Breaking! Bush May Bring Some Troops Home!
Just a rough guess, but I suspect there have been at least 100 stories in the MSM since January, and 10-15 or so in the last month explaining that the extra 30,000 troops Bush sent over for the “surge” could not stay there beyond next April because we’d have to rotate them out. Secretary Gates and others promised they would not extend the length of the Army’s 15-month Iraq tours, and there were no additional troops we could rotate in to replace those we have to take out to keep that promise. We’ve had story after story explaining that we’re already breaking the Army and being cruel to their families, and we have to end this.
So no matter what, the US is going to reduce by about 30,000 the number of troops in Iraq starting in the next 6-8 months. No matter what, we’re going to bring them home. We’re going to do it whether the “surge” is a “success” or a “failure,” whether we’ve achieved the latest version of our objective or we haven’t, whether al Maliki gets an oil law passed or sells all the oil to China, or whether he rehires all the ex-Baathists Bremer fired or deports them to Tom Tancredo’s District with fake Social Security cards.
General Casey and the Joint Chiefs have told us repeatedly we can’t sustain the extra 30,000 soldiers in Iraq; they’ve told Bush that in face-to-face meetings. The New York Times and the Washington Post just reported the meetings in which these messages were delivered. In fact, the Times story reported that one of the issues discussed in the meetings was whether it was wiser to start the draw down earlier and more slowly, to give us a strategic cushion we currently don’t have, or to wait until April, when the withdrawal would need to occur more rapidly and inflexibly to meet the inexorable rotation requirements.
Notice I haven’t given a single link, because that’s the homework assignment I’m giving to the nation’s major media. They can use Teh Google. After they find the dozens of links to their own stories, they can use the corrections and apologies page to explain the following mindless stories, complete with misleading headlines and unchallenged White House propaganda from Monday-Tuesday:
From The New York Times (New England Final print ed.):
Bush, in Iraq, Says Troop Reduction Is Possible
The Times then reports without critique the President’s claim “that only making Iraq stable would allow American forces to pull back.” And then there’s this:
After talks with Gen. David H. Petraeus, the top American commander in Iraq, and Ryan C. Crocker, the ambassador to Iraq, Mr. Bush said that they “tell me that if the kind of success we are now seeing here continues it will be possible to maintain the same level of security with fewer American forces.”
Mr. Bush did not say how large a troop withdrawal was possible. Nor did he say whether he envisioned any forces being withdrawn sooner than next spring, when the first of the additional 30,000 troops Mr. Bush sent to Iraq this year are scheduled to come home anyway.
Still, his remarks were the clearest indication yet that a reduction would begin sometime in the months ahead, answering the growing opposition in Washington to an unpopular war while at the same time trying to argue that any change in strategy was not a failure.
Nowhere does the Times explain that 30,000 troops must come home, and that it doesn’t matter whether Petraeus thinks we can do as well with fewer troops. It’s not just a “schedule,” it’s a required rotation out with no replacements.
Administration officials rejected the notion that the trip was a publicity stunt. They said Mr. Bush wanted to meet face-to-face with General Petraeus and Mr. Crocker, who are to testify before Congress about progress in Iraq next week . . .
That’s funny. I thought I read an article by the Times’ Mr. Sanger that said Petraeus was just in Washington to be part of the “face-to-face” Pentagon briefing to the President. The whole gang was there. A prize to the NYT editor who finds this article. Hint: five of you read that story, and you should read this.
From the Washington Post:
In Iraq, Bush Cites Gains
President Suggests Continuation Could Allow Drawdown
There is no mention in the WaPo story even hinting that the 30,000 have to be rotated out in April or so. But the WaPo does turn over the rest of its article to the White House, printing the following WH spin without the slightest analysis or critique:
Administration aides said the choice of location was intended to signal that gains here could be replicated in other parts of the country.
No, the choice was dictated by the fact that a remote desert air base in total US control, with a 13-mile perimeter guarded by 10,000 US combat soldiers and 120 miles from Baghdad, was perhaps the only safe place Air Force One could land. Is that the model the WaPo thinks could be replicated?
Bush said that he and other members of his national security team “came here today to see with our own eyes the multiple changes that are taking place in Anbar province.”
Absolute rubbish. They didn’t see Jack. The entire time they were on a remote US airbase guarded by 7,000 Marines and 3,000 Army combat troops. 120 miles from the continuing horrors in and around Baghdad. The base has electricity 24/7, running potable water (plus showers and flushable toilets), a PX, basketball courts, probably a Pizza Hut. Condi showed up in a pants suit with high heels and a purse; Gates was in a business suit — in 120 degree temps. The visitors saw a permanent US air base that no Iraqi can even come close to without permission, a security check, a retinal scan and an armed escort.
Bush stressed that any drawdown of troops was conditioned upon continuing improvements in security. No decision had been made on a reduction, he said. But security had improved to the point that he could “speculate on the hypothetical,” he said.
Fantasyland. The math of rotating in/rotating out dictates the withdrawal by April. The only question is whether to start it sooner for purely tactical reasons. And once again, the claim this wasn’t just a stunt:
“I don’t think a presidential visit will cause people to vote one way or the other,” he told reporters on the plane.
Right. The WaPo apparently believes that all the cameras waiting at the bottom of Air Force One, where Secretary Gates and the Generals were dutifully waiting when the President came down the ramp, with feeds directly back to the US for the evening news cycle were just fortuitous. And they just happened to have a set of klieg lights handy for Bush’s nighttime statement in front of the armored Humvees. Iraqis should look to New Orleans for what comes next.
