There were murders in New Orleans by Blackwater.

Thers!

Shazbot!

Jane, how do you stop this crazy thing!

g’evning thers… mighty fine grade a crap you are serving up

We want you to do your fucking jobs. They want you to blow them and ask for seconds.

hell yes. Do your fucking job, reporters.

Yeah I think Scarce pulled that clip for me from blogwars where Charles Johnson talks about his expertise in kerning. It’s like that old SNL skit of Steve Martin as the hick farmer who says he had sex with Margaret Trudeau and snorted coke with Hamilton Jordan. Except slightly less convincing.

I hope I didn’t use too many bad words.

*waving to jane*

yowza! Thers, you’re blunt and accurate. “We want you to do your fucking jobs. They want you to blow them and ask for seconds.”

G’evening pups! The guard dog at the door seems happy with my credentials tonight *g*

no more problem logging in ndfg?

Y’know, if I could find that SNL clip I’d actually put it up and just say “Charles Johnson talks about his expertise in kerning.”

That’s a post.

Off topic (but it wouldn’t be necessary to mention if the media would do their jobs):

Harry Reid is controlled by the telecom corporations.

The Democrats in the U.S. Senate need to elect a Democrat to serve as majority leader.

How much campaign money has Harry Reid accepted from telecoms?

From the rightwingnut movie hall of fame:

“Thank you sir — may I have another?”

Y’know, if I could find that SNL clip I’d actually put it up and just say “Charles Johnson talks about his expertise in kerning.”

sounds like something the late nite pups can find for you, Jane.

I hope I didn’t use too many bad words.

You mean like “Malkin”? Go wash off your fingers with soap, young man.

Seems to me that this journalism professor should spend just a bit more time questioning why the so-callled professionals have completely dropped the ball, and a bit less time wringing his hands over the fact that citizen journalists are kicking traditional media’s ass. Especially when it comes to questioning the talking points instead of taking them down word for word and calling it reporting.

That would explain the rumor that he’s bringing the intel cmte version of the FISA bill with immunity to the floor instead of the judiciary version without it.

I hope I didn’t use too many bad words.

You mean like “Malkin”?

No, like “fact.”

Thers, primo crap as always, Thanks.

Suz, can’t believe you recalled the beige ceiling - must be c. 1975:-)

I don’t think it’s a rumor. I’ll see if I can find you a link.

If the reporters will not do it, we will.

Seems to me that this journalism professor should spend just a bit more time questioning why the so-callled professionals have completely dropped the ball, and a bit less time wringing his hands over the fact that citizen journalists are kicking traditional media’s ass.

But that’s the point — “Citizen Journalism” has become just another category of propaganda.

suzanne @ 9, so far so good with logging in, or rather, my computer remembering my login at this site. Not sure if it was something buggy in the first week or so after the change, but FDL was the only site that my computer wouldn’t/couldn’t remember. Whatever, the Lake water feels great, & i hate to miss Ther’s Saturday nite Special Load O Crap.

Phil Ochs’s write-in triumph will be announced in Late, Late Night ?

And I will thank the fucking New York Times Opinionator dude not to conflate the left and right critiques of the “MSM.” We want you to do your fucking jobs. They want you to blow them and ask for seconds.

Spotlight, anyone?

Seriously, the NYT and other media outlets need to recognize that there is just the teeniest bit of difference between folks like LGF and and FDL.

And beyond content, there’s fashion.

Some may blog in their pjs, but those who really understand things know that “You really haven’t blogged until you’ve written a post while wearing a tiara and a feather boa. It’s ‘extreme blogging,’ and don’t let anyone tell you differently.”

I’ve given up all of the dead wood until my Newsweek subscription runs out, which is very soon. It’s so cool to read what I already know, but with so much less factual info. It’s unbelievable what goes unreported, underreported, or is just plain wrong.

Interesting, because my dad is a good ‘ol democrat who keeps up on things the best he can through the LATimes, and Newsweek, but he is blown away by what I tell him.

Perhaps the esteemed professor should also notice that that the press now behaves like abused puppies with regard to right-wing issues. If they report anything off-message (Dan Rather for example), they’re treated to an extended bout of public screaming (and presumably exclusion from the best cocktail parties).

nice to have ya back - sounds like there may have been a problem with the computer accepting the cookie that lets your computer remember.

votes still be tabulated bfl

Here’s a wonderful takedown of Haznizzle’s shizzizzle:

http://driftglass.blogspot.com.....paine.html

Here you go, SteveinNC

Seriously, the NYT and other media outlets need to recognize that there is just the teeniest bit of difference between folks like LGF and FDL.

