I know that there are many of you out there who think that the Dove Soap Campaign for Real Beauty, which ostensibly aims to encourage women to re-think the images of “beauty” is, well, kind of a contradiction in terms. After all, here’s a massive corporation trying to sell you beauty products while simultaneously insisting that massive corporations have absolutely no business telling women how they should look and feel. And those nay-sayers would have a point, I guess.
And yet, when I watch their advertisements (the latest, “Onslaught”, via Jezebel, is posted above and you can watch the earlier one, “Evolution”, here), the message is so right-on. “Talk to your daughter,” reads the ad copy, “before the beauty industry does.”
I can’t imagine what it must be like to raise a daughter in this media climate. I just can’t.
I like J. K. Rowling’s take on it, by the way.
Waif-like models were condemned by JK Rowling yesterday as “empty-headed, self-obsessed, emaciated clones”.
The author of the Harry Potter novels said she did not want her daughters, Mackenzie, one, and Jessica, 12, to emulate women whose only function was to support the trade in “over-priced handbags and rat-sized dogs”.
Oh! Ouch!
You know, if those books she writes don’t pan out for her, I think Ms. Rowling could have quite a bright future as a blogger. That’s some weapons-grade snark, right there.
What else does she have to say?
Writing on her website, she revealed that her “rant” was prompted by photographs in a magazine of a very young woman “who is either seriously ill or suffering from an eating disorder”.
She added: “She can talk about eating absolutely loads, being terribly busy and having the world’s fastest metabolism until her tongue drops off (hooray! Another couple of ounces gone!), but her concave stomach, protruding ribs and stick-like arms tell a different story.
“This girl needs help but, the world being what it is, they’re sticking her on magazine covers instead.”
I don’t think I need to run this down for you guys. You know the deal. The world of fashion and fashion publishing (and the movie industry, and TV, and music videos, and on and on) present an ideal of “beauty” that is an image of sickness, of starvation.
It’s disgusting, really. People all over the planet don’t get enough to eat and yet our culture endlessly rewards women like Posh Spice, with her plastic doll body and glassy-eyed, “Please Feed Me” expression. Why would anyone want to emulate that? “Mommy, when I grow up, I want to have comically huge double-D breasts, an 18-inch waist, and a face like an angry monkey!” Mmmmm, what could be more sexy than skin like paper, lifeless hair, limbs like sticks, and bones that jut out of all kinds of places where bones aren’t exactly supposed to jut? (Not to mention things like a crumbling skeleton and organ failure.)
But back to Rowling:
She recounted a conversation with a young actor on the set of the latest Potter film, who was talking about a girl who was called “fat” by classmates, although she was anything but. The author added: “… is ‘fat’ really the worst thing a human being can be? Is ‘fat’ worse than ‘vindictive’, ‘jealous’, ’shallow’, ‘vain’, ‘boring’ or ‘cruel’.”
In other words, is being “fat” worse than being Ann Coulter?
Not to me; but then, you might retort, what do I know about the pressure to be skinny?
Or the pressure to write incredibly shitty books that no one actually reads, which will apparently not just give you the body of a stick insect, but makes you mean as hell. And kind of a psycho.
But that’s another story altogether. You were saying, Ms. Rowling?
“Maybe all this seems funny, or trivial, but it’s really not,” Miss Rowling wrote on her website, jkrowling.com.
“It’s about what girls want to be, what they’re told they should be, and how they feel about who they are.
“I’ve got two daughters who will have to make their way in this skinny-obsessed world, and it worries me, because I don’t want them to be empty-headed, self-obsessed, emaciated clones; I’d rather they were independent, interesting, idealistic, kind, opinionated, original, funny a thousand things, before ‘thin’.”
Yay!!
If I had a daughter, I would tell her something along those lines every day, I think, “I love you just the way you are. You are the most beautiful girl in the world. You don’t need diets, pills, miracle creams, injections, or surgery or any of that bulls*%t to be beautiful. You are perfect and I will always love you no matter what. Now kiss me and then finish your collard greens.”
Period. End of story.
What do you guys think?
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TREX!!!
uno! dos! tres!
BOO!
beautiful cassie!
TRex!!!
Hiya!
drat!
SnarKassandra @ 4
YES! YES! YES! YOU KEEP SAYING THAT, SWEETEST!
evening TRex – i raised my girls to know that true beauty is that which is found within – not the external.
Trex! How’s Tricks?
i just wanna be me, and thin enough to not be fat and sick.
my mom got super thin a year or two after she started drugs and it looks ugly. she was way prettier before that.
TRex, you’re always surpassing yourself. This one I’m emailing upstairs to my own daughter, right now.
Thanks.
james, thanks for letting downstairs know
SnarKassandra @ 4
That’s the spirit!!
hiya suzanne.!
Well, if you’d just settle down with some nice young man and start a family…
;>)
Excellent! Raising girls in this thin-obcessed age seems a nightmare to me. If I hear one more regular sized person refered to as “plus-sized” I will scream! Marilyn Monroe was at least a size 12. She’d never make it today.
The plastic surgery industry is going gangbusters these days.
It is not just about being thin. It is also about being young.
It is hard to age in this culture.
i once heard a minister say that people look best when they are smiling and when they are thinking, not when they are trying to look pretty.
SnarKassandra @ 19
Smart minister. That fits my experience.
NP, Suzanne
Fee fi fo fuhm
I smell the blood of a therapod-um
(well, to be precise, I smelled it last thread, when the clock struck 11 and the refresh circle started spinning)
Suzanne @ 9
Bonne Soir, Ma Cheri, My eldest daughter was tomboyish and actively into sports so I never had to worry, however, my other daughter is a whole ‘nother ball park, she’s girlie-girl and always frets over her appearance! My wife and I are constantly reassuring her she looks fine…!!! *g*
Is it just me, or can one imagine a Congressional resolution condemning J.K. Rowling?
madmommy, marilyn monroe was a full figured size 14 – a size most women today would not admit to being.
EvilDrPuma @ 24
I think she’s great. And I like how Hermione and Ginny and Cho do just as much impressive magic and life-saving as the boys in the books.
EvilDrPuma @ 24
I think hearings should be conducted first.
It’s not just the girls who need a good self-image. Boys must be raised to appreciate girls’ niceness in addition to their bodies.
CTuttle @ 23
Have you seen the Nike “I am an athlete” ads? Numerous female athletes in various sports step up to a giant megaphone and proclaim their girl power.
Funny, I’ve been waiting for a propicious moment to share this.
I have a jar of Noxema deep cleaning stuff in my bathroom. The tag line on the jar reads the same as it did in the 50’s: Make him think that glow is because of him!
Seriously.
But, I still use the product because I like how it works. When I first bought it, I would let that line bother me, being the feminist that I have worked my whole life to be.
Now, I see the tag on the jar and just laugh!
Suzanne @ 25
I wouldn’t throw her out of bed for eating crackers…!!! ;-)
SnarKassandra @ 26
I’ll admit that I have very little exposure to the Harry Potter books, but Rowling shouldn’t take that as a negative. I just end up with so little reading-for-fun time.
Nicely done, TRex. Very nicely done.
I think this is what Fran was alluding to last night, and s/he had a point. Unfortunately, s/he came across as sounding humorless.
I saw an anorexic teenager at the Safeway the other day, and I wanted to cry for her. She was wandering aimlessly around the marked for 15 minutes that I observed. Finally she checked out with a tiny carton of non-fat cottage cheese. It was soooooo sad. Who knows what demons torture her.
There are you-tubes that anorexic girls go to which encourages them. It is on the cusp between freedom of expression and complicity in self-homicide. There are also back-lash vids that present the truth of these seriously sick young women.
Suzanne @ 25
Hot damn, so am I!
Great post, TRex.
