WTF?
oh yea. ZED.

No, but the Internet Killed the TV Star.

Cat fight with Anderson Cooper. Stay tuned for mud wrestling with Spears sisters at the top of the hour.

who killed the electric car?

what a stupid headline. jeez!

But this is such a great parlor game. WHich democrat do we blame for Bhutto’s assassination? (slaps hand to head). We could have played this game for hours over Christmas dinner!

Good grief.

How could Hillary do that if she was getting Britney’s little sister pregnant…..?

who killed davey moore? why? what was the reason for?

Sounds about right to me. What about American idol?

Disgraceful that a campaign would use the assassination of such a beautiful and brave woman to derail another woman’s campaign. Benizar Bhutto was a hero of mine for a long time, and I totally resent people appropriating her death for such unseemly purposes.

LMAO!!!!!

Is Fucktaed gonna go to the funeral/service? Send FB?

Did DAD have anything to add to Bush’s statement? probbaly not. That said it all, in my view.

You’re in rare form tonight, ET.

Did George Bush kill Benazir Bhutto would be a better question, Anderson. But one that nobody on CNN will be asking, I’m sure.

and exactly what is cnn saying?? oh yes lets poison the well even more

Did George Bush kill Benazir Bhutto would be a better question, Anderson. But one that nobody on CNN will be asking, I’m sure.
reply

The elephant in the room. :P

did i miss the statement from condysleeza? what did she have to say……

And it’s a BIG elephant, isn’t it? I keep waiting for the tipping point, when the MSM wakes from it’s slumber and starts doing it’s job again. Guess I will keep waiting.

what did she have to say……
reply

She said, “It’s not my fault!”

The CNN headline shouldn’t be a surprise.

A couple of recent studies have found that the media provides more critical (i.e. unflattering) coverage of Hillary Clinton than the other presidential candidates.

oy gevalt!

I am not a fan of Hillary, but she did not do this.

even longer now that congloms can OWN all the media if they so desire….

You’re in rare form tonight, ET.

I’m making Boby Flay’s tequila-cured salmon for our Holiday Party, and I’ve been taking some holiday liberties as I proceed…

I’m on my way over.

I don’t think Bush had Bhutto killed. The administration was working for a power sharing agreement between her and Musharif.

The nutcase conspiracy theories here have been getting out of hand lately.

ok ok you’re making me laugh out loud now! my mood has been lightened

HRC and no one else in Congress did jackshit to protect Bennie given that we’ve invested I don’t know how many billions over 5 in Pakistan, and Mushariff did little to protect her.

Bhutto Blames Mushariff

take the last right when you get to Seattle. Stay on the same road for 1,600 miles until it almost disappears. Can’t miss the place.

I’m waiting for the name of Vince Foster to be used any day now in relation to this assassination. Maybe even Buddy the Labrador who died as a result of an “accident.”

Bhutto benefitted from the Bush Administration’s support in what is becomming a typical fashion.
(Most of their ‘friends’ just get killed in the polls)

Has anyone seen Socks lately?

The last thing Bush would want is more light shinning on Musharif cause of the 5 billion freaking dollars sent to Musharif that went to fortify Pakistan’s hostility towards India. With Bhutto gone this topic will come up more often.

Can I bring anything?

That makes no sense.

The elephant in the room is Pakistan’s nukes.

EPU’d from downstairs:

I asked if maybe Mrs. Bhutto had mis-spoken in that David Frost clip and that in the context of that segment she had meant to say Daniel Pearl or some other murder/terror victim. I then wiki’d Daniel Pearl and he was killed by one Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh.

No, the elephant in the room are the god damned republicans.

Will anyone think of the mangoes?!?

The reality is that perhaps 700,000 Muslim women have died since 2002 in the climates of fear, over-reaction, instability, pent-up-hatred-release, superstition and plain old human meanness unleashed by George W. Bush, Dick Cheney and their neo-conservative friendly travellers. In several countries. Benazir Bhutto may have been the last prominent female Muslim politician we’ll seen for some time.

I’m packing for Iowa. It’s 25 degrees there. I’m afraid I’m gonna freeze my ass off.

A problem of mine.
What I meant to say is that Bhutto was put forward by Rice/Bush.
But we don’t seem to cover our ‘allies’ very well.
Most get defeated in elections.
But, as I saw somewhere earlier today “Politics in Pakistan is a contact sport”

The elephant in the room is Pakistan’s nukes.

And many more Soviet nukes that were let loose years ago.

I wonder where they are?

Think layers Jane.

I’m packing for Iowa.

Dress warmly, and we can’t wait to read your dispatches from caucus country.

Times like this I put partisanship aside. I’ll get behind a republican President in a time like this. If he’s not an incompetent fool. Not too much to ask, is it? It really is sad when you look to the WH just for assurance that its occupant knows what the fuck is going on and is on top of things and you aren’t satisfied, as i wasn’t today.

Jane, I assume they have heat there, yes? And bring lots of clothing.

are you ever?

Get some silk longjohns. Very warm, but not bulky under your clothes.

So we add the 700000 muslim women to the number of people who have died in Iraq and add the number of Americans who have died from lack of health insurance (my estimate is almost a million in seven years)and we get a number close to 3 million bodies.

