Here’s a short list of things for which there’s little except hope this week. But, I figure if we all got together at Sunday Late Nite and hoped for the best, maybe one (or even some!) of them might happen. There’s also action you can take to help hope along, in the links.
I hope Congressman Dennis Kucinich’s Tuesday Impeach-Cheney Resolution gets enough attention that Congresspeople are ashamed to vote to table (kill) House Resolution 333. Please ask if your Congressperson is on board, and call in to Dennis Kucinich’s conference call on Monday evening. More information here.
Dennis Kucinich will be on the phone, Monday, November 5 at 7:30 p.m. ET, 6:30 CT, 5:30 MT, 4:30 PT. If you want to listen, call (641) 715-3300 The access number is: 324341# This is a one-way call with no restriction on the number who are on the line to listen. Please get everybody together and put it on a speaker phone!
I hope Senator Patrick Leahy (D-VT) decides to postpone Tuesday’s Judiciary Committee vote on the Michael Mukasey confirmation to be Attorney General after reading this today with his morning coffee:
The United States knows quite a bit about waterboarding. The U.S. government — whether acting alone before domestic courts, commissions and courts-martial or as part of the world community — has not only condemned the use of water torture but has severely punished those who applied it.
After World War II, we convicted several Japanese soldiers for waterboarding American and Allied prisoners of war. At the trial of his captors, then-Lt. Chase J. Nielsen, one of the 1942 Army Air Forces officers who flew in the Doolittle Raid and was captured by the Japanese, testified: “I was given several types of torture. . . . I was given what they call the water cure.” He was asked what he felt when the Japanese soldiers poured the water. “Well, I felt more or less like I was drowning,” he replied, “just gasping between life and death.”
I hope Heather can tell her story, and Dan’s, to the Judiciary Committee before their vote:
When I read about what is happening with the detainees in Gitmo and the dark sites, all I can picture is my beloved Dan lying bruised and beaten and bloody, incoherent from exhaustion and starved from lack of sleep, with no ability to tell his family and his country that he was even alive, and no one knowing where he was. It is happening to people in the name of EVERY American as we speak.
Now comes Michael Mukasey who says he is not familiar with the particular technique of waterboarding and therefore he can not make a determination as to whether it constitutes torture or not. Well, let me assure him and you that waterboarding is torture … period.
Senators Schumer and Feinstein have said they will vote for Mukasey, We have five days to change their minds. You may say it’s a fool’s errand, but for Dan I must. I must speak out until there is no longer breath in my body.
Torture is not what Dan fought for; it’s not what Dan gave his physical health for; it’s not what Dan gave his mental health for.
Give Dan the legacy he deserves and help stop torture as the law, policy and practice of the United States.
What will YOU do to help stop torture?
EVERY American needs to stand up and say:
NOT IN MY NAME!
NEVER IN MY NAME!
Finally, I hope that hope means more than a wish, a prayer, and a four-leaf clover to Dianne Feinstein, who says this about Judge Mukasey:
The bottom line is this: I hope that Judge Mukasey will fairly and evenhandedly represent the American people and direct the Justice Department wherever the facts and the law lead, not where the White House dictates.
If all you can do is hope, Senator Feinstein, hadn’t you best think again about voting to confirm him? You are never going to have any more leverage than you have now. All you’ve gotten from the private meetings, his confirmation hearing testimony, and explanatory followup letters is hope?
You can do better, Senator Feinstein. Better than simply hope.
(YouTube courtesy TPM Veracifier: RGJoe sez “Confirm Mukasey!”)



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teddy!
Here’s to hope.
I got the zed. Very cool. Off to tell the others.
6
Teddy!
Teddy!
Hail, Muse!
Excellent post Teddy.
hi y’all….
I also hope we have at least one more November day like today, perfect for a long walk on Ocean Beach. Nothing like enjoying a sunny day at the Pacific.
Hmmm. @ 7
Ave TSF!!
Firepups (and lurkers) are invited to see the photos of our Texas firepup picnic. A great time was had by all, even the donkeys.
TexBetsy @ 8
Why, thank you.
Yes, here’s to hope! They can’t take that from us!
Evening all. Somebody needs to tell DiFi that hope is not a plan.
I do miss the beach.
TeddySanFran @ 9
I agree, as I’m in the middle of it! ;-)
Our collective hopes and positive thoughts have to have some effect (especially when accompanied by phone calls and visits to offices)
TexBetsy @ 11
Ooh cool! Although google persists in thinking I want stuff in German *blinks*.
Evening TSF, and everyone else!
DiFi’s bought and paid for, she’s gonna go along with the plan and vote for Mukasey.
Did you have to put LIEberman’s ugly mug at the top? I’m not gonna click on it, no need to hear that mealy mouthed, pasty faced little wanker any more than absolutely necessary.
peanutbutter @ 18
Danke!
Why is it that every time I see a video of Lieberman, I get a strong vibe of Emperor Palpatine? No more so than in this clip. “Confirm him!” “I will make it legal.” I think it’ll be a running joke for students of American history that it’s so difficult to tell them apart.
My contempt for Joe Lieberman knows no bounds.
I hope stories like these are not true:
Church youth minister allegedly paid children for sex
http://headonradionetwork.com/…..n-for-sex/
LAKELAND, Fla. — Police said a youth minister was arrested for allegedly having sex with more than one child. According to police, Marshal Seymour turned himself in Friday night after a warrant was issued for his arrest. The Lakeland Police Department said the warrant came after an investigation that Seymour committed numerous sexual offenses while he was […]
Great analogy Ralph.
Evenin’ all !
Teddy, am I naive in thinking Kucinich’s move is still the best way of ending this 7 year nightmare ?
The Dems in Congress and Liberal blogs have not given this much heed …
I’m still mad at Lieberman for his war on music.
I’m still mad at those who think torture is as American as apple pie.
TexBetsy @ 22
Probably true; two weeks ago a “church music minister was arrested for raping a 13 yo boy.
Thanks, Teddy. We can HOPE!
Great pics, Betsy. Looks like you guys had a great time, and that WWD did all of the work! *g*
This one is interesting:
Loo Hoo. @ 27
That about sums it up. :)
madmommy @ 19
He and DiFi are soul-twins.
Steve-AR @ 26
This is sadly all too common in our country. I find it somewhat interesting (and odd) that it seems to happen more often with church personnel than at public schools. I really do not think that religious people (even the fundies) are generally bigger perverts than the population at large.
TexBetsy @ 11
Great pix Betsy, looks like a great time was had by all. Were the donkeys part of the plan or just a happy accident?
I love that you had donkeys on your FirePup get together.
TeddySanFran @ 30
barf
evening all!
i hope that on thursday, the senate judiciary committee votes down the pos fisa bill they got from the intelligence committee.
actually, i hope that leahy take the bill off the committee’s schedule.
TeddySanFran @ 30
Make that soulless twins.
DrDick @ 36
where does schumer fit in?
TeddySanFran @ 33
Well, no one had a car big enough to bring elephants.
(The donkeys live there.)
selise @ 37
schumer chose protecting his ego over his duty to his country
there is a special place in hell for folks like him
selise @ 37
Yet another corporatist whore.
