zed??

Sanctimonious?…Our Joe?

;>)

Joe sanctimonious? Who knew?

Two pricks? Hillary & Joe? LOL

well, well, a “zed” without hardly trying…something to tell the grandkids about…

In other news: Hillary says water “wet”

Further down the evolutionary scale, the right-wing blogs bloomed like a staph infection.

!!!

Wow…I think someone’s won the contest that was going on somewhere in one of the late nite posts last night…!

Jane, thanks for the wonderful opportunity to engage with John Dean on the previous thread. The Lake is a wondrous place.

As to Lieberman, I can understand why Senator Clinton may avoid the word “prick” but it’s lovely to get her on the record about his sanctimony.

I’ve submitted my question about Lieberman in as many forums as possible, for any and all presidential candidates but particularly Obama (”What role might your mentor Joe Lieberman play in your administration?”) but it never gets picked up, even at YKos, where I thought it would be a lock.

darkblack @ 2

Sanctimonious?…Our Joe?

;>)

Say it ain’t so Joe. LOL!

You know something? There’s a whole lot of us out there. We’re women who know what this cackle crap is.

We get it.

We also vote.

sanc·ti·mo·ni·ous /ˌsæŋktəˈmoʊniəs/ Pronunciation Key – Show Spelled Pronunciation[sangk-tuh-moh-nee-uhs] Pronunciation Key – Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
1. making a hypocritical show of religious devotion, piety, righteousness, etc.: They resented his sanctimonious comments on immorality in America.

KayInMaine @ 4

Two pricks? Hillary & Joe? LOL

Right. But better not enlarge on it.

Holy Sanctimonius Joe Prick.

That has a ring to it

I’m still amazed at how blessed Connecticut was in having the happy choice between a progressive, totally decent guy like Lamont and a sanctimonious prick.

Mad Dogs @ 9

Say it ain’t so Joe. LOL!

Joe’s cool…Huhhuhhuhhuh.

;>)

Well, that definitely made me more likely to vote for Senator Clinton. Love to hear what she says about him in private, but she’s suburban Methodist, so tightly wound, we won’t likely even read that in her memoirs.

You all saw that Sara Taylor has a new job?

Loo Hoo. @ 17

You all saw that Sara Taylor has a new job?

more wingnut welfare

If Hillary had pursued that line of thought, she might be closer to getting my vote.

This is not my day for Technology. I’ve got Firefox installed now because after I posted one comment in the Dean thread, my computer froze and I had to restart, then the page wouldn’t load again. GRRRRRR!!! So anyways…

I hope his special day is a LOT better than mine.

They have to immediately attack her laughter at these gasbags, because it is the most powerful response anyone has made to them in a long time.

When you laugh at someone, you are signaling that you are not afraid of them. And you are giving other people permission to laugh at them. That is very, very empowering.

They can’t have that. So they are attacking with everything they can find.

But as Boston1775 says, the women out there know what’s going on here.

I had a conversation with Digby about this, and she said the same thing. She was in a message thread about the laugh thing, and opinions split along gender lines. The women thought it was great, the men thought it wasn’t.

Being a man, and having been laughed at by women at times, I can tell you how powerful an act it is, and how threatening.

Women get it, and women vote. In fact, from what I read, suburban women are the major swing group in the upcoming election.

Keep laughing HRC, it works.

Berken @ 16

Well, that definitely made me more likely to vote for Senator Clinton. Love to hear what she says about him in private, but she’s suburban Methodist, so tightly wound, we won’t likely even read that in her memoirs.

Some us who were brought up as “suburban Methodist” grow out of it.

darkblack @ 15

Mad Dogs @ 9

Say it ain’t so Joe. LOL!

Joe’s cool…Huhhuhhuhhuh.

;>)

DB, don’t you have one of Joe in diapers and with a pacifier?

And now Lady’s and Germs…..Hereeeeeeeeeeeeeeee’s Joey!

Planet Joe, the planet of Liars and Idiots!

TeddySanFran @ 8

Jane, thanks for the wonderful opportunity to engage with John Dean on the previous thread. The Lake is a wondrous place.

As to Lieberman, I can understand why Senator Clinton may avoid the word “prick” but it’s lovely to get her on the record about his sanctimony.

I’ve submitted my question about Lieberman in as many forums as possible, for any and all presidential candidates but particularly Obama (”What role might your mentor Joe Lieberman play in your administration?”) but it never gets picked up, even at YKos, where I thought it would be a lock.

That is a very good question, Teddy. They absolutely should have asked it at YK.

Audrey @ 19

If Hillary had pursued that line of thought, she might be closer to getting my vote.

This is not my day for Technology. I’ve got Firefox installed now because after I posted one comment in the Dean thread, my computer froze and I had to restart, then the page wouldn’t load again. GRRRRRR!!! So anyways…

I hope his special day is a LOT better than mine.

FireFox uh…..well….ya know….

It works good.

David Horowitz made the claim that he, personally, “purged” Liarman “of his party” on C-SPAN Q&A the other day. So that is a pretty disgusting thought to consider that Liarman now views the world in Horowitz terms.

Jane Hamsher @ 24

TeddySanFran @ 8

Jane, thanks for the wonderful opportunity to engage with John Dean on the previous thread. The Lake is a wondrous place.

As to Lieberman, I can understand why Senator Clinton may avoid the word “prick” but it’s lovely to get her on the record about his sanctimony.

I’ve submitted my question about Lieberman in as many forums as possible, for any and all presidential candidates but particularly Obama (”What role might your mentor Joe Lieberman play in your administration?”) but it never gets picked up, even at YKos, where I thought it would be a lock.

That is a very good question, Teddy. They absolutely should have asked it at YK.

That assumes that Matt Bai or Peter Daou have a frikin’ clue….

That fact not currently in evidence.

And yes, I am being sarcastic.

Jane Hamsher @ 24

TeddySanFran @ 8

Jane, thanks for the wonderful opportunity to engage with John Dean on the previous thread. The Lake is a wondrous place.

As to Lieberman, I can understand why Senator Clinton may avoid the word “prick” but it’s lovely to get her on the record about his sanctimony.

My old man used to say, “I’d call him a prick but a prick has a head”!

Jane,
Since the first time I found Firedoglake, I have been astounded by and grateful for all you and this community has accomplished. Additionally, events like the Blue America chats and Book Salons enable communication that fosters real democracy.

Three cheers for FDL and its foul-mouthed bloggers.

Joe Liberman is a prick.

sanctimonious joe – LMAO!!! how shocking – who knew lol OMG!!! and his shit doesn’t stink either

Ah, yes. Joe-effing-Lieberman, the jerk who just couldn’t wait to backstab Bill Clinton by giving the GOP the ‘bipartisan’ cover they needed to push for the horrific idea of impeaching someone, not over senselessly causing the deaths of over a million people as Bush has done in Iraq, but for trying to hide an affair.

Words effing fail me.

New spelling, just for Joe: SanctiMOANius

A.Citizen @ 25

Audrey @ 19

FireFox uh…..well….ya know….

It works good.

Heh. It’s all about timing. I’m normally asleep right now having worked all night, but didn’t want to miss Dean…and in fact, I missed most of it. *sniff* He’s been my hero for a looong time.

;)

TJ @ 29

Jane,
Since the first time I found Firedoglake, I have been astounded by and grateful for all you and this community has accomplished. Additionally, events like the Blue America chats and Book Salons enable communication that fosters real democracy.

Three cheers for FDL and its foul-mouthed bloggers.

Ahem. I believe the term is “foul-mouthed fem bloggers.” We non-fems are always polite. :)

Scarecrow @ 35

TJ @ 29

Jane,
Since the first time I found Firedoglake, I have been astounded by and grateful for all you and this community has accomplished. Additionally, events like the Blue America chats and Book Salons enable communication that fosters real democracy.

Three cheers for FDL and its foul-mouthed bloggers.

Ahem. I believe the term is “foul-mouthed fem bloggers.” We non-fems are always polite. :)

But I wanted to cheer for you too, Scarecrow. You’ve been a fantastic addition to the front page.

well.. is that all the rethug Ministry of Truth can come up with? They don’t like her laugh? or is this just another one of those rally the base culture-war things that I don’t understand? Geesh they’re imbecilic!

Speaking of Hannity, did y’all see this gem, on the Gore nobel award, on Faux News:
“You know, we have put up scientists, meteorologists, expert, one after another, hundreds and hundreds of them, that disagree with Al Gore and disagree with you, but you guys continue to repeat this myth that this evidence is overwhelming and incontrovertible.”

He actually started talking about “settled law” to refer to science.. until science is “settled” it should never be referenced by policymakers… cause it’s just conjecture. I wonder how long he thinks it takes science to “settle”?

Rik Hertzberg is an amazingly good writer.

