Login Here
It's "gimme more FUs day." The Petraeus/Crocker Dog and Pony Show and WH-Written Talking Points show continues. Meanwhile we have a special guest -- Rick Noriega -- for a live discussion today, coming up shortly.
_______________________
Consider this a thread to discuss Petraeus/Crocker testimony.
Democracy Arsenal is running an ongoing fact check of the testimony. And do take a peek at this post from Swopa.
Share This 
Spotlight
ZED
Free speech!
Betrayus and crock of bulls%^t
I had a shot at zed
zip?
The surge is working…!!!
zed?
Thanks Christy.
siete..
Adie:
Did you see my question at the bottom of the last thread?
Live blogging from 2:30 - 3:00 is available in the comments of the previous thread starting with comment # 97 and includes the following 14 parts, since I learned the hard way to save before the long sections vanish:
One Two Three Four Five Six Seven Eight Nine Ten Eleven Twelve Thirteen Fourteen
Biodun @ 9
Yep. Thanks. In fact, answer is right under it;->
Democracy Arsenal has been opened in another window since John Aravois gave us the link.
There has to be at some point a plan for the Iraqis citizens who are vulnerable to attack when the US military redeploys out of Iraq. What kind of humanitarian effort will be made for all those men, women, and children who would targeted for attacks for reasons like religious persecution, or affiliation with the US military?
This rosy picture of some future point in time a contained cooperative democratic Iraq that respects all non-secular groups in a equal fashion is just incredible…
Congrats on your speed, CTuttle!
I like the idea of “Squid” being Crocker’s alias.
Gotta go pups. Let my honey use the toobz I been hoggin’ all day. *blush*
{{{{{{Peace}}}}}}
Just a reminder folks, for the sake of the servers and to help Christy out, please stay on topic and keep the one-liners to a minimum. Thanks!
Absurd that Ros-Lehtinen wants Move on to apologize for calling Patraeus “Betrayus”/
She should start with a good example and apologize to the Iraqi people for supporting an unnecessary war that has resulted in hundreds of thousands of injuries and deaths, and millions of refugees. She should apologize for suppporting the Israeli invasion of Lebanon, she should apologize for pushing hard for cutting off all aid including humanitarian aid to the Palestinian people. She should pre-emptively apologize to the Iraninan people who might die due to her push for a pre-emptive strike on Iran.
Go first Ros-Lehtinen your crimes are far more serious than MOVEOn calling Patraeous “Betrayus”
Move on must have gotten the report beforehand. How did they know?
EPU’d.
The military is dickering with facts I think.
Today there were 9 troops killed and all but one death is attributed to vehicle accidents.
Accidents are ‘non-hostile’ so they are not used statistically as war related.
One of the ‘accidents’ happened when a vehicle flipped over and caught on fire…kind of like what happens when a vehicle gets hit by an IED.
The surge is working…..rinse and repeat.
-GSD
“Squid” is slang for Sailors, don’t defame of the Navy people. Call him something more apropos. I am at somewhat of a loss for anything that is not profane, however…
some box flaps and rachmaninoff’s 2nd piano concerto:
http://freewayblogger.blogspot.....inoff.html
is we all better now that the oracles have recited bushco TPs? i aint lernt a damn thing i didnt know before….
Wow, Cindy Sheehan was one of the four arrested…
I thought Cindy Sheehan was retreating from all this. She was arrested protesting this morning.
Tweety: I love the (aqua velva) smell of Al Queada in the morning.
I wonder why nobody has asked if the “decrease” in deaths could be a function of changes in the way they count the deaths? Or has it (I was distracted by a phone call earlier.)?
juslin @ 21
really worth listening to the complete GAO and retired Generals report. More substance. Both at C-Span
juslin @ 21
I think I need a bath now…
Uck…..
for your browsing pleasure during the break….
It’s a series of tubes!
Biodun @ 23
http://cindyforcongress.com/
Ann in AZ @ 25
“If the bullet wound is in the back of the head, it’s sectarian.
