If you missed Marcy’s and Jane’s excellent live-blogging [starting here] of yesterday’s House Oversight Committee hearing on Blackwater, but watched last night’s television news, you might conclude from questions by ABC’s Gibson and CNN’s Blitzer that the hearing focused on whether it’s more cost-effective to use Blackwater mercenaries or the US military to guard US officials. But you’d be wrong.
Or perhaps you caught the embarrassing clip of Chris Shays using the hearing to praise Blackwater for being “100 percent perfect” in protecting US officials; it never dawned on the clueless Shays that Blackwater’s shoot first and keep driving tactics and the arrogance of its US clients might have spurred a 100 other deadly attacks on US soldiers. He couldn’t grasp that a primary reason for the hearing was to expose the fact that the US State Department had been “100 percent perfect” in shielding its bodyguards from criminal investigations. It’s about the coverup, stupid.
The networks mentioned Blackwater’s CEO testimony, and each had file clips of the recent killings. [See today's NYT coverage for new details] But none of the tv coverage probed the US government’s responsibility.
On PBS’ NewsHour, Judy Woodruff covered the absence of accountability for Blackwater employees, but her story ended before testimony from State Department officials. When she interviewed Chairman Henry Waxman and Ranking Member Tom Davis, the discussion again focused on cost-effectiveness. “Are we getting our money’s worth from Blackwater,” she asked? Waxman doubted we are, and Davis thought we should ask the GAO. Well, that should mollify the Iraqis.
Had these reporters covered the State Department officials’ evasions, viewers would have learned that despite numerous Blackwater shootings/killings, none of State’s officials could say that the Department had ever done anything to hold its mercenaries accountable. That was true even though Blackwater’s CEO testified the company had fired employees for unjustified killings and even though the Commitee staff reported State officials had helped Blackwater, allowing Blackwater to whisk trigger happy employees out of the country.
Homicides are crimes, even if the victims are Iraqis. Do the media not see that those who help the suspects escape may also be criminally implicated? Or if the law is unclear, is not someone in the US government responsible for allowing this dangerous legal black hole to persist? Wake up, media.
Blackwater is implicated in killing dozens of people, but not one of the responsible employees has ever faced criminal investigation or prosecution. The US State Department is responsible for referring possible criminal actions by its contractors to the US Justice Department for possible criminal investigations and prosecutions. But it had never happened.
The only time the State Department asked the FBI to investigate was this week, two weeks after the incident that saw 17 Iraqis killed. The most likely reason for that very late FBI referral was to allow the State Department witnesses and the Committee Republicans to argue that since there was an “ongoing investigation,” the House Committee should not ask, and Administration officials should not answer, any questions about the recent killings. So every time the Committee tried to probe the incident, the State Department officials claimed they couldn’t answer the questions. Sound familiar?
Even in this highly sensitive case, State Department has dithered with joint investigations that haven’t even met. They’ve allegedly withheld evidence from Congressional investigators. In past cases, they’ve covered up incidents, and helped alleged perpetrators exit the country. It doesn’t take a criminal law expert to recognize that we’re looking at possible participation in a criminal coverup of multiple homicides by senior officials in the US State Department.
And if any in the media still think we’re doing something worthwhile by occupying Iraq with 160,000 troops and thousands of armed mercenaries, why are they not asking about the effect on the US military mission? Have our best-intentioned soldiers’ efforts to win over Iraqis been seriously undermined by what Iraqis undoubtedly see as unjustified killings of their citizens by reckless mercenaries, followed by indifference, lack of official accountability and even complicity by the highest levels of the US government?
Maybe it would help the media to think of having FEMA hire Blackwater to maintain “order” and protect FEMA officials from angry US citizens after a natural disaster and having them start recklessly shooting Americans, while Homeland Security officials looked the other way and covered it up. Would the media then be worried about whether it costs more to use mercenaries than soldiers?
Photo: Blackwater USA contractors actively involved in defending a position in 2004. The images were taken by Spanish freelance photographer Gervasio Sanchez and were made available to The Associated Press Tuesday, October 2, 2007. (AP Photo/Gervasio Sanchez)
Related posts:
- Blackwater Bribed Iraqi Officials After Nissour Square Massacre
- Gates and Crowley Need to Lead in Wake of Big Media Failure
- Scahill: Blackwater Rent-an-Assassin Service Integral to Bush Counterterrorism Plan
- Report Confirms Poor Electrical Work by KBR Endangers US Troops in Iraq and Afghanistan
- Crazy Pete Hoekstra (R-Blackwater)





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yo
Good Morning everybody!
Recon by fire.
I wonder who was providing security for the Polish diplomat?
Rep. John Tierney D-Mass on CSPAN discussing Blackwater and yesterday’s hearing…
raven @ 4
I was wondering the same thing.