Right now, I’m trying to imagine JK Rowling talking with Arianna “On Becoming Fearless” Huffington on helping young girls to grow into fearless women. If they ever got together to write something like that, it would blow away the teen mags in a minute.
[For those who missed it, just over a year ago, Arianna did one of the early FDL Book Salons, which a two week deal at the beginning. Week one was an intro to the subject of the book (w/o the author), and week two was a chat with the author. Powerful stuff!]
Suzanne @ 25
Suzanne, aside from marketing, I believe Marilyn Monroe to be the ultimate example of attitude over looks. Marilyn, on pure looks, was very average, but was transformed into a Goddess by that attitude.
JMHO.
Suzanne @ 25
but haven’t they messed with the sizes since then? So that a 14 in Marilyn’s day would be like an 8 now? I’ve heard that, dunno if it’s true.
Anyway……I am REALLY liking the anti-skinny trend y’all have got going on this thread……please, don’t let me interrupt…!
I have a 14 year old daughter who spends most of her time with her mom. She is a beautiful, energetic girl who rides horses like a champ, plays the piano wonderfully, and is excited about everything.
Her mom is an overachiever, a woman who is a classically trained pianist, a chocolate junkie who’s continually on a diet which, of course, never works, and someone who is very critical of just about everyone around her and vocal about it. Maybe it’s the cop in her (no offense to present company).
My daughter was until this summer not worried about anything; we’d go for ice cream, we’d sit around and eat junk food while watching Alf dvds and Dr, Zhivago with Kiera Knightly. Now all of a sudden she’s concerned with how much weight she’s gaining….and she hasn’t gained anything except 2 ppounds since last September (06).
Now I have to worry that she’s gonna get bitten by the eating disorder bug and I’m concerned. I try having her watch shows about models so she can see how grossly skinny these women are and how beautiful she is by showing by showing her paintings by Botticelli and Raphael so she can see how beautiful a normal woman can be.
CTuttle @ 31
Ummm…I guess I would. You know what they say…a dead girl or a live boy.
Skinny is OK. But so is regular and so is heavy. But too fat messes with your heart and stuff.
oddmommy, the smaller sizes got their numbers made smaller – 10’s became 8’s… to help build the ego trade.
that is not what happened with the larger sizes in my experience.
Laura Doty @ 12
Awwwwwww.
Thanks. And love to your beautiful daughter.
oddmommy @ 37
Let’s face it, once you’ve had a couple of kids you are never gonna have that teenage body again. You may get down to pre-pregnancy weight but you are just shaped differently. Better to embrace what we are uniquely able to do that to fret about the way we used to look. That’s what I tell myself, anyway!
Maybe in England. In Texas lots of Hispanic girls are fat. And pretty. And popular. It isn’t the same as it is with white girls.
OT but a sad passing:
TRex @ 42
; )
No, no, people! Don’t do it! Don’t raise your daughters with self esteem! We avoided imposing body image expectations on her, and now we can’t stop her! She’s doing all sorts of crazy things – starting clubs in high school, getting great grades, and creating immense amounts of art! She isn’t interested in fashion or makeup, and nobody seems to be able to shame or guilt her into anything! God help us, we’ve created A DAUGHTER!
Gotta go. But for the record, they call me Big Mitch because of generosity of spirit, as in the expression, “That’s mighty big of you, Mitch.”
Dinner is being served. See you all later.
EvilDrPuma @ 24
They’re trying that down here in Lower Dumbfuckistan.
the smaller sizes got their numbers made smaller to help build the ego trade.
Oh, Ms.D is just going to love to hear this.
Her mom is an overachiever, a woman who is a classically trained pianist, a chocolate junkie who’s continually on a diet which, of course, never works, and someone who is very critical of just about everyone around her and vocal about it. Maybe it’s the cop in her (no offense to present company)
none taken :)
your ex is setting a bad example with her poor eating habits and the peer pressure kids have now to be ‘perfect’ is terrible. makes me glad i’m not a kid and my girls are now grown up and better equipped to deal with that pressure from society.
It’s all the madness of marketing and finding ways to make money on females.
What an enormous waste of energy and talent and time and resources… the whole beauty and fashion industry. it’s an embarrassment really for an advanced society to be so wasteful, decadent and self absorbed. Really fucked up priorities.
You hardly even see any real hair colors these days either. And whats with tattoos? They are just like graffiti on buildings. They may be interesting but they don’t belong where they end up.
What a plastic artificial culture of copy cats.
Sad.. really sad.
TRex @ 49
What a shame that anybody has time to waste on a “cause” like that.
Evening all. As burns said last night, the thing that really makes women sexy is what is between their ears. As to the Paris Hiltons and Brittanys of the world, sorry but I don’t do domestic livestock.
Aunt Betsy eats sweets but she also eats vegetables and fruits and makes skinless chicken and stuff. And her answer to “Can I have a snack” is always “cucumber or carrots?”. Sweets are for dessert.
SnarKassandra @ 44
For whatever reason, white women seem to have much bigger issues with weight than Hispanic or African American women. Other cultures seem to celebrate the natural curves we are supposed to have much better than white girls do, generally speaking.
DrDick @ 54
And DrDick comes out breathing fire!
Hi Doc.
TRex @ 49
Isn’t she a day late and a dollar short? Does she know that the series is over? Dear Lord, save us from the loonies who take your name in vain.
For the thin body type I just hope I live long enough to see a return of the bias cut full length silk velvet dress.
DrDick @ 54
Again, that’s my experience. I have had some serious crushes on “plain” women who were intelligent and expressed themselves well. And never did have much time for plastic bleached-blondes who always end up looking the same to me.
My 24 year old daughter came home from high school some years ago and told me that the kids the marching band were talking about Looks. Something someone said prompted her to say My mom says I’m pretty.
Here’s a picture of her: here.She has nice enough features and all, but what makes her attractive is her confidence and pleasant outlook.
(okay, i’m biased.)
But, I think we teach our daughters by example as much as by talking to them.
Eureka Springs @ 59
Do you wear dresses?
TRex @ 49
Speaking of…this is Banned Book Week.
SanderO @ 52
I’m not giving up my Miss Clairol! No to plastic surgery and crash diets, but don’t take my hair color!!!
oddmommy @ 37
Depends entirely on how much you spend. The more expensive the label, the smaller the size.
Demi she is pretty!
Lea (no uh) @ 63
“It tells me that goose-stepping morons like yourself should try reading books instead of burning them!”
–Professor Henry Jones, Sr.
Right On Trex!
I’m pleased my daughter introduced me to Laila Ali as a role model (before she took up dancing) – and she’s sure no stick thin clone:
Laila Ali!
Lea (no uh) @ 63
Our school does it next week because this week is the six week tests.
Gonna run.
Early doctor’s appt in the morning.
See y’all in a couple of nights.
SnarKassandra @ 62
Only once and it was a full length beaded Bob Mackey..) (probably a $10k dress at the time)
SnarKassandra @ 69
What fuckery.
EvilDrPuma @ 72
Huh???
madmommy @ 43
SnarKassandra @ 73
The tests, that is. Not you.
Too bad we can’t have Banned Test Year.
Night James. Fly well wherever you fly.
I have to admit I love ballet and these women don’t have an ounce of fat on them… but neither do most athletes. You can’t do ballet with a lot of weight to move around. And their beauty seems natural and not plastic the way pop stars, celebrities and A listers look.
Lea (no uh) @ 76
I vote for that one!!!
Good night James
RonD @ 77
More importantly, land well wherever you land.
DrDick @ 74
Hell, that means I’m on the downhill slide, then ;0)
OOOh Eureka! I bet you looked stunning!
damn
(bias cut velvet is a gift from god)
We used to call that a quiz.
can we ban boosh and take a week to celebrate?