If the bullet wound is in the front of the head, it’s criminal”.
ticktock @ 13
Wish there were c-span cameras in Syria so that the 2 million Iraqi refugees could watch this. (maybe they can access, would love to know what they think about all of this)
I just find it interesting that the hearing is being held in the same room used for the house ‘Unamerican Activities’ hearings. Fitting.
Petraeus’ charts
http://media.washingtonpost.co.....er2007.pdf
Kathleen @ 31
Iraqi refugees residing in Syria should have been invited to this bullsh*t meeting…
watching code pink being removed…i dont like this at all
Tony F=ing Snow-job on C-Span
“Petraeus is committing what some people think is the politically unforgiveable sin of succeeding.”
What a bunch of shit.
hearing ready to resume…..
As we wait….
The Dems need to KICK SOME ASS!
anyone still mad at me for sticking up for the Code Pink people?
Big Mitch predicts:
The new talking point is that Dems are angry because the surge is succeeding, as we learned from Petraeus and Crocker.
nonplussed @ 19
Croctopus
someone give skelton a shot of something plz to wake him up
Biodun @ 23
Cindy has been walking across the country you can go read her blog at the “IMPEACH BUSH” website.
theWalrus @ 38
Our dreams fulfilled. But not today, IMO…
juslin @ 35
As I note downstairs, Code Pink are a critical part of the anti-war movement, now, as in other efforts. They draw attention to themselves and the ludicrousness of the pro-war group, plus allowing a certain elasticity in the left position in this manner, opening up the arena of discourse so that people who want to be viewed as more centrist can move toward the left. The right has long done this with the likes of the clowns Limpballs, Savage and Coulter who become the far right fringe alllowing everthing up to that line to be viewed as centrist right. I applaud and thank Code Pink for their service to this nation and this cause.
Ed*ard Teller @ 39
Absolutely not! Free speech for all lest our union die!
et@39
i’m in your corner.. i remember demonstrating in the late 60s & 70s of course i’m a tad older than a lot of folks here
Ed*ard Teller @ 39
here’s my take:
Many Americans believe that the government said it so it must be true. They believe that there is no dissension from the line of shit we are being asked to snort. Code Pink is filling a void. They must be given credit for doing so. I wish there were someone else to fill the void in a better way.
kdh22 @ 46
I’m with you.
BBC poll on Iraqi opinion
(may have been linked earlier, if so, forgive please)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6983841.stm
Folks let’s keep the Code Pink contretemps OFF this thread please! We know different people have differing views on the group and let it stay at that moving forward.
Thank You.
Richmond @ 45
Me too! and while I do not like everything they do (really did not like when they stood directly behind Valerie Plame during her testimony a real distraction and dis-service). Many of them are devoted to peace and justice.
Dumping tea in a harbor wasn’t looked upon as couthe(sp?) either.
Ed*ard Teller @ 39
I love you for it
BigMitch @ 36
Isn’t Snowjob still under contract to the “vast right wing conspiracy”?
Who’s up?
ET @39…
You’re doing OK. on this. But you know that. ;0)
Oh.My.God.
Crocker has now added an Ed Kochian “ehhhhh..” to his otherwise prolix and voluble speech pattern.
The Lurking Mod @ 51
Thanks
kdh22 @ 53
You may have spelled it wrong but take comfort in the fact that there is no such word. Only “uncouth.”
Looked at Democracy Arsenal. I find nothing to disagree with there.
zennurse @ 33
Look at page 14 of the charts. Compare the number of attacks in Summer’06 vs Summer’07. Attacks are up per the General’s own charts when viewed that way.
Taking Big Mitch on his point “I wish there were someone else to fill the void in a better way,” does anybody have a suggestion? They yell, they wear pink, they get ejected. What’s to change - the yelling, the pink, or what?
Ed*ard Teller @ 39
Not on this thread. As Jane once said, what was said at the last thread stays on the last thread. Nerves have been quite frayed lately. I wish everyone could just vent their anger at the real enemies.
I can not keep from thinking about what it would be like to be an Iraqi and watch this group of Imperialist who are responsible for the disaster in Iraq discuss the direction of my country. It is so absurd.
I have never been so ashamed of my country or Reps!
