(Please welcome Dahr Jamail, author of Beyond the Green Zone – Dispatches From an Unembedded Journalist in Occupied Iraq – Siun)
At the core of our work as netroots are two beliefs: first, that individual voices have value and second, that the conventional media has failed to report truthfully about the most important events of our time.
Dahr Jamail’s work reporting from Iraq – and now his book Beyond the Green Zone – is a stunning example of what we miss when our media censors the authentic voices of people.
I had not realized that Dahr was such a true “citizen journalist” but listen to his interview with Amy Goodman at Democracy Now:
And if a guy like me, a mountain guide from Alaska, can get a laptop and a small digital camera and go to Iraq and start reporting on what’s happening and do things like break stories about home raids and torture and white phosphorus being used in Fallujah, then why can’t the corporate media, with their millions and millions of dollars and all the advanced high-tech equipment available to them, why can’t they do it? And that’s the unanswered question.
Dahr’s reporting has been read by many firepups – and we have often talked about his work during our discussions of Iraq – but it is in his new book that we are able to get the full picture, both of his experiences in Iraq and of the horrors that the Iraqi people have faced during America’s invasion and occupation of their land.
Beyond the Green Zone tells us about conditions in Iraq – the lack of employment, clean water, electricity, and above all the desperation of Iraqi doctors. Dahr has visited the hospitals and morgues and reports what he sees – not as cold statistics but as Iraqis face them. Yet even this pales as we read the stories so many Iraqis shared with Dahr and which he shares with us, giving voice to the horror our invasion has created.
As many of you know, Dahr was one of the few to enter Fallujah and to tell the real story of the people who suffered there. From the senseless killings of peaceful protesters that sparked the initial Fallujah battles to the use of white phosphorous and cluster bombs, Dhar reports from the inside.
The boxes of medical supplies we brought into the clinic were torn open immediately by desperate doctors. A woman entered, slapping her chest and face, and wailing as her husband carried in the dying body of her little boy. Blood was trickling off one of his arms, which dangled out of his father’s arms. Thus began my witnessing of an endless stream of women and children who had been shot by the U.S. soldiers and were now being raced into the dirty clinic, the cars speeding over the curb out front, and weeping family members carriying in their wounded…
Standing near the ambulance in frustration, Maki [the manager of the clinic] told us, “They (U.S. soldiers) shot the ambulance and they shot the driver after they checked his car, and knew he was carrying nothing. Then they shot him. And then they shot the ambulance. And now I have no ambulance to evacuate more than twenty wounded people…”
Another car skipped over the curb outside, and a man who was burned from head to toe was carried in on a stretcher. He surely died shortly, as there was no way this clinic could treat massive burns. Maki, frustrated and in shock, said “They say there is a cease-fire. They said twelve o‘clock, so people went out to do some shopping. Everybody who went out to do some shopping. Everybody who went out was shot and this place is full, and half of them are dead.”
Throughout the book, Dahr lets Iraqis speak for themselves and their stories are haunting and horrifying. The brutality of the occupying troops, the encouragement of sectarian divisions, the manipulation of the political forces – all are reported and documented and the impacts are shown in his interviews with everyday Iraqis.
This is the Iraq we do not see on CNN or read about in the Washington Post, the Iraq that is hidden behind all the talk of surges and improvement and surreal debates about policy that consistently ignore the reality on the ground, the terror we have brought to the lives of these people.
Beyond the Green Zone is the very best of independent reporting – by a citizen who just could not stomach the lies, who put himself on the line to learn and tell the truth. This is an important book – for we, as citizens of the occupying power, have a responsibility to face what is being done in our name and then to do all we can to stop it.
Related posts:
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Dahr Jamail, The Will to Resist: Soldiers Who Refuse to Fight in Iraq and Afghanistan
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Jurgen Todenhofer, Why Do You Kill?: The Untold Story of the Iraqi Resistance
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Paul Tough, Whatever It Takes: Geoffrey Canada’s Quest to Change Harlem and America
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Leigh Stringer, The Green Workplace
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Howard Dean, Howard Dean’s Prescription for Real Healthcare Reform





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Thanks so much for being here today Dahr.
siun
Thanks Laura, and Siun, it’s very good to be here.
Welcome Dahr to the Lake – it is quite an honor to get to chat with you today.
Reading Beyond the Green Zone was a stunning experience and I was hard pressed to find a way to “review it” when what I really wanted to say was just “You must read this book!”
Siun and Dahr!
I really appreciate that Siun. The book was indeed a labor of love, and thus far I’m quite taken aback by how warm the reception has been.
As I mentioned above Dahr – I had not realized you were such a “citizen” journalist. Can you tell us a bit about how you decided to go to Iraq?
Welcome Mr Jamail.. I just want to say straight away how good it is to have you here alive and well!
I was living in Anchorage, Alaska when the drumbeat for war against Iraq began. I spent summers working on Denali (Mt. McKinley) as a guide, and then as a volunteer with the Nat’l Park Service doing rescues. I’d done a little freelance journalism, but nothing war related. I was aghast at the so-called journalism being carried out by the establishment media regarding the coverage of WMD accusations by the Bush administration, links to 9/11, etc. I was appalled, to be frank. So the short version of the story is, I decided that this administration could not have gotten away with launching an illegal war without a complicit establishment media. So I figured one thing I could do, as a U.S. citizen, would be to go see the occupation myself and write home to fiends in AK about what I saw.
Dahr @ 6
Thank you for telling the truth.