We hope.

You’ve been without heat for a few days, no? Didn’t that get you prepped?
Have fun in the middle of America. Give ‘em hell.

Can I bring anything?

Your plans for how we can rebuild the Democratic Party up here. They’ve been out of power since before my daughter, who’s a senior in college, was born. We’ve got more GOP corruption gushers going to erupt next week, and the Dems have just plain forgotten how to attract new people to their Party.

And better mangos. The ones in Alaska right now really, really suck!

Damn Jane, caucus or not don’t go! I grew up there, just watch it on tv. If you must go, go to Iowa City and watch it on tv with EvilDrPuma!

What I meant to say is that Bhutto was put forward by Rice/Bush.
But we don’t seem to cover our ‘allies’ very well.

Ah… got it. Yes, I would agree with massive incompetence on Bush’s part. And Condi too. This big stinking turd was delivered to her desk and she’ll never live it down.

I tried today at Eddie Bauer but they were all out of my size.

They were very pretty, though.

Follow team Rudy.. They are thin-skinned and will know all the warm haunts.

I had poodles, though. I’ll be poodle-less in Iowa.

Get some silk longjohns. Very warm, but not bulky under your clothes.

It’s only 25 degrees here in Minn. It’s practically balmy out.

Pretty is as pretty does, those puppies are w. a. r. m. Is there a Cabela’s where you are?

No doubt you can say that again. Mrs. Bhutto was killed by a religious extremist obviously. Her election was a threat to their goals. This was not a neocan plot either. Destabilising a Nuclear armed power does not work in the interests of any nation that I know of. And cranking up hostilities is not a CIA play. They want the Wiristan provinces held in check and Bhutto would have been the likliest Pakistani leader to do so. That aside it was a real assinine article and way way over the top or should I say bottom of journalistic whackiness.

It’s almost down to tea-drinking weather here in Texas. Actually they had snow in the pandhandle today.

Hi, everyone!

Shit like this really turns me off about Obama.

Silk long-johns are manna from heaven.

Haven’t seen one.

delurking to advise Jane to get a nice wool beret … if your head is warm, the rest of you stays warmer. It’s thrilling to have Jane so close to Minnesota!

According to DHinMI at DKos it is the Pakistani military who stand to gain the most. And he believe that Mushariff won’t hold onto power very long.

Wanna stay warm in Iowa? Shop for Carhart in an Iowa feed store and or wear your best wind-breaking attire. I lived in Omaha for almost 6 years.

Wanna stay warm in Iowa?

Don’t go in the winter!

Carhart insullated cover-alls and matching barn jacket and you will fit right in. Hell, they won’t even realize you are a former Hollywood foullmouthedfemblogger type.

Lemme see. ‘member I gave your C-SPAN appearance 2 mugs? Can we measure temps in poodles? How many poodles is 25 degrees?

Good observation….anyone for an Impeachment yet?

Carharts? LOL, not the most flattering overalls. Make you look like a grease monkey.

bwahahahaaa! it’s the reason a lot of minnesotans (& other upper midwest types) turn into snowbirds in the winter (i.e., migrate south for the winter)

I have a pair.. no grease and they fit over cashmere sweaters perfectly. *s*

Also, pratice saying this:

“You ah… ya been farmin’ long?”

There is nothing figure-flattering about any overalls, but if she shows up in a pair she might get to milk a cow ;0)

BFL-I beleive 25 degrees is at least a 2 dog night.

Anything in turtle fur, especially a neck gaitor.

http://www.rei.com/product/663041

Turtle fur is recycled plastic. It’s softer than wool, just as warm, and washable. Comes in every color under the sun. Neck gaitor is single most important item in skiing (well, after gloves). More important than hat because, contrary to old wives tale about head, it’s your core you want to keep warm. Neck gaitor prevents core heat from escaping out the top.

Silk not bad, I use cotten for evryday and lycra if it cols and wet. Thanks Nrs. Hamsher, for rescuing your site just now! It perked right up.

I’ve heard that in stores gthey call bags “sacks”. Like, if you biuy one item, they’ll ask you if you want a sack. Can anybody confirm this?

Condi’s a hack.
But you can bounce a quarter across the room off her butt.
And that’s important in this administration.

Ok.

Love those snowbirds….. we are sitting outside the restaurant waiting for your table…. one group in shorts and T-shirts and me sitting in my polar fleece coat and freezing my ass off….

It kind of like Oregon jokes….. you don’t tan, you just rust…
snowbirds are the only idiots swimming in the hotel pool between October and May…

I’d like to see that.

No, I can’t. Maybe it varies but here in Minn you “bag” your groceries. Maybe in some cases you’d call a bag a sack. Not many and I don’t think it matters.

I would like to see less of Ms Rice myself

Is it not plausible that the Bush Crime Family had something to do with Bhutto’s killing? “Officials” tell us Condi and friends were supporting Bhutto’s return, but these are the same people that we know without a doubt lied our country and military into the Iraq Invasion, killing hundreds of thousands of mostly innocent bystanders. Is it a conspiracy theory to explore the idea that John Negroponte, with a history of training “death squads” and recently requested a demotion and visited Pakistan, might’ve been involved?

