Tweet
We knew this years ago (at least the IAEA did), but it’s nice to see America’s intelligence agencies officially break free from Bush’s propaganda:
WASHINGTON, Dec. 3 — A new assessment by American intelligence agencies concludes that Iran halted its nuclear weapons program in 2003 and that the program remains on hold, contradicting an assessment two years ago that Tehran was working inexorably toward building a bomb.
Remember, Iran is allowed under the Non-Proliferation Treaty to have nuclear energy for domestic purposes, such as power plants. The amount of fissionable material needed for power generation is much, much smaller than that needed for weapons-making.
Oh, and the whole reason the Iranians have a nuclear program?
Get this: We gave it to them, twice — first in the 1950s, as part of the "Atoms for Peace" program under Eisenhower, and again under Ford in the 1970s:
In 1976, the Shah of Iran came to the United States, sent his representatives to intercede and say, “Look, we’ve done an analysis, and we’ve got a finite amount of oil. And right now we need to export it. And if we don’t export it, we don’t make money, etc. We don’t have enough oil to sustain this. We need to come up with an indigenous energy policy that frees up our oil for exportation. We want to use nuclear energy.” And the U.S. government went, “Good idea, Shah. We’re all for it.” That was Gerald Ford.
The chief of staff of the White House at the time was Dick Cheney. The Secretary of Defense was Donald Rumsfeld. So, this argument that both Cheney and Rumsfeld put out today that Iran is a nation awash in a sea of oil, there is no need for a nuclear energy program, they both supported Iran’s goals of achieving nuclear energy in 1976. Not only nuclear energy, but they also supported the Shah when he said, “We cannot allow a nuclear energy program’s fuel to be held hostage by the vagaries of sanctions and war. We need an indigenous fuel-manufacturing capability inclusive of the full uranium enrichment process.” And guess what the U.S. government said in 1976. “No problem, Shah. Good deal.” Of course, in 1979, the Islamists come in and suddenly we change our opinion. The bottom line is, Iran has every right legally to a nuclear energy program, and economically, we’ve already deemed it a responsible way to go.
Sounds like the United States intel community, regardless of what it thinks of Iran’s current rulers, would rather trust them than Dick Cheney or the rest of the PNAC Platoon.
100 Comments
Support this site!
Subscribe to the newsletter
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About Firedoglake
NIE Bulldada!
Good morning PW.
I have read that most of the senior Iranian scientists and engineers working on their enrichment program were US trained during the 1970’s.
A great man.
Apparently the NIE conforms quite closely with the just released report from the International Atomic Energy Commission
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200…..ear_agency
Mohammed Al-Baradei, head of the IAEA, has suggested that the two reports will hopefully allow for some moderation of tempers and a opening of stands on both sides.
Bush is such a Dick. Oh wait . . .
(couldn’t help myself)
Did anyone else listen to Bush’s presser this am?
Listened in the car driving to school.
Basically, the new NIE report means nothing to him.
It doesn’t change his take on foreign policy.
It means a lot to other people, though.
It’s pointless to ask, but I still can’t fathom how he is So unaffected by reality.
Did anyone catch what he said in the beginning…that “he” decided to release the information to the public, because of what “other members” of his administration had been saying (Cheenee???); so that he could set the record straight….
Anyway, it was something like that. I’m waiting for the transcript.
Advice to those who are loading these pieces here at the Lake at such a frenetic pace, remember we need to ponder and have dialogue. While I love the new site it seems I am jumping everywhere to read comments.
As one whose mind races from sun up to down, I kind of like the pace.
Reminds me of the Plame trial-Baptism by Fire!
Phoenix Woman…don’t want people to change topics,,,but here’s a very interesting meeting mirroring the famous “Winter Soldier” hearings during the Vietnam War.
url=http://www.ivaw.org/
Iraq War Vets To Speak Out Publically on War Crimes
http://news.yahoo.com/s/onewor…..g2cSWqYCoD
Olberman will have a field day.
How come no one mentioned the Fitzy/Waxman/White House triangulation?
Ya gotta love our short sighted political goals.