I am so glad this topic is coming of age, so to speak. I was beginning to feel as if I was going to be the last female in the western world to not spend thousands of dollars trying to convince others I’m younger than I actually am.
As far as young girls are concerned, it doesn’t matter what values we as parents may hold re the natural aging process. Our girls live in this culture. They see what’s going on around them. Lots of luck to any parent out there who thinks she can override this societal brainwashing that you won’t be a human being worth being around if you don’t remake your physical self into some kind of unattainable ideal.
SnarKassandra @ 66
Why, thanks.
In 11th grade, she tried out to be Drum Major. And she was so good. She practiced a lot, could do all the fancy stuff with the mace. And she could bark out the orders like any guy there. That was right before all the bands got female drum majors. She missed by two points.
SnarKassandra @ 44
You see that in a lot of minority cultures here in the US. There are a number of cultures in Africa where fat is beautiful. Much of what any culture considers beautiful is the look of prosperity.
Wow, Albatross, you sure have a talented daughter!
TRex, thanks for this.
Every generation, or every few generations seem to “decide” that there is a certain outward form of the “ideal” woman. And, that ideal is pushed relentlessly. And, somehow, the new “ideal” seems to be completely different from the old “ideal”. Uh, why is that?
It is really pernicious.
I suffered from not having the “ideal” form, back in the MM days. I would have fit in now, without even trying. Great.
Eating disorders now are, as I have learned by talking to female undergraduates, more common than I previously thought. To a degree that shocked me.
I know that men also are subject to certain pressures (based on reading my usual spam) but for women, it is much more pervasive, and much more subtle, and the “correct” type for females is much more arbitrary than it has ever been for me. edit: for MEN! fwiw.
SanderO @ 78
There’s a difference between no body fat and anorexia nervosa. I’m sure some ballerinas don’t realize that, but it’s by no means a given.
Hooray for big girls!
You can hear a letter I wrote to NPR on this topic being read aloud here.
Evening TRex -
Forgive the OT
Burma update as of 4 hours ago. Oct. 2
http://www.onlineopinion.com.a…..ticle=6452
(something I didn’t know about the Orwell Burma connection)
http://hrw.org/english/docs/20…..a16995.htm
(Human Rights Watch campaign of pressure)
http://burmamyanmargenocide.bl…..900am.html
(up to the minute blogs from Burma)
Colbert coming up with Charlie Savage.
Suzanne @ 85
Good idea! When should we celebrate Banned Bush Week?
TRex @ 49
God love the fundies, cause the rest of us just think they are a pain in the ass.
a mackey? es got to wear a mackey? THAT is just so so unfair dayamitall.
DrDick @ 96
I suspect they’re trying God’s patience, too.
what’s a mackey?
Suzanne @ 85
I know.
They took Britney’s kids away, but we’re still stuck here in the house with Crazy Uncle Dubya.
Please help us!
Eureka Springs @ 59
Oh my gosh. I have one (black, with a bodice like scallop shells) that my hubby bought for me the year we married. I found it in a thrift store and was tempted to get it just because it was so beautiful. But we were looking at the possibility of a work strike, and I didn’t do it. Unwrapped it weeks later, a bday present. My daughter (15 now) sashays around the house in it from time to time, and looks like a movie star from the 40s. And no, I never did wear it, never the ‘right’ do to go to. That bias cut is something else–one must be confident in her body to handle it.
Linda – you are certainly right that our daughters grow up in the culture and are impacted … but we have more influence than we think (which they don’t tell you till they are past teen years)
g nite… I am going to snuggle up to my sleeping wife right now… Her daughter is very thin but can’t put on weight…
Humans are weird..
bob mackey – costumer to the stars, those great carol burnnet outfits, cher, and many others (think 60’s and 70’s). he had an ability to style a dress to the woman, instead of trying to style the woman to the dress.
great gowns
Loo Hoo. @ 65
My family was in that industry. The pattern sizes have changed to flatter women into thinking they are a small size. Today I am a size 6 but in the fifties, as a high school girl making her own clothes, I was a 12. I was smaller then. Guess about a 4 in today’s sizes. Same thing is true of shoe sizes. There is a two size difference.
Suzanne @ 97
Yeah, but don’t you have to pretty much stand up all the time in a beaded gown? I imagine it would be uncomfortable trying to sit in one, with all those beads poking you in the butt and thighs. The best dressy dress I ever had was a black velvet, off the shoulder bias cut with a full, tea length skirt. Comfortable as jammies, and looked damn good, too!
EvilDrPuma @ 95
Banned Bush century…Condemned to roam a pitiless Earth until his ignoble passing arrives like a bad smell, wrapped in a burlap sack with kleenex boxes for shoes.
Siun and Suz,
It was Halloween in SF and I had five female roommates who worked me over for hours before we all went to the Castro.. I swear to Marilyn as I walked down the middle of the street it was like a parting of the sea. I had a few pinch bruises the next day but I never lost a bead, honey.
Am I seeing his right…Colbert doing a subtle promo for Kucinich?
madmommy @ 34
Heck, I think Courtney Paris is sexy, so you don’t have to convince me.
SanderO @ 103
Pleasant dreams.
madmommy @ 82
That’s alright, I’m already somewhere in the basement. My “girlish figure” vanished long ago.
Loo Hoo. @ 94
Colbert, needs to get his fowls right, it’s a Loon, not a Duck!!!
EvilDrPuma @ 91
The effects are the same – as are the preoccupations with eating/not eating.
Dancers could stand to carry a little more body fat without having a lot of weight to carry around. Its about the look, mostly, it think.
Since I’m not a junkie anymore, I am having to deal with more weight in certain places than I am used to, but I don’t let it stress me out. I’m just grateful to be healthy and alive.
SanderO, just in case you are still here, there are Terrible Eating Disorders among dancers, especially Ballerinas. There is enormous pressure not to have an ounce of fat, and no it is not due to all the exercise.
madmommy @ 82
I imagine that Dr. Dick wouldn’t throw 60-year-old Emmylou Harris out of bed if he came home one night and found her there.
darkblack @ 107
You say that now. In an hour, you’ll want me to click on a link.
Speaking of beautiful women, I’m going to read the Alice Walker book I picked up at the thrift store, The Temple of My Familiar.
Good night all. Sweet dreams.
Eureka Springs @ 108
OMG! LOL, ES
Sweetest of all possible dreams to you, demi.
Bye demi.
Me too. Getting an early ride to school.
Night, Demi. Read well.
It’s OK, Trex, that snark doesn’t make you look fat.
Good night, Cassie.
madmommy @ 122
Easy for you to say.
Sleep well, Cassie.
QuakerGirl- not my experience with shoe sizes, but otherwise I agree.
demi @ 119
THAT BOOK CHANGED MY LIFE!!!
http://www.antiquedress.com/item1696.htm
A Bob Mackie gown
It’s been a long hard day. I’m in for the night with a book I just purchased. Good night from me and Molly Ann, the four legged six pounder.
Laura Doty, The dress sounds wonderful. I used to own a vintage clothing store in the Haight Ashbury so I am all to familiar with what once was in fashion. Be sure and keep that dress folded up, not on a hanger..) They, the original 30’s silk on the bias, are almost impossible to find in wearable condition these days.
Nite, Sleepers…
‘night, QG.
Am what the name suggests. Get your young daughters involved in the out-of-doors! Teach them to hike, climb, raft and ski… Send them to an adventure camp if you don’t do it yourself. The love of nature taught me the importance of being a physically strong woman.
Valley Girl @ 129
Does that mean my feet have grown two sizes? :D
burnspbesq @ 117
DrDick would lock the door and throw away the key.
Good night, QuakerGirl. Sleep the sleep of the just.
EvilDrPuma @ 118
Well, since we are speaking of negative self-image…Here is your evening nightmare.
