Comments on: Democratic Consultants: Paid to Lose http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/ Firedoglake weblog Fri, 27 Nov 2009 00:51:28 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: MarkH http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1165985 MarkH Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:10:08 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1165985 <blockquote><p>i just think nader hatred is sometimes a scapegoat for a dem failure of the ’90s - both policy failure and failure to defend the right of the people to choose their own president.</p></blockquote> <p>Dems didn’t fail in the ’90s. We didn’t succeed with sparklers and bells and dancing girls, but we didn’t fail either.</p> <p>Where we failed in Nader’s eyes was in being too far to his Right. That his ego demands that an entire nation move his direction is a problem he should work on.</p> <p>Still, there should easily be room in this big tent party for Nader and his supporters. That the Clintons, Gore’s and Kerry’s didn’t find a way to accomodate him has been a problem for all of us.</p> <p>We need to hold our Left Wing together with the party, not just in words, but with actions. We also need to reach out to some Right-Leaning-Reagan-Dems who have become disgusted with the Conservative Bush Republicans and might like to lean the other direction for a while and we might even find common cause with some Libertarian types to give their interests voice and to help us win more Western states. It’s a stretch, but I think it’s possible.</p>

i just think nader hatred is sometimes a scapegoat for a dem failure of the ’90s – both policy failure and failure to defend the right of the people to choose their own president.

Dems didn’t fail in the ’90s. We didn’t succeed with sparklers and bells and dancing girls, but we didn’t fail either.

Where we failed in Nader’s eyes was in being too far to his Right. That his ego demands that an entire nation move his direction is a problem he should work on.

Still, there should easily be room in this big tent party for Nader and his supporters. That the Clintons, Gore’s and Kerry’s didn’t find a way to accomodate him has been a problem for all of us.

We need to hold our Left Wing together with the party, not just in words, but with actions. We also need to reach out to some Right-Leaning-Reagan-Dems who have become disgusted with the Conservative Bush Republicans and might like to lean the other direction for a while and we might even find common cause with some Libertarian types to give their interests voice and to help us win more Western states. It’s a stretch, but I think it’s possible.

]]> By: MarkH http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1165980 MarkH Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:05:06 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1165980 <blockquote> <blockquote><p> isn’t it possible that the problem wasn’t nader - but instead was that people had reason to support him? </p></blockquote> <p>Be that as it may. It got us 8 years of shit. </p></blockquote> <p>It would have been better to have him in the tent pissing out, rather than outside the tent pissing in.</p>

isn’t it possible that the problem wasn’t nader – but instead was that people had reason to support him?

Be that as it may. It got us 8 years of shit.

It would have been better to have him in the tent pissing out, rather than outside the tent pissing in.

]]> By: PetePierce http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1165288 PetePierce Wed, 26 Dec 2007 07:01:12 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1165288 <p><strong><a href="http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/09/22/telecom_immunity/index.html" rel="nofollow">Glenn Greenwald: Former Clinton officials lobby for amnesty for FISA lawbreaking</a></strong></p> Glenn Greenwald: Former Clinton officials lobby for amnesty for FISA lawbreaking

]]> By: selise http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164902 selise Wed, 26 Dec 2007 01:08:55 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164902 <p>CTuttle and family - hoping everything will be ok and sending positive thoughts to you and yours.</p> CTuttle and family – hoping everything will be ok and sending positive thoughts to you and yours.

]]> By: fishbane http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164888 fishbane Wed, 26 Dec 2007 00:51:42 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164888 <p>Hope your kid is OK…. Be well.</p> Hope your kid is OK…. Be well.

