Anybody ever worked a job where you would get your ass kicked for working too hard or fast by union members. Maybe if the unions hadn’t pulled all that bullshit wit featherbedding it wouldn’t have been as easy to do away with them. (I am now hiding in my bunker)

My father was once upon a time an accountant for a construction company and told about two things that got his attention.

1. A union member had to be present to run the cement mixer. What it took to run it was to press the on/off switch.

2. Every crane operating needed a union crane oiler to service the crane. This was a separate and additional person from the crane operator. Never mind that one crane oiler could have easily handled many many cranes at the same site.

Oh, I don’t know about that…India’s got a few problems right now. It’s possible their entire government will walk out because a power bloc has broken up over a dispute about a joint naval exercise with the U.S. The U.S. could find itself on the outs, and India already has too much control over IT assets for this country; it’s a national security risk.

Hmmm, interesting. Although, I believe it was Lenin who said “a capitalist will sell you the rope to hang him with.” Seems to me there are already lots of national security issues that have been ignored — selling Boeing plan designs to China? WTF?

If you have the skill set, you might think about starting a small company that specializes in providing personal service to small-medium businesses. A micro-business, like a mom-and-pop shop, don’t have the ability to do their own IT work and they often don’t have the time to do regular maintenance. You’d not only be helping them immensely, but you’d be out of the cube farm and dealing directly with real, live humans.

Sadly, no such skill set. Totally left-brained, verbal.
I am thinking of starting a small factory to make “tinfoil chapeaus”, though. Looks like that market might be exploding soon. (see next thread)

Unfortunately, I don’t think unionization can prevent off-shoring. That’s how they avoid the union altogether – just send it offshore.
I’ve figured from the start of my call center job that it could go to India any time. Then, I suppose I’ll have to be a Wal-Mart greeter, since I’m “too old’ for anything else.

there must be tariffs on any industry that off shores to countries that don’t have collective bargaining

bing, problem solved

Unfortunately, I don’t think unionization can prevent off-shoring. That’s how they avoid the union altogether – just send it offshore.
I’ve figured from the start of my call center job that it could go to India any time. Then, I suppose I’ll have to be a Wal-Mart greeter, since I’m “too old’ for anything else.

Oh, I don’t know about that…India’s got a few problems right now. It’s possible their entire government will walk out because a power bloc has broken up over a dispute about a joint naval exercise with the U.S. The U.S. could find itself on the outs, and India already has too much control over IT assets for this country; it’s a national security risk.

Amazing that we don’t see this getting picked up in US media, huh?

If you have the skill set, you might think about starting a small company that specializes in providing personal service to small-medium businesses. A micro-business, like a mom-and-pop shop, don’t have the ability to do their own IT work and they often don’t have the time to do regular maintenance. You’d not only be helping them immensely, but you’d be out of the cube farm and dealing directly with real, live humans.

On the other hand, most corporations are corrupt. It is not just Enron. Even broader categories are industries – pharmaceutical, insurance, oil, energy, security, agricultural to mention a few. Unions work best for large corporations. Without them, workers have little to no rights. Their pay can be reduced, benefits reduced, hours increased, vacation time decreased, etc.

Thanks to unions we no longer have child laborers in this country, thus the celebration of Labor Day. Now we continue this practice off-shore. Corporations cannot be trusted to “do the right thing” without being made to do the right thing.

Rather than criticizing the concept of unions, we need to recreate them to fit a modern, better educated, more sophisticated worker. Unions need to be updated. Everything spirals downward over time. Rather than throwing out the baby with the bath water, let us put our collective heads together and address what would be appropriate for the role of unions.

I am looking more into Andy Stern these days. I am interested in where he is taking the concept of unions. There must be others out there.

Albatross @ 85

I’m an IT contractor, and what I’ve noticed recently is that domestic placement firms, that help contractors find open positions for a percentage of their fee, are being aggressively undercut by offshored (read: east Indian) contracting firms.

These firms employ giant call centers that scour all of the major resume sites (Monster, Dice, etc) to match workers with jobs. They are totally undercutting the local, domestic firms with which I’ve worked for years.

But they’re not only undercutting the placement firms: they are under orders from their clients to reduce rates. Big companies aren’t even providing their professional openings to domestic firms, but are restricting them to offshored firms with orders to cut rates.

Today I got an offer from one such firm for a rate ONE THIRD of my highest rate, less than half of my lowest rate.

I’ve tried to bypass the firms and communicate directly with the employers – many of whose placement personnel I know personally. They have confirmed that these companies are trying to drive down rates, for two reasons.

First, of course, to save money on those they do hire for these lowered rates.

Second, to justify bringing over inexpensive offshored H1-B workers to fill in for a “lack” of domestic workers. Of course when they’re offering 1/3rd or 1/2 of a fair rate, you will create that lack of domestic workers…

Yup, that’s exactly what I’m seeing as well, and that’s why the “white collar” IT sector needs to unionize and unionize fast. I actually make less than I did when I first graduated in this field. It’s crazy.

Unfortunately, I don’t think unionization can prevent off-shoring. That’s how they avoid the union altogether – just send it offshore.
I’ve figured from the start of my call center job that it could go to India any time. Then, I suppose I’ll have to be a Wal-Mart greeter, since I’m “too old’ for anything else.