Probably ex-spetznatz guys, what is Blackwater in Polish?
nonplussed @ 7
Kielbasanoir?
“By a 2 to 1 margin, those who see little accomplishment in Congress’s first nine months blame the inaction on Bush and the GOP more than they do the majority Democrats.” – Dan Froomkin
Wake up, media!
seriously wtf. Yet another marketing makeover.
Tierney just had to say he couldn’t answer the question about who was Blackwater guarding the day of the recent massacre because of the conveniently timed FBI investigation. He did say it was Department of State personnel.
If Blackwater is armed-guarding US government officials and representatives, who’s going to criticize them?
Elliott @ 11
who’s going to criticize Blackwater?
(to be clearer)
Elliott @ 11
The old “ongoing investigation” ploy. Calling Inspector Clouseau!
oh and Good Morning Scarecrow!
happy birthday twȝk!
selise @ 15
Thanks!
well apparently mofodo is on the story so we can all relax………….oh right
war profiteers and mercenaries. these were once anathema to the politcal mainstream, not to mention the public at large. now, the serious people embrace them, and the conversation is about their efficiency and return on investment.
could someone explain where the shame went in our lives? has the relentless forcefeeding of white-is-black, down-is-up permanently poisoned the pool of values from which we all drink?
sadly, this doesn’t change even if the reins of power slip from reps to dems. this looks like it’s here forever.
jeremy scahill on democracy now! discussing blackwater.
SC thanks for the update on the MSM’s coverage of the hearings. Sad to say that I am not surprised that they focused on the “cost effectiveness” instead of WHO CAN HOLD BLACKWATER ACCOUNTABLE for their very serious indiscriminate killing, that was the main focus of the hearing. Very Very sad.
Will be checking to see what Matthews had on about the hearing.
You are so right Jane, Marcy and Chs blogging on this very serious issue was outstanding.
Did you catch Tierney say that he was in on a closed session on Iran yesterday?
twȝk @ 16
Happy Happy Birthday. Hope you are doing something special for yourself!
dmg @ 18
“Everything changed after 9-11″. After watching the Ken Burns series I am just amazed at what a bunch of chicken-shit motherfuckers the people in this country have become.
dmg @ 18
We need a new amendment for a separation of Corp. and State!
Good morning everyone.
Rep. John Tierney (D. Mass) on Washington Journal.
The hearings were barely a story
right behind how stupid Britney Spears and Congressional Democrats are…
Kathleen @ 22
Thanks! I am. Reading the rise of The New Media :)
twȝk @ 24
you’re right tw3k!
Capitalism is a pure religion for some. It may be time to do just that.
exactly, scarecrow!
and not to sound like a
a broken record, here, but
your analysis is exactly why,
in just under two minutes, my
“nightly nolo” of last night
covered the line of questioning
followed by rep. jan schakowsky,
on why it has taken five years to
BEGIN oversight of the mercenaries;
as well as the line of questioning
offered by rep. elijah cummings, as
to why blackwater officers would be
delighted to falsely pin their druken
employee’s cold-blooded murder of the
guard to the iraqi vice president on
our own troops — to take the “heat off”.
sickening, all of it.
p e a c e
The premise that ‘homocides are crimes’ doesn’t hold for American public opinion when it comes to killing people abroad, especially brown-skinned people. We are still in an Indian War mentality with respect to the Occupation. The average American can’t understand why those people just don’t get back on the Reservation where they belong, and let us get back to the real work of taking their oil.
The problem is that the mentality infects Democrats as much as it does Republicans. The whole world is beginning to understand this, and as it sinks in, the blow-back will be terrible.
God help us. Nobody else is going to.
I forgot that I had watched this last night on Hardball. Chris had Robert Greenwald of “Iraq for Sale” on last night responding to Blackwater and the hearing. He also has Frank Gaffney on, and we know where he stands.
Damn fair coverage. Watch for yourselves
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/
Scroll to Blackwater hearing.
Kathleen @ 20
Well, they did provide clips of the Blackwater CEO’s testimony, and background clips showing destroyed cars in Baghdad — but what struck me was the media’s inability to see how the Iraqis must view these incidents. 17 of their people were killed, and Judy is wondering if we got our money’s worth. The arrogance and indifference were just stunning — and then it was repeated on CNN and ABC.
CBS appeared to have the longest segment on the hearings last night between the big three. Must have been three minutes!
twȝk @ 24
yes we do. but i have a better chance of winning the lottery than that ever happening.
gee, i guess there’s an upside to everything.
Wonderful post, but I would take the concern even further. The U.S. taxpayers have financed an extremist, right wing, Christianist militia that is very analogous to the Shiite militias of Iraq or the Hezbollah or Christian sectarian militias of Lebanon. At this point this private army has seen limited duty within the United States, but it would not surprise me to see that change if the war in Iraq ever ends, especially if the Republicans are still in office.
