Last night, Kevin Drum wrote about the irony of claiming Democrats need a “big idea” to reenergize their long-term electoral prospects:
Movement conservatism, despite its frequent and tiresome pretensions, has never really produced any big ideas. What it’s produced is an intellectual superstructure designed to provide fresh justification for all its old ideas. Supply side economics was a new excuse for cutting taxes. Constitutional originalism was an excuse for cutting down the regulatory state. Neoconservatism was an excuse for old fashioned hawkery. Evangelical Christians provided ammunition for cultural traditionalism.
This is exactly right. The core of modern Republican political marketing isn’t “ideas,” it’s how to hide their brazen aims behind a new set of window dressing. All the proof you need is sitting in the Oval Office right now — a man who rose to his party’s nomination not because of any inspiring philosophy or policy accomplishments, but because his last name was the same as his father.
In fact, I was just writing this morning at Needlenose that the current Frankenstein-like efforts to give life to a Fred Thompson candidacy are a logical outgrowth of the GOP’s intellectual barrenness… and, in fact, something I predicted three years ago during the 2004 Democratic convention:
It’s hard to develop people who are good at selling your party’s message when . . . your party has tacitly admitted that its message won’t sell.
That’s why I’ll predict now that the Republican options for the White House in 2008 are (1) run some loyal governor or congresscritter who loses badly, (2) drag Jeb out of Florida to run (and lose badly), (3) move heaven and earth to amend the Constitution for Schwarzenegger’s sake, or (4) feverishly try to recruit some TV or movie personality who isn’t in politics now.
Keep your eyes open for option number 4 as the next couple of years go by.
A side note worth mentioning here is that the Republicans are so acutely aware of this that they’ve developed an entire worldview based on undermining the value of ideas and trying to understand policy issues. Instead, a candidate’s “gut feelings” and regular-guyness are seen as the most important qualifications for leadership.
This is a point I tried to make when I was pontificating on the core difference between the two parties last October:
The Republicans certainly know where the strength of their brand is, which is why they try to denigrate the very concepts of reality and pragmatism at every turn. The “Republican war on science” isn’t an accident; it’s of a piece with debasing the concept of a fair press via Fox News (adopting slogans such as “fair and balanced” and “no-spin zone” so as to corrupt them), ridiculing intelligent and articulate Democratic politicians as morally dubious girlie-men, and ignoring the foreign-policy arts of intelligence and diplomacy in favor of blustering threats and military force. In each case, moral and ideological certainty is portrayed as the highest ideal, and the willingness (or — gasp! — desire) to adapt to a changing reality is depicted as a sinful, deadly weakness.
The antidote, I wrote, is to make the common-sense desire to do the right thing policy-wise into a sign of morality and strength:
If you think of Jimmy Stewart in Mr. Smith Goes to Washington, you’ve got exactly the kind of identity that Democrats should be projecting — not ideologues wanting to revolutionize the world with grandiose schemes, but honest, morally centered men and women who want to do the right thing and are smart and determined enough to get it done.
After all, the “big idea” that many Democrats look back at nostalgically — the New Deal — came about not because people thought it would be fun to try a major expansion of government’s role in American life, but because the Great Depression had created such a desperate situation that radical steps were required. We don’t want things to get bad enough that something like that is needed again.
Related posts:
- Health Care Reform: Democrats Can Honor Their Legacy, America’s Will, and Also Win Elections
- Did Democrats Lie to Us About Only Needing 51 Votes for Health Care Reform?
- President Enzi’s Idea of Bipartisanship
- Hey, Harry Reid, Stop Protecting Democrats Who Want to Filibuster the Public Option
- Graham: “If You’re Trying to Commit a Crime,” You Wouldn’t Brief Democrats
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1
2
Bam !
4
rats ! hi guys !
the zed that is only an idea (sigh)
Geez. We’re getting pretty hard up for comments!
Hey Swopa!
Madness! Madness! Madness!
Number 9, number 9….
Millineryman @ 10
Too late.
Well said, Swopa. Dead on. Party of ideas? They don’t even have an idea how to party.
I guess you all have seen this:
http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/el….._to_retire
How about the idea that Dems play by the rules and obey the law?
I know. Not a big idea, but maybe the only idea that really matters.
The most difficult issue seems to be that the calcified democratic party doesn’t seem interested in reframing things. It’s the very new and up and coming politicos that seem much more willing to reframe things.
“Radical steps”? I’m becomming aroused.
peanutbutter @ 14
;0)
Republican greed has cut the guts out of our economy…If/when the first US bomb lands on Iranian soil and oil prices triple, our hollow economy will implode.
Truth and holding those responsible for creating and dessiminating false WMD intelligence accountable would be the best strategy for both parties.
The NYTimes blog, The Lede, has a question about why it is that the majority of Americans actually think that surveillance is a good thing. Fits right in with your post, Swopa. Me – I think it’s time to start discussing secession or emigration. I don’t see how the voters, without the resources and dirty tricks of the corporations and selected (regardless of what the voting machines say) government officials. It’s not a fair fight anymore, and government has split away from the people it governs without the people’s consent.
spurious @ 11
Indeed, timing is everything.
peanutbutter @ 14
This is true. They still think in terms of “this is a good issue for us” versus “let’s avoid a fight on this issue.”
Oklahoma kiddo @ 15
Yikes. I’ll edit the post, then.
“(4) feverishly try to recruit some TV or movie personality who isn’t in politics now.”
If Fred Thompson had kicked it because of non-Hodgkins, that means we would have been stuck with Ron Silver….