There is a difference…? ;-)

And may I point out that I nominated that song before the contest officially began (in protest of the contest’s postponement)?

Thanks.

I was pretty sure I’d read that. I wrote angry (but polite) emails to Senators yesterday for all the good that’ll do.

you’re probably right about the cookie. I’ve been lurking, i liked your late late contest! You’re still the greatest mod in the known universe imho (with the rest of the backstage crew in pretty close contention, but you rule *g* )

I wonder if his University signed off approving that piece that says journalists should be schooled, licensed and regulated by the government. kinda wipes out one of those constitutional amendments, but hey, its not like we are really using it nowadays yanno.

The MSM is a mess, but you’d have to be a total shithead to think, say, Glenn Reynolds provides any sort of satisfactory corrective.

Heh.

*blushing* thanks ndfg but it really is a team back here - i’m just the one who is out as a mod.

OK. Just Lemme know. So I can demand a recount in a timely fashion. (I do live in Flori-DUH now, ya know.)

Seriously, the NYT and other media outlets need to recognize that there is just the teeniest bit of difference between folks like LGF and and FDL.

Until it is inconvenient for them to grasp this, they won’t.

Might be too late, then.

iirc, not only do you live in florida - you were a (gasp) suit (ducking)

Thers, I don’t think they like it now - and that is why the pushback. We threaten their jobs with our pushback of telling ‘em to do their fucking jobs the correct way, not the easy way. I think we scare them.

iirc, not only do you live in florida - you were a (gasp) suit (ducking)

Hopefully not a Brooks Suit… ;-)

“The Gay General”? Funny how the Right wingnutrias failed to discover that many of the YouTube selections were members of the Republican Party State Central Committees, and then there is that remarkable chance selection out of 15000 submissions of GROVER. Yeah, sure he likely submitted 14,000 of those YouTube videos himself, but still…one would have thought the right-wing bloggers would have pointed out the odds of their hero being “randomly selected” was about equal to that of some Bible guy shouting at the candidates “Do YOU BELIEF IN THIS!” was merely a random Republican.

Oh right! Maybe he was.

And this proves another rule. While the rightwing “exposures” by “Citizen Journalists” often demonstrate almost nothing of real substance that falsifies the essential facts of a story (the Beirut smoke, “phony soldiers)” the “citizen journalists” of the other side focusses primarily on real issues.

I wonder if his University signed off approving that piece that says journalists should be schooled, licensed and regulated by the government. kinda wipes out one of those constitutional amendments, but hey, its not like we are really using it nowadays yanno.

I agree, he’s elitist. And he hurts his case with it.

But he’s not totally wrong. It really is dangerous, the Michelle Malkin Skool of Journalism/Stalking.

What to do, is the question.

To tired to read, much less type. Goodnight all!

Definitely right. The response of most of them? Do their jobs right? No, ridicule the bloggers-at least the leftie ones. I mean, shit, you ever been to malkin’s place? She has a quote from NYT calling her a “firecracker” on her masthead. That is one shitty blog-Malkin’s. Sucks real bad.

Aloha, MM!

All journamalizts should be licensed, regulated, and monitored for adherence to State Doctrine. If they are, it’ll be easier to round them up when the time comes.

Bloggers, not so much.

And the next Sunday on one of its gabfests with Howie Putz, they lead with the story of whether CNN was wrong to use those clips. I forget the guest and his attitude was “Fuck you. I don’t give a shit. It was a good question.” But the loonies drove that story - such as it was. Because their candidtaes got a little uncomfortable.

All J school does is teach journamalists the prevailing corporate mindset. IMHO, the golden age of journamalism was before J schools became the new ITT Techs.

What to do, is the question.

yeap. how do we protect free speech and have a free press as the unofficial fourth branch. the main stream media have turned news into infotainment with their corporate marketing strategy of appealing to the lowest common denominator.

Evening all. I see the hound Cerberus is otherwise engaged and does see the need to continuously eat my login info.

Great post Thers and an important distinction. Have to say I sent an email to the estimable professor asking him to get a clue. Just an academic courtesy you know.

Is it possible to have some kind of a fact check button to push on reputable sites? Like if the site chooses not to use it they are discredited? It would be delayed, after the facts are proven one way or the other, but I’m thinking some kind of truth in reporting kinda gizmo. Facts proven/disproven…

All J school does is teach journamalists the prevailing corporate mindset. IMHO, the golden age of journamalism was before J schools became the new ITT Techs.

