Okay, this is so stupid it’s just mind-boggling (h/t Dakine01):
Despite more than 20,000 lawsuits filed against music fans in the years since they started finding free tunes online rather than buying CDs from record companies, the recording industry has utterly failed to halt the decline of the record album or the rise of digital music sharing.
Still, hardly a month goes by without a news release from the industry’s lobby, the Recording Industry Association of America, touting a new wave of letters to college students and others demanding a settlement payment and threatening a legal battle.
Now, in an unusual case in which an Arizona recipient of an RIAA letter has fought back in court rather than write a check to avoid hefty legal fees, the industry is taking its argument against music sharing one step further: In legal documents in its federal case against Jeffrey Howell, a Scottsdale, Ariz., man who kept a collection of about 2,000 music recordings on his personal computer, the industry maintains that it is illegal for someone who has legally purchased a CD to transfer that music into his computer.
The industry’s lawyer in the case, Ira Schwartz, argues in a brief filed earlier this month that the MP3 files Howell made on his computer from legally bought CDs are "unauthorized copies" of copyrighted recordings.
"I couldn’t believe it when I read that," says Ray Beckerman, a New York lawyer who represents six clients who have been sued by the RIAA. "The basic principle in the law is that you have to distribute actual physical copies to be guilty of violating copyright. But recently, the industry has been going around saying that even a personal copy on your computer is a violation."
Per TeddySanFran, the folks at Endgadget have been following this too; they report that the WaPo gets a key part of the story wrong: the person (Jeffery Howell) is being sued not merely for copying tracks of a CD, but for plain old illegal downloading. (Though to be fair to the WaPo, Sony BMG, which for many intents and purposes is the RIAA, or at least a big chunk of it, did in fact argue in court back in October that making copies of tracks you bought is stealing as far as they’re concerned.) However, the RIAA is still being a bunch of stupid pinheads about it — and self-defeating ones, too, as they may not like what the judge has to say:
…the big change from previous downloading cases is the RIAA’s newfound aggressiveness in calling MP3s ripped from legally owned CDs "unauthorized copies" — something it’s been doing quietly for a while, but now it looks like the gloves are off. While there’s a pretty good argument for the legality of ripping under the market factor of fair use, it’s never actually been ruled as such by a judge — so paradoxically, the RIAA might be shooting itself in the foot here, because a judge wouldn’t ever rule on it unless they argue that it’s illegal. Looks like someone may end up being too clever for their own good, eh?
It sure does. In more ways than one.
This is analogous to the Bankruptcy Debt Slavery Bill’s helping to bring on the collapse of the financial markets. When people on the edge could safely blow off the 24 to 30% usury of the credit cards, they could afford to pay their mortgages, which are of course held by the same entities issuing the Usury Cards. But now that blowing off the credit-card usury is no longer an option, people are walking away from their mortgages — which is costing the banks MORE than if they’d let the people blow off the obscene credit cards.
The RIAA thought that forcing a Minnesota woman into the poorhouse to the tune of $9,250 a song would make major-label sales increase. They thought wrong, but will they admit it? Nope. Oh, and guess what? The artists on whose behalf this is all allegedly being done won’t see a cent of that money — it just gets rolled back into the RIAA’s lawsuit machine. (Speaking of violations, the techniques they used to find out that the woman had those songs on her hard drive are apparently OKed for criminal but not civil law prosecution — and this was a civil case. Hope that the appeal focuses on this.)
So now they’re going one step further:
They’re now saying that anyone who buys a song and copies it is breaking the law — even if the copy is just to your iPod, your computer, or your MP3 player.
Hoo boy! Steve Jobs has got to be pissed. As are all the MP3 player manufacturers out there.
Hell, forget Steve Jobs, think about the consumer electronics industry in general: Walk into any Best Buy or Circuit City these days and half the damned store’s given over to iPod accessories. Not the iPods themselves, or even for non-Apple music players, but the iPod accessories. Now the RIAA, if they win, will kill all of this — one of the few retail bright spots in this recession-verging-on-depression economy — dead, dead, dead.
And they still won’t boost up their album sales.
Brilliant, RIAA — you’re just firming up the resolve of me and people like me never to buy a major-label release ever again if we can help it. When I buy stuff, I buy straight from the artists, thank you very much. You know, the artists? The people you screw even harder than you do the buying public?
Geezo peezo, people. Go buy yourselves a clue, OK?
In closing: Thanks again to Dakine01, we find out that Mr. Howell’s not the only target of the RIAA to forego paying the ransom money fine and go straight to the mattresses:
The record industry got a surprise when it subpoenaed the University of Oregon in September, asking it to identify 17 students who had made available songs from Journey, the Cars, Dire Straits, Sting and Madonna on a file-sharing network. The surprise was not that 20-year-olds listen to Sting. It was that the university fought back.