Big yocks, that, though. :)
mc @ 13
I don’t think you’ll find anyone here who has the slightest difficulty with that idea.
However, if you’re here to try and sell the idea that Dems and Reps are equally corrupt, I sure hope you’ve got a boatload of evidence, cuz otherwise that dog ain’t never gonna hunt.
The Democrats should not use Ari Fleisher and the Bush administrations strategy
We know for a fact that there are weapons there.
Ari Fleischer January 9, 2003
Well, there is no question that we have evidence and information that Iraq has weapons of mass destruction, biological and chemical particularly . . . all this will be made clear in the course of the operation, for whatever duration it takes.
Ari Fleisher March 21, 2003
I think you have always heard, and you continue to hear from officials, a measure of high confidence that, indeed, the weapons of mass destruction will be found.
Ari Fleischer April 10, 2003
burnspbesq @ 24
‘Scuse me? I’m not that cynical.
but honest, morally centered men and women who want to do the right thing and are smart and determined enough to get it done
.
Too bad the (D) Congressional leadership does not have any of those.
So far in my 40 years, the only major accomplishments I have seen for the Conservative GOP movement are; Record Deficits, corruption, Cronyism, debauchery and overall dereliction.
My only saving grace is the fact that I watched Bill Clinton turn around our finances brilliantly fast.
Great Post
Dems often bash themselves for not having the same kind of intellectual bullshit justification for their policies that the goopers get out of the American Enterprise Institute..they are a waste of time with most- even most goopers- who don’t want an intellectual justification- they just want a tax cut, a war, and the reversal of Roe/Wade.
As you so properly point out- the rationale comes AFTER and doesn’t precede the gut level policy.
I hate to burst your bubble, but I’m thinking if this mortgage thing gets worse a “New Deal 2000″ will be needed.
Look — our military is at the breaking point, our infrastructure is literally crumbling, and the spectre of pandemic flu lurks in the shadows.
Buckle up, folks, it’s going to be one hell of a ride. I get the feeling that someone, somewhere has invoked the old Chinese curse on the USA: “May you live in interesting times.”
Brisingamen @ 30
I was thinking the same thing. We’re headed for a hard fall regardless of what we do in the next five years, I think.
In this vein of thought, I think Edwards is the only one who would have hte chops to put toghter a New Deal 2008 — the rest I think will dither about until we’re further in the toilet, and it will depend on who runs in 2012.
IOW, I think it’s pretty crucial on a number of fronts, not just the Iraq one, whom we elect. We need someone who will not just disengage us from Iraq, but also thoroughly, utterly, completely put down Bush’s legacy in the government. If we don’t do that, then all of this destruction he’s done will simply be used by all the presidents further down the road, regardless of party.
OK, I’m rambling again. I tend to do that when waiting for things to compile :-P
MSNBC seems to have become the “White Chicks Gone Bad” channel—every day there are hours of coverage of one or more blondes who are showin their tits or gettin drunk- or checkin in or out of rehab for some problem or another- WHO THE FUCK CARES!!!
Saul Alinsky said the most potent weapon one has against an opponent is ridicule, and I think the public is at that point where they’d be receptive to ridiculing these bozos.
Always hard to gauge the effects of an ad, but I’d bet that a 30-second ad with Rumsfeld as Moe, Cheney as Curley and Bush as Larry planning the invasion of Iraq would drive the point home.
In fact, if the smarter Dem candidates would spend less time bashing each other and more time bashing the Bushies–with satire–we see them break out a bit.
The really smart Dem candidate ought to be talking to the people who do Too Stupid to be President about some low-cost, high-impact ads.
One problem for dems is that repubs have convinced the country that being morally centered is wearing religion on one’s sleeve.
We need to get out of this fucking costly war, reprogram funds to our domestic tranquility and
help the poor…
Most americans think that “morality” is a word to describe what you do with your dick…I’m afraid that it’s become a perfectly useless term.
Just an observation about my generation and neighborhood on a micro level:
We don’t want to pay for things we need. We’re more than willing to pay for things we want. In home ownership, people will pay top dollar for granite countertops but bellow long and loud about a new roof. Pay for private school (or get grandpa to pay for it) and scream about braces or speech therapy. One young lady didn’t want to pay taxes (who does) because she “never drives on the highways or needs the fire department”. She meant it.
OTOH, the freeways and railways and bridges were a great gift and all new and a wonderful “gimme”, but to maintain something we already had is a drag. No Sugar Daddy factor.
Sorry, just popping off randomly in response to Bringsamen’s comment…
montag @ 33
It’s already being done. Ever see “Lil’ Bush” on Comedy Central?
rwcole @ 29
Yep. It’s another aspect of the undermining of rational thinking about government. The conservatives didn’t like the fact that actual academics who looked at the facts didn’t produce answers they liked, so they created their own pseudo-academic institutions where the only requirement to be a “scholar” was that your arguments produced the preferred answers.
As with conservative undermining of government and media, it’s a win-win. Either you accept that they are legitimate counterparts to real researchers, giving them a place within rational policy discussion, or you reject them as propagandists, lowering confidence in policy analysis in general.
My candidate is Edwards and Biden is sounding
fine, but Hilary is too into the war and
I’m afraid we’ve got Clinton fatigue…
I want my country back, the fucking “me
generation” is pissing me off
swopa, I love your posts and this one is no exception however I do have to take issue with one of your quotes;
no
it as an excuse to make believe they are cutting taxes when they are actually raising taxes for the middle and lower class and giving the revenue to the wealthy
cutting taxes?
that would be a no
rwcole @ 36
Agreed. And if you get caught putting it where it don’t belong, you (because you are morally centered) get a free pass from God because you went to church. No restitution required.
