Uno?

(((((((Christy!)))))))

Truthful allocution is the well-mannered and honorable way to invite making nice.

I’d call my Senator Diane Feinstein but it’d be a waste of time. I might as well have voted for a Republican.

I’ll give Evan’s office a call in just a few minutes when I go off to lunch. He’s usually a crap shoot, but he’s done the right correct thing on a few of these national security/constitutional votes lately.

Surprisingly, even Lugar has done the appropriate thing on some of these votes. Maybe there’s hope.

kindness at 3 — If you don’t call, then all she’ll be hearing from are wingers and lobbyists. Please don’t cede that ground.

The Courts should determine wrong-doing and liability (truthful allocution) before we extend immunity (making nice.)

We ought to ‘know’ what we are ‘forgiving,’ before we do it.

A blog(I don’t remember which one-sorry) had the right answer. Congress should do nothing for the next 20 months. Absolutely nothing. All the leadership should do is keep their houses in session to eliminate recess appointments. It is the only answer. What ever they do, they screw up or can’t seem stop the goopers. Just focus on increasing their majorities.

Someone suggested that, at the very least, get something back if the telco’s want immunity. Say, Net Neutrality?
What do you think?

Solai @ 8

Someone suggested that, at the very least, get something back if the telco’s want immunity. Say, Net Neutrality?
What do you think?

They’re already getting something back– campaign contributions.

Oh, and thanks for the Dixie Chicks video. I never thought much about them one way or another before the big controversy because in general I don’t really care for country music.

But I like folk music and I like bluegrass and once the right wing slime machine went to work on them it made me notice them and discover they are much more folk and bluegrass than standard country.

So if not for the reicht-wing slimeballs, I would have missed out on some good music.

Don’t get me wrong. I e-mail her office all the time. But I always get back form letter replys that have nothing to do with what I say & then she’ll go and vote to let racist judges become Federal racist Judges & side with bush43.

But you are correct. I shouldn’t let her ignorance get in the way of my civil duties as a citizen.

I’ll e-mail her again this morning. Thanks for the push in the right direction.

SufiLizard @ 10

Oh, and thanks for the Dixie Chicks video. I never thought much about them one way or another before the big controversy because in general I don’t really care for country music.

But I like folk music and I like bluegrass and once the right wing slime machine went to work on them it made me notice them and discover they are much more folk and bluegrass than standard country.

So if not for the reicht-wing slimeballs, I would have missed out on some good music.

Yeah, when the boot-licking country bumpkins started sliming them I ran right out and bought their CD. Of course it didn’t have “Not Ready to Make Nice” on it.

Good Morning everyone…. will hit the phones before my surgeon’s appointment…..

BTW… my local Nova M Radio station yesterday was putting out the need to call about FISA….. AND saying “our very own katymine found these numbers so get to calling”

general ma’am, you do anger better’n anybody ‘ceptin’ jane.
thanks and thanks, to the both of you.
us troops are sooo happy with the leadership here!

p.s. i prefer the live version of “not ready to make nice”. just personally, i think the visuals on this one don’t really do the song justice ….
what a powerful song, either way, though ….

katymine @ 13

Good Morning everyone…. will hit the phones before my surgeon’s appointment…..

BTW… my local Nova M Radio station yesterday was putting out the need to call about FISA….. AND saying “our very own katymine found these numbers so get to calling”

Good morning, katymine. Way to go!
Best to you this morning with the docs.

Hi, ‘pups -

Checking in briefly from Marquette, MI.

My bet would be that retroactive telecom immunity will be granted. Even The Discussion Aids The Terrists.

Sux, but that would be my wager.

i’ve been calling member of the house to ask for support of rush holt’s bill.

pisses me off no end that his bill (blessed by the ACLU) isn’t getting a hearing in committee (as did the flawed RESTORE ACT yesterday).

will start calling the senators too.

p.s. just heard (i think) speaker pelosi say that the RESTORE ACT will come to the floor for a vote next week.

I just read this on Greenwald:
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/

“UPDATE III: I just learned that the FISA bill cooked up by Democratic Sen. Jay Rockefeller’s Senate Intelligence Committee does contain full retroactive amnesty for telecoms. Here is a list of all registered Verizon lobbyists, and here is a partial list of some of the lobbying firms working on behalf of AT&T. AT&T was the fifth largest contributor to Rockefeller’s last campaign, followed by the National Cable and Telecommunications Association in Sixth place, Bell South in Ninth Place, and Verizon was in the top 20.

It’s basically legalized bribery and influence peddling — they pour money into the campaign coffers of these Senators from both parties, pay former government officials such as Jamie Gorelick to help them, and then these Senators jump and pass laws providing that they will receive amnesty for serious felonies. And Joe Klein and David Ignatius are all for it.”

SufiLizard @ 4

I’ll give Evan’s office a call in just a few minutes when I go off to lunch. He’s usually a crap shoot, but he’s done the right correct thing on a few of these national security/constitutional votes lately.

Surprisingly, even Lugar has done the appropriate thing on some of these votes. Maybe there’s hope.

Do tell. All I ever get from Bayh’s office is a perfunctory “thank you for making your views known” and then a follow-up form letter that says “I will keep your views in mind” (while I spit on the Constitution AGAIN). Bayh is useless and I can’t imagine that his superior father is not disgusted with his limpdick son. What a republican loser Bayh is.

“to talk without thinking is to shoot without aiming”
“to talk without thinking is to shoot without aiming”
“to talk without thinking is to shoot without aiming”

That is what she’s writing on the blackboard in the video.

how friggin obsurd, “retroactive imunity”

the president got these companies to steal for him, they agreed, they both made tons of profit and gathered assets and intelectual property worth millions if not billions of dollars

congress is passing law that says whatever they’ve stolen is now theirs

whar kind of depraved idiots did we get elected?

BobbyG @ 16

Hi, ‘pups -

Checking in briefly from Marquette, MI.

My bet would be that retroactive telecom immunity will be granted. Even The Discussion Aids The Terrists.

Sux, but that would be my wager.

I’d feel a lot better about it, though, if it resulted in a guarantee of net neutrality. Because, we’re going to lose that too.