Yes, this makes perfect sense…
Rice Adviser: Pakistan’s Crackdown on Dissent is ‘Small Favor’ That Makes ‘Iraq Look Pretty Good’
November 4th, 2007
This Sunday, after Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf “imposed emergency rule and suspended the constitution in a bid to save his job,” an adviser to Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice “saw a silver lining in the rapid turn of events”
“Thank heavens for small favors,” the official said. Compared to Pakistan, “Iraq looks pretty good.”
http://bodypolitik.org/2007/11…..etty-good/
Leahy should postpone the JC hearing. Delay, delay, delay. Dems, Go Public with this waterboarding issue. Make it an issue!! Make Mukasey an issue!! Show some outrage that American is being taken down into the sewer of torture by Mukasey/Bush/Cheney and don’t forget about Rummy and Addington. The more the public hears about waterboarding the stronger the case among the public for rejecting Mukasey will become.
CTuttle @ 41
I think for once in my life I am speechless.
DrDick @ 31
I think you are right, the majority are within “the family”. It does seem that the one involving a “church” are associated with sexually repressive denominations.
I initially called those adorable little donkeys jack *sses and joked about taking pictures with them. But then Betsy pointed out that what we really needed for that were elephants. I forgot about Dem donkeys.
TexBetsy @ 38
ba-dum-dum!
((((((((((TeddySanFran))))))))))))))))))))))))))
I’m stunned. Thank you very, very much.
For Dan,
Heather
Gnome de Plume @ 45
Besides, the jennies might have been offended.
Is there anyone more insensitive that Condi and the Bushies?
Joseph C. Wilson: A Reality Check on Iran Policy and U.S. Campaign Politics
from Huff Po by Joseph C. Wilson
On November 1, 30 Democratic senators, led by Senator Jim Webb of Virginia, delivered a strong letter to President Bush in response to his increasingly bellicose language on Iran. The letter informs the president that he does not have the authority to take military action against Iran without prior, specific authorization from the Congress. This message follows up on the bill proposed by Senator Webb and co-sponsored by Senator Hillary Clinton requiring congressional authorization for the use of military force on Iran. Senator Clinton, in fact, first proposed that the administration could not act without a wholly new authorization in a floor speech on February 14.
The November 1 letter directly addresses the Kyl-Lieberman non-binding resolution, which declares a sense of the Senate that the Iranian Revolutionary Guards, an autonomous force within the Iranian military structure, is a terrorist organization. The resolution also makes explicit that it is a diplomatic sanction, not in any way to be interpreted as a basis for military action. During the debate, Senator Richard Durbin of Illinois deleted reference to “military instrumentalities” and added: “Nothing in this Act should be construed as giving the president the authority to use military force against Iran.”
Durbin explained, “I am opposed to military action in Iran. To say we need to pressure the Iranians to change their course in the Middle East and I want to do it by nonmilitary means, that’s what my vote was all about.”
TexBetsy @ 49
Not if you don’t count rocks.
Steve-AR @ 44
My experience has been that the more closed the system is (cultish sects) the more the risk of molest.
TSF,
I’m actually Coral Sea area but … yessss …
“Nothing like enjoying a sunny day at the Pacific.”
29.6C and 63% r.h. according to my desktop techy weather console. And summer is approaching. =:-)
The dawg took me to the beach about 5:30 am, walked, played, had a swim, magic!
Hey CT, check your FB.
i liked ambasador wilson better before he started campaigning for senator clinton.
Chacounne @ 47
No, Heather, thank you.
Laura Doty @ 52
I think perhaps that the more morally conservative and strict denominations may attract those who are plagued by unwanted desires and lack adequate internal self control. The same could be said of the Catholic priesthood.
I just read Naomi Wolff’s post from earlier today. It is really frightening. It plays nicely against the headlines about Musharaff suspending Pakistan’s constitution and disbanding their Supreme Court. I can see the same thing happening here a year from now, only Bush would not have to disband SCOTUS because he’s already got the pack he wants.
peanutbutter @ 18
Ha! That’s probably the NSA filter …
selise @ 56
One day he stands up against McNearny and turns around only to support someone worse. Go figure.
I hope you will all sign the DSCC/DCCC Donor Strike Letter at Democrats.com:
madmommy @ 54
Now, I’ve gotta pick up a copy of SI… ;-)
selise @ 56
me too
Gnome de Plume @ 58
No he would suspend Congress and the Supreme Court would uphold him. The Democratic leadership would whine a bit and then line up for the internment camps.
DrDick @ 31
I’ve noticed that. When I worked as a case worker and facility director in corrections, I interviewed a number of pastors who had been convicted of sexual abuse of minors. A common thread seemed to be the dynamic of sinning together and then asking for mutual forgiveness. A couple of the pastors’ minds were so mystically messed up about the second aspect of this, that I’m convinced they got off more on the kinky forgiveness part than on the perverse sex.
TeddySanFran @ 61
you bet your bippy i signed it…. not one cent – no more.
DrDick @ 31
You should poke around Orcinus. The bloggers there do a lot of examining of what’s going on with stuff like this…
http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/
CTuttle @ 62
I checked online but it’s not there yet, I think it runs about a week behind.
TeddySanFran @ 33
A good thing we’ve got donkeys, elephants would have been much harder to swing, I’d think ;-)
just signed teddy
Thinking of Jane’s earlier post on Maureen Dowd being bitchy, I’m wondering how a victorious Hillary could get “The Village” shoved off of center stage and to get a more leftist, i.e., responsible media that actually cared about issues, into the national spotlight.
One would think that getting H. Clinton to do this would be no problem as the Villagers will be in full, roaring bitch mode by Inauguration Day.
One solution I think we can all agree should be rejected out of hand is the idea of utilizing government censorship against The Village (I’m still annoyed that the anti-porn feminists pushed liberalism as a whole off of the whole freedom-of-speech ideal back in the 1980s).
Clearly, Clinton can give exclusive interviewers to bloggers and force Villagers to get their quotes from DailyKos, Atrios, etc.
Maybe Clinton can verbally encourage bloggers to build institutions and encourage her moneyed friends to fund us?
I’m not terribly creative myself so I don’t have many ideas to offer.
peanutbutter @ 67
Visit every day, though more for his tracking of the white supremacists and eliminationism.
Done, Teddy!
preview of a few of the coming week’s hearings:
Tuesday, 10 am – Senate Judiciary
Business meeting to continue consideration of the nomination of Michael B. Mukasey, of New York, to be Attorney General.
Wednesday, 2 pm – House Foreign Affairs
Oversight Hearing: Democracy, Authoritarianism, and Terrorism in Contemporary Pakistan
Witness: John Negroponte, Deputy Secretary of State, U.S. Department of State
Thursday, 9:30 am – House Judiciary
Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties
Oversight Hearing on Torture and the Cruel, Inhuman, and Degrading Treatment of Detainees: The Effectiveness and Consequences of “Enhanced” Interrogation
Thursday, 10 am – Senate Judiciary
Business meeting to consider several bills including S. 2248, to amend the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978, to modernize and streamline the provisions of that Act.
details and complete list here.
thanx selise
Ed*ard Teller @ 65
Very creepy stuff. Seems to me it is more prevalent in authoritarian groups where the leader knows he will not be challenged. And the kids know on some level that no one will believe them if it comes down to their word against the leader.