Represented by the state’s attorney general, Hardy Myers, the university filed a blistering motion to quash the subpoena, accusing the industry of misleading the judge, violating student privacy laws and engaging in questionable investigative practices.
"Questionable investigative practices."
Remember what I mentioned earlier, about the RIAA and its goons using methods appropriate for criminal but not civil cases? You know, like using spyware and malware to frickin’ pillage your own frickin’ hard drive? Well, they’ve finally pissed off the wrong people with their high-handed Stasi shit. When the attorney general of a state joins with a state university to go after you, I don’t care who you are: You’re in deep trouble.
And it looks like other colleges and their increasingly-savvy students are following suit (pardon the pun). The RIAA just might end up shutting themselves down over this.



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happy new year pw!
hey PW!
oh good grief! The RIAA seems determined to lose any support they had to begin with.
Happy New Year PW and everyone!
eCAHN-from last thread…
In response to eCAHNomics @ 139
Toast us with a margarita?
Hey, on my vacation I learned a great trick with expensive internet arrangements. (Don’t know if that is what you’ll have)
I found I could print for $.25, no matter the length of the article. I would have cost a fortune to read FDL and Emptywheel online, so I clicked, expanded, and printed. That way I could read comments too.
I love it when I find a way to beat a rip-off system, too bad I found out on the last 30 minutes of my package!
Um, back in the day we used to get LP recordings and make party mixes on the old reel-to-reel tape recorder. Will they be coming for me too??? What crap…
umm, there are fireworks going off outside my window. At 9:00 P.M. Ah, Indiana – can’t get anything right.
They’ve been going off down the street from me for well over an hour… Sigh.
Unless I am reading the chart at the link wrong Bush still has not gotten the Market to its Clinton highs, it has been almost 7 years since 9/11 Bobo Brooks is right Bush has never gotten the credit he deserves on the economy!
EPUd from last thread to Greenwarrior
Skiing at Alta Jan 5-14, you betcha.
Oh common, it’s for the kiddies. Give em a break.
Why won’t my link work ? TCU’s link
huh, and here i thought that Home Taping killed music
Well, I’ve felt guilty about that for 40 years now… Sorry, y’all.
Great know it does so what is that bike chain link icon for?
I haven’t ever stolen music, mainly because I don’t like contemporary music. But RIAA makes me want to.
Well, there *was* a heck of a finale.
Guess we can roll up the sidewalks now…
Probably. If they thought they could get away with it.
It wouldn’t be so vile if these guys really had the artists’ best interests at heart. But they don’t — as Steve Albini showed, you can, thanks to the miracle of record-company contracts, make over $3 million for a major or even minor label and wind up owing them money.
Have fun, girl. It looks like a beautiful place.
Exactly.
Say, how is everyone this fine New Year’s Eve? Aside from premature fireworks ejaculations?
Isn’t there some site somewhere that lists “orphan” royalties for artists the recording companies “can’t locate?” As I recall there are huge stars on that list that they “can’t locate.” Humph. HMMMPH, I say.
Hey TXBetsy! How you doin’, girl? :-)
PW, doing fine. Just anxious about the Iowa and New Hampshire business. Which republican would do the least damage if elected?
Best fireworks I ever saw was at the Staten Island Yankees (a farm team for NY Yankees) stadium . There was a NY Pops concert there in summer 03? It was, they claimed, the first performance of Handel’s fireworks after the original. The Staten Island Yankees stadium seats about 6,000 and is right on the shore with a spectacular view of lower Manhattan. Fireworks were on barges in the water & were perfectly timed with the music.
Better still, Rudy conducted the Anvil Chorus from Il Trouvatore, and was as stilted as anyone could possibly be. I think I’ll see if anyone posted it on YouTube. It was hysterical.
In effect the ruling sought by RIAA would make the iPod illegal for all uses other than playing music bought from iTunes or some equivalent commercial download vendor (plus music placed into the public domain).
Doing OK PW. Quiet day here. How about you?
Correction suggested for your approval.
Aside from premature fireworks ejaculations?
Did I say that? I’ve never said that. Never. Nuh-uh. Nope.
ok, so maybe I *was* a teenager once… lol.
Oh, I don’t know… The fireworks for the 100th anniversary of the Brooklyn Bridge were spectacular…
Hey PW! Guys & Gals:
Happier New Year. eh?
Wishing all the best from here to all of you folks.
It’s gonna take all of us to get to the next one.