On Chris Matthews “Hardball” Frank Gaffney really spins the hearings saying that the hearings were mostly focused on our reps saying “thank you” to Blackwater. Clearly Frank did not watch the hearings.
Robert Greenwald focuses on the serious issues, oversight, morality, cost, over reach.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/
If you have not seen Robert Greenwalds film “Iraq for Sale”. It is really worthwhile
http://iraqforsale.org/
dmg @ 18
Penny wise and pound foolish, as we used to say. I had a dinner conversation last night on a similar topic, and the ‘efficiency’ argument came up. One of the really damaging things about a college education is that students who take a course in economics 101 (which I teach) learn the ideology but not the economics. It’s easy to talk about efficiency, and economists have developed a whole system of thought to isolate that question from the larger issues of equity and social efficiency. So what students take away is a very simplified and misunderstood version of the proposition.
It’s like my old teacher and hero James Tobin used to say: it takes a heap of Harber Triangles (measures of efficiency loss) to come up to a basis point in the unemployment rate.
Big things are bigger than small things. It seems obvious. I don’t understand why most people don’t get it.
dmg @ 34
707! But, but, then you’d have yours *g
Knut Wicksell @ 30
this is exactly spot-on, knut.
and it seems not to matter that
blackwater was even murdering officials
of the government we claim we are there
to protect — and nurture — as a flame
of freedom in an oppressive
blackBROWN night of terror. . .
uhm. . .
“r-i-i-i-i-i-i-ght“.
next bed-time story?
iran iran i-ran. . . eye-ran.
sad — but likely true.
Scarecrow @ 32
I wish someone could get the numbers of Iraqi dead in the last Blackwater incident accurately.
I have read 9, 11, 17 and 20. We sure can’t count Iraqi dead accurately. What is the problem here?
selise @ 19
Thanks for the heads-up…….hope to catch it noonish.
Elliott @ 21
Yep!
Elliott @ 33
It wasn’t bad, as far as it went. It never got to the State responsibility.
This is another of those Condi Rice moments: “no one could have anticipated this would happen,” . . . even though it already had on several occasions and State Dept officials helped cover it up. The administration is lucky that the media was distracted by the Blackwater CEO.
Robert Paehlke @ 35
Just listened to the Hardball coverage on the Blackwater hearing again. Robert Greenwald just said that Gates is pushing for a “non compete clause” in new rules being pushed for contractors. So Blackwater would have the market cornered? Sick
The hearing with Goldsmith now on C-Span2.
twȝk @ 38
yes, but i’d be a really good richies.
you know, one of those who give the doorman and maid big tips at the holidays.
Waccamaw @ 44
thanks!
we can’t get it right, because
as erik prince testified yesterday,
blackwater people never stick
around to aid the wounded — or
even count — the casualties.
for what it is worth, the nytimes.com
now puts it at 17 dead; 24 wounded on
september 16, 2007.
p e a c e
dmg @ 45
I’m sure you’d be much much better than that :)
Like lobbying for public financing of elections.
Kathleen @ 43
Kathleen,
Gates’ call for a “non-compete” clause is to stop Blackwater from raiding the active military. It would mean the soldiers would not be allowed to walk out of the Army on Friday and into a job with Blackwater on Monday. It would NOT mean that Blackwater has cornered the marketplace.
Gates is trying to protect the Army from Blackwater, not protect Blackwater from DynCorp and CACI
gah, I actually agree with browback on china!
Oh, Jeez. CNN running a story of some hapless store owner who flew both the Mexican and US flags, on the same pole, Mexico on top — not knowing the rules – just trying to attract Hispanic customers. Lou Dobbs will demagogue on this for weeks.
Scarecrow @ 42
I think it would have been a different hearing if there hadn’t been that conveniently timed FBI investigation. Isn’t that the real reason that called Prince, to address that incident in particular? I could be wrong there
If it were to be a hearing on Contracting, there would have been more CEOs there.
And I’d like to see the timeline on how that FBI investigation came about.
Meanwhile in Iraq, the Polish diplomat was seriously injured in an attack on his convoy.
Perhaps all that boasting by Blackwater is seen as a “bring it on” moment.
-GSD
Has it occured to anyone that media outlets have people in Iraq. And those people are probably very afraid to offend Blackwater lest an accident (incident) occur.
Scarecrow @ 51
That’s actually a rule?
ohcomeon @ 54
Yeah, I was wondering about that.
twȝk @ 55
Flag Etiquette
twȝk @ 55
Mickey Kaus will use it as evidence that they want to overthrow the government and restore California as a Mexican state. This is one of his big fears about immigration.
twȝk @ 55
AS CNN explained, when flying more than one country’s flag, each gets it’s own pole and is flown at the same height; same size flags.
