A fire broke out this morning in the Eisenhower Executive Office Building (the EEOB), which sits adjacent to the WH and houses a number of key executive branch offices, including the OMB and a number of national security personnel. CNN reports that the fire may have broken out in an electrical closet adjacent to VP Cheney’s ceremonial offices and the offices of David Addington. (To our readers in the EEOB, please stay safe. Reports on CNN at this point are that the fire has been contained and may be out, but firefighters are still checking. UPDATE: Fire officially out, per CNN.)
Coincidentally, I’m sure, Addington (as Cheney’s proxy and chief right hand man) is in the news — again — this morning as one of four WH lawyers who allegedly were involved in discussions about the destruction of those CIA interrogation tapes. Via emptywheel:
And it is in that context that I’m most interested in the scoop-we-already-knew the story reports–the news that David Addington, Alberto Gonzales, John Bellinger, and Harriet Miers all participated in discussions of the torture tapes. After all, use of compartmentalization to gain legal authority for legally dubious acts has the all the hallmarks of David Addington’s work. So I think this story is as much about how these White House lawyers operated to ensure the destruction of the terror tapes as it is about who.
As to the implication that, if Gonzales and Addington were involved in the torture tapes, then so were Bush and Dick? I think this passage implies that Dick, at least, was part of the discussion.
One former senior intelligence official with direct knowledge of the matter said there had been “vigorous sentiment” among some top White House officials to destroy the tapes. The former official did not specify which White House officials took this position, but he said that some believed in 2005 that any disclosure of the tapes could have been particularly damaging after revelations a year earlier of abuses at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq.
Some other officials assert that no one at the White House advocated destroying the tapes. Those officials acknowledged, however, that no White House lawyer gave a direct order to preserve the tapes or advised that destroying them would be illegal. [my emphasis]
There are relatively few people who would merit the "top White House officials." Add in the consideration that those people would have a national security role, and you’re talking people like Condi, Scooter, Stephen Hadley. And Dick Cheney. If not Bush himself. So at least some sources are out there saying someone in the White House was actively lobbying to destroy this evidence. (Incidentally, it might be worth mentioning that Alberto Gonzales implemented the email policy that resulted in millions of lost emails, so he has a history of advocating the destruction of evidence.)
CNN has a bit more, with an angle on Alberto Gonzales as well. And the LATimes has more on the destruction of evidence in violation of a court order potential in all of this. (I can’t help wondering if that "former senior intelligence official" is John McLaughlin and/or George Tenet or a proxy thereof, and if this is part of the continuing WHIG v. CIA/Cheney v. CIA rumble, but it’s a tangential question.)
After trying for months to pin all of this on the now-departed Harriet Miers via selective leaks to Isikoff and others (Marcy has, of course, been all over this.), the "WH" today shot back at the NYTimes report, demanding a retraction. But the demand has nothing to do with whether or not the WH-connected attorneys were involved in the discussions, but merely about whether or not the WH has ever said anything publicly about it. Let’s parse Dana Perino:
“Under direction from the White House General Counsel while the Department of Justice and the CIA Inspector General conduct a preliminary inquiry, we have not publicly commented on facts relating to this issue, except to note President Bush’s immediate reaction upon being briefed on the matter,” stated White House Press Secretary Dana Perino. “Furthermore, we have not described – neither to highlight, nor to minimize — the role or deliberations of White House officials in this matter.” (emphasis mine)
So the question is still wide open as to how involved the WH may have been in pushing destruction of the tapes. Good to know. Similar story on the WH line on this from the WaPo here. Jack Balkin nutshells it for everyone:
But all this is beside the point, which is not whether the White House has been misleading in its "public" comments over the past two weeks, but whether the White House has been complicit in crimes and other wrongdoing over the past several years. And on that question, what’s most notable about today’s Press Statement is that it does not deny the substance of the Times story.
The WH shot a poorly parsed, ham-handed non-denial denial out of the box first thing in response to substantive allegations, thus making the story an even bigger one by stepping into the fray. This is all so remniscent of the Cheney press push-back strategery on Joe Wilson’s op-ed, isn’t it? Take it away, Cathie Martin:
Enters talking points, and handwritten notes of talking points.
F When and how did you create this.
M Week of July 7, meeting with VP on the Hill, we had another staff meeting, so we were in on Capitol Hill. Talked to VP about press inquiries and reports related to Wilson matter. He dictated to me what he wanted me to say.
Published on board.
Not clear who authorized travel
Did not travel at my request
Apparently unpaid
Never saw document allegedly trying to verify
He was convinced Niger could not have provided uranium to Iraq but in fact they did in 1980s 200 tons under IAEA seal
No written report
VP unaware of trip, conclusions, until Spring 03
As late as October considered judgment was that SH [Saddam Hussein] had indeed undertaken vigorous effort to acquire uranium from Africa–according to NIE.
There’s a question mark in the margin, F asks, did he dictate question mark.M I didn’t know if I could use that (#8) because it was classified.
That’s former Veep Press Secretary Cathie Martin’s testimony regarding meeting with Dick Cheney at his offices on the Hill, to take pushback dictation against the Wilson op-ed directly from Dick Cheney on what the WH response should be. Got to ask myself whether there has been similar pushback dictation from Dick Cheney on the CIA tape destruction story — especially with David Addington’s name continuing to pop right up there in the mix of players. (Martin is now a press person at the Bush WH. Cozy.)
Addington has been Cheney’s right hand and enforcer on torture policy all along, and you cannot divorce one from the other in terms of action in search of policy initiative and priority.
I remember that Martin testimony vividly, because it also included a lot of inside information on how the WH/Veep offices planted stories with the press (including the fact that Meet the Press was a good venue for them), and then vouched their own stories with surrogates calling to plant follow-up tips to reporters with whom the stories had already been seeded. And I distinctly recall the shock on the faces of a number of those reporters with whom I was sitting in the courtroom — and wondering if they were all searching back through their minds to see if they were among the duped.