Thank you, Teddy, for finding the strength to keep hope alive.
I no longer hope for humane, decent, or principled action from the national Democratic Party headed by Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid (with the silent acquiescence of Howard Dean), but I will be watching to see if one single United States Senator recognizes the historical travesty that is this Mukasey nomination, and has the courage to buck the Corrupt Club’s peer pressure by exercising his or her enormous power to place a hold on this nomination.
A hold that, at a minimum, would force a 60-vote confirmation threshold for this unprincipled man, and which would, under normal procedure, block the nomination altogether.
Marty Lederman and all humane Americans without an anti-Muslim ax to grind can only wonder: “How Low Can They Go?”
http://balkin.blogspot.com/200…..ey-go.html
It is, in fact, now only a matter of degree. The door has been opened, and Mukasey stands ready to be the gateway to what lies beyond for this Executive Branch and for all of us. Israel and its American partisans ‘got theirs’ with this favorite son nominee. Do blinkered supporters of Israel in the United States Senate give a damn about human life if that life is an Arab’s, or happens to practice the Muslim faith?
Or perhaps all that talk about “never again” is just that: Talk, alone, when the innocent human lives of a persecuted group are threatened by state-sanctioned lawless actors; unless that persecuted group is of the Jewish faith, and therefore alone ‘worthy’ of protection from the likes of the Senate-enabled torture policies of the American Executive Branch’s CIA and its rendition partners.
TeddySanFran….I hope too.
Go Kucinich!!!! I’d call my rep, but I don’t really have any. I will call nancy …. again. Arrrrgh. What part of 11% don’t they seem to understand? That does not translate into voter participation at all.
Muckasey…. Just say no. No. They need to say NO to this clownjob regradless of what he says. They should have already said NO. They need to pick someone on merit to the country not the neocons. I can’t figure out why they’re even discussing this. Does Joe know how out of touch he is?
HUGS for you and for HOPE, TeddySanFran :-)
TeddySanFran@55
It is my honour to be Dan’s voice. I will keep shouting until the torture stops or I no longer have breath in my body.
Hugs,
Heather
Hello from the Oregon Coast….. beautiful day
hi katymine & heather. good to see both of you!
katymine @ 80
Hey katymine, sounds like you’re enjoying your trip!
Gnome de Plume @ 58
I created this yesterday, using Musharaff’s proclamation as the basis:
Proclamation of Emergency declared by UNITED STATES Commander-In-Chief, Field Marshall George W. Bush, on Saturday, October 25, 2008:
“WHEREAS there is visible ascendancy in the activities of extremists and the banding together of some militant groups have taken such activities to an unprecedented level of violent intensity posing a grave threat to the life and property of the citizens of the United Sates of America;
WHEREAS there has also been a spate of attacks on State infrastructure and on law enforcement agencies;
WHEREAS some members of the judiciary are working at cross purposes with the executive and legislature in the fight against terrorism and extremism thereby weakening the Government and the nation’s resolve and diluting the efficacy of its actions to control this menace;
WHEREAS there has been increasing interference by some members of the judiciary in government policy, adversely affecting economic growth in particular;
WHEREAS constant interference in executive functions, including but not limited to the control of terrorist activity, economic policy, price controls, downsizing of corporations and urban planning, has weakened the writ of the government; the police force has been completely demoralized and is fast losing its efficacy to fight terrorism and Intelligence Agencies have been thwarted in their activities and prevented from pursuing terrorists;
WHEREAS some hard core militants, extremists, terrorists and enemy combatants who were arrested and being investigated were ordered to be released. The persons so released have subsequently been involved in heinous terrorist activities, resulting in loss of human life and property. Militants across the country have, thus, been encouraged while law enforcement agencies subdued;
WHEREAS some judges by overstepping the limits of judicial authority have taken over the executive and legislative functions;
WHEREAS the Government is committed to the independence of the judiciary and the rule of law and holds the superior judiciary in high esteem, it is nonetheless of paramount importance that the Honorable Judges confine the scope of their activity to the judicial function and refrain from judicial activism;
WHEREAS an important Constitutional institution, the Supreme Court, has been made entirely irrelevant and non est by a recent order and judges have, thus, made themselves immune from inquiry into their conduct and put themselves beyond accountability;
WHEREAS the humiliating treatment meted to government officials by some members of the judiciary on a routine basis during court proceedings has demoralized the civil bureaucracy and senior government functionaries, to avoid being harassed, prefer inaction;
WHEREAS the law and order situation in the country as well as the economy have been adversely affected and trichotomy of powers eroded;
WHEREAS a situation has thus arisen where the Government of the country cannot be carried on in accordance with the Constitution and as the Constitution provides no solution for this situation, there is no way out except through emergent and extraordinary measures;
AND WHEREAS the situation has been reviewed in meetings with Vice President Cheney, Secretary of State Abrams, House Speaker Pelosi and Senate Majority Leader Reid, and with Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Boylan, the Chiefs of the Armed Forces, and the owners of Blackwater Industries;
NOW, THEREFORE, in pursuance of the deliberations and decisions of the said meetings, I, Field Marshall George W. Bush, Commander in Chief of the United States of America’s Armed Forces, and newly controlling partner of Blackwater Industries.
2. I hereby order and proclaim that the Constitution of the United Sates of America shall remain in abeyance.
3. This Proclamation shall come into force at once.
Field Marshall George W. Bush
President of the United Sates of America
There were six of us who meet in Portland OR yesterday…..
Does anyone in the Seattle area want to meet up next weekend?
I will be at the Westin Fri-Tuesday am and will be taking time to see my son and granddaughters.
The Naomi Wolf thread was very sobering. This paragraph stuck in my mind.
It is very hard to get passed the “it can’t happen here” mentality. “It couldn’t happen in the country of Bach, Brahms and Schiller” but it did. “It couldn’t happen in the country of Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln”..it might.
Hi TexasBetsy :)
It’s great to see you :)
Hugs,
Heather
I think I will call it an early night. Busy week ahead. Take care and enjoy the snark. Keep up the good work Teddy.
Sleep well Dr D
Hi all-ET, thanks again for letting me post your Declaration at my place-and I wanted to again remind everyone, if you can possibly participate, Tuesday, 11/6, is the day of the general strike. Flyer I made is here.Sound the alarm-
Nite, DD!
Betsy has just given me her blessing via google talk to go to bed, too. So I think I will turn in as well. It was a really good day. ‘night pups.
Night, night Dr. D
Hugs,
Heather
*waving g’nite to the leaving sleepy pups*
night gnome.
Fienstein might as well hope for the sun to rise on the west.
-GSD
Colom wins Guatemala poll
from AL JAZEERA
Left-leaning businessman defeats retired general in election marked by voter apathy.
Hey, Ed*, put that paper under wraps, will you please? Don’t want the wrong people getting a look at it….
Suzanne @ 93
Suz, was there a chink in the mods’ armor last thread? ;-)
Pakistan police beat lawyers (Reuters)
from Yahoo! News
Supporters of the opposition parties chant slogans against Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf in Islamabad November 3, 2007. (Faisal Mahmood/Reuters)Reuters – Pakistan police baton-charged lawyers protesting against President Pervez Musharraf’s emergency rule on Monday, as police continued to detain his opponents in the face of U.S. pressure to hold elections in January.