EPU’d

We’ve resumed the Virtually Speaking Interview series in Second Life. Marion Nestle will be talking about the policy and politics of food and nutrition tonight st 6pm Eastern.

And, next Thursday, which is why it is relevant, John Dean will be by.

WHAT THE FUCK!!??

yes, i was yelling.

via c-span3 just now. the senate judiciary committee will hold confirmation hearings next wednesday for AG nominee Mukasey. checked the SJC website, and yes – it was announced yesterday.

whatever happened to senator leahy saying that the committee must recieve the documentation owed it by the whitehouse before any nominee will be considered? did i dream that?

Kindness @ 3 — Aw, go ahead and call Feinstein. I did! The people manning the phones are actually quite polite, so it feels more effective than the canned e-mail replies you get.

kindness @ 11

Don’t get me wrong. I e-mail her office all the time. But I always get back form letter replys that have nothing to do with what I say & then she’ll go and vote to let racist judges become Federal racist Judges & side with bush43.

But you are correct. I shouldn’t let her ignorance get in the way of my civil duties as a citizen.

I’ll e-mail her again this morning. Thanks for the push in the right direction.

hi kindness, (love your handle there)

I’m right with you. my email will follow yours.

Praedor Atrebates @ 19

SufiLizard @ 4

I’ll give Evan’s office a call in just a few minutes when I go off to lunch. He’s usually a crap shoot, but he’s done the right correct thing on a few of these national security/constitutional votes lately.

Surprisingly, even Lugar has done the appropriate thing on some of these votes. Maybe there’s hope.

Do tell. All I ever get from Bayh’s office is a perfunctory “thank you for making your views known” and then a follow-up form letter that says “I will keep your views in mind” (while I spit on the Constitution AGAIN). Bayh is useless and I can’t imagine that his superior father is not disgusted with his limpdick son. What a republican loser Bayh is.

Oh, Bayh’s certainly a worthless beltway corruption-monger. But I know he surprised me by voting appropriately a couple of times recently. That certainly doesn’t absolve him of all his sins, I’m just saying there’s hope he’ll vote correctly on this if we apply enough pressure.

Do you think anyone in Congress could pass a bill that requires elected officials to spend X amount of face time with their constituents each year. You know, just as a reminder that they represent other people?
Would it pass?

Is there anything on the books now that is being ignored?

I went to Bill Nelsons website and used his direct web-based email:

I urge you not to support retroactive immunity for telecom firms for their part
in domestic surveillance and possible illegal activities.

Congress has been unable to obtain any useful information from the executive branch which is essential to evaluating the role of these firms.

I would equate the granting of such blanket immunity to that of a co-conspirator in a criminal case who, once free to speak, admits to far more grievous conduct than the prosecutor imagined while simultaneously exonerating the defendant.

It took only a few seconds and was as easy as
coming here.

Thanks for all you do Christie, et al.

selise @ 24

WHAT THE FUCK!!??

yes, i was yelling.

via c-span3 just now. the senate judiciary committee will hold confirmation hearings next wednesday for AG nominee Mukasey. checked the SJC website, and yes – it was announced yesterday.

whatever happened to senator leahy saying that the committee must recieve the documentation owed it by the whitehouse before any nominee will be considered? did i dream that?

Didn’t you know? Leahy et al folded on THAT “demand” faster than the norm. I believe they are asymptotically approaching instantaneous folding in the face of Administration resistance. It is theoretically possible that they will soon begin to fold BEFORE actually making ANY demands, perhaps just on the initial THOUGHT of a possible demand.

This should tell you what’s up. The Senate WILL give retroactive immunity without ANY quid pro quo (like full disclosure of what they did in the first place OR net neutrality). The House sacrificial bill with NO immunity will be “fixed” to match that of the Senate in conference (the Dems never intended for the House bill to actually make it, it is just theater for the little people) and the resulting Give It All Away Bill will be proclaimed a great “bipartisan” bill that “both sides can live with”. Except I couldn’t give a flying f*ck if THEY can live with it because they NEVER DO. WE have to live with their crimes against humanity and the Constitution.

who boy, wait till you see this (ot, sorry)

Ann Coulter calls for Jews to be ‘perfected’ by converting to Christianity Nick Juliano
Published: Thursday October 11, 2007

Jewish group calls on media to boycott right wing author

does she try her best to piss off as many people as possible?

Praedor Atrebates @ 19

SufiLizard @ 4

I’ll give Evan’s office a call in just a few minutes when I go off to lunch. He’s usually a crap shoot, but he’s done the right correct thing on a few of these national security/constitutional votes lately.

Surprisingly, even Lugar has done the appropriate thing on some of these votes. Maybe there’s hope.

Do tell. All I ever get from Bayh’s office is a perfunctory “thank you for making your views known” and then a follow-up form letter that says “I will keep your views in mind” (while I spit on the Constitution AGAIN). Bayh is useless and I can’t imagine that his superior father is not disgusted with his limpdick son. What a republican loser Bayh is.

Birch was really one of the good guys.
Wiki:

Bayh was also the principal architect of the Equal Rights Amendment, which was not adopted. But the proposed constitutional change with which he was most closely associated in his final years in the Senate was his attempt to eliminate the Electoral College and replace it with a popular vote. Bayh’s proposal, introduced into the Senate in 1977[1], never achieved the required two-thirds vote in either house of Congress.

my bold

selise @ 24

WHAT THE FUCK!!??

…….. happened to senator leahy saying that the committee must recieve the documentation owed it by the whitehouse before any nominee will be considered?

Castration

Update above: Glenn has more here. (H/T to susan for linking this in the comments.) Also, put some pressure on the Democratic Presidential candidates. If anyone sees a public statement by any of them on the FISA bill or any of these issues, please link it up in the comments. Thanks!

I know that emotions are running high for a lot of people, but I absolutely will not tolerate any references to violence or otherwise in the comments — directed at public officials or at each other. I hope that’s altogether clear.

perris @ 31

who boy, wait till you see this (ot, sorry)

Ann Coulter calls for Jews to be ‘perfected’ by converting to Christianity Nick Juliano
Published: Thursday October 11, 2007

Jewish group calls on media to boycott right wing author

does she try her best to piss off as many people as possible?

