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In a not-so-surprise move, the Thompson campaign's BFF -- the WaPo -- points out some of the recent Giuliani attempts at revisionist mystery:
But for most of Giuliani's career as a Department of Justice official, prosecutor and New York's chief executive, terrorism was a narrow aspect of his broader crime-fighting agenda, which was dominated by drug dealers, white-collar criminals and the Mafia. Giuliani expressed confidence that Islamic extremism could be contained through vigorous investigation by law enforcement agencies and prosecution in the court system -- the same approach he now condemns....
Giuliani often cites the 1993 attack as a motivation for his creation of an Office of Emergency Management, in 1996. But those present at the agency's creation say it was intended to give the mayor oversight over more routine emergencies.
Jonathan Best interviewed for the job of leading the agency and said the subject of terrorism barely arose. "That wasn't the focus of what they were looking at," Best said. "They were interested in hurricanes. Hurricanes were big."
In 1997, the city decided to place an emergency command center for the agency on the 23rd floor of 7 World Trade Center, across from the twin towers. Several top officials argued for a lower-profile site, such as an office complex across the Manhattan Bridge in Brooklyn.
But Giuliani was adamant about having a site within walking distance of City Hall, recalled Jerome Hauer, then the emergency management commissioner. Hauer left City Hall in 2000 and had a falling-out with Giuliani after Sept. 11 over Hauer's endorsement of a Democrat to replace the mayor.
On Sept. 11, the $13 million center was quickly evacuated, and 7 World Trade Center collapsed later in the day.
Giuliani and his advisers have rejected criticism of the site selection, saying no one could have predicted the collapse of the towers. But Louis Anemone, a top-ranking police officer who has since retired, disagrees. The World Trade Center "was number one on our list of the most vulnerable and critical and symbolic locations in the city. The place had been attacked once before, and they had been threatening to bring those towers down again," Anemone said. "For those of us who lived and breathed this stuff day in and day out, it boggled the imagination."...
What ever could have possessed "America's Mayor" to demand such a placement for the command center in a high profile target zone, eh? I feel another round of Love Shack coming on...I'd add in a laugh track if it weren't so damned serious.
Digby and Kevin Drum have more. And the NYDailyNews chronicles the fact that the Judy call during Rudy's NRA speech wasn't the first time that he left his cell on to get calls from the little woman mid-speech, and the Chicago Tribune has a dispatch from the floor during the NRA speech. Can't even learn a lesson about proper speech etiquette? Not trusting him to learn any other important lessons either, thank you very much.
(Photo via JolieNY.)
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Hello Christy!
Any chance we can get the weepy Brittany Spears fan Chris Crocker to recored a ‘Leave Rudy Giuliani alone’ video?
Vote for Rudy, because Al Qaeda is terrified of batshit insane crossdressers.
-GSD
Giuliani and MoveOn.org ad:
From CNN’s Late Edition yesterday:
let me know when the Times rebills Rudy and smacks him down for his attack on Senator Clinton
must suck to work for Shrub toadies
And about that phone call from wiffy Judi Nathan Giuliani:
good graphic, but what’s the deal?
is the mag. too toxic to recycle?
Oops! Good morning Christy. ;->
Yeah, Rudy sucks, but I think the Borger quote above is something to consider.
Do we help Republicans by attacking them this early? Right now, they’re just fighting for the approval of their base. In the general election we should let fly to whomever the Repugs nominate.
But in the primary season, maybe we’re giving them too much free publicity. Just like the Senate censure of MoveOn only served to help MoveOn, perhaps liberal attacks on Republicans right now only serves to help them.
And in the ‘08 election, I would say the ball’s in our court, so I’m more concerned with who the Dems are going to nominate and would like to see more action geared toward getting ourselves a good candidate rather than another corpratist shill with a better sense of public relations.
sufi at 8 — Do we then help them by allowing them to brand themselves and have a free hand at the media narrative, rather than helping shape that narrative by pushing back at their false mythology creation? It’s not an either/or answer on either side of the fence here…
WAH!
