Chris “both ways” Shays is now doing the pro-surge rubber chicken circuit with…wait for it…Brian Baird. Because, you know, it has bipartisan support. Meanwhile, his opponent Jim Himes (above) tries to untangle Shays’ convoluted rhetoric on Iraq, depending on whether Shays is voting or yacking.
Yesterday’s $5 fundraiser for Jim Himes has netted 80 new donors to our Blue America page, and by way of comparison Shays only had 107 donors during the last quarter. So it would be great if we could find 29 more donors, which would mean Jim had more contributors in just over 24 hours from Blue America alone than Shays had during the entire second quarter. If you’ve got $5 to spare, think of it as a way to combat the useful idiocy of Brian Baird.
Because John Amato and Howie Klein are so very competitive. (It’s all just a little unseemly, if you ask me.)
Contribute to Jim Himes via Blue America here.
Related posts:
- Public Option Expert Jacob Hacker on Why the Blue Dogs are Blowing Smoke
- BREAKING: Chris Christie Declared Victor in New Jersey; NYC Mayor Bloomberg Re-Elected by Narrow Margin
- Why is Jim Himes Channeling Pete Peterson?
- Early Morning Swim: Chris Matthews Smacks Birther Congressman Around
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Chris Mooney, Unscientific America
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well, well (in for $20 yesterday)
kinda low
tres
Good. I’m glad everything is going so swimmingly well…so…bring the troops home….oh, it’s not going well…so…bring the troops home.
Chris Shays must have been hanging around Holy Joe Lieberman too much.
Hey, Chris…take a close look at your future!
behindthefall @ 2
twenty bucks is chopped liver? :~)
Aloha Ya’ll!!!
Sha @ 5
Last year Shays said that Lieberman’s election was “more important” than his own.
http://www.newhavenindependent…..berman.php
Kissin’ cousins, those two.
punaise @ 6
only if it comes in an itty bitty tin with french writing and the picture of a goose on it.
Glad to see you met the goals for Himes yesterday. For a middle of the day, in the middle of the week, that was pretty good.
CTuttle @ 7
hey, ct! i’m up early today.
I’ve given twice (@$25 plus tip) to Jim Himes.
I’ll give more.
But, FWIW, prescription dog food (to avoid allergies) costs a lot.
althespook @ 9
that stuff is endangered as certain localities issue fat-oies against fois gras.
althespook @ 11
Now will you be up late?!!! ;-)
punaise @ 13
You are saying that they are trying to de-liver us?
Yea roots!
CTuttle @ 14
probly. we’ll see. am picking at the edges of my dad’s storage stuff which is now all over the house. has an augean stables kind of feel to it…
KO time!!!
Larry Craig is certain to be pleased by this announcement:
A New Go To Guy For The Big Timber Folks!
althespook @ 17
A lot of memories to sift through…!!!
1,589 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND..
Citizen Hamsher and the Firepup Patriots:
I’ve said it before here today but Blue America and all the other grassroots cadres hafta find a primary opponent for this Bozo Baird and flush the triangulating Clintonistas right out inta the open…
If Mrs. Clinton wanned ta get an end date certain and take the war and occupation off the table for the ‘08 elections, all she hasta do is pull ol’ Harry Reid’s chain and Rahm Emmanuel’s zipper. But, if she does that, she loses her leverage against all the real Democrats both in the race and in the Congress and her candidacy is over absent descent within the Democratic polity over the war.
I’ve said it over and over again…the battle for restoration of the idea of democracy and democratic politics in America is takin’ place INSIDE the Democratic Party. Even if we lose the White House and some margin in the Congress…the corporatist fascists in the elected Democratic leadership hafta be taken down.
KEEP THE FAITH AND REMEMBER ALL FASCISTS DON’T WEAR COWBOY HATS…SOME OF ‘EM WEAR RED DRESSES!!
CTuttle @ 20
oh yes. i just found my nightlight that sat by my bed most of my childhood. It was a gift from my maternal grandmother.
althespook @ 9
No, no, no, no, — getting a #2, right behind a zed is “kinda low”. How’d $20 get mixed up in this??
Disregard Chris Matthews.
Keith Olberman.
Fox News.
CNN.
Think for yourself.
Hang out here if it gives you comfort.
Make up your own mind. Don’t let someone else do it.
I think the Craig accidental call was made “accidentally on purpose” by Craig as a leak that Specter was cooperating with him.