Coulter: What a total ASSHOLE!

Re: SCHIP:

I want to share this letter from my critter, Keith Ellison (D-MN-05) that came by snail mail last night:

October 3, 2007

Dear Biodun:

Thank you for contacting my office regarding the Children’s Health Insurance Reauthorization Act of 2007. I am honored to hear from you and I’m proud to represent you in the United States Congress. Since coming to Congress I have been working very hard to advance my policy agenda based on four key priorities–peace, prosperity for working families, environmental sustainability, and support for human and civil rights.

You may be pleased to know that on September 25, 2007, I voted in favor of CHIP Reauthorization Act of 2007, H.R. 976. The SCHIP passed the House 265–159.

(snip)

Next year alone, this SCHIP bill will provide Minnesota with $50 million in additional dollars to help insure 30,000 more children in our state.

The SCHIP bill is a reflection of our priorities. As the late Senator and former Vice President Hubert Humphrey from Minnesota stated so eloquently, “The moral test of any government is how it treats those in the dawn of life, the children; those in the dusk of life, the elderly; and those in the shadow of life, the disadvantaged.” The SCHIP bill demonstrates the priorities of this Congress.

Unfortunately, after passing both the House and the Senate with strong bipartisan support, the President decided to play politics with the health care of our nation’s children by vetoing the SCHIP bill on October 3, 2007. I am disappointed by this veto, but I look forward to working with my colleagues in Congress to override the President’s veto.

(snip)

Sincerely,

Keith Ellison
Member of Congress

My bold.

Sorry for the OT, but though some folks might like to know that Naomi Wolf is being interviewed on KUOW, Seattle’s NPR station.

Warning…it’s pledge week.

I just called Wyden’s office. His staff person told me that, although Wyden hasn’t issued a statement on this FISA bill, he did vote against the last bill in August.

I asked if that meant he was going to vote against this one. The staffer said he couldn’t say, due to no issued statement yet, but he reiterated that Wyden voted against the last FISA reauthorization.

Biodun @ 37

Re: SCHIP:

I want to share this letter from my critter, Keith Ellison (D-MN-05) that came by snail mail last night:

October 3, 2007

Dear Biodun:

Thank you for contacting my office regarding the Children’s Health Insurance Reauthorization Act of 2007. I am honored to hear from you and I’m proud to represent you in the United States Congress. Since coming to Congress I have been working very hard to advance my policy agenda based on four key priorities–peace, prosperity for working families, environmental sustainability, and support for human and civil rights.

You may be pleased to know that on September 25, 2007, I voted in favor of CHIP Reauthorization Act of 2007, H.R. 976. The SCHIP passed the House 265–159.

(snip)

Next year alone, this SCHIP bill will provide Minnesota with $50 million in additional dollars to help insure 30,000 more children in our state.

The SCHIP bill is a reflection of our priorities. As the late Senator and former Vice President Hubert Humphrey from Minnesota stated so eloquently, “The moral test of any government is how it treats those in the dawn of life, the children; those in the dusk of life, the elderly; and those in the shadow of life, the disadvantaged.” The SCHIP bill demonstrates the priorities of this Congress.

Unfortunately, after passing both the House and the Senate with strong bipartisan support, the President decided to play politics with the health care of our nation’s children by vetoing the SCHIP bill on October 3, 2007. I am disappointed by this veto, but I look forward to working with my colleagues in Congress to override the President’s veto.

(snip)

Sincerely,

Keith Ellison
Member of Congress

My bold.

Now that’s COMPASSIONATE! I couldn’t agree more with the Congressman.

Suzanne Spaulding, who testified to the Senate Judiciary Committee on 9/25/07 about the PAA and FISA, pointed out very clearly why granting this sort of immunity is a dreadful idea:

On a related point, the Administration has indicated that it will be back in front of Congress seeking immunity for carriers and others who cooperated in the Terrorist Surveillance Program and, perhaps, other intelligence activities. It is hard to imagine a more powerful way to undermine respect for the rule of law and the critical role that communication providers play as the last line of defense against government abuse. Moreover, it’s not clear why this is needed. Under current law, communication providers already can avoid liability if they simply have a letter from the AG saying the government’s request is legal. If they did not even get that, what message do we send by giving them immunity for totally disregarding the law? Why wouldn’t the next telecommunications CEO decide to go ahead and ignore the legal requirements, figuring the government would bail the company out if it ever became public?

In an area such as this, where the normal safeguards of transparency are lacking, requiring communication providers to at least get a certification that the request to hand over customer information or allow communication intercepts is legal serves as an important potential deterrent to abusive behavior by the government. At a minimum, Congress needs to fully understand what past activities would be immunized before adopting such a wide-ranging provision.

http://judiciary.senate.gov/te…..it_id=6671

As far as I’m concerned, and in line with Christy’s preceding post, this immunity scam is another in the series of Cheney/Addington-led efforts to avoid accountability from the Judicial Branch for their unConstitutional actions. They know damn well that what they’ve done, and have allowed to be secretly done, knowingly and flagrantly violated the Fourth Amendment and FISA, and they have no intention of letting the Supreme Court get around to confirming that, if they can help it, and that is exactly what the despicable complicity of the likes of the Senate and House leadership and the Intelligence and Judiciary Committee Chairmen is helping them to arrange.

Senator Feingold, Senator Whitehouse: THIS time, PLEASE place a hold on any such bill…

P.S. Selise – FYI, it looks like the reason those hearings you wondered about in the last thread were postponed in the House was to allow members to attend Rep. Davis’s funeral which is being held today in Virginia.

P.P.S. Yeah, tell me about it, selise @ 24, regarding Leahy and Mukasey. Pat Leahy is also the chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee and could help stop this FISA immunity trainwreck that’s fast approaching, if he wasn’t all bark and no bite.

SufiLizard @ 4

I’ll give Evan’s office a call in just a few minutes when I go off to lunch. He’s usually a crap shoot, but he’s done the right correct thing on a few of these national security/constitutional votes lately.

Surprisingly, even Lugar has done the appropriate thing on some of these votes. Maybe there’s hope.