We as a country do not seem to have any long term goals wrt our political agenda, we are always putting out brush fires by hobnobbing with government administrations and giving them neato little toys like Saddam and this case here.Trouble is, five, ten years later the regime changes and all of a sudden we don’t want( Insert evil empire of your choice here) these people to have the neato toys we gave their brother.Then we have to back pedal and weasel around, trying to undo the damage we, ourselves, have done.
Fluid political opportunities will always exist, why can’t we decide to not be so damn generous with dangerous toys yet deliberately do nothing for places like Darfur or Bangladesh?
Oh, thats right, they don’t have any fucking oil.
I don’t watch Bush’s pressers, not because Herr Bush isn’t morally about as filthily wretched and perverted and as you can get — obviously he is. If he wants to improve he should take baby steps — first model himself on a realistically attainable goal — such as Charles Manson’s toe cheese; and go up from there.
But I digress.
My problem with the pressers are that with rare exception, the questions are for shit — either partisan, or show ignorance, fear or low self-esteem in the questioner — and equally worthless follow-ups if there are follow-ups at all.
And I end up just wanting to throw a brick through the TV.
This morning: “preventing “them from hav[ing] the knowledge necessary to make a nuclear weapon.”
State of Union, Jan. ‘03: preventing Iraq from acquiring “nuclear weapon-related capabilities”
Aug of ‘01: Daily Press briefing re AlQueda “determined to strike” ignored.
How many months ago in ‘06 or ‘07?: Iran is not the threat we’d like to to think it is.
These folks are recycling their strategies. Once you catch on, it’s so easy to see. And thanks to google we can prove it!
I thought someone posted something yesterday that it was the decision of someone in the CIA what to publish specifically…although the decision to publish a summary was the consensus of the Intelligence community. I don’t think that Bush or Cheney ARE in the Intelligence Community. maybe Mukasey or Gates were able to corner Bush when Dickie wasn’t around and convince him to publish something as it would likely be leaked and “misinterpreted”. Bush probably simply agreed and then the Pentagon and CIA decided “enough is enough”.
I’m on my fourth TV?
They are recycling their tactics.
The neo-con strategy remains the same as ever: chaos in the Middle East.
I’m still going with the idea that someone was going to scoop this. And so they had to get it out, ahead of the press or blogger. There’s no way you can trust what they say. So the truth lies elsewhere.
I totally agree.
Posted on the last thread . . . but relevant here
Too many people had a hand in putting this together for Cheney, Addington, and Hadley to bet that they could keep it quiet. Too many people knew what the NIE said — in broad sweeps, not necessarily the specifics — and if BushCo continued with its WWIII rhetoric, it would only be a matter of time before word started to seep out contradicting them.
The intelligence professionals were burned once, by the bogus “the intelligence community got it wrong” nonsense when the WMDs were not found in Iraq. Cheney & Co likely believed that these same folks were not going to stand by and let it happen again with Iran.
Chaos in the Middle East.
And confusion at home.
A strategy for eternal repub rule. But something happened to their nice strategies.
Dictators always forget that people are capable of acting outside their control, outside the propaganda machine.
And what is this crappola that he didn’t know that this was in the NIE until last week???? If that were true, then he’s just always out of the loop then isn’t he. He didn’t know about Plame. He didn’t fire the USA’s. He didn’t know there were no WMD’s in Iraq, etc., etc., etc. I wonder, does he know that Halliburton was doing business with Iran as late as 2005? Does he know that they still have a subsidiary office in Tehran?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..5Feb2.html
“But don’t expect Halliburton to leave Iran any time soon. The company has opened an unmarked office on the 10th floor of a Tehran office building, according to Vivienne Walt of Fortune Magazine. Since the South Pars project is expected to take 52 months to complete, according to the Tehran-based Mehr news agency, Halliburton seems likely to remain in Iran through 2009.”
Clueless or willingly kept out of the loop, a controlled puppet or a con man? This is the ultimate Plame revenge. Public ridicule and disdain. A fitting end to dreams of Middle East chaos.
Yup, and Karma is a biatch.
Not sure what happened to a comment. So apologies if this ends up as a double post.
In the last thread, I said that bush’s words today, “nobody told me about that” should become his Epitaph.
Somebody should photo-shop a tombstone to read:
Not sure what happened to a comment. So apologies if this ends up as a double post.
In the last thread, I said that bush’s words today, “nobody told me about that” should become his Epitaph.