Hume’s “lapse into graciousness.” Priceless.

Oh and Jane, you are awesome. That book salon list on the right is impressive to say the least. Thanks so much for this even if I complain about the techie stuff I still appreciate it the work you and the crew put into it.

God bless you!

Blub @ 37

well.. is that all the rethug Ministry of Truth can come up with? They don’t like her laugh? or is this just another one of those rally the base culture-war things that I don’t understand? Geesh they’re imbecilic!

Speaking of Hannity, did y’all see this gem, on the Gore nobel award, on Faux News:
“You know, we have put up scientists, meteorologists, expert, one after another, hundreds and hundreds of them, that disagree with Al Gore and disagree with you, but you guys continue to repeat this myth that this evidence is overwhelming and incontrovertible.”

In my dictionary, next to the definition of “irrelevant,” there’s a picture of Sean Hannity.

Here’s the thing about Lieberman’s future I worry about: he’ll be rather useless in the Senate in 2009, given our likely larger Democratic majority (I hope). Therefore he will seek other pastures to make himself sanctimonious and outspoken. He’ll be angling for a job in a Democratic administration, and I’d like all our candidates to pledge not to hire him.

He has no place in a Democratic administration, and our candidates should say so.

Is there any polling on Joe’s approval with CT people?

Loo Hoo. @ 21

DB, don’t you have one of Joe in diapers and with a pacifier?

Sorry, Loo Hoo…He wasn’t very cooperative on picture day and spat the dummy.

;>)

Chas in the San Juans @ 20

They have to immediately attack her laughter at these gasbags, because it is the most powerful response anyone has made to them in a long time.

When you laugh at someone, you are signaling that you are not afraid of them. And you are giving other people permission to laugh at them. That is very, very empowering.

They can’t have that. So they are attacking with everything they can find.

But as Boston1775 says, the women out there know what’s going on here.

I had a conversation with Digby about this, and she said the same thing. She was in a message thread about the laugh thing, and opinions split along gender lines. The women thought it was great, the men thought it wasn’t.

Being a man, and having been laughed at by women at times, I can tell you how powerful an act it is, and how threatening.

Women get it, and women vote. In fact, from what I read, suburban women are the major swing group in the upcoming election.

Keep laughing HRC, it works.

Absolutely. Watching her laugh and contain her laughing was one of the best things I’ve seen in a while.

“Cackle” indeed. What a limp response…

Can we add unctuous and hypocritical?
We need to see some more clips of Holy Joe yucking it up with Imus before attacking the crudeness of popular entertainment.

Hillary The DLC pot said, “Well, he the DLC kettle is certainly sanctimonious.”

Audrey — just before he left, Dean said he had to go make a speech, but would return later this evening to continue answering questions. Check back on the prior thread later.

TeddySanFran @ 41

Here’s the thing about Lieberman’s future I worry about: he’ll be rather useless in the Senate in 2009, given our likely larger Democratic majority (I hope). Therefore he will seek other pastures to make himself sanctimonious and outspoken. He’ll be angling for a job in a Democratic administration, and I’d like all our candidates to pledge not to hire him.

He has no place in a Democratic administration, and our candidates should say so.

Are you suggesting you believe he will be denied committee chairs by his old pals?

TeddySanFran @ 41

Here’s the thing about Lieberman’s future I worry about: he’ll be rather useless in the Senate in 2009, given our likely larger Democratic majority (I hope). Therefore he will seek other pastures to make himself sanctimonious and outspoken. He’ll be angling for a job in a Democratic administration, and I’d like all our candidates to pledge not to hire him.

He has no place in a Democratic administration, and our candidates should say so.

Naah. I say make him ambassador to Zimbabwe, and he can hang out with his soul-mate, Robert Mugabe.

Nah. Joementum is not a prick.

Being a prick connotes that which testosterone and androgen enable, a certain erectness, shall we say?

Joementum is the very definition of flaccid, quite the opposite of what we might expect from a prick. He is limp, ineffectual, utterly spineless.

Sanctimonious detumescence in all its glory; the only thing swollen about him is his ego.

I was over at the Dean thread using Opera as usual and had no problems — until I went and came back and found that the comments would not load after a hard refresh. First time that has ever happened with Opera. What’s going on with the Dean thread that is different? Is it likely to be a long-term FDL thing?

The right would rather women didn’t speak, but their mediabots can’t come out and actually say that, so they make sport of Hillary’s laugh.

They’d rather she made no sound at all; the laugh is the stand-in for speech.

burnspbesq @ 49

Naah. I say make him ambassador to Zimbabwe, and he can hang out with his soul-mate, Robert Mugabe.

or Myanmar.. do we have an embassy there?

Chas in the San Juans @ 20

They have to immediately attack her laughter at these gasbags, because it is the most powerful response anyone has made to them in a long time.

When you laugh at someone, you are signaling that you are not afraid of them. And you are giving other people permission to laugh at them. That is very, very empowering.

They can’t have that. So they are attacking with everything they can find.

But as Boston1775 says, the women out there know what’s going on here.

I had a conversation with Digby about this, and she said the same thing. She was in a message thread about the laugh thing, and opinions split along gender lines. The women thought it was great, the men thought it wasn’t.

Being a man, and having been laughed at by women at times, I can tell you how powerful an act it is, and how threatening.

Women get it, and women vote. In fact, from what I read, suburban women are the major swing group in the upcoming election.

Keep laughing HRC, it works.

When HRC laughs at these morons, their cremaster muscles go into spasm. I agree, keep it up.

By the way, I really appreciated the John Dean guest spot today. It’s a pity there was some sort of IE glitch (folks, this is why I run linux ;-) ) but it seemed to run along okay once that was fixed. I was really impressed with his demeanor and the things he had to say AND that he’d be back later on around 6ish(?) to pick up after his other obligations today. WOW! And he gives real answers, too.

I sort of feel like I got to watch a bit of history, you know? Sweet.

Scarecrow @ 35

TJ @ 29

Jane,
Since the first time I found Firedoglake, I have been astounded by and grateful for all you and this community has accomplished. Additionally, events like the Blue America chats and Book Salons enable communication that fosters real democracy.

Three cheers for FDL and its foul-mouthed bloggers.

Ahem. I believe the term is “foul-mouthed fem bloggers.” We non-fems are always polite. :)

That’s feckin’ right!

Even Dodd who seems pretty reasoned is afraid to dump on HoJo. The senate is like a website forum.. you act kinda civilized even to whackjobs because it’s polite.

Can’t for the like of me understand why they didn’t tell him to march with the elephants because he ran against a dem. Where’s that at?
Of I forgot… spineless dems

Let us all thank whatever things there are to thank that we aren’t sitting here moping over Vice President Lieberman’s seeming lock on the Democratic nomination.

Blub @ 53

burnspbesq @ 49

Naah. I say make him ambassador to Zimbabwe, and he can hang out with his soul-mate, Robert Mugabe.

or Myanmar.. do we have an embassy there?

I say shave off what little fuzz he has left on that flaccid head of his, swaddle tightly in a saffron robe and ship ‘em. Then let’s see what happens.

congrats, peterk!

Blub @ 37

well.. is that all the rethug Ministry of Truth can come up with? They don’t like her laugh? or is this just another one of those rally the base culture-war things that I don’t understand? Geesh they’re imbecilic!

Speaking of Hannity, did y’all see this gem, on the Gore nobel award, on Faux News:
“You know, we have put up scientists, meteorologists, expert, one after another, hundreds and hundreds of them, that disagree with Al Gore and disagree with you, but you guys continue to repeat this myth that this evidence is overwhelming and incontrovertible.”

He actually started talking about “settled law” to refer to science.. until science is “settled” it should never be referenced by policymakers… cause it’s just conjecture. I wonder how long he thinks it takes science to “settle”?

‘Ministry of Truth’ – i like that better than MSM. Gets right to the point.

Scarecrow @ 47

Audrey — just before he left, Dean said he had to go make a speech, but would return later this evening to continue answering questions. Check back on the prior thread later.

You can be sure I will. Thanks, Scarecrow. :)

Blub @ 53

burnspbesq @ 49

Naah. I say make him ambassador to Zimbabwe, and he can hang out with his soul-mate, Robert Mugabe.

or Myanmar.. do we have an embassy there?

If we do, I sure hope we’ve brought our ambassador home for “consultations.” That’s the diplomatic equivalent of a full-on hissy fit, and the first step on the road to breaking off diplomatic relations.

I think the laugh was super and all dems should laugh at stupid questions on Fox or any network for that matter.

They are a joke of a news organization… Chris Wallace?