Suzanne @ 39
I heard they had to put in a new (and much larger) Circle of Hell just for people like that…
CTuttle @ 98
whatchu talking about ct?
Changing the clocks is messing with my brain, it always takes at least a week before I get straightened out again.
The kiddos are gonna be disappointed to go out for the bus in the daylight tomorrow morning instead of darkness. The big kid won’t be able to see the stars and expound on his theories of life on Mars and the little guy won’t be able to see the moon and try to jump up to reach it.
Goodnight all!
Night, night Gnome.
Hugs,
Heather
Has Musharraff been contacted by the Burmese Junta and congratulated for his victory yet?
-GSD
And on that note, I too will join the herd heading for the Land of Nod.
Goodnight, all. The best of all possible tomorrows to you all.
GSD @ 95
How can she write that she bases her vote on hope? She’s had all the time she needs to ask him exactly what he’d do, under what circumstances, and for whom. Her hope is finished the moment he’s confirmed.
You think he’ll take a moment out of his busy schedule to appear again in front of these punks? I doubt it. Why waste his time? They are totally ineffectual and he knows they’ll prove it by confirming him.
Steve-AR @ 26
Why would this not be true. This is the morality which exceptionlist Americans subscribe to. Legions of deviant sexual predators haunt our churches. They always have. Churches are a good place to hide since the folks who use them are taught that the real evil is outside the church. They are taught that the real evil is far, far away in countries where the inhabitants do not look, speak or think like us.
That that evil can be kept from our shores by the expenditure of our blood and treasure. That anyone who questions this ‘reality’ is by definition ‘evil’.
Go on over to Orcinus and learn more about those who claim to be ready to ‘minister’ to us.
Frankly anyone who ‘belongs’ to a church today is out of their mind.
From Blitzer’s show this evening:
link
Ditto that, A.C
Good petition, Teddy. I signed.
Good night, all.
Night, night, Ron,
Hugs,
Heather
Suzanne @ 101
Apparently, not much! You didn’t remove my question to the troll, tho! ;-)
Nite, Sleepers!
It’s not a truck!
pow wow @ 77
i’ve told this story before…
when i visited israel/palestine in 2002 i spent a couple of weeks in the west bank volunteering with a group of palestinian peace activists (supported by some israelis and internationals). what i saw and experienced was (and still is) hard to understand…
after that i spent a few days in israel – one of the things i did was to visit physicians for human rights israel in tel aviv. wonderful, inspiring people who, in addition to telling me all about what they were doing also tried to help me make sense of what i had seen. one woman told me about how she had struggled with some of the same questions as i was, and how a doctor at phr, a dedicated volunteer (retired and then 80 (?) years old) who spent many days helping palestinians, had tried to help her see what must be done. he and his wife (before they had met) had both lost their families in the holocaust. they had one son who died fighting in lebanon…. and this is what he told her:
the lesson of “never again” can be learned in two ways: never again for me and mine, or never again for anyone. i chose the second lesson, never again for anyone.
if someone who’s been through so much, and lost so much, can learn that lesson… then, i have to believe, so can we.
this one is less than hopeful:
A.Citizen @ 107
As I told the GF; this shit follows Sutton’s law. Willie, why do you rob banks?..That’s were the money is.
TeddySanFran @ 9
Hi Teddy…will you send some of that SF weather east?? We had a mini hurricane yesterday, but luckily we are a few miles inland and didn’t get much except strong winds and a lot of rain…no damage, but the Cape had the worst.
Anyway…great article…just sent off two really nasty notes to Difi and Chuckie. This is the second one in a couple of days…and I hope Sen. Leahy decides to postpone the vote.
Everyone should make their comments clear to them too. As you said…we can only HOPE!!
Best from Boston…
Moesie
DiFink’s playing Hope-a-Dope with the Constitution
punaise @ 118
ga-roan
TeddySanFran @ 106
Her cynical use of language gives the game away. This is a woman who began her rise to power behind Dan White’s smoking gun and who has never failed to do the bidding of the oligarchy. Why should she not? Her husband has made hundreds of millions off of the MIC. Bush, Addingtion and Mukasey are all good friends of the family you see.
The Constitution…just a piece of paper.
You and me…little people who will pay for her gold-plated pension.
I think we need to elect Edwards and pull her heatlthcare and pension until the country is back on it’s feet both as to our rights and the financials.
You see she isn’t talking about ‘hope’ for her. She doesn’t need to ‘hope’ things will work out for her and her family as it already has.
She’s ‘hoping’ that not enough citizens wise up and send her to the guillotine.
Hey! If Bill Maher and many others in Free Left Blogistan can use the guillotine image then….
So can I and also….
Maybe it’s time.
‘Let them eat Cake…’
Oh, you go, CT.
The time change messes with me. too. I’m fading, so I’m going to call it a night!
(waving to the confused about time sleepy pups)
Night PB
I must say that the behavior of the Democratic leadership is doing more to wring the hope out of me than almost anything Twitchy McCodpiece has done.
-GSD
GSD @ 126
yeaup, before i learned they were spineless wonders, i had more hope
some of the ny roots projects folks are going to be protesting at schumer’s office:
i’m told there will be video
sweet, selise… be sure to let us know when the video is up
We can make them hope with us or replace them.
GSD @ 126
me too.
Suzanne @ 127
I agree also, and, Nancy is the biggest disappointment of them all!
Suzanne @ 129
i will. i joined the ny googlegroup saturday morning even though i’m in MA (it was RevDeb’s suggestion). basically just said i’m pissed off, is there anything i can do to help? imo, active resistance is the best therapy. good call by RevDeb.
President Edwards and Speaker Kucinich
How’s that for hope?
g’nite all..
And thanks Teddy
Night Eureka.
CTuttle @ 132
yeah. because i though she was sorta on our side – i expected bad things from hoyer and emanual and didn’t expect much from reid. oh well, gotta reset my expectations.
I find it bitterly ironic, that one of the Repugs’ main fund raising memes was to keep the gavel out of Nancy’s SF liberal hands! What a joke! 8-(
RNC must have some real juicy dirt on nancy and reid et al.
Tonight’s snack is the leftovers from today’s Texas firepup picnic. The corn’s amazing, and so are the marinated portabella mushrooms. YellowdogJim brought five pies, which meant that I brought the fall-colored m&m’s home with me.
I’m making it an early night. Medical appt in the AM.
pain free sleep wishes, tex and fingers and toes crossed for the appt
Thanks Suzanne.
Sleep well, TB and ES!
Suzanne @ 138
i no longer thing that… i think they are doing what they want to do. sigh.
Precisely. Protecting “me and mine” to the exclusion of all others actually allows such horrors as the Holocaust, and torture of “Islamofascist terrorist” suspects, to plumb their evil depths, so long as the victims are a vilified “other” and not (yet) “me and mine.”
Thank you, selise.
Some of the stories on my blog tonight:
U.S. Is Likely to Continue Aid to Pakistan
Uncategorized
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The Bush administration signaled that it would likely continue aid to Pakistan’s military, despite the detention of rights activists and government opponents.