Somebody should photo-shop a tombstone to read:
What ever happened to “mystery poster”???
FDL server was down for a while. And still has hiccups at this point.
LS at 22
If he wasn’t in the loop, then there is no executive privilege.
Hello Congress? Investigating committees?
Well, after checking with some experts, it seemed like no one could understand a “process” to follow in order to get the information that the mystery poster said was out there. So, we concluded that while the person may indeed have inside info and may have been pointing us to important avenues to pursue, no one could “follow” how to do that.
It remains to be seen if the info surfaces one day. Some think it is possible that incriminating stuff is “out there” to be had. But…. how to find it? That’s the question.
Thanks for asking. I still like the idea of having State Attorney Generals sue the Federal Government in order to get it to comply with the Constitution. But not sure that would work or would ever come to pass. However, I remain convinced that the states have a stake in “The United States” – and thus should try and force the feds to comply with a Constitution of The States and We the People.
Nobody could have anticipated that.
Apparently this has been suppressed by Cheney for about a year. Typical WH strategy…”we don’t agree with the findings…go back and look again”. They kjeep doing this until one of the agencies breaks and agrees. Then they have the “evidence” they need and badger the other agencies with it…saying “The Department of X says they have firm evidence…why can’t you guys find it?”
http://www.antiwar.com/porter/?articleid=11879
So the draft has been around for a year. But Cheney required them to consider the possibility that Iranian counter-intelligence was feeding them with false leads and tainted counter-intelligence.
http://rightwingnuthouse.com/a…..ntercepts/
One more point, apparently McConnell was compelled to produced the final NIW summary to the intelligence committees of Congress. He knew that eventually this would get out, so, according to spokesman Donald Kerr, they released an unclassified version of the summaries.
LS at 22 re Halliburton,
They were spinning off KBR [”kill burn rape”] so if they claim they are not involved in Iran, it is technically true.
I’d guess that this report cited by one of our late-night commenters a few nights ago may have played a roll in this disclosure. It says that war games show that in a conflict with Iran, the U.S. would likely lose the entire Fifth Fleet.
Note that the DNI, the Commander of CENTCOM, and the DNI are all three Admirals, and that Secretary of Defense is a career intelligence officer. I’m guessing that there was a threatened mutiny at the top levels of the DoD (especially the Navy) and the CIA.
This revelation should mark the end of credibility for Bush, Cheney, and their neocon supporters, but I said the same of Clinton’s credibility when dried presidential semen was found on that blue dress. ;-)
everything be swallowed up into a black hole here…. sabotage? FDL now too powerful for the Decider?
Exactly the point!
Heh. The Elvis Presley Remote Control. Or did he use a pistol?
Oops!
That second “DNI” was supposed to be “Chairman of the Joint Chiefs.” Sigh!
At last Bush had to pull his finger out of his ass long enough to pick at the cold crow on his plate just long enough to snivel like a five year old,’But but, but, they coulda!”.
What intrigues me the most about the NIE is that, for the first time in recent memory, someone has managed to outmaneuver Dick Cheney. I don’t think it was any accident that this report was released while Cheney was out duck hunting. This was someone’s coup de grace. I’m dying to know who the mastermind was.
IIRC the Iraqis were getting the Osirak reactor from the French. I agree that nuclear cooperation with Iran back in the 70s was nothing but a sop to the Shah’s vanity.
I guess the new site design and emptywheel’s FDL blog are the surprises Christy said we should expect while she’s on vacation.
Emptywheel pointed me to an interesting article about the “new” Iran intelligence this morning. It ends on a cautionary note we should all pay attention to.
Because of this NIE we will never get further sanctions. If the diplomatic route (sanctions) is closed… …war is the only option.
That also raises the interesting question of how far Cheney will go for spite.
“Gives up easy” is not a way I have heard Cheney described.
BTW, as you might have guess, Glenzilla is having himself a feast at the expense of the nations Very Serious Foreign Policy Experts over all of this:
Because of that, he has been relentlessly attacked and smeared by our Serious Foreign Policy elite — yet again. And yet again, ElBaradei has been completely vindicated, and our Serious Foriegn Policy Experts exposed as serial fabricators, fear-mongerers and hysterics.