This is an extraordinary book which should be read by any legislator who considers voting another dollar for the American occupation of Irak. I am more than halfway through it, Mr Jamail, and I am absolutely horrified at the story you tell.
How can we not know what is being done to humanity in our name?
I want to especially thank you for the vignettes you include about children. Every time I read about a child in your book, I wonder: what must that child think of me and my country, and how long will that child live with those irrevocable feelings? And is there anything I can do to change that child’s life?
Thank you so much for the courage it took to write this book, Mr Jamail, and thank you Siun for hosting the Book Salon today.
My question is: where will your citizen journalism take you next?
Eureka Springs @ 8
Thank you very much!
Thank you so much Mr. Jamail. The US occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan violates every military principle I know of as well as common sense. Ambassador Joe Wilson was here in December and opined that we might have to fight our way out. I wondered if you had an opinion.
TeddySanFran @ 11
I am continuing to cover the Middle East for now-I’ve been going to Syria/Lebanon/Jordan for the last few years, to document the growing refugee crisis. For now, my plan is to continue doing that, while I decide what I would like to write my next book about. And thank you for your warm comments.
Hey, Dahr! Keep up the
goodfucking incredible work. We miss you up here in Alaska. Can’t wait to read the book, when my order comes in.Boo Radley @ 13
My experiences in talking with members of the Iraqi Resistance would contradict his claims of the US “having to fight their way out” of Iraq. If/when the US gov’t is ever truly serious about total withdrawal, they would be allowed to leave. The problem is, neither US policy nor any of the leading presidential candidates on either side of the aisle are serious about total withdrawal.
Thanks so much for being here, Dahr. We’re long time fans of your work here at FDL.
Ed*ard Teller @ 15
Thanks Ed! I miss Alaska, and should be up there sometime in Feb. as part of my book tour.
Well done, Siun, and welcome Dahr. Recent media reports claim there has been a reverse in the flow of refugees back into Iraq, and claims that people are returning to their homes — can you give us your perspective on what is really happening? Thanks.
Dahr @ 18
I’ll be there. Let us know if you need any help.
Scarecrow @ 19
This is an important question. Read this report carefully-the Nov. 3 AP report on this quotes Sattar Nawrous, a spokesman for the Ministry of Displacement and Migration in Iraq. He was appointed by Maliki, who was appointed by the US. His claim has not been verified by an independent source. While it is true that a small number of families are returning-it is because Syria recently (last month) imposed visa restrictions-thus forcing those trying to leave to return home.
Hello Dahr Jamail!
I have ben collecting your dispatches at my mailbox for quite awhile now. Good to hear from you.
I have read conflicting claims about “al Qaeda in Iraq” actually being some of the Sunni tribal leaders. I believe this is a viewpoint from Robert Fisk; can you bring some light onto this murky subject?
Next, along the al Qaeda line, is there a deliberate attempt to make Salafis wear the al Qaeda label?-even if same Salafis are not al Qaeda?
Again, great to hear from you and see a photo.
Thank you for all your efforts.
The reality of the refugee crisis generated by the occupation is that it is catastrophic. The group Refugees International has labeled it the fastest growing refugee crisis on earth. Daily, between 2000-3000 people are being driven from their homes. The most conservative estimates available today show 2.2 million IDPs (internally displaced peoples) and over 2.5 million who have fled the country altogether.
Hi Dahr,
What’s really going on in Anbar? It appears that the Sunnis are negotiating with the americans for a bigger piece of the pie? What exactly do they want and will they get it in your opinion? Are the Kurds about to lose some oil?
Thanks, Dahr, for bringing important news at incredible risk to you. I recently heard Dr. Saad Eskander, the Director General of the Iraqi National Library and Archives (the US equivalent of the Library of Congress and the Nat’l Archives) speak, and I read his blog about his daily home and work life. He also is bringing a much needed perspective of reality, hardship and ongoing terror as an integral part of daily life to the public. He also was pleading for more amplification of his message that the US Army took possession of and refuses to return 25,000 items from the INLA immediately after the April 2003 invasion. Do you know Dr. Eskander and his work? If so, would you care to comment in relation to your own observations?
Welcome, Dahr. I remember seeing you in Santa Barbara at the screening of “Caught in the Crossfire” about the US military’s destruction of Falluja.
Can you comment on how the refugee population in Syria is faring. I understand Syria has been generous in allowing Iraqis into their country.
Annie @ 25
Welcome Dahr!
I am in the process of reading Beyond the Green Zone right now. It is a sometimes difficult read as I get so very angry at the incredible stupidity and arrogance my country has displayed.
Are there any decisions that have been made by the CPA and/or Army that have not back-fired due to incompetence, negligence or racism?
Have any of the so-called journalists from the TradMed contacted you and apologized for their failures to tell the truth?
The story of the Army arresting and taking away the 16 boys from the school resonated with me a bit as I attended a military HS and wonder how I would have responded if my country had been attacked as we attacked Iraq.
And as someone who followed the Vietnam era while living it, I am dismayed that our leaders have learned so little that they are still doing the “five o’clock follies.”
Dahr Jamail;
You are a person of rare courage and immense humanity.
If the ‘leaders’ of this nation had but one-one-hundredth of the decency you demonstrate, our world would be far more humane and just.
Several questions, if I may;
1. How have Iraq-War Veterans responded to your words?
2. Have ANY main-stream-media types had the courage or intellectual honesty to speak with you?
rwcole @ 24
Another great question-Anbar is now basically a macro of what the US did after failing to take Fallujah in April 2004. They armed the fighters to the gills, put them on the US payroll, claimed they were turning things over to the Iraqis, and used a media campaign to portray the situation as settled. This is what they are doing in Anbar-buying off tribes that were actively fighting them….it is now a ticking time bomb, just as Fallujah was before.