BigMitch @ 60
http://wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=couth
Berman: Refugee problem. Does US have responsibility to help refugees particualry those who helped US?
P: (Will he f-ing answer the question?)
totally OT, Reagan’s first wife died.
Romney’s Boston office burglarized
Ed*ard Teller @ 63
Take off the pink and have some of these regular folks do what they are doing.
as we sit here the war rages ever on….and on….and our economy sucks royally right now….politely…..
mui @ 67
Not being addressed
S’more free speech?
Top general tells Congress military goals of buildup met ‘in large measure’
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20689394/
“We have never armed tribes… “
LIES, LIES AND DAMN LIES
zennurse @ 68
Ironic. She had a movie on TV last night.
I’d like to hear a committe member ask: How many people will be killed in Iraq in the next 6 months? How many Americans, and how many Iraqis?
Betrayus: Feels strongly about refugee issue. Courageuous Iraqis etc. Feesl we have obligation to them.
*So what’s the contigency plan, Argh!?*
I’m beginning to think I was right about Bush being willing to ignore the fact that if he doesn’t reduce the number of troops, he’ll “break the military.” Via TPM:
So, one brigade to satisfy John Warner’s “conscience”, and then we’ll think about pulling out some more, but definitely not before March.
That really doesn’t sound like giving in to reality and drawing down troops in the spring so the Army doesn’t get any more broken. What will the Joint Chiefs do when he ignores their strenuous protests and extends deployments to 18 months?
I think I’d better go write to Webb and suggest he ask about whether they’re going to extend deployments, and if not, how they’re planning to continue the escalation until July.
Don’t watch TV, so didn’t get to see Code Pink’s protest.
In the 1960s, anti-war protests proved to be good TV entertainment. Good for TV stations. Good for the anti-war movement.
IMO, the anti-war movement today will be helped along by TV coverage of anti-war activities.
The 1960s prove there is no anti-war protesst activity reasonably close to the bounds of law that is too outlandish.
Didn’t see ‘em, but I’m with Code Pink.
Anti-war arguments should be disciplined and logically sound.
Anti-war protests should be filled with fire and emotion.
repugs do not go off the WH TPs to a man or woman!
You know, I think they are just killing or imprisoning anyone who doesn’t agree to submitting to Bush’s rule. Bush is the ruler of Iraq, not Maliki. Bush decides who is Al Qaeda and who is not. I’m not kidding about this. Bush is the ruler of Iraq. Bush/Cheney have taken over another country and are ruling it from the WH. This is freaking insanity. Iraq is the 51st state!
Jeez, what a lyin sack of … petraeus talks about caring for refugees…he creates refugees! wtf!
How many oil wells have we liberated herr zombie general?
mui @ 76
Feels strongly enough not to enlighten us as to a f*cking plan regarding these people….
Ed*ard Teller @ 39
Not me. Someone needs to serve as the Conscience of the American People in those hearings.
Bob in HI
Remember how some of our folks hated the Beatles because of their long hair and message?
Protests…”Take them into custody!!” Skelter.
Oh, that’s rich! Petraeus: “We have never given weapons to tribes.”
Maybe they didn’t hand them out, but they let the Iraqis have as many of them as they could carry off by not guarding them properly. My opinion is that we have armed both sides in the Iraq conflagration (that includes the civil war between the Sunnis and Shia, as well as the Sunni on Sunni and Shia on Shia violence.)
Protestors being removed once again
we cant ignore the protests in the room…
Kathleen @ 69
I think if I lived in DC I might be there. But probably not in pink, even though I like the color. At the last Anchorage Symphony concert last spring, the sponsor was Exxon. When an announcer asked the audience to thank Exxon for their generosity, many clapped, some stayed silent. I booed. Loudly, embarrassing my wife only a bit, but I was glad I did it.
Ed*ard Teller @ 39
Bill of Rights
Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
ET, you’re in good company.
Kathleen @ 69
Spare me Kathleen, and that has been effective and changing anything? Stopping the war is like capturing an elephant the old way, you need lots of people going after it, in some cases using different methods.