Nov 4
In Portland, Cultivating a Culture of Two Wheels
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Cyclists, who have long revered Portland for its bicycle-friendly ways, are helping the city build a cycling economy based on a growing number of smaller businesses.
Audit: Ambulance service overcharged for hurricane evacuations
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A medical transport service overcharged the federal government nearly $2 million to evacuate sick or injured people during Hurricanes Katrina and Rita, a government audit found. CareFlite billed the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services $5.7 million for transporting 810 patients in six months, according to an audit by the agency’s inspector general.
Nov 4
Fiji arrests 16 over PM assassination plot (Reuters)
Uncategorized
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Fiji’s Prime Minister and Commander of the Military Forces Josaia Bainimarama addresses the 62nd United Nations General Assembly at U.N. headquarters in New York in this file photo from September 28, 2007. (Keith Bedford/Reuters)Reuters – Fiji police have arrested 16 people over an assassination plot against the South Pacific island nation’s coup leader and prime minister.
Nov 4
Iraqi official gunned down in Baghdad (AP)
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Firefighters try to extinguish flames after a car bomb explosion in Tikrit, 130 kilometers (80 miles) north of Baghdad, Iraq, Sunday, Nov. 4, 2007. A parked car bomb exploded in a commercial area in central Tikrit, killing three people, including a 6-year-old boy, police said. (AP Photo/Bassem Daham)AP – Two carloads of gunmen ambushed a top aide to Iraq’s Finance Ministry on Sunday in Baghdad, killing him and his driver, police said. The two were among 15 people killed or found dead in Iraq.
Nov 4
As I Begin My Jail Time
Nonviolent Resistance
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By Eve Tetaz
As I begin my 7 day sentence in DC Jail for peacefully and non- violently protesting the US invasion and occupation of Afghanistan and Iraq, I wish to appeal to the American people to join together as one voice in opposing the illegal and immoral actions of our leaders whom we have elected to act in our name.
We are a nation of law governed by the Constitution that begins with the words “We the people…” When our leaders betray our trust by committing crimes against humanity in the waging of a war that has been condemned by international law, the highest religious authorities, and members of our own military, I believe that we must declare before the world, NOT IN MY NAME. When the government advocates the use of such tactics as rendition and torture to further their ends, we must shout, NOT IN MY NAME.
Nov 4
Protesting Feinstein’s Torture Support – 2
At Rallies and Marches
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Missteps on Both Sides Led to Health Bill Veto
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A bill to expand insurance for poor children symbolizes the inability of President Bush and Congress to work together.
Suzanne @ 138
Just asking – do we really believe there is art, documents, evidence of corruption or malfeasance that Goopers are holding over Dems’ heads? Or are they just to lazy to do what has to be done, and will leave it to the next Congress? To beaten down by the Wurlitzer?
DrDick @ 31
Hi DrDick. Back when the abuse scandal in the Catholic church was at its height, I read an article by someone who had interviewed a number of pedophile priests. One thing they all said was that they had joined the priesthood at least partly because they already had ‘urges’. They believed that, if they became priests, God would banish, or at least help them to overcome, their urges.
selise @ 143
I think they’re using we, the people, as hostages. That’s what they’re holding over NP et al.
i want just one person, one dem, to stand up and spill whatever it is.
that is the only way to lessen the power held over one being blackmailed – expose the blackmailer
BBQ looked tasty TexBetsy. Also, it gives me an idea for something to do amongst my friends – Book trading! Get rid of the stuff already read, and get some new stuff unexpectedly recommended.
cancercures, we used to trade books at the pd – there was a bookshelf in dispatch where one would deposit books for others and take whatever ya were interested in.
Hmmm. @ 148
I’m having a hard time imagining Nancy or Harry abrogating their Constitutional responsibilities in order to save it, and us.
Suzanne @ 149
Yes. Essentially, somebody has to sacrifice themselves for the good of the country.
So why hasn’t it happened? Or is that what Dennis K. is going to be doing on Tuesday?
The Phoenix 1480 progressive radio has a “lending” library with books and DVD’s that listeners have donated to be circulated in the community.
katymine @ 154
katymine!
I only got back from the SoCal meetup this afternoon, and slept. How was the PNW meetup?
theotherwash, Oregondave, Bustednuckles, RBG and someone with a user name starting with victor [laslow?] showed up….. had a great two hour chat… vegan food and pretty much took over one corner of teh Blue Moose
When I have more bandwidth than cellular wireless I will upload the two pictures of the group
katymine, TOW did a link last night to the meetup ya’ll had.. let me look for it
night ‘pups. i’ve hit the wall…
nite selise
here are the pictures, katy
Aloha, Selise!
LA Feinstein Protest Tomorrow
Protest Feinstein’s Pro-Torture Nomination! Mon 2:30 -3:30 Code Pink
Protest Michael Mukasey’s Nomination for U.S. Attorney General
Meet at Dianne Feinstein’s Office – 11111 Santa Monica Blvd. in West Los Angeles
NW corner of Santa Monica Blvd. and Sepulveda
Ok from L to R…
RBG, TOW, Busted, me, Victor & Oregondave
TeddySanFran @ 162
anything up this way tsf?
Anyone notice this very quiet announcement???
Chuck Hagel (R-Nebraska) Not Running For President OR Senate in 2008
So another Republican Senator has pulled out, disgusted with the way Bush is running the country.
Today’s action at DiFi’s House:
Thanks Suzanne….
thanks, teddy
teddy, you got a link to that press release
Thank for the set up Teddy. Here was my note to DiFi. I am very unhappy with her.
—–
Please do NOT confirm Mukasey. Waterboarding is torture … period.
Would you confirm him if it was called partial drowning torture?
Would it seem nicer as partial drowning interrogation? Maybe freedom dunking would fit, if you want to make a horrible act more palatable.
Question for the staff reading this- How many people died in Abu Ghraib because of “abusive interrogation”?
“There were five cases of detainee deaths as a result of abuse by U.S. personnel during interrogations… There are 23 cases of detainee deaths still under investigation…”
–The Schlesinger Report, August 2004
We now know that the number is higher, but I never even hear about these 5 dead or the other 23. Only about the ones with “underwear on their head”.
We can not tip toe around the fact that we have become a country that tortures and renaming it and redefining does not change the fact that it is something we do, and it must stop.
Stop caving to what the president wants. Stop thinking that Mukasey is the best we can hope for out of the Bush administration. We can do better. Democrats are not the minority anymore. This is an issue I care about very strongly. Approving torture and approving of the people who will NOT condemn torture is bad for the country.
I urge you to NOT confirm Mukasey. And I also urge you to stop allowing the Bush administration to push us further into becoming a country where a barbaric act is redefined into something permissible with a few word changes in a memo.
katymine @ 163
Ah, that’s useful. Thanks!
cinnamonape @ 165
I got two words for you ‘Chuck’….
Fuck you!
Hang around for decades while your rag-bag cabal of racist, Fascist scumbags due incredible damage to our nation and your gonna retire!
I wish you much joy of it. I wish you the words to tell your granchildren how you personally stood aside while the rule of law and habeaus corpus where replaced by torture and fear by your leader George W. Bush.
Why hang around you useless sack of pus. Feel ‘Free’ to leave now pal.