Holy schnitzel! What a freaky video. He’s one of ‘those people’ that wields a cell phone like a sword of rudeness, cutting his way through any air of civility. Not surprising.
Cell phone etiquette tells you alot about someone. What makes that moment even weirder is how some in the audience defend it, and Ghouliani’s attitude of “look how loving and caring I am to my family.” Yeecch! We all know how that is not the case.
bonkers at 10 — That’s “look how loving and caring I am to my third wife, that I dumpd my second wife for while we were still married” — as long as we’re being precise…
Christy Hardin Smith @ 11
He’s serious about fidelity this time though.
-GSD
Christy Hardin Smith @ 11
“…and my kids hate me…”
From the Chicago Tribune link in Christy’s post above:
The link also has a YouTube video of the phone call moment.
Democracy Now…today
War & Peace Report … Now 2 Hours
Hosted by award-winning journalists Amy Goodman and Juan Gonzalez
*Monday, September 24th, 2007: Listen/Watch entire show.
Click here to buy today’s show at our online store.
Today’s Show
Headlines for September 24, 2007
- 100,000 Protesters March in Burma Against Military Junta
- Judge in Jena Refuses to Release Mychal Belll on Bail
- Police Near Jena Arrest Two Men For Dangling Nooses From Truck
- 73,000 General Motors Employees Threaten To Strike
- Bush to Seek $200 Billion More For War in Iraq & Afghanistan
- Blackwater Contractors Return to Streets of Iraq
- Bush Skips UN Climate Change Talks
http://www.democracynow.org/index.pl
John Edwards
healthcare forum up on CSPAN 1 now
My impression of this stunt was Giuliani appealing as “one of the guys” that has to put up with a call from the “little woman” & garner the support of all those man men who begrudgingly indulge their wives.
CHS at 9 — you may be right, I was just exploring the question, it’s something that hadn’t really occurred to me before so I haven’t thought it through yet.
But it certainly seems plausible and something perhaps we should consider. I’m not so concerned with our blog discussions here, but expensive ad buys by MoveOn might not be the best use of resources.
Again, I’m not suggesting I have the answers, I just think these are interesting questions.
Your point about allowing them to frame the debate and creating their own mythology is very well taken.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 11
Good morning, Christy! Hope you had a great cup (or two or three) of coffee this morning. My tea got me going.
The little lady deserves a Nancy Reagan tiara.
In this weekend’s Michigan straw poll Rudy finished fourth[10.6%] behind Romney[39%], McCain[26.5%] and Paul[10.8%].
Thompson garnered 7.2%.
Rudy is like a beached whale. First he attracts and then he repels.
Rudy’s nemesis, The Village Voice, on Rudy’s Don Corleone routine:
As it stands now, there is no impediment to them branding themselves. They have the help of a enabling media. The left’s message machine exists mainly in the blogosphere and it leaks out into the mainstream slowly if at all. Unfortunately, we are still playing catch up.
Ms. Christy — do you really think the WaPo is Thompson’s BFF, and if so, is there another link besides that Akers piece?
When I saw that Rudy bashfest front and center on the front page, I was actually gonna give the Post some love today….but since the element of trust is long gone from our tumultuous 20 year relationship, I am interested in this ulterior motive you suggest…..
oddmommy at 23 — I could give you a host of links. They have been giving Thompson quite a bit of love the last few months in terms of coverage, most of which has been soft and fuzzy.
oops
Good Morning Christy!
Christy Hardin Smith @ 9
I agree with you here Christy - Push Back Early, Push Back Often and Push Back Hard……
OT - Scott Pelly’s interview with Ahmadinejad was disgraceful, and I mean Pelly’s condescending attitude and repetition of administration lies. I thought Ahmadinejad handled himself well.
I also think the “protest” against his presence in New York or his wish to visit ground zero are absurd on their face. But think of the reaction the First Fool gets when he goes anywhere - they have to close down whole towns (ala Montebello Quebec recently) because he is so vehemently hated virtually anywhere he goes except maybe Israel.