((((((PEACE))))))
Best to all of you and yours in the coming year!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8-dYry7NMQ
So, no more mix tapes?
What a buncha morons the RIAA must be.
Sorry,
I bought “Abby Road” on vinyl, eight track, and cassette.
How may times do these people want me to buy “Who’s Next?”
So I was wrong. The concert in question was 9/25/01, before 9/11. Here’s some stills, but they don’t portray how rigid & nervous Giuliani was.
http://artsaliveonline.com/giuliani_event.html
Marion in Savannah
I didn’t say what I saw was the most spectacular fireworks ever, only the best I ever saw. In fact, it was quite subdued, as it was supposed to be historically correct and in the 1700s they didn’t have the firepower that we have now. What was so great about it was how it coordinated with the music. But maybe contemporary Americans wouldn’t understand.
Oy, make that 7/25/01.
When it’s well done coordinating fireworks with music is pure magic. Do you know if it was the Grucci Brothers who put it together? They were the fireworks magicians in New York for just about ever.
While I think the RIAA’s ideas are full of shit in general, illegal downloading is a HUGE problem and robs songwriters of the means of making a living. Not every songwriter is a performer (at least not one who will sell out the garden and actually make some money.
Some people on this board (Alicia comes to mind) are songwriters and deserve to be compensated fairly for their work.
Keep in mind, not everyone is a Vince Gill or Brooks and Dunn, selling millions every time out. Many eke out lower to middle class livings with their work. When you illegally download a song, you are literally taking food off their tables.
I’m not defending the labels, but the fact remains, stealing is stealing and if you illegally download music, you are stealing from the very musicians whose music you like.
I have no doubt some of you think you’re “stickin’ it to ‘the man’” when you illegally download music, and to an extent you are, but you’re also sticking it to the songwriters.
I have a lot of friends in “the industry” and I could get all their stuff for free, but I want them to keep making music, so I buy it. I want them to make music, not work at Home Depot or Guitar Center.
Loo Hoo: The Republicans are in such disarray right now that we could run Mike Gravel and win. That’s why there’s this panicky bullshit from the CelebCorp Broderellas about begging Bloomberg to waste $200 million and replace Mitt Romney as this year’s Steve Forbes: They want him to peel votes from the Dems and keep John Edwards out of the White House.
Check out the link in 34, but here’s what it sez
I don’t think the RIAA is being mocked for their stand on illegal downloading. They’re being mocked for declaring that I (and many millions of others) are criminals because we’ve loaded CDs that we purchased onto our computers and nothing more.
You’re forgiven, heh.
Some of the rest who don’t deign to comment here, not so much…
Gawdwhutamess they’re leaving! – Will. Not. Think. About. That. Tonight.
FDL group: Thanks. Just… THANKS!
See ya in the new year. ;->
Yes, but I should be able to listen to CD’s I bought on my computer or my mp3 player. I should be able to use the music and not have to buy 3 copies.
HA! Glad to hear you say that. Third party Bloomberg sounded so serious yesterday, what with Nunn and all.
Oh, dear. Rudy didn’t really look comfy wielding that baton did he?!
An alternate take on the song of the day.
Eddi Reader in the Scottish Parliament
Bush has an ipod. Can the DC police arrest him?
Oh, well, I’m now in the process of buying CDs of stuff I had on vinyl 35 or 40 years ago… And had purchased on cassette tapes in between. So some of us buy our music 3 or 4 times, as technology demands.
Yes, you should, the RIAA’s stance on that is preposterous.
Now THERE’S an idea — didn’t they get Al Capone for tax evasion? IMPEACH!!! For stealing music if nothing else… Isn’t that worse than a blow job?
why? is bigthyme copyrighted TOO?!
Marion I have done the same, which is why I now back up all my CD’s onto my external hard drive.
ThatGuy: As I’ve said before, I wouldn’t mind the RIAA quite so much if they actually cared about the artists. But they don’t:
There follows a long, long, LONG list of numbers showing who got what. And at the end, we find out this:
I hope 2008 brings double the audience or more for FDL and similar sites. Wrestling control of the message machine is perhaps the most important issue we face. The Conglomerate Media needs to become irrelevant.
OK, that and ensuring fair elections for me are the two most important issues. Unfortunately, the voting issue in particular hasn’t taken hold even in the netroots, except for a handful of places. After 2000 and 2004, you’d think people would realize this. All of our work means very little if these two issues are never tackled.
ATTACCCKKKKK!!!!!
Kudos for your thoughtful comment – it certainly gave me no small pause. If I can figure out a cut & paste I want to send it around my songwriting friends.
Where’s Tula?