Stealing is ok as long as you put some in the basket.
Killing is ok as long as it’s done overseas.
Of course not. But that is where we are headed with the Republican aristocracy firmly – maybe not so much these days, one hopes – in place.
ONLY the wealthy will be able to send their kids to college, afford health care, afford to retire, afford to have a life, etc.
The middle class is disappearing and if there isn’t another New Deal, we’ll be back in the same system of government that the Founders fought against.
So much for this experiment in democracy.
Joe Klein’s conscience @ 38
Nope, no TV. But, my point is that the candidates ought to be doing it–pinning the worst of the worst on their real opponents, and selling such ads in smart places.
And the sooner they start re-branding all Republican politicians as stumblebums and clods and dickweeds, the easier time they’ll have of it come Nov., 2008. :)
Great post Swopa.
The rules for Dems.
1) Be honest.
2) Appeal with emotions not facts.
3) Celebrate our causes, not our candidates.
4) Keep it simple.
5) Put a face on it.
rwcole @ 32
Someone controlling the program at MSNBC cares about such things
realworld @ 45
As long as the expression of emotions is genuine.
Jonathan @ 34
Except they haven’t, they’ve just convinced our media and political consultants. The country doesn’t learn about morality from politicians. It’s just like their proclamation that the country is conservative — all they did was demonize the word liberal, they didn’t actually change support for liberal policies.
Now if we can just get our politicians to understand that the reason GOPers wear their religion on their sleeve is to appeal to their base (which is never going to vote Democratic), not to appeal to “real people”…
mc @ 26
Almost as soon as I hit “submit comment,” it occurred to me that I might have misunderstood you. Clearly I did. Please accept my apology.
Bay State Librul @ 40
The ‘08 election is much bigger than any candidate, or the Iraq war or any position on social policy. With the accelerating grab for dictatorial powers by the Republicans, the ‘08 election is in the class of the 1860 and 1932 elections. All of the marbles are on the line and it’s a binary choice. Winning and defeating the Republican party is everything..it may be our last chance.
Repugs are known for the slop they sell. And as it is their belief that their core audience are pigs being led to the slaughter, what else would they be selling?
Marketing 101: Sell the sizzle, not the steak.
An intellectual desert is, in the words of the Repugs: “Our Prime Real Estate! Why, Ahm gonna buy 40 acres mahself.”
realworld @ 45
Can I add a sixth:
Impeach Bush for robbing this country of
democracy’s “separation of powers”
“Use emotion”
Yes- but that needs a little explanation. It doesn’t mean “Be emotional when speaking about what you are going to do”
It means “consider the emotional needs of voters both when deciding policy and crafting your message”
So, for example, it means to consider that voters are afraid of terrorists when crafting policy about the middle east—It does NOT mean to shout and yell when communicating your policy (perhaps you would want to do that too- but that’s a different issue.)
Jonathan @ 47
Yes, No Bob Murray crocodile tears…!!!
kathleen @ 46
Dan Abrams? Doesn’t he run MSNBC?
realworld @ 45
Agreed with all of that. They’ve got the steak; they need the sizzle.
Bay State Librul @ 52
Kinda hard to justify that one when Congress pretty much has given it away for the last seven years….
Along the lines of keeping it simple, the NIA that came out today said things are better because while violence is still high it’s down from where it was.
We of course it’s down, violence is always down in the the heat of Iraqi summer! Duh.
Or as TexB remarked: Oh, so the surge brought on summer?
Redshift at 48
Thanks, as always, for the correction (i.e., re the MSM).
CTuttle @ 54
Have you seen video they have of Teddy Roosevelt’s speeches? Today, they’d label him earnest and angry, like they do Edwards.
spurious @ 11
turn off your mind, relax, and float donwstream.
kathleen @ 46
Not exactly. Someone controlling the programming at MSNBC has research that tells him/her that viewers care about such things. Commercial television is about selling advertising. Advertisers pay for eyeballs. Ergo, television shows what ratings and research indicate will draw eyeballs. In this regard, market economies are like democracies — we get what the largest number of people want. Quality? Tangentially relevant at best.
realworld @ 58
Dangit! There goes my drink!
Goopers notice that many americans are frightened and angry (but I repeat myself) about people in super markets who look different and talk in a language that they don’t understand- so they put together the great “WALL” program. They don’t care if it will ever be built- or whether it will work- or anything else- they only care about appealing to fears for votes..
That’s appealing to emotions.
punaise @ 61
It is not scheming. It is not screaming….
kathleen @ 46
Did you see the Barnicle/Fleischer interview on Hardball yesterday? I though Barnicle did a very good job. He knocked down the repub talking points on Iraq pretty effectively. All that’s getting play is Ari not knowing the soldier’s name, but the whole interview was good.
rwcole @ 64
You know, I thought for a moment this was going to be a segue into those now-ubiquitous teevees in the grocery store which still badly startle me when they start talking in my ear. I mean THAT makes me frightened and angry.
But my mistake, you were talking about something else… :-)
Barnicle’s not bad- just boring–really boring.
You know Uncle Sam is still molesting the kids and goopers are letting him get away with it.
When abused kids blow the whistle, they are most angry with the grownups who looked the other way and who still deny that anything bad happened.
Friggin’ creeps. Protect the country by enforcing the laws. The whole world knows what Bush did last summer.
punaise @ 61
I’m so glad punaise is back from beyond. Did ya bring us back a Lava Lamp?
Power Players
http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iow…..dkohr.html
burnspbesq @ 49
No worries. No apology needed.