I hope Dan Rather wins his suit against CBS and Viacom, I only wish he was asking enough to drive them into bankruptcy and force them off the air - they perform a dis-service to the American people and the world. I shall be expressing my feelings to both CBS and the producers of “60 Minutes.”
The whole “lets’s get cell phone calls from the little woman” gambit is meant to humanize Il Rudy, and make him seem like a regular guy — even though “regular guy” Giuliani’s personal fortune is between three and four times that of “rich guy” John Edwards.
I have to love it. Hollywood Fred and Rudy, battling it out to be the values candidate and standard bearer for the GOP.
GSD @ 12
And if he were a smoker, he would no doubt say he could quit anytime.
OKK at 28 — I know. It’s a hoot, isn’t it? *g*
It will be interesting to see what congress does about Admadinejad speaking at Columbia today. Will they call for a vote to remove all federal funds from the university? This will be an interesting free speech statement by both sides of the aisle. MoveOn move over while Columbia gets the screaming meanie finger wag.
oddmommy @ 23
Don Graham is quite in the spell of the Bush-Cheney cabal, and Fred Thompson appears to the heir apparent they’ve designated. If the news section has capitulated (mind you, they’ve resisted mightily in the last six year), then I would expect the hagiography to continue. Fred Hiatt’s support on the editorial page is expected, of course.
In this weekend’s Michigan straw poll Rudy finished fourth[10.6%] behind Romney[39%], McCain[26.5%] and Paul[10.8%].
Thompson garnered 7.2%.
Rudy is like a beached whale. First he attracts and then he repels
lol where is the story about the Ron Paul surge or is that only reserved for when Hucksterbee does well
and why aren’t real reporters asking if Hucksterbee is really running for the senate
theExile @ 26
Here is another clip of Pelley on a morning program about his interview. I had no idea Iranian President Ahmadinejad lived so humbly
Have we ever heard an American reporter ask such tough and direct question of any Israeli
official about their massive stockpiles of nuclear biological and chemical weapons that go undeclared and uninspected, Hell no never
in3289200.shtml?source=RSSattr=HOME_3289200″>www.cbsnews.com link
I thought the Ghouliani phone call was delivered like a bit from Bob Newhart. It’s just an act, and he’s a terrible actor.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 24
hmm, on reflection I guess you’re right, there has been a lot of “news” coverage about Thompson’s comings and goings….I just haven’t paid it any mind.
Reckon them “Freds” has gotta stick together.
bleeaagh
Phoenix Woman @ 27
Doesn’t his wife know when he is speaking - what does she say - “bring home a loaf of bread, 2 quarts of milk and a new tiara ’cause my old one is dusty?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 28
Just imagine the extra fun we’ll have with Newtie running. *evil grin*
Christy Hardin Smith @ 24
The WaPo knows that there’s no way Rudy makes it out of the primaries — and that even if he did, the dirt on him is crippling. SERIOUSLY crippling.
That, combined with the fact that a non-trivial portion of the GOP’s primary base voters aren’t too fond of East Coasties or non-whites (and to these people, Italian-Americans and Latinos are non-whites) and think that Catholics sacrifice babies at Mass, means that Rudy’s support is at best a mile wide and an inch deep, much like Kerry’s in 2004 among the Dems. (Note how when Thompson first announced, he immediately took thirteen points straight out of Rudy’s hide? Those almost all came from Southern and Southwestern Protestant base voters who were happy not to have to vote for an East Coast Italian Catholic.)
And here’s MoDo on the phone call moment:
You gotta love it… Also note how MoDo refuses to call her “Judith.”
I am not near a T.V. I hope folks keep on the look out for how much air time the Anti_ Iranian president protestors will get on the MSM. More than likely they will get far more than the anti-war marchers have ever gotten.