Paper must rehire fired reporters: judge
from Raw Story Breaking News
A National Labor Relations Board Administrative (NLRB) judge has dealt a major blow to a California newspaper that has earned the ire of journalists throughout the U.S. because the newspaper owner may have fired reporters for attempting to join a union…
That’s pretty damned stupid
People should pay for their music though.
Wow. McClatchy is saying Bhutto was going to report upcoming fixed elections:
NAUDERO, Pakistan — The day she was assassinated last Thursday, Benazir Bhutto had planned to reveal new evidence alleging the involvement of Pakistan’s intelligence agencies in rigging the country’s upcoming elections, an aide said Monday.
Bhutto had been due to meet U.S. Sen. Arlen Specter, R-Pa., and Rep. Patrick Kennedy, D-R.I., to hand over a report charging that the military Inter-Services Intelligence agency was planning to fix the polls in the favor of President Pervez Musharraf.
Try convincing teenagers of that at the same time you’re not giving them another $20.
But isn’t the case that PW is arguing that the RIAA is going after someone who transferred songs from their CD collection to their computer? I support copyright for artists and performers.
I have a substantial CD collection, and bought my first MP3 player (actually an iPod) this past summer because I was working in an isolated community for 6 weeks and it was absolutely impractical to take music with me otherwise. According to the RIAA’s argument, I broke the law? I make mixed CDs for my car to keep me awake and alert while driving. I’m breaking the law?
Since the record industry has been losing out to digital downloads, they’ve reduced the price of CDs from $20 to $15. Have they been overcharging me for twenty years? Are they offering me a refund for all those overpriced CDs?
You should have seen him in (im)motion. As rigid as one could possibly imagine. I 707′d. If he gets the R nomination, the Ds should definitely request a repeat performance.
Audience didn’t know what to make of it. For example, with less than 1000 attendees (in 6000 seat stadium), people near us were gabbing continuously during music as they might during a baseball game. I suggested, politely, that we were there to hear the music, and that if they wanted to talk there were plenty of seats that were not near other people. They looked surprised, like it had never occurred to them that someone might come to a concert to hear the music. (A Manhattanite’s prejudice of a Staten Islander.) But they moved away from us, with an apology.
All of which is to say that audience reaction of applause & cheers for Rudy was unrelated to his performance, but just because he showed up.
oh shoot! we’re moving before too too long, & trying to get rid of big LP collection.
so sonnyboy says copy ‘em, digitize ‘em.
santa gives us the wherewithall to do so…
DANG. we bought ‘em fair & square back in the 60’s.
You tellin’ us we’re in trubble?
gittamoe, ‘ere we come.
mediocare covers that, right???
This is NOT a new problem…People have been copying music ever since the tape recorder was invented. Seems to me that if you buy it once you should be able to copy it many times for your own use- but people who didn’t pay shouldn’t rip it off for free.
YOU need to try the first of this evening’s cakes.
Interestingly, Scottish Haggis and Kennedy placed flowers at an impromptu shrine outside of Bhutto’s campaign HQ’s, maybe, it could have been handed over then…
OffTopic
From Greg Sargent at TPM:
America Rising
One of the problems of the RIAA is that they haven’t been able to come up with a technologically superior product to the CD. Everything I bought on recrods, then tapes, I rebought on CDs. But not repeat purchases since then.
Yes, she is, but I think in your ire against the RIAA and the labels, you’re losing sight of the fact that others of lesser means are hurt when you steal music.
And don’t forget, the labels charged what the market would bear. No one held a gun to your head.
But the fact is, you’re sticking it to songwriters and artists as well as “the man,” when you illegally download a song. You can try to use as much twisted logic as you want but you can’t get away from the fact that stealing music is wrong, and hurts the very artists you enjoy.
Besides, it costs a buck to legally buy a song from iTunes. A buck. It’s even less if you have an Emusic subscription, if Emusic has the song.
I’m happy the labels have lowered prices. it’s a good thing™. But nothing they do justifies stealing music. As far as the college kids file-sharing goes, I would go after them, too. My band is recording a record and god help anyone I find sharing the files from it.
Burp. I’m still working on the (not Alice B. Tolkas) brownies I baked yesterday.
aw heck. been there, done that. Betcha the audience mostly knew full well the musicians are self-starting & carry thru at such occasions, no matter how idiotic the bozo-of-the-moment may be. he could’a caught on fire & they’d still finish without missing a beat. “Leading” the group at such an event is the musical equivalent of kissing a pig at the fair. congrats to rude-ie for not falling over, with that heavy globe on his shoulders.