I toured the Marine Museum at Ft Belvoir in August, and was very surprised to hear a retired Marine tour guide say that “Fallujah will soon be added to the list of heroic battles fought by the US Marines.” I bit my tongue, as I believe what happened there was a War Crime.
What hope do you have that there will be War Crimes Tribunals for the incidents documented in your work, as well as others?
Does it all depend on who writes the prevailing history?
peony @ 26
Iraqi refugees now comprise over 10 percent of the total population of Syria. This has forced the Syrian gov’t, last month, to impose visa restrictions-so now Iraqis trying to flee the violence find it more difficult to arrive there with the new restrictions. It is dis-heartening, as Syria, at least until last month, was the only country on the planet that allowed Iraqi refugees without restrictions.
Thanks so much for your incredible efforts, Dahr! I haven’t read the book yet, but it’s at the top of my list.
(And, TeddySanFran just stole my question!)
dakine01 @ 28
To date, aside from the NY Times “kinda culpa”, there has been no apologies from other corporate media outlets that I am aware of.
I haven’t been here in weeks. Got too much work to read the comments.
But I HAD to say that this book is extraordinary, and I think you are a brave and principled person to witness what has been going on.
Thank you for your courage and honesty. You may never be safe again, but perhaps you have only just revealed the peril we all face under this insane government.
There have been comparisons made between what we’ve done to Fallujah and what the Nazis did to Lidice. The main difference is that Lidice was smaller and easier to wipe off the map.
SteveNS @ 33
Realistically, I don’t hope for that until the US empire project is over. Only then, might there be war crimes trials…but as long as the empire is intact, the US will not join the ICC because it still has the biggest guns.
Bottom line… Do you think the USA wants chaos and will use that as a cover to somehow gain access to oil in the region?
Phoenix Woman @ 36
yes-this is a very accurate comparison-even moreso than my comparison of Fallujah to Guernica.
I am still astonished that you were able to get into Fallujah – and so grateful that you had the courage to do so … how else would we have any idea what really happened there?
What is life like for people in Fallujah now?
SanderO @ 38
Condi Rice has spoken of this directly…and as the US policy in the region continues, it is growing more difficult for me to argue that this is not deliberate.
Dahr — there have been a series of trials/courts martial involving US troops charged with killing Iraqi. Several have been dismissed, or charges downgraded, or resulted in acquittals. An overall impression is that US military tribunals are unlikely to convict US soldiers of serious crimes — we’ve seen little or no reporting in US media of how this is perceived by the Iraqis themselves. What is the perception there?
Mea Culpoa is one thing, but there are levels of complicity. Did the media simply regurgitate what the DOD was saying without any investigative reporting or fact checking whatsoever?
How do you square the fact that many outside the media “smelled” a rat in this story? Not a tad of skepticism from the press? Ha?
Welcome Dahr Jamail!
I’ve had a burning question that I’ve wanted to ask someone who has lived the “reality” of Iraq from other than a combatant-perspective/
Let me preface my question with my take on the situation. For both the Iraqis and the US, our staying is bad, and our leaving is bad.
American’s typically believe that “if we only try harder, we can make something good happen.”
I’m resigned to believing that there are no positive outcomes that we can expect from our invasion of Iraq.
And that gets to the heart of my question, which is, your insight as to whether Iraqis themselves realistically believe that Iraq as a country will survive, or that it is in the process of disintegration along religious/ethnic/tribal lines?
Siun @ 40
Thank you. Fallujah today remains largely destroyed. I have an Iraqi colleague who I continue to do stories with for Inter Press Service. He lives in Fallujah. He estimates there is about 80 percent unemployment there today, there continue to be sporadic attacks on occupation forces, and entire neighborhoods remain without electricity or water. Nightly curfews continue, as do vehicle bans throughout the city.
Scarecrow – I was just reading this morning about another set of acquittals … the soldiers involved were instead convicted of planting weapons on the bodies of the Iraqis they killed.
Scarecrow @ 42
This is exactly the perception in Iraq. And one could easily argue that these so-called courtmartials which are just show-trials are actually making things more dangerous for US soldiers, as the trials are driving more folks into the resistance out of anger and desperation.
Siun @ 46
This has been common practice for over two years now. There is photographic proof of this I’ve seen myself.
I was curious what you thought about Hubris Sonic’s analysis — that any drop in violence is directly related to military withdrawal from a particular region, and spiking where it is escalating.
Dahr, can you, have you been able to comprehend where the amoral willingness to mislead us about Iraq, by Members of Congress, comes from – or what warped world, or racist, views allow those legislators to continue their willing suspension of disbelief about the myths fed to them by the Pentagon about Iraq, in the debates both before and during our involvement, and in discussions of the anticipated after-effects of any U.S. withdrawal?
Who are these people “representing” us and willingly, knowingly, purposely allowing this inhuman, humanitarian catastrophe to be actively underwritten by this nation?
[Siun, well said: you wrote a superb introduction.]
Mad Dogs @ 44
You are right in assuming it will be bad whether or not the US stays. But I defer to the Iraqis-over 85 percent of which now want the US out right away. But we have to be clear-that this is a puppet gov’t in Baghdad. Maliki was not democratically chosen, he was installed to replace Jaafari. So there is no democracy in Iraq. Iraqis are willing to risk the power vacuum that will happen after the withdrawal, rather than carrying forward with this failed occupation.