General Butler testified in front of Congress about a plot to overthrow FDR, and one of the alleged conspirators was Prescott Bush, Shrub’s grandpappy. Congress concluded the claims had merit, but never took action. Sound familiar?

It doesn’t seem like a stretch to me to suggest that there might have been some nefarious plans by the Bush Crime Family in place to kill Bhutto. These same people, and in the Booshes case the same family, are never put away and financially disabled enough to stop them from doing this shit. People just want to look the other way or “put our national nightmare behind us.” We must stop the Killers once and for all!

It’s not like people have been suggesting aliens from Mars scooped Bhutto up or that Hillary Clinton killed her or something….oh wait.

Watching Nightline… “If there is a central front on terrorism right now, it may very well be Pakistan.”

No, it doesn’t matter. But I’m getting a little tired of people goofing on how I talk. Any tidbits of goofy speech from elsewhere, I’d just file away. And one of my tormentors is from Iowa.

Jane – I Digg your post, but the real question is: “Do the poodles have teleconference priviliges while you’re gone?”

Newsflash, eh?

Cashmere scarf or plain old cotton t-necks do the job for me. About the rest you are most correct, although a beret on top can look pretty dashing:)

CNN, racing with Faux to see who can get to the sewer first. Pathetic.

Very Punaisey

Unless you put your shoes ‘up’ on the closet floor, you have nothing to be ashamed of.

Sleepytime here in IL-5
Nightall

BFL, they are sacks in the midwest and also in texas.

sleep well mack.

Is it not plausible that the Bush Crime Family had something to do with Bhutto’s killing?

Everything is plausible. Just how likely is another matter.

Is it a conspiracy theory to explore the idea that John Negroponte, with a history of training “death squads” and recently requested a demotion and visited Pakistan, might’ve been involved?

Yes, it is a conspiracy theory. Is it something that we’ll ever really know for sure? Probably not.

It doesn’t seem like a stretch to me to suggest that there might have been some nefarious plans by the Bush Crime Family in place to kill Bhutto.

Doesn’t seem like a stretch to me either. But in the absence of any real evidence I try not to go around leaping to wild conclusions. That’s just me.

I live in the capital of “people who talk funny”. They have funny accents, they use funny words for things that no one else does, they have funny pronunciations for words that no one else uses. And they all think that everyone else is weird.

Jane,

Here’s an outfit that might do for the cold – Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin

I,m originally from Iowa and when I moved to Co I kept getting corrected about going up(north) and down(south). Here down to T-ride is up and up to Grand Jct. is down. Elevation!

It’s not a bag unless it fastens, snaps, or has a zipper.

I guess there’s a buncha people who wanted her out of the way. I’m not so much into that stuff as figurin’ out how to keep that corner of the globe from blowin’ up – short term and long – and gebnerally just tryin’ to figger out what’s next.

Now there’s someone who knows how to keep warm, and looks spiffy doing it! Wonder how often her glasses freeze up.

central front on terrorism

More right-wing water-carrying.

This is the sinister beauty of the right-wing linguistic assault. You don’t even need a sentence or a proposition or an assertion; all you need is a fucking phrase that plugs in to the reptilian brain.

I mean what could play any better than that short pithy deceptive evil phrase: “central front of terror”. It furthers entire books full of anti-democratic corporatist war-mongering imperialist agenda in just four words.

These fucking mainstream media propaganda outlets are really pissing me off. They are complicit in all the shit we are wallowing in.

The mall in Iowa City(Coralville)has a Eddie Bauer, and a Scheels sporting goods store. They will still have warm clothes because it hasn’t stopped snowing long enough for anyone to go shopping. I am sure Des Moines does too. Those little toe warmmer things work very well for sledding.

You live in Staten Island?

I bet Nightline won’t show this:
LINK

It’s an interview of Bhutto by David Frost on Nov. 2nd. The good part is 6 minutes in. Bhutto is talking about someone who may be out to kill her. She said “he’s had relations with Omar Sheik, who murdered Osama Bin Laden.”

I think Omar Sheik is OSM, the guy we arrested in Pakistan and waterboarded.

I’m not convinced Pervez will lose control of the country. What evidence is there for this? He’s been beating back public opposition ever since he forced his way into power, and I suspect he’ll be able to handle the current uprisings.

Plus, he has virtually unlimited support from US, so his chances are pretty good.

If this is all true, taking out Bhutto is very much in the interest of Pervez, since Bhutto might have won the election, and for the Booshes since more unrest means more chaos in the region leading to more profits for the M-I Complex. And through it all, Pervez maintains control of the nukes, just as he has the last 8 years.

Imagine Bhutto winning the election. Do you think she would’ve just continued to be the Neocons lapdog? I don’t, in fact I think she may exposed a lot of the bullshit that’s been going on. They couldn’t have any of that.

Apparently Biden is also attacking “other candidates” for being naive about their responses about the assassination. In particular he targets Richardson for suggesting that Musharraf should “step down” and turn over the running of the election to a “coalition government” (perhaps he meant “caretaker government”). Then Biden also has suggested that he is better suited to handling the complicated situation in Pakistan than the “the other candidates” because he’s the most experienced candidate in terms of longevity.

Yeah, so why not switch Parties and vote for McCain?