Jonathan @ 24
I hate manipulation of my mind. I just found out by taking a “quiz” that I am a Kucinich supporter with Gravel second, Obama 3rd. I had to take a quiz to be clear on what I think. Go figure.
behindthefall @ 23
just pulling your leg – my comment edited re $20 contrib., followed by your “kinda low”.
althespook @ 19
I wonder if the Timber industry told Craig to suck it up and fight? They have been paying him bribes for years and I suspect they can prove it.
There is an epoch struggle for the heart, mind and soul of the Democratic Party.
OT, but worth the read – From Larry Johnson’s No Quarter:
And a very, very disturbing set of facts from one of Larry’s commenters:
(My bold)
By the way, who is airing the Repug’s debate? I need a good laugh or two…!!!
Finally….someone says that Craig didn’t change his mind….he deliberately misled in his presser.
punaise @ 27
oh
Thought I’d stepped into blog doo-doo.
Craig is such a bottom feeder.
Jonathan @ 12
I gave at the office ($50 yesterday & $5 tip), i.e. my country house where I finally got the toobz to work.
I’ve always hated Shays. He’s one mean S-O-B, who attacks constituents at town meetings (not a constituent–seen him do it on C-SPAN). Always figured he kept being reelected because they couldn’t find anyone breathing to run against him. So, for now, I actually don’t care who Himes is, as long as he’s anybody-but-Shays.
As for prescription dog food, I read an article in the WSJ about a decade or two ago that that this is a complete scam by veternarians-contains same ingredients as off-the-shelf pet food. Don’t know if it’s still true, but try checking it out.
CTuttle @ 31
Fox Tv at 9:00 est. I already got my laughs watching Josh on Newshour.
“I hate manipulation of my mind. I just found out by taking a “quiz” that I am a Kucinich supporter with Gravel second, Obama 3rd. I had to take a quiz to be clear on what I think. Go figure.”
I know what I think… and it’s Gore.
Mad Dogs @ 30
made this point downstairs. for carrier launched nukes they go with the carrier preloaded. for buff’s staging off diego garcia they would go either on carriers with a stopover or on an undisclosed flight as cargo, NOT STRAPPED TO THE BLOODY HARD POINTS.
Something has spoiled in the scandinavian regions…
LS at 26
I dislike these days. Thanks for your message.
1,589 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND..
Citizen oklahomakiddo and the Firepup Patriots:
Thank you brother kiddo…you are a gorgeous voice of reason carried on the wind out here in the wilderness…I think we’re gunna get another ‘68 Democratic Convention but this time it may jest shake all the nutz outta the Democratic tree of leadership.
KEEP THE FAITH, THE BATTLE IS WORTH FIGHTIN’…TOO MANY HAVE DIED TO FORGET!!
LS @ 25
Explicky?
Sawbuck up for the cause.
Mad Dogs @ 30
I sense Cheney’s spoor on this. Of course, the military is saying that its all a mistake, suspending lower level participants, but I haven’t heard any info yet on what the pilot’s flight orders were, and who signed them.
Bob in HI
Oklahoma kiddo @ 37
It seems as though that was a lot of FDL readers choice.
LS @ 26
I was EPU’d below but I took the same quiz & got the exact same results (even though I support Edwards & Dodd in the real world). Either we think alike or they’ve rigged it. ;-)
Looking at Olbermann and Turley. What’s being overlooked is the previous alleged incidents of Mr. Craig’s indecency.
well, we fem-bloggers can’t let the boys raise (ahem) more contributions to Himes than us rabid lady-types here at fdl, can we, my systers?
Sent a tenner to Himes, and $5 to Darcy just to celebrate the good news that her most formidable opponent in the primary decided to drop out and then endorsed her.
solai @ 32
Isn’t that nice?!
Mad Dogs @ 30
reposting from previous thread, my comment:
Regarding the issue of the Iran question, the nukes, the tinfoil hat vs healthy realism: I have learned to have a degree if faith in Larry Johnson and his allies. Larry does not shoot off his mouth, he is careful with what he says and always presents his information from a factual context. Given that I don’t watch TV at all, only what you and C&L link me to, preferring the print NYT and a variety of mags (VF, New Yorker,Harper’s, Mother Jones, American Journal of Nursing), I rely on my computer for correct info. And I know what we all know about Cheney and Bush (see KO’s outraged commentary last pm). I think war with Iran has been in the planning stages for a very long time and share Larry’s questioning concern. I sure don’t have the ability to pick up the phone to call spooks and experts.
eCAHN
Himes appears to be as good as it gets in terms of House candidates. In any event, much, much better than Shays.