If you must, invoke Bayh’s dad(Birch Bayh). It’s time to pull out all the stops. Birch was a leader in the Senate in his day(Sponsoring the ERA amendment for one). Tell Evan Bayh to be a leader on an issue like his dad was.

Lisa at 39 — Thanks so much. I think it highly likely that Wyden is leaning our way, but I don’t like to take chances unless I can nail things down to a certainty. Really appreciate you calling and reporting back!

kindness @ 3

I’d call my Senator Diane Feinstein but it’d be a waste of time. I might as well have voted for a Republican.

Don’t give up!! If Feinstein is called enough, hopefully she’ll do the right thing just so we don’t call her anymore. Tell the nice person answering the phone that you’ll call back every day until she gets it right.

Wow!!! This is an incredibly powerful video…drafting Gore…holy moley…gives me chills…and the music is amazing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…../184837/05

pow wow @ 41

P.S. Selise – FYI, It looks like the reason those hearings you wondered about in the last thread were postponed in the House was to allow members to attend Rep. Davis’s funeral which is being held today in Virginia.

ah, that makes sense. thank you.

It always seems like I’m OT, but when big players meet quietly I get curious.
It would be interesting to know who else they talk to.

‘Foreign Ministry Director-General Aharon Abramovitch convened a special meeting in Washington Wednesday with Israel’s top representatives in the US and Canada to discuss Iran.

The Foreign Ministry’s spokeswoman refused to discuss the content of the two-day meeting, or what prompted it, other than saying “the Iranian issue is at the top of Israel’s diplomatic agenda.”

Among those at the meeting were Israel’s ambassador to the US, Sallai Meridor; the ambassador to the UN, the envoy to Canada, Alan Baker; the top diplomatic staff at the embassy in Washington and the heads of consulates in the US and Canada. Abramovitch was joined by Yossi Gal, the ministry’s deputy director-general.’

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/S…..le/Printer

The telecoms have a vehicle already for avoiding lawsuits — it’s called a “warrant.” Once a judge signs it, the telecoms are off the hook (so to speak) for turning information over to investigators.

It’d be nice if any of their in-house cousellors would explain this to the folks in the corner offices.

Sad day in America when saying the words, “The Constitution is not available for compromise, partisan deal-splitting or sale” makes a person feel like an intransigent radical.

It should be the honorable position and a source of pride, not something you mutter into your hand while you cough.

I gave up on this country once, kind of found my way back to the process and I’ll be damned if I’ll hang on this time until my fingertips bleed. It gets easier and easier to just delcare us a hopeless cause and say, “Fuck it.”

Not particularly proud of that, either, but people my age have seen and been through a lot.

Just close your eyes and hold your breath and always trust your cape.

BobbyG @ 36

perris @ 31

who boy, wait till you see this (ot, sorry)

Coulter: What a total ASSHOLE!

And where is Abraham Foxman’s condemnation? ADL?? Hello!?!?

Joe Klein’s conscience @ 44

kindness @ 3

I’d call my Senator Diane Feinstein but it’d be a waste of time. I might as well have voted for a Republican.

Arggggg . . .
just called franken-fein-stein’s office …..

pitchforks anyone!!!!
Don’t give up!! If Feinstein is called enough, hopefully she’ll do the right thing just so we don’t call her anymore. Tell the nice person answering the phone that you’ll call back every day until she gets it right.

Praedor Atrebates @ 19

SufiLizard @ 4

I’ll give Evan’s office a call in just a few minutes when I go off to lunch. He’s usually a crap shoot, but he’s done the right correct thing on a few of these national security/constitutional votes lately.

Surprisingly, even Lugar has done the appropriate thing on some of these votes. Maybe there’s hope.

Do tell. All I ever get from Bayh’s office is a perfunctory “thank you for making your views known” and then a follow-up form letter that says “I will keep your views in mind” (while I spit on the Constitution AGAIN). Bayh is useless and I can’t imagine that his superior father is not disgusted with his limpdick son. What a republican loser Bayh is.

I saw Birch Bayh speak on C-Span a year ago. It made me learn more about him. It made me wonder all the more where the son went off the rails. How can Birch be such a progressive and Evan be such a DLC wimp?

Christy,
Maybe someone from WVa can point out to Jay Rockefeller that however much his actions on the Senate FISA bill might be approved by his great-grandfather, it just does not reflect the values of the Democratic Party he has chosen to represent. And probably wouldn’t be the accepted values of his Uncle Nelson.

Or I may be an id10t.

Don’t you get the feeling that the democracy we “have” is but kabuki. We are owned and controlled by people who are unaccountable.

The congress is now answerable to their campaign contributors, the lobbyists and not to the people.

We’re screwed as usual. And we scream at these congress critters but to no avail.

Democratic leadership? For another 300 votes we could have had Larry Kissell instead of Robin Hayes. Do you hear overtones of tommy’s Had Enough in this title? Please support Kissell at Blue America. Larry Kissell NC-08 in ‘08!

October 11, 2007 ENOUGH

There is a fight going on in Washington. Some fight for
children, some fight for politics. And like the seasoned hand
at DC politics that he is, my opponent, Congressman Robin
Hayes, is trying to rationalize not supporting SCHIP
expansion, a program that will help keep children healthy, by
pointing out how powerless he is to change the bill to
protect North Carolina tobacco jobs. As folks in Cabarrus
County have recently been made painfully aware, tobacco jobs
are already leaving, and neither Mr. Hayes’ past votes or any
other aspect of his tenure in Congress have helped to keep
them here one bit.

Yet, now when the health of our children is at stake,
suddenly he is concerned about keeping our jobs here at home.
Of course this coincides with President Bush needing his vote
again, just like he did on CAFTA. The working families who
depend on Philip Morris fueling the economy of our area to
support their children are going to be among the first in
need of SCHIP. Congressman Hayes’ support of President Bush’s
veto is sadly pointless for those families.

When our jobs are at stake, Hayes stands with Bush over the
children of working families. When the children of working
families are at stake, Hayes again stands with Bush, only
this time blaming the job losses he and President Bush helped
create. Enough.

There are thousands of families in North Carolina who are
counting on Washington politicians to exempt children from
their political fight and support SCHIP expansion. I hope
Congressman Hayes will just this once break with President
Bush and exempt our Congressional District and children from
petty politics.