And look at what 7 years of experience in the White House has gotten us! Now that’s actual hands on experience in screwing things up!

“I do think that it would be a victory for no one but the extremists responsible for this attack to have some kind of postponement or a delay directly related to it in the democratic process,” State Department spokesman Tom Casey said.

Sh*T! You have the principal candidate of one of the opposition parties assassinated, and the other Party (Nazwar Sharif’s) that is going to boycott the elections ~ there are widespread riots, and a phony Supreme Court~ and the Bush Administration is saying “This is Democracy! Go on with the elections scheduled for two weeks!” Yeah…I’ll put down money on who will gain the most votes!

I don’t think that the PPP (Pakistan People’s Party of Bhutto) will be able to find and publicize a replacement candidate (as her party was essentially one centered on Bhutto’s personality) in two weeks! And Sharif’s party is not going to participate until (somebody should tell Biden this)…Musharraf steps down!

And certainly Biden is wrong to suggest that there won’t likely BE a coalition…any sort of linkage between the PPP and Musharraf is now certainly dead (although that’s what Condi was hoping for). Instead Sharif and the PPP will likely form some sort of consensus. That seems natural. The war of personalities (between Bhutto and Sharif is now ended…through circumstances out of their control.

Biden doesn’t offer much in the way of a solution. Does he think that he would, as President, throw our lot in with Musharraf? Where is his “foreign policy experience” showing other than to say “It’s complicated?” That’s not much more than what any of the other candidates have said.

I think that these candidates should just shut up for a day or two and consult, not with Musharraf, but with the leadership of the opposition Parties. THAT’s where they will learn whether they should support a delay in the elections and whether they support a caretaker government being established in the current situation.

And these assertions that “I’m more experienced” are just a load of crap.

Here’s another! “Musharaff calls Edwards? Ergo Musharraf considers Edwards advice important to Pakistan.”

The fact that Edwards was called by Musharraf is to me a NEGATIVE! Why his campaign is putting out that this meme indicates that this talk with Musharraf makes him a better candidate is beyond me? Is his campaign so out-of-touch with what’s going on in Pakistan that they don’t know that Musharraf is the cause of most of the problems in Pakistan. Why they think that his call to get (or offer) advice from Edwards is some sort of good thing seems to indicate that he’s on the wrong side of the fence on this? Why would they want to imply that Edwards is a “good buddy” of Musharraf is a case of terrible image management?

Now I don’t know why Musharaff bothered to call Edwards. I don’t know what was said between them. I don’t know if Musharraf called Obama, Clinton, Biden, Richardson, Dodd, or Kucinich? Maybe he gave them each a one minute call? But when a campaign tries to imply that this tragedy is a plus for their campaign it is simply repulsive.

This is a time for sending condolences to Bhutto’s family, supporters and Party. It’s a time where one should express support of her higher ambitions for the people of Pakistan. It’s a moment where these candidates should really sit down and think. Are they so pathetically obsessed with winning these primaries that they are using the “nuclear option” on each other…willing to destroy any others chances at winning by demonizing each other. I see it with the candidates, and I see it with their supporters.

Frankly it’s one of the things that pops up so consistently that makes me seriously consider dropping visiting FDL. The inflated differences that are asserted to presumably exist between most of these candidates, the animosity that is demonstrated towards them in an effort to “threaten” others to vote for their favored guy (sort of like “If you don’t make me quarterback I’m walking off the team, then you’ll have to play with 10 players…nah, nah ,nah!”). When you actually sit down and parse the Democratic candidates stands on how they would deal with issues there is not a smidgen of difference between the top three (or the next two). And none of those “differences” are so essential that they likely wouldn’t be modified when it came down to actual implementation of the policy once elected.

I guess there’s a buncha people who wanted her out of the way. I’m not so much into that stuff as figurin’ out how to keep that corner of the globe from blowin’ up

I think it’s going to blowup now. That ship has sailed.

I dunno. To the extent there has been a real war on terrorism, seems to me like Pakistan’s as important as anyplace else. But whether that’s right or wrong, I think one thing we can agree on is that it didn’t today all of a sudden beceome the central front.

Yeah. Where you talkin’ about?

Then what?

No, New Orleans.

musharraf will remain in power as long as he follows bushco orders… the minute he tries to act indy – bye-bye mushy for real

Freeze warning in Phoenix… temps down to 26 degrees at my house tonight.

Phoenix has around 8,000 homeless people and only around 4,000 shelter beds. Our local 1480 Progressive Radio station is doing a blanket driver for the homeless.

Oh. I like how people talk in NO much better than SI.

I don’t thionk I can say i know how they talk in NO, but Staten Island is pretty harsh. The town where I lived was invaded by SI people and you could pick them out pretty easy.

OT,
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12…..ref=slogin

NY Times investigative report on Rudy’s work for Purdue for OxyContin, including, yes,ladies and gentleman, that old familiar move of ….calling the USA in charge of the case…And to no avail, it did the company no good. Three execs pleaded guilty…More sadly, it cost one courageous HR member his seat.

But Rudy is now worth 30 million as a result. May not hurt him as much as Sex on the City or rooting for the Red Sox, but it does chip away at his claims of lobbying only for the greater good.And if Christy is here, maybe she can help here. Isn’t the South the region hardest hit by Oxy-related addiction and crime? Someone has got to care in the region.

