zed?

Good morning Christy and congrats dakine01

Speaking for myself only of course. I take no account of how politicians dress, laugh, gender or ethnicity. What I do consider critical are politician’s records, who they ‘travel with’, where their money comes from to win elections, and most importantly their actions and principles.

I remember something about Oven Mitt’s makeup bill. Died without a trace, while the haircut lives on in infamy.

I thought the cackle was significant, whether it was a cackle, a snicker or a bellylaugh. Clinton used to avoid answering questions. What is funny about the implication that Bush might use the Kyl-Lieberman amendment as cover for attacking Iran? Nothing. But she found it amusing in the Dartmouth debate, rather than respond with a serious and (God forbid) candid answer about why she voted for that stinker.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 3

Speaking for myself only of course. I take no account of how politicians dress, laugh, gender or ethnicity. What I do consider critical are politician’s records, who they ‘travel with’, where their money comes from to win elections, and most importantly their actions and principles.

I cannot wait for John Dean to set the record straight as to those four very astute questions.

Always remember Christy, no matter what the topic may be, IOKIYAR.

So Hillary has to be hounded by talk about cackles and cleavage while the Houn’ Dawg gets to look lost without a script and so what? He’s an actor.

Edwards pays $400 for a haircut (to cover the stylist time out of the salon) and it’s a serious problem to show how out of touch he is. Willard spends hundreds and thousands on make-up? *crickets*

Etc etc etc.

What about Rudy’s lisp?
Ya never hear about that.

All of this crap about flag lapels is insulting. And whether Barak is more of a Paul McCartney rather than a Mick Jagger type of rockstar… ugh!!!

I try to get past appearances, but the ugly and slime that oozes off of the Republicans in Congress (and those running for President) are quite glaring. Rudy and his current wife. Mitt holding up the Obama/Osama sign. McCain singing “Bomb Bomb Iran”.

Plenty of ugly there to write about.

dakine — If we started digging on how much the teevee reporters — and now the print reporters who do teevee interviews — are spending on facials, haircare, anti-aging lifts, laser facials, hair removal services…and on and on and on? Please, anyone who does any television or on-camera work does this sort of stuff. They’d be idiots not to: Nixon, Presidential debate, sweaty bad make-up, nuff said.

Susan in Iowa @ 5

I thought the cackle was significant, whether it was a cackle, a snicker or a bellylaugh. Clinton used to avoid answering questions. What is funny about the implication that Bush might use the Kyl-Lieberman amendment as cover for attacking Iran? Nothing. But she found it amusing in the Dartmouth debate, rather than respond with a serious and (God forbid) candid answer about why she voted for that stinker.

bingo! we have a winner!

One media narrative from 2004 that still pisses me off is the bashing of John Kerry because he could speak French.

How increadibly stupid is that. The American people would prefer someone ignorant of the world, rather than someone who is conversant in another language… especially French.

Susan in Iowa — Talking about when the cackle occurred and whether it could have been used as a distraction from answering a question? Now that’s substantive. Talking about whether her laugh sounds like a cackle and whether the optics of having a cackle as a laugh are a turn-off to the voters and whether she’ll modify her laugh — and then doing laugh analysis at every appearance to see if that is happening, and going back over past appearances to guage when you have a snicker, a giggle, a smirk, a laugh, a belly laugh or a cackle…you get the picture.

That’s just fluff.

I saw her in the New Hampton event, and she didn’t use the laugh at all. She smiles a lot. But she only got one tough question, and ducked it after slamming the guy.

Democrats should stop wearing clothing that signals conformity and conservatism.

Stop dressing just like the frigging uptight Republicans.

Personally, I find Bush’s little smirk/giggle henh-henh-henh noise to be very annoying. Perhaps CNN could devote an hour to his irksome mirth mannerisms.

Christy @ 13, I agree with that. I find the media annoying, and their treatment of Al Gore absolutely outrageous, ditto Edwards. But I think that HRC has been campaigning in a bubble and avoiding questions. David Yepsen wrote about it in the Des Moines Register this week, and AdNags did a piece about her avoiding reporters on the trail.

CalGeorge @ 15

Democrats should stop wearing clothing that signals conformity and conservatism.

Stop dressing just like the frigging uptight Republicans.

The Republican candidates should start wearing orange jumpsuits, so we can recognize them as Republicans.

Christy Hardin Smith @ 10

dakine — If we started digging on how much the teevee reporters — and now the print reporters who do teevee interviews — are spending on facials, haircare, anti-aging lifts, laser facials, hair removal services…and on and on and on? Please, anyone who does any television or on-camera work does this sort of stuff. They’d be idiots not to: Nixon, Presidential debate, sweaty bad make-up, nuff said.

I know that Christy. I watched Nixon sweat away during the debates in ‘60, even though I was too young to recognize what I was seeing.

I was just going with the hypocrisy theme, i.e., Edwards gets beaten up for the haircut yet no one ever mentions that Willard (and most of the others except for Roody probably) spend as much or more all the time on grooming. Willard and Brownback and the others have haircuts that do not come cheap.

I am sooooooooooooooooo looking forward to the discussion with John Dean.

cleter @ 18

CalGeorge @ 15

Democrats should stop wearing clothing that signals conformity and conservatism.

Stop dressing just like the frigging uptight Republicans.

The Republican candidates should start wearing orange jumpsuits, so we can recognize them as Republicans.

Or straitjackets.

CalGeorge @ 21

cleter @ 18

The Republican candidates should start wearing orange jumpsuits, so we can recognize them as Republicans.

Or straitjackets.

Or dunce caps.

The thug candidates accuse their party opponents of changing their positions on social issues (or not changing them, as the case may be) but I sure do find it interesting they *never* seem to trot out that old tried and true phrase “flip flopper”. ;-(

oddball — Me, too. Do note the special time with Book Salon today: 11:30 am PT/2:30 pm ET.

CalGeorge @ 21

cleter @ 18

The Republican candidates should start wearing orange jumpsuits, so we can recognize them as Republicans.

Or straitjackets.

An SS uniform would be dignified and appropriate.

(yeah yeah Godwin’s law…But that Naomi Wolf can call a fascist a fascist.)

Susan in Iowa @ 17

Christy @ 13, I agree with that. I find the media annoying, and their treatment of Al Gore absolutely outrageous, ditto Edwards. But I think that HRC has been campaigning in a bubble and avoiding questions. David Yepsen wrote about it in the Des Moines Register this week, and AdNags did a piece about her avoiding reporters on the trail.

I missed the HRC event New Hampton event but did see Edwards in Fayette. I have followed John and caucused for him in 2004. OK Kiddo, I feel he is the real thing.( a genuine progressive)

I also think that there is a different dynamic with criticism of Clinton. I have been seeing it in blog writing/commenting of late. I think she gets people adamantly defending her who would not give a male candidate the same pass. It is as though people are so expectant that she will be attacked on the basis of gender, that any critique is seen as gender-based.

That’s right, John Dean is coming up. I’m experiencing “question block”. There’s too many to choose from. I dealing with ‘choice overload’. Seriously.

OKK at 28 — LOL — Now that is something I never expected to hear from you. :)

Susan in Iowa @ 27

I also think that there is a different dynamic with criticism of Clinton. I have been seeing it in blog writing/commenting of late. I think she gets people adamantly defending her who would not give a male candidate the same pass. It is as though people are so expectant that she will be attacked on the basis of gender, that any critique is seen as gender-based.

I haven’t seen that at all. The heavy debate here, as of late, has all been on policy or the lack of statement on policy.

cleter @ 18

CalGeorge @ 15

Democrats should stop wearing clothing that signals conformity and conservatism.

Stop dressing just like the frigging uptight Republicans.

The Republican candidates should start wearing orange jumpsuits, so we can recognize them as Republicans.

No need to waste all that material……..just look for the freaking lapel pin. Tho’ it sure was interesting how many of them were sporting *nothing* on their suits during the last debate.

cleter @ 16

Personally, I find Bush’s little smirk/giggle henh-henh-henh noise to be very annoying. Perhaps CNN could devote an hour to his irksome mirth mannerisms.