From the NYT’s sister paper, the Boston Globe, which reprints the WaPo article: Bush Says US Troop Reduction Is Possible
Reuters: Bush Cites Iraq Progress and Says Troop Cuts Possible
CBS News: Bush Envisions Possible Troop Cutbacks
PBS NewsHour: President Bush Delivers Prospect of Troop Cut in Iraq
Associated Press: Bush Sees Possible Troop Cuts in Iraq Oh, and AP: did you notice you just got punked, again? How many times is that?
WASHINGTON – President Bush’s senior advisers on Iraq have recommended he stand by his current war strategy, and he is unlikely to order more than a symbolic cut in troops before the end of the year, administration officials told The Associated Press on Tuesday.
When Abraham Lincoln may have said you can fool some of the people all of the time, and all the people some of the time, this is how that can happen. All it takes is a lazy, gullible and complicit media.
Update: Eric Boehlert of Media Matters has an excellent article on how the media spent its summer trying to forget about Iraq.
Extra: Each week Selise compiles an annotated list of Congressional hearings for the week. You can always find them here. Thanks, Selise.
Photo: AP/Charles Dharapak
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yo
Dos!
Same as they did with us Crow. I rotated in Sep 69 and they billed it as a withdrawal of the 9th ID. They didn’t withdraw shit, they just shifted the troopers ETS’ing and transfered elements of the 9th elsewhere. And they say we didn’t learn anything from Vietnam.
“All it takes is a lazy, gullible and complicit media.”
Truer words were never typed.
Scarecrow,
Even Hacktacular Howie called BS on the spin in his Media Notes column today in the WaPo0.
Smoke & Mirrors is all this is. Bush don’t give a crap about the troops. I think Jenna’s fiance ought to join up.
Good morning, all. Thanks for the great post as always, Scarecrow.
My question for the day, however, is how can anybody listen to that guy in the blue shirt and take him seriously?
The madness just goes on and on and on…
OT – another U.S Attorney job opening up – in Indiana…
http://www.indystar.com/apps/p…../709050473
dakine01 @ 5
Funny what happens when Kurtz gets away from his desk for a while, and mingles with the masses.
It is maddening, but I believe public opinion on Iraq has moved well beyond the Bushies ability to manipulate it with these Potemkin events.
They could “see with their own eyes what’s taking place.”
Yup! PERMANENT BASES!
dakine01 @ 5
Good for Howie. Blogging has been good for him. Teh Google is a mind-changing thing.
You know, in light of the previous day’s article on the psychology of repetition to create a perception of truth (independent of whether or not the issue in question is true or not), I’d like to offer up the following:
Say “lazy, gullible and complicit media” every time you refer to the media. Yes, it’s already true, to the point of redundancy, but let’s turn it into a meme and release it into the wild.
I would like to do that with Diaper Dave, as well, but that’s more OT…
I saw a cartoon somewhere, Rove sitting on the grass in dialogue with Socrates, asking, “But isn’t it true that repeating a lie over and over makes it the truth?”
Scarecrow @ 15
You mean, here?
Scarecrow @ 15
Eli used it on this thread last night
Shorter GWB: “Pulling troops out of Iraq? Good idea – great idea. As long as it’s *my* idea.”
peanutbutter @ 16
Wow, do I keep up, or what? That will be another two hundred years in purgatory, and that’s on top of the several extra months I’ll get for laughing at Pach’s new almost-dogs.
Unfortunately, they haven’t been doing even this level of homework. Maybe that explains the decline in public attention to the “major media” and the
surgerise of Olberman. Regardless, seeing Howie in print without the blinders on is a good sign.Good morning, everyone!
This is take 2, since I EPUed myself…
I woke up to hear the latest “terror disaster that’s been diverted” – they were talking excitedly on my local CBS radio affiliate about how the US has foiled a dangerous terror plot in Germany – one designed “to kill Americans just because they hate Americans.”
It is absolutely amazing how the US manages to discover and announce such major terror threats “in the planning stages” every time before a major report on the war status is to be released. Uncanny, I tell ya.
Fortunately, I found something to help me cool off. No, I haven’t made an iced cappuccino yet (gonna do that right after this post). I read this clip from Bill Maher (August 24th show), as posted on Daily Kos. It got me to laugh out loud, particularly at the end. I thought you all would enjoy his snark this morning.
Bush would have LOVED to have Goebbels on board…
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
–Joseph Goebbels
Scarecrow @ 19
Those are some itty bitty critters!
Scarecrow @ 13
Did Pach strike Howie with a thunderbolt?
for a bright spot on daily news… great interview with anthony romero (aclu executive director) on democracy now! today.
OT – looks like our favorite mine owner, Bob Murray, is going to no show for the scheduled hearing today. He’s got more important things to do than testify in front of Congress. Guess that leaves Stickler on his own.
Is attributing that quote to Abraham Lincoln a joke I don’t get? Or is it just a big mistake?
raven @ 23
First rule of etiquette: Never make fun of someone else’s kids, including their pets.
Second rule: never be around someone who violates rule number 1, because you might laugh.
dov12348 @ 22
I just love how long it takes for “science” to play catchup in some areas. What takes painstaking experiments and observations in human nature is instantly understood by a handful of people — and it seems most often those people determined to use that understanding to the detriment of everyone else around them.
I have no doubt I could root around in ancient history and find yet someone else saying this same stuff. There’s nothing that hasn’t already been said before, thousands of years before…
raven @ 23
Yeah. I’m afraid my labs would step on them by accident :-O
“or deports them to Tom Tancredo’s District with fake Social Security cards.”
Hey it would have as good a chance at succeeding as their pathetic plans. I say let’s do it.
BDB @ 27
Well, with me, either is possible. Who said it?
OT BREAKING!
Proof that Al Gore is a funny guy (via ThinkProgress):
“GORE: (Laughs) Of course the vice presidency is part of the executive branch! But I fear that I’m losing my objectivity where President Bush and Cheney are concerned. Not much surprises me anymore. I have a lot of friends who share the following problem with me: Our sense of outrage is so saturated that when a new outrage occurs, we have to download some existing outrage into an external hard drive in order to make room for a new outrage.”