My problem with the pressers are that with rare exception, the questions are for shit…
Yeah, they jumped all over the chance to swing at the softball lobbed at them, several times, by Bush’s complaining about Iran’s “lack of transparency”, didn’t they?
Keep in mind, for Bushco. the problem with Iran is not the quest for nuclear weapons, it is Iran possessing knowlege of the nuclear cycle. Iran will not give up on nuclear energy, Bushco will never allow that.
Even if Bush/Cheney et al concedes Iran has no desire for a nuclear weapons program, it doesn’t change the end result… …war.
707! Let me count the ways that quote can be read. *g*
Sometimes “Click here to load new comments here”, sometimes not…
Busted!
Some people are still eating breakfast.
Interesting little image you painted.
(erp) and pee yew.
Now would be a good time to use diplomacy instead of a hammer.
Get some dialog going to ease the pressure off of Iran so we can focus on Iraq and Afghanistan.
Someone needs to take the gas can away from Cheney.
“Just like any modern scientist, Galileo Galilei published his findings–as a small book titled “The Starry Messenger.” 550 copies were published in March of 1610, to tremendous public acclaim and excitement. We can imagine what it was like for people–probably something like when people learned that the Earth was round, not flat. Or, more recently, what it was like to discover that our galaxy was only one of billions!”
http://inventors.about.com/lib…..lileo1.htm
President Bush, today reacting to Galileo’s report said, “This just proves what we have been saying all along- we believe the world is flat but a lot more research needs to be done on this issue.”
puravida (The commenter formerly known as mc)
Sorry Demi.
*G*
Hey demi:
You’re back at the computer. Check your Facebook…
Advocates for war with Iran will twist any fact and torture any argument to support their cause, but it will be hard to convince anyone but themselves. The military and now the intelligence community have come out against it. The public is and will be against it. Except for a few crazies, Congressional Republicans will (no doubt in private) tell the White House that they won’t support it either. Neither Bush nor Cheney can just order a war. It has to be set in motion and as soon as any move is made in this direction there is going to be an uproar for all of the above.
As I said in the last thread, the danger now is not a Natanz type attack that would escalate into a general war but a limited strike against a “training camp” on Iranian soil.
Secrecy News has more on the NIE:
http://www.fas.org/blog/secrec…..ram_n.html
[SNIP]
NIE on Iran’s Nuclear Program: No Slam Dunk
In an unusual policy pirouette, the Office of the Director of National Intelligence yesterday published the key judgments (pdf) of a National Intelligence Estimate on Iran’s nuclear weapons program little more than a month after the DNI issued guidance declaring that “It is the policy of the Director of National Intelligence that KJs [key judgments] should not be declassified.”
[Continues at website]
Here’s Chimpy during his presser this morning:
The prune juice worked.
Here’s Chimpy again:
(Same link as my 58.)
I am watching the Chimpos press conference on C-Span. First he says Congress is denying Santa to the troops (his spending bill), Santa to taxpayers, and santa to the intelligence community (telcom immunity & basket warrents, probably). Then he says something like Dems are big “irresponsible” spenders and he’ll veto any bill of theirs. Then: Just because they halted the program doesn’t mean they can’t start again (Iran.) “It’s a warning.”
B-a-n-g-i-n-g m-y h-e-a-d against the table.
They won’t let you in the club unless you are a hysterical warmongering serial fabricator. It’s like a secret handshake. Speaking of which, I have strong suspicions about Lichtenstein. I have heard nothing about their nuclear intentions which leads me to believe they are hiding something.
No, but with the revolutionary guard designated a terrorist organization, Iran insisting on the right to the nuclear cycle (as international law allows), and
Isreacertain middle eastern countries willing to bomb their neighbors with promised US protection… …I just don’t see this NIE as having too much effect on preventing war.I mean, since impeachment is off the table.
Chimpy: This is a reevaluation.
Omigosh. Chimp smiled after saying:If the Iranians learned to make nukular weapons, then the world would be more dangerous.
ICBM’s with Limburger Cheese warheads?
The mother of all stink bombs.
How about those US oil men’s contracts with Kurdistan?
Chimpy: Iran is dangerous. The long pole in the tent. They test ballistic missiles. and it is a nation that is trying to enrich youranium.
Tell me how many nations don’t test ballistic missiles?!?