Emptywheel is getting that same WH panicky ham-handed over-response vibe as well. And I’m getting the distinct gut feeling that another shoe is out there waiting to be dropped. Much more on this as I get it…




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Lordy.
The Martins are such a lovely couple, aren’t they?
Yes, I know it’s a bit convoluted, but is there some festering turd of a policy in which Dick Cheney and his minions do not have a hand? Inquiring minds and all…
Those shredders get hot when jammed.
AND as someone else earlier mentioned, there’s the New Yorker profile which had a bit about a fire at Addington’s house several years ago…
They can’t possibly be planning to say anything the courts want were destroyed in this fire. . . .
just waiting…….
Any time I say “they can’t possibly” about this crowd, the answer, inevitibly, is “yes.”
No — they were all searching back through their minds to see WHEN they were among the duped.
The wiser ones among them were also likely looking ahead: “Who am I meeting with tomorrow, and what are they going to try to plant on me?”
Zip-PahDe-Do-dah
Zip pah0-de-ay
My -Oh-My What a wonderful day Mr Blue Bird on my shoulder
“(I can’t help wondering if that “former senior intelligence official” is John McLaughlin and/or George Tenet or a proxy thereof, and if this is part of the continuing WHIG v. CIA/Cheney v. CIA rumble, but it’s a tangential question.)”
Seems as if this particular White House has its own “deep throat.”
This all reminds me of that basic rule of thumb: “Don’t fuck with the Company.”
Bush is probably safe. Most likely he was out riding his bike when any discussions occured. Cheney doesn’t like having him around because it takes too much time explaining things to him. It’s easier to just pat him on the head, tell him he’s still the Decider, and let him go ride around for a few hours.
Like Food For Thought, can we consider this fire an Appetizer For Conspiracy?
Smgumby — As I said to Scarecrow earlier, it’s a good thing that Cheney favors those large, fire-proof safes for all his important documents for storage so no one can get at them, now isn’t it?
What kills me is that the major cable news channels are pushing the no evidence of arson line. Does anybody who has even the most tenuous connection to reality believe this shit anymore?
Hi Redd,
Glad to have you back- and commenting on what may become the lead story in Clusterfuck’s presidential biography. I agree- you can smell the fear about this one- and Clusterfuck’s “I don’t recall anyone ever telling me about this” is exactly what you would expect from this guy if things were closing in on him….
I am interested in whether that public comment removes the possibility of executive privelege claims on the parts of Gonzo et al. What do you think?
I sat on a jury this summer deciding a civil case about an insurance company suing a contractor for negligence for starting a kitchen fire.
And in whose house was the kitchen fire, you ask?
Tony Snow’s.
See that’s funny, cause I was just thinking that all the hard-drives in the safe overheated due to lack of ventillation. Good he we have back up disks. . . stored in the safe on top of the hard-drives…
Wasn’t there some other gooper prez who got into a bit of hot water about destroying tapes????? House Mill—-no– Millhouse—Uh DICK we used ta call him…
An odd and ominous repitition of history.
it’s a good thing that Cheney favors those large, fire-proof safes for all his important documents for storage so no one can get at them, now isn’t it?
You mean the ones whose doors were accidentally left open this morning?
That will self-combust upon command.
TOM CRUISE WORKED ON A LAW FIRM THAT WAS CONNECTED NAMED THE FIRM
And the documents themselves on top of the back-up disks, on top of the hard-drives, in the man-sized safe without ventillation, causing over-heating, causing a fire. . . nothing to see here folks!
Tony Snow’s.
Do’h!
Digg It Christy!
This from Salon today:
Emptywheel has updated her piece, btw, with a copy of the WH official press release on this. As she says, it’s awfully amusing to see a WH that relied so heavily on “unnamed source” rumor planting get their dander up about unnamed sources. *G*
From CHS @ 4
No. The answer is No.
Bush saying “I don’t recall anyone ever telling me about this” is believable since he is largely ceremonial in this Administration.
shredders overheated and fried the electrical wiring in that centuries old bldg. do you think the newly-deputized stasi, er, firefighters snooped around looking for signs of anti-american activity….
Further to my 27:
I left out the most important part:
(Same link as my 27.)
Bush saying “I don’t recall anyone ever telling me about this” is believable since he is largely
ceremonial in this Administrationbrain dead.Not that there was anything wrong with your version, – I just felt like it.
I have never heard of a politician saying “I don’t recall….” except when they were up to their eyeballs in guilt…so may it be with Clusterfuck.
OfT – the good news:
Two conservative Time magazine columnists are on their way out the door: Neither William Kristol nor longtime contributor Charles Krauthammer will be on contract with the magazine starting next month. Mr. Krauthammer confirmed the news to Off the Record, and a spokeswoman for Time said Mr. Kristol’s contract would not be renewed.
The bad news:
And according to two sources familiar with the discussions, Time is in negotiations with National Review editor Ramesh Ponnuru to sign him to a contributor contract.
http://www.observer.com/2007/k…..e-out-time
So, as I understand it, Dana Perino is saying that the NYT statement that the White House is more involved than it has acknowledged has to be false, because she hasn’t acknowledged anything. It’s beginning to look like there’s nothing behind that vacant expression.
rw — I don’t think this public statement about not making any public statements opens that door on atty/client privilege. But I’m open to argument if someone thinks differently on that…
YOUR TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE I CAN’T TAKE MU EYES OFF OF YOU
ITS DO SUNNY AND YOU DET THE PRIZE FOR BEING VERY FUNNY
Too many shredders, overloaded circuits … poof!