Please write letters to the editor of your local paper
supporting the health of our children, and encouraging Robin
Hayes to do the right thing.

And of course, please do all you can to help support our
fight to Take Our Country Back!

You know it’s appreciated.

Larry Kissell
Democratic Candidate for Congress
North Carolina’s 8th District
Someone Working…For a Change

RBG @ 38

Sorry for the OT, but though some folks might like to know that Naomi Wolf is being interviewed on KUOW, Seattle’s NPR station.

Warning…it’s pledge week.

Naomi just dropped FDL in her interview.

Let me add another subject to the calling list.

Senator Leahy needs to hear from you regarding the failure to enforce the subpoenas issued for Karl Rove, Harriet Miers and Josh Bolten.

His office number is 202-224-4242, and he needs to hear from you. Got a minute? Give him a call.

Love to see a front page post on this. I diaried it on the Orange Satan yesterday and made the Rec List. Now when I call, I’m told they’ve been hearing that a lot.

The Orange Satan WORKS!

perris @ 31

who boy, wait till you see this (ot, sorry)

Ann Coulter calls for Jews to be ‘perfected’ by converting to Christianity Nick Juliano
Published: Thursday October 11, 2007

Jewish group calls on media to boycott right wing author

does she try her best to piss off as many people as possible?

Yes, I really wish that MSM would just NOT bring her on..or for that matter Lynn Cheney – she’s another one.
On the other hand, I do not feel the need to be “perfected”, particularly when this statement comes from someone who bears a very close resemblance to a “female” version of Lord Voldemort.

Peterr @ 48

The telecoms have a vehicle already for avoiding lawsuits — it’s called a “warrant.” Once a judge signs it, the telecoms are off the hook (so to speak) for turning information over to investigators.

It’d be nice if any of their in-house cousellors would explain this to the folks in the corner offices.

Well, gosh, how could they have possibly understood what they were getting into? It’s not like they have platoons of lawyers on staff with expertise in this exact field, just because it’s their entire business, right? The administration told them it was legal, and they had no choice but to take them at their word. Poor little giant telecom companies!

Yes! Keep those faxes, calls and petition letters coming. Have a look at our ad and petition at Families USA.

The override vote is coming…

Yes, things are pretty heads up! It gets that way Way Too Much.
For me…I’m going camping. Today.
Just lucky timing. I made the reservations months ago. It’s the October Birthdays Campout.
I’m making potatoe salad right now.
Loo Hoo said she’s joining us.
Any other So. Cal. Folks who want to retreat for a Day or two…we deserve it…can see us at San Clemente State Beach. Ask for the Moores.
We will check in later, via Blackberry.
Stay strong Pups!
(my dog is very excited He gets to go to the wilds!)

selise @ 24

WHAT THE FUCK!!??

yes, i was yelling.

via c-span3 just now. the senate judiciary committee will hold confirmation hearings next wednesday for AG nominee Mukasey. checked the SJC website, and yes – it was announced yesterday.

whatever happened to senator leahy saying that the committee must recieve the documentation owed it by the whitehouse before any nominee will be considered? did i dream that?

Seems to me that fell by the wayside several days ago. You did hear this, though. The only thing I can make out of scheduling the hearings is that they may be able to ask some questions that will get back to the missing docs or whether the nominee would block getting docs or how the nominee feels about certain Presidential overreaches. No doubt the hearing itself is going to be interesting. If it isn’t, it’ll be another capitulation to add to the list. I’m of a mind that says we must find out the reason for these seemingly way too easy and basically mindless capitulations. Blackmail? Threats of financial ruin? What?

Whatever! The Dems are not demonstrating that they have a feel as though they have the moral high ground, and I have to admit, that makes me wonder if they have the moral high ground. If they don’t have it, then I suggest that they seek it or, if they feel they can’t ever get there, they should get out of politics and leave it to someone with more integrity before we find out and throw them in jail. Feinstein with all her husband’s contacts and all their potential for conflict of interest should be very wary.

Here’s a pretty way out presentation of the whole shooting match:

http://video.google.de/videopl…..3139148549

One more thing. I always double up on my calls to my senator (Feinstein) by leaving the same messages at the DC and the local offices.

May I just add that my cynical outburst was in no way meant to dampen the enthusiasm or denigrate the work of those making calls today in hopes of slowing this monster down.

I made my calls to my two senators yesterday (after lunch and before I descended into this miasmic funk of despair).

Going to call Feinstein at lunch, and while I’m at it, a call to Campbell on the House side.

BTW for the Greenwald link, this is the permanent link– you’ve linked to the blog itself so his FISA column will moved down on the next post…

http://www.salon.com/opinion/g…..index.html

demi @ 61

Yes, things are pretty heads up! It gets that way Way Too Much.
For me…I’m going camping. Today.
Just lucky timing. I made the reservations months ago. It’s the October Birthdays Campout.
I’m making potatoe salad right now.
Loo Hoo said she’s joining us.
Any other So. Cal. Folks who want to retreat for a Day or two…we deserve it…can see us at San Clemente State Beach. Ask for the Moores.
We will check in later, via Blackberry.
Stay strong Pups!
(my dog is very excited He gets to go to the wilds!)

Demi – I’ll let you camp for me. My camping requires a bathroom with hot showers and ceramic tile *g*

If the Senate approves the immunity, anyone guess what would happen when the bill goes to conference with Conyers?

Toby Wollin @ 67

demi @ 61

Yes, things are pretty heads up! It gets that way Way Too Much.
For me…I’m going camping. Today.
Just lucky timing. I made the reservations months ago. It’s the October Birthdays Campout.
I’m making potatoe salad right now.
Loo Hoo said she’s joining us.
Any other So. Cal. Folks who want to retreat for a Day or two…we deserve it…can see us at San Clemente State Beach. Ask for the Moores.
We will check in later, via Blackberry.
Stay strong Pups!
(my dog is very excited He gets to go to the wilds!)

Demi – I’ll let you camp for me. My camping requires a bathroom with hot showers and ceramic tile *g*

They have all of those things! And, we bring big blow up air mattreses. And, we are having sirloin steak and pinot for dinner. And two- bite pecan pies for dessert.
And a fire.
But, I’ll be thinking of you.
I know camping is not for everyone, but the way I do it is not what most people think.
Oh….and the stars!