Joe Klein’s conscience @ 60
I’ve read some of his speeches, never seen any video of them…!!!
Oliver Willis presents the correct basic rhetorical strucuure of arguments about the surge, Iraq, and most bad things this administration has produced. I guess you need to polite it up a bit, and amplify with examples, but I think Willis captures the basics perfectly.
Freedom’s Watch: Resist The Trap
…
“The surge isn’t working to end the war or make America any safer. The president is an idiot.”
http://www.oliverwillis.com/20…..atch-.html
Good post.
The republicans are cyborgs trying to blend in with we biotic folks. Yes, Bladerunner is film being made flesh. I wonder who is more gullible, those who believe the republican party line or those who hear what Cheney, Rummy, Wolfie, Rovey, etc say and fail to believe they mean exactly what they say. Some people are blinded by the belief that these guys are working for the good of the country. 51% Dick said that you only need 51% to dictate policy. His policies sure show that.
dead last @ 75
More like cylons, I’d say ;-) Or even the good ol’ classic: PODPEOPLE!
Jonathan @ 47
1) Be honest. Nothing else counts otherwise.
Alfred (thespook) kicked into overdrive late last night..
peanutbutter @ 63
Blame Betsy.
peanutbutter @ 76
Now, think of what a creative bunch could do to create a political ad with a Kevin McCarthy lookalike and sixty seconds of video…. :)
realworld @ 79
You’re the one with the timing! :-)
OT..another rat jumps ship
Renzi Says He Will Not Seek Re-Election
http://www.rollcall.com/issues/1_1/breakingnews/19759-
rwcole @ 68
He’s doing a job. This man does not give a damn about being famous. Find him boring? He’ll find a way to pay his kids’ tuition some other way. He is a journalist that has adapted to 24/7 television and radio.
Jonathan @ 59
Sure. I have a natural tendency toward being an optimist, but I think it is really important to recognize (as our politicians too often have not) the difference between conservative marketing and BS and their actual influence.
Another good one is the idea that the decline in party identification and growth in independents somehow means that those people have “centrist” views on the issues, halfway between the two parties. In fact, polling shows they overwhelmingly favor liberal positions.
Redshift @ 84
Ironically enough on Facebook I left the politics as “Other” because the one I *wanted*, Progressive, was not there. And I increasingly feel that “Liberal” isn’t accurate for me these days.
Ari Fleisher looks like a thug in this piece at Hardball. He should be in jail for being a traitor not on the News spreading more lies. Enough!
Why in the hell would anyone believe anything this liar says. Why?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/
wesgpc @ 74
The first part of what Willis says is true, and should be the core of our framing for September.
The second part of what Willis says is true, but counter-productive.
Put yourself in the shoes of a person who voted for Bush in 2004. It seems to me that Bush voters now fall into three main categories: those who will never be convinced that that vote was a mistake, those who have already concluded that that vote was a mistake, and those still on the fence about it. The first group, we have no way of reaching. The second group, they’re already on board.
The third group is the target, and here’s the problem. When we say “Bush is an idiot,” they hear, “Bush is an idiot, and you’re an idiot for having voted for him.” That may be true, but it’s also a gratuitous insult that can keep the rest of the message from getting through.
It’s never a good idea to piss off people who have something that you want (in this case, their votes).
The problem for the Democrats is that there is not a charismatic spokesperson delivering a focused message. Too many people speak too many messages.
I read hear a lot about how bush is an egotistical frat boy moron and cheney is a dangerous criminal.
What if these guys have exactly what they want in Iraq. A big U.S. military presence. No real Iraqi government. No apparently good way out.
Bush and Cheney appear not the least bit disturbed (and I mean emotionally) about how things have turned out in Iraq.
Do those of us at FDL misread these guys in terms of their competence?
burnspbesq @ 62
Actually, it is worse than that. Advertisers want the specific “eyeballs” where it is easiest to part them from their money.
Hence, the media works to titillate their prime target audience of pimply, testosterone-driven 16 year old eyeballs away from the raunchy Internet Toobz, to their likewise raunchy Boob Tubes.
Mad Dogs @ 70
sorry, just a modest spare tire from mother-in-law’s (belle-mere)’s French cuisine.
AP – The Iraqi government will become more precarious over the next six to 12 months and its security forces have not improved enough to operate without outside help, U.S. spy agencies conclude in a new assessment of the country’s political and military fortunes.
Jonathan @ 89
Umm, if you’re a six-insulin shot a day diabetic, and you want to eat nothing but candy and ice cream, you’re getting exactly what you want, but that doesn’t make you smart for doing so….
I’m starting to wonder if the “Three Stooges” would do better at leading the Democrats.
punaise @ 91
Jeebus! Now how is she going to get around?
punaise @ 91
*drool* I’m sooo jealous…!!! :P
Jonathan @ 89
Cheney is a competent criminal sociopath. Bush is a competent puppet. The mistake we make is thinking that either of them actually care about what happens in Iraq.
Montag @ 93
By competence I mean ability to achieve one’s objectives, however fucked up they may be.
Jonathan @ 98
Bush doesn’t achieve objectives. Things have always been handed to him. He is just a useful idiot.
Jonathan @ 98
Well, I suppose this is the old conundrum–can you be smart and insane at the same time? Yes, certainly. What’s likely to be the result? Well-executed insanity….
The problem with our party is they are not unified against the illegal occupations.. and they are led by robber baroness Clintons DLC with highly paid consultants who aim to say nothing controversial even if it means perpetuating lies, coddling war criminals and continuing to weaken their base, the middle class.