I’ve tucked up in bed with a book at 10 PM on New Year’s Eve for years now, and even though I had every intent of staying up at the Lake tradition (and a serious case of the yawns) has overcome. This is one year I’ll be VERY glad to say goodbye to. Love and Happy New Year to all you pups, and I’ll “see” you again in 2008.
David Byrne had a great article in Wired about the changes in the music business that the record companies are failing to adapt to:
I’ve got a couple of recovering Marxist friends who backslide regularly when it comes to pirating music- but the truth is- they’re just cheap fucks not revolutionaries.
i have 3 favorites: your 2 plus restoring habeas corpus. so we can safely fight for the other two.
Sleep well Marion.
Let me be perfectly clear. I have not downloaded any songs from the internet.
They’re all from my CD collection, and that was PW’s argument. I am opposed to illegal downloading. But I believe I have the right to listen to music that I’ve already purchased.
Still laughing. You give me new appreciation for Rudy. But if you’d been there, I think you would have agreed with me that his nervousness had nothing to do with the bozo audience, but rather because he was just plain scared still. Actually, cancel my prior suggestion that we request a repeat performance should he become the R candidate. You alert me that it might humanize him, and that would be a tragedy.
Nite Marion.
Good night & see you next year. I, too, have no affection for 07.
Make that “stiff” not “still”.
can yew imagine living thru that age and not ever trying the stuff? still?
am i banned from the Lake? lookee, some a my best friends….
does that count?
if not, will u pretend to be my friend?
covers it all – gay weed smoking bloggers in pajamas. oh wait, where are the pajamas?
They’re smoking the pajamas and wearing the weed!
as i understand the wisdom of the present (s)ages, you’re perfectly welcome to listen to yer ipod while mall-walking, just so long as you have your whole CD collection, plus receipts, on yer person.
that about it?
GAWD pleeeze let us get thru this next year. weee promise to be tolerable, if not “good”. honest.
OT…Final Desmoines Register Poll just out
Obama 32%
Clinton25%
Edwards 24%
http://www.desmoinesregister.c…../1001/NEWS
Adie, don’t sell them unless you absolutely must. Betcha they’ll be worth lots of money before too long. I am kicking myself to the moon for getting rid of mine.
ThatGuy,
I barely listen to anything associated with the RIAA to begin with, sorry to say. If i listen to an indie band locally? I tend to buy their CD which is off a smaller, less greedy record business(or sometimes self produced nowadays). But the Industry in my mind has gone to pot, the product is over manufactured. At least, the stuff they let get played on mass radio networks. Indie bands are almost always word of mouth. If the RIAA was more in mind of working with musicians instead of ripping off the audiences AND the artists? I’d pay more.
As it is? I’ve bought maybe 3 CDs in the last five years from popular artists. I dont’ download them either because i hardly listen to top 40 radio. Payola’s velvet fist isn’t my idea of ‘listening’ pleasure, thank you. I’ve bought a few mp3s legally from eMusic, dont’ have an iPod (offbrand mp3 player for me, too damned poor for that!) and have a tendency to listen to non RIAA artists to begin with. I buy when i can. But when i DO buy? it’s almost always a CD that i know is worth it. Usually what isn’t pressed on me by the industry itself. I just don’t like what’s on the air, so they don’t get money from me anyway. Which to me says all their is about the ‘quality’ the RIAA is being so greedy about, and that the artists seldom see a penny of unless they go gold or platinum.
American farmers just need legalized gainful hemployment. /s
I don’t get the thing about copying music onto your hard drive from CDs you bought yourself. If I stick a CD into the slot of my laptop, it gets sucked the rest of the way in, and an icon pops up, asking if I want to transfer the songs to the hard drive.
So the computer can ask me to copy the music, and if I say “Yes,” I’m a criminal? Didn’t Jobs have like 500 attorneys working for apple when they started this whole ball rolling?
Heh, Hetero and no PJ’s…. 8-)
right! thanks. not about to. and if we can’t store them, our kids will.
Naw! It would cross-pollinate the good shit then… 8-(
This is without a doubt the dumbest thing I’ve heard all day. If I purchase a CD I should be able to put it on my computer or i-pod. Unfortunately I don’t know how to do it, exactly, and I don’t have an i-pod. But still, assinine. Not paying for a track is something else entirely, and that is nothing more than theft.
Just went out for a smoke and it sounds like WWIII out there and it’s only 9pm. My poor dog is curled up at my feet, I don’t think she’d go out even if she were about to burst. Thunder doesn’t bother her but she doesn’t like fireworks at all. Thankfully it rained buckets yesterday and the ground is soaked so fire shouldn’t be a problem.
smoke!
Shit that sounds good–two years and still cravin the things.