TeddySanFran @ 41

Here’s the thing about Lieberman’s future I worry about: he’ll be rather useless in the Senate in 2009, given our likely larger Democratic majority (I hope). Therefore he will seek other pastures to make himself sanctimonious and outspoken. He’ll be angling for a job in a Democratic administration, and I’d like all our candidates to pledge not to hire him.

He has no place in a Democratic administration, and our candidates should say so.

Junya, in retirement, is gonna need a real good butt-kisser and Joe has got the creds: “My lips, meet Repug ass.”

cleter @ 58

Let us all thank whatever things there are to thank that we aren’t sitting here moping over Vice President Lieberman’s seeming lock on the Democratic nomination.

They say every cloud has a silver lining. I think you’ve identified a great one. The other one I truly believe is that Al Gore does not have responsibility for 9/11 on his conscience. He would have felt guilty for every life lost, unlike our current president who only thought about leveraging it to his whims.

Intelligent design as settled science. God said so.

darkblack @ 43

Loo Hoo. @ 21

DB, don’t you have one of Joe in diapers and with a pacifier?

Sorry, Loo Hoo…He wasn’t very cooperative on picture day and spat the dummy.

;>)

Perfection!

Sanctimonious detumescence
I am loving that, Rayne.

I don’t mind Hillary laughing at laughable stuff. I don’t understand the right wing going bonkers over it. Doesn’t Bush chortle all the time? Do they object to that?

TeddySanFran @ 52

The right would rather women didn’t speak, but their mediabots can’t come out and actually say that, so they make sport of Hillary’s laugh.

They’d rather she made no sound at all; the laugh is the stand-in for speech.

Actually, I think (to a lot of people, anyway) it makes her sound more human and less calculating, which scares the rethugs. Also, she is the annointed dem front-runner, so they have to attack her personally, and the laugh identifies her gender, somewhat, so is a good target, resonating with a lot of men who are afraid of women in power (a little like the–gasp!–cleaveage issue a while back).

SanderO @ 57

Even Dodd who seems pretty reasoned is afraid to dump on HoJo. The senate is like a website forum.. you act kinda civilized even to whackjobs because it’s polite.

Can’t for the like of me understand why they didn’t tell him to march with the elephants because he ran against a dem. Where’s that at?
Of I forgot… spineless dems

Maybe Dodd, et al, have a forlorn hope that Leiberman will sometime, somehow, do the right thing. And they actually have had to live with the dude…

cleter @ 70

I don’t mind Hillary laughing at laughable stuff. I don’t understand the right wing going bonkers over it. Doesn’t Bush chortle all the time? Do they object to that?

and that chortle is downright creepy

TJ @ 66

cleter @ 58

Let us all thank whatever things there are to thank that we aren’t sitting here moping over Vice President Lieberman’s seeming lock on the Democratic nomination.

They say every cloud has a silver lining. I think you’ve identified a great one. The other one I truly believe is that Al Gore does not have responsibility for 9/11 on his conscience. He would have felt guilty for every life lost, unlike our current president who only thought about leveraging it to his whims.

If Al Gore had been president on 9/11, Osama would be in the Federal Supermax serving a life sentence, and no American troops would have died in Iraq. And Pat Tillman would be playing safety for the Arizona Cardinals.

So, policy-wise, how does Hillary differ from Lieberman, exactly? Are their voting records strikingly different?

Just out of curiosity, have any of the Republican candidates’ trophy wives shown cleavage?

uhhhh joe doesn’t even front that he’s a dem – has definitely travelled to the dark side

TJ @ 66

cleter @ 58

Let us all thank whatever things there are to thank that we aren’t sitting here moping over Vice President Lieberman’s seeming lock on the Democratic nomination.

They say every cloud has a silver lining. I think you’ve identified a great one. The other one I truly believe is that Al Gore does not have responsibility for 9/11 on his conscience. He would have felt guilty for every life lost, unlike our current president who only thought about leveraging it to his whims.

I’ll make the obvious point that President Gore might have paid attention to a PDB entitled “Bin Laden Determined To Attack In U.S.” And he probably would’ve thwarted 911, having noticed all the hair on fire at Ft Meade & Langley — something this crew totally ignored.

TJ @ 76

Just out of curiosity, have any of the Republican candidates’ trophy wives shown cleavage?

perhaps they make ‘em wear burkas.

Hillary and Bill, You’ve read this thing right. There are more educated women than any powerful man wants to think about.

Cackle is just one of those words that can make a woman angry, offended and … well, angry.

Elliott @ 73

cleter @ 70

I don’t mind Hillary laughing at laughable stuff. I don’t understand the right wing going bonkers over it. Doesn’t Bush chortle all the time? Do they object to that?

and that chortle is downright creepy

Yeah, because it shows his insecurity. Her laugh sounds much more genuine, IMO.

TJ @ 76

Just out of curiosity, have any of the Republican candidates’ trophy wives shown cleavage?

I carry this in my wallet. [in case people ask the question]

burnspbesq @ 74

TJ @ 66

They say every cloud has a silver lining. I think you’ve identified a great one. The other one I truly believe is that Al Gore does not have responsibility for 9/11 on his conscience. He would have felt guilty for every life lost, unlike our current president who only thought about leveraging it to his whims.

If Al Gore had been president on 9/11, Osama would be in the Federal Supermax serving a life sentence, and no American troops would have died in Iraq.

Very true. But despite this happening, Republicans would have blamed 9/11 on the fact that we had a Democratic president. History has now shown that having a Republican president does not protect our country from attacks.

TJ @ 66

cleter @ 58

Let us all thank whatever things there are to thank that we aren’t sitting here moping over Vice President Lieberman’s seeming lock on the Democratic nomination.

They say every cloud has a silver lining. I think you’ve identified a great one. The other one I truly believe is that Al Gore does not have responsibility for 9/11 on his conscience. He would have felt guilty for every life lost, unlike our current president who only thought about leveraging it to his whims.

Gore would have listened to the August warnings and might well have averted the attack, you know.

But we’ll never know. And what Gore has done since is just amazing. And you know, it’s also a giant middle finger waved at all the right wing reicht…

@ peanutbutter @ 55

By the way, I really appreciated the John Dean guest spot today. It’s a pity there was some sort of IE glitch (folks, this is why I run linux ;-) ) but it seemed to run along okay once that was fixed. I was really impressed with his demeanor and the things he had to say AND that he’d be back later on around 6ish(?) to pick up after his other obligations today. WOW! And he gives real answers, too.

I sort of feel like I got to watch a bit of history, you know? Sweet.

I just got in from work, hoping to read Dean’s live blog. Can’t get it, or any earlier threads either. What gives?

TJ @ 76

Just out of curiosity, have any of the Republican candidates’ trophy wives shown cleavage?

Mrs Fred “Rooski don’ take a dump without a plan” Thompson 3.0 is not averse to showing off her technical marvels. A triumph of the surgeons art, they are.

Fred had some healthy man-cleavage, himself, before he started wasting away. Wait, were you being rhetorical? Sorry.

TJ @ 76

Just out of curiosity, have any of the Republican candidates’ trophy wives shown cleavage?

Actually, they have wives, but spend more time with their boyfriends if you know what I mean. Not sure if the boyfriends or the wives are showing cleavage at this time. ;-)

If Al Gore had been president on 9/11, Osama would be in the Federal Supermax serving a life sentence, and no American troops would have died in Iraq.

I think President elect Gore in spite of VP Lieberman would have actually listened to CIA visits interrupting his vacation with a Bin Laden determined to strike US type of warning.. 9-11 might not have been explosive at all with President elect Gore.

TeddySanFran @ 78

TJ @ 66

They say every cloud has a silver lining. I think you’ve identified a great one. The other one I truly believe is that Al Gore does not have responsibility for 9/11 on his conscience. He would have felt guilty for every life lost, unlike our current president who only thought about leveraging it to his whims.

I’ll make the obvious point that President Gore might have paid attention to a PDB entitled “Bin Laden Determined To Attack In U.S.” And he probably would’ve thwarted 911, having noticed all the hair on fire at Ft Meade & Langley — something this crew totally ignored.

TSF – I’ll agree he would have paid attention, but I’m not sure anything could have stopped it.

I think the right made a mistake going after Hillary for her laugh, unless they want her to be the nominee. I was drawn to her for her laughter (especially at Chris Wallace, knowing Bill’s recent history with him) but I became defensive on her behalf when Fox & Fiends unleashed their absurd criticism.

I won’t leave Edwards unless he’s defeated, but Hill’s had a great month. I am drawn to her after this silliness — does that make sense?

yellowdogD @ 85

I just got in from work, hoping to read Dean’s live blog. Can’t get it, or any earlier threads either. What gives?

Try Firefox; apparently there has been a problem with IE.