TexBetsy will be by with cookies and milk later for the traumatized among us
;>)
G’night Cassie.
And although my mother was never in prison, she was never, ever the mother I wanted or needed, not while I was growing up and not even now. Some of us have to find mother-figures who can teach us what we need to learn and who love us unconditionally. You’re doing fine, IMHO.
:)
Night Demi & Cassie.
Trex,
“weapons-grade snark”. Beautiful. Got a belly laugh and a giggle-snort out of that description. Can’t stay, but couldn’t let that one pass without an “attaboy”.
EvilDrPuma @ 127
See # 131, bit of a slip on my part.
I find it funny at the other end of the spectrum. I’m petite in every possible definition of the word. But i could never be a model becuase i’ve actually got HIPS for all i’m tiny. *grins* There’s also the fact that my bust? Nearly nonexistant. (so because i don’t have the bust and i’m too hippy i can’t model. Phoohey on that overated industry anyway. I want my MUSIC! :P )
But i dont’ starve myself. That’s just asking for trouble at my size. I never saw the point of it mostly because i like to actually eat. Diet is an unknown word to me. About the most i need to do is excercise a little more to keep the rest of my system in good shape–but that’s hard with pain issues in the way. Or my lungs deciding it’s a ‘breathing is optional’ day.
I don’t need to be the tall stick figure. It’s more fun being sneaky and small. :D Comes in handy for making idiots at work underestimate me right up until i roadblock them in an effort to be a-holes just becaue of the ‘retail’ label of my pharmacy.
G’nite retirees!
May I put in a word about hair dyes? Not to rain on anyone’s parade, but they are linked to cancers. I’ve had patients and friends whose first visit to the oncologist was marked by their being asked “do you dye your hair?” right after “do you smoke?”
I’ll be 52 in a couple of weeks, and have greying hair. I must admit that I’m a lot greyer than many women my age and older. But I like to think of it sign of my inward transformations. (Plus I console myself with the fact that while 52 may be grey, this 52 year old climbs into a gi and brown belt several times a week!)
Night QG.
TRex @ 130
Well, there’s hope for me. I’m only on page 23. But I love it already.
(did we finally find something in common?)
Valley Girl @ 90
Both male and female seem to have genetic imperatives that are reinforced with cultural amplification.
Men seem predestined and reinforced to be agressive.
Women seem predestined and reinforced to be attractive.
Both genders can use their brains to overcome an excessiveness of these qualities.
But it is never a simple, single effort since we must inhabit our bodies all the days of our lives.
Moral of story? Never forget what your brain is for.
Eureka Springs @ 133
folded carefully, resting in the cedar closet! Thank you!
Colbert: “Everyone knows that Cheney’s fantasy is driving a bulldozer through the New York Times while drinking crude oil from Keith Olbermann’s skull”
CAN’T.STOP.LAUGHING
LOL
It’s the single largest sex organ.
darkblack @ 140
Lon Chaney, Jr. only wished he could look that disturbing.
QuakerGirl @ 137
Yes, unfortunately they usually will grow a size or two as time passes. Sigh. Try finding cute shoes in a 10. Which is why I prefer Chuck Taylor high tops, clownish though they may look.
TRex @ 152
makes me wonder how on earth boosh was able to figure out how to procreate
Laura Doty @ 146
My attitude is that I earned every one of those grey hairs. I don’t know why more women don’t just go with it.
QuakerGirl @ 137
Quite possibly. This direction is the opposite of the change in dress size, which you mentioned. Not quite 2 sizes for me, but 8- 8 1/2 – 9. If the fashion industry was trying to make me feel good, shouldn’t I be size 7 now?
Either I am less willing to wear uncomfortable shoes, or my feet have “grown” (spread out!), same as you say.
Suzanne @ 155
I thought Jenna and not Jenna were IVF.
Suzanne @ 155
Bang! Pow! Give that woman front-page billing.
T, gentle aside, but I think you diminish your support for JK by ragging on Ann. She thrives on attention, all kinds. The more you despise her, the more she *knows* you want her. Oddly sick, but she is a consummate attention whore.
Maybe you thought of her because of her lame fat jokes. And I know, she looks like she could use a few pounds. Maybe she should stop spitting and swallow for the extra calories. But I’d much rather you take the high road and let the ladies handle her.
TRex @ 152
It is also the single sexiest organ.
Suzanne @ 155
‘On the 8th day, the Lord created the turkey baster’
;>)
madmommy @ 154
Try to find anything in a EE.
DrDick @ 156
mine too – i’ve earned every one of them fuckers – and luckily, mine are more silver rather than that steel gray.
DrDick @ 156
Becaue in my case, my hair is just curly enough to be difficult. And the gray hairs are exponentially more wiry and kinky than the not gray hair.If I had gray hair like Emmy Lou, no problem.
Valley Girl @ 157
I think they do grow with age – if for no other reason than that your arches flatten with age.
TRex @ 130
OMG that book changed my life too. Shook loose everything.
DrDick @ 161
You guys crack me up…
They’re Neil’s.
DrDick @ 163
Yeah, but men’s shoe styles don’t change so drastically as women’s do. How many pairs of black shoes do you have?
madmommy @ 170
None. I only wear cowboy boots or sandals.
Fern @ 166
It’s called gravity and believe me, everything goes south. You reach an age where you can just relax and enjoy it. It’s just a body – it’s not YOU.
Charlie Savage: A very quiet Constitutional revolution is under way. This is not just about 9/11. An imperial presidency was discussed in Jan ‘01.
The woman who cuts my hair refuses to color in her shop. She knows too many stylists who’ve had cancer.
My hair is wiry and steel grey. My husband called me beautiful about an hour ago, out of the blue. I’ll go with the brain being the sexiest of organs…
TRex @ 169
Ick. When’s it going to be cool enough to wear the really awesome jacket?
Fern @ 166
Consistent with reports from all my female friends. Tho, admittedly, not so many that I discuss shoes with! ;)
madmommy @ 154
New Balance cross-trainers. Stylish without being slaves to fashion. Come in every size you could imagine, and widths from A to E. Women’s shoes have different, gender-appropriate lasts.
DrDick @ 171
I have 4. And most of the women I know have at least twice that. The things we go through for you guys is just wrong ;0)
sorry, laura, didn’t mean to insult with my steel gray color comment – was just happy my gray is a color i like and compliments my skin tones – which the steel gray would not do.
no offense intended
DrDick @ 163
At this very moment I am wearing my size 8 EE New Balance 854s. My work shoes are Eccos, which also fit my fat feet perfectly.
TRex @ 115
second that.
Twain @ 172
SO true. When I think of my legs as not shapely enough, I remind myself that they ‘get me there.’ My elbows have little pudgy bits around them. Drives me nuts. Oh well, I have two arms to pick things up with.
Do you all remember Jamie Lee Curtis’ before and after photos some time ago? That was so great. I noticed in Freaky Friday that her elbows are like mine. It’s an unnecessary shot–I wondered if she had them leave it in, on principle.
I’m happy with my salt & pepper silver and size 11’s… but finding any kind of “nice” shoe is out of the question. Guess its a good thing I don’t have to do corporate drag. Sandals or hiking boots work for me most days.
I went shopping with a friend recently. One of the things we were looking for was a new party outfit for her 8-year-old daughter. I was astonished to see what was available. If Paris Hilton’s wardrobe had shrunk in the wash, it would have looked right at home on the department store rack.
Of course, no mini-slut’s life is complete without make-up and perfumes and assorted accessories. I can’t imagine how these kids will grow up as healthy, balanced individuals when they’re being fed into the vortex of body image as young as 8.
Suzanne @ 179
And absolutely NONE taken! My hair is like my father’s. He was a welder, and as he greyed, I used to imagine that flecks of steel from work had landed in his hair….now I’m showing some of his mettle….
evening pups – kitchen all policed now i can relax for a few…. i’m fat fit and FINE!!! got a problem wid dat??
burnspbesq @ 180
Actually, I am a much happier man since I discovered Sheplers online.