Nobody’s gonna miss you.
Eureka Springs @ 60
This front-page article from this morning’s LA Times caused me to re-think my position on McNerney a bit.
http://www.latimes.com/news/pr…..7655.story
Folks, let’s not forget that McNerney’s win over Pombo was damn near a miracle, and the district is still a decidedly reddish shade of purple.
Word is that the Republicans are getting ready to run a candidate so odious that Pombo looks like Mother Teresa by comparison.
Under those circumstances, guess what? Progressives really don’t have anywhere else to go. Unless they think that putting a horror-show of a Republican in the House is an acceptable price to pay in order to punish a supposed apostate.
Call me crazy if you want, but on that fact pattern I can hold my nose and tepidly support McNerney.
Is it the time change OR are we just a bunch of really polite people tonight?
Suzanne @ 169
here ya go
click on today, it’ll come up in a little window without a URL
Congratulations, Firepups! we have managed a two-ring circus tonight, with 80 posts downstairs lasting two hours past the appearance of TSF’s current thread!
I think that’s a good thing.
Bob in HI
I wonder to whom Chuck “ES&S” Hagel will pass the secret codes to fix the Nebraska voting machines. He was never really elected there, I am convinced, as are many others.
Is there a good progressive Democrat running in Nebraska?
It kind of bothers me that whether waterboarding is or isn’t torture has become the issue here. It’s like arguing over which knife and fork is the right one to use when eating roast baby. Isn’t roasting the baby the issue? Why are we quibbling about what level of physical and psychological abuse is acceptable? NO level of abuse is acceptable and, even if it were, I understand there’s ample evidence that it just doesn’t work. Just like a roast baby won’t go far in feeding a family of four.
katymine @ 174
i think it is we are a bunch of tired polite pups tonight… dang time change – geez, a nightshifter like me gets all confused when i’m tired at the same time everyone else is
Fred Kaplan chatz tomorrow at 1pm eastern at the WaPoO about his article in Sunday’s Outlook section “The Case Against Condi”
Hope Suzanne has the swear jar ready!
teddy, sure is.. .and there is already a quarter with a string attached to the jar for repeat use
persiflage @ 178
Nothing like perspective to inform a view.
persiflage @ 178
Mukasey’s also made it very clear that his Preznit has a large grey area when it comes to obeying federal law. I don’t see how a Committee of the US Senate can even think of confirming him after that.
tw3k, we are enjoying your timewarp music selection chez TSF. makes us long for whiskey sours, Shermans, and illegal substances hereabouts.
Oh the reason why I suspect that Hagel is quitting because he’s frustrated with his own party and the White House is that his resignation announcement accompanied THIS SPEECH!
Hagel Blasts Bush
~ The use of military force in “Iran” could lead to “one of the great miscalculations in history.”
~He warned that “it’s the unpredictable that always gives us pause. … The President of the United States is talking about World War III, and threatening.”
~”Does anyone believe we are going to be successful in dealing with Iran without Russia?”
~A published report says Hagel sent a private note to Bush urging “direct, unconditional, comprehensive talks with Iran.”
~The United Nations is “not set up for us to get our way every time.”
~Given record global levels of antagonism to Bush Foreign Policy “reintroducing America to the world” will be a critical difficulty for the balance of the current office and future Presidents.
~The toll of fighting wars in Afghanistan and Iraq on U.S. troops has degraded American military preparedness in other critical theaters, and severely impacted recruitment.
~ By fighting a war in Iraq based on incorrect intelligence “we have lost a sense of citizenship.” The hypocrisy of the current Administration does not serve to raise the level of patriotism. He noted “There’s a Vice President [Cheney] out there who had five deferments. He said, ‘I don’t have time to serve.’ “
tw3k @ 182
I think it was that bucket of Kentucky Fried Baby I ate last night…
~ The use of military force in “Iran” could lead to “
one of theseveral additional great miscalculations in history.”Just wrote my Senators on this issue (again) and Feinstein. I’m hunting Schumer’s contact form now, ah, here it is. Maybe not as effective as a phone call, but I’m not all that good at talking on the phone to people who aren’t interested.
I feel we’re one assassinated ArchDuke away from Armageddon.
Read a great piece of fiction today.
No, not a White House press release, you big silly. An actual novel.
Richard North Patterson’s newest book, “The Race.”
I knew it was fiction as soon as I figured out that the main character was a moderate Republican with firmly held principles.
burnspbesq @ 173
Pete McCloskey is in that District…can someone who knows him get him to either Primary McNerny or run as an Independent in the General Election.
DiFi State Office Contact List
TeddySanFran @ 189
i hear ya teddy – me too
TeddySanFran @ 177
His first election was suspiciously different from what the polls predicted. One more reason to either ban the things or require that they be properly designed and handled.
persiflage @ 178
I’m sorry persi, but I must have missed a part of this post, or this place. I have yet to hear anyone we would consider “reasonable” even entertain this idea.
my bold
cinnamonape @ 191
Ain’t happenin’, if for no other reason than McCloskey’s age. He turned 80 in September.
TeddySanFran @ 189
A topic at the NW meetup….
IS it my disease related depression OR we just getting tickets to our own real live performances of the world turned our very own version of Mad Max and Terminator?
TeddySanFran @ 184
dance all night! :D
Pete McCloskey’s nearly 80…but from reading this he’d be a damn sight better than McNerney!
McCloskey Switches Parties!
TeddySanFran @ 183
Over the years I’ve heard people argue against various changes to government power with “it’s all well and good right now but what if some future government decides to use those powers to (insert abominable action here)” I used to laugh, now I realise just how right they were.
persiflage @ 186
i c4nz h4z ch1ck3n?
A McNerney question:
Are his votes reflective of his district?
I know we progressives have problems with the way he has been voting BUT… is he accurately representing those who reside in his district? Isn’t it a rather violet shade?
In the spirit of Suzanne’s announcement of a few nights ago, I hereby disclose that I am …
a former member of the Federalist Society.
For one year, during which I did not attend any society functions.
They publish a lot of stuff on a wide range of legal topics, and I thought some of it might make worthwhile reading.
I was wrong.
This got EPU’d downstairs, but I’d like to comment on it: cinnamonape @ 189
The Hague Invasion Act, more properly known and The American Servicemembers Protection Act, is a truly amazing piece of legislation. Per the Wikipedia:
Since Bush will surely grant pre-mptive pardons to his loyalists, there is almost not chance to bring them to justice in U.S. courts. So, IMHO, each presidential candidate should be asked their stand on recinding the Hague Invasion Act. In fact, prosecution of U.S. war criminals should be a major campaign issue. Right now, it’s sort of like the elephant in the living room.
burnspbesq @ 196
Maybe his son..also named “Pete”? He was an attorney at the Hague War Crimes Trials. http://www.scu.edu/law/news/Fi…..rticle.pdf But maybe he isn’t in that District.