Oh Ann Coulter isn’t that bad…she’s going to be mentoring some hopeful young ladies on her new show America’s Next Top Beeyotch.

Michelle Malkin agreed to be one of the judges.

You know, it’s not as easy as it looks. You can’t just show up and start spouting off. You have to find just the right target, right message, right timing and venue.

/s

http://luttonsquare.blogspot.c…..lecom.html

I say no way…it’s crazy to offer this for nothing.

Limited or total immunity could always be offered in the course of any investigation for cooperative witnesses.

Without that offer, investigators would have very little leverage in getting the telecommunication companies to reveal anything.

You have to wonder who’d realy benefit from telecom immunity; the very same people pushing hardest for it.

with the gentle nudge from move-on, i already called congressman cooper (D-TN) to request that he NOT approve any bill which included immunity for a telecom who may have assisted this administration in illegal wire-tapping activity. when i asked the congressman’s position on this issue, i was told that one of his legislative assistants would have to call me back with that information.

off to call both alexander and corker, and i’ll add the point about no umbrella warrents. thanks christy.

Re FISA, the Administration brazenly broke the law for years. What we are seeing now with telecom immunity and in September 2006 with the MCA are moves to “legalize” their illegal activities before they leave office.

Re Leahy, his caving is part of a pattern. He expressed some doubts but did not oppose the nomination of Chief Justice Roberts. He participated in but did not lead the unsuccessful filibuster of Alito. He failed to move on contempt citations against the Administration’s stonewalling. In the most recent case, he announced that he would hold the Mukasey nomination until there was an agreement on the outstanding issues. And golly gee, he caved on it.

Leahy does, I think, have his heart in the right place but he is and has been ineffective and ineffectual.

PS — as magnanimous as I try to be, Ann Coulter is NOT invited. :) No, really.

christy is upstairs with more…and other MM person we can love to hate.

Chrity’s upstairs…

susan @ 18

I just read this on Greenwald:
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/

“UPDATE III: I just learned that the FISA bill cooked up by Democratic Sen. Jay Rockefeller’s Senate Intelligence Committee does contain full retroactive amnesty for telecoms. Here is a list of all registered Verizon lobbyists, and here is a partial list of some of the lobbying firms working on behalf of AT&T. AT&T was the fifth largest contributor to Rockefeller’s last campaign, followed by the National Cable and Telecommunications Association in Sixth place, Bell South in Ninth Place, and Verizon was in the top 20.

Ron Dellums is on the list as a lobbyist for Verizon.
WTF?!#%@!

D.C isn’t Hollywood for ugly people;
it’s Wall Street for ex-progrerssives.

(And, yes, Mike McCurry, I’m also talking about you.)

Biodun @ 76

Chrity’s Christy’s upstairs…

Just made the call to DiFi. Any Democrat that votes for this that represents me will likely lose my vote in the primary and possibly the general. I am tired of this crap.

Thanks for providing the phone numbers.

Next Christy: More FISA Thoughts And Some Kudos

I got to meet Birch Bayh two summers ago (2006). What a wonderful man, still. I didn’t have the heart to bring up his son whom I met a few months earlier and with whom I was totally unimpressed.

Birch seemed genuine and was gracious to everyone. Evan could hardly be bothered to stop talking to his bigwig friends long enough to shake my hand.

demi (if you’re still here):

Happy camping! Surloin steak–yum yum. But I’ll have that with Chilean Carmenere (red) wine…

Peterr @ 48

The telecoms have a vehicle already for avoiding lawsuits — it’s called a “warrant.” Once a judge signs it, the telecoms are off the hook (so to speak) for turning information over to investigators.

It’d be nice if any of their in-house cousellors would explain this to the folks in the corner offices.

The question remains, just why did the telecom companies, all except Qwest (isn’t it?), comply with the government without the benefit of any type of paper to CYA, which is the first things businesses generally require. They should have known to secure a letter, at a minimum, and not getting one makes them accomplices in whatever unconstitutional acts occurred to any or all of us. Did the government threaten to take away all their rights and privileges if they didn’t comply? Did they threaten to take their licensing, or otherwise make their lives miserable? It’d be nice if we knew what’s up.

My other question, though, is why is it so important to give them immunity. If the President wants it so bad, and thinks it’s so right, then he should do it himself, since he is so certain he has all the power. In fact, he actually does have plenary pardon power, so why is he quibbling about this with the Congress? Seriously, why?

Watching Susan Burke from the Center for Constitutional Rights on Democracy Now talk about the lawsuit being brought on behalf of Iraqis killed by Blackwater, in US courts, makes me wonder “How many DINO Dems will vote to give Blackwater retroactive immunity when this gets further along?”

Biodun @ 81

demi (if you’re still here):

Happy camping! Surloin steak–yum yum. But I’ll have that with Chilean Carmenere (red) wine…

I know…red with meat. But, we love the grigio..and it was on sale! ha!
I’ll send a wish to the stars for ya. :)

EPU land,
From yesterday’s thread:
Here’s how the kabuki will play out IMHOP
1. Regardless of the Holt or markup bill passing the House
2.The Senate will pass a toothless bill that Greenwald et al fear, and
3. The joint conference will end up giving the Administration all they want including retroactive immunity. If they can pass it through both houses with house language, some aid to Specter will insert all the administration wants and the president will sign with an attached signing statement and,
4. we will still not be privy to the flimsy legal reasoning nor what’s been done under color of law.

Sorry for the rant, but somehow i have seen this before.
I think we progressives are all that stand between fascism and getting back the country whose values I hold self evident.

In fact, he actually does have plenary pardon power, so why is he quibbling about this with the Congress? Seriously, why?
*
because he wants DEMs buying into this.

I think this is interesting:
How much the telecoms gave Voinovich .

You can put your zip code in there too.

Just called Warner’s office and spoke to bubbleheaded child who had no idea what I was even talking about, (”Restore Act?”) or pretended not to, nonethless she ‘took my message’. So I’m sure everything will be okay now — no more warrantless wiretapping.