Will they allow investigators into the building?
(Actually, it reminds me of my favorite theory for the Dept of Commerce fires that destroyed much of the 1890 census: time-travelling researchers with lots of scanners overloaded the circuits while trying to capture the msising information.)
The Justice Department is bound by the President’s determination of the law….or something like that…which means that Bush and co-President Cheney told them to do it and that it was okay, because they said so.
The very idea of an electrical fire breaking out (and being permitted to rage out of control for even a minute) in one of the national capital’s most important buildings is absolutely f**king ridiculous.
The fire didn’t last oh, I don’t know, 18 minutes did it?
Focus on the other shoe, Christy. I think we know what it is, something like destruction of evidence ordered directly by Bush, but wait for it anyway.
Great post as usual, Christy! Sigh. I guess Hugh has his work cut out for him on this one. I don’t understand why they are so interested anyway. Pelosi has taken Impeachment off the table, and we don’t seem to have the votes for it anyway, since I don’t hear all that much outrage from the Rethug side of the aisle.
OTOH, Hugh has at least 282 offenses on his list. They describe different scandalous behavior of both people within the administration privately and in their capacity as members of the administration. Surely they could find several incidents of verifiable and chargeable breeches of the law in terms of Obstruction of Justice, Abuse of Power, Contempt of Congress, Destroying Evidence while Defying a Court Order to Preserve. There’s just way too much there, there. Then they wonder why we’re pissed!
hackworth — They’ve been doing renovations in parts of the building near that area for quite a while, per CNN. It’s a very old building and they’ve been updating a number of the systems in it — including sprinklers and electrical — for quite a while. Just FYI.
The NYT has updated their story a bit, to include the following, right after the “Spokesmen for the White House . . .” paragraph:
You’d think that the reporter would at least call Perino’s reply what it is: BS. “Careful readers will not that Perino’s reply speaks about the official public statements of White House officials. She does not deny that the events themselves as described in this paper ever took place.”
But don’t underestimate his him. He’s just as crooked as the rest of the gang, only stupider and vainer.
The very idea of an electrical fire breaking out (and being permitted to rage out of control for even a minute) in one of the national capital’s most important buildings is absolutely f**king ridiculous.
I dunno. Were there FEMA offices in that building? That could explain it.
Forgot the link to the updated story.
No evidence of wrongdoing…except that Cheney was smoking in the closet before he went over to the Oval Office and flicked the butts as close to the classified paperwork as he could them. /s
JoFish — I thought it was contained fairly swiftly as well, actually, based on the reports that I was watching anyway.
The crimes recorded on those tapes must have been much worse than the crime of obstruction. There can’t be even ONE person involved who didn’t know it would be obstruction, the discussion was on the word games to play with the judges order.
I hate to say it, but all this is almost moot any more. Impeachment is off the table (and likely couldn’t be completed before the next election anyway) so Bush can do as he pleases.
Boxturtle (Would like to see BushCo, et al, perp walked across the tarmac at the Hague)
Oops. HuffPost says the fire was in CHENEY’S offices.
Just. Holy. Cow.
Dana Peritonitis says that the Times inference is troubling—her argument is that since the White House has said nothing at all, it’s impossible that things could be worse than they said they were.
If Clusterfuck was DEAD- and no one in the White House said anything about his health- except for Cheney who said “he’s doin fine”, then Dana would complain that it was inaccurate to say that His Shrubbinesses health was worse than the White House has said it was.
Stock up on Popcorn!
Privilege won’t be able to stop this Investigation!
The longer it stays in the headlines, the louder the drumbeat will resonate…there’s a Reckoning a coming…
Didn’t Comey say something to Gonzo about “Feeling Really Stupid and Ashamed when This Secret Torture Memo comes back to You?”
Now, We know why Bush’s Dis-engenuous Torture Memos Always Insisted that “Everything was Legal” – because, anything “illegal” would have meant the Destruction of the Tapes was “Destruction of Evidence” and “Criminal Obstruction of Justice.”
I’m sure there’s a good explanation, probably involving a microwave, Cheney’s morning popcorn, and an innocent misfiling of tapes.
I scanned back through a lot of the Cathie Martin testimony that emptywheel liveblogged, and my notes on it as well as I was putting this together. I think I may have to do another look see on press manipulations she discussed — and try and put together some point by point on it as I get time.
We talked a lot about it while we were doing Libby live trial coverage. But it seems to me that the time may be ripe to revisit this.
You just made my morning, darlin’! OTOH, some other piece of trash will hire them in a heartbeat. :-(
The bad news…..people have been watching the destruction of the very last of ALL the evidence this morning.
This gang may have some SERIOUS troubles. Defying court orders and destroying evidence is pretty damned serious. If it results in alleged terrorists WALKING, it may not look funny at all.
Yep. It’s a historical building of some significance, and they have been restoring it.
Thanks Christy. On that note, I shall paraphrase an old Bushism from the reaction to the August 11 PDB. “They’ve covered their asses…”
LOL Crosstimbers — CNN was saying that Cheney doesn’t really use those offices. That they are largely for ceremonial purposes — photo-ops and such. Not certain about the Addington ones, that are allegedly nearby, though. But Cheney and Bush were supposedly meeting in the WH this morning when the fire broke out, so the popcorn theory may not hold butter…
His immediate reaction? Hmmm! Seems like one could easily squiggle out of that. “But upon examination of our records and due deliberation we have found that the President WAS BRIEFED.” The initial statement was a “firewall” (something the WH appears to need in real life) that would work up until one of those lawyers reveals that Bush was involved…then suddenly he “Recalls”.