]]> By: CTuttle http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164862 CTuttle Wed, 26 Dec 2007 00:31:42 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164862 <p>Mahalo, Selise, you’re always so succinct! Right now, my wife and son are at the ER, my son had a Grand Mal seizure… I have to hold the fort down… 8-(</p> Mahalo, Selise, you’re always so succinct! Right now, my wife and son are at the ER, my son had a Grand Mal seizure… I have to hold the fort down… 8-(

]]> By: ThingsComeUndone http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164860 ThingsComeUndone Wed, 26 Dec 2007 00:28:56 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164860 <p>Yes a Lefty “Shock Doctrine” we can use this concept to push back against Bush going to far and giving the more radical elements of the 70%ers even more creditability with voters. After all we have been right and Bush has been wrong about almost everything for years.<br /> If Bush does not start backing down will the 70% be 80% by the end of his term? Plus as more people become Lefties then it stands to reason that more people will go EXTREME Left. After all in every circle there are always some people who have to be the coolest, most fashionable, toughest, most EXTREME LEFT than anyone else.<br /> Just what will an EXTREME Lefty look like? Heck I’m not sure I’m even comfortable with the idea. But the Bushies should be terrified of FDR style government coming back with an 80% approval rating and a government that works.</p> Yes a Lefty “Shock Doctrine” we can use this concept to push back against Bush going to far and giving the more radical elements of the 70%ers even more creditability with voters. After all we have been right and Bush has been wrong about almost everything for years.
If Bush does not start backing down will the 70% be 80% by the end of his term? Plus as more people become Lefties then it stands to reason that more people will go EXTREME Left. After all in every circle there are always some people who have to be the coolest, most fashionable, toughest, most EXTREME LEFT than anyone else.
Just what will an EXTREME Lefty look like? Heck I’m not sure I’m even comfortable with the idea. But the Bushies should be terrified of FDR style government coming back with an 80% approval rating and a government that works.

]]> By: selise http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164857 selise Wed, 26 Dec 2007 00:24:52 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164857 <p>how then do you explain the unwillingness of the vast majority of the dems to tell us the truth?</p> <p>how then do you explain who the dems alone choose as their congressional leadership?</p> <p>the only explanation i can come up with that explains both these features is that the majority of dems in congress are complicit and the minority do not have an abundance of courage.</p> <p>i agree that primaries are required. i just don’t see them as sufficient, so long as the vast majority of $$ is not going to go to our political allies. imo, the other critical thing we must do is to pull back the curtain from the political theater our dem senators and representatives are engaging in. they have been pretending to support us while fucking us over - and if we don’t expose that it will continue because we won’t be able to tell our allies from our enemies.</p> how then do you explain the unwillingness of the vast majority of the dems to tell us the truth?

how then do you explain who the dems alone choose as their congressional leadership?

the only explanation i can come up with that explains both these features is that the majority of dems in congress are complicit and the minority do not have an abundance of courage.

i agree that primaries are required. i just don’t see them as sufficient, so long as the vast majority of $$ is not going to go to our political allies. imo, the other critical thing we must do is to pull back the curtain from the political theater our dem senators and representatives are engaging in. they have been pretending to support us while fucking us over – and if we don’t expose that it will continue because we won’t be able to tell our allies from our enemies.

]]> By: CTuttle http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164850 CTuttle Wed, 26 Dec 2007 00:18:24 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164850 <p>I would concur with that assessment, both of Hawai’i’s house critters are members of the Cong. Progressive Caucus… *g*</p> I would concur with that assessment, both of Hawai’i’s house critters are members of the Cong. Progressive Caucus… *g*

]]> By: ThingsComeUndone http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164847 ThingsComeUndone Wed, 26 Dec 2007 00:13:03 +0000 http://firedoglake.com/2007/12/25/democratic-consultants-paid-to-lose/#comment-1164847 <p>You don’t have to pro or con a disaster. Every few years there is a flood down river where I used to live. If you insist on living in a flood zone or a country run by a Want to Be Fascist then you can expect problems of a certain nature and prepare for them.<br /> Prepare for the worst and then be relieved when it doesn’t happen. But unless we can push the Dems to stop Bush, well then I have to think about the worse case scenario.</p> You don’t have to pro or con a disaster. Every few years there is a flood down river where I used to live. If you insist on living in a flood zone or a country run by a Want to Be Fascist then you can expect problems of a certain nature and prepare for them.
Prepare for the worst and then be relieved when it doesn’t happen. But unless we can push the Dems to stop Bush, well then I have to think about the worse case scenario.

]]>