To dem politicians
The emotions that matter are THEIRS (voters) not YOURS.
You can cry and scream and tremble all day and that won’t do a damn bit of good.
Gore/Edwards, Gore/Kucinich. The right combinations.
So Rove is all over Crawford, Texas according to Julie Mason on Hardball. Did we think he’d REALLY spend more time with his wife?
What I believe the Democrats need to have is some kind of commonality that resonates to the point of compelling the majority of the people here in the US to simply believe and trust in our strategy for the future…
Jonathan @ 98
…fucked up objectives!!! 8-(
Badwater @ 97
I think they do care and that they have gotten exactly what they want – a weak gov’t they will keep changing, a stranglehold on the oil, a footprint in the ME and all that money. We are steadily building bases (which they deny, of course) and they have plans into the future. They have made a mess all over but that’s okay. They still will have the money.
OT, a little, but.. here’s another fraud- from Juan Cole
Pitching the Imperial Republic
Bonaparte and Bush on Deck
The French general and the American president do not much resemble one another — except perhaps in the way the prospect of conquest in the Middle East appears to have put fire in their veins and in their unappealing tendency to believe their own propaganda (or at least to keep repeating it long after it became completely implausible). Both leaders invaded and occupied a major Arabic-speaking Muslim country; both harbored dreams of a “Greater Middle East”; both were surprised to find themselves enmeshed in long, bitter, debilitating guerrilla wars. Neither genuinely cared about grassroots democracy, but both found its symbols easy to invoke for gullible domestic publics. Substantial numbers of their new subjects quickly saw, however, that they faced occupations, not liberations.
link
What a wonderful post Swopa. Thank you!
burnspbesq says: August 23rd, 2007 at 2:48 pm:
“The second part of what Willis says is true, but counter-productive.”
You have to polite it up. And you have to concentrate on structure. Bush may be an idiot, or a stooge, or in over his head, or a hypocrtical but inompetent schemer, or an grown-up adolescent sociopath, or sadly mistaken on most everything, or something else.
I am serious about the structure thing. Every statement should start with a concise attacking argument against Cheney/bush based on fact. For example:
NOT “The surge is working militarily, but the political progress it was designed to facilitate is nowhere on the horizon.”
But RATHER: “Cheney-Bush continues its track record of complete failure in providing leadership and effective diplomacy needed to support and extend any security gains Iraq due to the surge.”
montag @ 100
Well, and I don’t want to get too far off on a tangent, think about Ted Bundy.
He was competent at doing something evil.
I’m concerned about writing off Bush and Cheney as idiots, pupppets, criminals, whatever, without understanding their objectives.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 103
*sigh* Tis a mere pipedream…!!!
From NBC’s Andrew Merten
John Edwards’ speech this morning from Hanover, NH today wasn’t short on jabs against the “establishment” and “Washington insiders” — words that seemed directed at Democratic front-runner Hillary Clinton.
“We have got to chart a new course,” Edwards said. “Those wedded to the policies of the ‘70s, ‘80s, or ‘90s are wedded to the past — ideas and policies that are tired, shop worn, and obsolete. We will find no answers there.” He went on to warn of only looking fondly on the past: “The problem with nostalgia is what we tend to do is, you only remember what you liked and forget the parts that you didn’t like,” he said, without making any verbal recognition towards the Clinton presidency.
When asked by a reporter after his speech if his warnings against nostalgia and the establishment were digs at Clinton, Edwards neither confirmed nor denied that they should be interpreted as such. He simply reasserted what he said during his address, saying, “Going back doesn’t move us forward, and we need to move forward,” adding, “We have to take on the entrenched interests that exist in Washington and stand between us and the change that the American people want to see.”
But another comment during his speech wasn’t that subtle. “The American people deserve to know that their presidency is not for sale — the Lincoln Bedroom is not for rent,” Edwards said, obviously referring to the Clinton Administration practice of inviting top donors to stay overnight at the White House.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 103
Gore/Edwards a real possibility
Boy Steny Hoyer is sure A*P*C’s man
http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iow…..riran.html
U.S. lawmakers return from Israel
pledging tougher sanctions on Iran
Steny Hoyer doing A*P*C’s bidding
http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iow…..riran.html
Boston1775 @ 104
Now please don’t underestimate the allure of the 95 degree, 95 percent humidity Central Texas august experience.
I just got sick watching the Fleischer HB clip. How do they justify giving him air time. Because he has money to buy ads?
IQA is shooting at our troops in Iraq because our troops are in Iraq. End of story.
Kathleen @ 114
I seriously doubt Gore will run. Seriously seriously seriously. There’s nothing from the folks who would know to indicate so.
OTOH, wouldn’t it be something if Edwards tapped Gore for VP?
An Edwards/Obama ticket could also be very interesting.
Hm…I just dunno. I *wish* Clinton wasn’t a Clinton. If you follow me.
In response to the earlier comments on a new deal and the implied depression. Bondad predicts that the financial services industry and construction slumps will hit in about 8 months. April 2008.
Add to that my belief that the Subprime foreclosure panic will ripple through Wall Street(bailed by the feds) while the common man will lose his primary asset to forclosure while the brokers get off scot free.
If Edwards can hang in that long he has a chance. Aperfect economic storm created by the rethugs. And don’t forget about the weak dollar as well.
Rudy Giulianni on the I/P conflict
http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iow…..shill.html
“His Foreign Affairs article, entitled “Toward a Realistic Peace,” raised eyebrows when it suggested that immediate negotiations for Palestinian-Israeli peace were not in the interests of the United States.