Cultural forces act not only on our daughters’ self-image, in terms of shaping their perception of beauty.
It works against them in terms of their achievements, and it does so in a way that truly hurts our society.
My daughter at age two told me she wanted to be a doctor. It was one of her earliest conversations with me, prompted by too much Discovery television on Saturday mornings (some medical show on at that time).
In kindergarten she told me she wanted to be a veterinarian, and help sick animals.
But by fourth grade, she told me she wanted to be a hairdresser. I damned near went through the roof.
My gifted daughter, the one that the school psychologist said was 3 standard deviations away from normal in terms of intelligence, telling me that she wanted to do hair for a living.
AAAGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!
It took a year of concentrated effort to undo that damage. It happened just about the time that she was really having problems with being accepted, had a lot of moody spells and fights with me about clothes (the “I’ve got nothing to wear” problem, with a closet and dresser full of clothes).
Part of the problem was related to cliques; she was letting one little monstrous drama queen get into her head and really mess with her. After we sat down a few times and dissected her social world — who’s the queen bee, who are the sycophants, who are the wave riders, so on — she finally began to see the peer pressure for what it was and started to change her mind about what she wanted to do with her life.
And now I can’t interrupt her when CSI or NCIS is on, or Mythbusters…she’s decided that she wants to be a pathologist and she claims those shows helped her make up her mind.
Whew…now if we can just survive contact with the male of the species in a year or two.
Suzanne @ 25
I think part of that, though, might be attributable to the fact (I think!) that sizes have gotten bigger. I’ve watched myself stay the same size as I’ve put on some weight over the years. I attributed it to companies wanting me to be “flattered” by how thin I was in their store/clothes.
i am happiest wearing comfy clothes and shoes – doesn’t really matter to me what the size is for the clothes, some are old from when i was around 100 lbs more than i am now (thryoid was radiated and i gained a bunch until they got the replacement dose figured out – 8 years later). I have stuff in my closet ranging from an 8 to a 22 – and have no idea what i weigh now or what size i wear. i do not care – it is not important to me. what is important is that i am comfy in my own skin, no matter how much gravity is no longer my friend.
persiflage @ 184
Eight? My son has been dancing since age 5. I’ve seen stuff at competitions and showcases that you just wouldn’t believe.
burlygrrll @ 183
I used to wish I could wear my favorite hiking boots to work. Now I DO wear my favorite hiking boots to the office (when it rains). So I’m not 5th avenue. Too true. But I do enjoy a good hike (and they are the most comfortable shoes I’ve ever worn!)
persiflage @ 184
That really is one of the more disturbing trends in recent years. I really get freaked out by this progressive sexualization of children (which is what this is) of ever younger age.
burlygrrll @ 183
Yes, I have always found it a total challenge to find “ok” shoes for work environment.
Men don’t really understand how much “shoe torture” women are subjected to.
persiflage @ 184
It’s worse than that. Try checking out the toddler clothes. Hip huggers and belly shirts for 3 and 4 year olds. Shudder.
DrDick @ 193
I’m going to go out on a limb and blame the Republicans and the corporatist wing of the Democrats. Amazing how it always comes back to the same people, isn’t it?
Ginger Rodgers did everything Fred Astaire did, but backwards and wearing high heels.
I would rather explain to my children that people like to take off their clothes and that it isn’t that it is wrestling, more love wrestling….. than attempt to counter all the crap contained in commercials. If you can get past it, soap is soap. in every form. A dermatologist will tell you to use glycerine soap, only. makeup is made of urine and fish and dead bovine’s surplus parts. food is poisoned because the people that want to put rat feces in your food pay the government to let them. no parent should allow their kids to watch TV unless they can also explain the commercials, or we will have a lot of ill kids that are really good at video games and an alternate reality
Valley Girl @ 194
comfortable shoes for this burlygrrll 8-)
Rayne @ 188
You have my sympathy. It appears, however, that you are laying a good foundation so she should survive that OK. You on the other hand may want to avoid sharp objects and high windows for a few years. ;-)
Suzanne @ 190
It’s so liberating, isn’t it?
Okay, kids.
Off to the grocery store. Might take a while, so don’t worry if Late Late Nite goes up a little late.
See you in a bit.
Suzanne @ 197
Ann Richards used to say that. I miss Ann, and Molly too.
I can’t tell you how mad I get about the expectations put on women by our society – men and women alike.
The dirty little secret is that no one is beautiful enough. The models that get paid zillions of dollars to be held up as standards of beauty that we are supposed to envy and emulate? They have to have plastic surgery too! No human is able to come up to these inhuman standards.
do ya mind picking me up whirled peas and a winning lotto ticket please, trex
G’nite TRex and thanks again.
Good night everyone.
TeddySanFran @ 203
God bless the Texas Angels.
Night Laura, sleep well.
suzanne@190
hear hear – one must be comfy in one’s own skin….this is how i live and glad to be here lol
Alicia @ 204
Well said.
Alicia @ 204
That is indeed the whole point. By setting impossible, inhuman standards they insure steady business from all those vainly attempting to achieve the impossible.
As I leave, just want to remind you about tomorrow’s vote re: Burma (I linked this downstairs) and here now for those who didn’t see it: at Crooks and Liars–by our very own Siun! (text and links).
Sweet dreams to you all.
DrDick @ 200
Drugs. Laying in stores of meds to chill me out.
Not really, but it’s tempting.
At least I had the fortune/misfortune to run into my ex-SO with my daughter in tow one day. Since then we’ve had so many conversations about boyfriends and what constitutes a good one or a bad one, all because of him. At the time the run-in seemed like a curse, but I’ve been able to point to him so many times since then as a learning device that I guess in hindsight I’m happy I ran into his self-centered, egotistical self.
I tell my daughter, “If he can only talk about himself, if it’s all about him, run the other way.” She nods her head unquestioningly, after seeing my ex yack for 45 minutes about himself.
Just hope I don’t have to run into him again to give her more pointers about what-not-to-do…
Nice to dip my toes in the lake a bit tonight. Off to read a couple of chapters in my Ecoysystem Restoration text before my eyes go crossed for the evening.
Really, get those girls of yours out in the woods and let them soak up the beauty. Passages Northwest.
EvilDrPuma @ 210
In addition, those pictures and magazine cover are airbrushed to a fare the well. I found a website surfing once that showed the actual photo vs. the cover of the magazine. Amazing!
EvilDrPuma @ 210
My wife has a button on her cloth purse that says,
“Fuck Your Fascist Beauty Standards.”
I don’t know where she got it.
DrDick @ 211
And, for you, it would be a great anthro course to teach… ever thought about that subject?
Our kids – Praise the Lord! – dress in a combination of REI-type gear, cast-me-downs and stuff they pick up at Value Village and the Salvation Army. Their choice. ETette and ET, Jr. both like to dress up, and borrow their parent’s clothes from time to time, but they’re thrilled if they can score some outrageous dress or suit at St. Vinnie’s. They have friends who are clothes horses, but those kids end up being the butt of a lot of jokes among the outdoors-oriented peer group our kids have developed.
Laura Doty @ 192
I don’t know what came over me, but I bought a pair of pumps recently – the first in about 30 years – with 2 inch heels. Not what most women would think of as heels. I felt like a kids playing dressup with her mom’s shoes. I didn’t know how to walk!
RonD @ 216
Brilliant.
OT for ET:
WaPo’s Paul Kane blogged this evening about Ben Stevens’ call-in to a radio show in Anchorage.