Dept. of Irony
Our leader actually HAS nukes, and he’s crazier than their guy is.
Perhaps the most interesting reaction to this new NIE will be that of the truely insane, Isreal supporting, fearmongering, Iran haters like Hagee. His hysteria and shrillness have been far out in front of the Bush Administration all along.
Speaking of which, I have strong suspicions about Lichtenstein. I have heard nothing about their nuclear intentions which leads me to believe they are hiding something.
LOL. Yeah, they’ve been curiously quiet. Unacceptable!!!
Reporter Raddatz. (Cites past errors. Syria. Past statement on Iran )How do you possibly think the world is going to rally around you and your intelligence?
Chimpy: Um because Iran is dangerous. It’s a way to rally our partners. Carrot and stick approach works.
check1, check2…
But of course:
The chief of staff of the White House at the time was Dick Cheney. The Secretary of Defense was Donald Rumsfeld. So, this argument that both Cheney and Rumsfeld put out today that Iran is a nation awash in a sea of oil, there is no need for a nuclear energy program, they both supported Iran’s goals of achieving nuclear energy in 1976.
So you’re saying that, just like with Iraq, their assertion is that we know they have a nuclear program because we have the receipts? *g*
MR CBL?
How is the Mrs.?
I have not seen CBL around in a long time.
Omigod. That C-Span Chimp “mea culpa-but only sort of” clip is worth watching, but I think it will be a while before I can steel my stomach to watch another press conference of his again.
Chimpy will probably not bring up Saudi rape case when they come to the table in some upcoming conference. Why? Chimpy: Uh, uh, uh.
I need an edit on aisle 76 please.
What about Monaco? I haven’t heard anything from them either. That makes me suspicious.
XO XO Mods. [Mod: no extra charge.]
Thank you for asking. She is well and misses you all a great deal. Hard drive crash coupled with fairly severe financial hardships brought on by the fiscal policies of the current Admin… Maybe another post for that one.
Please tell her I said hello, and it is very nice to meet you.
Why stop with other countries? Here is California, we have nu-cu-lar power plants and plenty of scientists/labs with knowledge of the construction of nu-cu-lar bombs. AND for motive? Why, merely to force our multicultural, gay-accepting, humanistic seculo-organic green lifestyle on you alls. Bwaa-haaaa-haaaaa.
Yeah, but despite the usual lies, the one big takeaway from the presser is how pissy he was. Even our cheesiest local news program mentioned it (and showed a clip of him storming out at the end.)
Neighborhood nuclear superiority!
Actually, the amount of enriched uranium needed for power plants is far larger than is needed for a bomb, but the purity needed for a bomb is far higher.
A full scale nuclear powerplant will have perhaps tons of uranium, but only about about 5% or so U-235. A fission bomb will need a few dozen pounds at most, but it would have to be somewhat over 90% U-235.
The same centrifuge cascades can be used to concentrate uranium to power grade or bomb grade, depending on how they are configured.
The only way to tell if anybody is making bomb grade or power grade uranium is to be there on the ground doing inspections on a routine basis.
new thread upstairs
Braier Foxschnooze: What is your rx to Chavez loss. he’s said our true enemy is the US empire and a vote for me is a vote against him. He repeatedly called you the Diablo.
Chimp: Uh the venezualen people rejected one man rule. They voted for democracy. And uhuh uh, the US can make a difference in Vz here’s how. The congress can pass a free trade agreement with Colombia. Colombia leader works with such difficult problems. He’s a strong leader. It would be a real knock to democracy if we didn’t support Colombia.
First he says Congress is denying Santa to the troops
It’s more like the reindeer keep getting shot down.
Blue Texan’s upstairs…
The other interesting thing about this news is that it provides an explanation for the Hersh/New Yorker story a few months back about how the Bushies had switched from trying to sell the military on bombing nuclear facilities to trying to sell them on bombing training and staging areas for supposed Iranian interference in Iraq.
Since that was in the period when this report was being suppressed by Cheney, they knew the nuke argument was bunk, and were looking for another way to “fix the intelligence around the policy.” As always with neocons, facts are not a basis for deciding, they’re an excuse to justify what you’ve already decided.
The thing I’m not seeing truly addressed is that, other than this being leaked out, the administration has been lying us into war again, only this time they got caught, fair and square. It begins and ends there. There is nothing to spin. They are liars. All of them.