Oh, and all the music i do put on the mp3 player i do have? i do have the actual albums from. They’re trying to pull the LP records to cassette tapes game again. Which is stupid, since it didn’t work in the 80s. What makes them think it’s going to work now?
hemp is so very fashionable these days! what i have is hanging in the closet. if it comes out of the closet, it can go with the cake.
madmommy, you sound about as tech savvy as me! But it still pisses me off too.
OT Nader has endorsed Edwards.
WooHooo. Link?
me too, Me Too!, ME TOO!
ain’t gonna be easy, but we’ll git’r’done.
that seems like no help whatsoever.
Great. Put me on the Endorses Edwards list too! I don’t trust HRC or Obama at all. Edwards yes.
As clocks strike midnight please consider staying indoors or at least under a porch roof this new years eve.. All of the random bullets shot up in the air must come down..and when they do it’s deadly.
Better than Nader in the race!
no doubt, gw…
And the fact is, if I copy a CD I bought to my iPod, I am no more stealing than I was when I recorded an LP so I could listen to it in my car or on my Walkman. Part of the problem with the RIAA is that they’re trying to use digital rights management to make what you “buy” much more restricted than it was in the past. The commonsense idea of what you’ve bought is a piece of music, however you choose to listen to it, not a particular set of bits on a particular piece of plastic. The fact that you get the law defined that way doesn’t mean listeners will follow without a fight.
The ease of copying digital formats is obviously a problem, but that doesn’t mean presuming that customers are guilty until proven innocent is an acceptable solution.
Political Wire
In response to Twain @ 97
that seems like no help whatsoever.
Face it. That’s scary!
Right now, we’re still willing to vote for ANY of the Dems if it comes to that, but favor EdwardsPrz w/ DoddVeep to keep the steam poring from the kettle as they get to work on this poor abused country/world.
nader’s a drag. go away and sit in a corner Mr. N., PLEASE!
There are no votes in the middle. All the votes you get depend on the voters agreeing with your position. That Nader is throwing votes to Edwards, if your an Edwards’ fan, is good news, even if you think it is marginal.
IMHO, the fact that Nader has endorsed Edwards is good news. It means that he finds Edwards acceptable and wouldn’t run against him. Which says something positive about Edwards’s relative electability compared to his opponents.
Thank you for that comment with the very words my brain couldn’t piece together without sounding defensive.
The poll must be freaking the Hillary people out
okay okay. i’ll hold my nose and be what passes for “happy” these days.
still, there are so-o-o many probably even angrier at Nader now than ever, that i was afraid he might cause some to turn away from Edwards.
but you’re right, i’m sure. Edwards could stand a green-voter boost, which Nader might provide. Tho he doesn’t talk directly about it except as a health issue, as a confirmed unabashed tree-hugger myself, i don’t have qualms about him at all in that line.
I don’t have a CD player, I just play CD’s on my mac.
Am I going to jail?
If you listen to the music on your iPod, as opposed to your Walkman, the artist, the producer, etc. all make the same amount of money. Why should one be “stealing” but not the other?
not while i’m still drawing any breath…
Happier New Year Hon!
I’m sure it is and it’s too late to do much about it. If Gore would endorse Edwards, I think it would be all over.
egregious, wanna bunk together?
You’re not reading for content.
I think the RIAA’s position on ripping to iPod is idiotic and I’ve never claimed otherwise. But in the rush to condemn the RIAA and “stick it to the man,” I just want people to think about the other, unintended consequences of illegal downloading. If *I* buy a CD I put it on a hard drive for backup, a DVD for backup and on my iPopd so I’m right there with you. But often, in a discussion about RIAA policies and practices, there is a lot of written justification for illegal downloading and I’m trying to make sure we don’t lose sight of other issues.
Gotchur point, which I didn’t originally. My guess is that more people are still allied with Nader than are pissed with him after 04. But I don’t know that. Either case could be accurate. thanks for elucidating.
Too late? Nuh uh! Methinks that’s terrific idea, no matter WHEN it happens.
Only after passing “GO” and collecting $200. *g*
Yeah. Who & when is Gore going to endorse. Could be big. Why the silence?
This morning Edwards was surging Obama failing now all is different. So does it mean anything?
I read he wasnt going to.
1) Ralph Nader didn’t lose the 2000 election for Gore in Florida. Gore won Florida.
2) Nader was opposed to many of the things we here at fdl have found wanting in our political system. He went about his opposition to them by forming his own movement. From time to time he teamed up with the Green Party, another group opposed to many of the things we here have found egregious.
3) Nader was one of the late 20th century’s greatest men, leading the way for many consumer protection and environmentalist actions, groups and agencies.