Which seems incredibly odd, don’t you think? I don’t recall ever hearing of a single post that caused problems for users of a particular browser in this way before, except in reference to embedded images…

Scarecrow @ 82

TJ @ 76

Just out of curiosity, have any of the Republican candidates’ trophy wives shown cleavage?

I carry this in my wallet. [in case people ask the question]

You carry a picture of Senator Cryptkeeper and his succubus in your wallet?

yellowdogD @ 85

I just got in from work, hoping to read Dean’s live blog. Can’t get it, or any earlier threads either. What gives?

Seemed to be a browser issue, ydD. Try firefox?

FunnyD

de·tu·mes·cence (dē’tōō-měs’əns, -tyōō-) Pronunciation Key
n. Reduction or lessening of a swelling, especially the restoration of a swollen organ or part to normal size.

What happened to the John Dean thing? There was, and is nothing on my screen but the intro. No place for comments or anything.

yellowdogD @ 85

@ peanutbutter @ 55

By the way, I really appreciated the John Dean guest spot today. It’s a pity there was some sort of IE glitch (folks, this is why I run linux ;-) ) but it seemed to run along okay once that was fixed. I was really impressed with his demeanor and the things he had to say AND that he’d be back later on around 6ish(?) to pick up after his other obligations today. WOW! And he gives real answers, too.

I sort of feel like I got to watch a bit of history, you know? Sweet.

I just got in from work, hoping to read Dean’s live blog. Can’t get it, or any earlier threads either. What gives?

There’s a glitch in the system. Try using a browser other that IE or Safari. Firefox worked for me.

Blamed 9.11 on a president… there’s plenty of question as to whether W and his sidekick let it happen or made it happen. They certainly made out because it happened.

Read the Shock Doctrine.

Rayne @ 91

yellowdogD @ 85

I just got in from work, hoping to read Dean’s live blog. Can’t get it, or any earlier threads either. What gives?

Try Firefox; apparently there has been a problem with IE.

Which seems incredibly odd, don’t you think? I don’t recall ever hearing of a single post that caused problems for users of a particular browser in this way before, except in reference to embedded images…

I’m curious too & would love to hear a technical explanation. My day job involves cross platform compatibility and there’s a few things that could be candidates such as particular javascripts, and it is clear that a lot of that is tucked into the commentary section via the refresh comments, quote, etc. But clearly most of those things work most of the time here, O I’m curious, even professionally curious as well…

TeddySanFran @ 90

[snip]

I won’t leave Edwards unless he’s defeated, but Hill’s had a great month. I am drawn to her after this silliness — does that make sense?

I know what you mean. IMO, she is close to perfect in the image department, which is essential for being a good President (and winning the election as well, of course). What worries me is what she would actually DO as prez..

cleter @ 92

Scarecrow @ 82

I carry this in my wallet. [in case people ask the question]

You carry a picture of Senator Cryptkeeper and his succubus in your wallet?

No, don’t have that one; do you have a link?

I see O’Reilly, etc’s comments as no evidence of her being a good guy. It’s a kneejerk reaction.

They think she’s got it won, and some of them can’t even wait to start hammering her.

Right now, it’s mostly personal stuff, but wait to see if she wins the nomination. Then, it will be a drumbeat, and every time she opens her mouth and tap-dances a step to the left, they will flay the hide off her over her consistent support for the war, until she started reading the polls about the surge.

and, once we nominate her, watch how fast the MSM stops with the “she’s really OK” BS, and watch them jump right into the hammerfest, themselves.

That same old deadly question:

How can she go after the GOP about the war, which is THE issue on which they are most vulnerable, and on which we can and should swamp them at the polls, when she doesn’t believe that the invasion was a mistake?

I don’t know the date of her little love-tap at Lieberman, but until I see different I think it’s fair to assume that it was recent, and that fits with the fact that she’s trying to get a toe back in the progressive tent, because she’s getting worked over on her earlier and unapologized-for positions, including her support for Lieberman.

One of the posters here, in a moment of utter clarity, described her positions as “tepid incrementalism”.

Hammer-nail-bang.

Only, as Iraq continues to loom larger and larger as THE central issue of the campaign, her increments are going to have to get bigger. And there will be people reminding all and sundry about the expansion.

The problem the republicans have, is getting their rank-and-file to limit their swipes at her to a kind of en passant jabs, and to save their political ammo in case she does get nominated.

Nothing has changed. She is the one politician who can keep the white house in republican hands, and who can make Giuliani’s, or any other republican’s, slimy coattails, look so clean and attractive that they could take back the Senate and the House.

My 2 cents, no free ride for her. Let her be asked, over and over, why she doesn’t think it was a wretched, bloody, mistake, to pull the trigger on Iraq.

And why she’s so cozy with AIPAC, which has an undeniable agenda of pushing our government for an attack on Iran.

And how she thinks she can capitalize on the issue of Iraq in the election, when she’s been such a supporter of the war.

PeterK @ 99

TeddySanFran @ 90

[snip]

I won’t leave Edwards unless he’s defeated, but Hill’s had a great month. I am drawn to her after this silliness — does that make sense?

I know what you mean. IMO, she is close to perfect in the image department, which is essential for being a good President (and winning the election as well, of course). What worries me is what she would actually DO as prez..

Yes, in a nutshell.

Hoping to vote Edwards ‘08!

Hillary talks OK but she takes cash from the coffers of corporate america. That’s a bad sign as I doubt whether she will have the sense and the balls to tell them to F off when she has the key to the oval office.

She a pol gal… and aside from her chromosomes she acts like one of the good old boys.

SanderO @ 97

Blamed 9.11 on a president… there’s plenty of question as to whether W and his sidekick let it happen or made it happen. They certainly made out because it happened.

Read the Shock Doctrine.

It never ceases to amaze me that they ran for re-election on 911. It happened on their watch. A Democrat would have been impeached, or at least pilloried. But not W, not by our media.

Or by our Democrats, for that matter.

cleter @ 75

So, policy-wise, how does Hillary differ from Lieberman, exactly? Are their voting records strikingly different?

Hillary’s record.

Sanctimonious’ record.

PeterK @ 99

TeddySanFran @ 90

[snip]

I won’t leave Edwards unless he’s defeated, but Hill’s had a great month. I am drawn to her after this silliness — does that make sense?

I know what you mean. IMO, she is close to perfect in the image department, which is essential for being a good President (and winning the election as well, of course). What worries me is what she would actually DO as prez..

I fully expect we’ll have to primary her in 2012.

Yesiree… Hillary’s my girl all right. Particularly in view of the help she afforded Ned Lamont in defeating this sanctimonius guy Lieberman.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 106

Yesiree… Hillary’s my girl all right. Particularly in view of the help she afforded Ned Lamont in defeating this sanctimonius guy Lieberman.

She loaned him Wolfson, her guru, and let Ned be photographed with her on her flowery chintz sofa in the Chappaqua sunroom. Are you aware of other aid she gave?

I am ready to debate the pros and cons of Hillary.

Hi pups -

The US Embassy in Burma is headed by:

Chargé d’Affaires
Shari Villarosa
Union of Burma
Term of Appointment: August 2005 to present

Shari Villarosa became Chargé d’Affaires of our Embassy in Rangoon, Burma on August 31, 2005. She previously served as Director of Philippines, Malaysia, Brunei, Singapore Affairs in the Department of State’s East Asia and Pacific Bureau, Economic Counselor of the U.S. Embassy in Jakarta, Indonesia and Chargé d’Affaires of our new Embassy in Dili, East Timor.

The previous Charge’ served from 2002-2005.

The State Dept recalled the US Ambassador sometime after the 1988 election in Burma was overturned by the Junta.

The fact the State Dept objected to such an outcome suggests the US Ambassador was recalled prior to 2001.

burnspbesq @ 63

Blub @ 53

or Myanmar.. do we have an embassy there?

If we do, I sure hope we’ve brought our ambassador home for “consultations.” That’s the diplomatic equivalent of a full-on hissy fit, and the first step on the road to breaking off diplomatic relations.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 109

I am ready to debate the pros and cons of Hillary.

Ok. I’ll take the “con.” You go first.

“I’m curious too & would love to hear a technical explanation. My day job involves cross platform compatibility and there’s a few things that could be candidates such as particular javascripts, and it is clear that a lot of that is tucked into the commentary section via the refresh comments, quote, etc. But clearly most of those things work most of the time here, O I’m curious, even professionally curious as well…”

peanutbutter…

Here’s the kicker: As far as I can tell, it’s only happening on the Dean thread and the front page. I couldn’t get in on the Dean thread with IE so I went to my history and got into the previous thread just fine.

Sorry for the OT, but it is curious.

TeddySanFran @ 107

Chappaqua

in general, I have trust issues with politicians who relocate in order to find a good place to run for congressional office. Politics is meant to be local… you serve a constituency.. not parachute into Westchester County ’cause there’s an empty senate seat nearby.