Scarecrow @ 28
When my wife and I first met she got this cocker spaniel. I had never been around them, always had big dogs, and thought yuk! What a great dog he was, heart of a lion. Goes to show you never can tell!
Diane @ 26
Will Congress hold this bastard in contempt? Or are they still that wimpy?
And our homework assignment is to SPOTLIGHT to all of the offending media.
mc @ 33
Ah, I <3 Gore. It’s funny, though, he was such a stiff, pompous ass in 2000. I blame it on the political straightjacket he was in then. I doubt we’d be seeing this side of him if he’d been President (or at least not this early, it would have had to wait till after to emerge).
I mean, honestly? Who would have predicted Gore would have been such a superstar? You would have been laughed off stage seven years ago. I would have laughed you off, and I have always liked him, even at his most publicly humourless…
Is it possible that the president just plans to ignore any scheduled rotation of troops? I don’t know the rules and regs about it, but as CIC does he have the authority to cancel all rotations indefinitely, and what would happen if he did?
Here is a Washington Post editorial today on ElBaradei, if you can stomach it. It’s titled “Rogue Regulator” (That meddling bureaucrat!).
I don’t know whether to interpret the peeved and exasperated sloppiness of the thing as an indictor of increased or decreased likelihood of an attack on Iran, and I no longer care.
This portion where Fred Hiatt argues, “No, we’re not crazy, really” is priceless:
“Emboldened, he has now set himself a new task: stopping what he considers to be the “crazies” in Washington who “want to say, ‘Let us go and bomb Iran.’ ” We’re not part of that camp, though we consider its members saner than many of the statements of Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. But what’s really unacceptable is Mr. ElBaradei’s way of accomplishing his aim, which is to excuse the Iranian activity that most justifies the would-be bombers…”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01810.html
Joe Klein’s conscience @ 35
He was probably invited, not subpoena’d, so spine has nothing to do with it.
As was said of the Romans: They make a desert and call it peace.
ReneND @ 36
ahead of you there
pile on
All anyone has to do is read “THE” plan for the middle east on the PNAC website. Iraq was to be the first of many countries that are to be toppled with permanent bases. Iran, Syria, Lebanon are also on the list.
Also, there are as many “contractors” as there are military personal. They can’t control Iraq even with over 250,000 private & regular military.
Going for my first cuppa…. anyone one want one?
Scarecrow @ 32
Abraham Lincoln.
It doesn’t make a tinker’s damn what “success” the surge has. Any reduction in the violence in Iraq, both at the occupying army, and in the sectarian attacks, will clearly, unspinnably, be achieved at the point of a gun.
The surge has one purpose: to move bush and his strategy wizards that much closer to their get-out-of-town date with the graydog, while they dump the whole shittaree in the laps of the democrats.
And the questions which practically every MSM outlet know NOT to ask when they have the bushturds on, is:
“What makes you people think that when the troops start to come back, this “stability” will continue? What evidence can YOU assholes, who CREATED this monstrosity out bullshit and lies, and whom are now PROVEN to be as wrong as two left feet about EVERY fucking thing you pimped to us, give us that THIS assessment is correct, and that for some totally unknown reason, whatever reduction there is in the body count, ours and theirs, the “stability” will continue when we start withdrawing the surge?”
“OR!!! Do you plan to make this permanent?”
(P.S. We hope you don’t mind if the democratic candidates running next year bring THAT to the attention of the voters…)
Ay yes. 2003 redux on El Baradei. It seems like only yesterday that the lying, compliant media was happily abetting Bush’s war by trashing all of those who counseled patience and adherence to simple facts.
Who can forget the smearing of Scott Ritter. The dismissing of El Baradei. The ridicule and scorn heaped on Hans Blix.
Same as it ever was.
Thanks Fred Hiatt, once a dickskin always a dickskin.
-GSD
Joe Klein’s conscience @ 35
Murray was not subpoenaed to testify; he was invited. Therefore, he is not in contempt anywhere but in public opinion which is meaningless to him.
No one will be holding their breath waiting for the traditional media to set the record straight. It’s their job to propell the propaganda. The traditional media is as big a problem if not bigger than the administration itself. Lazy, complicit and compliant. Nothing will change until they are supplanted with new voices that reach the masses and not just the blogs.
From Liberty Tree’s Famous Lincoln quotes.
I’m sticking with the Lincoln myth, because I believe in the value of useful myths.
But the blogs say otherwise.
Perhaps an invitation will turn into a subpoena, hope Senator Byrd is in fighting form today.
Scarecrow:
A propos your previous post — you can’t talk about Bremer and Bush without mentioning Wolfowitz and Feith. Bremer disbanded the army after returning to the U.S. to “consult” with them.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..ge=printer
peanutbutter @ 37
I remember the SNL skit (a takeoff on West Wing) he did shortly after the 2000 election-poignant AND funny. I remember thinking “Where was that Gore a few months ago?”
mc @ 51
I firmly believe if they’d let him out of the cage for the campaign he would have won hands down. Everyone was complaining about his lack of charisma back then. Agh. And even then he DID garner enough votes…but no need to go there again…grrr…
scarecrow,this is what I don’t understand;
patreas is the general that wrote the manual explaining how to overcome an insurgency
in his own manual it explains the only way to do this is through manpower, I don”t have the metric but I believe he estimates no less then 1 soldier for every person
that translates into at least a few hundred thousand soldiers, this is the manual that the other general used to base his assessment before the war…forgive me, I forget his name but he was run out of the military for comming forward
so why isn’t this manual being thrown in the generals face, why don’t they challenge him and tell him using his own metric this engagement must end in failure and he is dooming our armed forces to a failure he himself wrote must come
we need to challenge this mans personal integrety and make his concience step forward so he testifies according to his oath to country instead of according to his loyalty to cammander in chief
Chimpanomics in its last throes.