Ruby Tuesday @ 47
boys, if you see a boy slap him and make him a man :)
Loo Hoo. @ 41
Just a hunch. Listening to the measured words…the fact that it got released to the press…the fact that he supposedly didn’t know it was the wrong number…someone at CNN said to Wolf that it was on his phone..and he kinda said, no not my phone…apparently it sounds like it was purposely leaked to a reporter…
Loo Hoo. @ 48
The only importance of all of this is that the longer it goes on, and the more bizarre it gets, the better it is for the Ds.
SadieSue @ 45
Didn’t seem rigged, because it was based on issues and the point allotments were explained.
Five nuclear tipped cruise missiles accidentally being shipped is a Klaxon going off in my head… Military security protocols precludes accidents such as that, it’s clearly prepositioning and Barksdale blew the whistle… Be very wary…!!! 8-(
“It seems as though that was a lot of FDL readers choice.”
I get that drift too sometimes.
Does any one know how Air Force Nukes are moved to overseas bases? Ship or Air? If it is by Navy ship, are the xtian Air Force wackos, running their own show? Are there problems among the JCS’s.
The idea that a group of Air Force ordinance people loaded six nuke cruise missiles by mistake is crazy. The comment by the Air Force that those folks were de-certified and that is the end of it, is also crazy.
Jonathan @ 50
Better still!! I would love to have candidates to love, instead of anybody-but candidates.
SadieSue @ 45
I think we all think alike.
ps HI!
JPL @ 36
Aargh! Not Faux Spew! My TV set is a virgin, I shall not pop it’s cherry…!!!
Young Mr. Himes dropping in here last night to promise that he would be true to his word impressed my tired soul. Sent him $25, Jane, he’s a keeper.
LS @ 54
Yeah, I know – hence my note that we think alike (which is ever so surprising considering our current reading choice). =)
Is Chris Shays pathetic or what? Every time he’s about to speak, he looks like he’s on the ball. Then as soon as he opens his mouth, he’s all crybaby sounding. It’s enough to curl your teeth.
LS @ 52
But didn’t we already know Specter was standing up for him or do I have my timing wrong. I thought we knew that from the get-go.
althespook @ 38
Bush probably ordered some up fer his trip to Oz in case the natives got a lil’ restless.
KO has Andy Warhol on. Oh, it’s Draper!
SadieSue @ 62
*g*
Elliott @ 59
Yeppers, I’d say we definitely think alike. And HI back!
zennurse, I saw your well thought out comment downstairs. I’ve been thinking all day about what would have happened had there been an accidental plane crash. Flying nuclear bombs across America? WTF?
Loo Hoo. @ 69
Nah, they weren’t armed.
althespook @ 38
Maybe they needed to get them to the Gulf so they could be loaded on a carrier bound for the M.E. Anyone know if any of our Congress people on the armed services committee are addressing this with the urgency needed?
CTuttle @ 55
Blew the whistle. That is exactly what i have been thinking might be possible. The mutiny of the sensible armed forces has begun on the crazy civilian leadership. They are sounding sirens.
For those who are opera fans, Pavarotti is on my caseload, so to speak, and it sounds imminent. I am not such an opera fan, but I do love him.
althespook @ 9
He’s back in CA, so it’s not “fois de” it’s “eau de”.
bmaz @ 72
Flouride!
zennurse @ 64
We knew Specter was backing him, however, we didn’t notice that the used the word “intend” in his now non-resignation speech. Then the call shows up, after the fact, in the media; implicating that he had plotted to change the wording in the speech to “drive the story” that he was going to fight it. If you carefully listen to the call, it sort of sounds staged, but everything he has said, ever, sounds staged…including the naughty, nasty…comments about Clinton.
Jane, since you’re in California, can you help them moderate their competitive instincts, to be more mellow. . . like you?
LS @ 54
I came up with Kuchinich on top too. Wonder if his campaign put it out, or if we all just agree with him and ought to be supporting him? Who put this quiz out? It was awfully simplified, no shades…
raven @ 66
Boy you got that right. Warhol is dead on. Maybe with all his book profits he can get one of those $400 haircuts we have heard so much about. Could use it.
bmaz @ 72
Oh, that thought is hopeful but its hard to imagine such a conspiracy– it would involve too many people–this is the military after all and I can’t imagine that many being that subversive.
