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	<title>Comments on: Good Gravy, Who Are These People?</title>
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		<title>By: Punkster</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-946911</link>
		<dc:creator>Punkster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 13:12:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-946911</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;This entitlement BS has exactly the same effect on me that biting down on a nice wad of aluminum foil does…  I’ve often said that if I ever win the Powerball lottery and someone spots me buying a pair of thousand dollar shoes, I hope they wrestle them from my grasp and beat me to death with them.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Lower Manhattanite at the Group News Blog (and late of Gilly’s) has written extensively about the long knives being sharpened in New York especially for sweet Rudy should he actually win the nomination.  I hope to God he’s right.  Didn’t someone once say that you should never pick a fight with someone who buys ink by the barrel?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This entitlement BS has exactly the same effect on me that biting down on a nice wad of aluminum foil does…  I’ve often said that if I ever win the Powerball lottery and someone spots me buying a pair of thousand dollar shoes, I hope they wrestle them from my grasp and beat me to death with them.</p>
<p>Lower Manhattanite at the Group News Blog (and late of Gilly’s) has written extensively about the long knives being sharpened in New York especially for sweet Rudy should he actually win the nomination.  I hope to God he’s right.  Didn’t someone once say that you should never pick a fight with someone who buys ink by the barrel?</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945883</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 01:56:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945883</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-944875&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;punaise @ 183&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/&quot;&gt;http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Ohio Congressman Found Dead&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Citing a Republican leadership aide says, the AP is reporting that Rep. Paul Gillmor (R-OH) was found dead in his apartment Wednesday (via CNN).&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Condolences to his family.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Did he have a wife &amp; kids?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-944875"><em>punaise @ 183</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p><a href="http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/">http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/</a></p>
<blockquote><p>Ohio Congressman Found Dead</p>
<p>Citing a Republican leadership aide says, the AP is reporting that Rep. Paul Gillmor (R-OH) was found dead in his apartment Wednesday (via CNN).</p>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<p>Condolences to his family.</p>
<p>Did he have a wife &amp; kids?</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945795</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 01:39:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945795</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-944776&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;semiot @ 89&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;It seems that a not insignificant segment of Americans might actually dream of being Leona Helmsley - or at least basking in the authoritarian glow of such a luminous ego. Kill a dog. Make a dog a millionaire. Whatever. As long as the little people are forced to treat someone like royalty, you partake of the romance of Queen Bitchy.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Little Bootsie?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-944776"><em>semiot @ 89</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>It seems that a not insignificant segment of Americans might actually dream of being Leona Helmsley &#8211; or at least basking in the authoritarian glow of such a luminous ego. Kill a dog. Make a dog a millionaire. Whatever. As long as the little people are forced to treat someone like royalty, you partake of the romance of Queen Bitchy.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Little Bootsie?</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945777</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 01:36:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945777</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-944743&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;oddmommy @ 62&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;oh gawd. That bag IS one ugly m***f***er. I too read that Ruth Marcus op-ed this a.m., and dropped my jaw at the hideous photo. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And why, one might ask, are the Shitstream Media buzzards that devoured every last ounce of flesh from John Edwards’ $400 haircut not swarming in droves over Mrs. Ghoul’s $52K purse??&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I think it’s because they’ve either been paid off or they’ve bought into some mythology where Rudy has to be the successor.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And, now that the Bush mafia has taken how many trillion dollars from DoD and Baghdad, will they continue to dominate American politicians and the press?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The problem (if you want to see it that way) is there really isn’t any part of the mythology which is meant to continue after George. It was all just part of a sales pitch meant to get him into power. After he leaves they’re out in the cold on their own again (the American Republicans that is).&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-944743"><em>oddmommy @ 62</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>oh gawd. That bag IS one ugly m***f***er. I too read that Ruth Marcus op-ed this a.m., and dropped my jaw at the hideous photo. </p>
<p>And why, one might ask, are the Shitstream Media buzzards that devoured every last ounce of flesh from John Edwards’ $400 haircut not swarming in droves over Mrs. Ghoul’s $52K purse??</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I think it’s because they’ve either been paid off or they’ve bought into some mythology where Rudy has to be the successor.</p>
<p>And, now that the Bush mafia has taken how many trillion dollars from DoD and Baghdad, will they continue to dominate American politicians and the press?</p>
<p>The problem (if you want to see it that way) is there really isn’t any part of the mythology which is meant to continue after George. It was all just part of a sales pitch meant to get him into power. After he leaves they’re out in the cold on their own again (the American Republicans that is).</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945738</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 01:23:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945738</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-944691&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;mc @ 14&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Yeah, I really want to sit down and “have a beer” with these people.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Watch out for the hemlock!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-944691"><em>mc @ 14</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>Yeah, I really want to sit down and “have a beer” with these people.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Watch out for the hemlock!</p>
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		<title>By: posey</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945403</link>