On this day funeral, I thought learning of Rudy’s sins actuarial might cheer us up.

And with that, the BlueState bids you all good night.

Good night, BlueState. Thanks for the link.

Sub prime housing crisis will grow that number as rentals skyrocket. Wish all well and hope for an Impeachment so we get a national safety net from the dems.

me, too dawlin.

Then what?

It seems as if Pakistan is following the Iran model. Bad, very bad.

I like it too, it’s just odd. It’s the only place where subtitles are used if the person is interviewed on TV. My kids favorite show is Dirty jobs. They did a bit with a crawfish trapper and they had to use subtitles for everything the guy said because his accent was so strong.

That’s impressive that they can mobilize people to do good like that. Are the wingnut radio stations doing anything to help?

They use little teeny tiny traps.

I have a friend from Pakistan who owns a bodega nearby, and travels to his native home twice a year. He says that although Bhutto was right in that Pervez turned a blind eye to her lack of protection, the assassination was likely carried out by folks allied with the Taliban who resented her western education and influences.

Then he asked me, “Who killed JFK?” and I said.

“We all did.”

That guy does some nasty, nasty jobs. Pretty easy on the eyes though. hmmmm…

Very bad indeed. Least we won’t have to listen to Fucktard lie to us about them wanting to get nukes.

707! And they have to go around and empty each and every one of them, one crawfish at a time.

Back for a sec, re: Bhutto. Harvard/Radcliffe classmates of hers are emailing anecdotes to each other. I’ll find out if I can get one of them to share.

You two crack me up!

Time to hit da hay Night all. Sad day. We’ll see what tomorrow brings. I could deal with there beinbga GOP prez now. Just as long as he wasn’t such head of shit as we have now. Hard to be very hopeful tonight. At least in the short term.

Mike Rowe is teh hot, plus he’s funny and can sing! The jobs are gross, but it is little boy heaven.

Politically, Two People Were Killed Today

Thus, Musharraf, while no friend of democracy, may very well be right that this assassination was committed by Muslim extremists. But this is not terrorism in the sense of 9-11-type attacks on the US. Instead, this is political and religious in the context of trying to bring down the secular government of Pakistan, and the horrible image of the US is helping inspire those who may have killed Bhutto and who have also been trying to kill Musharraf.

The US had been pushing Musharraf to accept a power-sharing arrangement with Bhutto. He appears to have initially resisted, eventually gave in, but the deal finally fell apart. But whatever the next step was going to be, from the US perspective, it pretty much had to involve Bhutto, who was the only Pakistani politician with enough popular support to sufficiently legitimize the US-backed policy of taking on the Muslim extremists.

TOWA see my 35.

Of course the wingnut radio…. even JD Hayworth drive time show does not help the homeless.

1480 Progressive Radio who wants to interview our very own Hugh about his list has been providing services for the Phoenix homeless for a year. They started when they found out that the city only had ONE distribution center for water for the homeless. We do not have drinking fountains that are found in other cities. So we had a water drive for cases of water bottles to drop off, hats, sun screen and personal care items.

We just finished a drive for gift cards from Home Depot for the 100 homes in 100 days drive for Jackson County Miss. Home Depot matched any donation up to $3,000.

I like his reactions when they explain to him what he has to do. And the guys that usually do the job just love having a new guy they can torment.

Yeah, you right.

He is quite willing to make a complete ass of himself every episode. It makes for entertaining tv, for true!

OMG, marymc, he’s one of us!

I’m in Staten Island, but I’m originally fum Brooklyn. Ask Jane, I doan tawk funny. Subtimes I repeat myself, but only when I’m on da phone.
I’m suhprised at youse guys pickin on sumbodys accent. Get a grip. ;-)

Maybe, but it’s a little hard to mix up Daniel Pearl with Osama Bin Laden.

That headline would shame the editors of National Enquirer. WTF has happened to CNN?

Please, no more idiocy about Bush administration involvement in this assassination.

Bush/Cheney were heavily invested in engineering at least the illusion of a pluralistic horse race in Pakistan. This killing blocks that aim. As evil as our leader are, they gain nothing from a less stable Pakistan.

I’ve never heard anywhere that OBL has been murdered. Suspicions of him dying of kidney failure yes, but never murdered.

“leaders,” plural. My kingdom for an Edit button!

It’s an interview of Bhutto by David Frost on Nov. 2nd. The good part is 6 minutes in. Bhutto is talking about someone who may be out to kill her. She said “he’s had relations with Omar Sheik, who murdered Osama Bin Laden.”

I think Omar Sheik is OSM, the guy we arrested in Pakistan and waterboarded.

She said that…but I think she must’ve misstated something there about murdering OBL. Maybe she meant he was associated with the murderer OBL?

Odd that Frost didn’t follow up on that claim. OBL murdered? That would be big NEWS! Even Bhutto didn’t bat an eye at passing on this information. I suspect that she meant something else.