Layoffs skyrocket.
-GSD
One of the best posts I have ever read. The media just time after time write down what this idiot says, without comment, and pretend that that is the news. It is also obvious that no Republican can be elected President if there is not outward flowing momentum from Iraq throughout 2008. All the Republican candidates know that they can count on this coming and they can count on the media to spin it as a victory of sorts just as they are spinning it already.
brendan @ 51
Yeah, I thought it was interesting that the decision managed to get the approval of all “the stupidest people . . .” The whole gang had their finger prints on this one.
Something to watch for:
Sarkozy, and then Merkel, finally caving, and sending French and German troops to pick up the slack from the Brits leaving.
I’m not saying it’s going to happen, but I will GUARANTEE you guys that bush is begging and wheedling and offering SOME kind of deals to try to get even token units of the respective militaries, for “training purposes for the Iraqi army”. All he needs is German and French bodies there, to share the target duty.
IF he can find some way to do this, and IF Sarkozy and Merkel think that whatever bush is offering them will be worth the anger from a substantial part of their countries, it will be new life for the clusterfuck.
“but no need to go there again…grrr…”
…unless there is an announcement in the near future…?
How much does Al weigh these days?
OT, but Stan Brand was on Today show talking about representing Craig in front of the Senate ethics committee. I laughed loudly when he said (I’m paraphrasing here) that the Senate generally doesn’t take up misdemeanors committed by Senators in their private lives–only “high crimes (etc)” done in their official capacity. So he pointed out that if the Senate wants to take up every miscellaneous infringement and traffic violation done by a Senator in their private lives too, they’ll be spending all their time doing that and won’t have time to do anything else.
Good show, Stan, keep on truckin’. And this is just one of his three lawyers! They are screwing the Republican party royally! I love it.
peanutbutter @ 37
I admit, I was one of those snookered back in 2000. I thought Gore was stiff as cardboard. Lucky for me, Gore won PA anyway(though I never voted for the Decider). Now, I would gladly volunteer for Gore if he were to run.
From CNN.
The main motivation of the group in Germany is hatred against American citizens and therefore they had as main targets the American military installations,” Jorg Ziercke, president of Germany’s Federal Criminal Investigation Office, said.
America the hated.
-GSD
Ann in AZ @ 59
One of Craig’s other lawyers is the guy who represented Vick re: the dog fighting charges.
GSD @ 61
What is it going to take Democrats to point out that Bush is OBL’s wet dream? Allah couldn’t have answered OBL’s prayers any better than giving him the Decider.
Very much on topic; there have to be clips around of Russert, Matthews, Carlson, and all the rest of them, dripping with gravitas, as, beginning 5 years ago, they helped pimp the war to us.
We need to start digging those up for YouTube, etc, as much as we need to do it with the bullshit-slathering from bush and his coterie of fuckups.
The following headlines are deceptive and misleading:
The lie is the use of the word “possible,” where the truth is that the word should be “necessary.”
Why “necessary“? Because we don’t have sufficiently many troops to simultaneously maintain the current force level and make good on the commitment to fifteen-month tours. It’s very simple arithmetic.
What difference does it make?
In the original form, it sounds like the surge has been so successful that we can now start bringing troops home. If fact, the surge has been so unsuccessful that we’ve depleted our forces and must start withdrawing.
It’s all a matter of framing. And what a difference a word makes!
HJC hearing on FISA has started, webcast here.
perris @ 54
Even the neocon/kagans argued they didn’t have enough, and complained in December/January that 15,000-20,000 would be woefully short. So they said, 20-30,000 or more “combat” plus another 15,000 or so for support. But the Pentagon complained we couldn’t supply that many without extended tours, calling more National Guard and Reserves. It was politically unacceptable.
I don’t think Petraeus ever believed he had enough troops; he had all they could give him and tried to make it “enough.” All the recent stories are suggesting the alliance with the Sunnis just fell into his lap, and unlike the ideologues, he realized he could use it to his advantage and make up for not enough troops. Now they’re trying to link the surge to this alleged “success” and as Bush said, “now that we’ve succeeded, we can withdraw some without harming security.” It’s all smoke.
scarecrow
you know what the democrats need to do when patreas testifies with his report?
first they need to challenge his judgement and ask him if this is the way he himself would conduct this engagement or if he is “just getting by with the resources available”
they need to set him up by asking about his manual first
then they need to ask him outright what he needs in resources and manpower to guarantee success
then they need to ask him if he subscribes to the powell doctine, overwheling force with clear goals
then they need to point out that the gao comes as close to calling him a liar as is possible without using the word “liar”
they need to point out the true metrics in lives lost, that they have risen not fallen, they need to point out the goal posts have moved every time the goals cannot be met
they need to point out most of the gains that are aleged happened where there was no surge, where the Iraqi’s were left to tend to their own governance
then they need to point out the other gains are becuase of the amount of Iraqi’s that have fled, died, and been “cleansed”
and then once again they need to ask him if he had unlimited resources, what does he need to guarantee success
that last one is the main one becuase he will unconditionally ask for more men, men that cannot be delivered and he will have to submit the plan as it stands is likely to fail
GSD @ 62
but, but, but why would they hate us? Is it our freedom? Our compassion? Our fairmindedness? Our media tells us America is the source of rightousness and justice in the world. Are we not the chosen people?
Scarecrow @ 57
Come on, Scarecrow. That’s not what I was getting it. It wasn’t “stupidity”. The State Department’s plan, and Garner’s, was to make some use of the army. Bremer was put in precisely to make the opposite decision. The army would have been an anchor of Iraqi sovereignty, and removing it created the justification for occupying the country. Bush I kept the army intact and negotiated a cease fire with it to avoid a “vacuum”. You don’t think that decision was uppermost in this administration’s mind?