Steve-AR @ 57
bmaz @ 72
DoD pushback on Tricky Dick’s Dr. Strangelove designs…!!!
bmaz @ 79
I like him though. of course my hair used to come to the middle of my back and I had to use hair ties on my beard when I played softball!
Somebody leaked the B-52 story.. Maybe the next president will give that person a Medal of Honor.
BTW, my local B&N has Dead Certain. Up to p. 31 & going off-line to devour. Since I can’t imagine how a person like W can exist & get people to like him, it is an invaluable book for me, because it educates me about my enemy. The anecdotes allow one to imagine how the other side thinks (laughingly-referred-to-as-thinking) about things. And it does reinforce the negative opinion that W is one petty-minded bully of a know-nothing who wants to domineer the world (because he knows what’s right & good). And Draper does it all with the very words & actions of W & allies. Nice piece of work, at least so far. I always like these specifics about alpha-males covering the other dog’s pee, because it takes the behavior down to the primitive level that is reality.
CTuttle @ 55
More than wary. Very spooked. But is the MSM asking the right questions or are they accepting that it was accidental?
You needn’t answer that.
Did KO address that? Trying to keep an eye on tennis.
JPL @ 84
Freedom
Sorry, Steve AR, didn’t intend to get in the middle of your business! Here is my response to your 57:
Exactly. As if there aren’t enough investigations going on already. But this needs to be front and center. Immediate. This is unfreakingbelievable.
Loo Hoo. @ 78
go back and click on the site, it has a grid where you can track each issue and their individual attitudes to date, also has a page where you can track their finances. Kucinich has almost zip, but Brownback has less, yay.
Brian Baird reminds me of those old anti-drug commercials:
This is your brain. This is your brain on koolaid.
Don’t let this happen to you. Don’t become a koolaid junkie.
Just say no to Iraq.
Surely you jest, to think that Congress might be on the job.
zennurse @ 73
Enrico Caruso is my fave. But I’ve got everything Pavarotti ever did.
eCAHNomics @ 91
*g* -Who is on the f’ing committee anyway outside of Susan MF Collins?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 92
Sad, sad, sad.
raven @ 70
So there would have been no damage had the planes crashed?
zennurse @ 80
You’d be surprised, Ma’am! The Armed Services are populated with rational sane individuals, too! Many individuals, Officers and Noncoms alike, would rather prevent unnecessary wholesale slaughter than blindly follow orders…!!! 8-)
JPL @ 84
after he’s liberated from Guantanamo
I don’t know history.
But I think sometimes about the Roman circus.
What an entertaining distraction it must have been.
Gladiators.
Christians fed to lions.
What fun.
While the empire collapsed, internally and at the fringes.
zennurse @ 73
:(
Loo Hoo. @ 95
There would be damage but not a nuclear explosion. However, we have some folks upstairs who know a whole lot more about this that I do. They did cover this is CBR training at Ft Campbell in 66. Flyboys?
Loo Hoo. @ 69
Oh it can be lots of fun. Back in the early 1980’s a truck carrying nuclear tipped torpedos rolled over on a flyover ramp of what we Denver residents then called The Mousetrap (where I25 and the Boulder Turnpike met up). They were fully locked and cocked and due to some massive messup apparently could have detonated. The nuclear emergency response team people shut the entire road down for about ten hours while they sweated those babies out. Literally closed down the city, no one could go anywhere.
So just imagine the fun if a BUFF went down with live nuke cruise missiles on it…
So any opinions about how Putin handled the news that it was just a mistake. Gordon Brown probably had an accident.
OK. I always have trouble with conspiracy theories. It’s a temperament thing. What are y’all suggesting would be target of these mystery nukes, assuming this was something other than an accident?
althespook @ 101
Glad I added the disclaimer. So spook, these babies were armed?
Jesus.
Conspiracy theories.
Nukes?
Try John F. Kennedy.
Or even Watergate.
Jonathan @ 105
You woke up huh:)
raven @ 104
raven, we never did get a straight answer but apparently so because they evacuated me, my family and a whole lot of other essential types on a BUFF to DC real fast. Sent a police car to my home and my kids’s schools and got us out asap. Everyone was white and shaking while they did it, so SOMETHING was scaring the crap out of them.