Elliott @ 33
30 minutes on democracy now!
what would the world be like if americans got their non-local news from amy goodman 5 days a week?
twȝk @ 48
public financing and/or a restoration of equal time requirements policed by an active fcc; and and overturn of the true genesis of mcuh of what ails this nation’s discourse, the supcourt ruling finding that corporations have political free-speech “rights” — everything follows from that one horrid decision.
Elliott @ 57
Is it law tho?
I didn’t see the entire hearing but when Prince was asked about for instance the body-guard-killer, he told that the killer was fired and fined for handling a gun after having consumed alcohol, not for the murder.
Another mercenary was fired because he was caught in lying about another incident, not because of the incident itself.
Scarecrow @ 59
Flag rules and regulations
edit: guess i was a little slow with that…
dmg @ 61
I’ll come work for then :)
selise @ 60
the world would be a much better place!
twȝk @ 62
scroll down to section titled “Flag Code”
Executive Orders about the flag. Sounds like a free country to me. snark
twolf1 @ 64
That Jasper Johns flag is one of my favorite flags. It’s at the Witney.
Willem van Oranje @ 63
I thought that testimony was a dodge. The CEO argued that they couldn’t deal with the possible crime, because they’re not the Justice department. so the firings are for violation of company rules, not for committing a crime.
Elliott @ 21
no. but there was a house intelligence committee meeting yesterday: “Full Committee Brief – Iran” and tierney is a member.
i didn’t put this meeting on the list since it was a closed meeting.
dakine01 @ 49
Thanks for your opinion it is an interesting one. I will certainly do more reading about the issue so that my opinion is more well informed. This was the first time that I had heared that Gates is pushing for a “non compete clause”.
Waccamaw @ 44
excellent! that means it will be in their archive and that more people will get to see it (more than those of us who watched the live feed).
Elliott @ 67
Well, sh?t, there goes my claim of ignorance.
twȝk @ 74
oops
too bad §3. Use of flag for advertising purposes; is limited to the District of Columbia.
Another one of the big issues during the hearing (besides the ACCOUNTABILITY issue) was whether Blackwater had been hiring non-Americans to work for BW and their “alleged” criminal histories. The question as to whether this is legal or not came up again and again.
I also heard the “War Crimes Act “brought” up several times.
I would like the House/or Senate to follow up on Blackwater’s possible use of genoicidal serbs, wanted war criminal, including/and Pinochets men. Plus in-depth examinatino of it’s hiring tactics. Job Fairs in Hungary? Be all you can be in Iraq? I’d like the House/or Senate (I prefer Waxman’s committee) to ask for an exmplar of hiring documentation culled frm Chile. (If they falsify, trip prince up). I don’t believe the kinds of background checks are quite the same as say working for a state-funded nursery school. One way or another I suspect Prince and a host of others deserve long jail time.
Money? Who gives a rats damn about money. The real cost is human life. And let us not forget the perception of Americans being a bunch of kill for cash crazies. What a bloody mess.
As for the money part well ALL books from a murder for money corp. should be transparent if such companies are to be permitted.
I was utterly disgusted with the chicken sh** goopers and their fawning praise of prince’s pirates.
OT was watching Jon Stewart the other night and he had a clip of faux news. My wife and I had never seen faux before and were amazed. It is no bloody wonder that most ‘mercuns are stupid and ill informed if this is what they see every night for news.
Any good news out there?
twȝk @ 74
Ant the proper way to dispose of a flag?
Kathleen @ 72
even tho Prince insisted that the high contractor salaries were NOT causing US servicemen to leave the military to work for Blackwater, et al. But that the Secretary of Defense needs to set up non-compete clauses screams how wrong this privatizing armed services is.
I used to send out a lot of stuff to friends who use main stream media as their source of news. Now I only do it about every week or so and try to pick out the worst rumor/gossip item and the most dishonest coverage of a story.
raven @ 80
707! It’s a singelton!
nomolos @ 79
Isnt it true since the Clinton era, people don’t like to talk humanity. They like to hear numbers and cost-effectiveness. I went through this in ******* school. Are numbers really the only thing that move people? Or is that just some “general wisdom”, that is really only part of the story? Something we learn from management type “gurus”.
Good morning Scarecrow!
is dKos not loading for anybody else?
nomolos@79
Maybe we should phrase it the wanton killing of Iraqi “human resources,” for the non-humane crowd to understand.
I’m planning on having a big party the neighbours might not like.
I need to shut them up.
I’d also like Ben’s garage and the pine grove belonging to the Johnson’s that hits my property line.
Can Blackwater help me?
oh and the library down the street has some super old manuscripts I’d like to get my hands on.