The book is amazing.. Sometimes I fear more words on Iraq might wear me down or dull my senses.. This book puts an arch in your back, sometimes I literally found myself pacing while reading. It left me with renewed determination to do something, anything and everything humanly possible to stop our end of the madness.
OMG Dahr – a hero of mine!!! Been following you for a long time. Thank you for your bravery and outstanding work.
Jane Hamsher @ 49
I haven’t read the full analysis-but what you say here I agree with. My experience, as well as most of the Iraqis I talk with is just this-that the primary cause of violence, chaos and instability is the occupation. Each time they pull out of an area, things improve. Each time they enter an area, things grow worse.
I must say I was struck when I first saw the phrase “collective punishment” used in your book, as we know that is a War Crime. I have become accustomed to it now, though, as I read more. It is amazing that our troops, or our mercenaries, have taken these actions, and it must be known up the chain.
I am interested to know more about the orders given about Fallujah, and how high up outside the military chain they originated. Could this really be a parallel to Lidice in that way too?
Eureka Springs @ 52
Thank you. Most of my colleagues would agree with me that this is one of the highest compliments we could get for our work.
Who make up the refugees and who make up those who are staying? Is the professional class fleeing as much as the working class? What happened to Riverbend?
TeddySanFran @ 55
Jane Hamsher @ 49
Or Jane, it may be as simple as the US “not patroling” as much. If you don’t send your troops out into the neighborhoods, you don’t get shot or blown up as much.
Think of it as “garrison duty” where you don’t leave the garrison.
Dahr,
I think you were answering my question @25, but after you quoted my question, your response was cut off. Would you please address any observations or familiarity you may have about the work of the Iraq National Library and Archives?
Having read Dr. Eskander’s blog and hearing him speak passionately about the work he’s doing, the audience (myself included) believe that his life is in imminent danger, as he is direct about complaining to and about the Iraq national government. I’d like your perspective on those remaining in Iraq’s professional sector and how their lives are affected at the moment. His response to our concerns?
“I am just doing my job. I am not a hero.”
Thanks-
SanderO @ 57
Riverbend is now in Syria with her family. She is safe…at least for now. I just heard from her.
The professional class has, as usual in wars, been the first to go and the hardest hit. Brain drain, in that doctors, professors, lawyers, etc, fled because they were the most able, financially, to leave, and also because they were and are heavily targeted by kidnapping rings.
Mr. Jamail you’re described on wikipedia as an anti-Iraq War activist.
Are you opposed to just the Iraq war or all wars under any conditions?
Annie @ 60
My hat is off to the doctor-it is critical work because the majority of what was looted has never been seen again. Although I’m not personally familiar with his work.
Dahr…
Thanks so much for your reporting. We receive it via DemocracyNow! Can you clone yourself?
One of the most stunning things in Dahr’s book is the clear picture of how the loss of the professional class, esp doctors and medical professionals has left so many Iraqis with no way to get emergency care
CD @ 62
I opposed the invasion of Iraq because it was based on lies. I am not a pacifist. While I do believe, as Robert Fisk says, “War is the total failure of the human spirit,” I understand that war is part of the world in which we live. In addition, I don’t consider myself an activist.
Dahr! Always good to hear your “voice”!
Pray continue. :o)
Do you have a favorite candidate yet?
I ask, because I think Iraq is on it’s way to becoming THE issue in the campaign, both in the primaries and in the general election.
I have to ask this, because I read it a long time ago and have wondered what the deal is/was. Supposedly, illegal alien soldiers serving in Iraq for the US, were buried to conceal that they were serving….????
Is it true?
“The brother of Reuters cameraman Mazen Dana said he was deliberately murdered for discovering mass graves of U.S. troops killed in Iraqi resistance attacks.
“The U.S. troops killed my brother in cold blood,” Nazmi Dana told IslamOnline.net in exclusive statements.
“The U.S. occupation troops shot dead my brother on purpose, although he was wearing his press badge, which was also emblazoned on the car he was driving,” he said.
He also recalled that his brother had obtained a prior permit from the U.S. occupation authorities in Iraq to film in the site.
On Sunday, August 17, U.S. troops shot dead the award-winning Reuters cameraman while he was filming near the U.S.-run Abu Gharib prison in Baghdad.
His last pictures show a U.S. tank driving toward him outside the prison walls, several shots ring out from the tank and the camera falls to the ground.
Mass Grave
“Mazen told me by phone few days before his death that he discovered a mass grave dug by U.S. troops to conceal the bodies of their fellow comrades killed in Iraqi resistance attacks,” Nazmi said.
“He also told me that he found U.S. troops covered in plastic bags in remote desert areas and he filmed them for a TV program. We are pretty sure that the American forces had killed Mazen knowingly to prevent him from airing his finding.”
It’s hard to believe that the so called “planners” did not know the chaos which would ensue. I would guess that they seriously wanted to turn Iraq into a “basket case” which would “require” a colonial daddy to make it work at all and of course, distribute the oil wealth to the Iraqi people… yeah right.
Dahr @ 66
Thank you very much Mr. Jamail.
Tanbark @ 67
This assumes we’ll have a legitimate election in 2008…which would be a stretch when we consider 2000 and 2004. But if I had to vote today, it would only be for a candidate that supports full, unconditional, immediate withdrawal.
SanderO @ 69
There is much to support your idea. Recall, Henry Kissinger was talking about his hopes of partitioning Iraq as long ago as the 1970’s.
Thank you so much for the good news about Riverbend.
FWIW, imo Vichy Democrats make a huge mistake by allowing Bush to talk about Iraq in isolation to the wider destabilization that his invasion and occupation is causing through out the region.