Personally, I find Bush’s habit of speaking in public while he appears to be semi-comatose on Percoset a little bothersome, too. They never talk about that, either.

I would like to ask Mr. Dean whether he would accept a full pardon from the next president should it be offered. But I don’t think I will.

Jim Clausen @ 26

Susan in Iowa @ 17
………

I missed the HRC event New Hampton event but did see Edwards in Fayette. I have followed John and caucused for him in 2004. OK Kiddo, I feel he is the real thing.( a genuine progressive)

You missed the opportunity to see The Imperial Campaign in action. Nothing that can be bought was left out. There were tubs of chilled water bottles on the way in. The staffers lunging with stickers and clipboards were like running the gauntlet. The room was about one-third roped off stage set with gigantic backdrops fronted by rows of attractive children, great lighting and sound. The peasants packed into the rest of it, standing room only.

But for all that, it was disappointing. She rambles, she offers up a lot of platitudes, with a few programs where she gets into details (mainly healthcare). My mind kept wandering. When she picked questioners, she mainly picked unthreatening-looking women who turned out to be teachers and child care workers.

random image break: eeek!

Susan in Iowa @ 5

I thought the cackle was significant, whether it was a cackle, a snicker or a bellylaugh. Clinton used to avoid answering questions. What is funny about the implication that Bush might use the Kyl-Lieberman amendment as cover for attacking Iran? Nothing. But she found it amusing in the Dartmouth debate, rather than respond with a serious and (God forbid) candid answer about why she voted for that stinker.

absolutely. Look, tryig to whitewash whatever she was doing with her calculated fake laughter that didn’t go over as well as her “handlers” had hoped is purely artificial. Just as artificial and manufactured as her laugh.
She was trying to avoid a question while “softening up” her image. She is plastic. Like the plastic insurance cards she will mandate we all have like homeowners insurance and car insurance.
Check out the profit increases in the insurance industry over the past 6 years, and then read her plan and remember she is probably still the single highest recipiant of insurance industry donations of all the members of congress.

Kevster @ 8

What about Rudy’s lisp?
Ya never hear about that.

The last bald president was Eisenhower, who was also the last pre-tv president. All subsequent presidents have had manly, virile, full heads of hair. Coincidence?

Waccamaw @ 31

cleter @ 18

The Republican candidates should start wearing orange jumpsuits, so we can recognize them as Republicans.

No need to waste all that material……..just look for the freaking lapel pin. Tho’ it sure was interesting how many of them were sporting *nothing* on their suits during the last debate.

but I want to see them all in orange jumpsuits!
I don’t see it as a waster of material, they can be reused, or remade into hunting vests.

read about Hillary’s health care plan, here…

http://willyloman.wordpress.co…..-unveiled/

she how many times she giggles when asked about her campaign contributions from the Health care industry.

tw3k @ 30

Susan in Iowa @ 27
I haven’t seen that at all. The heavy debate here, as of late, has all been on policy or the lack of statement on policy.

I should have excepted present company. This week I have seen that kind of discussion on HuffPo, Taylor Marsh, and some of the MSM blogs like First Read and The Trail.

PeteCO @ 37

Kevster @ 8

What about Rudy’s lisp?
Ya never hear about that.

The last bald president was Eisenhower, who was also the last pre-tv president. All subsequent presidents have had manly, virile, full heads of hair. Coincidence?

No. That’s why Romney is dangerous.

Susan in Iowa @34–

Thanks for the summary. Those of us in the later primary states never really get the feel of what it must be like to compare candidate presentations. While it’s useful to have You Tube clips of the speeches, nothing can really take the place of a person on the spot describing all the nuances of the event.

Susan in Iowa — How are things going in Iowa? Getting crazier — or is the pace about the same with the town halls and otherwise? I get the feeling from press accounts that things are more fevered this year, but I’m always suspicious that this is the press trying to manufacture their own sense of urgency to make the account seem more exciting than this actually being the feeling on the ground. The Iowa local press hasn’t felt that same urgent tone — at least not what I’ve been reading.

Would love to know how locals in Iowa, NH, and elsewhere are seeing things from their vantage point. We don’t get any of this in WV because our primary is so much later, and it’s tough to judge conditions on the ground based on the snapshot view you get from reporters who appear, at this point at least, to have staked out a particular narrative and meme.

Now Christy; you don’t really expect the media who are giving us all that important stuff about the democrats, to mention such trivia as the beauty mark on Rudy Giuliani’s forehead…

the one that’s the spitting image of about-to-be-indicted Bernard Kerik…do you? :o)

And then, everytime someone brings up that his campaign manager in South Carolina was indicted for cocaine possession, Rudy sighs a lot, too.

But that’s just because he’s happily married and in frequent touch with his thrifty wife, via his cellphone.

Lest Mr. Boehlert forget the scream…..Yearrrrrggghhhh! The fluff narrative du jour on Dr. Governor Dean was that the man was clearly unhinged.

The Heather’s are heathering but only on those kewl kid wanna be democrats…it’s all that they know how to do….just like Junyah High school. That pretty sums up the pathetic state of politics/presidential elections in this country… yes the dfh adults who actually give a damn are subjected/bombarded to discussion narrated by those still stuck mentally/emotionally in their Junior High School days.

Susan in Iowa @ 34

Jim Clausen @ 26

Susan in Iowa @ 17
………

I missed the HRC event New Hampton event but did see Edwards in Fayette. I have followed John and caucused for him in 2004. OK Kiddo, I feel he is the real thing.( a genuine progressive)

You missed the opportunity to see The Imperial Campaign in action. Nothing that can be bought was left out. There were tubs of chilled water bottles on the way in. The staffers lunging with stickers and clipboards were like running the gauntlet. The room was about one-third roped off stage set with gigantic backdrops fronted by rows of attractive children, great lighting and sound. The peasants packed into the rest of it, standing room only.

But for all that, it was disappointing. She rambles, she offers up a lot of platitudes, with a few programs where she gets into details (mainly healthcare). My mind kept wandering. When she picked questioners, she mainly picked unthreatening-looking women who turned out to be teachers and child care workers.

I find it interesting that Hillary is running exactly the kind of campaign that Bill was running against. Bill was the Washington outsider, the think outside-the-box governor, the underdog Come Back Kid. She, on the other hand, is, not. She’s like the centrist Mondale.
Her campaign seems a lot like what we would be getting from Vice President Lieberman about now, had things gone a little differently in 2000.

Susan in Iowa @ 34

Jim Clausen @ 26

Susan in Iowa @ 17
………

I missed the HRC event New Hampton event but did see Edwards in Fayette. I have followed John and caucused for him in 2004. OK Kiddo, I feel he is the real thing.( a genuine progressive)

You missed the opportunity to see The Imperial Campaign in action. Nothing that can be bought was left out. There were tubs of chilled water bottles on the way in. The staffers lunging with stickers and clipboards were like running the gauntlet. The room was about one-third roped off stage set with gigantic backdrops fronted by rows of attractive children, great lighting and sound. The peasants packed into the rest of it, standing room only.

But for all that, it was disappointing. She rambles, she offers up a lot of platitudes, with a few programs where she gets into details (mainly healthcare). My mind kept wandering. When she picked questioners, she mainly picked unthreatening-looking women who turned out to be teachers and child care workers.

That’s interesting. We attended a fundraiser for Obama here in Denver a few months ago, and it was very different. Smallish hall, people lined up outside on the day, The pre-speech entertainment was a marching band from a local school. Mixed crowd, roughly equal parts black/white/Hispanic. He was greeted as a rock star. Gave a good, albeit brief speech (the event was short notice) and left with the applause of the crowd ringing in his ears.

The only difference between her and old “Go to War while I Wait Here,” Joe L. is that he joined the Independants. she just sided up with the DLC.

Susan in Iowa @ 40

tw3k @ 30

Susan in Iowa @ 27
I haven’t seen that at all. The heavy debate here, as of late, has all been on policy or the lack of statement on policy.