Per Daily Kos:
The modernization of the EEOB:
Computer Facilities
Modernization of the EEOB includes the transformation of the existing structure into a state-of-the art facility, featuring a secure computer facility and secure conference rooms. These spaces provide secure areas for classified and unclassified data as well as confidential meeting space.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..875/424241
See my 27 and 32…*g*
Oooh, Froomkin’s gonna be a doozy today…
Might as well begin storing data in the old building before the construction work is finished, just in case data needs to be disappeared.
Local radio reported that Cheney was meeting with Bush at the time the fire occurred (to which I immediately mentally added “conveniently establishing an alibi for both of them.” *g*)
Yeah, I saw that. That’s part of what made me go back to the Times, to see what they were saying about it. I was surprised that the Times didn’t take her to task for her non-denial denial more directly.
Or maybe they’re just saving that for tomorrow’s paper.
It looks like the plumbers are back and have gotten a little careless with their soldering torches.
*In a related story, reports from the first firefighters on the scene noted the distinct smell of whiskey and gasoline and alsoloud music coming from the office of Vice President Dick Cheney.
-GSD
*Snark
The bottom line:
Why destroy the tapes?
Protecting interrogators’ identities is…Ridiculous. Try again.
So, why destroy the tapes?
D’Oh……
A plausible alibi is all they were lokking for.
Someone noted that this fire was already noted in Wikipedia and that the cause was stated to be electrical.
-G
Wonder if DAD will be talking about tis today? or is the written statement all we get?
Doris Kearns Goodwin was prattling on MSNBC about how historic the building is.
I wonder if she’ll be relived to learn that this was only a document fire.
Somebody check when that entry was made. Was it before the fire?
Once again Cheney attempts to destroy a building to cover up his crimes…
I hear Halliburton has already won the contract to rebuild the EEOB.
This must be some different nation’s capital than the one I live in. Nearly every part of the federal government, from buildings to computer systems, is ancient and decrepit (insert your own comment about “starve the beast” Republicans running the Executive Branch for most of the past thirty years.) While it’s amusing to speculate about this fire, and worth looking into because it’s Cheney’s office (his “ceremonial office,” according to WTOP), it’s only really surprising that there aren’t fires in these old buildings more often.
Okay. There goes my other theory involving quail hunting in the EOB.
quite convenient to say the least, and far to coincidental
it’s going to be their line but we are sure not gonna buy it
Hee! I love it!
“In your face, causality!”
- Professor Hubert Farnsworth
This is a non-statement.
Lord Cheney doesn’t consider himself part of the White House, does he? His ceremonial offices are in the OEB.
Of course Cheney ordered the destruction.
The real question is whether some intrepid intelligence officers surreptitiously made copies of the tapes.
What Redshift said.
With the push to cut govt spending in everything but defense, or at least to hold the line on it, often has meant that infrastructure maintainence has been cut — in many cases, quite deeply.
Adam Smith’s invisible hand is sticking it deep into our pockets, again.
Fed’s loan billions to banks.
-G
Breaking: Britney’s Sister a Slut.
You mean our Blue Texan is not really blue? *g*
Must have been those shredding machines overloading the circuits…old buildings, ya know. /s
I just love a good Futurama reference. If you could just work one in about the headless body of Spiro Agnew.
Hellfires of Hades followed Satan Chee-knee’s footsteps out of the containment unit this morning but were quickly pushed back.
The classics…they still work.
Why is anyone surprised at any of this. This is how fascist regimes operate. That Bush and his comrades are not in prison for treason and crimes against humanity shows what disrepair this former democracy is in.
Here’s Malkin’s take:
Fire near VP Cheney’s office sets off nutroots alarm: “Reichstag!”
So who would have predicted that the largest communist country in the world would be bailing out one of the great financial giants in the biggest crony-capitalist country in the world?
-G
Even very old commercial buildings must be retrofitted at some point with electrical service wiring and panel box to provide suffient amperage to run a modern air conditioning and heating system. All commercial wiring must be shielded in a metal or pvc conduit. This provides added fire protection as the wires themselves are already encased in a plastic sheathing. I’m not buying the official story.
Nutroots. That’s us, right?
OfT (again)
Jonathan Turley sees at least *six* possible crimes attributable to the WH re the destruction of the torture tapes:
http://rawstory.com/news/2007/….._1219.html
CNN reports that the fire may have broken out in an electrical closet adjacent to VP Cheney’s ceremonial offices
“smells like….sulphur”
could have started in a telephone bank, any pushpolling happening in Iowa today?
He only destroyed 18 1/2 minutes of one tape. This is many hours worth!
Poor Michelle, she must be studying history with Dana Perino.
-G
I think we’re “moonbats” also. . . . . .or is that somethin’ different?
Breaking: Malkin is a political slut.
Mao
GREAT ONE PUNAISE!
My understanding is that Judge Mukasey signed the search warrants on Jose Padilla based upon the confessions of Abu Zubaydah. Those confessions were supposed to have been voluntary. So the warrants themselves were obtained under questionable circumstances.
Attorney General Mukasey needs to immediately recuse himself and an independent actor needs to appoint a Special Prosecutor. If Mukasey was duped into thinking these confessions were legitimate, then he is an “injured party” and inappropriate to handle a fair-handed investigation.
If he KNEW that water boarding occurred in order to obtain Zubaydah’s testimony then he issued warrants based on illegally obtained confessions…or at the very least he DECIDED they were legal. But WAIT! Didn’t he say that he really hadn’t a clear idea what water boarding was about, and had no idea if it was illegal? But if he KNEW he made a judgement about the legality. That means he LIED before the Senate Judiciary Committee.
In EITHER case he should recuse himself. Cases he handled are directly affected by this destruction of evidence.
So who has to appear in court on Friday? Is it that fat Fred (can’t think of his last name) or Addington?
That’s funny. How you guys say? 707?
OT–
Filed under Please Don’t Hold Your Breath:
. . . with just a hint of brimstone.