Where are William Randolph Hearst and Joseph Pulitzer when you need them?

Of course, if they were around today, I have a feeling they’d be blogging.

I don’t know if the MSM has gone too far to be redeemed. Their funeral, though.

I continuously tell my students that the internet provides unprecedented access to information. Unfortunately not all of that information is accurate and you need to learn to distinguish that which is before you use it uncritically. Having said that, there is an awful lot of pure bullcrap in the MSM as well (Faux News or the Wall Street Journal editorial page anyone?). One must confront all information with a degree of healthy skepticism.

Peterr, wasn’t Hearst one of yellow journalisms’ worst offenders?

Whoa, the Boston Globe endorses Obama and McCain.

Whoa, the Boston Globe endorses Obama and McCain.

yeap, we have that up one the news ticker.

Interestingly enough, the Dean of our J-School is kind of on our side of the issue. She thinks that citizen journalism is the wave of the future. Full disclosure: she is the wife of a colleague and a friend.

Hearst loved wars…sold newspapers. can’t remember the exact quote.

Looks like Letterman is cutting a deal with WGA to return his show and Craig Ferguson to live. Letterman a 30-year WGA member. His actions would seem to be a plus for WGA, a way to force the big boys/networks to the table, too?

DesMoines Register endorses Hillary and McCain.

I don’t see Newsticker, Suz??? Help.

Worthy of note - On this date in 1791, the Bill of Rights was ratified.

h/t FFRF.org

News ticker only appears on the home page, Loo Hoo.

LooHoo, news ticker is always under the front post on the front page and before the previous posts.

So why do editorial boards like McCain when rethug voters don’t?

Definitely.

But Hearst would have been appalled at the corporate mindset prevalent in the MSM today. Unless, of course, it was his corporation. *g*

He had a combination of “go out, get the story, and beat the competition” and “how can we spin this to make some bucks?” Sadly, most of today’s media seems to be focused only on the second half of that equation. The “get the story” part is severely lacking.

Having said that, there is an awful lot of pure bullcrap in the MSM as well (Faux News or the Wall Street Journal editorial page anyone?). One must confront all information with a degree of healthy skepticism.

Fair enough, but well… it’s not just that. The wingnut version of “citizen journalism” is “a license to kill.” That’s messed up.

MSM is about risk management. Hearst was about yellow journalism. There’s a difference, I think, but unfortunately not one that helps us, or the country.

I think it’s kinda like the Bush would be a great guy to have a beer with meme that the campaign press pushed. When these guys go before the editorial boards, they have a chance to charisma them (bet you didn’t know that was a verb) He’s a hale fellow well met kinda guy, fun like Bush was.

Fair enough, but well… it’s not just that. The wingnut version of “citizen journalism” is “a license to kill.” That’s messed up.

Excellent.

Of course, your average wingnut is just about the lowest denominator imaginable.

“The wingnut version of ‘citizen journalism’ is ‘a license to kill.’”

True. There are a minimal set of limits on the MSM that do not apply to the wrong blogosphere and they go way beyond the pale. Rush Limbaugh, Faux News, Bill O’Reilly, Michael Savage and other rightwing mouthpieces routinely push the envelope. The whole Shiavo affair is a classic example where the came close to pulling a full Malkin.

Nightcap for a long, frazzly day [and hugs for FDL & the team–the steam valve for my pressure cooker life ;-) ] — here’s a little tidbit: Newsweek’s cover story is The Sleeper.

Yeah, my candidate of choice, he demands better, too: Edwards

Hearst had a mixed record. In San Francisco, for instance, his SF Examiner exposed more than a little official corruption. Perfect, though? Not by a long shot. No argument there.

Okay, so how would I know the news is up if I’m reading comments?

Maybe because the only semi-sane candidate? Who else could an educated group endorse out of that mob?

Hazinski seems to neglect the MAJOR reason that people have begun to rely on “Citizen Journalism” as their trusted source of information. It’s because the Main Stream Media have utterly failed to provide truthful and trustworthy information over the last several generations. It utterly failed to disclose widely the greatest example of governmental manipulation in the history of the country…the bogus Iraqi WMD evidernce.In fact, the major edia PROMULGATED that information without checking it up. Then there was the Valerie Plame embarassment….where they not only exposed a CIA CounterProliferations Officer…but constantly opened their pages to those who LIED repeatedly about the facts of the case. They propogated the idea that the Bush Administration was unaware of the threats by Al Qaida in the months prior to 9/11 when the reality was vastly different.