I should have excepted present company. This week I have seen that kind of discussion on HuffPo, Taylor Marsh, and some of the MSM blogs like First Read and The Trail.

Well, in hindsight I did totally say something like “four years of “The Cackle” O H3ll No!”

It is a visceral reaction to her evasiveness. I guess a cackle could been seen as gender bias.

willyloman @ 39

read about Hillary’s health care plan, here…

http://willyloman.wordpress.co…..-unveiled/

she how many times she giggles when asked about her campaign contributions from the Health care industry.

Maybe more contributor info.

cleter @ 46

Susan in Iowa @ 34

When she picked questioners, she mainly picked unthreatening-looking women who turned out to be teachers and child care workers.

I find it interesting that Hillary is running exactly the kind of campaign that Bill was running against. Bill was the Washington outsider, the think outside-the-box governor, the underdog Come Back Kid. She, on the other hand, is, not. She’s like the centrist Mondale.
Her campaign seems a lot like what we would be getting from Vice President Lieberman about now, had things gone a little differently in 2000.

Apparently hand picked questioners? Sounds like someone else I can think of.

Elliott -

I would say something about my preferred fabric for thug hunting vests but…….use your imagination.

Cackle = Nice framing.

Eric’s article demonstrates beyond a shadow of a doubt how grossly negligent the media is.

Or is their BS intentional?

Like with the Bush Brown handling of Katrina the meme is incompetance. But when Bush said Heck of a job Brownie, he was uttering the truth. If you look at it the way Naomi Klein does, the handling of Katrini was exactly what the capitalist free marketers wanted. And they got them all. Brownie did good for the corporations. See it wasn’t incompetence.

The media behavior is ALSO not incompetence. These bobbleheads are doing what they are paid to do… promote the free market for profit agenda. Any populist who advocated for the people is trounced and made to look like a fool, and a loser. The echo machine is relentless. And even spinsters like MoDo who does the occasional comic fluff piece is picked right up and used as if she was one of their soldiers. She complained about Gore’s brown suits too. What a jerk!

They are now trashing the NET and the blogs because it has become a check on their MSM and state propaganda. Citizen journalists are doing the job these slackers aren’t and showing them how to ferret out the truth and fewer and fewer people are watching or reading the MSM. More and more are looking to the net and blogs for information, news and opinion and are finding BETTER quality online. Even if it is more partisan.. they / we are participating as we are not able to in the MSM. So they are scared and trying to control the Net too.

The WWW made be the most democratic institution the world has seen and the right is worried. It also may be our last and best hope as it is obvious that our congress is not listening to the people. They listen to their paymasters.

Money has corrupted America bigtime.

Cindy Sheehan was a WWW phenomenon who stepped out and acted in their face. She is not the target of the MSM as a mad deranged women. What she advocates is completely sensible, however.

We need to step out from NET and act. A general strike will send them a message. We MUST show our strength…not in hit counters, but feet marching.

I will find the John Dean chat interesting — will be busy but try to drop in on it as it goes.

The one I’m looking forward to is Naomi Klein with Shock Doctrine. I am slowly working my way through the book and it is such an eye opener…

Christy and PeteCo, I have been trying to make it to all candidate events. I have pretty much decided to support Biden, although if Gore gets in I will have a difficult choice. Oh, wait, in caucuses you can have more than one choice…

They do have a different “feel.” When I was working at a big company there was a lot of discussion about comapany culture. Lately I have been thinking that the concept applies to campaigns.

Hillary’s is as prepackaged, scripted and tightly controlled as she is. At the Steak Fry, her supporters were far and away the most aggressive and noisily obnoxious, with megaphones, whistles and screaming, and there were so many hundreds (thousands?) of signs lining the curbs in Indianola that it just said money, and lots of it. In New Hampton, she showed that the excessive aggressiveness comes from the top.

Obama’s support at the Steak Fry was a contrast, as is he. They were mellow but enthusiastic. He spoke in Charles City two days before the New Hampton event and I asked him a question about Iran along the same lines as Randall Rolph asked in New Hampton. He was polite, he answered in depth, and when I went up to him afterwards he engaged on it some more.

peanutbutter,

The deal with Naomi’s book, is that she lays out that there IS a conspiracy vast or not, but they control the agenda and have reworked the nation, and even the world in their corporatist agenda of greed and racism. She exposes how we are a shell democracy, but effectively a fascist regime.

Susan at 56 — Thanks so much for that. Fascinating stuff. Please drop that sort of thing into the comments whenever you like — love the first-person accounts and interactions. Same goes for everyone else in early primary states. We get far too little of the regular interaction information — and far too much of the whatever staged color commentary reviews the media wants to give us.

I’m far more interested in what our readers are seeing and thinking, frankly. :)

Christy Hardin Smith @ 58

Susan at 56 — Thanks so much for that. Fascinating stuff. Please drop that sort of thing into the comments whenever you like — love the first-person accounts and interactions. Same goes for everyone else in early primary states. We get far too little of the regular interaction information — and far too much of the whatever staged color commentary reviews the media wants to give us.

I’m far more interested in what our readers are seeing and thinking, frankly. :)

I agree. I never get to see this stuff. Even if candidates come out here, it’s such a big state that chances are I wouldn’t be able to attend :-P So hearing these details are very interesting…

PeteCo, another difference with the Obama event was the way he interacts with people. He had kids behind him, high school age, and they had questions for him. He treated them like people. Hillary treated “her” kids like props. He answered a lot of questions, and when the mike people couldn’t get to someone in the crowd, he reached over heads and handed over his own microphone. That ensured that if the questioner asked something awkward, he couldn’t shout them down the way Hillary did. He is impressive.

Christy Hardin Smith @ 58

Susan at 56 — Thanks so much for that. Fascinating stuff. Please drop that sort of thing into the comments whenever you like — love the first-person accounts and interactions. Same goes for everyone else in early primary states. We get far too little of the regular interaction information — and far too much of the whatever staged color commentary reviews the media wants to give us.

I’m far more interested in what our readers are seeing and thinking, frankly. :)

Be careful what you wish for 8~)

Watch the shiny object over here, while the Congress joins in celebrating The New Republicanism: preemptive pardons and ex post facto liability exemptions for corporations.
As we all already know, Bush the first believed the laws didnt apply to Goopers in Iran Contra, Ford got on board with the idea that they didnt apply to the Trick after Watergate and now they wont apply to scooter or the telecoms or, just wait, abu gonzalez.
I think you could make money taking the odds that there will be a blanket pardon issued by Bush for everyone who worked in the WH…or some other suck-on-this piece of crap to cover all the asses that are hanging out and broke the law–Rove, Rummy, Condi, the CIA master craftsmen of torture.

it’s the new doctrine of preemptive pardons and liability get-out-of-jail cards for corporations…sounds right to me.
Just too late for Enron.

Christy Hardin Smith @ 58

Susan at 56 — Thanks so much for that. Fascinating stuff. Please drop that sort of thing into the comments whenever you like — love the first-person accounts and interactions. Same goes for everyone else in early primary states. We get far too little of the regular interaction information — and far too much of the whatever staged color commentary reviews the media wants to give us.

I’m far more interested in what our readers are seeing and thinking, frankly. :)

And don’t forget the camcorder!

Good morning all.

Christy, that is not even fluff. It’s distraction from the issues in the guise of superficial teasing. It is part of the bullying culture promoted by Bush.

peterboy @ 62

Watch the shiny object over here, while the Congress joins in celebrating The New Republicanism: preemptive pardons and ex post facto liability exemptions for corporations.
As we all already know, Bush the first believed the laws didnt apply to Goopers in Iran Contra, Ford got on board with the idea that they didnt apply to the Trick after Watergate and now they wont apply to scooter or the telecoms or, just wait, abu gonzalez.
I think you could make money taking the odds that there will be a blanket pardon issued by Bush for everyone who worked in the WH…or some other suck-on-this piece of crap to cover all the asses that are hanging out and broke the law–Rove, Rummy, Condi, the CIA master craftsmen of torture.

it’s the new doctrine of preemptive pardons and liability get-out-of-jail cards for corporations…sounds right to me.
Just too late for Enron.