OT, I really appreciate you continuing to talk in terms of things like electricity and employment.
The HAVA folks are pressuring NYS to use unreliable voting machines. So, the net effect is that NYS could go red and it would be in fact, lost as there would be no paper trail. With so many electoral votes the right is reaching for NYS with the cover that there is Guiliani support here. Florida, then Ohio and now they are going after CA and NY.
LS @ 68
I heard stories of this from all over Iraq, even as far back as my first trip there, in November 2003. But I never found any hard evidence that would support this. It is not out of the realm of possibility, as this sort of thing occurred in Vietnam, but the implications of such an accusation are so enormous that to report on this would require a LOT of hard evidence, of which I’ve seen none.
Siun @ 65
And even when there are professionals available, fear keeps folks away:Dental students cannot find patients to work at the school clinic, as people avoid hospitals. To make matters worse, there’s a grave lack of medications and supplies.
Laura Doty @ 76
Yes-and it’s important to remember full context for this when we look at things like medical care-that this war was launched while Iraq had been strangled by 12.5 years of the harshest economic sanctions in modern history…where entire hospitals didn’t even have aspirin to give to patients. Remember Albright’s infamous quote about how she felt half a million dead Iraqi children was worth the price. This has been a bi-partisan war that has spanned decades.
Dahr,
Can you comment on the “real” number of Iraqi causalities. The USA official number is below 50K and the Lancet study is something like 1MM. Big gap here… Mind into the gap, as they say in the UK
Your thoughts?
Dahr, thanks for cutting to the chase.
That would be “mind the gap”…
Throughout your book Dahr, the willingness of Iraqis to speak to an American and the simple hospitality shown is so striking … and I continue to wonder how anyone still functions day to day in Iraq … yet you tell of so many people continuing to do what needs to be done to help others. It’s quite a lesson for all of us.
Dahr, as far as you know, was there ANY evidence that the allegations three years ago about Allawi shooting those captured prisoners out of hand, were true?
Imagine burying you friend or family in the backyard because the fighting continues at such fierce rate there is nothing else you can do.. Once the fighting calms enough, you have to dig them up and move their body to a cemetery.
Laura Doty @ 76
my question is: If the lack of medicine and withholding of hospital equipment which began under the clinton/gore/albright ’sanctions’ enforcement and the situation has further deteriorated; what hope is there for the Iraqui people that they will ever again have normal and proper medical care?
Dahr,
In any occupation, a certain percentage of the local population gets into be with the occupiers (literaly and figuratively) how large a group is this currently in Iraq- and would they be tolerated in the event of a US withdrawal?
Dahr,
How were you able to get into Iraq and move about freely? Do you speak Arabic? Where did you do the writing of your book?
Thanks
Hi Dahr!
Greetings from the (Sort Of) Still Frozen Northland. I’ll be ordering your book shortly from this place, as soon as I get my paycheck this week.
This is Liam signing in from Fairbanks. I had my camera with me when you came up here to speak back in March. I took a few pictures of you and you had asked me to send them your way.
I forgot about that until I just remembered. Your email address at your website is a good adress for you?
(if so, I will send them to you forthwith)
If you go through my Flickr photostream, you’ll see some of the pictures I took of some of our protests here in the past year or so.
I am at the Rasmuson Library right now, doing some research on Don Young, so I have to take off.
go ahead and email me (lettermanATmosquitonetDOTcom) and I’ll get the pictures to you
SanderO @ 78
Very important question. The real number is now well beyond the 655,000 total which was found by the report published in the Lancet medical journal in Oct. 2006. The legwork for that was carried out in July 2005. Thus, I look now to the figure provided by the group Just Foreign Policy, which is up over 1 million dead.
Regarding Iraq Body Count-they are not legitimate, nor have they ever been. Any journalist who quotes their figure is sloppy, at best….for even on their site they admit they are not a total number, they only count deaths reported by three different media outlets, and they don’t consider an outlet legitimate if they don’t have an English website. They are not credible, other than giving people an idea of how many deaths are being reported by 3 different media outlets which have English websites.
Dahr, May I ask what languages you speak?
Tanbark @ 82
I’ve never investigated this…but what I did see appeared to verify that it did occur.
Eureka Springs @ 89
English and a little Spanish, and very little Arabic. I worked with very good translators in Iraq, and continue to work with many of them in Syria/Lebanon/Jordan.
LetterMan @ 87
Thanks! You can contact me via my website email: mail@dahrjamailiraq.com
A million dead is basically genocide and goes beyond collateral damage.
How extensive is the US bombing campaign lately? We are led to believe (I think wrongly) that the US is involved in house to house work and not bombing. What is the truth here?
Now that you say that about Kissinger and his Irak Partition plan, so much that Viceroy Bremer did makes more sense. There was a clear plan for chaos, disenfranchisement, and sectarian strife all along, do you think?
Dahr – our friends at GorillasGuides have been tracking the spread of cholera in Iraq and I noticed your reporting about water conditions from early on … we’ve encouraged people to donate to Red Crescent as the only way to get aid to people in Iraq facing this. Today’s reports mention the spread of cholera to Baghdad.
SanderO @ 93
You make a very important point. According to a recent AP story on the US Air Force in Iraq, 5 times as many bombs have been dropped on Iraq in the first 6 months of this year, as compared to the same period last year. It is like Vietnam, in that as the US loses control of the ground, more air power is used, thus, continued increases in civilian casualties.