Nope. Marx, Karl Marx.
Mucus-say in deep shit already and he’s barely taken the oath of office. The Clusterfuck administration- on the way in the door, they remove yer brains and yer reputation.
Thanks for pointing that out. I think nutroots refers to the blog, like FDL. Kos, etc. Moonbats is the people who go to them – us. I think.
I’m sorry, it V. I. Lenin that said of the U.S.A., “You will sell us the rope we will hang you with.”
Nope, Lenin.
China is about as communist as East Germany was Democratic.
Quibbling aside, I get your point.
Throw in Mukasey’s possible involvement in
a) knowingly approving warrants that he knew were based upon coerced confessions.
b) not informing other Judges of the presence of these recordings
c) continuing to lead the investigation of the destruction of the tapes when he has a clear Conflict of Interest
For that matter none of the “Communist” states were or are.
Yo Raven: Maybe it’s…all of the above?
Game, set, match.
-G
Huckabee is a liar. He is pretending that the floating cross in the background of his commercial is a coincidence.
As someone who has been in front of the camera for more than a few commercials, the area with the camera’s views are scrutinized endlessly, and chosen with extreme care.
For him to claim that it is a fluke shows him to be a liar.
I call Hucka-bullshit.
Just not enough for Nancy. She’s too busy doing….something important, I’m sure.
kinda Styx in your craw, no?
You are right. . .uh correct!
China calls its capitalist-like economy “socialist market economy” and its government and politics “communist.”
I don’t like the Huckster, but I do enjoy the Huckenfreude.
More smoke pourin’ out of the WH Press Office this a.m. than the EEOB.
a fire. how conveniently disturbing and mysterious.
i choose overheated shredders for 666 trillion alex.
the divil made me do it.
and the disclaimers about what went on in the bigwhytehaus & when?
picture a naughty 10-yr-old: i wasn’t actually standing in the avowal offish when i said it. nuh – UH! 3″ outside the door perhaps?
who among us can trust them any more about anything?!
Charon target with that one, my friend.
They sure do– not to mention if you overload the wall sockets by running banks of them side-by-side.
Seriously, when I heard the news the first thing that popped into my head was “Here we go– let’s have a fire and burn all the evidence.”
I Hades puns of yours…
Keep yer slander straight sir.
Is cere a bus there?
Tangential Reaction To This Line:
(I can’t help wondering if that “former senior intelligence official” is John McLaughlin and/or George Tenet or a proxy thereof, and if this is part of the continuing WHIG v. CIA/Cheney v. CIA rumble, but it’s a tangential question.)
Destruction of tapes reportedly occurred in Nov 2005 — year or more after McLaughlin and Tenet departed — so knowledge of positions taken by OVP staff would more likely be in the minds of Porter Goss and his staff.
Redd
Thanks for the take on executive privelege.
Hackworth said:
The very idea of an electrical fire breaking out (and being permitted to rage out of control for even a minute) in one of the national capital’s most important buildings is absolutely f**king ridiculous.
That is my thought too. What does the secret service report…
A little bit of history:
Drudge has that sad family Hucka-foto frontpaged.
It looks like the establishment is going to pull Huckabee from the cross and nail John Edwards to it.
-G
Wexler’s Impeachment “Petition?”…
can’t see the signatures…
links to contribute page…
signs you up to help with his campaign for re-election…
link to contribute side by side with the “petition”…
…and Wexler is not a co-sponsor of HR 333…
hmmmm, makes you think, huh?
Wexler’s Impeachment “Petition?”: Ok… I signed… Now What?
I think most of the comments here are demonstrating Orrin’s point of that “irrational fear of government”.
Don’t you know it was just Dubya lighting one of his farts while balancing a pretzel on his nose?
“What does the secret service report?”
It’s a secret.
Apparently they already have a suspect! He’s in the picture on the left. Seems familiar! Maybe they should be careful of Polonium!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20…..dOmVuFOrgF
A retired insurance adjuster with many years of experience in arson cases, told me that electrical fires are among the most difficult (nearly impossible) cases to crack where arson is suspected.
Let’s file this one under The Politics of Tears:
Cheney vacations in Tartarus:
The great pit of Tartarus, which was originally the exclusive prison of the old Titan gods, but which later came to mean the dungeon home of the damned souls.
Romney seen cryin every time he reads the Huckster’s numbers.
A retired insurance adjuster with many years of experience in arson cases, told me that electrical fires are among the most difficult (nearly impossible) cases to crack where arson is suspected.
It’s not like anyone just wanders into the White House “Compound”. I hate to be a contrary but the idea that there would be some kind of investigation that would turn up ANYTHING is whacko! Fuggiitaboutit.
The Secret Service will report once the inventory of Cheney’s match collection has been completed.
And back on topic:
From the WH statement about the NYTimes article:
You’d cry too if you’d just poured millions of yer own fortune down a rabbit hole and were gettin beaten by a cornpone baptist minister.
Wonder if it ever occurs to the Mitter that he should have run as a sane person.
The part I thought was funny is one of the news channels said the mother wrote a book on parenting that was just about to come out. Now it’s been indefinitely postponed. It’s funny whether it’s true of not.
ferryman will get you o’er it
Karl
Wait, the fire is the topic?
That would never work in Republic primaries.
lessee, nix-on wuz the one wit’ the 365(24X7) active fireplace.
all the old soap operas & grade B mysteries taught us how ta’ toss th’evidence inta the fahr quick-like when we hear footsteps at the door.
all them-there sneaky story-lines taught us things don’t always burn completely, thus leaving clewz.
motive? check
opportunity? check
shifty eyed suspectitater(s)? check
Oooooohhhh! *raises hand & waves wildly*
From the WH statement you quoted, with corrections:
We will continue to decline to comment on the record on this issue, and in response to misleading press reports, but will of course continue to send out off the record minions to spin this for our side. See here and here for further confirmation of this WH strategy.