“Maybe it would help the media to think of having FEMA hire Blackwater to maintain “order” and protect FEMA officials from angry US citizens after a natural disaster and having them start recklessly shooting Americans, while Homeland Security officials looked the other way and covered it up. Would the media then be worried about whether it costs more to use mercenaries than soldiers?”
Just tuned in . This might have been said already. Prince kept asserting that Balckwater was only licensed to work for the US Govt. Has anyone ever determined who hired them to “protect” New Orleans in the wake of Katrina?
Scarecrow @ 70
So let me get this straight: Blackwater can kill anyone else they believe is a threat, and answer to no one for their actions, but they can’t put one of their own in a nice room and hold them for a couple of hours until the Bagdahd office of the DOJ sends someone over?
Shorter Prince: “We have unlimited power, except we don’t.”
mui @ 87
Nah, if you are going the B-school route, they’d have to be referred to as Iraqi “human assets”.
nomolos @ 79
At one point Erik Prince actually said “it’s not just about the money”. What horseshit! They actually fine people for killing an innocent Iraqi and then the quilty person
what did Prince say has to “choose between an aisle and window seat” for the ride home
Jesus Mary and Joseph that’s what the punishment is for for killing an innocent Iraqi? What was the amount paid to the Iraqi family who loses and innocent person $5000.00. How insane!
Then one of the Senators did the “ballpark” math on the amount that Prince said that BW Profitted last year (One Billion) Prince had said earlier that he makes around 10% profit One million a year was the “ballpark” figure for Prince. Prince squirmed and avoided this one and seemed to get rather pissed until he was reminded by the Senator asking the question (and one of his lawyers) that this was Americans tax payers money coming at him.
Nah “it’s not just about the money for Prince”. It’s about the Love that he gets to share with the Iraqi people.
Mabel’s Wig Shack @ 88
MISUSE OF APOSTROPHE MEANS YOUR HEALTH COVERAGE IS SUSPENDED PLEASE HAVE POLICY FORMS READY BY 3:00 PM TO HAND OVER TO BLACKWATER UNIT ‘PATROLLING’ YOUR NEIGHBOURHOOD
twȝk @ 86
Doesn’t load for me either – and I blame the Lieberman campaign.
Scarecrow, after listening to Shays talk about his Peace corps experience and the importance of non-uniformed personnel(with big guns?!?) as checking the populace and not stirring them as being rationale for Blackwater ops, I just signed up over at Himes’ website. Shays has gotta go.
mui @ 87
My basic argument to people who show no regard to the human cost of the war has been strictly financial. Sadly, it makes the point.
But they were deployed there, right?
The blog casts the major news media as negligent in its coverage of the Blackwater hearings, but frankly the hearings didn’t provide much fodder for them to use. It was pretty weak stuff for such a serious issue. You have to admit that these hearings have been badly managed. It’s a very weakened Congress, after all. There are too few good people in it.
JML @ 89
He said he could work anywhere with clearnce from state dept. Quite a difference from “working for the US Govt.”
Scarecrow, thank you for putting this horrific lawless slaughter of civilians into some kind of perspective.
NICE MAN gives me candy.
NICE MAN shoots daddy.
NICE MAN lays down withering crossfire.
NICE MAN defends freedom.
Toby Wollin @ 91
What’s B-School route?
mui @ 87
“contractors”, “human resources”, “packages” “passed away” “passed on” etc, etc, etc.
Euphemisms annoy the hell out of me
twolf1 @ 94
I was wondering about that.
nomolos @ 102
Me too!
twȝk @ 86
no and i tried to go in via another ‘link’ but no go.
Can we get Glenn Greenwald, Jane & Christy, Steve Colbert, David Schuster and Digby to do some of the congressional grillings?
The folks we elected don’t seem up to the job.
-GSD
Are we getting our money’s worth?
Did the dead Iraqi civilians get their money’s worth?
Until we stop treating Iraqis like worthless pieces of shit, we aren’t going to succeed in Iraq.
The arrogance that the Blackwater man displayed yesterday during his testimony was appalling. The government should have no further dealing with that company of hired thugs.
There should be zero tolerance by our government for the kinds of actions Blackwater has repeatedly engaged in.
Through its repeated cover-ups, the State Department is complicit in Blackwater’s crimes. They have looked the other way whenever an incident has occured. They have stonewalled. This is not how government should work.
Our government cannot afford to be represented by an organization that has a license to kill and no accountability.
It’s wrong! Do something, Congress!
JML @ 89
Chertoff
nomolos @ 108
water damage specialists
mui @ 101
Sorry – B-School route refers to the “thinking” that people get into when they’ve been put through “Business School” or an MBA. Where I went, human beings were referred to as “human assets” and believe it or not, in one of my accounting classes, we actually discussed “human asset accounting” (which was actually sort of neat because it took into effect the value that people bring to an organization based on things other than just revenues they bring in if they are sales people, etc.).