Nice to see things from Alaska trickling inside the Beltway.
burnspbesq @ 191
I’m obviously out of touch. For all I know the kid was born with designer diapers. It just shocked me see how grown-up the clothes were. I just don’t think I missed out on anything by climbing trees, reading and playing when I was 8.
I remember seeing a John Clease (i think that is the name) PBS show about beauty with Elizabeth Hurley – they showed the airbrushing, the lenghtening of the legs via computer photoshopping, etc., to make the model’s body fit some ad director’s image of what beauty should be.
very interesting show.
Valley Girl @ 217
I actually have talked about it when I have taught a sex and gender class. Don’t get much chance to do it any more, as another (tenure track) faculty member does it. Always one of my favorite classes to teach. Only problem was that there was so much to cover that you had to leave out a lot.
Suzanne @ 223
Once you’ve done all of that, you might as well just pay somebody to come up with a completely computer-generated model.
I prefer real people, thank them very much.
DrDick @ 211
Talk about ‘moving the goalposts’!
Wow, the Rockies pull it off, 9-8 in the 13th inning!!!
OT – Dr.Dick is delightful company! We went to dinner and listened to music last weekend.
All the fun I can stand.
Goodnight everyone. The best of all possible tomorrows to you.
There’s the beautiful model waif thing that’s one thing. But what about the busty tall types that get all the attention too? That doesn’t work for others. Yes i’m petite. It doesnt’ mean i’m nonexistant becuase i’m not bloody well ‘big’ enough to fit into whatever mold the fashion industry wants.
So i’m not rubenesqeue. But i sure as hell am not anorexic either. 5′2″ 114 lbs does not mean i’m fat either, not at my size. Perfectly healthy–just tiny. Which as i said, the fashion industry doesn’t like either. You have to be taller than i am to even get in the door! Besides, i have early greying hair for a 30 yr old as well. I eat normally at that too. I am who i am, the fashion industry can’t tell me how to dress. Half the time i want a simple pair of jeans! Not the stupid hip huggers which are STILL a plague in the stores i can actually afford.
mae west would be considered overweight today.
so would marilyn monroe, jane mansfield, rita hayworth, betty grable and all her pinup friends from ww2.
CTuttle @ 227
Did you see the replay? Holliday never touched the plate.
Alicia @ 228
Alicia and her sister are also wonderful. Everyone had a great time.
DrDick @ 193
I agree. I watched one little miss trying on clothes then vamping around in front of her mother, looking for all the world like she was getting ready for a hot date. She would have been no more than 10. It gave me the creeps.
Nite, Ron!!!
Valley Girl @ 194
I wear size 11 AND orthotics. I’ve found that Skechers brand soes work for me–sneaker-like comfort and at least semi-dressy styles as well as stylish sneakers.
OhioTex @ 236
I love Skechers – they’re my ‘dress-up’ shoe these days.
madmommy @ 232
Are you serious? I was monitoring it on the ‘puter, didn’t watch it!
I still think the men need to be educated too. My sister’s date told her recently that she didn’t look fat, but he hadn’t seen her with her clothes off (meaning he still reserved the right to think she was fat). She’s a size 6.
I’m way too hard on myself, my weight, and my looks. I’ve spent my whole life being told how fat I am, even though I’m often the healthiest eater in the room. I walk MARATHONS for pity’s sake. I often just can’t shake societal expectations though, as hard as I try.
My boys at this point? It’s all about just trying to convince them about general hygeine. They couldn’t care less how they look, though J is fighting to get into better shape and lose weight. He’s not dieting or anything though, he’s exercising more, for his own health.
Speaking of Posh Spice, does anyone know what the hell happened to her? I mean, she was a beautiful, successful young woman. Now it looks like she’s got the Paris Hilton virus or something.
CTuttle @ 238
Check it out, I wouldn’t kid ya. The catcher blocked the plate, Holliday went to the backstop side but did not touch the plate. The catcher dropped the ball and the ump hesitated, so the catcher picked up the ball and went to tag as the ump called Holliday safe.
TJ @ 239
Your sister needs to shop around a little bit more.
TJ @ 239
Tell her to fun far and fast from that loser!
TJ @ 239
That is unspeakably rude. I would hope, if I said something like that to a woman, that I would never see her with her clothes off.
Frank Probst @ 243
A lot more. That one is a total jerk.
TJ @ 239
Tell her to kick that dunce to the curb. What a jerk.
Frank Probst @ 243
He’s been written off. However, she runs into them more often than not.
Good evening dear friends.
We need to teach our children our most important values from the time they are born. “What a kind boy you are, sharing that with ___” “What good thinking that was.” “You’re so beautiful when you laugh.”
Evening all and hello!
Years of teenage angst and buying power left us parents crying. Now, as new adults, they realize the folly of all this stupid purchasing of things from Abercrombie, etc. and actually buy sensibly. Graduate school for our girl at Winterthur has seen culture studies as a science.
madmommy @ 242
All the Espn analysts are saying no way…! Didn’t look like he did…!!!
TexBetsy @ 249
Now that’s a great thought to end the night on. I’m going to bed, folks. Be excellent to each other.
Night EDP.
I used to be (please note past tense) married to someone who had huge issues with my weight. And that was when I was 5′5″ and 135 lb. Sure ate away at my confidence.
CTuttle @ 251
The camera angle was pretty clear on TBS, the catcher had his leg well across the plate, Holliday hit it as he slid, plus he whacked his face on the ground and got a bloody lip for his trouble.
Nite, EDP! Howdy, Tex!!!
*waving to all the leaving sleepy pups*
Woops, buried my comment inside Frank’s in 248. Yes, he’s been written off. However, she sees a lot of it. She’s a 43 year old nurse practioner (ie she can prescribe like a dr). But the doctors want 25 year old trophy wives.
Evening TexB. I use similar phrasing with my boys and hope that it sticks!
night doc
madmommy @ 259
i can tell you that it does. at least so far.
Time for me to turn in. I’ll have to check back in the morning to see what TRex has in store for Late Late Night.
TJ @ 258
Egads. Tell her not to date a doctor, for crying out loud.
tj, refresh the page and it is fixed, courtesy of the lurking mod
Night MM.
Frank Probst @ 263
I know one doc’s wife about whom it has been said, “Her job is to stay pretty and stay skinny.”
sleep well madmom
TexBetsy @ 249
Amen. That’s what I try to do with mine. Around our house, we talk about character. And we dissect and make fun of commercials.
I have been buying Dove soap only because of those commercials, which I appreciate, and I have e-mailed them to tell them so.
TeddySanFran @ 221
Not very many comments for a WaPo article. Ben’s a sad case. I’m getting set for State Rep. Vic Kohring’s upcoming bribery trial, destined to become the weirdest in Alaska history.
Apparrently i’m invisible tonight becuase petite isn’t an issue in this world. *shrugs* Nothing new to me there.
TexBetsy @ 266
Those are the ones who start to look brittle as they age.
TJ @ 239
Last date.
Who’d a thunk the Cubbies, Phillies, and the Rockies, would all be seeing post season action, at the same time…!!! ;-)
Fern @ 254
I had a boyfriend like that. I am now about 70 lbs heavier than that, and my husband tells me I’m beautiful every day.
aliasofwestgate @ 270
Hi Alias! Didn’t see ya. /s
aliasofwestgate @ 270
not invisible, alias
aliasofwestgate @ 270
I think it’s just everyone flapping at different purposes, honestly.
I know a lot of petite women, and also naturally VERY skinny ones, who have major issues as well. None of us meet the requirements. :-/
Alicia @ 274
I love a happy ending.
Suzanne @ 264
Thank you, lurking mod.
She loves her job and is great at it, so I thought it would be great for her to find someone with a medical career. She says it’s not likely.
aliasofwestgate @ 270
Darling, you ain’t really petite. First wife was 5′ even and 90 pounds when we married. Nothing wrong with small.