As an FYI point of reference about the professionals, here are stats about the Iraq Nat’l Library and Archives staff from Dr. Eskander’s January 2007 blog entries:
TeddySanFran @ 94
I do. Which is one reason I spend so much time in my book on the death squads, sectarian instigations, etc.
Siun @ 95
I’m grateful they are tracking this-thank you.
Annie @ 97
This is horrific but not surprising. Thank you.
Dahr,
Are you single? (just kidding, I’m old and a lesbian lol)
Thank you for your absolutely amazing work. You are owed a debt of gratitude by all people who need truth.
My question: do you ever speculate personally on how this war/atrocity might ever end? What might it look like? I realize you’re an on-the-ground reporter and not a pundit, but I’d be interested in your thoughts.
I’ve always thought that the discussion of Bernie Kerik’s appearance in Iraq in Imperial Life in the Emerald City suggested that Kerik was involved in encouraging or more the rise of death squads in Iraq … and today there’s a report that Maliki is openingly welcoming 18,000 militia members including from the Badr Corps into the army and police.
Dahr,
How large is the presence of mainstream media in Iraq? What do you think of the work of Lara Logan?
Is the MSM going to slip out and not cover Iraq and attribute this to war coverage fatigue and focus more on the elections or Paris Hilton?
Hello,
Thank you for recommending the film “Caught in the Crossfire.” I’ve shown that to a number of people.
In your book you write that US Special Forces were sent to “advise, support and train Iraqi death squads.” and that they were “hand-picked from the Kurdish Peshmerga, Shi’ite Mehdi army, and Badr army militias.”
You mention a Newsweek article saying the Pentagon was considering something like this, but I was wondering how you know this actually
happened – I’ve never seen it reported anywhere else.
Thanks very much.
Sharkbabe @ 101
Thanks-I’m still flattered. :) How will it end? Realistically, this is my guess from how things are today: The US Empire collapses for economic reasons…this eventually forces it to withdrawal its military from Iraq, Afghanistan, and other places around the globe (like the over 725 military bases and installations), and only when the US withdraws from Iraq will there be a truly sovereign gov’t there with popular support, which would bring the violence and sectarian strife to an end.
Dahr, What of the situation in Basra? I gather the brits are basically hunkered down behind the wire at the airport and are pretty much of a non-factor, except they are there in case the occupation’s lifeline, the Kuwait to Baghdad highway is threatened.
Is Basra willingly going to stay a part of “greater Iraq” and will whomever controls the oil down there continue to send the revenues from it to the central government in the green zone?
Siun @ 102
Yes, and Ret. Col. James Steele is the other name to pay attention to.
Dahr says November 11th, 2007 at 3:07 pm:
You’re welcome.
Eureka Springs @ 52
You remind me of Bernie Sanders saying in a truthout interview that he would support a 24/7 effort focussed on withdrawal from Iraq and to let the Republicans filibuster. He thinks it’s a good idea, even though other domestic policy issues like work on bills for education and health care would not be addressed.
A “bi-partisan war.” According to Washington, D.C.’s present currency, that translates as “all good.” You can’t get better than “bi-partisan” in the bad publicity-phobic environs of Capitol Hill.
Perhaps the publicity-hounds in our Congress, currying their images to the exclusion of all else, might spend a moment contemplating their places-to-be in the chronicles of some of the worst of man’s inhumanity to man in world history, once uncensored truth finally returns to the written page, and to the television broadcasts of this country. That notoriety will more than offset, even without an election at stake, any present comfort zone provided by the censored official press, which now fiercely protects (only) those who pursue and enforce the corporate agenda.
SanderO @ 103
I am not familiary with Lara Logan’s work. MSM-I prefer to call them corporate or establishment media, as they in no way represent the mainstream of the US. At this point, the corporate media, with few exceptions, does not come close to accurately portraying the reality on the ground in Iraq. But things will continue to degrade in Iraq to a point where they will be forced to at least give it air time, despite the wishes of the ownership of said outlets. Particularly so when the airstrikes begin against Iran.
WOW Dahr,
I have been saying the USA will have an economic meltdown and one of two things will happen: full on fascist style repressive government, or (less likely) a re emergence of democracy and a complete repudiation of the right and its beliefs. In the meantime we spiral down the drain, taking the world with us. Thanks GWB, heckuva job, Mission Accomplished!
Daniel @104 – I’m interested to hear Dahr’s response but you should know that the administration quite openly discussed the launching of the “Salvador Option” which is what Newsweek reported. Here’s the link to the Newsweek article: Newsweek
Considering the game of chaos looks as if it was not a happenstance… can we begin to look at 911 and see it as a planned event by some “rogue forces” who want to get the USA into a war footing in the ME?
911 as a cause looks more and more like it wasn’t a stroke of luck for the forces of evil in the MIC.
What say you?
Welcome to Dubhaltach @108.
Dahr – Du is a member of the GorillasGuides team which includes numerous Iraqi bloggers.
Siun @ 113
Yes-I discuss this at length in the book. US-backed deathsquads had long since been implemented in Iraq, months before the Newsweek article. They were being run via the Min. of Interior….Negroponte and Steele were instrumental-as they were when they worked together in Central America in the 1980’s.
Siun @ 115
Thanks-I’ve just bookmarked them and will utilize as a resource from now on!
One thing we’ve discussed here often is whether there are ways – beyond doing what we do to try to stop the occupation – to help the Iraqi people. So far, our suggestion has been to give money to Red Crescent but I’m curious if you have any other suggestions.
Siun @118
My sense is that the USA should get completely out and an international NGO should deal with Iraq and the USA should pay the bill. The USA brand is completely spoiled at this point.