I don’t even think his wife was even on the line. If you listen to what he says, it doesn’t sound like he’s actually responding to another person at all. It’s all in the timing of his “responses”..it is too rapid.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 28
and the likes of James Dobson, guardian of the “family values” sanctuary, caught between an, um, rock and a hard place, as our book salon guest pointed out yesterday….gotta looooooove that too.
LS @ 35
it sure overshadowed the “awkward’ of his prior gun stance and there he is in front of the National Rifle Association.
It effectively changed the subject that day.
scory @ 38
I don’t see that as fun, I see that as torture. I hate listening to any word out of his big mouth.
theExile @ 26
Pelly managed to make Ahmadinejad appear a reasonable and intelligent person being interrogated by a government agent. The White House (or Darth himself) could have written the questions.
Disgusting.
It is a good thing to remember that just because Bush and Ahmadinijad are at odds, that doesn’t mean that Iran’s President is a saint — he is decidedly not, based on a long history of activity. Bush isn’t either — and it’s no excuse for Scott Pelly acting like a jerk during an interview. But let’s be careful not to canonize someone simply because he is not a friend to Bush. And, fwiw, I feel the same way about Chavez in Venezuela — dictatorial, self-aggrandizing egos all and sundry in my book. But that’s just me, perhaps…
the ONLY thing that makes the sight or sound of Rudolph Guiliani endurable to me is the knowledge that soon…..SOON……he is going to be flushed away like the primordial slime he is into the distant sewer of forgotten history.
The Flushing Remonstrance was a forerunner to the first amendment of the U.S. Constitution that gives people the freedom of religion, speech, press, assembly and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. On December 27, 1657, It was signed by thirty Flushing residents who risked fines and banishment imposed by Governor Peter Stuyvesant (later Giuliani) in order to state their call for freedom.
Queens County celebrates the 350th Anniversary of the Flushing Remonstrance.
http://www.discoverqueens.info.....rance.html
Christy Hardin Smith @ 47
I agree with you, but I still LOVED that schtick Chavez did at the UN…..
is Scott Pelly the CBS 60 minutes dude? I saw that interview too, just didn’t know his name. He’s a pompous ass.
Here’s Chimpy on presidential nominees:
And who might that Repug nominee be? Here’s Chimpy again:
You gotta wonder what Chimpy’s motives might be about Hillary.
Kathleen @ 41
Did the Washington Journal have speakers from the Washington peace march on their program and I missed it? I didn’t see anything. Much of this morning was dedicated to Admadinejad’s appearance at Columbia. Bet they get far more coverage than the peace march. Many people didn’t even know it had taken place and the ones who did only know several demonstrators were arrested for violent conduct.
LS @ 42
I agree. That first phone call, I think she was on the line. The second one, no. It was totally staged to try to take the tension out of the room.
In case this hasn’t been mentioned - the Mackinaw (MI) straw poll for Republicans had Guiliani in 4th place, behind Ron Paul.
btw, I loved the pix that i used for this article. It was such a perfect marriage of visual and sentiment. *g*
There are a lot of reasons to criticize Rudy. How about his agreement with Condi and Christie, that New York’s air was safe to breath. It was a very toxic dust produced not by the collapse, but the explosions that destroyed WTC 1 and 2. See the many videos showing upward and outward, identical explosions for both Towers. It is a fact that most items, desks, computers, and body parts were vaporized.
The EOC in hardened “bunker” of WTC 7 was abandoned, without orders by Richard Scheirer before the second Tower was destroyed. WTC 7 employed Federal law enforcement and spy agencies, and was an important resource. Sheirer committed dereliction of duty and was rewarded by working for Giuliani Associates.
WTC 7 was destroyed by a perfect controlled demolition after 5:00 pm. There has been no evidence presented that any significant damage occured, even though fire fighters did not fight the small fires in WTC 7. This is controversial but the Emergency Office in WTC 7 was abandoned just when it was need most-without orders. That is cowardly.
It is also interesting that the destruction of WTC 7 was reported by the BBC before it actually happened. It is also interesting that Kommander Guy saw the first tower hit by the jet on television even though it was not televised.