All dressed up and nowhere to go.
The stamp thing? Totally a cover, dude. So obvious!
;)
Hmm. Maybe that’s another country that sells stamps….
Thank you for that comment… even though everyone is long gone from here.
Sometimes hearing things said back to you helps to really get through all the nuances.
I’d still like that photo-shopped!
Ahahah, PNAC.
Iraq should not pass any oil law that permits international cohorts in corporate crime to rip off the people of Iraq, just as the King ripped off the American colonist,resulting in America. Sad to realize a new King, dysfunctional and compromised exists. He is the “EXECUTIVE OIL KING,” who along with neocon facsist cohorts in corporate colonial crime screw Iraqi and American and Iranians alike, as long as they maintain their cash flow and get their piece of the “oil pie” while people of the world suffer.
There is no link between smoking and cancer or no link exists between Iraq’s Oil, America’s new King and his corporate facsist cohorts
in colonial war crimes? Send the war criminals to jail!!!!!!
What would be the kiss of death to a texas oil men?
A successful energy creating nuke program fusion/fission, Iranian Style, with a little help from their friends?
In the International Media : no Nuclear threat from Iran cuts down the tension for war,so prices of oil/gas can go down,darn ! and this is the reality: the Oil Lobby needs tension to keep a barrel in the 100 dollar range, as well as the Weapons and Security contractors, no war means no more contracts , and the Hedge-Funds heavily invested in all of them must be fiuming, what a loss of profits and what a shame !
Candidates must tell exactly how much solar panels, hydrogen fuel cells, ethanol/biodiesel, electric/batteries, turbines for wind and water, geothermal,fusion and evacuated tubes/thermal investment are willing to really push, the real deal ! training,services,parts,etc., how much ? organic foods and a smart Farm Guest Worker Program because we must get our own food right here at home !
the Intelligence operative (s) that forced this Report Release ( Dec.3,07) deserves a very big medal,because the neocons in the DNI,White House and Pentagon, Feinstein-Bolten-Edelman must be also fiuming with despair ,imagine ! no more Iran bombing for a while! , shame on the traitors ! and good job to the patriot in the “Intel ” that pushed to release this report , good job ! whoever you are,you deserve the job at the top !
lets focus on the H.R.1955 , http://thomas.loc.gov/home/c110query.html ,
a Bill pushing its way to the Senate floor that if approved will turn this great country into a Banana Republic,with un-elected committees indicting citizens for speaking-up, a McCarthy re-run,please read the Bill and see for yourself,it’s been pushed in the House by R.Harman,the top AIPAC-Israel Lobby defender and would give their orthodox group unlimited powers to arrest anyone they don’t like,this is the most Un-Constitutional Legislation ever, it would end Free Speech and the Bill of Rights in one single shot,what a criminal shame !, it’s imperative that ALL the candidates express their opinion about this insulting piece of Legislation, make sure they get the news, because even them, if talking about making Washington DC free from Lobby’s, neocons and extreme warmongers could get indicted for “violent” talk under this absurd fascist Bill, “Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act of 2007 , H.R.1955 “, this Bill in its present form has no supervision, no parameters, no control, nothing ! ,amazing that this kind of Legislation could go on in America today !
but when we see R.Harman and R.Emanuel , S.Schumer,S.Feinstein,S.Lieberman,Mayor Bloomberg,Joshua Bolten in the W.H., Edelman in Defense, Chertoff in H.S. ,Bodman in Energy and Mukasey in Defense ,the picture gets very clear, they work together and they want America as a colony of Israel,this Bill H.R.1955 is the tools to make it happen, and all this while the men in my christian community are busy watching the players and eating hot-dogs,what a shame and what a disaster, America !
this Vote, http://senate.gov/legislative/…..vote=00407 , for a candidate that repeatedly told the Senate that when necessary and by saying NationalSecurity,he and others could go outside the USA Constitution and the RULE OF LAW , and do as they please, be torture, rendition, spying on americans,what ever,and only 40 Senators stood by the USA Constitution,the other 53 just made a joke out of that great Document,this vote is the worst High Treason Act in American History, it’s the beginning of the end, it must be reversed, its unconstitutional,void and null,its Un-American.