And the beauty part was the trucker didn’t know what he was carrying, had od’ed on caffeine and no sleep to make extra bucks. there were no backup cars, no security, nada. quite the charlie fox as they say in military circles…
Blub @ 103
My guess is that it was either: a) test the strategic issues of transport; or b) to do the actual transport (in two separate loads) from North Dakota to the Gulf region, so they could be loaded onto the carrier intended to bring them to the M.E.
althespook @ 107
Wow, amazing. Actually I was wondering about the ones in this latest incident?
Oh, raven.
I’m too old.
People here should feel free to tell me to fuck off.
I’m just venting.
Senate Armed Services Committee
House.
Jonathan @ 110
Why would they do that? This is the marketplace of ideas.
The nukes were apparently “not armed” but…:
http://www.aero-news.net/index…..39e0681640
CTuttle @ 96
Of this I’m sure, I met Paul Reikhoff and Abby Pickett at YKos last year in Vegas– But since it is true, I wish they would consider hijacking a water truck and a food truck and convoying to Baghdad airport, then hijack a few planes home.
y’know?
Blub @ 103
I think we’ve been conditioned to sneer at conspiracy theories. Looking back over the last two decades, I’ve become less closed to hearing theories that attempt to explain some of the seriously insane shit that has occurred. Just because it’s a theory doesn’t mean there’s no conspiracy. See PNAC.
Richmond @ 108
That makes some amount of sense to me….. the one “conspiracy” I’d believe is that shrubomination wants to use them to menace Iran with… his very own Cuban Missile Crisis. I just can’t accept this thing would’ve been intended for a domestic target. btw, I thought nukes were supposed to be transfered overland domestically via hardened railcars and special truck convoys?
althespook @ 101
I remember it, Rocky Mountain Flats, it wasn’t pretty, however, a nuclear device involved in a crash would probably detonate the outer shell of high explosives shaped around the core, but, being an erratic detonation it wouldn’t trigger the necessary evenness for nuclear exchange to occur, it would still be a dirty b*mb!!!
raven @ 109
i dunno. cruise missiles came into strategic play just as I was retiring and my NTN on them was low so don’t have the expertise I do on some older systems. But as i’ve said earlier and some other commenters have noted, the security on those things is just unbelievable in most cases. and due to weather issues and lot of other factors they are normally transported by truck or rail mixed in with other cargo (purloined letter principle).
Also, modern nuclear weapons are much more safe than the older systems due to the high gee forces of cruise launches, so even a nosedive crash should not set them off. would strew plutonium to hell and gone around the crash site, but no big bang.
Blub @ 116
They are, that’s why there is such and uproar over this cluster fuck.
Al, could you define?
raven,
The marketplace of ideas depends on input.
Tonight, I’ve questioned input.
althespook @ 118
From the link above
These Bush people don’t have a clue what to do about Iraq.
Iraq’s police force should be overhauled because of ethnic divisions in its ranks, a new US study says.
“The National Police have proven operationally ineffective,” an independent commission, led by James Jones, a retired marine general, says in a report due out on Thursday.
“Sectarianism in its units undermines its ability to provide security; the [police] force is not viable in its current form.”
The report says the force should be disbanded and reorganised.
The solution is to get the hell out of Iraq, you idiots.
http://english.aljazeera.net/N…..A163CD.htm
zennurse @ 114
But, Ma’am, you can’t just leave your men behind! That is your mission!!! *g*
Richmond @ 108
Here’s what I posted over at No Quarter:
Jonathan @ 110
Don’t.
CTuttle @ 117
These were experimental nuclear torpedoes and the rumor we heard was that the plant screwed up and shipped them WITH the detonating electronics cards in place, and the PIN to activate them was a three digit number on a fat exposed keyboard.
So while it did take several monumental coincidences to make it happen, it MIGHT have been for realsies. Shudder.
zennurse @ 126
Namaste
Jonathan -
Locally, history can be erased.
On a larger scale it can be set back a century.
Globally, it never stops.
In medieval London, murder rates were 75 / 100K. In Europe as a whole (very rural), maybe 25 / 100K.
Currently, it ranges from about 60 / 100K in Colombia to 5 / 100K in the US to about 1 / 100K in Norway and Sweden. Maine and Canada are at 1.5 / 100K.
That’s with 6B people on the planet, not a 100 million or so.
zennurse @ 120
define what maam?
zennurse @ 120
sorry, define BUFF, thanks.
althespook @ 130
namaste?
