conservative, no matter what the evidence.)
OMG. Tucker is on with Charlie Black. There’s no way I can compete with or understand these two big brains. Time to begin fixing supper. I am going to fix my lady’s favorite meal. She’s on KP. Her choice.
Replace EW with JH, CHS, etc. Now back to Iowa, folks.
I think most people recognize the difference between temperament and passion. Well, I hope, anyway. When Edwards got fired up during his last speech here, the crowd went crazy and one guy kept yelling “Give ‘em hell, John!”
On reflection, I think that the angry white male thing really started bigtime during the Iran hostage crisis, which Reagan manipulated, illegally, to win the presidency.
Woops, and replace CIA tapes with Iowa, naturally.
All this crap about bipartisanship just frosts me. Guess some of the Dems just don’t have the stomach to acknowledge the realities of dealing with the Rethugs of the Gingrich/DeLay/Boehner model.
Didn’t they learn anything dealing with the likes of KKKarl?
Market worshippers (including libertarians) believe that an unregulated market is the same thing as a free market. In the real world, a market is only created by someone setting the rules, and you have only two choices, either government sets the rules or the people with money set the rules.
I saw Charlie Black gnawing on a foot-long chili dog in Merrimack last weekend. I so wanted to take his picture.
-G
You all have a really enlightened view of KP: the person who has it gets to choose the meal and watch it be cooked. I’m quite impressed with that division of labor, sir.
Well, in 1994 there was that House Banking Scandal to be angry about. Some people were’nt paying back the coffee fund. It was imperitive that they put that right.
Bipartisanship, baby! (vomit)
Wow! Was Shirley Temple with him? I loved that Mr. Bojangles thing on the stairs.
bipartisanship is just Repuke-speak for “bait and switch”. suckers!
snakes, every one of ‘em.
Yay Kristine! Many thanks to you for giving those people a ride.
I’ve got no problem with bipartisanship, as long as it’s understood that it’s a result, not a fundamental principle. You get bipartisanship on matters where interests overlap if both sides are negotiating in good faith. Until we have those conditions, trying to build bipartisanship first just means we’ll continue to get screwed.
(More to the point, the entire basis for the current demands for “bipartisanship” is the assumption that both sides are equally to blame for partisan rancor. Starting from false premises rarely leads to correct conclusions: garbage in, garbage out.)
Cool.
Cool.
Thank you so much for your hard work, in the snow no less!
Go Kristine! Go Edwards!
Excellent! I’ll be cheering you on long-distance!
That is very well said.
so, is it only very, very cold? or super-duper very very cold there tonight?
Huckabee creeps me out… (was on cnn for a sec)
All that nasty talk about Edwards is making me really, really support him even more. Go Kristine!!! Go Edwards!!!
Man, great comment. My bold. Thanks for this. It is so very difficult to rebuild trust once it’s gone.
My caucus location is at a junior college where apparently the Republicans are caucusing also. The Democrats are caucusing in the auditorium, what with all the space. The Republicans are doing it in the men’s bathroom. I’m not sure where they’re caucusing, however.
BA-DUM-BUM!
Seriously though, they ARE in the same college, but separate areas, of course. I’m hoping everyone enters through the same doors, however, so that I can listen in on the entrance polls.
A balmy 25 degrees with little wind. “Regular get out of the house cuz I got cabin fever kinda weather” Jim from NE Iowa
Bwahahahaa! ROFLMAO!
Right now it’s 30 degrees, which is nearly springtime around here lately. The sun is just setting, though.
Jane’s upstairs.
Well, I’m going to turn on the TV and watch what unfolds. It’s been a pleasure.
it is time to bid adieu to the neocon warmongering likud thug, hillary clinton. may mrs. clinton and her compatriots the likes of rupert murdoch, joe “douchebag” lieberman, willy “blood under the fingernails” kristol, george “butcher of crawford” bush, the anti-christ himself: obertsthurmbannfuherer richard b cheney freefall to a state in which they belong: a cave in the bowels of the prison in the hague for crimes against humanity.
Paul’s supporters are really something else. I know someone who is a fanatic supporter and when I pointed out his stands on every other issue besides the war in Iraq, and how much I disagree with them, I was told “Fox News doesn’t like him either.” I stopped trying to talk to this person and just delete the e-mails now. His supporters are the REALLY scary ones!
This is PhysioProf’s official policy on bipartisanship:
I don’t want my party to “unite” with the psychopathic racist sexist authoritarian sick fucks that are the remaining dregs of the Republican Party. I want my party to adopt a clear unambiguous progressive platform that repudiates all of the pathology of the degenerate Republican Party.
To the extent that there are any Republicans who are sick of the depravity of their party, and not too addled to recognize that it is their party that has single-handedly created the national clusterfuck we are currently embroiled in, they are welcome to join us. Otherwise, they can all go fuck themselves.