Instead of bickering about how much flour goes in the gravy, this year a couple of musician friends and I argued about music downloading, and just how rich Paul McCartney should be. It was really fun, but I think that we may have alienated a few people over the pumpkin pie.
My friend was totally baffled and offended that a fan asked him for a CD gratis at one of his club shows. My friend explained to the fan the costs that went in to making that CD - the gear he had to pay for and maintain, the van that carts that gear around, the recording costs, rehearsal space rent, and the years of practicing his instrument and honing his writing skills. We all said “yeah man right on, tell it like it T-I-is.”
This same friend, not five minutes later, told us about how he had just downloaded five new albums and didn’t pay anything for them. He totally busted himself. That then led to the “just how rich should Paul McCartney be?” bickering.
I ran across this the other day in the New York Times and I thought it was excellent
INTERNET idealists like me have long had an easy answer for creative types — like the striking screenwriters in Hollywood — who feel threatened by the unremunerative nature of our new Eden: stop whining and figure out how to join the party! That’s the line I spouted when I was part of the birthing celebrations for the Web. I even wrote a manifesto titled “Piracy Is Your Friend.” But I was wrong. We were all wrong.
What did you bicker about over the bird (or tofu)?
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Aloha!
3 in a row, my personal best!
Donita and Fini!
Awesome BK! Did you have a good turkey day?
CTuttle @ 3
CT! How were the yams?
Hi fini
Happy Thanksgiving!
Hi Donita. We didn’t bicker. Had great fun at the expense of the teenagers present (and clueless), but no bickering. Just good food, most of which we’re having again tonight.
Nothing like a little Morphine to make the pain go away.
Hey finifinito! Good to see you.
Donita, Dusty Springfield is just so stone cold great.
Hey, what did you wear to the movie premier?
Hello! No bickering over here. Lots of liberal oriented political hashing, and going over historical events and such. No conservatives around this year!
Elliott @ 6
Hey! Happy Thanksgiving to you too! Egregious! How art thou?
Had a good one. First sober holiday I’ve had in about twelve years, maybe fifteen!
It’s different.
Bustednuckles @ 13
Me too. It’s kinda weird.
finifinito @ 5
Heh, no yams this year, some butternut squash tho… ;-)
This is already OT, but this is so cool I can’t help but want to share it.
Fabulously beautiful;
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pag.....ge_id=1811
peanutbutter @ 11
Same here, and my brother Tom and I managed to have our annual JFK assassination discussion. Someone brought up the fact it was the 44th anniversary and the media that used to bring this date up every year for several years now have downplayed this important date in our real American history. The teenagers were rapt in their attention to our discussion and its ties to Watergate and the Bushies.
Hey Donita!
Happy Thanksgiving!!!!(a bit late)
How’s it going??
Bustednuckles @ 13
Yay!
That’s one to be thankful for.
No bickering here. My daughter quit speaking to me this year. I’m sure she has her reasons, which I have not yet been told. Life goes on, but not in the way one expects. Thanks for asking.
finifinito @ 12
Hm. Isn’t it wherefore art thou? Am preparing to move from Virginia to California at the end of January. Hope they have wifi and groceries and stuff like that out there. I hear it’s a pretty wild place.
So what’s new with the Finitude Dude?
egregious @ 14
Best feeling when I quit drinking was NOT waking up each morning with a dull throbbing headache.
Bustednuckles @ 13
Congratulations, that’s big.
bhatten @ 20
Sorry to hear it. Sounds tough.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ll5kMQHJ814
I like this version of I Can’t Stand the Rain” too.
I love this song!! Arms of a Woman:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biFcf-dplLI
How cool Egregious!
It’s different too, but alright.
Tons of laid back folks.
Bay area?
Let me be the first to welcome you to the Left Coast!
One thing that does suck is the time difference though, stuff happens back east before we even think about waking up.
Bustednuckles @ 16
Now THERE is someone paying attention to his evolving dreams. Amazing.