Mad Dogs @ 125
I find your theory plausible
Hmmm… Lamborn won silver today, and Malkkkin took gold on WPITW…!!! I wonder if TRex will make a comment or two about her tonite?
Mad Dogs @ 125
I think your psyops theory makes a good deal of sense, Mad dogs.
Shrubomination.
zennurse @ 131
BUFF = B52s, aka Big Ugly Fat F*ckers
zennurse @ 131
Big Ugly Fat F*ck*r. B52’s usually, now can be C17’s altho they may have their own nickname I never learned. (My boss wrote the assembly line floor user interface that builds the C-17’s. I think that’s so cool!)
Chris Shays and Brian Baird: Blowing Sunshine Everywhere
Gorillaz – Sunshine in a Bag
GordonM @ 129
Very, very interesting to this amateur.
BBC report of Nukes.
What Bush has done is succeeded in handing Iraq to Iran. Good move, Mr. Prez.
Signs of Iranian-style occupation of the country are already there and can easily be felt on the ground. Therefore, Arab League boss Amer Mosa is not wrong in calling on Arab states to negotiate with Iran about Iraq’s future.
http://www.azzaman.com/english…..fname=news2007-09-05kurd.htm
Oklahoma kiddo @ 123
Yes, but on an upbeat note, only about one unit in the Iraqi army can operate independently, maybe.
althespook @ 137
We also used to make pipes out of the gigantic porcelain elephants, we called them BUFE’s too. Big Ugly Fuckin Elephants.
althespook @ 137
OH gods, i remember those damned Galaxies moving out Kelly AFB in 1995. Damned noisy to us idiots training in Lackland that summer. I never did learn the nickname for them, since i ended up washing out. But bloody friggen LOUD is what they were. I can’t believe i eventually learned how to tune them out!
2. Assumes that Iran knows full well that Barksdale, LA is in fact staging area for B-52 Mideast bombing runs.
3. Assumes that Iran knows full well that US nuke arming procedures are “fail-safed” with N-squared signoff and authorization processes.
4. Assumes that Iran knows full well that “if” nukes were loaded, they damm well were authorized by the “highest command authority”.
*********************************************
I don’t know that this is out of the realm of reason. Don’t these people pay huge amounts for their intelligence too?
aliasofwestgate @ 144
Jonathon, James and I remember when you couldn’t hear them until the goddamn ground shook from the arc light.
aliasofwestgate @ 144
You should see the ones the russians are selling off so they can build the next generation. They can fly entire trains around the world. jeebus.
aliasofwestgate @ 144
Jonathon, James and I remember when you couldn’t hear them until the goddamn ground shook from the arc light.
zennurse @ 145
Oh, way less than 1% of what this country spends. Doesn’t mean they’re out of par on accuracy, though.
Elliott @ 133
Likely, even.
Debate’s starting
solai @ 148
Big Dog is on Larry King.
LS @ 113
Whew! I feel better now. W was warned of the sitiation.
Josh has a sorta post up on loose nukes at TPM…linky.
All the nice Fox people are being introduced.
Loo Hoo. @ 153
whatever you’re smoking, the rest of us want some too…
raven @ 146
I had the joys of 15 months in the barracks located fifty yards from the flightline where squadrons of D models took off routinely. You do learn to tune the noise out of the take-offs. Managed to avoid the arc light though.
A scary thing.
Wonder how the good citizens of Louisiana are taking this news. Have they had enough?
No embarrassing the candidates by announcing their polling stats. Really, that was so tacky of George.
aliasofwestgate @ 155
Arc Light
Loo Hoo. @ 159
I think they’re concerned mother nature has them in her sights again. two cat 5’s in less than two weeks and either could have popped NOLA like an overripe mango. And we have lots of hurricane season left…
solai @ 160
thanks for the observations!
Immediate digs at Frederick of Hollywood
I’m at least a generation behind you guys. Sadly i can understand the fear of it, but i have no emotional context to it. My attempt at the military was ‘peacetime’ (even with all the little conflicts we had our noses in that year). At least i tried. Wanted to stay too, but got shipped out anyway.
raven @ 161
is the B52 a bomber they designed to sound scary?
Elliott @ 133
I’ve been wondering about the “send a message” and have been trying to come at this from a State Dept angle . . .
Rattling a saber this big is not done lightly. Invading Iraq is small potatoes, compared with sending this “message” in this form. Simply mentioning nukes as a possible option is a big, big diplomatic deal. Sending a message that you’re moving them around . . . huge.