She is a Pro who wont rid us of the Cons.

SanderO @ 41

Is there any polling on Joe’s approval with CT people?

The poll that asked a question close to yours is here at DailyKos. If there were a rematch, Lamont would win.

Rayne @ 91

yellowdogD @ 85

I just got in from work, hoping to read Dean’s live blog. Can’t get it, or any earlier threads either. What gives?

Try Firefox; apparently there has been a problem with IE.

Which seems incredibly odd, don’t you think? I don’t recall ever hearing of a single post that caused problems for users of a particular browser in this way before, except in reference to embedded images…

I have a vague memory of some browser-specific problems after a WordPress upgrade a longish while back.

I blame Bill Gates.

(For IE, that is. The vagueness of my memory I blame on other things. I forget what, though.)

okk

uhhhhhhhhhhh ……..NO!!

Jane Hamsher
“I could probably enlarge on that a bit, but it wouldn’t be anything I haven’t said before.”

Lieberman an “enlarged” Sanctimonious prick. That about covers it.

TeddySanFran @ 90

I think the right made a mistake going after Hillary for her laugh, unless they want her to be the nominee. I was drawn to her for her laughter (especially at Chris Wallace, knowing Bill’s recent history with him) but I became defensive on her behalf when Fox & Fiends unleashed their absurd criticism.

I won’t leave Edwards unless he’s defeated, but Hill’s had a great month. I am drawn to her after this silliness — does that make sense?

Yeah. Because whatever her faults, she is on our team. Pissed me off about the haircut and the Barack Hussein Obama too.

Eureka Springs @ 114

She is a Pro who wont rid us of the Cons.

Nice! Aloha, Ya’ll!!!

TeddySanFran @ 108

Oklahoma kiddo @ 106

Yesiree… Hillary’s my girl all right. Particularly in view of the help she afforded Ned Lamont in defeating this sanctimonius guy Lieberman.

She loaned him Wolfson, her guru, and let Ned be photographed with her on her flowery chintz sofa in the Chappaqua sunroom. Are you aware of other aid she gave?

I heard something about $5,000 dollars. Hillary threw Lamont to the dogs. And Hillary gets a lot of her campaign monies from the same interests as does Lieberman. HRC is a punk. And I may forced to choose between her and a Republican in Nov., 2008. What’s galling is Clinton knows I won’t vote for the GOP candidate. I resent it.

I’ll go out on a limb here, and predict that as Iraq continues to be the central issue, and may very well worsen, at some point; then, unless Edwards and Obama are just stalking horses who really don’t want the nomination, I think Clinton’s support will begin to erode, and in panic mode, she will finally and unequivocally eat that authorization vote and say flatly that it WAS a mistake to invade Iraq.

By then, I think, and hope, it will be too late, and she won’t be able to turn what is shaping up to be a political rout in our favor, into the kind of cliffhanger that the GOP can steal. Again.

Hillary Clinton is not on my team. She just happens to be a registered Democrat like myself.

Good News

Minnesota school reverses course,
reissues invitation to Tutu

http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iow…..vited.html

Scarecrow @ 111

Oklahoma kiddo @ 109

I am ready to debate the pros and cons of Hillary.

Ok. I’ll take the “con.” You go first.

that should have come with a spew alert!

Scarecrow @ 110

Oklahoma kiddo @ 109

I am ready to debate the pros and cons of Hillary.

Ok. I’ll take the “con.” You go first.

*chortle*

I think it was pretty much all said, though, here:

What worries me is what she would actually DO as prez..

Despite not liking Clinton, I’m also not an Edwards fan anymore.. after his (and his wife’s) more recent comments against Iran and other “tough guy persona” foreign policy issues. At that point, I’ll just say that I’ll vote for any Democrat who gets the nomination whose name isn’t Kucinich (whom I despise as the Dem equivalent of an isolationist protectionist)

CTut; that WAS funny. :o)

Loo Hoo. @ 104

cleter @ 75

So, policy-wise, how does Hillary differ from Lieberman, exactly? Are their voting records strikingly different?

Hillary’s record.

Sanctimonious’ record.

They look basically the same.

We in this house are disapponted today. There was no John Dean.

kathleen@124

got the email from JVP last wednesday re REV TUTU’s re-invite :)

I know you and lahoma were looking forward to John Dean, OKK. Christy even asked your question for you. He’ll be back to answer more questions later.

cleter @ 128

Loo Hoo. @ 104

Hillary’s record.

Sanctimonious’ record.

They look basically the same.

Slap. hand. do. not. make. obvious. “p”. comment.

Blub @ 127

Despite not liking Clinton, I’m also not an Edwards fan anymore.. after his (and his wife’s) more recent comments against Iran and other “tough guy persona” foreign policy issues. At that point, I’ll just say that I’ll vote for any Democrat who gets the nomination whose name isn’t Kucinich (whom I despise as the Dem equivalent of an isolationist protectionist)

Now, don’t go picking on DK! I happen to like him and many of his views, to a point…!!! :P

What do you mean no John Dean.. he was rather prolifically answering and even asking questions on the last thread, or was I mistaken?

No more mister nice guy with me, Hillary. Gloves are off.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 130

We in this house are disapponted today. There was no John Dean.

Just as an FYI – I encountered a lot of Word Press problems today – it’s a shame but it happens

Oklahoma kiddo @ 129

We in this house are disapponted today. There was no John Dean.

It’s there, OKK. Try using a different browser.

Loo Hoo. @ 132

I know you and lahoma were looking forward to John Dean, OKK. Christy even asked your question for you. He’ll be back to answer more questions later.

Thank you Loo Hoo. ;0)

Loo Hoo. @ 105

cleter @ 75

So, policy-wise, how does Hillary differ from Lieberman, exactly? Are their voting records strikingly different?

Hillary’s record.

Sanctimonious’ record.

Progressive Punch comparison of Voting records of Clinton, Obama, Dodd, Lieberman

link

PeterK @ 132

cleter @ 128

They look basically the same.

Slap. hand. do. not. make. obvious. “p”. comment.

Whose is bigger?

Oklahoma kiddo @ 136

No more mister nice guy with me, Hillary. Gloves are off.

What number would that pair be now, OKK? Tenth pair..??? ;-)

Latest on Jena 6
Mychal Bell back in jail

” “Jena 6” Teen Mychal Bell Sent Back to Prison
In Jena, Louisiana, the ‘Jena 6’ teen Mychal
Bell has been sent back to jail. The seventeen-year old Bell has already served ten months in prison for a schoolyard fight in which Bell and five others beat up a white student. The fight occurred after white students hung three nooses from a tree where the black students had sat. An all-white jury convicted Bell of aggravated second-degree battery. Bell was allowed free on bail just two weeks ago after an appeals court found he had been improperly tried as an adult. But on Thursday, the same judge who wrongly tried Bell — District Judge J.P. Mauffrey — sentenced him to eighteen months in prison on charges pending from another case before the fight occured. Bell was sentenced on two counts of simple battery and two counts of criminal destruction of property. Judge Mauffrey also ordered Bell’s parents to pay all court and witness costs. Defense attorneys had previously tried to force Mauffrey to recuse himself from Bell’s case.”

http://www.democracynow.org/ar…..12/1454221

http://blogs.usatoday.com/onde…..n-bac.html

http://ap.google.com/article/A…..QD8S7S2V00

CTuttle @ 134

I happen to like him and many of his views, to a point…!!! :P

On the subject of DK, I guess I feel obliged to point out how extreme some of his views are, and, as a trained economist, how wrong I feel some of his theories are. True.. Edwards and Clinton aren’t progressives. But DK, who is a progressive after a manner, will bring about Great Depression: the Sequel as certainly as four more years of rethug rule will. Given that choice, and what I think the country needs now, I’ll grin and bear the non-progressive dems I have to choose from. At least business as usual isn’t fascism, on one extreme, and delusions of autarchy, on the other.

Millineryman @ 30

Joe Liberman is a prick.

Hi Millineryman! I wore the red hat you made for me to a big party last night and everyone loved it, got lots and lots of compliments about how beautiful it looked. Thank you so much.

OT..Loo Hoo, have you been following the eriposte threads at “The Left Coaster”?

Laughter is the best medicine to keep the wingnuts busy.

Lately IE has been going out on me or not opening for progressive websites only
….weird indeed.

ccmask @ 147

Laughter is the best medicine to keep the wingnuts busy.

if only they knew how to laugh…

Hillary’s vote for the Kyl/Lieberman amendment was the straw that broke my back. She is not listening to Middle America on this one. She may have the I-lobby but there are tons of Americans, Republicans, Democrats and Independents who are Jews, Christians, Muslims, Agnostics and Atheist who do not support a pre-emptive strike on Iran. Especially based on unsubstantiated claims.