Too bad your friend played himself like that, Donita. Whether you’re Paul McCartney or Pee Wee Muffley, artists need to get paid.
This art thing doesn’t happen for free.
I bickered with my brother who doesn’t “believe” in voting. I wanted to punch him
Bustednuckles @ 8
Nothing like a little Morphine to make the pain go away.
Honey White - Morphine:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXnGxASoXn0
tommy roto @ 30
I have a friend like that.
Only thing new is I have roomates now and we are looking for a new crib to hold a small crew. Finito Enterprises needs a new HQ in Indianapolis. We expect to move out of state next year though, to where is still in discussion. We want to move somewhere more artsy but affordable. Ideas, suggestions, tips and warnings are welcome.
I’m really enjoying this playlist, thanks for another worthy one!
and I’d like to note that if you launch the player stand-alone player, you can bookmark it.
What are costs in Indianapolis, Fini?
finifinito @ 33
There are negatives associated with moving almost anywhere in the country. You just have to pick your pizen.
Boston1775 @ 10
rings on my fingers and bells on my toes, baby. Thanks for asking.
Yes, Dusty rules.
What area of CA, egregious?
egregious @ 21
whatfore art thou?
To Tex, Thank you. Of course, you’re right. It is. B
Loo Hoo. @ 35
The housing costs here are exploding because of property taxes. I am right now looking for a minimum 2br/2ba with a monthly budget of $600. I am having a hell of a time finding that and the 2 bathrooms is a deal breaker, my roomates are a young married couple I am friends with and their infant daughter. We are looking at a lot of 3 br units but those are priced out of our range in the decent areas. Most 3br units are $750-1500. 2br units are going for closer to our budget about $450-1000 but most do not have 2 baths.
bhatten @ 40
I’ve had on-again / off-again relations with various relatives over the years. Still have two that i have no communication with at all.
Had a glorious dinner with much discussion of what the current drought means for our futures and where we might be better off living in terms of natural resources depletion.
On Friday (today) my mom left in tears because of a bag of rice. Baby rice. From India, Bengal. Not exactly local produce: 12,000 miles is a tough sell for me. We try to eat local or at least North American. So mom brought this 400 gram bag of rice with her and gave it to us. I put it back in her travel bag and told her that we’re trying not to do that and that eating rice from 12,000 miles away was part of our collective problems as a nation and that there were probably hungry people in India who could use the rice, etc. As it turned out, the rice was just the metaphorical lynch-pin for all that’s wrong with her life, the universe and everything. She left, insisting that she wanted to be alone and relax. (Never mind the questionable uncouthness of giving back a gift of food — my conscience is heavy.)
I fear she’s just one of millions of baby boomers who’ve lived a golden life of many choices and are just beginning to realize they won’t be able to maintain their standard of living in their old ages and they’re running scared. Headed for a trail of tears. Stay tuned. This cohort is the next big news story that won’t get covered…. feh.
Loo Hoo. @ 38
Menlo Park. Thot if I lived near Stanford I could absorb some of that brainpower by osmosis.
Fini that sounds pretty reasonable, depending on how the neighborhoods are.
The Portland area has a real happening music scene but rent out here is going to be real high.
You would have to find a suburb that hasn’t gone through the roof yet and those are getting few and far between.
2 bdrm is any where from 700-900 and up.
TexBetsy @ 32
That drives me insane.
finifinito @ 33
What about the Peoples Republic of Austin? Is that still affordable?
Donita Sparks @ 47
If ya don’t vote, don’t b*tch…
Whoa, Menlo Park, right between San Francisco and San Jose.
Lots and lots of people down that way.
Are you still going to continue your trips to Russia EG?
Donita Sparks @ 48
Depends on the neighborhood. If you have kids and are looking at school districts, expect to pay. Suburbs are more affordable than central area, but are really SUBURBAN.
That Spindrift song is interesting. Where are they from, LA?