CalGeorge @ 107
Didn’t prince says something like $2500 was compensation for an Iraqi life to family. When it was mentioned one family of deceased Blackwater family only got $25,000, Cmmtte made a stink.
twolf1 @ 94
Not loading. Must be Lieberman
alank @ 97
i didn’t listen to all of yesterday’s hearing, so maybe this is wrong (please correct me if so)… but i think that’s usually true when the hearings have unfriendly witnesses. most of the congressmember suck at asking good questions and doing follow up.
on the other hand, hearings with friendly witnesses have been much better. for example the 9/21 dpc hearing on blackwater was, i think, far superior to yesterday’s hearing.
Toby Wollin @ 109
Hmmm my grad experience was a little behind (THANK goddess). Asset almost sounds like antebellum south.
nomolos @ 79
John Stewart
mui @ 110
I think BW pays $5000,oo for an innocent Iraqi life. This is so f—ing sick.
Toby Wollin @ 109
But still valuable if your accounting is to be presented to the iciest of ice-cold hearts. And unfortunately that is not just in Blackwater.
katherine Graham Cracker @ 82
I did as well, but all that happened was everyone became convinced I was a Left wing reactionary and began avoiding me. The short answer is that most people don’t give a shit-they are “too busy”.
It did take care of that cluttered in-box and annoying social schedule, though. I have virtually unlimited time to devote to the internet and watching Congress.
kathleen @ 115
Hmm so maybe they have a payscale, How do blackwater shooters & management decide between $2500 and $5000. I heard $2500. But I bet it depends.
As I understand it, there are over 100,000 contractors in Iraq. Blackwater provides about 800 of them. I’m sure mighty curious about who’s running all the others…
You would think that with the technology available today, Congress wouldn’t need to go to Iraq. What did it cost the American taxpayers to have Lieberman don a vest and go to market?
Professor Foland @ 119
Someone in Cmmtte forget who, asked Prince why such and such a contractor treated their subcontracted like actual employees with health insurance, etc. Prince couldn’t answer. But I’m sure Blackwater sorta employees are not the only ones receiving ill treatment. I wonder if Prince includes subcontracted in his numbers.( ca. 1,000 were Prince’s numbers of actual employees I think.)
Professor Foland @ 119
HimmlerCheneyCan you imagine the two Democratic fron runners doing something like this?
Former President Carter got in a shouting match Wednesday with Sudanese security officials who blocked him from a town in Darfur where he was trying to meet representatives of ethnic African refugees from the ongoing conflict.
The 83-year-old Carter walked into this highly volatile pro-Sudanese government town to meet refugees too frightened to attend a scheduled meeting at a nearby compound.
Carter was able to make it to a school where he met with one tribal representative and was preparing to go further into the town when Sudanese security services interrupted.
“You can’t go. It’s not on the program!” the local security chief, who only gave his first name as Omar, yelled at Carter, who is in Darfur as part of a delegation of respected international figures known as “The Elders.”
“We’re going to anyway!” an angry Carter retorted, telling security officers they didn’t have the authority to stop him.
What are we thinking? We can’t expect the “Villagers” to go after Blackwater. To be a Blackwater mercenary is a neocon Villager’s dream come true: you get to play GI Joe like you are in the real Army except you don’t have to deal with the rules, accountability and shitty living conditions; you get paid 10 times more than the grunts in olive green, you can quit when you want, and if you murder someone while playing Rambo, all you will face is a ticket home for early retirement. Best of all, once you get home, you can brag that you “served” in the Iraq War. No one within the Village is going to mess with this sweet deal.
On an off topic note – anyone know what’s going on at Daily Kos? I’ve tried several ISPs and I can’t bring the website up. Anyone else having problems?
Please don’t tell me that the Democratic ‘leadership’ of my party isn’t aware of Blackwater’s dirty laundry.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 123
no
Professor Foland @ 120
The numbers keep shifting. Of the 100,000 contractors, only a fraction are “security” forces, and only some of those are Blackwater. Two weeks ago, I was seeing estimates of the number of security force contractors around 20,000 to 30,000. Yesterday, I saw one story say it was 10,000, and another say it was 50,000. Apparently, nobody really knows. You’d think we could at least get an accurate count of those hired by State Department and Defense Department and/or other US agencies.
The focus has been on Blackwater protection of US diplomats, but the large contingent of US State and AID official engaged in “reconstruction teams” all over the country all use private security contracts. I haven’t seen anything indicating they’re from Blackwater or some other company. Or how many there are in this role — that matters because the surge’ “success” was said to depend on these reconstruction teams, but no one counted their security guys as part of the surge troops — even though as a practical matter, they are.
And the gutless coward Bush won’t even stand in front of a group of people who haven’t been pre-screened.