Suzanne @ 202
Campaigning to restore the estate tax and now saying he’d eliminate it is not bending to the will of the people you represent; it’s speaking with forked tongue.
newtonusr @ 195
It’s true, I indulged in a little hyperbole. I do, however see a lot of attention on “Mukasey doesn’t know if waterboarding is torture, therefore he shouldn’t be confirmed.” I feel that the focus has shifted from the big picture of torture to the minutae of one form of torture. It’s a general feeling I’m getting from newspaper and blog-reading. Maybe they see waterboarding as a chink in the guy’s armor, I don’t know.
burnspbesq @ 203
come sit by me, burns. it take a big person to admit they have made an error – we all make em but we don’t all own up to them.
one of the things i like about here is that where i came from is not held against me. what matters is where we are now and what we intend to do about it.
i think we are the smart ones – we recognized that we were involved in something that was not a good thing – admitted it and sought a place where we could be part of changing it.
Perhaps the War Crimes question should be submitted via YouTube to the GOP CNN debate. I’d sure like to see those Bush-wannabes yuck it up when that question got asked.
America would see them all for the enablers they are.
persiflage @ 200
But, Persi, it’s never been changed, it’s still just as illegal to torture today, as it was, fifty years ago! The OLC’s memos will come back and bite the whole lot in the arse… Sorry, that it’s taking so long… ;-)
persiflage @ 207
It’s just such an obvious problem that I think we all home in on it. There are certainly other issues, not the least of which is that he doesn’t seem all that willing to start enforcing the law in the executive branch. But the water boarding question is such an obvious case of hypocrisy and nonsense that it’s just a natural.
Suzanne @ 208
Come sit by me, Suzanne and Burns…
I was wrong as well – I used to be a Pepsi, but now I’m a Coke. And it’s so nice to be in a place where that bit of history doesn’t mean shit. And perhaps more importantly, where there is understanding and instead of folks using it against me, ever, it would be a source of light.
:-)
Suzanne @ 202
We talked about this at some length at yesterday’s meetup in OC, particularly in light of his absurd position on the estate tax.
That position, while utterly f**king stupid, is understandable in a district where there is still a substantial number of family farms and a real desire to avoid rapid suburbanization. The argument that some non-trivial number of family farms might end up being sold to developers because of the estate tax is not completely implausible. However, if that is what one is trying to avoid, there are a number of ways to do it that don’t involve repealing the estate tax or increasing the exemption to astronomical levels. One that comes fairly readily to mind is to make it easier for family farm properties to qualify for an already-existing provision in the Internal Revenue Code that provides that if a certain percentage of the taxable estate consists of farm land or interests in a closely held business, the tax can be paid in installments over five to 15 years with interest at a below-market rate.
tw3k @ 201
We iz owta ch1ck3ns, haz spechul on da rapiblikan loliphant, taztes lik ch1ck3nhork
The waterboard question is easier focused on than the acknowledgement that the waterboard question confirms we are a nation that tortures and are just arguing over degrees of difficulty.
CTuttle @ 210
I thought that bit in the WaPo article by Evan Wallach about the 1983 conviction in Texas was particularly damning – it was just 24 years ago. Maybe you can suggest that Mukasey wouldn’t be expected to know about some detail of the WWII war crimes trials or the Phillipines Rebellion, but he should have been familiar with that one.
Suzanne @ 202
It’s a rapidly changing area. Traditionally it was big agriculture (which might explain his stand on the inheritance tax…that’s where the BIG MONEY is in the district…along with Developers). There’s a huge influx of commuters from Silicon Valley who reside there now. And also many of the former migrant workers from Mexico who worked the large farms are now Citizens…as are their kids. Some retirees, usually white and conservative, live up in the foothills.
More and more it’s becoming like the South Bay (which is firmly Democratic). There are tense political issues that relate to nativism and class, though. McNerney got elected by reaching to those non-Pombo communities. But he’s definitely gone over to the other side in his actions on some legislation.
Given how extreme the guy is who’s trying to be Pombo’s successor, I’m wondering if a Primary challenger to McNerny would be successful and also win in the General Election. In a three-way race such a person might easily get 35% of the votes if McNerny looked as if he had abandoned his populist positions.
burnspbesq @ 196
Yikes – sorry for my confusion with the age question that should have been below not in between. If I only had a brain.
Suzanne @ 215
Gee Suzanne, one neat sentence and you’ve summed up what’s been bugging me.
Suzanne @ 215
Mukasey said that torture was illegal and should be prosecuted, so he left himself no choice but to waffle on the question of what torture was, IMHO. That’s the problem – if he admits it’s torture he’s compelled to prosecute some of the people who work for him, and some in the CIA as well.
Question:
I will be in Seattle next weekend… does anyone want to do a Seattle FDL meetup?
cinnamonape @ 217
In principle, I don’t have a problem with raising the limit for farms. As land becomes more valuable, that’s naturally going to be a problem. What I don’t like is that he’s (apparently) said that he wants to eliminate the tax altogether.
Cujo359 @ 220
That’s why he changed his tune from the first day of testimony, somebody yanked him aside…
speaking of meetups – i was thinking of hosting one at the little cottage by the creek in the redwoods for the sf bay area and monterey bay area pups.
katymine @ 221
I’d love to meet you folks. During the week it would be tough, since I live and work way south of Seattle, but if it’s on the weekend I can probably be there.
Cujo359 @ 220
As well as his fucking supervisor. And the Veep.
katymine, i know we have seattle area pups… be sure to sprinkle that question on the daytime threads
persiflage @ 214
r0000fl!
mmmm loliphats :)
Back from chopping wood and starting my next blog. This is addictive…
$.25
Oh, a meetup in the redwoods would be divine.
Actually, a meetup in Seattle would be cool as well, but I can’t be there next weekend. But I could be in the redwoods whenever the mod whistle blows!
CTuttle @ 210
OK, I’m seeing it more clearly now, you’ve just never had an Administration craven enough to test the boundaries before.
hey et – am reading your first post now… looks like you have a new indoor hobby to get you through those rough alaskan winters (laughing)
Cujo359 @ 225
My boyfriend is doing the seattle MNF game on the 12th and we will be staying at the Westin. I will be without transportation but if any of the Seattle pups want to pick a place. I was thinking mid day either Sat or Sunday?
TeddySanFran @ 226
If I recall my Constitution correctly, those two have an out. Congress should be doing that job, and so far they seem, how can I phrase this delicately, completely uninterested in doing their fracking jobs.
Suzanne @ 224
Sounds like a plan. Signing up…
Ed*ard Teller @ 229
How many blogs do you have?
TeddySanFran @ 230
use the string, teddy, use the string
Ed*ard Teller @ 229
heh, :)
I was thinking the weekend of 11/17 or 18 – the weekend before turkey day (eyeballing calendar) either day should work for me… hows it for the nor cal pups?
Cujo359 @ 220
Ah, OK. I had read a lot of stuff he said but I guess the contradiction just didn’t fall into place for me. I am enlightened now. Thanks all for the education.
ET great start… now the next job is starting to cultivate your string of front pagers…. the future Teddy’s of Alaska… woohoo
katymine @ 234
Either works for me. Getting to downtown Seattle is one heck of a lot easier on the weekends.
BTW, my email address is my nom de ordinateur at earthlink.net. Probably best if you don’t capitalize the “C”.
Suzanne @ 215
Any method of severe psychological distress that actually would result in an actual confirmed terrorist giving information of whatever validity would have to be torture. They would lie to make the torture stop.