O/T but Robert Greenwald is dogging Rudy Giulinani (in a good way). Vote
Dude, where’s my nukes?
First thing I saw when I flipped on CNN this morning. Half a dozen nuclear armed cruise missles misplaced for a time.
selise @ 66
Merci Selise!
perris:
Democrats “need to” do this and they “need to” do that, but they won’t: they’re the ones who suckled this viper Petraeus.
Most of the ground forces/infantry are National Guard stock and Grunts. The Army is underrepresented in Iraq, I believe. It’s mainly the weekend warrior types who’ve played the water carriers for Der Shrubbenführer over the 4 long years.
brendan @ 74
they are afraid, they are mere children with new found authority and they are afraid to swing their lance
they need to be informed by us, in our calls, in our fax’s and our emails that this is what we expect
they had better learn how to conduct their office and fast and we have to lead these horses to the well and force them to do what needs to be done
But then this is what Bush says today in Sydney, standing besides his pal John Howard:
Tanbark @ 58
I think others’ contribution are more likely to go to Afghanistan, and that can free up a few US troops for Iraq. There was a fine series in the NYT recently about the deteriorating situation in Afghanistan — complete with a set of maps showing the reemergence of Taliban control, in each of the last four years. half the country is now either in their hands or up for grabs, with Karzai confined mostly to the capital.
perris @ 54
You are absolutely right and people did discuss that with him before the surge began. The ratio mentioned in Petraeus’s manual was something like 20-to-1.
He said that he intended to have that ratio in one area at a time, and temporarily have holding actions in others. In January, he gave that tactic only a one-in-four chance of working.
Republicans on HJC hearings on FISA providing cover for Bush again. Same ole same ole.
brendan @ 75
too late to edit my last post but I wanted to add;
we write here not to talk among ourselves, that’s the perk, we like each other
we really write here because we think we are read by those we’ve elected, we think we can help shape their performance
and we are right about that, we don’t know when or how many but we do know we are read here at the lake
we know when we make suggestions they are soon delivered by some democrat if the suggestion has legs
and this is the real reason we participate at the lake isn’t it
wigwam @ 78
I recall there were several blogs (Greenwald?) back in January revealing how disingenuous AEI/Kagan et al were being with the numbers.
perris:
Petraeus is a creature three or four years in the making. I think he was assigned this political role from the beginning, and accordingly festooned with accolades by the media, ever since the “success story” of Mosul.
mui @ 72
i am recording the audio – if all goes well, i will post later… so firepups who missed it can give it a listen (as far as i know, it’s not being covered by c-span).
sounds like there may be some sparks. here’s hoping.
Fantastic post Scarecrow. Sounds like you got all the cockroaches–even the ones in the corners. Thanks for your wisdom.
1,589 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND..
Citizen Scarecrow and the Firepup Patriots:
I jest watched Rep. Brian Baird on C-Span, this guy is the bellwether for the battle to save our democracy. Baird said that the war was SOOOOO bad because it was mismanaged and poorly planned but now that we have destroyed Iraq we have a moral obligation to keep the fighting goin’ until…well, until we rebuild it in our image. Blue America, Move On, and all the grassroots progressive platoons must target this guy and run a well funded opponent in the primary. It would be better for the country, the anti-war movement and the Democratic Party to have a Republican win this seat back than re-elect this bastard.
I say that about ALL the corporatist DLC/A*PAC candidates in the Democratic Party EVERYWHERE. The battle for the life of American democracy is bein’ waged inside the Democratic Party and the only way we create an antithesis to the corporate fascism bein’ advanced by BOTH parties is to isolate the Clinton-A*PAC-DLC hierarchy and leadership…even if it means losin the White House and the Congress again.
A permanent occupation with military garrisons that would have made imperial Rome proud and permanent war on the people of Iraq, Iran and the United States is what awaits behind the phony bullshit of “we have a moral obligation to stay in Iraq.” We can not afford a Democratic Party that contains Mrs. Clinton, Harry Reid, Rahm Emmanuel, Joe Biden, Stenny Hoyer and Brian Baird…even if we lose the general election we win if these folks are no longer Democrats and are exposed as loyal Bushite corporatists.
The battle for the heart and soul of the Democratic Party is the battle for the life of American Democracy…John Edwards and Al Gore are the only folks who have a chance to coalesce a movement to beat the fascification of America.
KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE AMMUNITION, THE DEMOCRACY YOU SAVE WILL BE YOUR OWN!!
wigwam @ 80
and we aquesed with a one in four chance of success…we didn’t bring up the powell doctrine I suppose
and we didn’t point out that “one area at a time” is the exact definition of “whack a ball” or “whack a mole” or whatever they want to call it, it’s whack the ball over there and then whack it back over here
Helpless Dancer @ 73
All that money for defense. All that money for security. Where’s it going? Sigh.
Joe Klein’s Conscience:
The irony of it… :o)
I voted for Gore in 2000, but I am totally opposed to his running again.
I understand that the republicans basically stole the election, and I understand the sympathetic feelings for a lot of people who would like to somehow set that right, by having him run again, against a republican, whomever he is, having to defend bush’s loon-crusade.
But the facts are:
The GOP should never have been within a SCOTUS decision of winning the presidency in 2000. Gore ran one of the most inept, confused, and defensive campaigns in recent political history. He gave John Kerry lessons on how to roll over and play dead for these conservative know-nothings.
He couldn’t carry his own state, Tennessee.
And the dead-lock capper for why he has NO business running again:
HE PICKED JOE LIEBERMAN AS HIS RUNNING MATE!!!
