I fail to see why the folks here want officials of our Government, the folks trying to win a war against a desperate enemy, want our OWN people punished. Even assuming, arguendo, that torture has been committed (which I do not–waterboarding does not KILL like decapitation), why you would punish our folks for trying to WIN is beyond me.

So, leaving aside for the moment what constitutes torture, you seem to be saying it’s fine to waterboard those we perceive as enemies, because waterboarding doesn’t kill and what counts is winning and defeating a “desperate enemy.” Demonize the enemy so that anything is justified.

Winning at the expense of our own humanity is not winning. But it takes a certain sensibility to understand this.

You miss the point. It’s not about wanting people punished, that’s an authoritarian perspective. We’re not authoritarians here.

I fail to see why the folks here want officials of our Government, the folks trying to win a war against a desperate enemy, want our OWN people punished. Even assuming, arguendo, that torture has been committed (which I do not–waterboarding does not KILL like decapitation), why you would punish our folks for trying to WIN is beyond me.

Huh? You seem to think that things that cause excruciating and protracted pain and suffering are NOT TORTURE while something that would likely kill one very quickly IS TORTURE.

You really need to get a grasp on what words mean, LL.

Torturers actually go out of their way to keep their victims alive…to continue to create more pain and suffering. That’s why victims of torture actually beg for death…beg to be killed.

And many forms of torture don’t leave physical scars. They don’t break the skin. Waterboarding was one of the most insidious methods used by Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge to extract “confessions”. People would say anything to make the suffering and panic stop. Only when they confessed were they granted respite from the torture and shot.

http://news.independent.co.uk/…..115549.ece

A team doctor watches the quantity of water that is ingested and for the physiological signs which show when the drowning effect goes from painful psychological experience to horrific, suffocating punishment, to the final death spiral. For the uninitiated, it is horrifying to watch.”

Gosh, where have I seen *THOSE* names listed before as Republicans who’d provide bipartisan cover to Democrats who were afraid of opposing the big bad Bush Administration by their lonesomes?

Tools, all three.

And cowards, most of the fifty.

I had to shut off the fucking TV, listening to
Matthews and others ripping Hillary.
My selection is Dodd, but after watching Hillary get reamed last night, I feel sorry
for her, and may flip-flop.
Hardnuts was disgusting!

What no sympathy for Mike Gravel? He wasn’t even allowed on the stage.

What no sympathy for Rudy? He was pilloried and nobody cares.

Why should I feel badly for someone who is asked a question and can’t answer it with a ‘Yes’ or ‘No’?

Oklahoma kiddo @ 54

Principles? What’s that?

We got no class
and we got no priciples!

Alice doesn’t live here any more.

Also, can we get senators and judges to recognize that ‘24′ is a TV show: that is, it’s fiction, not a documentary or a ‘how to’ show? And that if you have only 24 hours to find a hidden bomb, your law enforcement system has already failed at least three times (first in border security, second in preventing the bomb from being constructed or places, third in not knowing beforehand about any group that would do it)?

phred@101 . Of course decapitation is the physical separation of the head from the body. The horror of it is the effect it has upon the loved ones, the comrades and the family. That’s why it is the ultimate torture short of nuclear torture. Anyone who has seen the Pearl tape knows the horror of decapitation done personally by Zarqawi, who thankfully, is no longer among the living, having been taken care of by a beautiful American fighter bomber.

Pearl was not killed by Zarqawi.

Please bone up on your facts.

-GSD