4) Nader was responsible for the passage of more beneficial legislation than any American since Abraham Lincoln.
5) His endorsement of John Edward will help Edwards, and hurt Obama, who will lose some younger voters to Edwards over this.
6) For me, Nader’s endorsement of Edwards is one more reason to vote for Edwards.
7) Nader can often be a jerk in one-on-one situations, and is reputed to be one of Washington, DC’s worst tippers.
It means they’re polling different people?
Do you ski at Snowbird?
I dunno… I’m guessing “internal” polling is showing something different… why would Obama go on attack today if Edwards wasn’t threatening him? And why is Hillary so calm and composed?
Something doesn’t seem right with this latest poll…
I think Gores silence speaks volumes against Clinton.
No I lived in NC near a Snowbird mountain. Named my cat Snowbird. hee
bad year!!! good song
but next year is HERE!!!it can only get better
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFAPzbiGhow
He doesnt care for her Ive heard
I’ve never excoriated Nader for D’s loss. Has to do with R cheating.
Nader has been on correct side of many issues & has worked tirelessly for them.
Having said all that, I find him an uptight holier-than-thou asshole, but that’s just MO.
I still don’t support the RIAA or their ‘product’ in general. Pardon me for being picky. Or on the side of the indie artists who work their own labels so they dont’ get totally ripped off by the RIAA.
I think Gore’s silence says nothing in particular. He may not see any of the main contenders being especially green. Can you imagine him endorsing Kucinich at this point?
Obama was a tattletale? Via HuffPo:
Isabella Darmawan, Obama’s first-grade teacher at the Catholic school he attended when he arrived as a six-year-old, recalls an essay in which he said he expected to be president someday, though he didn’t specify of which country. His second- grade teacher, Cecilia Sugini, says he often led his peers when they lined up single-file for class and was quick to let her know when other pupils misbehaved.
im so very happy Jomo didnt make it to VP …hes a smirking Darth imo
Living near Snowbird Mtn in NC must have been long before global warming!
So, for real snow, try Snowbird Utah, or Alta Utah, both of which are in Little Cottonwood Canyon, & both of which are spectacular.
Why? Okay. Here I go out on a limb.
Look at the outstanding lineup of Dem. candidates, & then compare the repubbles’ sorry crew of losers.
When you stop guffawing, and twitching over justifiable lingering fears of election fraud, ask yourself why someone of Gore’s quality would even think of interrupting the semi-natural campaign process at this point.
Possible answer off the top of my head: He and any other ethical person in his position of power might not want to muddy the waters prematurely. Better to let things play out unhindered for awhile, and then decide when, or even whether, to step up with an endorsement.
Wonder if he plans to remain “above the fray” until there is a nominee. Surely he knows that if he endorsed someone in the primaries that would be a serious hit to the other candidates.
No. If he were going to endorse Kucinich he would have already done so when it might have actually helped. Gore used to like Lieberman.. he may have changed but he has not yet seen all of the light..)
I refuse to judge any politician for anything they did while still in elementary school.
Id love to. Ive never been in that part of the country.
Yep. Hope that Gore, prior incarnation as pol, is now pure. Still, you can’t fault me for wondering.
Never too late to start!
I think I saw that he wanted to stay above the fray. Something about “his brand”
Sadly disagree. Chimpy’s adventures with exploding frogs may have been in this age range. Stuff is relevant.
Gore might also like a cabinet position and I can’t think of anyone I would like more in our gov’t.
teh true dat
MadMommy! Aloha! So which Tiger are ya rooting for…? ;-)
Hey. Kindergarten? Hard call except for well-earned, harsh critique of apparent parental neglect/enabling/abuse.
shame on bar!!!
Ah-h-h-h! A serious reason to keep putting one foot in front of the other. ;->
When Texteen was in 4th grade he was a bully. When Snarky was in 4th grade she got into fights and stole things from other students. They’ve both grown out of it.
You have to ask? My fervent hope is Auburn goes down to a crushing defeat. A defeat so miserable and demoralizing that the coach is fired, the cheerleaders turn their backs on the team and the school gives up football entirely. :0)
You’re a good mom.
Chimpy is still blowing up [frogs].
Something is rotten in crawdadfd.
watertiger in da house. g’won upstairs…
This advertisment paid for by Clinton for President.
——
It doesn’t resemble any other poll I’ve seen recently. Maybe that’s because the Register backs Clinton and they desperately want to help boost Obama over Edwards.
That’s the kind of b.s. we could look forward to in a Clinton presidency.
Interesting. Mac Owners have about 3-4% of the boxes, and PC Owners the rest.