(where’s the little barfing icon, when I need it?)
selise @ 85
I have bad reception. Is it true they said only one Repug showed up?!?
perris:
Yes, of course. And I’m not as inertly resigned to things as my pessimism might make it seem.
Also, in fairness to Democrats, here was a sharp comment of Reid’s about Petraeus: http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..02093.html
ccmask @ 86
Copy that on the kudos. Scarecrow really had his flashlight out there today. Got em all.
brendan @ 82
And he has been well rewarded. Two stars since this clusterf*ck started.
Shorter Petraeus: War has been very very good to me.
OT–
Just wondering. Minneapolis has been at the center of national (maybe even international) news recently: the I-35W bridge collapse and Larry Craig’s prurient behavior in that men’s room at the Minneapolis-St. Paul airport. Then there’s the Repug National Convention next year in the Twin Cities. Any possible connection at all among these events?
Just wondering. Any MN FDLers at the Lake today?
Is the sole Repug purposely dressing like a person from the Coldwar Era?
selise @ 67
I hope they have been given the information that the entire adminstrations goal has been to eliminate the fisa court
and I want someone on that panel to point out that without warrants the administration is asking for the right to steal, plain and simple, they don’t want anyone to see what they are stealing and that is the only reason they don’t want to show how they are listening to
I guarantee they are listening to political oponents and to bussiness competitors
this I guarantee and they should guarantee it also
they should say that right up front;
“I guarantee these programs are listening to political adversaries and bussiness competitors and I guarantee they are stealing”
then force the administration to prove that they are not stealing
bing…warrants are back if they have to prove they are not stealing and that is all that needs to be pointed out
perris @ 87
The other “mitigating factor” going in was anticipated assistance from the Iraqi army. But that never materialized.
Brendan, when I hear people like Russert and Matthews pissing and moaning about the blogsites, it’s music to my ears. :o)
“Too chickenshit to ask the real questions and risk your cushy jobs and fat salary? Don’t worry, Tim and Chris…we’ll ask them for you, and slowly but surely grab some of YOUR audience, while we’re doing it.” :o)
mui @ 87
i think conyers said that only one R wanted to make an opening statement.
the webcast quality is worse than usual. :(
i can hear it, but it’s not great.
Good point, Scarecrow; the switcheroo is more likely.
Wait Bob Barr a witness?
Afghanistan is on track to top the coalition death toll from last year. Which was the worst since 2001.
The Afghanistan numbers are starting to mirror the early days of the Iraqi insurgency.
-GSD
mui @ 96
yes. witnesses are:
The Honorable Bob Barr, Former Member of Congress
Morton H. Halperin, Director of U.S. Advocacy Open Society Institute
Suzanne Spaulding, Managing Director The Harbour Group
Professor Robert F. Turner, University of Virginia School of Law
mui @ 100
He’s really been good on this issue.
WHy do some people like bob barr sound better out of office than in it?
peanutbutter @ 8
It certainly does which raises the question what, if anything, can we supposedly sane individuals do? Or are we prisoners of fate, carried along by decisions of greater minds than our own? George Bush is an asshole. Do we need more links demonstrating his lies and deceptions? I guess we do. Not much to blog about otherwise. Can we also consider actions we, individually, might take to make an impact on the powers that be.
I think a no buy day makes sense for a consumer oriented society like the USA. Imagine a day when Best Buy, supermarkets, car dealerships everyone opens and no one crosses their thresholds. Can blogs organize it? It would be a powerful statement with no one risking anything more than a smaller credit card balance. I’m mad as hell. I don’t want to take it any more, but it’s not something I can do by myself.
GSD: remember, Bush said that the reason they hate us is because we’re free. (Um, aren’t we a lot less free than we were seven years ago?)
I decided to write a little ditty for George Bush and his terra defense plan:
George Bush and his War on Terra keeps us safe. Every time bad news is going to come out, he “proves” to us how safe his war on terra is keeping us.
Bush is like the Annie of foreign policy.
Don’t look now, but our troops will likely be rotated right into Iran!
Welcome to the apocolypse, American-Bush made. I’m sure because God told him so.
As Gordon Lightfoot said, “It’s been good to know ya” (I think that’s what he said)!
Any suggestions on a relatively decent and safe country to immigrate to? Because I think we’re in for one HELL of a ride here; and I do mean that literally.
Ahhh, what the night shift does to me…
Biodun @ 95
Harmonic convergence.
JF @ 103
People can evolve. Let’s hope a lot of folks in the government get a jump start on that. We need people to speak out.
Biodun @ 95
Hey Biodun,
You know I’m ALWAYS interested in rooting out the shadowy hand of the world puppet masters in all supposedly ‘coincidental’ events (I blame it on Umberto Eco); but the generalized incompetence of Tim Pawlenty’s Republican Gubernatorial efforts are probably just the what they appear to be: the eventual result of tragically myopic planning.
You know Pawlenty is dying to get a new bridge well under way before the Republican convention comes to town — hence the ‘rush to build’ without adequate planning — but I wouldn’t be surprised to see that backfire on him, as well. We can only hope it doesn’t kill more people, but I doubt that is foremost in his planning considerations, either.
We’ve come a long way from the Minnesota Miracle.
Let me get this straight. All major media outlets have previously (though quite recently) reported that troops would have to be withdrawn for the simple reason that there aren’t enough of them and they need to rest. Nothing political about it. Pure common sense.
And now the media is saying that its Bush’s stategery to draw down (some) troops because he is the decider (and he is very strong, resolute, the guy you want to have a beer with, and now cries real tears).
egregious @ 111
Barr is a classic libertarian conservative. He finds government snooping on its citizens morally repugnant. I suspect he thinks the same of Bush, as well.