Khalid Sheikh Mohammed lasted 2 1/2 minutes under tghis torture before confessing “I was responsible for the 9/11 operation, from A to Z.” He also confessed to organizing the 1993 World Trade Center bombing; the Bojinka operation to blow up 10 airlines flying to the US from the Philippines; the Bali nightclub bombings; and Richard Reid’s attempted shoe bombing, planned attacks on Heathrow Airport and Big Ben clock tower in London, Daniel Pearl’s murder in 2002, and planned assassination attempts on Pope John Paul II, Pervez Musharraf and Bill Clinton. In short, he confessed to everything but creating the fake US Moon Landing videos.
The same method used on ideologically uncommitted people would damage them severely. People have asserted that they were the devil incarnate, witches, ate babies, etc. under this procedure.
It’s useless as an intelligence tool, as simple “suggestion” can result in confessions. Innocent people are “fingered” as accomplices and so the circle of those that must be tortured increases exponentially.
Cujo359 @ 237
One inactive one, one awaiting sentencing, and the one I’m working on starting. There is no blog in Alaska that tracks the growth of progressive blogs here and encourages more communication on that level. Time to step up to the plate.
Suzanne @ 240
Due to fiance’s work schedule change, “our” day is now Sunday, so Saturday’s best for a meetup for me, but I’m also very flexible. (Tipping my hand as to the shortie post today: walk on the beach etc)
katymine @ 242
I liked this bit:
I think you can scratch out every instance of “Alaska” and replace it with “America” and you’d still have a good plan.
katymine @ 242
I’m jealous you’re going to be in Seattle this coming week, katymine. My mom is FINALLY moving out of her house there this week, and I wish I could be there to help her – and meet you, your son and your granddaughters.
I had not thought about sunday in relation to your having to go back to the city and do a front page post.
ok, so i guess we are looking at saturday, the 17th – i do not do mornings very well – so was thinking of an afternoon thing.
Cujo359 @ 247
i agree with cujo
wigwam @ 204
Hmmm! Is a person like Rumsfeld still US or Allied Personnel. I would think that he is a private citizen and not still an officer of the US government.
And “all means necessary and appropriate” is vague. It’s the sort of stuff that got Malcolm X accused of wanting to foment a race war.
newtonusr @ 236
woo hoo – count me in Suze!
I know ET… sure wish you could join us….. dang missed meeting you when I was up your way too… life is way too short and sh*t happens… THAT is why I am trying to meet all the pups I can as I travel around now…
Well, I bid ya’ll a fond adieu! Aloha Oe!!!
anyone who wishes to attend a sfbay area norcal centralcal pup meetup at the little cottage by the creek in the redwoods on 11/17, sat afternoonish, email me at
ten67x at gmail dot com
g’nite ct sleep well
Cujo359 @ 235
True impeachment is the only way to punish a serving President (the VP is not immune…recall the indictment/conviction of VP Spiro T. Agnew for corruption back in the days he was Gov. of Maryland). Agnew wasn’t impeached.
But the AG would certainly play a major role in any impeachment inquiry if he was establishing that those following the orders of Cheney and Bush were torturing individuals.
Sweet dreams CT – am outta here as well. Thanks all – especially SF Teddy – for another fine late nite at da incomparable FDL. ;~)
and teddy, in case i have neglected to say so, please thank your fiance for sharing his day with you with us in the evenings. sunday posts with you are like sitting around the sunday dinner table, teddy.
cinnamonape @ 257
True. That’s what Patrick Fitzgerald seemed to be after – to try to find enough information on Cheney.
Unfortunately, I still think that Congress isn’t going to act. Bush could eat a live baby on the White House lawn in broad daylight and they wouldn’t do a thing. Impeachment’s off the table, after all.
g’nite npb – see ya on the 17th :)
The one little tidbit you all forget when you talk about impeachment is that Chief Justice Roberts will preside as the judge in the Senate at the trial.
Article 1-section 3
cinnamonape @ 251
I’ve taken “personnell” to mean citizens, but I don’t have any good reasons to think that’s correct.
This measure was sponsored by Jesse Helms, so I’d expect that “all means necessary” included nukes.
Suzanne @ 259
With you at the other end of the table, dear, moderating us all!
katymine @ 262
I didn’t forget – it just seems like far less of a hurdle than convening the thing in the first place.
Oops. It’s getting to be that time.
G’nite all.
g’nite wigwam
ok, i’ve been looping that track all day!
TSF got a t00bz?
cinnamonape @ 251
It would seem that this Act would almost set a course to undertaking warlike acts against the Hague Tribunal. Is that really what Congress intended?
Also one can read this Amendment in two ways…one which means the Courts of the US will not interfere with such suits. The other way is that the legal authority of the United States overall (including Congress and the Executive) cannot interfere with such suits.
Amendment 11 – Judicial Limits.
The Judicial power of the United States shall not be construed to extend to any suit in law or equity, commenced or prosecuted against one of the United States by Citizens of another State, or by Citizens or Subjects of any Foreign State.
BTW Did you see the link I posted above that shows that one of the largest legal contingents working with the Hague War Crimes Trials are American (and includes one Peter McCloskey, son of the former Congressman from California).
newness to take you through the nite
Well, all this talk about our hopes sure has sucked the energy out of me. Goodnight, all. And don’t forget to fall backward.
katymine @ 262
But the Judge at the impeachment actually is far more constrained in his powers. He “presides” which is the role normally undertaken by the Vice-President. In other words his task is to mange debate and follow the rules established for Senate debate. He cannot rule on evidence or other issues…he must take votes (and that is how issues are resolved).
And he, himself cannot vote during these determinations, or participate in debate.
wigwam @ 263
Personnel are “citizens”? That’s a stretch? But it would mean that “employees” including still active CIA agents are. Even non-citizens could be US Personn.el But once they are out of gov’t they are open targets for prosecution, IMO.
The Hague Bill is no longer relevant for those who have separated from service. Firing, resignation and impeachment would thus make them vulnerable.
A.Citizen @ 172
Yup! More glib ‘Little House on the Prairie’ BS.
For a minute, there, Chuckie, we thought you might have some cojones. Sadly, no.
PLEASE… give us MORE HOPE … more opportunities to see what CAN be done in these tragic times.
It’s too easy — and fits the Neocon Agenda — to feel hopeless. If we feel hopeless, then we will make no effort to change anything.
We all need to feel as if our efforts will MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
Note especially: Paul Hawken’s newest book: Blessed Unrest: How the Largest Movement in the World Came into Being and Why No One Saw It Coming
“the lesson of “never again” can be learned in two ways: never again for me and mine, or never again for anyone. i chose the second lesson, never again for anyone.”
——
Truly wonderful. Sadly, the Jews of Israel are still blinded by their European experience and haven’t got there yet. Perhaps they will in time, with some help from friends.
TeddySanFran @ 177
Excellent question. As an open seat which has clearly gone Dem many times before it might be a good Progressive Dem pickup (if Kerrey doesn’t stomp on it).
We don’t want to spend all our money on lost causes obviously, but if we can take a shot at an open seat with a good candidate…
Does anybody know if there is a good Dem in that race?
burnspbesq @ 203
Say three hail mary’s, contribute to a bunch of Progressive Dems and you might be forgiven.
Praise the Lord and pass the fried chicken!