Siun @ 118
This group, Emergency:
http://www.emergency.it/menu.php?A=001&ln=En
They run clinics in Iraq-and most of their staff are Iraqis-many of them former patients! They do fantastic work-and yes, Red Crescent is great too.
Dahr, do you know where Ahmed Chalabi is presently operating behind the scenes, and are we (U.S. State Department and/or DOD) his current enabler and protector?
Also – would you say that the Iraqi parliament is effectively a U.S. puppet too, or does it more or less represent the Iraqi people, when it (rarely) gets a chance to meet and act?
Dahr, has anyone approached you about testifying before Congress?
As we do your reports – so that is only fair :-)
All our stuff is free for taking btw so nobody need ever ask.
Do you have any info on the diarrheal disease situation in Fallujah. We know that some doctors there took an initiatiive to set up monitoring unit – but then there was no more information coming out after that.
I appreciate hearing view Dahr, thank you.
pow wow, that’s a good question about Chalabi.
He has more lives that a cat. I would think he’s a good mine canary. When he hops on a Lear for his London Townhouse, we’ll know the jig is about up.
pow wow @ 121
Chalabi is now being hailed as the “Iraqi” in charge of bringing back electricity/water/etc. to areas in Baghdad that have been suffering. (ie-the entire capital city.) He is a stooge, as he always has been, and wouldn’t last 5 minutes in Iraq without US backing.
For the Iraqi gov’t, while there are a fair number of MP’s who do work in the interests of the Iraqis, Maliki and his cabinet are puppets. Keep in mind, most of those in the gov’t were elected because they promised a timetable for withdrawal…and that was the first thing that the US did not allow them to deliver. Thus, overall, the gov’t has very, very little popular support. In fact, recent polls show that less than one percent of Iraqis support the gov’t.
Boo Radley @ 122
No.
Dubhaltach and Dahr, do either of you have an opinion about this program: The Collateral Repair Project? It looks like a good program, but so hard to know from a distance.
And thank you both, again and again for what you and those working with you do.
Mod note: Link repaired
Dubhaltach @ 123
I don’t. Please email me about this via my site-I can follow up for you-I have contacts there.
Laura Doty @ 128
I can’t pull up the site-is it down?
Mod note: Link repaired
Here’s a working link to The Collateral Repair Project.
Thank you either I or Omar will do that our correspondent there left for Baghdad for a week to see relatives two months ago and now is being forbidden to return even though he has the biometric ID card.
Don’t know if you’re still reading, Mr. Jamail, but I saw you speak and got your book recently. Haven’t gotten too far, as I want to absorb and not just breeze past — reading it feels almost like witnessing, as much as learning. I am pleased to see this important work getting some blogosphere love.
Here is the correct Collateral Repair Project link.
Dahr,
Thanks.
Any predictions for tomorrow?
Thank you Siun and ES. I double http’d. Sorry.
Dubhaltach @ 132
Good. And yes, that happens to my people there too….I’ll spare the curse words.
Dahr – can you tell us a bit about your book tour and how people are receiving your book?
Pups – here’s a link for Book Tour dates – Dahr on the road
caia @ 133
Thank you very much.
Siun @ 138
Are the gaps times you have available? I see you’ll be in SF early in 2008. Would love to help arrange an engagement in Sonoma County. Whom should I contact on your end?
Siun @ 138
The book was launched Oct. 15 in NYC on Democracy Now! That kicked off the tour, which has been a bit frenetic, with me literally going to a different city each day at times. But it has been well organized, thanks to my publisher Haymarket Books. The readings/presentations have been well received-the average audience between 150-200 folks, asking really great questions, and pleased with the book being released. I have felt a lot of hope seeing so many people so engaged…which directly contradicts what people say individually-that Americans are apathetic, lazy, etc. That’s just not what I’m seeing as I travel around the US.
By the way – you report a lot on Bechtel’s role in the occupation. Did they get paid even though they did nothing to help the people of Iraq get water supplies back? Given developments like the spread of cholera, I would sure like to see those payments rescinded!
Hey,
I’m just thinking, there are a bunch of people on this site right now who’ve read this amazing book. Even though amazon is not a site I personally support, they are used extensively for ordering/rating/etc. of books by book stores and individuals all over the country. How about when this chat is over (or right now) we all go and review Dahr’s book? I’m sure it would help (at least a little) with spreading the word… (No need to comment on this Dahr– thanks for the discussion, and your incredible work!)
C.
Siun @ 142
Bechetel withdrew from Iraq completely in November 2006. They were paid $2.3 billion for their contracts. Many of their projects were never even started, and most never completed. Of course their reports claim the opposite, but the facts on the ground in Iraq are the proof. On every measurable level, Iraq’s infrastructure today is worse than it was during Saddam’s rule, under the sanctions.
Very good idea Claire!
That’s one way – along with ordering the book – that we can help spread the word.
Dahr,
Thanks for your citizen journalism, which takes far more commitment and work than many of us can manage. Your voice and testimony is very important, and I appreciate it!
Bob in HI
Laura Doty @ 140
If you email me directly via my site, I can get folks in touch with my tour organizer who can set up dates. But FYI, her name and email are here:
Sarah Macaraeg
sarah.macaraeg@gmail.com
bobschacht @ 146
Thank you Bob. The only reason I tell my personal story is to show people that anyone can do this work.
Dahr @ 144
Stuart Bowen the US auditor in Iraq in an April report noted that most of those projects which were completed were not maintained and were no longer usable.
claire @ 143
Not a bad idea. I’ve also heard, from previous book-boosting experiences, that one way to draw attention on Amazon if you do buy from there is to buy a book with a better-known book with a similar appeal.