“The Palestinian people need decent governance first, as a prerequisite for statehood,” Giuliani said in the article. “Too much emphasis has been placed on brokering negotiations between the Israelis and the Palestinians — negotiations that bring up the same issues again and again. It is not in the interest of the United States, at a time when it is being threatened by Islamist terrorists, to assist the creation of another state that will support terrorism.”
TexBetsy @ 116
I love this weather. ;0)
TexBetsy @ 116
Only if there is beach and a cantina close by.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 121
I declare you insane :)
Watch the piece on Iran’s Revolutionary guard. http://www.channel4.com/news/general/iran_in_focus
Kathleen at 120
IMO, the reason some horrible event — an event that makes 9/11 look like an ice cream social — occurs in the U.S. in the next 50 years is the awful way the U.S. supports suppression of the Palestinians.
Jim Clausen @ 119
Is this why Dem primarys are in an all out race to be the earliest?
Perhaps the next prez, depending on who it is will appoint Joe Lieberman the next Middle East envoy.
OT, but I thought N=1 might find this interesting:
http://www.theliberaloc.com/20…..or-correa/
TexBetsy @ 116
It’s the perfect weather to recharge a turdblossom.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 121
Well, it at least is preferable to five below with a wind chill down to thirty below and two feet of snow and ice on the ground.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 127
I hoping for Burma, myself….
Twain @ 123
Lahoma says the same thing. Unrelated to weather conditions though.
“The system in Washington is rigged.” John Edwards.
Tucker and the guys find this hysterical and stupid.
Robert Fisk: The Iraqis don’t deserve us. So we betray them…
Published: 23 August 2007
http://www.robert-fisk.com/
Boston1775 @ 133
And I find Tucker and the guys hysterical and stupid.
Edwards speaks for me.
OKK
Test
X squared plus 1 = 0
X =
Jonathan @ 125
How many times do we have to hear this or read about this issue in other countries newspapers before we do the right thing and demand that Israel pull back to the 67 borders, share Jerusalem, water rights and stop building illegal settlements?
Bush 41 and James Baker tried to deal with the I/P conflict in a more fair and balanced way, that is why the Israeli lobby set them in their targets in the 92 election.
Jonathan @ 136
sqrt of -1, or rather an imaginary number. *If* I remember back in the misty dawn of my education, that’s “i” ?
peanutbutter @ 138
i (square root of -1) is correct. You get an A.
Jonathan @ 111
Sure, that’s understandable–in part, because none of these people have revealed themselves in any way that most of us can identify as a clear sign of their innermost qualities.
But, if you think about it, Cheney has fucked up, repeatedly, on his own (oh, yeah, Halliburton was doing great when he quit–their stock was down to about five bucks a share because of the Dresser Industries deal Cheney insisted upon). Bush spent most of his life as a drunken fuck-up. Sure, they can bully others by virtue of position and get what they want, or by palace intrigues, but that doesn’t mean any of what they’ve done was smart.
As I suggested, simply achieving your goals isn’t an indication of intelligence, nor is it an indication that things will turn out exactly the way you want, even if it looks that way for the moment. Yes, I think they intended, from the start, to create mass chaos in the Middle East–that was easy. But, the military is well-worn down, the public is fed up, and Iran may turn out to be the big winner in this mess.
Those are things they didn’t consider when they started out to reorder the Middle East. What we, the ordinary public, do not know right now, is whether or not these bozos actually believe their own bullshit. That’s the real uncertainty right now. I don’t think there’s any real debate at the moment that whether by intent or accident, things in the Middle East are a hellacious mess.
If one judges by the results, it doesn’t matter much if they’re craftily insane or ploddingly stupid. They’ve broken the military, probably ruined their party for a generation, made it infinitely more difficult for their friends in the oil bidness to control the oil in the region, and ruined the national debt in the process.
Why are we doing HS math in here?
Eureka Springs @ 101
I had to laugh (cynically) when I read “The problem with our party”. The people have been handed the bill once to often as both parties of the frat brothers and sorority sisters party with the big boys of pharma, insurance, and military contractors. None of the little people have received an invitation to the party, just the bill.
TexBetsy @ 141
I don’t know, Tex, but it’s getting me ready for school next week. peanutbutter wins a prize in my book.
peanutbutter @ 128
Thanks! I visited, read and left a comment! ;^)
TexBetsy @ 141
I apologize. I did it only because I like OKK and I gather that he is a HS math teacher. Again, sorry.
Boston1775 @ 143
***
I believe today was OKKiddo’s return to teaching math…gotta keep him on his toes. *G*
Jonathan @ 145
Not a problem, but I spent this morning at the HS getting ready for the school year.
TexBetsy @ 141
College math is too tough?
Mad Dogs @ 148
Perfect answer. A
Boston1775 @ 143
It must be school time. I think nursing classes are back in session, as I’m getting a fair number of term paper topic searches on my blog. Wish I had the faculty salary to go with that though….
Just came across the father’s slide rule, who among you can handle one of those?
It all started with Forrest Gump.
Which, by the way, is why I hate that movie.
Gareth Porter Bush’s “Killing Fields” and the Real Lesson of Vietnam
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..61577.html
Elliott @ 151
Not I. :) Too young.
I apologize in advance.
For an A in math:
(d/dx) x squared =
Well, I think McCain just dived down rabbit hole and clonked his head on the Red Queen’s crown. Somebody threw a fifty-cent piece down the hole and he went after it….
Boy, John, now that we know what you are, maybe it’s time to haggle over price….
TexBetsy @ 154
Where I grew up it was cool to be a nerd, and the ultimate of nerdiness was carrying a slide rule in your pocket protector.