Austin is one of the places that is not considered particularly affordable. Far better than California, but it has not suffered the alot of the mortgage crisis and become a buyer’s market as some places in the recent past. Plus, the property taxes are considered quite high. Depends on who you ask, I guess. But that is the view I hear.
There’s a line there, somewhere. Else the logical holds for libraries to charge rentals for the books (and send shares of such to the authors).
Bluntly put, for artists such as Paul McCartney, having his music downloaded for free is lost money. For an artist like Heather Alexander or Janis Ian or, well, pick any excellent but with tiny audience musician, “pirated” music is free advertising. I’ve found a crapload of outstanding musicians and authors via work for which they received not one thin dime directly - downloads, loans, whatever - because of which I’ve spent thousands of dollars over the years.
Actually, it’s possible even Paul McCartney isn’t really losing. The theory of this is that if you’re so well known advertising is worthless, then advertising is lost money. So, how come I just watched yet another Coca Cola commercial on the television? Surely Coke doesn’t need to tell anyone it exists, not anymore. (hint - sarcasm)
No, it shouldn’t all be free all the time, and we’re going to wind up having some lockup to generate income to gain more. The point is something I would think most firepups would get: Humans are nuanced. Bright lines are for children, idiots, and the desperate.
Kirk Spencer @ 54
Ah but when it’s used as advertising the artist HAS been paid. They have been paid by the corp using the song for the rights to use it in the ad so it isn’t “lost money.”
American Goose @ 43
American Goose, We baby boomers had this as our golden lives. JFK was shot dead. Martin Luther King was killed. Robert F Kennedy was shot. 58,000 plus kids were drafted and killed in Viet Nam. Richard Nixon was president.
We fought in the streets, in our music, with our countrymen to stop the killing.
Maybe she’s just not up to date on the rice thing.
Fini, check with TRex on Athens, GA. He sounded like life is affordable there.
Austin is off the list already because my roomies don’t want to live anywhere that gets overly warm in the summer. We are looking for a moister environment, and the northwest is intriguing to us. Oregon and Washington seem interesting. New England does to a degree, but probably more straight east coast than New England is more ideal. Maybe Virgiania or the Carolinas/Northeast Georgia. Chicago is also on the list because its the largest city in the region. I’m pulling for a more urban enviro than we have in Indy akin to Austin without it being in Texas basically. Is there an Austin like city on the East Coast or in the Northwest?
Then we had the Pinto, the Gremlin, the Pacer and (shudder) DISCO!
AAAAAAAaaaaaauuuuuughggghhhhhh!
There was no bickering - my father-in-law and I defeated my brothers-in-law at cribbage, 5-0, with a skunk on the final hand for 6-0. There was no bickering, we R0o13D!
Donita Sparks @ 39
What fore?
For the joy of music
For awe at the night sky full of stars
For saving the lives of children
For restoring constitutional democracy
For community building at fdl
For exploring my new evolving dreams
finifinito @ 58
Athens is pretty progressive for GA, which isn’t saying much. The most progressive area around Atlanta is probably Decatur but I’m not sure about the rents. Around Gwinett county you can expect to pay 800 - 1000 for a two bedroom, two bath.
American Goose @ 43
I’m sorry. That’s a bummer.
finifinito @ 58
Olympia, WA., might be worth a look.
Powered up for a quick flyby from the tall timber, where the bald eagles soar overhead and the northern ravens take care of the cleanup.
Salut! to Byron Dorgan for taking the Senate duty today. Good on the Senators for giving W a time-out from recess appointments.
Watching NBC and Brian Williams tonight. A change for our usual Grandpa Charlie household. May become a permanent one. I’m impressed with the news coverage.
Reporting on assaults on women in Iraq. Thinking person’s news. Brian may grow on us.
Finifinito look at Urbana IL
Hey all. Mainly we let my sister drone on about how we shouldn’t feel sorry for all the mortgage crisis evictees because they probably had boats and ski-doos and big screen TVs that they bought on credit that they couldn’t afford either.