TRex, thank you for mentioning the Dove campaign. I really appreciate their attempts to make women think about the images of “acceptable appearance” we’re shown on a daily basis.
I’m a plus-sized woman. The women on both sides of my family weren’t thin, either, so heredity may have something to do with this.
I had a very sad incident with one of our friends’ daughters a few years ago. Abigail was ten, in Select soccer, tall, healthy, athletic and already beautiful. We took her to the ice cream shop after the game because her team won. She spent almost half an hour eyeing the ice cream before deciding that she was ordering an “ice”. I said, “Sweetie, you don’t want ice cream?”
“Well, my mom says it’s fattening.”
I wanted to drive to her mother’s house and scream at her. Instead, we had a discussion about why people gain weight, and why it was okay to eat a little ice cream once in awhile after running up and down a soccer field for a couple of hours a day. I think about this, and I still shake all over with anger.
-S
CTuttle @ 273
Go Cubbies! (Break our hearts one more time).
Ed*ard Teller @ 269
Those Paul Kane blogs don’t get a big commentload. I think it went up after 6pm DeeCee time, so it might get some Hill traffic in the a.m.
TexBetsy @ 278
Long time coming but worth the weight, uh, wait!
DrDick @ 280
By modern standards i AM petite at 5′2″. I used to weigh 90 lbs. In high school. I dont’ mind the weight i’ve gained. It adds to the much healthier look i have now compared to how my hyperactive metabolism was at that time. (it’s slowed down marginally, but i’ve also been on enforced sedentary lifestyle becuase of health issues.) But i also miss being as active as i was at that age, playing basketball and biking, and generally being out and about.
The modern standard as far as i’ve been told? 5′5″ and up.
I’m 5′10″ or at least was before my back started having disc problems. Always wanted to be petite. And to have curly hair since mine is so straight it can be used as a level. My petite friends with curly hair wanted to be tall and have straight hair.
aliasofwestgate @ 270
My fiance is also small, alias, and struggles with the challenges that creates in the men’s department as well.
DrDick @ 282
Go Diamondbacks….
I am 5′1″ and heavier than ever. Gained weight after becoming disabled and haven’t done all that much to take it off. On the other hand, I look exactly the same shape as my mother, aunt and grandmother all at my age. Oh well!
aliasofwestgate @ 270
You’re not alone Alias. I used to buy all my clothes in the kids department. Now I’m a bit more womanly but I still have to buy my shoes from the kid’s section. I have quite the collection of Mary Janes. No killer heels though.
Suzanne @ 286
I sneak through concert crowds at this size. Hehe. XD I’ve curly hair and i’d love straight, but i like being tiny.
Hello everyone. I like what I am reading here. I have two adult daughters in their 30’s. The messages sent to most girls over the last 50 years have been to either control their sexuality or send them to the mall. I always felt less than as a teenager cause my breasts were small. I tried to make sure my kids had strong self images and strong opinions. They are both independent and don’t take any trash from society about their minds or bodies. And they don’t feel the need to get married or have children. They may want to at some point but aren’t feeling any pressure.
Strategerie @ 281
Strat, when I hear talk like that it makes me want to snatch them bald-headed.
TeddySanFran @ 287
My grandfather was only about 5′4″-5′6″ (he lied about his height so I am not really sure) and had to shop in the boys’ section.
Suzanne @ 286
Isn’t this the truth? I’m 5′4″, and wish I were taller. I also wanted curly hair, when I was born with stick-straight, baby fine, very thick hair. Perimenopause brought the wavy hair I wanted, but now I don’t care about it.
Don’t we always want what we can’t have? LOL
-S
TexBetsy @ 289
Unfortunately, to a very large extent, what’s in our genes determines what is in our jeans. I now am the proud owner of my father’s physique (though I am more active and in better shape).
persiflage @ 290
Wow. i’m not that tiny! I think i’d have to get my bras from the teenagers sections to this day though. Everything else i can get away with by being picky as hell when i shop. And raiding the men’s sizes when i get annoyed with the lack of actual jeans.
marymccurnin @ 292
TexTeen has no plans for marriage or children. Cassie, on the other hand, has a million career plans and this odd habit of proposing marriage to adult men. Generally online. All liberal wonderful people. Thankfully —- They’ve all declined.
Alicia @ 293
Let’s go, girl.
You know I want to put the smackdown on a woman who could be so mindlessly cruel to a ten-year-old.
-S
TexBetsy @ 298
I tend to do that myself and I am already married.
I had a hard time buying clothes when I was a teen because I was so tall and skinny (118 lbs) – would have to get my jeans in the men’s departments because women’s clothing was made for the average, 5′5″, woman and were never long enough.
Now, my 6′2 daughter buys men’s pants so they are long enough for her.
The more things change, the more they stay the same.
I have a question…. how can someone strangle themselves wearing handcuffs with hands behind their back?
Only in Phoenix…. Only in the same city of Sheriff Joe…. ONLY here
Best part of Cassie’s proposal’s is that when they turn her down, she asks them if they know that I am single. LOL
By the gods. My mom would have some major words with that lady and that’s if I left any pieces to work over. Ice cream is something to be enjoyed–not worried over! That’s so cruel…
TexBetsy @ 303
Now that is funny.
aliasofwestgate @ 270
“Petite” and “emaciated” are two entirely different things. I’ve seen chemotherapy patients who look better than Posh Spice.
Suzanne @ 301
A few years ago one of the women basketball players took several of my classes. She was 6′6″. I cannot imagine how she found clothes. Very attractive young woman.
(looking at betsy) speaking of ice cream (ahem)
marymccurnin @ 300
What is your address and phone number, please?
I lived in Marin County for about five years. No fat people allowed. Fat would be five or ten pounds over the Marin legal limit. Many of the boomers have had their faces done. Skinny and tight. Yuk. They have erased all of their physical history. I take pride in mine. Imagine what this tells both boys and girls. Make yourself over for the good of our upper middle class/upper class society. Makes me feel proud to be poor, aging and a bit wrinkled.
one per person. ice cream in moderation
newtonusr @ 309
Contact me on facebook. Do NOT contact her. OR texteen. :)
Strategerie @ 299
Let’s go, girl.
You know I want to put the smackdown on a woman who could be so mindlessly cruel to a ten-year-old.
-S
and I can lay a smackdown, believe you me! I’m big and strong enoughh to tote amplifiers, bales of hay and Fender-Rhodes keyboards, so a dessicated little shrunken twig would have no chance.
newtonusr @ 309
Oh! newtonusr!
Frank Probst @ 306
So do i at work! I’ve also seen a few overdone ‘beauty freaks’ of nature more than once. It amazes me the lengths some go to look ‘good’. Ugh. At least as a geek i’ve got ‘excuse’ to be whatever i damned well please. Not that it would stop me as it is. I stopped giving a damn about those cliques when i was 16. Amazing how it frees one to think about other things and explore other worlds.
Although Democratic candidates for President have raised $225 million and the GOP losers about eighty million less than that, there’s lots more available:
aliasofwestgate @ 297
I’m a shade under 5 ft tall. I used to weigh about 95lbs but now I’m maybe 110. I have a weird body shape. My chesty region is quite womanly, my hips boyish and all balanced on tiny feet. I can sometimes get shoes in the ‘grown-up’ section but, most often it’s the kids shoes for me. There’s one advantage to this, kids clothes are usually cheaper than adult ones. I have a pair of kids trainers which cost me $85. The adult pair was $110.
marymccurnin @ 314
This humorous interplay entitles the participants to one evening at a crummy but unique biker bar in Eldorado…
marymccurnin @ 310
LA is the same. It’s so nice to be visiting Montana, where people at least mostly look normal.
TeddySanFran @ 316
That is some serious jack.
Well, I had best go to bed as I have to talk theory in the morning and that is always best served well rested. Take care and enjoy the snark.