NYC. Stuyvesant H.S. Class of ‘67.
Jonathan @ 155
x
Elliott @ 151
All right, Elliott, I used one AND I can’t remember how to use it. My little Texas Instruments 34 calculator has taken over.
old=remembers slide rules
older = remembers using them.
older yet = already forgot how to use them.
It seems to me that the first thing has to be to unite behind the Democratic candidate, whoever he or she is. In my view, any of the Democratic candidates is vastly superior to any of the Republican candidates. I don’t think we stand a chance of beginning to correct all of the things the Bush crowd had destroyed, unless we stop knit picking Democrats in the primary. Vote how you want, but don’t promote another Republican administration.
Boston1775 @ 159
lol
Elliott @ 151
I can – both linear and
CIRCULAR! (Father was a mech.e.)
BigMitch @ 160
aren’t you a lawyer?
Elliott @ 151
Depends what you’re using it for.
Elliott @ 164
I used to be a lawyer. Now I am a bum.
Y’all seem to forget that Hillary Clinton is both a Republican and the front runner. Odds are overwhelming we’ll have Republican government for the foreseeable future.
Mitch I was born in 66.
kathleen @ 153
Shorter Junya: “We gotta pour more fuel on the fire, or it will go out. Jest lahk Veetnam.”
Anyone able to go and hear Juan Cole tomorrow in Washington D.C.
http://www.newamerica.net/even…..iddle_east
Juan Cole: Lessons from Past Western Incursions in the Middle East
Learn More About:
Steven Clemons
About These Icons Juan Cole will discuss his new book, Napoleon’s Egypt: Invading the Middle East and the relevance and lessons of Napoleon’s expedition in Egypt to the current American occupation of Iraq. New America Foundation/American Strategy Program Director Steve Clemons will offer comments and moderate the discussion.
Juan Cole is a professor of Middle Eastern and South Asian history at the University of Michigan, the President of the Global Americana Institute, and the publisher of Informed Comment, a blog that specializes in providing translations and commentary on the modern Middle East.
Start: 08/24/2007 – 12:15pm
End: 08/24/2007 – 1:45pm
New America Foundation
1630 Connecticut Avenue, N.W. 7th Floor
Washington, DC, 20009
United States
The constipated engineer was able to work it out with his slide rule.
Swopa @ 165
!
.
Hi Swopa, great post
and your earlier one (Needlenose) referenced by Scarecrow, iirc
BigMitch @ 166
I think I’ll just bite my tongue here.
TexBetsy @ 109
I liked the post too, but I’m confused. The only idea the Democrats need is … what? The New Deal?
If I missed something, please point me to it.
Bob in HI
bobschacht @ 174
Yes. We need to take care of ourselves and each other. Focus on the needs of the country and not on our fear.
Elliott @ 173
Gotta admit, though–couldn’t have asked for a better straight line. :)
Sounds good. Do you know where we can get some, because there sure as hell aren’t any honest, morally centered men or women in the Democratic Party, at least not in leadership positions, and of course if it doesn’t involve lying, cheating and stealing the ReThugs want nothing to do with it…..
Swopa, If you’re out there, Edwards is recognizing that we may need the Next New Deal. I think that’s why I’ve studiously avoided him… I don’t want to be where I am.
chuckling @ 167
A real Republican is better than the radical right wing Fascist administration in the White House. Make sure you have your passports, that is if folks in other countries will let us in.
zero
Big Mitch
The answer is 2x.
Isaac Newton developed calculus in the late 17th century.
My opinion: If one wants to study the history of ideas, one must study both physics (which includes ideas of mathematics) and 18th century philosophers.
BigMitch @ 166
My favorite occupation. Just checking in. Hi everyone.
Hastert to Step Down Early
An Illinois Republican source tells the Evans-Novak Political Report that former Speaker Dennis Hastert (R-IL) “plans to resign November 6 this year instead of finishing out his term.
http://politicalwire.com/archi…..early.html
Hmm, I’m thinking that ex-wrestling Highschool Coach Hastert’s deliberate “look the other way” of the Foley scandal has more to do with Hastert’s own predilections. Repubs only leave office when a scandal is headed for the front page and involves pedophilia.
Jonathan @ 181
I was in a wonderful and unusual HS program where we had the same teacher for physics, pre-calculus & history of math. 15 class periods a week.
I think it would be hard to find any actual Republican who claims Hillary Clinton as one of their own. I really don’t get it, and since she stands a good chance of winning the nomination, it seems to me the viewpoint will only help the crowd that’s been running the country for the last seven years, whatever you think they are.
Colbert apologizes to Brian Williams
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..61515.html
FYI, new post upstairs
TexBetsy @ 184
Must learn to study it in the German, too! And Tex Betsy – How terrific to have someone help to put it all together! (if the teacher was wonderful)
Does anyone remember that the Apollo missions to the moon were calculated in real time using slide rules? (Can’t remember if computers were used and to what extent, if any).
RockPaperScizzors @ 183
No matter. That will play out. If this involves a special election, John Laesch better get his act together fast.
Boston1775 @ 104
Uh huh. I never bought that he was off the payroll. They’ve just got him somewhere where he doesn’t even have to pretend to work within Hatch Act guidelines.
Something that doesn’t seemed to be grasped universally here is that the media, which still have some level of credibility in large areas of the country, are paid for (literally and figuratively) by corporate interests, who overwhelmingly side with the GOP.