But sending the message via a cover story scheme that says “Gosh, we don’t have as firm a control on these things as we thought” is madness.
Sending a message is intended to provoke/entice a certain response. But if you send a mixed message, you’re going to get a mix response — the exact opposite of what you want to happen.
This is not to say they were or were not sending a message. But if they were, they likely just stirred the pot with a very, very large spoon . . . and will get an answer they can’t make sense of.
It’s Magic 8 Ball time at the DOD . . . Reply hazy, ask again later.
althespook @ 147
I agree, I forget their nomenclature, but, C-5’s are huge and loud! I’ve loaded/offloaded on many! Heck, C-130’s can deliver nukes…!!!
The Republicans are Gay on Terror.
raven,
I remember my first arc light.
Was at a MACV compound in Tay Ninh City.
B-52s dropped their 750-lb bombs in War Zone C.
Ground beneath me shook, like an earthquake.
solai @ 160
I know it is OT but I think it is hilarious that Fred rolled out his announcement video an hour before the debate began and then went on Leno. Talk about mean stuff !
Elliott @ 166
no it is indiscriminate carpet bombing from far far up in the sky. About as accurate as a fire hose on a roller coaster. Conventional bombs, tho.
Loo Hoo. @ 159
Um, think that happened a couple years ago.
Elliott @ 163
Nah, it’s a band from here in Athens that plays “Love Shack”!
CTuttle @ 165
105 mm Howitzers can too.
raven,
i think i get what you’re trying to make a point with. But remember, i’m only 30. I wasn’t even ALIVE when that operation took place. So i can understand the fear on an intellecutal level as i said. But i have no emotional context to give it more ooomph than that. I was talking about C-5 Galaxies as well, not B-52s.
So explain to a dumb idiot youngin’ what your point is?
watching Bill Clinton on Larry Kind – ya’ know what he’s really good at? He’s really good at reframing the situation… right now he’s talking about “why people hate Hillary”…
we should take notes…
althespook @ 169
Hmm, I was always under the impression they were very accurate?
CTuttle @ 168
I currently live on the glide path for the C5 and C17 to land in San Antonio. I have an extra place setting in a cabinet in case one drops by for dinner (as it often seems they are about to do…)
althespook @ 156
Wow, I need to stoke my bowl some more, it was Six Nukes, not, Five…!!!
raven @ 174
Buh dap bump. He’ll be here all week folks! Try the veal, it’s excellent.
raven @ 174
lmao
I hadn’t even thought of them..
The reason I asked is
I remember my father telling me there was some air vehicle that was designed to throw the sound forward to add fear to the attack.
raven @ 175
True…!!!
aliasofwestgate @ 173
Which point? Let me tell you something, if you raised your hand and stepped across that line you have my repsect. It said you were willing and that’s more than most people will ever do.
That’s what i’m talking about! *laughs* You learned to live with them on that path in San Antonio. And i was right smack in the middle of it that year in 1995 over in Lackland.
punaise @ 138
Ay, punaise! Creepy.
where’s the beef, if tea too?
raven @ 178
they got better and of course now with the laser sights and other add ons they can be amazingly accurate. But the early stuff, even arc light, was far less accurate than some in the military let on. Mind you, if winds were favorable and there were no other problems, even those munitions could get pretty good BDA’s with minimal collaterals. Still, I preferred to watch from a safe bunker in Denver, all things considered…
If I was in a third world country scrubbing my laundry with a set of rocks in the river and that B-52 Bomber came up over the horizon, I’d be scared stupid. I saw one at the Fort Liquordale Air & Sea Show and it was just amazing. But my favorite is the Stealth Bomber.
Bush knew Saddam had no weapons of mass destruction
Salon exclusive: Two former CIA officers say the president squelched top-secret intelligence, and a briefing by George Tenet, months before invading Iraq.
By Sidney Blumenthal
http://www.salon.com/opinion/b…../bush_wmd/
Elliott @ 179
Wasn’t a 52, you never heard or saw those baby’s on a bomb run from where I was anyway.
aliasofwestgate @ 144
Umm, the Galaxy was the C-5A.
The C-17 is officially named the Globemaster III.
C-17s were probably still in field testing in 1995.