At the same time, the MSM have shifted to an “entertainment” model…have had innumerable cases like Jayson Blair, Judy Miller, etc. Their major purveyors of analysis are not actually journalists, but are former spin-meisters for politicians. Utterly pathetic.

And having a journalism degree is no panacaea to providing accurate information if the journalist is incapable of understanding the relative value and reliability of that material. To a journalist the idea is that there are TWO views on an issue…and that is all that is necessary to allow the public to adjudge validity. That’s simply rubbish, in some cases there are multiple modalities and the selection of two as representative (and the selection of spokespersons) is biased itself. It allows the journalist or the publisher to frame questions so that the reader is led to the results they want. Rather than inform, it distorts. In other cases the requirement that there are two views to be given suggests that the views are equivalent in value. This is precisely why the public believes that “ntelligent Design” (and before that “Creationism”) has some sort of Scientific Merit. The number of Biologists that hold that the physical evidence establishes the veracity of Evolution outnumbers Creationists by about 10,000 to 1. And that 1 is usually not doing any research and is a poorly credentialed do-nothing fundamentalist getting paid elite-level wages from some Creationist “Think” Tank. They’d be washing glassware if they were out in the real job market. Ditto those that were “HIV Skeptics”, or “Global Warming Skeptics”.

But they are given the imprimatur of credibility at the same level as the bulk of the Scientific community (and those doing authentic research using the Scientific method). Journalists need to be trained in Science if they are going to report on Science (or WMD’s). They need a deep background in Regional International Politics, History and Anthropology if they are going to report on politics or culture of a potential war zone. Most of these reporters on the great push to Baghdad couldn’t tell their Shi’ites from Sunninola. Instead they were as about as adept as Geraldo.

So of course people are going to begin to trust alternative sources more when these folks are given “equal time” with real Scientists. The MSM has been remiss on its role in truly offering credible information itself.

The US Media has converged on the Soviet Union in becoming a spokesman for the Administration…and it has tainted, perhaps irrevocably, its role as the critic of that Government. Getting merit badges in the same old, same old…isn’t going to help. In fact. marketing has become far more critical than courses in ethics and law in many journalism programs. The spend more time learning about advertising and “image” (makeup) than preparing for an interview by research.

Wouldn’t bet on McCain’s sanity myself, but I do not really see much difference between him and Romney in most areas. Except maybe that McCain is an even bigger panderer and flip-flopper.

[waving to Suzanne]

Whoa, the Boston Globe endorses Obama and McCain.

I’ll throw this out there since I’m interested in people’s thoughts on this and it’s Late Night…

Ya know, I haven’t really understood the blogosphere’s lukewarm reception to Obama since he first announced. We rail on and on about the “ways of WARshington” and the serial panderers that populate DeeCee, yet when we have alternatives, there’s a pretty loud chorus singing the nebulous “experience” and “electability” tunes when talking about any outsider candidates. What’s up with that? I wonder if the Conglomerate Media themes that have dominated public discourse over the last 30 years are responsible for this. So if we’re so disgusted with how our government has operated in recent history, why in the world would people support the most entrenched DeeCee insiders there are, who have hung around the cocktail weenie circuit for decades, as the people who are gonna clean things up?!? Not gunna happen…

Look, here’s a guy that came from nothing in terms of connections and money, has a brownish pigmentation, and while still in his 40s, is the leading candidate to be the next Prez of the U.S., if the latest polls are to be believed. Given the societal and personal hurdles Obama has had to clear to get this point, I’d say there are few people more “experienced” and savvy to know how to get things accomplished, in any context.

Maybe many of us are so wanting some Liberal knight, that is so Liberal he or she would make Howie Klein think, “Man, this person might be too radical for me…” to ride in and save the kingdom. That’s never going to happen. Each of us here will find things wrong with anyone that we ever support. Obama’s voting record is quite good throughout his governmental career. I think some of the recent no show votes are a result of playing within current media frames and probably just some campaigning conflicts.

Given his life experience and what he has chosen to do with life as an adult, I think once in office, he’ll be one of the most Liberal Presidents in recent memory. As of the last year or two, I feel like he’s doing what he thinks he needs to do to win over a lot of skeptical voters across the country, and with a hostile media repackaging his message at every stop.