Jimmy Carter for President.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 126
“what’s that? huh? oh my look at that sky. yep. gonna sprinkle later. nice talkin’ to ya. gotta fly.”
but ms. pelosi i had other questions…
Scarecrow @ 128
State dept has a list of security companies doing business in Iraq. Don’t see Blackwater. Do see custer battles.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 125
lol
did you see the DPC hearing? the one where reid asked “who’s KBR?”
This is capitalism run amok. Privatise …. privatise …. privatise …. ad infinitum, including military power. One day, Iraq won’t be there, Iran will will be regardless, and Blackwater will have to come home. What is the USA going to do with a bunch of trigger happy mercs, very probably totally unhinged (even more so after all this than they were to start off with)? Looking at all this from the outside, this should be a policy issue – you need to cope with this legacy – what are you going to do?
I say I’m from outside looking in – I’m an Aussie.
SteveNS @ 128
I bet he would be damn good the second time around.
nonplussed @ 118
I did the same. Now I have a blog and they can read it or not.
John Edwards response to Hillary Clintons yes vote on the Kyl/Lieberman amendment.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/
Scroll down to “are we going to war with Iran”
“But I want to come back to a discussion that took place a few minutes ago to make everyone understands what Senator Gravel is talking and Senator Clinton was talking about. Because there was a very important vote cast in the United States Senate today. And it was, basically, in a resolution calling the Iranian Revolutionary Guard a terrorist organization.
I voted for this war in Iraq, and I was wrong to vote for this war. And I accept responsibility for that. Senator Clinton also voted for this war.
We learned a very different lesson from that. I have no intention of giving George Bush the authority to take the first step on a road to war with Iran.
And I think that vote today, which Senator Biden and Senator Dodd voted against, and they were correct to vote against it, is a clear indication of the approach that all of us would take with the situation in Iran because what I learned in my vote on Iraq was you cannot give this president the authority and you can’t even give him the first step in that authority because he cannot be trusted.”
Another clip of Edwards saying no to the Kyl Lieberman amendment
http://astrogirlguides.blogspot.com/
Professor Foland @ 119
Not all the contractors in Iraq are security contractors. There are construction workers, truck drivers, cooks, laundry people. All fall under the umbrella of “contractor.” One of the by-products of the downsizing is that most of the traditional support functions that used to be done by active military personnel has now been contracted out.
Here’s a state dept. list of design build and general contractor. Plus tips.
selise @ 131
You have to be kidding me. KBR obviously did not send reid any money….an error that must be corrected
dakine01 @ 137
How could we forget the contractor that charged $5.00 for bottled water or ice cream or something like that. Plus dirty meals by Halliburton
Good morning, everyone! I have spotlighted this article to a number of local newspapers “in light of” the proposed Blackwater facility to be built in San Diego. I do not want these people in my state!
selise @ 113
There were some tough questions. The full hearing is worth the watch so that you can determine for yourself.
http://www.c-span.org/
peanutbutter @ 141
Don’t blame you.
Christy has a new thread:
Limbaugh Kicked The Wrong Hornet’s Nest
selise @ 113
The really pointed questions are asked by chief counsels, but none has participated in the interrogatories, afaik.
nomolos @ 139
i recorded the audio. and have listened to much of it. and yes there were some ok questions. but how much new info was revealed?
have you seen the DPC hearing? no comparison imo.
Okay, I am sitting here next to my french doors looking out on the most beautiful crisp october morning. Sun is shining, my oaks are starting to turn. Life is good. I am listening to wonderful commercial free digital music. My kids have left for school, and there is no crises. I have meetings starting at noon and only one client today. In essence, this is heaven. *sigh* gratitude.
But every post I read this morning about blackwater brings a feeling in my gut that makes me literally sick. I feel powerless. I feel like I did when I was 9 and learned the neighbors son had been drafted. I think why do I do this to myself? Why do I need to know that my government is corrupt, and that democracy is gone. Where is the peace and serenity in this truth about my country? Where is my path and purpose? Keep moving. Keep seeking peace in my own life. Pray for those who take lives and those whose lives are taken. Pray for the leaders who left us here. Live and make as much peace and love as I can in my own life.
I cannot control the war in Iraq, my leaders, the greed of this nation. I just don’t have the power. But I can control me and my reaction to this reality.
Sorry…I needed a pep talk. Go out and make peace with someone!! Go out and love somebody!!
New thread/post from Christy.
alank @ 145
well then, i blame the committee chairs for the lack of chief counsel participation.
katie Jensen @ 147 –
what you said.
sadly, the peace that comes with delusion, denial and lack of concern for our fellow humans is a false peace. the only peace i know to work for is the peace that comes from facing the truth.
Hmm. all the KellogBrownRoot listings have halliburton email contacts. I thought Halliburton had more subcontractors.