Ed Kunin,
We’ll have to agree to disagree on your proposal of a one day strike. The Bush administration is doing a good job of one thing, destroying the middle class. Let’s not help them along, ok?
im4mary @ 109
I agree..Iraq is now a “shiny object” as the Iran war is being geared up. Peter Pace, ever the book licker, was fired because he was the leader of the resistance to the Iran war in the military. His term expires at the end of Sept.
hackworth @ 113
Yep, but one more piece. Bush claims he might (but see today’s “probably not”) reduce troops because and only because the surge is working. That’s the story most of the media reported, even though their own previous stories showed it was all nonsense.
that was a powerful statement by Suzanne Spaulding, Managing Director The Harbour Group
must check out The Harbour Group
Larry Craig is now mentally unfit.
So says the latest GOP spin attack.
Hang in there Larry, they’re coming after ya hard but we want you to stick it out, metaphorically that is.
-GSD
egregious @ 115
I would prefer the Congress go on strike. Simply stop cooperating with this Administration. Give them nothing except what’s absolutely essential to keep Govt functioning. Refuse to cooperate until they leave. Spend every day describing the horrors.
I’ve been saying for months that nothing — nothing — positive can get out of Washington until this criminal regime is gone from office. I don’t see the point of pretending otherwise, and i see a lot of benefit in the Dems simply declaring it, every day.
hackworth @ 113
Yep, that’s the gist, as Scarecrow has so succinctly (and then laboriously) outlined. In another breaking story, apparently George W. Bush is planning to have the earth’s gravity operate at an acceleration of 9.8 meters per second (just like it has every day for the last four and a half billion years). He’s a madman for all this decidering. Isn’t it glorious to witness a leader who has finally found his stride?
Steve-AR @ 110
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I thought that the Admiral(can’t remember the name)in command of the middle east theater let it be known that an attack on Iran would not take place on his watch.
johnSwifty @ 119
Should be meters per second squared (m/s^2). Sorry, units geek here.
Helpless @122: Fallon.
“Hang in there Larry, they’re coming after ya hard but we want you to stick it out, metaphorically that is.”
707
Eric Boehlert has an excellent article at Media Matters on how the media spent its summer.
Hey, Firepups! Based on the headline i.e., “bad reporting,” this is not even OT:
I just called the Diane Rehm Show (and GOT ON) because they were “covering” the campaign, and there wasn’t one word about ISSUES! (yes, I’m yelling).
I said it broke my heart that that’s all they were talking about, and that my friends and I {g – who could I mean?] talk about issues -
who has a real plan to address the health care crisis? Who will really end the war? Who will RESTORE OUR CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS?” And that I like Edwards, but he is hardly covered.
The host seemed to take me seriously, but the man to whom she gave the response COMPLETELY ignored and mischaracterized what I said, set up his own straw man to knock down ( Edwards isn’t being covered because he’s neither black nor a woman), and then went on to “defend” covereage because, are you ready?
“We” shouldn’t JUST cover issues, it would be terribly boring to not cover the horse race, “I” find the horse race terribly interesting, and so it’s perfectly okay that we talk about the horse race.
None of which, of course, was even close to what I said.
GAAAAAAAAA! Yes, I am mad.
Now, sorry, Scarecrow, I’ll read the rest of your post and the comments.
JF @ 123
It was a poor attempt on my part all the way around. Apparently Sydney operates at 9.7.
Well, George W. Bush is still an idiot, if that’s any consolation.
Today, Glennzilla’s victims are Fred Haitt and Michael Ledeen: http://www.salon.com/opinion/g…..index.html
johnSwifty @ 110:
*g* I can see the connection between that bridge collapse and Pawlenty. I also see his connection to the Gooper Convention, since he pushed for it here. But how is he connected to Craig’s act in the now-famous men’s room opposite the food court at Northstar Crossing ? Any speculation on that?
johnSwifty @ 126
Some things will always remain constant.
brendan @ 118
Thank you. So much detail to keep in mind, somtimes this get lost. Like nuclear weapons.
OT–I don’t know if I’ve just missed you guys discussing this or not, but I thought I would put it out there because I think it is fascinating.
(From the preview of a preview of an upcoming book by Jack Goldsmith in the NY Times) NY Times link
For more local context on how remarkable this is for Mrs. Ashcroft:
.
From Jake Wagman’s political blog in the St. Louis Post website
jayt @ 9
WEll, it looks like she isn’t going for the big bucks job – Ivy Tech is a community college. Surely can’t compare to ex-LA USA Yang’s pay.
Jayt-
btw – I saw your post the other day about trying to get back to practicing law after a several-year break — I’m thinking about something similar, too. Can’t remember – are you one of the Central Texas firepups?
Elliott @ 116
The Harbour Group
hmmmm?
JF @ 131
I though we were slowing down. That’s my excuse for feeling heavier.
Shorter version: Bush talks out of ass again, press eats it up again.
OK that came out slightly worse than I meant it to.
I’m sure most FDLers know by now that Boy George talked to Robert Draper about how when he’s out of office he’s looking forward to going on the speaking circuit so he can command more fees than his dad and Clinton.
Scarecrow @ 134
so it’s not the search for the perfect hot fudge sundae?
Just waiting for the draft; in every sense of the word.
What ever happened to our representatives representing the people; whatever happened to those in power exercising common sense, discernment, and upholding our Constitution?
Well, maybe George is convinced that 30 years after we leave, Iraq will have become a tourist location in the same way as Vietnam.
(There was a new item up on the captive-audience screen yesterday that had me giggling: Vietnam is planning the ‘Ho Chi Minh Golf Trail’ to link their coastal resorts. Um, okay ….)
Oops, forgot to end quote after “his term…”; my bad. Maybe some sleep would do me good!
Biodun @ 130
Not unless Pawlenty was personally responsible for directing the sting operation against “lewd” public behavior. In terms of tragedy, that would be gloriously ironic for a supposed up and coming golden boy in the Republican scheme to have inadvertently orchestrated the most public display of hypocrisies the Republican’s have to offer, one year before hosting the national convention. Actually, I guess that would be categorized as comedy.