Alecia @ 148

Lately IE has been going out on me or not opening for progressive websites only
….weird indeed.

more innocuously (or perhaps not) I can no longer get IE (after one of those mandatory Microsoft sec patches) to work my employer’s email site.

Blub @ 144

CTuttle @ 134

I happen to like him and many of his views, to a point…!!! :P

On the subject of DK, I guess I feel obliged to point out how extreme some of his views are, and, as a trained economist, how wrong I feel some of his theories are. True.. Edwards and Clinton aren’t progressives. But DK, who is a progressive after a manner, will bring about Great Depression: the Sequel as certainly as four more years of rethug rule will. Given that choice, and what I think the country needs now, I’ll grin and bear the non-progressive dems I have to choose from. At least business as usual isn’t fascism, on one extreme, and delusions of autarchy, on the other.

A Dept of Peace would be nice…!!! *g*

Steve-AR @ 140

Loo Hoo. @ 105

Hillary’s record.

Sanctimonious’ record.

Progressive Punch comparison of Voting records of Clinton, Obama, Dodd, Lieberman

142.php”>link

great links thanks

You know, for years I made it a touchstone not to agree overmuch with Arthur Schlesinger, but I may have to rethink that. I’m off to pick up the diaries now.

CTuttle @ 152

A Dept of Peace would be nice…!!! *g*

for me personally, there’s also the question of California’s interests (I’m a patriotic Californian first :) ). Kucinich’s economic policies would be even more devastating for this state than they would be for the country as a whole. Just sayin’…

Jane Hamsher @ 145

Millineryman @ 30

Joe Liberman is a prick.

Hi Millineryman! I wore the red hat you made for me to a big party last night and everyone loved it, got lots and lots of compliments about how beautiful it looked. Thank you so much.

Hi Jane,
WOW! Thanks for letting me know. I bet you looked fabulous in it! You know the hat can only do so much. :)

Alecia @ 148

Lately IE has been going out on me or not opening for progressive websites only
….weird indeed.

Do you remember awhile back when IE, Haloscan, and Blogger all went down in the same night for a few hours? Makes you wonder if the powers-that-be were up to something? Could be.

Blub @ 151

Alecia @ 148

Lately IE has been going out on me or not opening for progressive websites only
….weird indeed.

more innocuously (or perhaps not) I can no longer get IE (after one of those mandatory Microsoft sec patches) to work my employer’s email site.

I can no longer get IE 7 to access the Electronic Freedom Foundation’s website at http://www.eff.org.

Problem happens under both Windows Vista SP1 Beta and Windows XP SP2.

Billy Gates, what are doin’ to my systems?

A Dept of Peace would be nice…!!! *g*

It’s called the State Department. Kucinich’s idea isn’t any better than naming endless “czars” to head up counter-productive or meaningless efforts.

What we really should do in this country is restore the DoD’s name to it’s original name, the Department of War. We need to eliminate as much Orwellian doublespeak as we can.

Steve-AR @ 146

OT..Loo Hoo, have you been following the eriposte threads at “The Left Coaster”?

I just looked at it. OKK, you should look at this. Scroll down to the chart and notice who is in the green.

Blub @ 155

CTuttle @ 152

A Dept of Peace would be nice…!!! *g*

for me personally, there’s also the question of California’s interests (I’m a patriotic Californian first :) ). Kucinich’s economic policies would be even more devastating for this state than they would be for the country as a whole. Just sayin’…

True, He’s as likely to get the nod as Ron Paul, has at the Gooper nod…!!! ;-)

CTuttle @ 161

Ron

I wouldn’t count the mad Texan out so quickly.. his fanatical followers might just stage a revolution ;-).. It’ll be pretty amusing if a strong libertarian voice emerges on the rethug side at the same time the fundies split to nominate Bauer or Dobson as their fringe indie candidate. Would anyone (outside of the military industrial complex) be left to cast a vote for Rudy?

puppethead @ 159

A Dept of Peace would be nice…!!! *g*

It’s called the State Department. Kucinich’s idea isn’t any better than naming endless “czars” to head up counter-productive or meaningless efforts.

What we really should do in this country is restore the DoD’s name to it’s original name, the Department of War. We need to eliminate as much Orwellian doublespeak as we can.

Never fear! The Kennebunkport Peace Department is here!

Hey, they don’t mess around, especially in the town where Bush Sr. & Ice Cube lives. ;-)

Blub @ 162

CTuttle @ 161

Ron

I wouldn’t count the mad Texan out so quickly.. his fanatical followers might just stage a revolution ;-).. It’ll be pretty amusing if a strong liberarian voice emerges on the rethug side at the same time the fundies split to nominate Bauer or Dobson as their fringe indie candidate. Would anyone be left to cast a vote for Rudy?

New Yorkers? 8~)

Jane, do you have a picture of yourself in the red hat?

Blub, burns, and peanut butter. Want to plan a meet-up at the Harbor House in Dana Point some week-end? Oct. 27th is out for me, otherwise name a time. Any other Southern Californians?

Steve-AR @ 139

Loo Hoo. @ 105

Hillary’s record.

Sanctimonious’ record.

Progressive Punch comparison of Voting records of Clinton, Obama, Dodd, Lieberman

link

Thanks! That is very helpful. Her numbers are better than Lieberman’s, then, and about in line with Obama or Dodd.

CTuttle @ 164

New Yorkers? 8~)

yeah.. being boo’d at a Yankee game definitely affirms his lock on the big apple :)

AP. Obstacles stall Rice’s Mideast diplomacy.

Apparently it doesn’t dawn on the Secretary that she, her boss and his boss (Dick) and the rest of the neocons ARE the “obstacles”.

Blub @ 143

CTuttle @ 134

I happen to like him and many of his views, to a point…!!! :P

On the subject of DK, I guess I feel obliged to point out how extreme some of his views are, and, as a trained economist, how wrong I feel some of his theories are. True.. Edwards and Clinton aren’t progressives. But DK, who is a progressive after a manner, will bring about Great Depression: the Sequel as certainly as four more years of rethug rule will. Given that choice, and what I think the country needs now, I’ll grin and bear the non-progressive dems I have to choose from. At least business as usual isn’t fascism, on one extreme, and delusions of autarchy, on the other.

This country desperately needs some strong honest medicine on so may fronts. I don’t profess to be knowledgeable in economics but I do read Ian at FDL and watch Moyers who among others suggest we are in deep mearde no matter how one slices it. I know I seriously consider buying a mule instead of a new car these days. Kucinich would reduce the unitary executive powers while in the oval office and he would allow even insist on full accountability of the robber barons and he would work to bring production as well as fair pay back to the US middle class.. Restoration of our constitution and middle class will be painful for sure… The sooner the better, imo. Kucinich is the man for the job. I don’t think the radical right corporate sponsored congress would let him swing the economy nearly as far in the direction he would like… But liberty and the middle class would certainly be much more of the focus. And defense spending would be reduced for a change.

cleter @ 166

Thanks! That is very helpful. Her numbers are better than Lieberman’s, then, and about in line with Obama or Dodd.

with a few rather deafening lapses, her voting record is fairly OK.. but it still doesn’t mitigate my trust issues. I’ll take Dodd, of course, anyday anytime, but I just don’t see a scenario that can put him over the top.

Blub @ 161

CTuttle @ 161

Ron

I wouldn’t count the mad Texan out so quickly.. his fanatical followers might just stage a revolution ;-).. It’ll be pretty amusing if a strong libertarian voice emerges on the rethug side at the same time the fundies split to nominate Bauer or Dobson as their fringe indie candidate. Would anyone (outside of the military industrial complex) be left to cast a vote for Rudy?

For what it’s worth, at the local pumpkin festival, the Ron Paul people were out in force. The only people I’v seen being active around here are the Ron Paul folks–with the exception of the Guiliani people’s tasteless 9/11 demonstration.

Loo Hoo. @ 165

Jane, do you have a picture of yourself in the red hat?

Blub, burns, and peanut butter. Want to plan a meet-up at the Harbor House in Dana Point some week-end? Oct. 27th is out for me, otherwise name a time. Any other Southern Californians?

sure.. if I’m in town. Up north quite a lot lately. Lemme know :)

I wonder why the Bush administration never came out and told America who the big bad terrorist client was who paid for the “put options” on airline stock right before 911?

*crickets*

cleter, I certainly find that refreshing and a positive sign that We the People are awakening from our national coma…!!!

Blub@37
well.. is that all the rethug Ministry of Truth can come up with? They don’t like her laugh? or is this just another one of those rally the base culture-war things that I don’t understand? Geesh they’re imbecilic!
———-

Worked pretty well with Howard Dean — Old dogs, old tricks.

ccmask @ 173

I wonder why the Bush administration never came out and told America who the big bad terrorist client was who paid for the “put options” on airline stock right before 911?