My favorite “WTFmoment” was when Issa tried to “slime” the proceedings as a Democratic witch-hunt and it backfired.
Biggest laugh of the day, by what I saw.
It’s already happened.
Above from Greg Palast
selise @ 146
Thanks for the link to the audios. They should produce podcasts of hearings. Realaudio should be abandoned everywhere. Flogging the format is tantamount to spreading a virus.
I’m interested in the numbers: Of our approximately 160,000 troops in Iraq how many are in combat positions and how many are support? What are the equivalent numbers of the contractors? The reason I ask is that sometimes I hear the argument that there aren’t that many contractors who are doing active security.
from truthout.org
Go to Original
Blackwater Contractor Wrote Government Report on Incident
CNN
Tuesday 02 October 2007
Baghdad, Iraq – The State Department’s initial report of last month’s incident in which Blackwater guards were accused of killing Iraqi civilians was written by a Blackwater contractor working in the embassy security detail, according to government and industry sources.
A source involved in diplomatic security at the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad said a Blackwater contractor, Darren Hanner, drafted the two-page “spot report” on the letterhead of the Bureau of Diplomatic Security for the embassy’s Tactical Operations Center.
scarecrow, I am way late to this, and I have said it here before, but the Blackwater incident in Fallujah (with the contractors’ bodies burned, etc.) was predicated on the same type of incident (firing into the crowd) that happened recently, the one that led to this hearing.
This has never been reported.
I have a very good source on this. Just FYI.
alank @ 154
i agree about format… and even more importantly (to me anyway) is the lack of archives on many committee websites. that’s why i try to make audio recordings and post them so folks can download mp3s.
but there’s good news on the horizon (at least at first for house committee hearings)… that we should have dvd quality archives available that can be used to generate other formats (youtube clips, mp3s, etc). (more on this here)
bg @ 157
there have been multiple reports of firing into peaceful protesting crowds and mass casualities in faluja since april 2003. do you have information on an unreported incident? if so, when did it occur?
What? The traditional print and broadcast media has failed the public again? Say it ain’t so! Do we expect these collaborationists to tell the truth?
Another in an endless string of horrible and misleading
“reporting”.
Thank god for the blogs.
As I ask in every case with every hearing: So what? Congress is impotent. I might as well not exist. When they DO uncover evidence of wrongdoing the media hides it, the Repubs dispute it, and finally the Dems back down. It’s the same dance EVERY TIME. No one is EVER held accountable much less punished. I say dissolve congress and let Bush rule. He will anyway. No matter what these fools in congress say or do. Face it, we been coup’d. In the immortal words of Mel Brooks: ‘Springtime for George Bush and America’. Or was it Hitler? Oh, well, same difference.
selise, Unreported in the incident of the 4 contractors who died in Fallujah when they were “ambushed” by an angry mob and killed, then burned and strung up on that bridge, THAT incident, is that they were leaving the scene of an incident and did what they often do (according to my source). That is, they open the back doors of the vehicles and spray the crowd or anyone around with gunfire as they drive away. In the Fallujah incident, they got stuck in a traffic jam and could not escape the crowd that pursued them after this incident. That is when the crazy sh** happened.
I have a source who I believe on this, who has inside info (ie: Blackwater people who have admitted it.)
bg @ 163
ah, i see. thank you. i guess that explains why blackwater won’t tell the families anything.
Check out coverage in today’s USA Today-totally from the blackwater frame-the headline sets the tone basically accepting Prince’s claims without question.Also,the discussion is described as partisan which immediately suggests purely political motivations behind the hearings.
the hearings were a sham. To sit before congress and talk about spiriting away a murderer the next day…and NOBODY BLINKS>>> This is such a HUGE scandal, I don’t know if the american public can wrap their heads around the fact that this is a Hague-worthy hanging war crime. From Blackwater on up. It is sickening to realize what has happened to this country and the bastards that smearing our good name by butchering innocents to ‘liberate them’. May what exists as a divinity have mercy on us.
Judy Woodruff needs to go back to CNN. She is far below the quality of the rest of the Jim Lehrer reporting. Of course, lately, CNN seems to be dumping all their aging blond, on camera, female employees.
mui @ 122
It was OUR congresscritter, Eleanor Holmes Norton. This is a HUGE question…….Blackwater treats its employees as “independent contractors” thus no FICA, FUTA or MEDICARE payments….no pensions, health insurance, none of those “pesky” employee benefits.
elef @ 155
Well state dept. site has listings of security and non-security (general.) with contact numbers. Maybe you could ask for a brochure or something, the kind investors might get. Halliburton is the boogeyman to me. But some othe brave soul could proabbly do it.
Although DOD probably keeps numbers. I think. I don’t have much confidence in anything anymore.
DN covered the gaps pretty well, with Jeremy Scahill on hand to discuss what was being missed in the hearing.