The nickname for the C-5A was “Fat Albert.” :)
Elliott @ 182
I think he may be referring to the Nazi Stuka dive bombers from world war two. worked, too.
althespook @ 190
Our Japansese brothers had Washing Machine Charlie at the Canal. He’s fly over in this noisy piece of crap and keep the jar heads awake.
raven @ 184
Alright then. You were just so cryptic that it went over my head. Not much i can do about that except for read to find out why. *grins sheepishly*
Possible psyops?? Hmmmm…
I do know that my NYC cop friend told me that when you want to deflect a mugger, you should act batshitcrazy. Leakiing such a story, could be both psyops for us and whatever other entity that is targeted.
new thread! I have da Zed! Jane is On Fahr!
althespook @ 162
aliasofwestgate @ 195
Cryptic, I was probably full of shit!
Word’s up!
althespook @ 179
Hilo Airport is a daily(actually nitely) refueling point for many trans-pacific flights of C-5’s and by all sorts of Government aircraft! They come in Low and Slow!!! Heh, all the traffic keeps my aircraft recog skills well honed!!! ;-)
CTuttle @ 201
Just watch out for the guy down the street with the funny tube on his shoulder…
montag @ 192
You’re right, montag. Thanks. Fat Albert? *giggles* Suits ‘em perfectly.
CTuttle @ 201
We are on the flight path of slicks from the local NG outfit and I can feel the rotor thump long before I can hear or see em.
Didn’t someone say that the military was doing exercises somewhere the last couple of days? This nuke stuff has me spooked big time. I keep thinking how they were doing exercises on 9/11 also.
Evening everyone.
So, nuclear weapons flying about, huh?
RonD @ 206
oh THANK YOU. I feel so much safer now…
(opens door to fallout shelter, sees if wi fi will work down there…)
We better quit this bs and get up for sweet lady jane.
raven @ 208
fun spoiler.
raven @ 132
Bowing to you.
Jonathan @ 170
That explains a lot.
Fern @ 150
The scarier thing is to contemplate what shrubco expects the Iranians to do with this info…. is the goal to provoke them into doing something stupidly murderous, so we’ll have the excuse we need to bomb them into glass?
msmolly @ 210
ditto
Peterr @ 167
The way I read this in “diplomatese” is Deadeye and company want simply for the Iranians to ignore the how and why of the cover story and read the following message between the lines:
1. Don’t feck with us!
2. We mean business!
3. We mean nuclear business!
4. We ain’t feckin’ kidding!
This follows other parts of the saber-rattlin’ script for Iran that magically has popped up in recent weeks in both US and Foreign media.
Twain @ 171
They’ll eat anyone.
Mad Dogs @ 214
Then why not simply move them and tell them you’re moving them? Why the “oops, we slipped up there” story? It kind of muddies the “we’re serious and know how to take you out” strength of the message.
Elmer Fudd is not a terribly effective messenger, even if he has nukes.
Mad Dogs @ 214
Actually, this may be as much for domestic consumption as international. The “I’m a crazy fucker” card. With everyone distracted by preventing nuclear war, more judges get nominated and confirmed, more regulations eviscerating medicare, environment, oversight go unnoticed. And when he gets “sane”, the relief that our brave POTUS has avoided another catastrophe is to strong, he gets to ramp it all up again.
CTuttle @ 55
If they are always prepositioned before being loaded onto an airplane AND they were loaded onto an airplane here in America, then what does that say about where the target might’ve been … if they were gonna drop ‘em?
OTOH, only one person fired? Can’t be right. Has to be a coverup! No ONE person has that kind of authority to make a mistake of such importance.
Blub @ 103
anywhere that would distract America’s attention from George Frickin’ Bush who is currently not around these parts, being in Oz
Peterr @ 167
Some of us were a little concerned when Obama mentioned nukes with regard to Pakistan. But, THIS is Bush… It has a whole different meaning after someone has already done the things he’s done.
Unless….. Unless there’s a schism in the military and there’s a rogue element being barely contained by the ‘good guys’. It’s scary to consider. But, remember, someone in the military had to go along with selling hardware that went to Iran in the Arms-for-Hostages deal. Did the military publicly admit to it? No.
Who IS in charge?
OldCoastie @ 177
Nah, that’s a Republican tactic to set up a strawman and then show you really do want to support his view after all. See, we don’t “hate” Hillary, but that doesn’t mean the alternative is to support her either. We just look at her record, her positions and her intransigence on Iraq and then we look elsewhere.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 190
Good find!
Another blowback from Tenet?