And I seriously doubt that Omar Sheikh is Khalid Sheikh Mohammed. He used lots of aliases, but Omar wasn’t in any of them. Sheikh is a common “name” and title in the Muslim world. It’s simply a name given to someone who claims descent from Muhammed. Omar is a given name, and is pretty common as well. As well, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was detained in March 2003. He couldn’t have been involved in the attempted assassination unless he planned it years ago, even while Bhutto was in London.

As evil as our leader are, they gain nothing from a less stable Pakistan.

Just as they’ve gained nothing from a less stable Iraq and Afghanistan.

Nah. I looked it up.

But I have been to New Orleans many times. I never have any trouble understanding what anyone’s saying. Maybe that’s because I’m from New Jersey. Y’no’m’sayin’?

Good job. But the private sector has never handled it like FDR we need a real safety net for our whole country. Not FEMA there are good programs that need fundingand good people working tirelessly in them.
Frankly boys and girls I am sick of all the bullshit politics.
Get down to the basics… we need a new admistraion now nor next year. We have crime in top levels of government. The pverty gap is growing very fast. We need a government for the PEOPLE and I am shouting. Impeach screrw the dog and pony show in Iowa.

And if he was murdered someone surely would have collected

Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh. and he surely would have collected that $50M reward and the Bush would have sung his high praises.

Man did I garbble that one.

I have always though the accent is a Brooklyn/Southern cross. When I say that to the natives they look at me as though I’ve gone round the twist.

She and Ms. Bhutto where ‘…just friends…’

ok kids… I am heading to bed…. nite all

And ‘Disaster Capitalism’ is about what now?

There is no substance to thius thread it is gossip. Oh well I have had high hopes but this is really pathetic.

Axelrod’s response was not just offensive, it was stupid!
We don’t know yet who killed Bhutto or why. People with good judgment would not try to assign blame before knowing the facts.
Of course, people with good judgment would not hire David Axelrod to speak for them.

Who you callin’ ‘we’ pal….

And I thought The Hill killed that Foster dude. Shouldn’t she be in the slammer?

sleep well katymine.

GIGO pal!

nite katymine

That is possibly the most assinine thing CNN has done, and that is really saying something.

Going digging for my warm stuff… gee 26 tonight… IT is f**king Phoenix… the weather guy talked about putting the diapers on their landscaping to prevent frost damage…. my landscaping rule, if it dies from frost I have a nice funeral.

Gee, what does Pakistan have that Iraq was many years away — and Afghanistan easily a century — from obtaining? Something small, pointy and, when triggered, hotter than the sun? Something that nullifies the temptations of Shock Doctrine economics? Come on, coooommme on…what am I thinking of?

I don’t understand the reluctance to even think about possible meddling by the War Pigs. When the “proof” offered in defense of the official stories revolves around statements from the Bush-Cheney controlled State Dept, led by Rice and Negroponte, I don’t buy it.

I do know the history has a tendency to repeat itself.

In 1917 there were people warning against the War profiteers instigating conflicts in order to increase profits, most notably Senator and Presidential candidate “Fighting” Bob LaFollette and his wife Belle Case. General Butler testified to Congress and wrote books about this, warning the public to not let them start World War II, and he even blew the whistle on a plot by Big Money, including Shrub’s grandpa, to overthrow FDR. In his farewell speech to the nation, General Eisenhower chooses to warn about the dangers of war profiteering. And it goes on and on.

Now all these people were chastised by the media for doing this. I guess they were all conspiracy theorists.

Oh wait, but they were right. Will we ever learn?

She is however very ‘experienced’!

katymine that is my rule of thumb as well. the first year, i brought all the herbs and plants into the house and had ants for weeks. now they all stay outside.

You seem to be saying CNN is coarsening our political discoutse. I think you should be pointing your finger at that thuggish douchebag David Axelrod from the Obama campaign. It’s his stupid statement they’re talking about on CNN.

That’s what I thought when I heard the accent for the first time. Unique.

Makes sense to me.

People in New Jersey where I grew up called everyone they encountered, “Bro”, “Chief”, “Pal”, “Pardner”, “Buddy”, “Man”, “Darlin”, “Sweetie”, “Hon(ey)”, as appropriate. These forms of address–which I use habitually even in totally inappropriate professional environments–worked very well for me in New Orleans.

I am not a linguist or folklorist, but I suspect that these forms of address arose specifically to indicate an absence of class consciousness, unlike “Sir”, “Ma’am”, “Mister”, and thus function effectively to initiate open communication among equals.

But they’re the ones talking about it in a major national forum.

True dat.

You seem to be saying CNN is coarsening our political discoutse. I think you should be pointing your finger at that thuggish douchebag David Axelrod from the Obama campaign. It’s his stupid statement they’re talking about on CNN.

Asked and answered.
Axelrod isn’t to be excused for this despicable flaming turd, but CNN has to lay claim to the most repugnant parroting of the day, week, month with this.

CNN sucks too.

silk longjohns? LL Bean and have ‘em FedExed to the hotel… you should get ‘em quick…

if not, I blame Clinton…

that’s a great idea OC (hoping Jane knows what size she wears in LLBean)

It appears that Bhutto was harsh on the Islamic militants, and Musharraf rescued them from her. So, the question of whether it was Al Qaeda or Musharraf’s forces who did her in is moot. They’re on the same team, as is the U.S.

Suz!