Biodun @ 51
Well I suppose we should take it as good news that one of the folks who predicted we would be greeted as liberators in Iraq is also predicting a victory for Hillary. Maybe there IS hope.
Helpless Dancer @ 22
Democrats have no brand and are still playing catch up because they let the Republicans set their agenda. This Petraeus ad was a perfect opportunity for Dems to take the bull by the horns, but they are so into defense mode that they were unable to seize the day. The minute the other side started making objections, they could have shut it down by overlaying every objection with objections of our own, to wit: 1)Free political speech is the first amendment to the Constitution. Does anybody have any objections to that? 2) So it’s only okay to trash a general if he says something Bush doesn’t want to hear, citing Schinseki, Abizaid, Casey, Odom, et al. 3) You seem to be upset that someone in uniform’s service is being denigrated; why weren’t you objecting when it was John Kerry’s just before a presidential election? Or Max Cleland before a Senate race? Or John McCain, for that matter? So what is your real agenda? 4) It’s very convenient that you are making more of this ad than of the success or failure of war in Iraq. So what is your position on where to go next with this war? 5) I see you would rather discuss an ad than the possibility that we may go to war with Iran next?
With the way that the Dems are demonstrating their professional skills, I’d say it’s lucky they are no longer depending on individual clients in a law firm. Surely most would have been sued for malpractice. They are not good negotiators and not good at defending their position. Branding may be the least of their problems at this point.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/S.....e/ShowFull
“Hoenlein wrote Bollinger Wednesday: “While I respect academic freedom and the importance of diverse views being heard, it would not violate those principles to deny a platform to someone who persecutes his people, denies freedom of speech in his own country, violates the UN Charter with threats to destroy other states, and is the leading state sponsor of terror,” he wrote.
Abraham Foxman, national director of the Anti Defamation League, called Columbia’s decision a “perversion of the First Amendment.” “If Bollinger wants to communicate with him let him send him a letter; there’s no imperative to let him speak,” said Foxman.”
Odd how people are all about free speech as long as it supports their views, and will do everything they can to block opposing views.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 47
You bet this is a key point! I remember when people would look to Mao as some wonderful benefactor. He slaughtered millions of his people with the “sword” as well as starved them to death. His prisons are still notorious. Would I have marched with Mao? Not in a million years. And I wouldn’t stand with any other dictator, including the one in the White House.
Re: Ahmadinejad:
I’ll say what I sadi in the last thread: Although he’s the head of Iran’s Revolutionary Council, he really takes his marching orders from the Ayatollah.
Rather off topic but after Sunday mornings shows, it seems evident that the ruling class has picked HRC to be the next president. The Brooks bull shit just tells it all.
Kathleen @ 59
I agree, Columbia should never let Bush speak there ;-)
Ironically, if Bush did speak at Columbia (or anywhere else) he would make sure the crowd was carefully vetted and controlled.
Graham and WaPo’s interest in Fred doesn’t surprise me. To them, he’s a local and “our kind.” Also, to imagine him as President would mean more politics as personality rather than performance. Makes their jobs easier.
Fred’s VP choice would be important…could be another Cheney type of move. I continue to wonder about FT’s health — much less his sincere interest in actually serving other than a ceremonial role.
The Beltway types know that Rudy is an authoritarian nut case and can’t be trusted to do their bidding. Judy could be a fascinating First Lady to cover …. tiaras anyone. *g*
And re: Hillary:
EPU’d from last thread:
Biodun @ 99
Hmmmmm….7 ex-CIA question the veracity of the 9/11 report:
http://www.opednews.com/articl.....rans_c.htm
oddmommy @ 50
The whole tone of that interview just raised my hackles. Pelly playing the tough journalist,parroting Admin talking points about IEDs and nukes and getting offended because Ahmadinijad was smiling. Judging by the tone of all the segments,60 minutes has gotten the corporate message. First they canned Rather and now they’ve capitulated entirely.