But if you lose money on an investment or fire staffers in the travel office …..

The direct contact with candidates is invaluable, which is why I do not support efforts to get big states like Michigan “first.” It doesn’t have to be Iowa, but it should be somewhere that they have to talk to the likes of me and have reporters film it or write it down. Candidates talk about what they want to talk about. We ask them about other stuff.

tw3k @ 63

Christy Hardin Smith @ 58

Susan at 56 — Thanks so much for that. Fascinating stuff. Please drop that sort of thing into the comments whenever you like — love the first-person accounts and interactions. Same goes for everyone else in early primary states. We get far too little of the regular interaction information — and far too much of the whatever staged color commentary reviews the media wants to give us.

I’m far more interested in what our readers are seeing and thinking, frankly. :)

And don’t forget the camcorder!

You know, I have been kicking myself at hourly intervals since last Sunday. I had one and left it on the kitchen counter in the rush to leave. It would really have been an answer to people who saw the edited film on ABC and insisted that she wasn’t out of line. If you were there, you saw it. My 23-yr old said “wow, she was mean!”

Susan in Iowa @ 66

The direct contact with candidates is invaluable, which is why I do not support efforts to get big states like Michigan “first.” It doesn’t have to be Iowa, but it should be somewhere that they have to talk to the likes of me and have reporters film it or write it down. Candidates talk about what they want to talk about. We ask them about other stuff.

While I see your point, it’s also a discouraging thing to be in one of the bigger states and never see the candidates. I don’t really know what a good solution is, given the size of this nation, tho…

Susan in Iowa @ 56

Christy and PeteCo, I have been trying to make it to all candidate events.

I’m hoping he gives her a good run so we get some more attention out here. MrsCO & I are currently on the list of volunteers for the convention next summer, but if it’s going to be the Coronation of Queen Hillary, I may find something else to do with my vacation time. It’s going to be interesting.

PeteCO at 69 — I’d go no matter what. Watching the interaction between candidates and their staffers and the media and voters and all the folks in between is really fascinating — and a huge education in the stage managing of all of this above and beyond what you might guess. I know it has really been an eye-opener for me seeing so much of it and trying to cut through it when I can since I started writing here at FDL.

Truly, it is something you have to see up close to believe a lot of the time. And not necessarily in a good way…

green heron @ 41

PeteCO @ 37

The last bald president was Eisenhower, who was also the last pre-tv president. All subsequent presidents have had manly, virile, full heads of hair. Coincidence?

No. That’s why Romney is dangerous.

How big a crime is it to put nair in a candidate’s shampoo bottle?

Don’t forget to support some of few remaining real media sources out there.

McClatchey—truth to power.

-GSD

Susan in Iowa:

What do you like about Biden? The partitionment seems to fit well with a neocon oil stealing arrangement. Biden’s friendliness with the consumer loan industry is not good. What do you find valuable in him?

I should probably add that the reason I decided to support Biden had everything to do with going to see him live twice. I wasn’t even considering him, but I came away with a sense of incredible authenticity–he doesn’t bother with packaging. He just says, here’s what I’m thinking, what I would do. He answers questions until you’re tired, and doesn’t duck them. I will never forget someone asking about Pakistan and he started sketching a map of the Afghan/Pak border with his hands against a big curtain, explaining wherre the Pashto are, and Musharraf’s problems. It was like going to school. He is incredibly bright and charismatic, and absolutely charming in person.

Due to my recovery from surgery, I have been watching an excessive amount of TeeVee than my normal{THANK God for the baseball finals}

I really do not think it is drug amnesia but I do not remember much reporting on the war in Iraq or Afghanistan. Just yesterday it was some bubblegum star whose concerts were bought up by ticket resalers.

My favorite question is….. “why is that considered news?
Miss Dog just does not have a answer either

Susan in Iowa @ 60

PeteCo, another difference with the Obama event was the way he interacts with people. He had kids behind him, high school age, and they had questions for him. He treated them like people. Hillary treated “her” kids like props. He answered a lot of questions, and when the mike people couldn’t get to someone in the crowd, he reached over heads and handed over his own microphone. That ensured that if the questioner asked something awkward, he couldn’t shout them down the way Hillary did. He is impressive.

He’s getting our support right now. Having said that, I think that if the coronation of Hillary proceeds as planned, Edwards will be her running mate. A woman/black man ticket? I don’t think so.

Susan in Iowa @ 60

PeteCo, another difference with the Obama event was the way he interacts with people. He had kids behind him, high school age, and they had questions for him. He treated them like people. Hillary treated “her” kids like props. He answered a lot of questions, and when the mike people couldn’t get to someone in the crowd, he reached over heads and handed over his own microphone. That ensured that if the questioner asked something awkward, he couldn’t shout them down the way Hillary did. He is impressive.

Susan, I saw Sen. Obama at UNH early this year. He is indeed a very dynamic and endearing public speaker. I also noticed he had a very big campaign office in Portsmouth NH and the lights were on at 1:00 a.m. this Saturday.

-GSD

katymine @ 75

Due to my recovery from surgery, I have been watching an excessive amount of TeeVee than my normal{THANK God for the baseball finals}

I really do not think it is drug amnesia but I do not remember much reporting on the war in Iraq or Afghanistan. Just yesterday it was some bubblegum star whose concerts were bought up by ticket resalers.

My favorite question is….. “why is that considered news?
Miss Dog just does not have a answer either

The war has been virtually disappered since the Bold and Glorious Petreaus Report was issued.

-GSD

Christy Hardin Smith @ 70

PeteCO at 69 — I’d go no matter what. Watching the interaction between candidates and their staffers and the media and voters and all the folks in between is really fascinating — and a huge education in the stage managing of all of this above and beyond what you might guess. I know it has really been an eye-opener for me seeing so much of it and trying to cut through it when I can since I started writing here at FDL.

Truly, it is something you have to see up close to believe a lot of the time. And not necessarily in a good way…

Yeah, I know. Actually I wouldn’t miss it, it really is a once in a lifetime thing. What are FDL’s plans for the convention? Are the powers that be assigning media facilities for bloggers?

Heard several callers into Air America stating that HRC events are very controlled. Do not allow in unapproved signs, t-shirts and any of the war protesters are “known” by her staff.

I want to know if anyone is experiencing this as they describe this “worse than Bush” event screening.

OT – interesting article in today’s Boston Globe regarding the “dumbing down” of TV news and how the MSM powers that be have underestimated their audience:

http://www.boston.com/news/glo…..ews_flash/

Susan in Iowa @ 34

Jim Clausen @ 26

Susan in Iowa @ 17
………

I missed the HRC event New Hampton event but did see Edwards in Fayette. I have followed John and caucused for him in 2004. OK Kiddo, I feel he is the real thing.( a genuine progressive)

You missed the opportunity to see The Imperial Campaign in action. Nothing that can be bought was left out. There were tubs of chilled water bottles on the way in. The staffers lunging with stickers and clipboards were like running the gauntlet. The room was about one-third roped off stage set with gigantic backdrops fronted by rows of attractive children, great lighting and sound. The peasants packed into the rest of it, standing room only.

But for all that, it was disappointing. She rambles, she offers up a lot of platitudes, with a few programs where she gets into details (mainly healthcare). My mind kept wandering. When she picked questioners, she mainly picked unthreatening-looking women who turned out to be teachers and child care workers.

unthreatening-looking women. . .teachers. . . child care workers. . .
what is that? I see too much picking apart of HRC here. So you don’t support her. Okay. Let’s hear why you support another candidate.

GSD @ 78

katymine @ 75

Due to my recovery from surgery, I have been watching an excessive amount of TeeVee than my normal{THANK God for the baseball finals}

I really do not think it is drug amnesia but I do not remember much reporting on the war in Iraq or Afghanistan. Just yesterday it was some bubblegum star whose concerts were bought up by ticket resalers.