Night Dr D. I am right behind you. Very early day at work (to be followed by a nap as quickly as possible).
Bye y’all. Enjoy the ice cream.
newtonusr @ 318
When are we going to do that?
true colors
cindy lauper
pain free wishes, tex and thanks for the ice cream (taking second one now that tex is gone)
marymccurnin @ 323
We need to gather up all local pups who don’t mind a pretty long drive (John in Sac, etc) and book it. Oct and Nov is perfect. It’s 30 minutes from your town.
madmommy @ 56
Generally, yes, but there’s not as much difference as there used to be. (Ms. Redshift used to study eating disorders across subcultures back when she was still in psychology.) Different ethnic groups aren’t immune to mainstream popular culture, unfortunately.
[sauntering down the hill above Firedoglake, a sheepish grin on his face, carrying a stuffed monkey and wearing a cap that has red white and blue letters with the date 1.20.09 on it, Fini pulls up a piece of log bench and sits down by the side of the campfire]
Evening pups. I was invited for birfday cake, though it appears the person who extended the invite has just recently left.
newtonusr @ 326
Where in El Dorado?
katymine @ 329
El Dorado is about 40 miles east of Sacramento.
fini, there’s still some ice cream left
hippo birdy, fini! how’ve you been?
and happy birthday (still your birthday here on the west coast) fini
happy birthday fini!
NOW I am going to bed.
newtonusr
email me at marymccurnin at mac dot com and we can make Big Gold arrangements.
marymccurnin @ 330
I lived & graduated HS in Placerville.
TexBetsy @ 334
Hey! thanks TB! I had cake earlier anyway, no ice cream though, I’ll take a bowl! And thank you all for the birfday wishes here just now and on Facebook today!
tex musta been tired, her link is to the lake and not cake
katymine @ 329
katymine!
Poor Reds…
Poor Reds…
katymine @ 336
You should come and see us and then we can go to Sf and see all of the bay area pups.
Suzanne @ 331
Persi hastily hides 2 ice-cream cones behind her back. She never was good at sharing.
Suzanne @ 338
http://www.foodtv.ca/DMM/C/A/C…..ke_003.jpg
Hi everyone!
A couple of years ago I heard a doctor talking about how so many women were ‘too fat’ here. Then he had an ER patient who was very trim.
His comment? “Body by Fisher, mind by Mattel.” Grrrr.
marymccurnin @ 340
I know… Party @ Teddy’s!
email on the way.
TexBetsy @ 342
Mmmmm that looks goooooood. Almost as good as the cake my friend made me. I am blessed to know a former pastry chef who made me a Tiramisu Cheesecake!
fini- and, all the best, and many more b’day celebrations. xxoo VG
Geez, once again, I’m late to the party. At the end of an excellent rant on the commercialization of beauty, TRex wrote,
Well, I don’t have a daughter, but I have 3 nieces and 4 grand-nieces, and they are all just completely wonderful. I haven’t noticed any problem with obsessing about physical appearance, but maybe I’m not around them enough. But I think I’ll send TRex’s message to their parents along with my encouragement.
Bob in HI
cake or death upstairs!!!!!
TRex, great post…very timely, on the occasion of punaisette’s 14th birthday today.
Rayne @ 188
VERY useful strategy to be aware of. Thank you, Rayne. (I have an almost-5 year old to usher through all of this nonsense.)
TRex, you really are a jewel. Thank you.
I don’t understand why this applies only to girls. Boys need similar positive reinforcement, too. As a father of two XY’s, I know.
I know it’s hopeless EPU’d by this time, but I think I just adore you, TRex. Weapons grade snark- that made my evening.
Well there’s the other side of this ugly coin.
The fantastic propaganda of corporate fast-food and prepared food vendors who advertise, convince and feed, not only America’s children but the whole family, the fattiest, caloriest, unhealthiest, nastiest tasty garbage that any culture has ever stuffed down their gullet. They might even be more successful than the stick-people culture.
Unhealthy obesity is a far greater problem in America, among the whole population, than the eating disorders of diet-obsessed girls.
While we all love our children (I hope) “just the way you are” saying its alright to be way-out-of-weight control seems little better than saying its alright that you’re not a 75lb swizzlestick.
We have to teach our children, and ourselves, to be the best we can be with what we have to work with.
EPU coda: no one will notice and it doesn’t matter, sometimes I do something just for myself.
My late wife, Marion … in a previous marriage, had gone up to 75 kg. Woke up the morning after her 47th b’day, said, “I don’t like myself like this.” Her ex- was like umm, 25 stone, c. 300 lb., borderline diabetic, courting heart disease.
Marion started healthy dietary approach for both. John tried to undercut her every way: let’s go out to dinner, or, I brought home takeaway.
She kept to her regimen, too much, went down to 49 kg in 2 years. Up to 52, when separated. Later divorced. Bit of a nervous decline not long before I met her. Worked herself out of that mostly by then.
Marion looked like a real woman, not a stick figure, and was comfortable in her own skin. Not living up to anyone else’s ideal or image.
Even better, with personality and character. Could have been a good role model for ~celebrities~ and such. Between the Big C and ~medical science~ she finally understood there is always a time to let go. I miss her.
I think that when they become 10yrs old, they will stop listening to you and start listening to their friends and the fashion industry, so you hafta make sure you convince them before they’re 10.
* The only thing that really affects their self confidence is real accomplishments.
moose @ 355
Moose, You have been noticed. I’m sorry for your loss. I hope you find another woman with personality and character when you are ready.
If I had a daughter, I would tell her something along those lines every day, I think,
TRex, its a blessing and a burden. Maybe, someday, but until then thanks for passing this on. My two are both Rowling fans, if JK said kids should do handstands, they’d do handstands by the dozens. Our household isn’t well-to-do enough to try to compete with the “GottaHaveIt”s of our world, so we make do with piano, dance, and reading past bedtime. Does wonders for the self-esteem, which seems to be the trick of the thing.
Parents, worried about what your kids are eating? Want to install healthy eating habits? Then stock the fridge and cupboard with healthy, fresh, organic and locally-grown foods. Make your meals and your snacks reflect your pursuit and DO NOT GIVE IN. You’ll be pleasantly surprised what kids will eat if they get hungry enough.
Diet is only one-half the battle – turn off the tv, the game console, the computer and kick them out of the house into the yard, the playground, the gym, anyplace that gets them off their arses. Once they hit the teen years, it’s probably too late, but get them in the habit when they’re younger and it lasts a good long time.
$10,000 dollars in lighting, the very best photographers, make-up artists, hair-stylists, the most expensive clothing made to fit precisely… You’d be looking pretty good too– And, that doesn’t include the hours of photo-shop manipulation–
Our children compare themselves to manufactured images. It is our job to deconstruct how they are made, by whom and to what purpose. They are as real as a cartoon sketch.
I spent some time researching the fashion industry fro a fictional piece. The dirty little secret then, and I witnessed it, was that most of these bone thin children were shooting heroin into the panty-line because it’s too darned painful to starve yourself to death.
I came away feeling that in this modern age we have no right to look back in horror at the idea of human sacrifice, the drowning of yesteryears vestal virgins, because we have our subtler methods. Everyone in the fashion industry insist on impossible standards and then stand around blandly watching children murdering themselves to be suitable cloths rack or a frozen image in their pictures. They tut-tut when these children suffer nervous break downs, or end up in rehab– How pathetic! How substandard! It is nothing short of evil…
Let those pretty children suffer and die on our mantle while we rake in the big bucks!
I think grown women need to do more than feed their children well and offer the “you’re terrific as you are” platitudes we hope will counteract billion dollar marketing efforts– we need to scoff at the false ’standard’ and react with hostility toward a rapacious industry that is so hostile toward our children.