Thought a teensy correction for Dana was in order to keep things on the up and up.
I would like to extend a hearty Congrats to the Chickenhawks of all Chickenhawks–the Democrats 20 of whom voted to give Bush exactly what he wanted in the Budget, including 70Billion to build more Dover Coffins and wreck more families in Iraq and the U.S.
The Pres. Candidates were so enthusiastic about ending the war, that they couldn’t hop on their privately funded planes to vote against funding the war.
McCain whose son is in Iraq voted for the funding. Levin voted for the funding. Jim Webb whose son is in Iraq, voted for the funding.
As the Kos has said, quoting Toby Ziegler of West Wing fame: “We don’t need any opposition. We do fine ourselves.”
Here is a list of the Bush Puppy Dog gutless slaves:
Yes Give Us More Dover Coffins and Faster:
Akaka (D-HI)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Carper (D-DE)
Casey (D-PA)
Conrad (D-ND)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Inouye (D-HI)
Johnson (D-SD)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Levin (D-MI)
Lincoln (D-AR)
McCaskill (D-MO)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Salazar (D-CO)
Tester (D-MT)
Webb (D-VA)
I could point out that conditions have never been worse in more cities in Iraq–Basra is a total mess. The refugee situations has spun out of control, and the Liebermans have not taken any Iraq refugees into their homes, and come to think of it no one in Congress has as well. In fact less than .1% of the refugees have been allowed into the U.S. Borders. I guess the Condi plan is to relocate them into Mexico. I’ll have to read up.
http://www.salon.com/opinion/g…..index.html
Fire – An incovenient truth
33% will probably win the first few gooper primaries—if ONE candidate ran on a sanity platform, could he get 33%? Probably not.
And let’s file this one under Ahem:
Yes, I agree. I’m just saying that if a criminal were to commit such an act and hope to get away with it, then that is a method that presents a lower risk of getting busted (than other methods).
Mukasey is involved in THAT investigation. He issued warrants based upon the confessions “voluntarily” obtained from Abu Zubaydah. He’s hardly unbiased or impartial.
Except when they do…as they just did in making this release! Sheesh! Don’t these people even see that they lie about what they are doing WHILE THEY ARE DOING IT????
Maybe they forgot to release this “off the record” so that they could say we “haven’t OFFICIALLY commented” and get away with it.
thank you for the Dana correction, she was blowing so much smoke I thought she’d set off the smoke-alarms in the press room
We don’t do hangouts.
Modified-Limited or otherwise.
Dave, burn the f**king tapes.
Hugs
Dead Dick
And back to Tears:
(Same link as my 144.)
Surprize! Surprize! Who would ever have thunk this crowd would go along with shrub? Mary, Mary quite contrary is quite contrary when it comes to Democrats. She’s a Repug Pet Rock. Come to think of it, the entire list is made up of Pet Rocks.
gotcha
I presume they use those unbreakable camping/backpacking mirrors?
Otherwise, there’s no way. Too risky with all those shifty eyes.
There’s that name again. Weren’t we just talking about her yesterday? At least Sen. Cardin’s name does not appear on this list.
OT
Seems like Rudy’s holiday video is ripe for a front pager. Morning Joe had a blast with it this morning.
http://rawstory.com/news/2007/….._1219.html
Cheney is an eyewitness that Dubya was elsewhere blowing up
dogsfrogs with firecrackers. He was not playing with matches in the vicinity of Cheney’s ceremonial throne room.More tears. Then enough:
I guess that makes Chimpy a tough guy.
(Same link as the other tears.)
speaking of scrapple, i object.
that fine, noble dish was greatly maligned yestidie by being linked to Stentorial Cullskee
Fire in Cheney’s office- uncontrolable lightning seen comin outta his asshole again..When that guy gets indigestion- he’s impossible to live around.
Right. Not Britney’s sister. I went O/T. Sorry. But that’s gonna be another instance like Pari, Anna Nicole, where that kinda bullshit gets more ink than Dodd or the mess in Iraq or the Democrats being pussies on SCHIP.
And nowm back to a conflagartion near you…
File it under “Amen” the Democrats have proved they are loyal Bushies once again and this has been approved in the Senate, and will soon be approved in the House today. It was approved in the Democratic dominated Senate 70-25 along with an enormous spending bill giving Bush everything he asked for.
In a boost to President George W. Bush, the Senate voted late Tuesday to approve the catch-all 555 billion dollar budget bill, adding extra war funds without any of the restrictions that Democrats hoped to pin on their release, such as linking them to a withdrawal date for US troops.
So as you decorate the Christmas tree, or Hanukah bush, or for Kwanza, give thanks to a year in which the Democrats showed they can be model Republican slaves.
I bet you cheered when you heard the Democrats made advances in Congress–”controlled both houses” didn’t you? I’ll bet if I go back on FDL Jane and Christy are gushing in the days that followed that November 2006 vote full of promise and noble things to come.
Posturing Pelosi was going to stop the war. Her homey Steny was ready to kick some tail.
Not.
Chuckie Luckie Schumer was roarin.
And what do you have? Iraq wasting more money and killing more Americans and Iraqis than ever. The surge has been an objective failure.
The Coalitioin–baby they long ago booked their asses out of Iraq. They ain’t there and they ain’t goin’ back.
Your tax dollars are endlessly being hemorraged but your Congress can’t pass medical care for children, and has a shitstorm of a bill to fund care for the elderly if you talk to anyone immersed in trying to get decent care for patients. Insurance companies totally rip off patients in thousands of scenarios every day even when they need coverage for critical illnesses.
I regrettably think of 2007 as The Year of the Democratic Slaves.