My favorite question is….. “why is that considered news?
Miss Dog just does not have a answer either

The war has been virtually disappered since the Bold and Glorious Petreaus Report was issued.

-GSD

Long before that. Both the war and the occupation. I get my news on Afghanistan from BBC.

Laughter as inappropriate…
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..66505.html

Susan in Iowa @ 67

tw3k @ 63

And don’t forget the camcorder!

You know, I have been kicking myself at hourly intervals since last Sunday. I had one and left it on the kitchen counter in the rush to leave. It would really have been an answer to people who saw the edited film on ABC and insisted that she wasn’t out of line. If you were there, you saw it. My 23-yr old said “wow, she was mean!”

Your descriptions are vivid and informative and pictures, especially video, are worth a thousand words. I don’t doubt that having a cam could taint a candidates response. At the same time a candid view of the event would be much more informative than the standard fair on the MSM.

TexBetsy @ 83

GSD @ 78

The war has been virtually disappered since the Bold and Glorious Petreaus Report was issued.

-GSD

Long before that. Both the war and the occupation. I get my news on Afghanistan from BBC.

Here is a website with links to international sources with news on Afghanistan
http://www.e-ariana.com/

PeteCO at 79 — You know, I don’t have any idea other than the fact that there were facilities set aside at the last convention for bloggers. I’m certain someone is looking at that — but I really have no idea what stage the planning is at on that sort of thing as I sit here this morning. Jane is likely more keyed into that than I am, so you might ask her later today…but I haven’t heard anything settled from anyone who is running things at this point, to be honest.

peanutbutter @ 68

Susan in Iowa @ 66

The direct contact with candidates is invaluable, which is why I do not support efforts to get big states like Michigan “first.” It doesn’t have to be Iowa, but it should be somewhere that they have to talk to the likes of me and have reporters film it or write it down. Candidates talk about what they want to talk about. We ask them about other stuff.

While I see your point, it’s also a discouraging thing to be in one of the bigger states and never see the candidates. I don’t really know what a good solution is, given the size of this nation, tho…

peanutbutter,
I agree with Susan, even though I currently reside in Texas and have lived in Michigan, Florida, NY, and MA at various points.

The big states are just TOO big to be able to support the type of “retail” politics that Iowa and New Hampshire (and other small states) can support. I know the folks (especially those who are politically active) in IA and NH take very seriously the “responsibilities” to dig deeply into the candidates positions.

Unfortunately, no small state is probably “representative” of the nation as a whole. And no large state is able to support the need for there to be at least some folks to have the face-to-face get together with the various candidates and force them to meet with and answer questions from “real” people.

Christy Hardin Smith @ 70

PeteCO at 69 — I’d go no matter what. Watching the interaction between candidates and their staffers and the media and voters and all the folks in between is really fascinating — and a huge education in the stage managing of all of this above and beyond what you might guess. I know it has really been an eye-opener for me seeing so much of it and trying to cut through it when I can since I started writing here at FDL.

Truly, it is something you have to see up close to believe a lot of the time. And not necessarily in a good way…

Randall Robinson said that Bill Clinton is/was a genius at the personality game, but Clinton believes in nothing - the latter part is inflammatory rhetoric based in part on Robinson’s blaming of Clinton for wrecking the Banana Industry in the Carribean.

If you can watch CSPAN BookTV at 4pm with Robinson, its very interesting.

Christy Hardin Smith @ 87

PeteCO at 79 — You know, I don’t have any idea other than the fact that there were facilities set aside at the last convention for bloggers. I’m certain someone is looking at that — but I really have no idea what stage the planning is at on that sort of thing as I sit here this morning. Jane is likely more keyed into that than I am, so you might ask her later today…but I haven’t heard anything settled from anyone who is running things at this point, to be honest.

If you guys need anything, I’m guessing you can see my email address. We’re happy to help.

Katymine,

How your recovery is proceeding well. Get better and stronger!

TeeVee is a drug to distract and at the appropriate time to propagandize the public.

Why cling to the notion that news is something like reporting of importance events locally, nationally and internationally. TeeVee is entertainment and the shows are there to sell soap or cars… even the austere even newscasts.

There are a few notable exceptions on TeeVee. PBS’s Frontline, Bill Moyers Journal, Now and some arts broadcasts. The rest is drivel with the exception of some of the travel shows which allow us to see places we’ll never get to see with our own eyes.

When you watch the Sunday AM talk shows it only raises your blood pressure if you still have a working brain. The bobblehead pundits are in such awe of themselves and being close to “power” that they fall all over themselves to curry favor with the ruling elite which gave them the perch for about $1m a year typically. It’s a good gig and they’re NOT going to bite the hands that feed them. Are they?

hackworth @ 73

Susan in Iowa:

What do you like about Biden? The partitionment seems to fit well with a neocon oil stealing arrangement. Biden’s friendliness with the consumer loan industry is not good. What do you find valuable in him?

Check Opensecrets.org and compare contributions to candidates from various industries. I’m not sure that’s completely fair. Others, including Chris Dodd, whom I like very much, get more money from banking sources.

He keeps saying that he is not proposing partition. I think the plan is at planforiraq.com, but what he says about it is that the Iraqi constitution, whatever you may think of it, does already provide for a weak central government with a federation of states. He argues that if you give people control over their daily lives (policing, domestic relations, etc) in their own areas, they will have less incentive to continue the civil war. In fact, they are already voting with their feet because of their terrible circumstances. Even people who are left in mixed areas will have a reason to put down their guns if their leaders are satisfied with the result.

He really believes that all the choices are bad at this point, and that this may be the least worst. He seems to care deeply and genuinely about Iraqis AND our soldiers, and I think his motivation is partly a moral one.

To get a sense of who he is on the stump, I would recommend three bits of video. IOne, his speech to the Steak Fry crowd. Two a speech to the Firefighters, I think last March. Three, a CSPAN event on the Friday before Labor Day in Cedar Rapids Iowa, where he was exactly like what I saw the next morning in Charles City. If anyone wants them, I can go get links.

Dru @ 86

TexBetsy @ 83

Long before that. Both the war and the occupation. I get my news on Afghanistan from BBC.

Here is a website with links to international sources with news on Afghanistan
http://www.e-ariana.com/

Thanks. Wish they had an RSS feed so I could easily add them to my sources.

I will be happy to report on the Iowa flavor. I’ve been a government teacher for 30 years and talk to a wide variety of Iowans who by the way are very well informed and not subject to fluff.
Although we Iowans take alot of heat for our first in nation caucuses most Iowans take this responsibility very seriously.

After Iowa and NH the campaigns are much more packaged and less about one on one politicking.

p.s.Susan in Iowa is giving us her flavor and does not need to be attacked for her position.

Susan in Iowa @ 56

At the Steak Fry, her supporters were far and away the most aggressive and noisily obnoxious, with megaphones, whistles and screaming, and there were so many hundreds (thousands?) of signs lining the curbs in Indianola that it just said money, and lots of it.

Was finishing my breakfast and reflecting on this comment. Seemed to me I’d heard something like this before. Then it came back to me. Does anyone else recall these same type of descriptions about the Lieber Kids when Lamont was running against Lieberman? Loud, obnoxious, shouting down others, tons of Lieberman signs being placed even where it was illegal to do so? Sounds like Lieberman redux to me.

Jim Clausen @ 94

p.s.Susan in Iowa is giving us her flavor and does not need to be attacked for her position.

Correct. Thank you.

I remember and I saw them with my own brown eyes!

I agree CHS when the media decides to focus on Hillary’s or anyone else’s laugh instead of substance we know we are just getting more of the distraction that our nation has become used to.

Although I must admit that when Senator Clinton laughed after Gravel challenged her on her yea vote on the Kyl/Liebermann amendment and she laughed with disdain and disregard blowing off the seriousness of the challenge, I lost any thread of confidence that I had left in her.

That laugh demonstrated arrogance and disrespect for the people who interpret her yes vote on that amendment as a very serious mistake.