		<dc:creator>posey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 22:55:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945403</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;posey — What browser are you using? Sometimes folks using Opera have interface issues and extra characters get inserted like that. Same if you compose in a Microsoft word processor and then paste into the comment window — imbedded code comes along for the ride and then shows up as ghost characters.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;No idea if either applies to you, but just in case, I thought I’d throw that out for you to see it.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Thanks for the suggestion, Christy. Nope, I’m on Internet Explorer, and I typed my comment directly into the comment box. I can’t wait to see how this one turns out. It must be my system, though, because the other comments look fine (unless dakine01 is editing them too).&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>posey — What browser are you using? Sometimes folks using Opera have interface issues and extra characters get inserted like that. Same if you compose in a Microsoft word processor and then paste into the comment window — imbedded code comes along for the ride and then shows up as ghost characters.</p>
<p>No idea if either applies to you, but just in case, I thought I’d throw that out for you to see it.</p>
<p>Thanks for the suggestion, Christy. Nope, I’m on Internet Explorer, and I typed my comment directly into the comment box. I can’t wait to see how this one turns out. It must be my system, though, because the other comments look fine (unless dakine01 is editing them too).</p>
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		<title>By: Dudette</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945312</link>
		<dc:creator>Dudette</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 21:54:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945312</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Next time some wing nut asks Edwards about his haircut he should just say “At least my wife doesn’t require seat on a chartered jet for “Baby Louis”, her $3000 handbag.”&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Next time some wing nut asks Edwards about his haircut he should just say “At least my wife doesn’t require seat on a chartered jet for “Baby Louis”, her $3000 handbag.”</p>
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		<title>By: Julia</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945127</link>
		<dc:creator>Julia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 19:40:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945127</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;If you were riding in a private plane with Rudolph Giuliani, would you want an empty seat next to you?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Personally, I’d want my bag to have a seat too.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you were riding in a private plane with Rudolph Giuliani, would you want an empty seat next to you?</p>
<p>Personally, I’d want my bag to have a seat too.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945054</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 18:48:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945054</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-944819&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;Phoenix Woman @ 129&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;It’s just amazing to compare somebody like the Third Mrs. Rudy to a true class act like &lt;a href=&quot;http://rickwrites.blogspot.com/2007/09/rip-jane-tomlinson-absolute-best-of-our.html&quot;&gt;the wonderful (and sadly, now late) Jane Tomlinson&lt;/a&gt;:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Many thanks, Phoenix Woman.  You’re a class act yourself.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Even though she was in great pain - especially in her bones, neck, hips, back and shoulders - she took part in the London Marathon in April, a triathlon in August and, along with her husband, the Great North Run in October.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(snip)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;in March 2003, she set out, together with her brother Luke, on a 1060 mile bike ride from John O’Groats to Land’s End, stopping twice en route to receive chemotherapy.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(snip)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And, almost unbelievably, days after finishing the journey, she completed a second London Marathon before returning to work as a paediatric radiographer.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But more was to come. She completed the gruelling UK Half Ironman triathlon competition in the autumn before collecting her MBE from the Queen at Buckingham Palace in October.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;All in all, she raised more than £1.5 million for Cancer Research UK and other charities.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(snip)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In November 2004, she became the only cancer patient to complete a full Ironman triathlon, a daunting feat comprising a 2.4 mile swim, a 112 mile cycle ride followed by a 26 mile marathon.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(snip)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And in the summer of 2006, she crossed the United States, from San Francisco’s Golden Gate Bridge to Brooklyn Bridge in New York City.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But, despite her smiles at the end of her journey, the mammoth feat - 63 days on a bike, covering 3,700 miles - had left her seriously ill.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;She was also disappointed that a lack of interest from the US media meant she only raised £100,000, well short of her expectations.
&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-944819"><em>Phoenix Woman @ 129</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>It’s just amazing to compare somebody like the Third Mrs. Rudy to a true class act like <a href="http://rickwrites.blogspot.com/2007/09/rip-jane-tomlinson-absolute-best-of-our.html">the wonderful (and sadly, now late) Jane Tomlinson</a>:</p>
<p>Many thanks, Phoenix Woman.  You’re a class act yourself.</p>
<blockquote><p>Even though she was in great pain &#8211; especially in her bones, neck, hips, back and shoulders &#8211; she took part in the London Marathon in April, a triathlon in August and, along with her husband, the Great North Run in October.</p>
<p>(snip)</p>
<p>in March 2003, she set out, together with her brother Luke, on a 1060 mile bike ride from John O’Groats to Land’s End, stopping twice en route to receive chemotherapy.</p>
<p>(snip)</p>
<p>And, almost unbelievably, days after finishing the journey, she completed a second London Marathon before returning to work as a paediatric radiographer.</p>
<p>But more was to come. She completed the gruelling UK Half Ironman triathlon competition in the autumn before collecting her MBE from the Queen at Buckingham Palace in October.</p>
<p>All in all, she raised more than £1.5 million for Cancer Research UK and other charities.</p>
<p>(snip)</p>
<p>In November 2004, she became the only cancer patient to complete a full Ironman triathlon, a daunting feat comprising a 2.4 mile swim, a 112 mile cycle ride followed by a 26 mile marathon.</p>
<p>(snip)</p>
<p>And in the summer of 2006, she crossed the United States, from San Francisco’s Golden Gate Bridge to Brooklyn Bridge in New York City.</p>
<p>But, despite her smiles at the end of her journey, the mammoth feat &#8211; 63 days on a bike, covering 3,700 miles &#8211; had left her seriously ill.</p>
<p>She was also disappointed that a lack of interest from the US media meant she only raised £100,000, well short of her expectations.