*crickets*

and rat out Bandar and his bandits?

Oklahoma kiddo @ 135

No more mister nice guy with me, Hillary. Gloves are off.

7O7
They were on before?? ;-)

Loo Hoo. @ 160

Steve-AR @ 146

OT..Loo Hoo, have you been following the eriposte threads at “The Left Coaster”?

I just looked at it. OKK, you should look at this. Scroll down to the chart and notice who is in the green.

I saw that. Has my position on Hillary shifted as a result? What do you think? ;0)

Elliott @ 176

and rat out Bandar and his bandits?

Bandar an’ fellow rats invest heavily in our markets don’t they? Assuming these reports are true, I’d bet that they were the ones involved in any shady deals. Who knows what info Saudi intel might’ve fed ‘em.

If Hillary is correct about the issues, that must mean that the other candidates are wrong about Hillary being wrong.

Blub @ 143

CTuttle @ 134

I happen to like him and many of his views, to a point…!!! :P

On the subject of DK, I guess I feel obliged to point out how extreme some of his views are, and, as a trained economist, how wrong I feel some of his theories are. True.. Edwards and Clinton aren’t progressives. But DK, who is a progressive after a manner, will bring about Great Depression: the Sequel as certainly as four more years of rethug rule will. Given that choice, and what I think the country needs now, I’ll grin and bear the non-progressive dems I have to choose from. At least business as usual isn’t fascism, on one extreme, and delusions of autarchy, on the other.

I’d be interested to learn more about the problems with DK’s stuff in this vein…?

Blub @ 179

Elliott @ 176

and rat out Bandar and his bandits?

Bandar an’ fellow rats invest heavily in our markets don’t they? Assuming these reports are true, I’d bet that they were the ones involved in any shady deals. Who knows what info Saudi intel might’ve fed ‘em.

Who else?
Who else would be protected?
I know there are other possibilities — and I would love to hear the speculations — but this rings most of the bells imo.

It’s there, OKK. Try using a different browser.

I have IE; how do I use a different browser? Do I have to delete IE? You’ll obviously have to use very simple words to explain this to me!

Mad Dogs @ 157

Blub @ 151

more innocuously (or perhaps not) I can no longer get IE (after one of those mandatory Microsoft sec patches) to work my employer’s email site.

I can no longer get IE 7 to access the Electronic Freedom Foundation’s website at http://www.eff.org.

Problem happens under both Windows Vista SP1 Beta and Windows XP SP2.

Billy Gates, what are doin’ to my systems?

I concur, this sounds more like a patch to IE7 gone awry. But searching through the patches doesn’t seem to come up with a new one. Did any of y’all recently download any updates or patches to IE7 or to your windows system?

WordPress was updated two or three weeks ago to 2.2.3, but FDL looks like it’s still on 2.2.2 so that shouldn’t be the issue, plus it sounds like non WP sites are also problematic. So that tends to rule WP itself out.

Solution’s simple: ditch IE ;-)

skeptic @ 183

It’s there, OKK. Try using a different browser.

I have IE; how do I use a different browser? Do I have to delete IE? You’ll obviously have to use very simple words to explain this to me!

I went to google and typed in firefox and down loaded it. You have an option to save or run and I put run. After it downloads a screen will pop up and you can type in firedoglake on the search engine. It ran slow but I was able to read all the comments.

CTuttle @ 173

cleter, I certainly find that refreshing and a positive sign that We the People are awakening from our national coma…!!!

What? That the Ron Paul people had a table at the pumpkin festival? Well, I guess it’s better than a bunch of Guiliani goons busting people’s heads with their truncheons.

What I thought was most interesting was that the Ron Paul people had won over some conservative Christians who cannot abide Guliani. Keep your eye on Ron Paul. If the Southern Christians who don’t trust Guliani or Romney start taking refuge there, Paul could go somewhere.

skeptic @ 182

It’s there, OKK. Try using a different browser.

I have IE; how do I use a different browser? Do I have to delete IE? You’ll obviously have to use very simple words to explain this to me!

You may run several browsers at one time. Using explorer go here and download to your desk top or applications folder if using a MAC. It is very easy.. don’t wory about add ons until you use standard FF for a while.

skeptic, try it on a new screen and if you have problems come back and somebody should be able to help you.

skeptic @ 182

It’s there, OKK. Try using a different browser.

I have IE; how do I use a different browser? Do I have to delete IE? You’ll obviously have to use very simple words to explain this to me!

Not at all.

Go here: http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/

Download the windows version (it should detect what you are using and offer the correct version, whether windows, mac, or linux).

Install the exe by double clicking on it. Use the default answers to the questions (only a few) it will ask you. You can then run it like any other application. If you don’t like it you can uninstall it. If your computer has the memory chops you can run FF at teh same time as IE7 should you wish.

Enjoy!

skeptic @ 183

It’s there, OKK. Try using a different browser.

I have IE; how do I use a different browser? Do I have to delete IE? You’ll obviously have to use very simple words to explain this to me!

No ya don’t have to delete IE, go here…

http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/products/?flang=en-US

peanutbutter @ 184

Mad Dogs @ 157

I can no longer get IE 7 to access the Electronic Freedom Foundation’s website at http://www.eff.org.

Problem happens under both Windows Vista SP1 Beta and Windows XP SP2.

Billy Gates, what are doin’ to my systems?

I concur, this sounds more like a patch to IE7 gone awry. But searching through the patches doesn’t seem to come up with a new one. Did any of y’all recently download any updates or patches to IE7 or to your windows system?

WordPress was updated two or three weeks ago to 2.2.3, but FDL looks like it’s still on 2.2.2 so that shouldn’t be the issue, plus it sounds like non WP sites are also problematic. So that tends to rule WP itself out.

Solution’s simple: ditch IE ;-)

I dnld’d four new ones last night. I suppose I’ll just go to Firefox again.

Frank Gaffney on the Stephen Colbert show pushing for sanctions against Iran. Based on what?

http://www.comedycentral.com/s…..ndex.jhtml

Elliott @ 182

Blub @ 179

Bandar an’ fellow rats invest heavily in our markets don’t they? Assuming these reports are true, I’d bet that they were the ones involved in any shady deals. Who knows what info Saudi intel might’ve fed ‘em.

Who else?
Who else would be protected?
I know there are other possibilities — and I would love to hear the speculations — but this rings most of the bells imo.

The point is, it is simple enough to track who put options in the market. Who ordered the options? Why not tell us? For a president who always like to announce whenever they find the #2 guy, or miami terrorist cells, Bush steps right up. But he never did with the simple tracking of put options. We already know that he isn’t afraid of insider trading. And he got the PDB “Osama Determined to Attack”. Or maybe 15 people did it never thinking the others would think of it. They are quicker than a three card monty dealer to make a buck. Not so quick on sounding alarms.

Or, they just don’t want to show off that they found out who put the bets on the airlines.

I’m reading (compulsively) Arthur Schlesinger’s “Journals” right now, and recommend it for enlightenment about how our current authoritarianism has come about. A very valuable book, IMHO.

ccmask @ 193

Elliott @ 182

Who else?
Who else would be protected?
I know there are other possibilities — and I would love to hear the speculations — but this rings most of the bells imo.

The point is, it is simple enough to track who put options in the market. Who ordered the options? Why not tell us? For a president who always like to announce whenever they find the #2 guy, or miami terrorist cells, Bush steps right up. But he never did with the simple tracking of put options. We already know that he isn’t afraid of insider trading. And he got the PDB “Osama Determined to Attack”. Or maybe 15 people did it never thinking the others would think of it. They are quicker than a three card monty dealer to make a buck. Not so quick on sounding alarms.

Or, they just don’t want to show off that they found out who put the bets on the airlines.

I know!

This should not be a mystery!

from the “Where’s the outrage?!” file

You know, we should nominate Kucinich, and they should nominate Ron Paul, and then we could have a good honest debate and give the country two clear choices.

The thought of a Hillary v. Rudy Subway Series gives me the shakes.

FYI, new post

Loo Hoo. @ 165

Jane, do you have a picture of yourself in the red hat?

Blub, burns, and peanut butter. Want to plan a meet-up at the Harbor House in Dana Point some week-end? Oct. 27th is out for me, otherwise name a time. Any other Southern Californians?

I think someone else took one. I’ll try to get it.

peanutbutter @ 181

I’d be interested to learn more about the problems with DK’s stuff in this vein…?

well.. for example (and this is just one of many many examples).. this is right from his website: “As President, Dennis Kucinich will end America’s participation in NAFTA and the WTO.”