But for all that, it was disappointing. She rambles, she offers up a lot of platitudes, with a few programs where she gets into details (mainly healthcare). My mind kept wandering. When she picked questioners, she mainly picked unthreatening-looking women who turned out to be teachers and child care workers.

I knew there was something that bothered me about the tone of your comments. You’ve got your mind made up about everyone, don’t you. Everybody’s already in a box. Bet you had your mind made up about what Hillary had to say before she said it too.

Kathleen @98

“That laugh demonstrated arrogance and disrespect for the people who interpret her yes vote on that amendment as a very serious mistake. “

Given the context I agree

selise @ 11

Susan in Iowa @ 5

I thought the cackle was significant, whether it was a cackle, a snicker or a bellylaugh. Clinton used to avoid answering questions. What is funny about the implication that Bush might use the Kyl-Lieberman amendment as cover for attacking Iran? Nothing. But she found it amusing in the Dartmouth debate, rather than respond with a serious and (God forbid) candid answer about why she voted for that stinker.

bingo! we have a winner!

Completely agree! Her response was disgusting. It was very similar to 43’s old smirk and swagger….DISRESPECTFUL AND ARROGANT

Since there seems to be interest, maybe I can do two more candidates. and Jim can add more flavors.

Richardson: I saw him in July, and I suspect he has polished up a bit since then. He had a standard stump speech that is organized around six or seven things that he would do. He has an impressive grasp of policy details, especially on energy.

He attracted a pretty big crowd, standing room only, and talked for a long time before he went to questions. He uses a lot of body language, pacing and rolling from side to side. He seemed exhausted by the time he made it to our evening event, but animated talking about policy. He is self-deprecating and unpretentious, and can be funny.

Since he was talking about the closed Maytag plant in Newton, I asked him a question about how his employer-based health care plan would help those workers. He didn’t really answer it, and asked me if I wanted a single payer plan. I said, not necessarily, but I’m worried about competitiveness and how these costs are sending plants across the Canadian border. He didn’t have an answer for what you do about that, or about jobless people with no access to health care.

Re “soft” partition a la Biden or apparently Dodd. This is based on a tacit acceptance that ethnic cleansing has already occurred and that there is effectively no central government. The problems with this idea are that A) it ignores Iraqi sovereignty, B) there are still several areas where ethnic cleansing could happen with explosive consequences (not just around Baghdad but in Kirkuk, for example), and C) a more likely scenario is not partition, soft or otherwise, but fragmentation. This can already be seen in the Shia on Shia violence in the South and the Sunni on Sunni violence in Anbar. There is also potential for Kurd on Kurd violence in the North. For a few years now there has been a truce between the two main Kurdish parties but they have a history of a decades long civil war between them.

Kathleen @ 98

I agree CHS when the media decides to focus on Hillary’s or anyone else’s laugh instead of substance we know we are just getting more of the distraction that our nation has become used to.

Although I must admit that when Senator Clinton laughed after Gravel challenged her on her yea vote on the Kyl/Liebermann amendment and she laughed with disdain and disregard blowing off the seriousness of the challenge, I lost any thread of confidence that I had left in her.

That laugh demonstrated arrogance and disrespect for the people who interpret her yes vote on that amendment as a very serious mistake.

I think that if the media had reported that she laughed rather than answer the question, this would not be this morning’s topic. The issue is appropriateness of response rather than pitch or volume.

One thing I’ve been meaning to mention regarding Dodd which can and should be taken with a grain of salt, considering the source (and this may have been mentioned before):

Back when they pulled AirAmerica off of the radio dial in my area I would resort on occasion to tuning in to Imus since he did manage to book most of the high-profile political figures. Imus also regularly referred to Rumsfeld and Cheney as “war criminals” so I gave him a little extra rope before the inevitable tune-out in disgust.

Dodd was a frequent guest and they openly mocked him for being a heavy drinker. Typical nitwit radio, but I wonder if this has come up anywhere else?

Seems that it would be the first thing to come up in the back channels and the whisper campaigns. Of course, those probably don’t get unleashed unless the target is a perceived threat.

Marilyn In Texas @ 82

Susan in Iowa @ 34

unthreatening-looking women. . .teachers. . . child care workers. . .
what is that? I see too much picking apart of HRC here. So you don’t support her. Okay. Let’s hear why you support another candidate.

I see too much picking apart of HRC here.

Too much? That’s an interesting way of putting it. Almost….Republican, dare I say it.

OK, I’ll bite. I support Obama because he’s less a part of the machine. His life up to this point has demonstrated his empathy with and tolerance of others. He’s about the same age as me (a few years older) which means he doesn’t carry a lot of baggage (Vietnam) that some candidates do. It’s time for a president who isn’t a rich white bloke, quite honestly.

I like Obama better than H Clinton but I am still leaning towards Edwards or Kucinich.

I think the “fluff” thing is indicative of another problem that the modern political press (and process) fails to acknowledge: Being a good (or likeable) person is not the same thing as being well-qualified for office.

Years ago I though about starting the process of running for office, and talked with a friend who had run successful political campaigns for statewide and national office. She strongly discouraged me from pursuing elected office, largely because I don’t suffer fools easily, and as she said, “that would be death on the campaign trail.” We had seen “The War Room” together, and she asked me if I could compartmentalize my behavior in the way the Clintons did. Honestly, I could not — and still can’t.

Running for office should be about the positions and policy a candidate will take if they are elected. It should not be about who’s most popular with the cool kids.

It will take serious campaign reform, including a Constitutional amendment differentiation political speech from free speech, to get back to that place.

Loo Hoo. @ 99

But for all that, it was disappointing. She rambles, she offers up a lot of platitudes, with a few programs where she gets into details (mainly healthcare). My mind kept wandering. When she picked questioners, she mainly picked unthreatening-looking women who turned out to be teachers and child care workers.

I knew there was something that bothered me about the tone of your comments. You’ve got your mind made up about everyone, don’t you. Everybody’s already in a box. Bet you had your mind made up about what Hillary had to say before she said it too.

The Hillary “stuff” isn’t just MSM stupidity, it’s a coordinated campaign by the GRWC. Unflattering pictures and misogynist comments, ” the cackle”, “shrill fishwife” on and on. It’s nothing new, I’ve watched the same shit for 25 years.

Loo Hoo, This has been my experience that I referred to at the top of this thread. Anyone who criticizes Hillary can expect a personal attack on themselves. I am getting used to it.

I would have loved to support her. I even read her memoir. But I have concerns about character, policy and winning. So I started looking at other candidates. I went to see her because my local county chairman, who I have great respect for, keeps saying she is different in person. He is a great supporter of her campaign, and was interested in my impressions of the event.

He knows that we are all Democrats.

PeteCO @ 106

Marilyn In Texas @ 82

unthreatening-looking women. . .teachers. . . child care workers. . .
what is that? I see too much picking apart of HRC here. So you don’t support her. Okay. Let’s hear why you support another candidate.

I see too much picking apart of HRC here.

Too much? That’s an interesting way of putting it. Almost….Republican, dare I say it.

OK, I’ll bite. I support Obama because he’s less a part of the machine. His life up to this point has demonstrated his empathy with and tolerance of others. He’s about the same age as me (a few years older) which means he doesn’t carry a lot of baggage (Vietnam) that some candidates do. It’s time for a president who isn’t a rich white bloke, quite honestly.

Obama had a great speech at Luther College in Decorah(My Liberal Arts alma mater). He does well with the pre-vietnam message of hope. Iowans are an old crowd, I tend to hear criticism of Obama as too young and naive. Also hear him compared to JFK. FWIW

Fresh thread, up and running for anyone who wants one…

Susan

Au Contraire

It’s anyone who says anything in SUPPORT of Hillary who’s likely to get it with both barrels.

Susan in Iowa @ 110

Loo Hoo, This has been my experience that I referred to at the top of this thread. Anyone who criticizes Hillary can expect a personal attack on themselves. I am getting used to it.

I would have loved to support her. I even read her memoir. But I have concerns about character, policy and winning. So I started looking at other candidates. I went to see her because my local county chairman, who I have great respect for, keeps saying she is different in person. He is a great supporter of her campaign, and was interested in my impressions of the event.