</p>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
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		<title>By: Arnie</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945036</link>
		<dc:creator>Arnie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 18:33:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/09/05/good-gravy-who-are-these-people/#comment-945036</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-944849&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;perris @ 157&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-944834&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;Christy Hardin Smith @ 143&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;You know, I happen to know a number of wealthy people who do a lot of good with their money — self-made or inherited.  And it’s neither fair nor accurate to say that all rich people are the same.  Some are generous and some are greedy little shits.  I’m just saying…&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I think it’s the very old money that hates the middle class, I believe they think there even is a middle class because of them&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;what they don’t understand or refuse to acknowledge is that they are as wealthy as they are BECAUSE of the middle class not inspite of it&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;never the less, the amount of wealth to them is not as important as the differance in wealth…they would rather there be a great devide and they should have less then an equality and they should have more&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;there are also the “reagan wealthy” that have been told they are supposed to keep all that they aquire without paying back into the society that gave them their wealth&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;so there are those two kinds of wealth that want to keep it all withuot paying the rent they owe for all they have&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;My milage differs with your considered opinion, those of “old” wealth are some of the most secure and non-threatening genuine people you are likely to meet. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;It is the nouveau riche, beginning with the wealth accumulated after the civil war, including the likes of Rockefellers, Morgans, Vanderbilts, etc. (who spent in ways to “prove” their wealth - refer to Thorsten Veblin’s opus), that arrogance and “class distain” enters into the picture, mostly built on insecurity of position and questionable source of that wealth. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;That has not changed to present day accumulations of wealth and how it was obtained. What you describe is the newest (and least secure) of the nouveau riche who have to distance themselves from their origins (as well as from their means of obtaining that wealth).&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Please examine quite carefully this “yardstick” you use called wealth. In economic terms, wealth is merely the accumulated un-consumed products of participation in the economic process and in itself is economically healthy. What is not economically healthy is the abduction of economic resources into a few hands, a plutocracy that becomes entrenched and selfserving. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In history, no king or kingdom ever survived having entities (nobles) controlling any significant position of power. Only the advent of great, self-perpetuating wealth in America has allowed this to occure and the result is what you are beginning to see, the coupe de e’tat that has killed the American Republic.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;How’s that for EPU’d&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-944849"><em>perris @ 157</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p><a href="#comment-944834"><em>Christy Hardin Smith @ 143</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>You know, I happen to know a number of wealthy people who do a lot of good with their money — self-made or inherited.  And it’s neither fair nor accurate to say that all rich people are the same.  Some are generous and some are greedy little shits.  I’m just saying…</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I think it’s the very old money that hates the middle class, I believe they think there even is a middle class because of them</p>
<p>what they don’t understand or refuse to acknowledge is that they are as wealthy as they are BECAUSE of the middle class not inspite of it</p>
<p>never the less, the amount of wealth to them is not as important as the differance in wealth…they would rather there be a great devide and they should have less then an equality and they should have more</p>
<p>there are also the “reagan wealthy” that have been told they are supposed to keep all that they aquire without paying back into the society that gave them their wealth</p>
<p>so there are those two kinds of wealth that want to keep it all withuot paying the rent they owe for all they have</p>
</blockquote>
<p>My milage differs with your considered opinion, those of “old” wealth are some of the most secure and non-threatening genuine people you are likely to meet. </p>
<p>It is the nouveau riche, beginning with the wealth accumulated after the civil war, including the likes of Rockefellers, Morgans, Vanderbilts, etc. (who spent in ways to “prove” their wealth &#8211; refer to Thorsten Veblin’s opus), that arrogance and “class distain” enters into the picture, mostly built on insecurity of position and questionable source of that wealth. </p>
<p>That has not changed to present day accumulations of wealth and how it was obtained. What you describe is the newest (and least secure) of the nouveau riche who have to distance themselves from their origins (as well as from their means of obtaining that wealth).</p>
<p>Please examine quite carefully this “yardstick” you use called wealth. In economic terms, wealth is merely the accumulated un-consumed products of participation in the economic process and in itself is economically healthy. What is not economically healthy is the abduction of economic resources into a few hands, a plutocracy that becomes entrenched and selfserving. </p>
<p>In history, no king or kingdom ever survived having entities (nobles) controlling any significant position of power. Only the advent of great, self-perpetuating wealth in America has allowed this to occure and the result is what you are beginning to see, the coupe de e’tat that has killed the American Republic.</p>
<p>How’s that for EPU’d</p>
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