Ah yes, we don’t want the smoking gun to a mushroom cloud, do we?

Even if Pakistan devolves into chaos, which I don’t think is a certainty given the US support of Pervez and his ability to withstand dissent before, what would they do with the nukes? If they tried to use them, wouldn’t their country be annihilated, and wouldn’t the entire world rise up against any nuclear aggressor?

Russia is giving nuclear fuel to Iran right now. Shrub gave nuclear plans to India in exchange for mangoes. Waving the nuclear weapon boogeyman around isn’t as cut a dried as many make it out to be IMHO. I wish our Dept of Defense would actually concern itself with defending America one of these days, rather than getting involved in a giant, convoluted game of Risk.

LL Bean sizes are not strange… whatever the “regular” size is should do…

I’ve got late late nite upstairs

Some more information about Bhutto’s letter to Musharraf about who she accused of being involved within the government of plots to assassinate her.

Her staff say they were very concerned about Musharraf handing her security over to Brigadier-General Ejaz Shah. He was an ISI commander who was the “handler” of Osama bin Laden and Mullah Omar back in the days when they were mujahideen (and perhaps afterwards). He was recognized as one who helped create the Pakistani Party that supported the Taliban movement.

And when Federal police with the help of the FBI and CIA were close on the trail of Omar Sheikh, one of those involved with Daniel Pearl’s kidnapping, Sheik’s uncle (a Pakistan Court Justice) called his friend, Ejaz Shah, to allow Omar to surrender to his personal custody.

Shah is also thought to have been the figure between the trial and detention of the Chief Minister of the Supreme Court as well as the disappearance of many democracy activists.

http://www.rediff.com/news/2007/oct/19hamid.htm

http://www.prisonplanet.com/ar….._b_isi.htm

It’s now reported that although official police perimeter security initial did body checks of those entering the area to attend Bhutto’s Rawalpindi rally, they withdrew from several of the security posts towards the end of the event, allowing people to pass in unchecked.

From one of your links:

“Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto was hanged by the United States-backed General Zia ul Haq’s military regime.”

Did we see history repeat itself again today?

You overstate our ability to protect Pervez, but I take your point about how difficult it would be — even with Musharraf dead — for suicidal Taliban nutcases to wrest control of the country from the military and ISI. The nuclear fuel Russia is supplying to Iran is a non sequitur, however. The technical challenges of extracting weapons-usable material from that fuel, even if Iran withdrew from NPT tomorrow, far exceed those of secretly spinning high-grade U235 de novo from yellowcake.

Meanwhile, back on the subject of dumbass headlines, NYT is treating us to “Bhutto Assassination Ignites Disarray.” Sooo Timesian, no?

I’ve had a close personal relationship with disarray in a succession of apartments over the decades and have never once required combustion to call it into being.

Re: PhysioProf at 161 …

“Shit like this really turns me off about Obama.”

Did you read the AlterNet piece on Paul Krugman vs. Obama? Krugman is turned off by health care economics and Obama’s vocal tendency to bend over before he’s even won a single primary.

I think it was at http://tpmelectioncentral.com/…..mpaign.php

All of which fits in with the analyses: (1) Obama is attacking both Hillary and John Edwards FROM THE RIGHT; (2) Obama was a set-up by DLC and Clintonista insiders simply to bleed away progressive primary voters — who would not vote for Hillary — away from Edwards. ERGO: HRC wins.

There is something wrong with Obama’s campaign strategies.

Mz. Bhutto was doomed from the day Zia hanged her pops.

She had a run in Pakistan, and Musharef ran her out.

Then she came back, a threat to Mushie.

So what, he was gonna LET her live?

She was never a hero for the people, she was a one percenter in HER country, who lost her titles and tithings, when her father was kilt.

And as a one percenter, when she came back, she was a PURE threat to Mushit Boy, BoyKing’s Newest Poodle.

I’m sickened she’s dead. Sickened from the WAY she died. Sickened WHY she died.

But fer cryin out loud, for FDL to make fun of those who butcher her reality, is a bit too much.

Poor taste, Mz. Hamsher.

Course, if you had posted about Mz. Bhutto gender guts and leadership values for furthering the women’s gender cause, I woulda walked all over THAT, too, as Mz. Bhutto was a pure opportunist, land baron, and one percenter lookin to get revenge on the bastid who kilt her pa. And then, get her land back and her power base back, and all the while, crawling over the backs of the Pakistani People’s and taking all their money into her one percent coffers.

I can’t shed a tear for this dearly departed despot. Not ONE tear, not for ONE despot.

But I sure as shit won’t make fun of her death, either. No matter WHAT the pub’s do.

It’s a thin line, between love and hate. What a song THAT was. *G*

Oh, n BTW, here’s the real skinny on Bhutto, for the ages.

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080107/huq

I’d feel pretty confident, that’s some solid history, with facts.

Ju know, good journalism, unlike Jo Klein, or others who fail Journ 101.

N while FDL was all OVER that, it WAS Greenwald who broke it, and ran it.

Jane, nice work . . Peter B even gave you kudo’s on his show today . . . . Air America 1240AM in Sacto, CA, 5pm or so.