He knows that we are all Democrats.

Hillary Concern Trolls? Squadrons of electronic Brownshirts Hillary supporters? Planted questioners?

Curiouser & curiouser.

rw at 113 — Actually, it’s both. People invest so much personally in presidential candidates for reasons that I do not understand, frankly. But maybe that’s because there isn’t one candidate who has completely grabbed me this time around as yet… *g*

Marilyn In Texas @ 82

I see too much picking apart of HRC here. So you don’t support her. Okay. Let’s hear why you support another candidate.

“picking apart” HRC does not necessarily imply support of another candidate.

i’m still trying to figure out who to support (not very enthusiatic about any of my choices). part of that process is trying to evaluate the candidate’s rhetoric, history and policy proposals… and that will naturally entail lots of “picking apart”.

In EPU territory, but a note about Edwards. He gives great event. He probably knows all the good places, but in Charles City it was the tractor museum. Backdrop of antique machinery, big room, lots of seating, lots of media. His little children escaped their nanny and started hanging on to him, and he handled it with equanimity, handing them off to Elizabeth after reassuring them. He is sort of like Oprah With Issue Positions, hugging people, and really trying to connect. An exchange with an HIV positive mother and son was incredibly touching. He and Elizabth tag team with it.

On the other hand, he talked a long time and took few questions. It was more like late in the campaign than an August event.

PeteCO at 114 — I think Brownshirts is too far — it’s very well orchestrated campaigning, planning down to the last little detail. As a fellow Type A personality, I can respect that level of organization, frankly. But it doesn’t leave room for reallyhuman interaction that most people prefer — which can, at times, be a problem with voters.

It’s interesting to watch the different candidate personalities and their personal interactions (or lack thereof) across both sides of the political aisle. We don’t do ourselves any favors though by exaggerating malice or intent where it isn’t. The folks who were working for Lieberman were actually, in large measure, Young Republican groups roped into service after he lost the primary. The folks working for Hillary, as far as I know, are supporters — well-organized by paid campaign people, yes, but still supporters that I have been able to ascertain.

It’s not the same as the false plants that Lieberman had sent to his aide by Rove and company to prop him up after he lost the primary. That was a completely artificial and volatile situation of his own making.

I was thinking last night about something that I guess is on topic re: fluff. Week after week we’ve been hearing about Britney and more Britney. Obama’s lapel pin (or lack thereof). Haircuts & cleavage. Anybody in the media remember the miners in Utah? I was wondering. Did they ever recover the bodies? What about the mean pr*ick who owned the place? Has he just gone on his merry way? No follow up, guys? It’s like that story either has to be one for potential for “breaking news” or it’s no story at all to them.

And speaking of “breaking news” I was watching FOX when those Koreans were being held hostage by the Taliban and “breaking news” of a rescue mission came flashing on the screen. Anybody know if FOX ever explained that bullshit? It’s ALL fluff, except when it can be interrupted by “breaking news.” And when they spend an inordinate amount of time “on the scene,” reporting the same thing over and over and over again – usually “things haven’t changed here” it’s back to your regularly scheduled fluff, ya know. I mean that witch Nancy Grace has a show that’s billed as a discussion of “legal issues”. There are so many monumental legal issues out there but if it’s not a tragedy, it’s not a “legal issue” worth her time. Greta has become a Nancy wannabe.

Court TV covers astronaut love triangles. So we’re left with Dan Abrams to provide us with insight. Help me, Lord
AAAAAGGGGGGGGGHHHHHH!@!!!!!!!!!

You got me all wound up with this, CHS.

Sorry, beerfart. For me this week, it was yet another round of Anna Nicole Smith news. Please, just let her rest in peace and move on to actual news…we have enough shit that needs to be tackled without wallowing in the poor woman’s former life yet again, and yet…here we are.

Christy Hardin Smith @ 118

PeteCO at 114 — I think Brownshirts is too far — it’s very well orchestrated campaigning, planning down to the last little detail. As a fellow Type A personality, I can respect that level of organization, frankly. But it doesn’t leave room for reallyhuman interaction that most people prefer — which can, at times, be a problem with voters.

It’s interesting to watch the different candidate personalities and their personal interactions (or lack thereof) across both sides of the political aisle. We don’t do ourselves any favors though by exaggerating malice or intent where it isn’t. The folks who were working for Lieberman were actually, in large measure, Young Republican groups roped into service after he lost the primary. The folks working for Hillary, as far as I know, are supporters — well-organized by paid campaign people, yes, but still supporters that I have been able to ascertain.

It’s not the same as the false plants that Lieberman had sent to his aide by Rove and company to prop him up after he lost the primary. That was a completely artificial and volatile situation of his own making.

I think this is right on the money. I have no reason to think that the HRC supporters are anything but that. But there are a lot of paid staff around, and they do a lot of herding and directing, from what I’ve seen. Also, if you pass out hundreds of plastic megaphones, guess what happens.

Christy Hardin Smith @ 120

Sorry, beerfart. For me this week, it was yet another round of Anna Nicole Smith news. Please, just let her rest in peace and move on to actual news…we have enough shit that needs to be tackled without wallowing in the poor woman’s former life yet again, and yet…here we are.

Don’t worry about it. You raise a good topic. A frustrating one. And I’ve calmed down. Too much caffeine, I guess. But I suppose this is where people like you, Jane, TRex and the rest come in. I mean, it wasn’t THAT long ago that a blogger would never get onto TV. Happens more and more now, of course. Probably alot of people like fluff but I’m wondering if it’s just not an indication that TV and weekly magazines just can’t compete as a source for news.

But yeah, I was channel surfing trying to decide which football game to watch yesterday and I thought I passed a show on Anna Nicole and I couldn’t believe it. Isn’t that stale even for fluff? Guess not.

Jay @ 105

One thing I’ve been meaning to mention regarding Dodd which can and should be taken with a grain of salt, considering the source (and this may have been mentioned before):

Back when they pulled AirAmerica off of the radio dial in my area I would resort on occasion to tuning in to Imus since he did manage to book most of the high-profile political figures. Imus also regularly referred to Rumsfeld and Cheney as “war criminals” so I gave him a little extra rope before the inevitable tune-out in disgust.

Dodd was a frequent guest and they openly mocked him for being a heavy drinker. Typical nitwit radio, but I wonder if this has come up anywhere else?

Seems that it would be the first thing to come up in the back channels and the whisper campaigns. Of course, those probably don’t get unleashed unless the target is a perceived threat.

Imus, of course, is a recovering alcoholic. I doubt Imus would have mocked him for it if Dodd really had a serious problem.

Steve-AR @ 109

The Hillary “stuff” isn’t just MSM stupidity, it’s a coordinated campaign by the GRWC. Unflattering pictures and misogynist comments, ” the cackle”, “shrill fishwife” on and on. It’s nothing new, I’ve watched the same shit for 25 years.

Cackle = Wicked Witch of the West…which is precisely how many of the most delirious of the Republicans view Hillary. If they had simply said that she “laughed it off” it would be a bit different. But the “framing” was interesting. I really wished she hadn’t accused the questioner of being some sort of “plant”…but given the campaign I’m sure all the candidates get some of these.

She actually did respond to the question after the put-down, even though it wasn’t something that is satisfactory to progressives. Let’s face it…nothing she says will be satisfactory to progressives on these issues. We all know her rationales for voting for the Iraq War Resolution and the Kyl-Leibermann Resolution. We disagree with them, because we feel that they provide(d) Bush with leverage to invade Iran (and Iraq before that).

But I have to say that if Edwards or Biden or Barack had put down a Pro-Lifer or Creationist or Malkinista in the same manner we might act actually be applauding.

Realize that we disagree with her position on this, and that is the main reason her response was unacceptable to us. And even if she apologized for those votes (she already has for the Iraq Resolution…though progressives found that apology unacceptable)…and undertook efforts to retract them I doubt that it would change many minds.