Macintosh owners are far more likely than PC owners to Pay for Music Downloads
“Macintosh owners are far more likely than PC owners to have recently paid for a music download, according to the NPD Group, a market research firm. In the third quarter of 2007, exactly half of Mac owners paid to download music at least once, while only 16 percent of PC owners did. The data was derived from an online panel of 4,915 people and weighted to reflect the United States’ online population.”
As to suits brought against downloaders in Federal Courts, this didn’t get a lot of play in mainstream media, and few attorneys know about it, but the powergrabber who has run AOC, Administrative Office of Courts for years, Meacham unilaterally decreed that he was going to put key stroke monitors on all AOC computers in Judges’ chambers. When he did, the stats he reported noted a 3-7% rate of illegal downloads in the Judges’ chambers. This was broken down to include porn and free music, movie etc. downloads by personnel in chambers–it didn’t necessarily mean the judges were doing this at work, although some probably were, and at home, their children are as well.
Monitoring of Judiciary Computers Is Backed
Judge Kozinsky Writes Editorial WSJ Critical of Monitoring Judicial Computers: We Don’t Be BOP Inmates We Be Judges
Judge Not
Monitoring Internet use at work
Judicial Monitoring: the Bureaucrat Blinks, Privacy Wins
Judges Back Down on Workplace Monitoring
“After investigating, Mecham concluded that between three to seven percent of the judiciary’s browser traffic involved ’streaming media’ audio and video downloads, which use significant amounts of bandwidth and slow down online services. Mecham’s solution to the discovery was to activate filters which were programmed to record downloads of MPEG movie files and MP3 music files. The reports of the downloads were forwarded to Mecham’s deputy, Clarence Lee, for review. If Lee found the files to be ‘inappropriate,’ he would identify the files, and the computers from which they were downloaded, to the chief judge of the relevant circuit. No one disputes the reported information was embarrassing at times – the sophomorically graphic website names alone were offensive. It is also undisputed that some of the downloaded movies were distinctly ‘adult.’ The notification letters urged the judges to identify the computer user and recommended disciplinary action for the offending employee.”
Many judges objected to being spied on the way they routinely ordered probationers to be spied on by keyloggers from the Probation Office often when a computer is involved in the alleged wrongdoing–I suppose since the federal judges didn’t consider themselves probationers, but rather the Kings of the Probationers.
The Judges in the Ninth Circuit were so outraged that their 3-7% of illegal downloads including porn and music were being nailed and made pubic, that the Chief Judge Mary Schroeder turned off all Ninth Circuit computers for two weeks, enhancing conduct of the people’s business, or er not so much.
Current Chief Judge, and flamboyant quote meister Kozinsky was so riled up that he threatened to somehow get the U.S. Attorney to investigate Meacham for wiretapping violations.
This came to a head during the Judicial Conference in D.C. were the judges made it clear to Meacham that he needed to back down fast, and he did.
One hypocritical point this made was that the Federal Judges who preside over these cases are guilty of the conduct or not controlling the conduct in their employees in their chambers that they impose sanctions for in Court.
Another was the time worn aphorism that people who are often casual at the prospect of dishing out punishment, aren’t very capable of taking it.
The Supreme Court already ruled on a closely related case: Sony vs. Universal, the Betamax case. They explicitly ruled that it’s legal to copy a TV show for personal use. If it’s legal to copy a program with sound and video, clearly it’s legal to copy only the sound.
If they were serious about this as an issue, they should have brought it up back in the 1970s or earlier.
They’re too late now. Fuggedaboudit!
- Tom
Maybe if people didn’t have to pay $15 for a Cd with one or two songs worth listening to on it then they wouldn’t “steal” music.
The same thing applies to people looking for oldies that were originally released on vinyl LP’s.
Back in the day I used to copy my LP’s onto cassette tapes for my car. I guess I’m an outlaw too.
Back in Apple II days I joined an Apple Users Group that turned out to be a pirate’s nest. The meetings consisted of people bringing their machines and software to someone’s house and copying programs they didn’t have. I copied lots of games for my son. I didn’t consider it stealing because there was no way I would buy any of them. Each year he got 29.95 to buy a game of his choice. The rest enhanced his use of the machine, but didn’t cost producers anything because under no circumstances would I be their customer.
The same is true for music downloading. People download music to hear a song once in a great while (If you have 3000 songs on your Ipod it will take a good while to get around to them all). They’re nice to have, but the user would not be a customer. Record companies are foolish not to acknowledge this reality. People might pay fifty cents for a track of marginal interest, but they will not pay fifteen dollars for a CD carrying that song which they could take or leave. Record companies are twenty years behind the times which is why they fight a battle they cannot win. More stupid capitalists who think of no one but themselves.