But it’s hard to tell the lib’s from the liars, anymore . . . . FDL, methinks ya mighta missed the story within the story, about Mz. Bhutto. Course, ya woulda hadda done the homework . . . . .

Didja?

Larue – you have an interesting measure of surety about the authors intent in this, and prior pieces here today. Me? I would take her over Musshy any day, and there is little doubting her courage.

So what is your malfunction?

The lack of knowledge among most commenters re South Asia is simply apalling if not embarrassing even for a foreigner. Bonkers @ 180 was particularly irksome with a throwaway know nothing line of “Shrub gave nuclear plans to India”. Excuse me, India did not need your dumbass plans. The country is perfectly capable of and did develop the technology on its own with knowledge and materials widely available in the public domain at least since the mid 1960s. No, it did not have Soviet nukes. India Soviet relations have been very cool since the latter walked into Afghanistan. All this is beside the point. That nuclear pact has been killed by the left in the Indian Parliament. Yes, some brown people are smart, creative thinkers, independent and don’t respect the USA. For those of you really hung up on non issues, don’t eat Indian mangoes but do stop snivelling and learn some respect as well history – won’t harm you, may indeed come in handy.

One of the great things about FDL is how much you can learn from the posts of course, but also in the comments. In fact, I learned earlier today that English is one of two official languages of Pakistan.

Your condescension however I could do without.

Yes, I know that India has had nuclear capabilities for a long time, and this was a major reason Bennie Bhutto’s dad developed Pakistan’s nuclear program in the early 1970s.

Considering I’ve spent a good deal of time in India and other SE Asian countries working directly with locals, not as a tourist, I don’t really need you to explain that “brown people” are smart and have a variety of opinions.

The mango deal was brought up to illustrate a point I had been making over and over again, which was ignored in your comment, that all this constant deal-making and tit-for-tat around the world may not be in America’s best interest, and may in fact be done solely to benefit powerful business interests which has been going on for years and years now. They always claim it’s to promote “democracy” around the world, and we all know this is not the case. The Mango Deal was worrisome on a number of fronts. More background here:

http://nuclearmangos.blogspot……angos.html

Now your point about the Indian Parliament killing the Mango Deal is interesting, and I’ll check that out when I get a moment.

Sorry if I’m not a scholar about SE Asian politics and history. Funny thing though…there’s almost always a great deal of disagreement even among scholars. They communicate their differences, offer proof to back-up claims, and get closer to some sort of semblance of “truth.” For the most part, they don’t tell people to “stop snivelling and learn some respect as well history – won’t harm you, may indeed come in handy.”

Hope this helps.

Bonkers – you mistake my genuine rejection of bigotry as condescension. Despite all your work in India, you remain confused about South and South East Asia. The real condescension is in the term ‘the Mango deal’. Who is forcing mangoes on you? And for all your knowledge base, you are not very well informed about decisions by the Indian Parliament. The Congress is in an alliance with the Left and the Left will not agree to letting the USA in and that is that. The Congress cannot win a Federal majority on its own. It needs the Left parties so another election before the 2009 ones occur when the current Federal Parliament’s term expires will not change the picture.

It is very US amertican hangup to excuse Pakistan’s nuclear arsenal as a response to Indian investment in the field. That is yet to be proven. From all my knowledge to date, the timeline is not a tit for tat but simultaneous.

Also, after the disastrous skirmish with China in 1962 and in the wake of increasing animosity from Pakistan after Indian intervention in then East Pakistan but since Bangladesh, India sought actively to develop nuclear capability. If US Americans are troubled by that, that is hypocritical in the extreme, coming from not only the most heavily armed nuclear country but the only one guilty of unleashing nuclear horror on people – you know, human beings.

You do not have to like my caustic comments re the predominant US American mindset. I do not have to accept that which I find objectionable.

Jane: 25 degrees ABOVE ZERO is not that cold. Wear mittens and socks in layers. When not needed for other things, cover your nose and mouth.
Drink hot cider.

She should instigate a massive lawsuit against CNN.

“Who is forcing mangoes on you?”

I’m quite certain no one has ever asked me that question before. It does illustrate that we’ve had a failure to communicate. I thought I’ve been making myself pretty clear in that I feel the US should not involve themselves so much in other countries affairs, and when they do, it’s usually to benefit powerful US business interests, and not really about “spreading democracy.” Maybe I could’ve said things better, or perhaps you’re rushing to judgement without first understanding what I was saying. Your hang-up on the Mango Deal is a case in point, since any condescension in that has obviously been directed toward Boosh’s (in)ability to negotiate deals. That’s why I provided a link.

“you are not very well informed about decisions by the Indian Parliament.”

Guilty as charged. Next time my wife and kids want to go to the park, I”ll stay home and study up on India’s Parliament. I’ll have a report for you the next time we meet.

“I do not have to accept that which I find objectionable.”

Right on! Although again, you might want to make sure you comprehend what’s being said before objecting to it. I wish the US would spend more time taking care of it’s own problems before meddling in the problems of other countries. Our foreign policy should be more about humanitarian aid throughout the world, rather than blowing things up and killing thousands. As far as stopping terrorists and dictators, I think the “killing them with kindness” approach would have great benefit to the US, and the world’s people.

I do not think these opinions represent “bigotry.”