But can’t you imagine the horror the Republican hegemony will undergo if Craig is, in fact, still in office when the convention comes to town? Almost every single person coming in from out of state to cover that convention will have an opportunity to pass by that fated men’s room. I wonder if anyone will capitalize and sell T-Shirts? Here’s a question, what would the ‘I visited Wall Drug’ caption be for a T shirt commemorating a visit to the Senator Craig restroom?
mc @ 125
The rethugs are united and determined to take Larry down, but Mitch McConnell says Diaper Vitter is ok. b/c what Diaper did happened b4 he was a senator and he hasn’t been charged with anything. No undergarment crime.
tejanarusa @ 127
Thanks for calling them out on it!
Follow up with an email, if you have time! Point out that the strawman and the interest in the “horse race” is manufactured excitement by the media. Remind them that if they are concerned about keeping listeners and staying in the horse race that is “news in the internet age”, they might consider covering what the PEOPLE WANT TO HEAR instead of the horse race the PUNDITS WANT TO TALK ABOUT. People want real answers to real problems, not manufactured drama like “is Hillary’s blouse too low cut” and “is Obama black enough” and “is Edwards too much of a pretty boy to be taken seriously”.
Christy has a new thread ready to go.
Note to self: Never fly Napal Airlines.
New thread!
Scarecrow @ 120
I couldn’t agree more except I don’t think it’s going to happen. The hope is come November 2008, things will change with either President Clinton or President Obama. Maybe, but those two get more cautious daily. The Democrats, for some reason, think they will be perceived as soft on terrorism if they support our boys in the field by bringing them home.
If liberal blogs find a way to flex their muscle, it would be helpful. That’s important because lots of important folks don’t think liberal blogs have muscle. They should be proven wrong.
Michael Gordon was on Charlie Rose last night. It really grates on my last nerve how Establishment programs like the NewsHour and Rose treat him as an Iraq “expert”. I have to admit he has polished up his act but it still the same act. The surge is working. Progress is being made. Bottom up political action.
He is very careful about defining al Qaeda after his initial shilling where al Qaeda was used as a synonym for insurgent. He avoided any mention of Iran at all. He still doesn’t grasp all of the dynamics of the Iraq civil war. And cops out completely when it comes to where all this is leading which seems curiously at odds with the “progress” claims.
johnSwifty @ 143
{highSqueekySockPuppetVoice}
Ok, I’ll play. “I visited the Senator Craig restroom and I got a HELL of a lot more than this lousy T shirt!”
{/highSqueekySockPuppetVoice}
Elliott @ 139
Well, there’s that, too.
Hugh @ 150
Hugh, — did you see the piece he did in the NYT Magazine? I’ve been meaning to check on that, but got distracted by Bush bringing the troops home.
mc @ 33
Oh, that’s perfect! I gotta use that. And I’m not sure that that’s really OT to this thread…
landofthefree said:
I’ve got it composing in my head right now-althogh I expect it will just get an automated response.
I was so p’o’d I tried to call back, but of course, only got the busy signal. May have to listen to the podcast to find out who the “responder” was – I missed the start of the show and thus the introductions.
raven @ 34
Raven, the little ones don’t know they are little — my first Chihuahua would get between me and strangers and growl like he was going to tear their throats out.
hackworth @ 144
cahuenga @ 147
Seconded. OTOH, I thought Hindus never killed any lving creature? Or is that just one sect or something? You know, sacred cows, don’t even crush the cockroach, etc.
Helpless Dancer @ 73
It’s worse than that — someone put warshots on a bird that was migrating from one base to another. All live weapons are painted a different color from those used in training/practice, to keep mistakes like this from happening.
The fact that it has happened makes me VERY nervous. How many other bombers are wandering around with ammo they shouldn’t have?
Maybe off-topic, but could the Spotlight feature be extended to make it quick and easy to forward a post like yours to Congresspeople and/or their staffs in addition to the media?
Biodun @ 138
There you have it — proof that the Criminal-in-Chief is insane. He really thinks people are going to pay to hear him speak?
Pardon me while I ROTFLASTC.
Hasn’t he noticed he isn’t bringing in the bucks for the Repugs fundraisers any more?
Griffin @ 160
It’s a logical question. It requires a lot of manual effort loading all the relevant e-mail addresses. I don’t know of any technical constraint.
katymine @ 43
Don’t be conned by that.
It’s important to differentiate between the real goals and plan and the cruft used to sell the venture to it’s many second-tier partners. PNAC was one part, Israel was one, Republicans was obviously one, War-profiteering corporations was another and there were even some others. It is/was a large venture and required a lot of different advertising lies to bring in different people.
Madness madness madness
So, when we leave you might say, “Yeah, we defeated him.” But, if you don’t know what his REAL goals were you don’t really know whether he’s achieved them or not.
I don’t honestly believe he expected this to go for decades. He’s just looking for cover to get out when it’s good for him (Jan. 20, 2009). They’re milking this thing for all it’s worth, but they are realistic and know that once Dems are in charge it’s over — and then they’ll blame the Dems in charge for ‘failing’, for ‘losing’ and so on.
What I wonder, is whether, in the end, the Republicans will realize they’ve been ridden hard and put away wet or will they just think they ‘won’. I wonder whether the Dems who take power will look back and investigate or will just sweep it under a rug and move on, letting the Bush mafia truly win.
Brisingamen @ 161
He is incredibly competetive and is still competing with Bill, his father and Nixon (re: Vietnam=Iraq, Watergate=BushCo admin, etc.).
I think he probably WANTS to be impeached, convicted and tossed out, so he’ll be noted for it more than Nixon. Real real sick.