It’s been discussed here and everywhere how the Republicans resort to fear to try to win. Watch FOX sometimes. The line now is that it looks like Hillary is going to be the next president. They’re trying to scare their viewers into getting behind the GOP nominee even if its a cross-dresser or a Mormon – something they haven’t shown an inclination to do in numbers large enough to be of comfort to the GOP and it’s media outlet, Fox.

Susan in Iowa @ 121

Christy Hardin Smith @ 118

PeteCO at 114 — I think Brownshirts is too far — it’s very well orchestrated campaigning, planning down to the last little detail. As a fellow Type A personality, I can respect that level of organization, frankly. But it doesn’t leave room for reallyhuman interaction that most people prefer — which can, at times, be a problem with voters.

It’s interesting to watch the different candidate personalities and their personal interactions (or lack thereof) across both sides of the political aisle. We don’t do ourselves any favors though by exaggerating malice or intent where it isn’t. The folks who were working for Lieberman were actually, in large measure, Young Republican groups roped into service after he lost the primary. The folks working for Hillary, as far as I know, are supporters — well-organized by paid campaign people, yes, but still supporters that I have been able to ascertain.

It’s not the same as the false plants that Lieberman had sent to his aide by Rove and company to prop him up after he lost the primary. That was a completely artificial and volatile situation of his own making.

I think this is right on the money. I have no reason to think that the HRC supporters are anything but that. But there are a lot of paid staff around, and they do a lot of herding and directing, from what I’ve seen. Also, if you pass out hundreds of plastic megaphones, guess what happens.

One thing I can’t get is why such adulation of Obama is authentic “rock-star enthusiasm” while when it’s HRC supporters it’s supposedly loud, obnoxious and staged? Sounds like it’s simply expressed appreciation by each candiadtes supporters…and perceived differently.

It’s TABLOID JOURNALISM!” Let’s acknowledge it! No longer “Main Stream Media (MSM) — its all TABLOIDS!!

Sadly, the U.S. media has now devolved to the level of The National Enquirer.

They even pick up stories from The Enquirer that we would never believe if we saw them in the supermarket (ie, this from a Los Angeles Times column, Top of the Ticket

Former Sen. John Edwards today denied a story in the National Enquirer that he had an extramarital affair with a former campaign worker who followed him on numerous trips around the country.

Yet we attempt to counter equally outrageous stories every day. Hillary Clinton’s ‘cackle’ laugh (remember Howard Dean’s ’scream’?); John Edwards haircut (remember Bill Clinton had a too-expensive runway haircut that even stopped air traffic, according to the MSM-Tabloid tales); Brad Pitt doesn’t want to run for office, but maybe his friend George Clooney will run.

“Her campaign seems a lot like what we would be getting from Vice President Lieberman about now, had things gone a little differently in 2000.”

Cleter: ZING! :o)

AND: Here’s Charles Krauthammer; IMHO one of the most unctious, lying, scuzzballs in print, in his column in yesterday’s Myrtle Beach Sun News. It’s one the most clever, have-it-both-ways, republican asshole pieces we’ll see, in that he sorta-kinda puts the knock on her (and of course, BILL!) but then, it all adds up to how “moderate” she is, and maybe she aint so bad, after all.

Krauthammer’s stupid. He thinks that by speaking of her with anything less than drool running off his chin, he’ll help her get nominated, with what influence he has with conservative democrats. Which is considerable, I expect.

It’s no accident that the repub candidates have relatively little to say about Clinton.

She’s their ace in the hole. Why flip her up now? You can bet the ranch that Rudy, etc., flop back on their bed pillow at night, and think:

“Sweet Baby Jeebus; please let them nominate Clinton.”

If we pick nearly any other democrat, every damn one of them is a political footnote.

http://www.myrtlebeachonline.c…..16869.html

Sorry about the ad pitches. If you want to read Krauthammers fifth column, fifth column, you might want to turn your volume down.

And, re-reading it, he’s not as hard on Bill, as I thought, but the whole piece is him talking about Hillary, in civil terms. Which is something NO bushCo-sucking columnist would be doing, if they didn’t know that she is the ONLY chance they have to keep the white house, and retake the congress.

Beerfart@125.

If you think Faux is using Clinton to scare the base NOW, with three effing months until the first primary, if we nominate her, just think what they’ll be doing in the general.

One mistake that a lot of her supporters are making is this:

They’re assuming that Iraq will at least stay at the same level of mayhem, and not get worse. Anyone want to bet 8 more years of a republican president on THAT?

Because, with her ducking the tough questions on that most important of issues now, think about this; if Iraq starts to unspinnably implode, where is the “mistake” word from her? How can she go after george bush and the GOP for what’s going on, when she has spent so long in bed with them?

(As if she shouldn’t ALREADY be going after them…and apologizing, as John Edwards has done repeatedly, for that authorizing vote.)

cleter @ 18
…
The Republican candidates should start wearing orange jumpsuits, so we can recognize them as Republicans.

Somehow the image of a line of Repubs wearing orange jump suits, standing in line along a prison wall and whistling while they tap their feet in unison (a la the Rockettes) just makes me smile.

Marilyn In Texas @ 82

Susan in Iowa @ 34

You missed the opportunity to see The Imperial Campaign in action. Nothing that can be bought was left out. …

But for all that, it was disappointing. She rambles, she offers up a lot of platitudes, with a few programs where she gets into details (mainly healthcare). My mind kept wandering. …

unthreatening-looking women. . .teachers. . . child care workers. . .
what is that? I see too much picking apart of HRC here. So you don’t support her. Okay. Let’s hear why you support another candidate.

I think the previous writer gave a hint, that “My mind kept wandering.”

I think we have some very big problems which need to be addressed…monumental really, and Clinton doesn’t address them very well.

Out of Iraq
Health Care reform
retirement pension reform
infrastructure rebuilding
mortgage crisis repair
environmental protection
new energy sources
world fair trade
fix New Orleans
fix the military
fight Al Qaeda
review 9/11
fix education (if it can be done)
fight poverty
improve world relations
revive anti-nuclear proliferation
revive nuclear draw-downs
increase minimum wage AGAIN!
strengthen unions
improve port and border security
improve immigrations problem
revive stem cell research
get religion out of government

I mean, the list goes on and on and on. Hillary has said she’ll work on 3 or 4 of these things.

I’ll vote for John Edwards and his big bold ideas for a better America!

So when you spread your bread with Fluff and peanut butter….be sure you leave enough for another Fluffernutter!

I think that maybe you have missed the point of the “cackle” stories-which was EVADING questions by Hillary.

So unless she answers-it IS an election seasonon and she IS fair game. Playing the victim card for everyhting is getting very tiresome for people who would like to hear some answers.

I remember Chevy Chase and Gerald Ford, where a very nimble and athletic President was humbled by a momentary gaff caught on tape.

Hillary’s laugh works fine by me. And if she want’s to laugh at stupid questions, I say GO FOR IT girl!

What about Bush barf syndrome. Didn’t that one time incident fuel an entire season of SNL?

And what about the Merckel back rub?

ifthethunderdontgetya @ 4

I remember something about Oven Mitt’s makeup bill. Died without a trace, while the haircut lives on in infamy.

I don’t get it. Why are you comparing the two? One was $400 for a single 30-minute haircut, the other was $2000 over a 4-year period. Didn’t Billy do something similar while holding up flights when he was President?

Beerfart Liberal @ 125

It’s been discussed here and everywhere how the Republicans resort to fear to try to win. Watch FOX sometimes. The line now is that it looks like Hillary is going to be the next president. They’re trying to scare their viewers into getting behind the GOP nominee even if its a cross-dresser or a Mormon – something they haven’t shown an inclination to do in numbers large enough to be of comfort to the GOP and it’s media outlet, Fox.

It’s really not fair that you single out FOX, all the news outlets do the same thing, just FOX has put a conservative spin on it to capture the conservative audience. CNN & PMSNBC is just as worthless.

Also your comments about Mormons seemed a little on the negative side. Thought you libs were supposed to be “open minded” to things. Do you feel the same way about JFK? He was Catholic you know.