Yes. And her rotary phone.
Tester is new and therefore a disappointment as is Jim Webb (though he was always Hawkish, Webb did replace Makaka with a D and helped to devastate Makaka’s continued rise to Redneck stardom).
Except of course he’s tearing up over lower VA costs, and the prospect of juicy reconstruction contracts respectively.
Blue Texan’s upstairs…
Both of them come from populations of very “conservative” Democrats who are not much different from Republicans.
I hope Bush, Addington and Cheney are getting generous Christmas gifts for their Democratic slaves who voted with them nearly 100% of the time. Bush won every battle thanks to his loyal Democratic lackeys.
Bush: “Gimme this and this and this.”
Dems: “Whatevah you want daddy bring us the list.”
OT Hope you all can sign this:
http://action.freepress.net/campaign/sbmopenletter
Open Letter to Congress
Subject: FCC Votes for Big Media: Throw the Rules Out
Send this message to:
¤ Your Senators
¤ Your Representative
Dear Members of Congress,
We write to you today to ask you to act swiftly to overturn the FCC’s Dec. 18 vote to relax media ownership rules.
We have spoken out against media consolidation in every way we know how: attending hearings, writing letters, submitting comments. However, on Dec. 18, the FCC ignored this widespread public opposition — just like it did in 2003. The FCC has turned its back on its mission and its mandate. Their decision to let Big Media get even bigger will erode localism, diminish minority ownership, and decrease competition.
Please take action now to introduce a Resolution of Disapproval and overturn the FCC’s reckless action.
Sincerely,
(Your name)
(Your address)
I regrettably think of 2007 as The Year of the Democratic Slaves.
reply
Willing slaves I might add. They weren’t brought over in a ship unwillingly. They made a free will choice to be a shrub slave.
Number of Bush family who are enlisted in the Armed forces including all the eligible nieces and Nephews=zilch.
Number of Cheney family who are enlisted=zilch
Number of Liebermans enlisted = zilch
Number of Pelosis enlisted = zilch
Number of Congresschildren old enough to enlist = Next to none in the house and Next to none (2) in the Senate.
PetePierce — I thought one of the Bush nephews was a JAG? George P., I think.
not all newbies disappoint.
please do check back to what Chris Dodd said about OH’s new Senator Sherrod Brown yesterday.
*curtsies & twirls around just once, for luck*
I know this off topic but feel all should help stop the FCC from consolidating ownership of the MSM!
from email I received this am. I have already forwarded this to all my email lists and thought what better way to get the word out but to get the Firepups helping to stop this abuse of wingnut power grabbing.
Dear Media Reformer,
Millions of people stopped the FCC in 2003. Let’s do it again!
Sign the Open Letter to Congress
Our fight for better media just suffered a blow. Yesterday, FCC Chairman Kevin Martin pushed through new rules that will unleash a flood of media consolidation across America.
The rules will further consolidate local media markets — taking away independent voices in cities already woefully short on local news and investigative journalism.
In 2003, the FCC tried to do the same thing, but millions of people demanded that Congress reject the FCC’s rules. And they did. It’s time to do it again.
We need 100,000 people to get Congress to reverse the FCC’s rules right now.
Sign Our Open Letter to Congress
Then get three of your friends to do the same.
You have stood with us in the fight for Net Neutrality. This is also about making sure that everyone has access to the diversity of views that a democracy requires.
Like the fight for Neutrality, it’s about finding many voices in our media, not just one. It’s about preventing large corporations from becoming the ultimate gatekeepers to the information we watch, listen or read every time we turn the radio dial, click on the television, or open a newspaper.
Earlier this week — spurred on by the calls and letters of tens of thousands of people like you — 26 senators from both parties sent a letter to the FCC Chairman promising “to revoke and nullify the proposed rule” if the FCC voted to lift the longstanding ban on “newspaper-broadcast cross-ownership.” But Chairman Martin did it anyway.
Congress has the power to throw out these rules — and if 100,000 people demand it, they’ll have to listen.
Take action now and spread the word.
These 26 Senators are just the beginning. By sending letters like this to Congress, we can and will make a difference. You can truly help the cause with just a few clicks. Sign on now — and get your friends to do the same.
Your actions are making a difference. Let’s keep up the pressure. And stay tuned — this fight is far from over.
Thanks for bringing us this far,
Robert McChesney
President
Free Press
http://www.freepress.net
George P. Bush joined the Navy Reserve as an intelligence officer:
http://www.politico.com/news/s…../3251.html
It sounds like traditional reserve service and does not involve Iraq. However, it should be great for his political career.
HA! Des(e) iz LOL!
Some of these names are understandable. But the first one jumped out and bit me. He’s my Senator, rated by Progressive Punch as 15th most progressive Senator (out of 50?). For reference, Lieberman ranks 47th, and Russ Feingold is 26th. I don’t think Akaka belongs on this list. Point me again to the source of this information, which must be highly selective?
Bob in HI
Wait a minute. Tinfoil Hat. Maybe they’re getting rid of all the evidence. Didn’t Sen. Wyden suggest all senators go down to the old executive office building and read “the documents” before voting against /for telcom immunity?!? Then Dodd said the other senators don’t have access. Maybe Cheney decided to make sure they wouldn’t have access before voting against/on telcom immunity.
Last I heard he was a law clerk, Christy but I’ll check. My bad if I was wrong. I have never been so frustrated on so many issues at once, more intrested, and more frustrated the more I learn.
Great post on the Sessions fearmongering ethos that calculates people are so stupid. Sessions thinks it’s great politics to present the same dumb downed message to trash the Dems. I strongly disagree with his strategy and hope it will backfire.
BobinHi–
I was glad to get the Prog Punch link. I hadn’t seen that site before.