CEO @ 62
Re: Hillary II:
EPU’d from last thread:
Biodun @ 114
I want to know if the good old USA is such a strong country…. the best…. you know the lines .. are we so weak that it cannot have anyone visit and tour our sites like Ahmadinijad.
If America is THE GREATEST Country… shouldn’t it be able to withstand a few days visit by the President of Iran? I know the guy is a wacko, even some of the Iranians think so but IF we are so strong then why can’t the country withstand ONE man visiting?
Biodun @ 51
they r talking about it on msnbc right now…
CEO @ 62
The fix was in from the beginning. Same thing happened with John Kerry. The fix is in for the Republicans as well. Come election day, like in so many third world dictatorships, we the people get to vote for the fix. The only difference is we have two fixes and dictatorships have one.
I just can’t stomach the thought of Hillary as the nominee. The woman is a walking, talking windvane.
Frank33 @ 56
Mornin Christy, PW and pups,
If wtc7 was pulled as Larry Silverstein stated, I’d sure like to meet the brave, fleet-footed soul who ran in and installed the charges in a burning building.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 47
Christy - let’s talk about dictatorial, like Bush and Cheney. The US is author of all it’s problems in Iran, and the rest of the world. The Iranians DID NOT overthrow a freely elected American government. Oh right, you don’t have freely elected American governments anymore, they are selected by the SCOTUS and bought by the corporate elite.
Pelly told Ahmadinijad that Bush’s message to him was:
Sounds to this observer like the Commander Codpiece is describing himself…………..
QuakerGirl @ 52
exactly
Christy Hardin Smith @ 47
We should also remember that while Ahmadinejad may be president of Iran, he is not “Supreme Leader”, that title belongs to Khameni.
Also, Iran used to have a democracy, but we decided that that was bad for control of our oil. My take on this history is we ought to be a lot more humble in deciding who should run other countries.
Kathleen @ 74
Washington Journal did have the woman from ANSWER, and the right-wing guy on the morning of the 15th (I think it was that day).
Kathleen @ 59:
Re: the “Israel” lobby that is yet to be named:
The new book by John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt describes this lobby as:
I would add Alan Dershowitz to the list of individuals.
Helpless Dancer @ 67
there was one point when Pelly, parroting Bush, asked him how he would respond to Bush’s accusation that he has made his country an international pariah. I was SO hoping Ahmadinijad would say something along the lines of, “I could ask you the same question, Mr Bush.”
CHS — you need to put a “tm” next to revisionist mystery! We are laughing at our house this morning about that one!
Frank 33 said
This is, pardon my French, bullshit.
The building was destroyed by several hours of fire, with the generator fuel feeding it.
Go down to your friendly library and read the Aug 25th Science News cover story - structural and materials engineers have been doing serious studies of what happened (it isn’t at all easy: very large models and lots of computer time are involved), and they can get the same results without any demolition materials needed.
theExile @ 74
Exactly my thought when Pelly said it!
Biodun @ 51
Hmmmm. I’m beginning to think that Guiliani is the designated, although “uncrowned” successor.
After reading this article, which points out
I think it makes sense. Look, Guiliani is many things, certainly, but can you see him continuing the whole “war on terror” rhetoric?
Absolutely.
Can you see center-leaning Democrats voting for him (since he seems liberal enough, for example the abortion position)? Yeah, especially if the whole NYC Mayor thing doesn’t sink him, and it hasn’t so far, he remains up in the polls.
And Bush is so unpopular, he doesn’t dare publicly support anyone he’d actually like to run. In fact, by trashing Guiliani as he appears to do, he might figure he’d spark a bit more interest in Guiliani.
I’m thinking that the administration is courting the DINO segment of the population this time around, figuring that the rightytighty religious nutjobs are welded to the Republican party now anyhow and in any case the DINO votes could be enough to tip over. Plus which, we already know that they won’t run the vote honestly in any case (eg, the electoral vote grab in California, the ongoing shenanigans over evoting in NY).
I wonder. I really really wonder.
theExile @ 74
we are of like mind.