After that crap Saxton speech to Petraeus & /or Crocker, I don’t mind the protesters for once.
crocker seems rattled to my eyes
BigMitch @ 60
How ’bout this:
Dumping tea in a harbor was deemed uncouth too.
Anti-war arguments should be disciplined and logically sound.
Anti-war protests should be filled with fire and emotion.
Well said!
What a leading question!!: “If we leave in the wrong way what will be the result?”
Ed*ard Teller @ 89
Exxon: the people who brought you the Valdez Oil Spill.
LS - you are very right about what they are calling success in Anbar - everyone should read what progress in Fallujah looks like:
Dahr Jamail on Fallujah
Finally a question about the refugee crisis but they were allowed to kind of dodge the answer…..
Also wish they would quit making it an all or nothing on leaving. I haven’t heard a Dem yet say that we should leave immediately, but more than a token withdrawl is needed.
It didn’t look like she was wearing pink and had an American flag on. Everyone happy now?
Petraeus/crocker strategy: Never underestimate the gullibility of American politicians, or their willingness to roll over for patriotism.
What I haven’t seen much of– and I hope someone asks Petraus about this– when he talks of the cost of leaving, will someone please ask him about the cost of staying?
What this administration as always avoided, from the day after infamous 9/11, was what the cost would be. People were fired for daring to estimate the cost. They’re quite happy to go on at length about their fears of the cost of “cutting and running,” but VERY reluctant to say anything about the cost– not just in dollars, but in deaths, maiming, and psycho-social impairment– of staying, and not just to us, but to Iraq. Make’em talk about the cost of staying, every day, on every facet of this terrible and infantile exercise in imperialism.
Bob in HI
i’m sick of the 2 jersey asskissers..where’s some jersey dem reps on this joint hearing? damn
Crocker: we have to consider consequences of our actions.
When the hell did they start this?
OK. I’ve had enough.
Over three hours and not ONE probing question.
I’m going out for a walk and contemplate what this country will be like after it collapses.
See you there!
I’ve done similar actions to the folks speaking up - it’s hard and weirdly scarey but at least someone in the room is trying to speak truth.
And the idea that the D’s will prosecute disgusts me.
Crocker’s facial expression resembles Alan Rickman as Snape.
1,592 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND..
Citizen Lurking Mod and the fIREPUP pATRIOTS:
“Let’s keep the Code Pink contretemps OFF this thread please. We know different people have differing views on the group and let it stay at that moving forward.”
You didn’t really just say that to the free citizens of FDL didja “Moderator”? The “contretemps” involving Code Pink is NOT about Code Pink or different folks’ views of Code Pink…the DIALOGUE around this group’s actions is what FDL and free politics is all about! We are tryin ta find a way forward to impose the will of the people on an authoritarian power structure that is murdering people all over the world and has been enslaving and murdering American citizens for 200 years!!
Don’t you dare give us a condescending verbal slap on the hands for trying to create an analysis of the shit we’re in in order to move democracy forward. Shame on you!!
KEEP THE FAITH AND WHEN IN DOUBT GO BACK AND THE THE CONSTITUTION WE’RE TRYIN’ TA SAVE HERE!!!
When you get into this thing about freedom of expression, where do you draw the line? And I’m not talking about yelling fire in a theater.
BigMitch @ 104
About 30 seconds ago.
Cara @ 99
If you read my note on #13 I believe that in order to have a credible exit plan it should incorporate a humanitarian effort strategy to protect the Iraqis civilians as much as possible…
Prosecuting Code Pink will give them another chance to make their case in public.
Part of civil disobedience is getting prosecuted and using that occassion appropriately.
contra: siun at 106
The Bush administration dresses up in suits and lies. Purple suits won’t change the lies.
P: on amnesty. ?!? Conditional immunity.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 109
Taking off my shirt and dancing on a table top….
Just kidding, had to lighten up, okay?….
Jeebus @ 73
It is a mark of this administration that they lie shamelessly.
Bob in HI
It is Skelton’s response that has me infuriated.
juslin @ 93
Agreed. & Betr. ditto, early on. Haven’t been watching last few min.