‘end’… not lobby for fairer trade overlays and better human rights protections, not even industrial policy. Just ‘end’… This is Smoot-Hawley leading up to the ’30s depression all over again. Autarchy doesn’t work… and certainly not after the horses have fled the barn and the barn’s been burned down.. bolting the door is less than useless.. it’s destructive. All that’ll happen is that we’ll all be poorer, while the plutocrats who run our corporations will take a page from Halliburton’s book and relocate their HQ to Dubai and accelerate their plans to send their operations to Bangalore.. unless Kucinich plans to use Blackwater to occupy their boardrooms and hold their CEO’s family members hostage or omsething equally ludicrous. Capital flows are global.. and there’s nothing Kucinich can do about it.

If he applies his controls (currency controls? capital constructs? investment limitations? restrictions on foreign ownership? outright nationalization? fascism?.. not sure I can even imagine how he plans to deliver on his “no outsourcing” pledge), then he’ll just accelerate the trends he’s trying to stop and we’ll give up valuable freedoms.. like freedom of movement, association and where we keep/deposit our money.

Meanwhile.. his immigration policy is just bizarre. http://www.dennis4president.co…..ican-jobs/
Limit H1-B visas to halt outsourcing.. huh? If we don’t bring the foreign workers to the US, then we just lose those jobs to India and China all the faster. You can’t restrict freedom of movement of labor that way, anymore than you can do so by doing it the rethug way.. buildin’ a wall in San Diego. It amounts to the same thing… Kucinich’s immigration policy is the same as Duncan Hunters.. just dressed up using different language.

The bottom line is.. you cannot constitutionally do what he wants to do without abusing the system as badly as shrub has.

I support many of things Edwards and Dodds, or even Hillary, has suggested.. or at least I support investigatin them as possibilities. We do have to revisit many of our trade agreements to insist on much greater concessions from the corporations in terms of the environment, workers rights, unionization and fair pay.. companies that want something from the US in terms of trade concessions should be asked to offer up money for schools, social programs, and US investment in return.. and government shouldn’t be shy to horse-trade as blatently as that. and we need a real solution to the immigration dilemma. But we can’t do so by giving up our rights and protections.. nor by destroying the source of most American and global wealthmaking.

Elliott: Follow the money. I can’t wait until the Kerik Saga begins. It won’t be the first time he made Rudy look bad. Imagine if Edward Smith, Captain of the Titanic had lived and ran for president against Rudy, on how good he got those people into the lifeboats.

My comment about Hillary – I will vote for her if she is our candidate. But when evaluating people, I try to listen to both my head and my gut. I read her biography, I wanted to like her, even though she did not support Lamont – but the more I read what she says and see her, the more my gut sends me messages. Her laugh is manufactured (to say nothing of grating). If it was a caluclated thing to put down her questioners – I am sorry – I prefer at least a laught to be genuine, even when you might be triangulating!

Regarding the news about Tutu mentioned below – I wrote about this a couple of days ago. I also saw there was a third thread on FDL about this, but got home too late to comment. The faculty is still not happy about the president’s reversal (no explicit apology to Tutu) and are still working on a fight against the removal of the professor from her position as chair of the Peace and Justice dept. There is an email group of a Progressive Caucus of faculty. I cannot report to you what is going on or what people are saying there – all i can tell you is that the issue is still alive. Thank you all for your caring and support.

Kathleen @ 124

Good News

Minnesota school reverses course,
reissues invitation to Tutu

http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iow…..vited.html

Umm…the thought of being on the same side as Schlesinger frightens me, can I just say? His reference to “lower breeds” of people in his ‘91 article E Pluribus Unum is…how you say…horrifying?

peanutbutter @ 184

Mad Dogs @ 157

I can no longer get IE 7 to access the Electronic Freedom Foundation’s website at http://www.eff.org.

Problem happens under both Windows Vista SP1 Beta and Windows XP SP2.

Billy Gates, what are doin’ to my systems?

I concur, this sounds more like a patch to IE7 gone awry. But searching through the patches doesn’t seem to come up with a new one. Did any of y’all recently download any updates or patches to IE7 or to your windows system?

WordPress was updated two or three weeks ago to 2.2.3, but FDL looks like it’s still on 2.2.2 so that shouldn’t be the issue, plus it sounds like non WP sites are also problematic. So that tends to rule WP itself out.

Solution’s simple: ditch IE ;-)

Another Microsoft Beta tester just advised me to “clear cache”, and voila, that worked. It seems that I may have had a corrupted Javascript loading and re-loading…etc.

I could’ve swore I had already done that, but what the hey.

I just deleted Temporary Internet Files, History and Form Data to make sure.

And now I can get to http://www.eff.org just fine.

ccmask @ 193

Or, they just don’t want to show off that they found out who put the bets on the airlines.

Which is exactly why I’m bettin’ its Bandar & Co.. shrub’s old friends. the same friends he used US government assets (our assets) to sneak out of the country in private jets in the aftermath of the attacks.

If the FBI was allowed to investigate, they would’ve long since tracked their way through whatever trail of shell companies, bankcrupty remote agents and trusts that separate the Saudis from their investment vehicles. The only way I can imagine that they can be stopped from doing so would be (i) if the fiduciary and holdco chain was tracked to Saudi Arabia and the government there refused to cooperate with us, and we agreed to let it go there or (ii) shrub invoked national security to prevent the FBI from investigating foreign entities… which also says Saudi to me. Either way, everything points to involvement from our corrupt allies.. I’m not saying that they knew we were going to be attacked.. but certainly their intelligence would likely have known more about the orders to attack us, that were, by all reports, given within their own borders, by members of their elite establishment, than we’ve been told. And we’ve known or suspected for years, that they level of Saudis drove the whole thing.

There’s just no other country that would have the requisite degree of opacity, secrecy and proven record of obstructionism which would allow them to conceal the money trail like this.

Loo Hoo. @ 165

Jane, do you have a picture of yourself in the red hat?

Blub, burns, and peanut butter. Want to plan a meet-up at the Harbor House in Dana Point some week-end? Oct. 27th is out for me, otherwise name a time. Any other Southern Californians?

Don’t forget about Lolo, OldCoastie, and several others that I vaguely remember are in OC or SD. I could do lunch this Saturday; I am relieved from the 1:00 offspring pick-up in Costa Mesa. Otherwise, Sundays are better than Saturdays for me.

Sat 20th works for me. I’ll likely be in the Bay Area the following week.

itwasntme @ 194

I’m reading (compulsively) Arthur Schlesinger’s “Journals” right now, and recommend it for enlightenment about how our current authoritarianism has come about. A very valuable book, IMHO.

Speaking of compulsive reading, I’ve knocked down two books this weekend: Goldsmith on Friday and Saturday, and the latest from Walter Mosley today. OMG, I think he killed off Easy Rawlins.

Oy ! John Dean’s back downstairs.

For folks with IE and Safari browsers, it looks like the Dean thread is fixed again.

Please refresh your browsers and look again.

SamFromUtah @ 6

In other news: Hillary says water “wet”

Wait, are the poll results in yet?

TeddySanFran @ 90

I think the right made a mistake going after Hillary for her laugh, unless they want her to be the nominee. I was drawn to her for her laughter (especially at Chris Wallace, knowing Bill’s recent history with him) but I became defensive on her behalf when Fox & Fiends unleashed their absurd criticism.

I won’t leave Edwards unless he’s defeated, but Hill’s had a great month. I am drawn to her after this silliness — does that make sense?

If they can manipulate your feelings to get around your intellectual disagreements, then there is no hope for Democracy. The manipulators will win every time — just like Madison Avenue advertising.

ccmask @ 173

I wonder why the Bush administration never came out and told America who the big bad terrorist client was who paid for the “put options” on airline stock right before 911?

*crickets*

*crickets* indeed!

Dick Morris should be the LAST person to complain about the sound of anybody else’s voice.

Had Gore chosen Gebhardt instead of the sanctimonious prick, he probably would have taken Missouri and the election. Gore’s selection of the prick was a cynical miscalculation.

Sanctimony is alive and well on FDL.

“I could probably enlarge on that a bit, but it wouldn’t be anything I haven’t said before.”

Say it again anyway.

“Gore’s selection of the prick was a cynical miscalculation.”

True dat.

And Al, along with Hillary, is a sentimental choice. They were both put upon by all the conservative bullshit, and now, a lot of people are wistfully, and not very intelligently, trying to somehow square that by giving them a pass on their many negatives. Especially, Hillary and her track record on Iraq.

It makes no sense. With us looking at a good chance to put the trolls back under the bridge for years to come, while we try to salvage something out of the train wreck they’ve made of our country, a lot of democrats want to nominate a candidate who can’t honestly pick up the Iraq stick and beat the GOP with it.

It’s an extension of the bushCo insanity.