I just think despite the refrain they don’t have the votes to stop Bush in Iraq that there are ways to structure votes to strangle the budget to force troops home without suffering politically.
Behind that humongous budget there was so much ridiculous pork while money that’s needed for basics didn’t get allotted.
My source was the kos http://www.dailykos.com which is usually correct with Congressional votes. Once I get settled in I’ll check the vote with
http://www.govtrack.us/ when I get the Omnibus bill number.
Christy–
I’m glad you got me to drill Georgie P. (the hopeful Bush 44). You are going to have to wait a long time before a current Bushie puts themseleves at risk while being in the service. However they have a track record of risks while not in the service.
George P. has taken risks, but the service is not where he took them. While a Rice University student, George Prescott was arrested by the Metro Dade police when he showed up at 4AM at the home of his former girlfriend, broke in through her bedroom window, which aroused not the girlfriend but the attention of her daddy. As any young lawyer to be knows, you can’t get your litigation groove on to early, so he had a vigorous argument with her father as to whether his direct path to his objective through his ex girlfriend’s bedroom window was the best approach.
Also as any young lawyer to be knows, what you don’t have in skill can sometimes be compensated with persistence, so after running away from daddy, he returned in a Ford Explorer burning up the front lawn by runnning back and forth. He was not convicted, because luckily, daddy and the ex-girlfriend decided not to press charges and unlike some ADAs who would anyway just because they can, this one took a look at the fact that he was an ex-President’s (lost to Clinton 2 years prior) grandson and his political future and dropped the charges.
Noelle,not to be outdone, and in the mode of Rush Limbaugh dabbled in filling out her own Rxs without hitting med school first, and some people felt they were not for “legitimate medical purposes.”
You are quite right that he’s now in the service. but he did not enlist as a JAG because they get sent to Iraq often and elite white Republicans don’t do Iraq.
As you know and have blogged hundreds of times eloquently, Iraq is the war that the Bush WHIG (White House Information Group–the Bush marketing arm for selling Iraq fearmongering or the Jerry Dela Feminas* of the Mushroom cloud) types hire servants to fight and die.
Bushies watch on television minus Dover coffins–kind of like a title fight for celebrities, or the Roman emperors watching the gladiators fight to the death.
George Prescott Bush (son of Jeb and Columba, and a lawyer) joined the Naval Reserve as an Intelligence officer. Currently for this aspiring Senator and President as Bush 44, it is the easiest way to get military service on his resume.
He’s following in the footsteps of a Democratic President.
Jack Kennedy would have spent World War II in Georgetown as an intelligence officer but for the FBI discovering he was having an affair with a suspected Nazi spy. Instead of being bounced from the Navy, his father arranged that he be sent to a war zone (but for his “hooking up” which is what they call this activity now on college campuses, he never would have been a war hero).
You were thinking, correctly, that as an attorney, and a former law clerk at the Florida Supreme Court his skills, would best be ultilized as a JAG officer.
But there’s a little problem with JAG for Bushies. JAG officers mandatorily now have to serve on active duty which may well mean Iraq, or if they join the Army reserves or National Guards while not required to serve Active Duty they often get sent to Iraq which means the land of the bang bangs as Bushies call them, where they can get their body parts scattered all over the road. So that’s yukkie for them.
Steve Sailer blogs about Georgie Prescott’s brave course into Naval Reserve and the details why here:
http://isteve.blogspot.com/200…..serve.html
AYK, the last Bushie to take a risk service wise was Poppy unless you calculate the risk that George Bush 41 might have hopped in a training plane blitzed out on coke and booze and had trouble keeping the ole plane’s nose on the horizon on takeoff.
Bushies talk about the importance of risk for others but not for them and their families unless of course risk could mean falling off a mechanical bull while drunk. The naval reserve takes people up to 42, so now that the barhopping at Chelsea Piers and Georgetown has attenuated for Barbara and Jenna, they have time for a Navy Reserve career. But as Jenna tells everyone at her cocktail party book promotions when asked that inconvenient question of why she doesn’t join, there are many many ways to serve our country–bars in Georgetown were a venue where she did this nearly ever night for a spell.
Georgie Prescott’s younger sibs are also deeply committed to risk taking. Little bro John Ellis Bush aka “Jebbie” was arrested twice. The first time was when he and his date were arrested in a car for being drunk and naked from the waste down while getting busy and fogging up the windows, in a Jeep Cherokee parked in a Tallahassee Mall (you remember the song “Talahassie Lassie” by the Beach boys . He was later arrested for being a public drunk and resisting arrest in the Austin bar strip.
Bob–
Here’s the roll call on the Budget vote, and both of your Senators voted for the Bushie war appropriation and the rest of the Omnibus Budget bill as did much of the Democratic House.
http://www.govtrack.us/congres…..=s2007-441
Again thanks for the link to Progressive Punch. You live in a very interesting beautiful place.
Speaking of JAGs Christy, I noticed one alarming story while catching up on the news at TPM Muck quoting this story from Charley Savage in The Boston Globe:
http://www.boston.com/news/nat…..y_lawyers/
The Bush administration was going to push an initative that would have had Pentagon political appointee attorneys in charge of all promotions of JAG lawyers. Ayk there have already been some nasty reprisals and paybacks for JAG attorneys who have brilliantly and dilligently represented Gitmo detainees, and one who I believe prevailed in SCOTUS.
This is but another reprehensible attack on the Rule of Law and the basic rights to competent defense that was launched by I don’t know who/where in the Bush administration. More people than Bush’s point guard at the Pentagon,DOD General Counsel “Jim” Haynes were involved.
I find it difficult to believe that if Fred Fielding had input to this decision he would have allowed it to fly, but then I guess absolutely nothing should surprise anyone anymore.
She speaks for the President. Explains it all, doesn’t it?