You can already see how this is being set up: We are repeatedly being told that Hillary is going to be the Democratic candidate (and the implication is that Obama will be her running mate). Once this goal is realized, the entire machine will be dedicated to cycling deadly memes…”Geez, America hates her! Can you imagine what a disaster it would be to have her as President?” and “Osama….oh my gosh! Did I say “Osama”? I’m sorry, I mean Obama…” and the like, over and over, until it becomes the subconscious narrative of the entire campaign.
I remember watching the debates between Bush and Gore and after every one of them, I thought “man, that was embarrassing! Gore wiped the floor with that imbecile!” only to have Tweety (or whomever) talk about how great Bush looked, that the candidates were equally paired, it’s just whether or not the voters want to extend the “Clinton era of shame” (or some such ironic horseshit).
It always sounds paranoiac when someone says this, but our media IS owned by the military-industrial complex. The way that news-readers rise up through the ranks is by showing a willingness to tow the company line, which is “Bash the Dems and protect the GOP”. Fer Khrist’s sake, have you listened to any of the network news anchors lately? Brian Williams sounds like he’s heading up some Soviet style propaganda unit whenever the war comes up and Katie Couric acts like she’s had a visit from some GOP bigwig who’s informed her of a contract on her kid’s life (if she doesn’t come through for the Grand Old Pooters).
I’m telling you, there there will be a full-court effort to catapult the propaganda in the coming election, with every make-believe Dem scandal talked about like it’s the end of the world and every Republican pig painted with lipstick and mascara. Count on the “voices of authority” in this country, handpicked and pre-filtered for their ability to spin every lie that comes their way, to play favorites with the party that will use any means available to them to keep control of the resources of the American government, even if it’s only to loot it.
peanutbutter @ 118
I think part of Gore’s appeal is his inaccessibility. Also nostalgia for what could have been if he had become president instead of Bush. If he was really running, he would doubtless be doing all kinds of irritating things.
Jim Clausen @ 119
The two Americas theme should play real well by then.
BigMitch @ 160
Well, now I know how old I am – older yet!
For years the repugs have been implementing Grover Norquist’s plan of “reducing government to a point where it can be drowned in a bath tub”. Google Grover Norquist. he tied right to Bush and company.
A simple phrase easy to understand. You can grasp it with one look.
What the Dems (in my opinion) fail to do is keep it simple.
Myself and a couple of local bloggers have taken to simply defining many if not all of the Bush$Co outrages as DROWNING victims.
For example:
1.Dead miners reduced government oversite makes them DROWNING victims.
2.Polluted air…Drowning victim
3.Lack of national health care…..Drowning victim
4.Katrina…..Drowning (drowning) victims.
5.Collapse bridge….Drowning victim.
It’s easy think of an outrage. Call it a Drowning victim.
The Repugs ADMIT that is their plan. STICK-IT to them. Make them own it.
On the positive side the Dems could simply claim they are going to be the life guards. Protecting all Americans from the hazard of getting drowned in the repug , tidal wave, cesspool or…. you get the point.
Think about AD buys using water, life jackets, life boats, life saving ring, even cute male or female life guards.
A simple easy to understand contrast between US and them.
Between safety and hazard.
Between life and death.
You should get the point. Think about it. Expand on it write about it “float” the idea in the blogsphere.
I don’t have the writing skills or the exposure to make it fly but a real blogger.
Find me at:
http://shutterwi.blogspot.com
TexBetsy @ 154
Once upon a time, I knew. Don’t know if I could remember well enough to show someone. Matter of fact, I’m not sure where I put my slide rule. . .
Bob in HI
Enough of this father’s slide rule stuff…
Who knows their way around an abacus?….
Ideas:
1) Government of, by, and for the people (not government of the cronies for the President).
2) Transparency in government (end powerful lobbyist control of legislation).
3) Competence in government (end the undermining and dismantling of goverment agencies by anti-government ideologues).
4) Uphold the Constitution.
That’s what I want in my government.
Joe Klein’s conscience @ 60
Yeah, the way they did Howard Dean.
If you break it down you might say the thing is to let your earnest feelings come through and to connect to the crowd by speaking to things that matter to them and showing your energy and enthusiasm for getting to the job.
But, mostly it’s about being yourself. If you truly do have all the people’s needs at heart and if you truly are intelligent and experienced and if you really are a leader and have the energy & drive to carry it off, then it will come through.
Also, if you display other qualities which are not presidential, then that will come through too.
Early on the Kennedys believed it’s not what you are that is important, it’s what the public believes you are. They were masters at presenting themselves as something special. Later, it became clear they were not an inevitable force and their new humble attitude with their strong caring qualities showed through. I know John was inexperienced when he first ran. We know Bobby was a tough competitor. We know they had some problems to overcome. But, we also knew they had character and compassion and drive. They worked hard, connected with the public and the public responded. That is a lesson for all politicians.
It might not have been entirely obvious to the public at the time, but Jimmy Carter had a lot of those same qualities. He had a very outgoing easy Southern style, but he was also a very hard-working campaigner and was a very tough fighter. I don’t think the public really saw the toughness until many years later. But, boy oh boy did he connect with the public. They were ready for a big change after the rough 1960s and the tragedy of Vietnam and he offered a new direction and optimism.
kathleen @ 179
I think Dems might eventually realize HRC is more Repub-Lite than Dem and that Obama is still very likely to continue tripping over his interdiction and ruin his campaign.
…and the willingness (or — gasp! — desire) to adapt to a changing reality is depicted as a sinful, deadly weakness.
“conservative” is the wrong name for the lizard-brain Neanderthals. “regressive” is the appropriate moniker.
.
Here’s your Big Idea
http://www.prospect.org/cs/art…..he_credit_