It’s a cruel, unsupported, prejudiced, and sort of ‘ad hominem in absentia’ position. But we love her, so we listen and nod.
So on the whole ‘nature/nurture’ question, today I’m leaning towards ‘overreaction against essentially kind and enlightened parenting.’ Hard to swallow that we’re built from the same genes.
Hmmm.
darkblack @ 64
Care to elaborate? How is the music scene there? Any good local blogs to read from there?
Hmmmm I am amazed and apalled that my brothers and I are all genetically related.
TexBetsy @ 66
I like Urbana, its not far from Indy. Good idea!
egregious @ 61
And for staying at John and Janice’s for a treat.
How are you egreg?
Hmmm. @ 67
Trust me that many of us have siblings and cousins who experienced the same basic upbringing as we did yet have gone off into the wilds of the wing nut ditto heads and Orally followers.
Bloomington IN is also supposed to be nice.
Go on Craigslist in the cities you like, Fini.
Olympia is spittin distance from Seattle.
How far can you spit Busted?
egregious @ 28
I’m still trying to figure out HOW they managed to dispose of all the rocks they cut out. They certainly did not walk out with it in their pockets a la The Great Escape.
OT, extremely:
One interpretation of “Romeo, Romeo, wherefore art thou Romeo?” is not so much “Yoo-Hoo! Come out, come out, wherever you are! Where are ya, loverboy?” but more like “Why the hell did this guy I’ve been anonymously dating here have to turn out to be, of all possible people, Romeo from the one and only family that my family’s been locked in a blood feud with from time immemorial?”
Yee Haw! LSU goes down in 3OT! Hogs knock them off…
finifinito @ 58
Asheville NC Very cool city. Expensive for here but not if you are from somewhere else.
LS @ 26
LS, Thank You. Wow.
Toby Wollin @ 77
Ha!
Figure of speech hon.
Seattle has a great music scene.Very vibrant.
NewsHour: To have a feature on New Orleans. One more W success.
OT: The Repubs vigorous and phoney claims that the upcoming Pres. debates did not choose NO as a sight had nothing to do with Katrina sounded alittle empty, I have to say.
Kansas City has a good music scene and fairly affordable, I think. But gets very cold in the winter.
We in this state see all these people moving about. We wonder why? I spent almost 40 years that is the the very expensive hussle and bustle that California has become. I was so glad to get away from that rat race. Here you can buy a pretty decent home for less than $50,000 with some land too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhOtCNHdc00
Fini, what about Milwaukee? Pretty cool up there.
OT I havent wanted an Ipod but look at the Kindle. This is so cool but I wish it had FDL
Sold out too….wish I could have one.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/produ.....08170/002-
Donita Sparks @ 87
Madison’s even nicer. But very cold.
Kirk Spencer @ 54
You’d be amazed at how ephemeral the effects of advertising are. There are a gazillion economic studies about the persistence (or lack thereof) of returns to investment in advertising, across a whole range of products and services. Conventional wisdom is that brand equity is a lot easier to lose than it is to build up.
snowbird42 @ 80
I was going to suggest Asheville, too. I have several friends that have moved there who are artists. North Carolina is beautiful. Hot in the summer though.
I have spent too much time in Bloomington, IN. It’s a cool town and all but to me its like Indy too much. I need to get out of this region of the country for a while. I will check out Olympia Wa and Asheville, NC, those are good suggestions. I also plan to check out Athens and Savannah GA too. I have an ex whose father lives in Savannah. Its nice there too.
snowbird42 @ 88
what’s the appeal?
Milwaukee rocks actually. I have family there too. Great idea Donita!
TexBetsy @ 93
You can get a book for 10 bucks instantly. And its small and light. The books stay in your library so they can be read again.
Im going to start a lending library of my political books at our local Democratic Group, I have so many.
Tex, Where are you? I could probably contribute.
finifinito @ 68
College town…State capital… home of K Records<