Comments on: Guess Who Has Immunity Now?

By: melvin

melvin — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 14:13:25 +0000

The way I read the news accounts on this immunity, the Blackwater guys have not been granted immunity from prosecution. Rather, they were given what amounts to “use immunity” for statements they made as part of an internal investigation. This is often done in police departments when there is an internal affairs investigation. The cop being investigated is told he must cooperate and answer questions truthfully; if he does not, he can be fired for failure to cooperate. The flip side of it is that the statements he makes, and evidence derived from those statements, can’t be used to prosecute him in a criminal case.

Here is where a big problem occurs: If the prosecutors decide to charge him with a crime, they must show the evidence they propose to use was INDEPENDENTLY obtained. Often that is nearly impossible.

Kastigar v. U.S. (United States Supreme Court, 1972.) http://www.lectlaw.com/files/cas82.htm

By: nellieh

nellieh — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 13:36:22 +0000

I would suspect being a designee of the President, the Secretary could grant immunity through him. If that be the reason they were able to do it, if I were a Democrat running for office I would scream constantly to demand who gave the immunity, by whose order and why. This is not a State Secret! This was MURDER! The Republicans were out raged, I mean outraged! by Willie Horton. The Republican candidates are all over Huckabee because of his approving early release of a rapist who later raped and killed a woman in another state. This is a KILLING OF 17 PEOPLE. IMMUNITY!? Are they nuts? In my opinion they have to be protecting Prince and his largess.

By: cinnamonape

cinnamonape — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 08:56:01 +0000

This is what the head of the DOS stated in his testimony before Congress
“Depending on the nature of a given incident, the
Department may require remedial training, request the contractor to reassign personnel to duties not requiring a firearm, remove the personnel from the project, or to make referrals to law enforcement authorities. Should the facts of an incident indicate potential criminal acts, further action is determined in consultation with the Department of Justice.”

Clearly DOS is not a “law-enforcement authority” and cannot offer “immunity” for criminal activities. It can only issue administrative sanctions…and only grant protection from those sanctions.

It would be like a security guard telling a murderer that if he fessed up then he wouldn’t go to jail…the murderer confesses. The promise of immunity means “jack sh*t”…and the security guard cannot hold back the evidence if subpoenaed. Tough titties to the guy who believed that he had the power!

Griffin resigned from the head of the Department of Security on Oct 24th…the same day Condi made an announcement of new oversight rules regarding Blackwater. I suspect that he was the one that issued the offer of immunity. but it just demonstrates how little Condi has control over what is occurring under her that she

a) didn’t follow the investigation and explicitly delineate ground rules for the investigators

b) didn’t keep up with what was going on in the investigation so that she didn’t know that immunity had been “offered” by the time of her Congressional testimony

Condi is inept and out of touch with the disaster in Iraq…it’s pathetic. It ate up Colin Powell, and Rumsfeld, now its gonna chew up Ms. Rice, and spit her out. Couldn’t happen to a more deserving sycophant!

By: cinnamonape

cinnamonape — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 08:32:31 +0000

Sandman @ 118

Loo Hoo. @ 111

What movie? Sorry, I missed Bill-O just this once.

I don’t know, probably released in the next two months.
Probably named “Redacted”

No, but O’Reilly is likely putting the producers of that film and also “Rendition” on his list of people to be visited by Fox Security.

Cuban’s film is called “Loose Change” and deals with the 9/11 Attacks, and raises a lot of issues relating to that. Not sure if it is a documentary or a drama. But I think it’s a documentary since Charlie Sheen is involved in narrating it. Bill d’O has said that Cuban is Anti-American and would have been thrown in prison during WW2, also sees he’s gonna be “watching” Sheen.

But this sort of stuff has been going on for at least 6 months between Bill d”O and Cuban. I guess the film must be coming out soon. I think that O’Reilly is really perturbed about this because a lot of his followers believe in the 9/11 Conspiracy Theory…but attribute it to plans in the Clinton period or a secret CIA cabal independent of Bush.

By: cinnamonape

cinnamonape — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 08:18:55 +0000

LS @ 93

Toby Wollin @ 89

FDL is number 70.
The evil Michelle M…is number 5.
What? Is there no justice???????

That is such a bunch of crappola….Spit!

That wouldn’t be a Carnegie/Richard Mellon Scaife study, would it?

By: Marshall

Marshall — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:26:05 +0000

You cannot grant immunity to war crimes.

By: Leila

Leila — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 04:45:29 +0000

Next year in the Hague!

By: Rufus

Rufus — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 03:19:45 +0000

Most everyone can talk about granting immunity but it’s my understanding that only federal judges can give immunity. Any lawyers out there? Help us here.

By: siri

siri — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 02:54:32 +0000

“When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag, carrying a cross.” ~ Sinclair Lewis

siri@legitgov.org
www.legitgov.org

By: Mad Dogs

Mad Dogs — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 02:33:28 +0000

More info from the NYT:

Immunity Deals Offered to Blackwater Guards

State Department investigators offered Blackwater USA security guards immunity during an inquiry into last month’s deadly shooting of 17 Iraqis in Baghdad — a potentially serious investigative misstep that could complicate efforts to prosecute the company’s employees involved in the episode, government officials said Monday.

The State Department investigators from the agency’s investigative arm, the Bureau of Diplomatic Security, offered the immunity grants even though they did not have the authority to do so, the officials said. Prosecutors at the Justice Department, who do have such authority, had no advance knowledge of the arrangement, they added.