This can make the book show up in the “customers who bought this also bought” space.
If those who haven’t bought the book yet (and who don’t have a local independent bookstore they want to support) all bought it with, say, Blackwater by Jeremy Scahill, or some other likeminded book, that might make a difference.
Hugh – thanks for that note. One more way of “blaming the Iraqis” eh? Claiming all this lovely work was done and just not maintained … argh!
SanderO @ 69
There was no way for them to know. During the American Civil War when Atlanta and Richmond were evacuated there was widespread looting. This was less than 150 years ago. Too early to draw any conclusions.
We’re winding up our Book Salon time here – and I suspect Dahr could use a break!
Thank you so much Dahr for visiting with us today – and more for the work that you have been doing. Your reporting is inspiring and so important. And the human connection you provide for us readers to the people of Iraq and their experiences matters in so many ways.
Please come back and visit with us again – we’re always here and eager to learn.
And firepups – read the book! it really is astonishing. You can also subscribe to Dahr’s alerts here – I find them invaluable.
Thanks Dahr.
We need more Dahrs!
Siun @ 153
Thank you so much Siun. It’s been great with great questions-which I believe to be extremely important nowadays. I hope to come back for more. Much appreciation for your support and wonderful intro.
Thank you Siun and special thanks to Dahr. I’ve ordered your book and am going to hassle my local bookstores to carry it (was dismayed to discover this week no one does!) Hope to meet you in person in Sonoma County next year!
Stay safe.
Thanks Dahr, Great success with the tour! Come back and see us at the lake.. There’s always a clean towel and lots of firedogs scheming on changing our imperialist ways..)
Thanks so much, everyone. Dahr I hope you’ll stop by again. It was great to have you here. And Siun, thanks for leading such a great book salon.
Very informative.
Why Iraq? Oil.
Thank you for providing your insight and observations. I perceive a disconnect in what caring Americans think that they can do (or not do as the case may be), and the perception that Americans are not interested. I believe that the lack of coverage by traditional media is intentional and serves the purpose of furthering the aims and objectives of the military-industrial-governmental complex.
What we must continue to do is to remain informed and essentially perform the same sort of mission and work as the original Sons of Liberty – spreading the word in a timely and accurate fashion.
I do believe that the US has already experienced a coup, and that there are now two distinct “we’s”: the we of the government elected and appointed officials, who are accountable and who respond solely to the corporatists, lobbyists and partisans, and the we of we the people who are now without any means of effective representation and who are intentionally, deliberately and increasingly oppressed.
This will make it extraordinarily difficult to bring pressure to bear on withdrawing military presence from Iraq and bringing robust, effective and genuine diplomatic and economic efforts in its place.
I now wonder if it won’t take the UN and external pressure – e.g. sanctions – against the US to force changes in a direction more compatible with our former republic.
FYI, new post upstairs
Eureka Springs @ 157
Thanks much! Sounds like a great plan. I’ll be back.
wow! just wow! thanks siun and dahr…this has been a very enlightening salon – most questions i’ve had were answered during this group – the lake is fab u lous!!
Dahr @ 41
Dahr, do you have a source and a link for her comment?
Also, thank you for your incredible courage and writing. Reading your book fills me with shame at my country’s actions. Since you are still in the middle east and will no doubt continue to see refugees, please tell them for me (and for all of us) we are so sorry for this ravge and destruction to human life.
Marilyn in Texas
Siun @151
Of course Bechtel got paid. Otherwise they’d have sued and there is no less controllable information source than a civil trial.
mr jamail, mahalo!
live long and prosper.
49er from hoonah.
peas!
Thank goodness for Dahr Jamail and this book, which clearly represents a vital, eyewitness contribution to our understanding of the effects of our involvement in Iraq – for those who will read it – in our own language.
Don’t believe his assessment, Members of Congress? Does his account clash too much with your trusty sources of “classified” information in the Pentagon and elsewhere in the Executive Branch? Then by all means invite Mr. Jamail to testify to one of your committees, and cross-examine him to your heart’s content; unless of course, as seems likely, the truth is the last thing you want to be publicly told, about Iraq.
dahr, thank you for all you do. sorry i missed your salon.
thank you for your excellent dispatches that are delivered to my inbox!
if anyone wants to recieve them write @
dahr_jamail_dispatches@dahrjamailiraq.com
“then why can’t the corporate media, with their millions and millions of dollars and all the advanced high-tech equipment available to them, why can’t they do it? And that’s the unanswered question.”
News consumers like to blame what is referred to as corporate media. Despite being a corporation, there are still human beings at the top who decide on what and how the “news” will be presented. More importantly these corporate humans also decide whom to hire.
It is obvious that there is more than one person in news organizations who are undercover agents for gov’t agencies. The president of Iran softly accused John Roberts on this during their interview not too long ago.
Roberts’s questioning methodology and the content of the questions provoked the Iranian president to say “You question me like you are a CIA agent.” (paraphrase) I think the Iranian president was not so subtle in his attempt to tip off the American people.
So is it any wonder why the millions of $$$ and resources available to the MSM are used to produce basically the same message, the same info-product that is coming out of Washington? Is it any wonder why the administration has been given so much operating room by the MSM in regards to their illegal activities? To be specific, Plame, missing emails, Torture, rigging of the DOJ, domestic spying.
If you were a spy agency, wouldn’t it be in your best interest to plant as many agents into the MSM as possible? Think about it.
What does this mean? We have been seeing what this means in the form of blood and debt.