Is this a country or what?

I really ought to make it my mission in life to disabuse bloggers of the notion that Olympia Snowe is reasonable. Good lord, isn’t it painfully obvious that any seemingly moderate vote she ever makes is a) to help her sustain her elected position and b) only offered when it becomes apparent that her vote isn’t needed one way or the other by the GOP vote counters.

Um, FYI in case ya’ll didn’t know this. I called Bayh’s office and got the usuall yeah, yeah yeah. But then when I saw Nelson on there I called his office all prepared to use my mother’s old address, and the guy at Nelson’s office said they go by zip codes- he didn’t want my name or address.

33133 or 33134 is Coconut Grove and Coral Gables. Just in case anyone wanted them.

Christy:

I am VERY CONCERNED. I just called every single person on the list, and didn’t have to wait or get a busy signal on ANy of the calls.

People need to start calling. I don’t care if you are tired. I don’t care if you don’t think it will work. Just call. Because, it does, in fact, work.

Praedor Atrebates @ 30

selise @ 24

WHAT THE FUCK!!??

yes, i was yelling.

via c-span3 just now. the senate judiciary committee will hold confirmation hearings next wednesday for AG nominee Mukasey. checked the SJC website, and yes – it was announced yesterday.

whatever happened to senator leahy saying that the committee must recieve the documentation owed it by the whitehouse before any nominee will be considered? did i dream that?

Didn’t you know? Leahy et al folded on THAT “demand” faster than the norm. I believe they are asymptotically approaching instantaneous folding in the face of Administration resistance. It is theoretically possible that they will soon begin to fold BEFORE actually making ANY demands, perhaps just on the initial THOUGHT of a possible demand.

This should tell you what’s up. The Senate WILL give retroactive immunity without ANY quid pro quo (like full disclosure of what they did in the first place OR net neutrality). The House sacrificial bill with NO immunity will be “fixed” to match that of the Senate in conference (the Dems never intended for the House bill to actually make it, it is just theater for the little people) and the resulting Give It All Away Bill will be proclaimed a great “bipartisan” bill that “both sides can live with”. Except I couldn’t give a flying f*ck if THEY can live with it because they NEVER DO. WE have to live with their crimes against humanity and the Constitution.

My Senators and Representatives are making ME work too hard with all this phone calling and letter writing!

I thought THEY were supposed to be working for US!

Since one of my senators is a “leading” Presidential candidate, I will be sure to tell HER to go on the record for opposing retroactive immunity to the telecoms, her funders.

I called Clinton’s office and got the legislative office answering machine. So, I talked to the tape.

I have called some of the above senators..taking a break, but I wanted to say to all of you who work so hard that in the normal course of life I probably wouldn’t ever call a senator because deep down in my heart I don’t think it means anything to them but I have been proven wrong, it does make a difference. I also want to say that I have gotten an education from all of you. I am not at my computer 24/7 so some of my posts tend to be last from the left coast but I try to read everything I can and sometimes I am completely overwhelmed and filled with an anger I have never experienced before at the extent of the nightmare this administration has perpetrated on the United States of America. This battle we are fighting is one that is thousands of years old, the fight to live a decent life in the face of those with all the marbles who will always close their minds to the ones who have little, and I am proud to stand with all of you.

Maybe what we need is a Senator who will pursue an amendment specifying what we want in trade for the telcom immunity. There could be one amendment requiring they turn over all information about what was given to Bush & Co and what other Bush wanted but that they couldn’t or wouldn’t turn over. Then there could be an amendment requiring Net Neutrality.

Having them broken out into two amendments would give us an idea of which Senators support each idea.

Which senator should be asked to put forward two such amendments?

e-mailed & called.

If this doesn’t work our hope will be the House Senate Conference Committee when they try to reconcile the two differing bills into one.

I called both Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D-WV) and Sen. Barbara Mikulski (D-MD) office. My message was that bill should not support criminals.

I sincerely hope these Senators get the message that regular Americans are angry at warrant-less wiretapping.

Called Feinstein’s DC office (very polite staffer) and also followed up with a fax, delineating my points more thoroughly than is usually possible with a call.

Called Sen. Dianne Feinstein. The aide mentioned that there have been very few calls regarding this bill.

Come on folks! Hold your Sen’s feet to the fire!!

done/SD

I was on hold quite a while….due to heavy volume of calls…

:-)

Called Feinstein’s office. She has no public position yet b/c there is no Senate draft of the bill. Asked if she had a position as a member of the committee, and again, no public position.

I called Feinstein. I told the staffer that:

1. Retroactive immunity sets a bad precedent-
GB can ask companies to do anything and the company will know they’ll essentially get a pardon.

2. You should never give a pardon without knowing exactly what the company did, and we don’t know any of that.

The staffer said these were “good points.”

1pm Pacific Time – just got off the phone w/Feinstein’s office. Again, the official position is that she doesn’t talk about incomplete drafts. The aide sounded a bit harried, but I can’t necessarily say it was because he’s getting hammered on this. I told him the bill in current rumored form is unacceptable.

Just gave Sen. Hagel’s ofc a call…staffer was quite friendly.

Thom Hartmann created a website called callcongress.org where the intent is to keep an updated list of numbers to contact congress. callcongress.org does link back his orignal website, thomhartmann.com, but his intent was to have a domain name easier to remember:
callcongress.org

So if anyone finds new numbers or finds that a posted number is wrong, they can contact the site to let them know.

I called Feinstein’s office and got through after about a minute of waiting. The staffer just took down my complaints and said nothing else.

I appreciate the “phone calls” and the other immediate action that will communicate displeasure. Thank you for your attention to this issue. Indeed, the Congress — both parties, DNC and GOP — appears to have capitulated on legal requirements, and violated their oath, as if nothing will happen. Broadly, the entire 2006 mandate appears to have been thrown out the window: Iraq war continues; the funding isn’t stopping; and the FISA violations aren’t getting attention.

A government that will not enforce the rule of law is not legitimate. Let’s create a new system of governance that will assert its oath and take seriously the rule of law. We the People are not required to assent to this lawlessness. Indeed, until the Congress and President know there is a credible discussion in place to revoke their power lawfully and non-violently, they’re going to continue to cave. Congress may not, on their own, go home; but the public can discuss a new system of governance. With due respect to the narrow issue of the FISA immunity, could we consider a broader solution: Anyone up for discussing some credible solutions like revoking their powers through a new system of governance?