Of course, this could be an incredibly naive opinion, and he’ll be a DLCer, but there’s really no evidence to suggest that, in fact quite the opposite. There is a certainty - with another Clinton, we know exactly what we’re going to get, and that is most definitely not the kind of “experience” and “leadership” I trust to restore the Constitution.

Good evening dear friends. Hello Thers.

Hi Jane. Hello Suzanne.

Hazinski seems to neglect the MAJOR reason that people have begun to rely on “Citizen Journalism” as their trusted source of information. It’s because the Main Stream Media have utterly failed to provide truthful and trustworthy information over the last several generations. It utterly failed to disclose widely the greatest example of governmental manipulation in the history of the country…the bogus Iraqi WMD evidernce

I don’t disagree, but that’s not my point. The MSM has failed, but that does NOT mean that we should even for a minute show any sympathy for the wingnut “solution.” The “citizen journalist” stuff is a trap.

cause i tell ya - and you can bookmark the news page and check or check the front page. The 4 newest headlines show on the front page and the news page shows you the headline and a clip - and yes there is a new item

hey tex, feeling better tonight?

bonkers, my objection to Obama is that he came up in the Chicago Machine. We don’t need more patronage and cronyism.

Doing pretty well Suzanne. All the kids are gone and my house is clean. New bed arrives tomorrow.

And yourself?

I do not think that Obama would make a bad president nor would Hillary. Both are infinitely preferable to any of the Republicans. Neither, however, is particularly progressive. They are both moderates and leaning a bit to the right at that. It is a measure of how extreme the modern Republican party is that they are even considered liberal at all. Obama also has a fair bit of bagage from his association with the Chicago Democratic machine. It is not Daddy Daly’s machine, but it is a classic political machine and he is part of it. Along with that he is a staunch corporatist and his policies reflect that (look at his health care proposal for instance).

There are much more progressive candidates available and at least one who is still viable. If he is nominated, I will vote for Obama and only wince a little. I will not vote for him in the primary however. I want the best, most progressive candidate that I can get. The way to do that is to force everyone as far to the left as possible by support the most progressive candidates with our money, time, and votes.

seem to have knocked off that bug that had me in its grips mid-week so i’m doing pretty darn good, tex :)

Interesting..Edwards on three Sunday shows.

Putting my foot down on charisma as a verb.
Sternly.
*g*

Hearst was actually a populist in his early years…and viciously attacked the Tammany Hall and other corporate-politician linkages in cities across the US. In fact, many argue that he was the primary reason for the rise of Progressive politicians like Teddy Roosevelt, Wilson, Taft, LaFollette, William Jennings Bryan and even Eugene Debs.

The Cuban-American war which he helped foment was largely built up by his proximity to Cuban independence advocates and the justifiable (although exagerated in Hearst papers) cases of human rights abuse by the Spanish Regime. Hearst later exposed cases of the abusive conditions of the Concentration Camps where Spanish soldiers were held after the war.

The famous quote allegedly made to the famous photographer Remington was denied by Hearst and Remington and others who might have known its veracity never indicated it was true.

“Please remain. You furnish the pictures and I’ll furnish the war.”

The way to do that is to force everyone as far to the left as possible by support the most progressive candidates with our money, time, and votes.

I’m with you all the way there. Edwards seem to be the only one who points out the fact the average citizen is always left sucking hind teat.

OT —

any other mac users finding firefox very slow when the lake is up?

I don’t like the way Obama grabs the nearest talking point to bash other Democrats, even if they’re Republic talking points.

On the other hand, when I hear Bill Clinton compare Obama to a “talented talk show host”, it makes me want to support Obama just to spite Clinton.

PhilK there are other choices!

any other mac users finding firefox very slow when the lake is up?

Hi Betsy! Pretty quick now, but slugs down on occasion.
Add-ons are the culprits mostly.

Bonkers, your points are all extremely well taken about Obama.

My objections to his candidacy are three-fold:
1. He chose Joe Lieberman as his mentor upon being sworn in to the US Senate in 2005.
2. He missed votes on choice in the Illinois lege.
3. He challenged Clinton’s Kyl-Lieberman vote without having voted himself.

Of course, should he become the nominee, I will work to elect him.

jumping back in here, firefox works better on pcs for me (at my daughter’s or on my roomie’s pc). At home on my mac i stick to safari. Seems to work better for me.

newtonusr should i uninstall adblockplus as well?

ndfg the problem with safari is that it’s impossible to paste with formatting when i do blog stuff, so i tend to use firefox.

newtonusr should i uninstall adblockplus as well?

Yep.