Hang on. What’s the “big rush” to pass this bill now? If the President “won’t” sign any bill that doesn’t have immunity, who/what inside the DNC is [a] moving on this schedule; and [b] including in this bill immunity?

A scheduling issue isn’t the same as immunity. Those are two different issues. Why isn’t the DNC blocking this bill in either the Senate or the House; or am I seeing the return of the rubber stamp, artificial timelines, and more “approvals without fact finding.”

Oh, wait. This isn’t a dream. The DNC is in “control”.

Does using fake addresses to get around zip code edits in the email forms for Senators and Reps raise any legal questions? Seems like we should be able to email them (they are working for and affecting us with their votes) but they restrict access to only people within their states/districts.

The “immunity clause” goes the other way: Those who refused to cooperate with illegal activity should not be punished; while those who violate the law get immunity.

Invoking “issue of fairness” as a pretext to grant immunity for illegal acddtivity cannot be unfair and imbalanced. Putting aside the immunity for illegal activity, punishing those who refuse to cooperate with illegal activity has the appearance of unjustness. Does Chief Justice Roberts and the goons on the Supreme Court plan to call this double standard a “state secret” and refues to review the alleged illegal retalation against Qwest? This is no better than the Roman Empire. At least they had nice, colorful uniforms with feathers and knew when to fly away when all was lost. Not this crew in DC.

Do Natalie and the Chicks get the:

“Hey!-Did-we get-it-right-and-Toby Keith-did-YOU-and-the-rest-of-the-”patriots”-evermore-fuck-it-up-or-what???”

award? :o) :o) :o)

I think you may have missed something: Ongoing state-level litigation against the telecoms is based on state law; Congress, in “granting immunity to the telecoms” would have no power to block the States from enforcing state law against the telecoms. Game on for doing an end-run around Congress, and keeping the telecoms accountable for their alleged illegal activity. What do the telecom lobbyists have to say to all 50 State AGs? DC doesn’t control the world; the States have the power to bypass Congress, and enforce State law against the telecoms. [Hit the link for details from the Court which supports this legal theory.]

Pergressiffs, How can we furriners understand y’all unless we apply the ’serially abused wife’ model?

You keep calling and writing, begging the cretins who have repeatedly betrayed your trust. Patriot Acts I and II, anyone? What member of Congress resigned over the Waco massacre? What member of Congress has called for an investigation into why the Pentagon’s extensive, expensive ground-to-air missile defense system didn’t fire on Black Tuesday? How many members of Congress are demanding that Sy Hersh’s “Even Worse” Abu Ghraib evidence is released to the public? What member of Congress still wants to get to the bottom of the Anthrax Affair? And surely worst of all: what member is daring to make waves (like, putting secret holds on crucial bills until he/she gets some progress) over the mass murder by deliberate neglect down in New Orleans?

What would be the fate of an attorney who advised her client to sign a contract without first reading it? That’s what YOUR congresscats did with Herr Bushler’s “Enabling Act.” I mean, your Bushie and Joe Lieberman’s “Patriot Act.”

Have you seen anything that might be sign of your abusers turning over a new leaf? No, on the contrary they’ve just rammed the rusty old family Suburban into the closed garage door on the way home from the liquor store, kicked the family’s Irish Setter down the sidewalk; they’ve torn the handle off the porch screen door and defiantly plunked a brand-new full case of Southern Comfort 1.75 ltr bottles on the kitchen table. You’re not going to get a ‘new leaf’, folks, you’re in for another weekend of punches, rape, and screaming.

And yet some of you still believe in running to the neighbors’ phone, with blood streaming from your bashed noses, to call the rampaging Hubby even as he plans his next attack on your person.

What would you feminists say to a woman who repeatedly returned to a determined, psychotic abuser? Why can’t you see that the same situational shoe fits when one applies it to the smelly, twisted foot limping around as a Democrat congress these days?

What’s the point in telling people to call and plead with arrogant monsters like Dianne “Wife Of The War Profiteer” Feinstein? Or to call on Tom “More Cluster Bombs For Tel Aviv” Lantos, who smugly admits that he has “two good ears for the Israel lobby, and none for the bleeding heart appeasers” ?

You might as well advise the faithful to:

Call Or Write The Fuhrer And Ask Him To Stop The Mass Killing In The East, By The Einzatzgruppen

Call Albert Speer And Ask Him To Stop Killing Slave Laborers In The Todt Org And In The Munitions Factories

Please take a moment to consider how many times you’ve already been betrayed by the likes of Ted “Kopecne” Kennedy, Jay “Son Of Rockefeller Drug Laws” Rockefeller, Nancy “Morgen Stern” Pelosi, and Harry “Crooked Land Deals Apology” Reid. When they’re not fooling you deliberately gullible folks with empty promises, your sly heroes sell crack to school children, and they pimp their arthritic grandmothers to Saudi oil sheiks who chortle with delight as criminals are maimed and beheaded (in lavish public exhibitions) in their happy country. They use your precious tax dollars to send illegal munitions of mass murder to a racist, apartheid country with a terrible human rights record. It doesn’t bother them that you live with rotting teeth because you can’t afford a dentist…they’ll vote for more ‘black budget’ for the NSA instead, no matter how much misery they see in their own home towns.

Does it do any good to call/write a Capitol Hill sociopath? Telling Nancy PeLousy to turn her back on the AIPAC money…you might as well attempt to convince Scientologists that there’s no such being as “Xenu,” and that OT VII persons actually *can’t* travel through time and turn lead into gold?

Would someone please look up the definition of ‘futility’ and take it to heart?

I agree with Steny Hoyer. If the telecoms want immunity, then they must first confess what they did. Then, like with other truth comissions, they are granted immunity only for what they confess. If other illegal activity comes to light, then they are held liable for that.

Senator Burr’s office states that he “has not released a statement” and is considering the bill. I weighed in as heavily as I could. He might not be lost completely – unlike Dole, his brain has not completely atrophied.