Watching the morning kabuki on television about Rove’s resignation is quite something. They’re all taking it at face value and nobody is speculating as to what the truth of the matter might be. You know that behind the scenes they’re saying something else amongst themselves, but they really just do not see their identity as journalists who report what they know. Their loyalty is to a “tribe,” a whispering coffee klatch that viewers simply do not get a chance to be a part of.
Marcy, on the other hand, thinks that one of three investigations are probably reaching critical mass and quite likely to snare him:
The Abramoff Investigation
We know Rove is tied in with everyone tied in with the Abramoff investigation. We know that Susan Ralston, Rove’s Assistant was closely involved–and it appears that she has been refused immunity, even though some of her testimony about Abramoff appears to be quite interesting. Novak, at least, thinks Ralston would get to Rove. So it’s possible that Rove is one of the ultimate targets of the Abramoff investigation.
The OSC Investigation
We know Rove is a target of the OSC investigation into the politicization of anything and everything in the entire government. We know he did, in fact, politicize anything and everything. While the ultimate outcome of an OSC investigation would consist of Scott Bloch explaining that Rove did politicize anything and everything and recommending that Bush should fire him, but then to have Bush sit on that recommendation as he has with Lurita Doan. Perhaps Rove is leaving in an attempt to prevent us all from learning how closely our government resembles that of a one-party state, like the old Soviet Union.
The Iglesias Investigation
But I’m most interested in the possibility that Rove is rushing out just two steps ahead of the Iglesias investigation. HJC is collecting a great deal of evidence that DOJ employees covered up the real reasons for the Iglesias firing … and that the real reason for the firing had everything to do with politicizing the judiciary. If this is the reason Rove is quitting, it’s not just that BushCo wants him out before he’s officially indicted. After all, it’s not just Rove–but Bush, too–who was involved in firing Iglesias. So Rove may be leaving as part of a firewall approach in an attempt to save Bush.
All of these are ongoing, yet what we hear about is that Fitzgerald never brought charges as if this somehow exonerates Rove. Rosy speculation abounds that he will go to some presidential campaign like he didn’t blow the 2006 election and isn’t most probably about to go radioactive. That nobody on television this morning has mentioned any of the above is both remarkable and telling.
Update: From CNN:
Both Rove and the president are expected to speak before boarding Marine One at the White House at 11:35 a.m. ET.
(h/t dakine01)




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Uno!
dos
good morning
Ladies, Do.Not.Stop.
Show them where the real newpeople (persons) are.
epu’d from below AP via the Hartford Courant on the resignation
raven @ 3
For once that statement might not be an oxymoron.
As he goes, check Rove’s pockets for the blanket pardon.
Hope Rover leaving is a prelude to the shit hitting the fan. Marcy has laid out which fans are more likely to be whirring in Rover muck.
What I said over at Marcy’s place:
My first reaction was surprise that they’re spinning off Rove before Abu. I’d have been sure that Rove was a firewall-within-a-Gonzo-firewall.
Gives more strength to the Iglesias scenario, IMHO.
Isn’t it possible that he will still be Bush’s senior advisor secretly? Actually being held accountable for any wrongdoing whatsoever seems so far fetched with this administration.
What Republican candidate wouldn’t want what Karl Rove has given George W. Bush?
International scorn, domestic ridicule and loathing, personal cynicsim.
Bring Rove on to the someones campaign and watch them tank.
-GSD
THANKS Jane for bringing up this question and pondering the notion. I got sick of hearing the pat comments from the weinie set, so came to the Lake. AHHH -fresh air and perspective! Can’t wait to find out what the REAL reason for the weasel’s departure is.
I think Marcy has it pegged right behind door number three. Leahy/Wax have a lot more info than the WH expected coming from “leakers” in DOJ that are fed-the-fu**-up with the shenanigans from Rove et al.
The USAG scandal has rovian fingerprints all over it and Leahy/Wax are generally pissed off enough at this point. I also believe that a few goopers let it be known to the WH that they could no longer protect against Hatch violations as their constituents have let them know in no uncertain terms that their cushy seats in congress are no longer certain.
“Finally, Chief of Staff Josh Bolten told senior White House aides that if they stayed past a certain point, they were obliged to remain to Jan. 20, 2009.”
Ok, this, along with every other thing in Gigot’s article, does not ring true. People resign all the time. You mean to tell me that Bolten is going to tell the “architect” that he cannot resign?! Transparently false.
Indictment coming, Note the “sake of the family” quote.
Badwater @ 7
Good point. If Marcy is right about investigations implicating Rove, he’ll be pardoned on the way out.
DC Madam. Please, please, oh please.
Bill Kristol finally offers a relevent thought after 2 decades of whiffs:
Karl’s departure is pretty sudden and for me, pretty surprising. … Karl Rove loves politics. He’s awfully smart. And September’s going to be an awfully big month for the presidency. It’s odd that he’s not going to be there.
-GSD
this is a great quote I gleamed from think progress…it’s the pnac figure head krystol;
if krystol isn’t lying, (which is a stretch, he ALWAYS lies), then something HUGE happened, krystol HAS to know about something like this
unless bush took him out of the loop…which means cheney is out of the loop
my scenarios are endless
‘It had to happen’, said Tweety. Really? The peons didn’t see it coming. So, what have the nabobs been talking about when not discussing the weather in Nantucket for their summer jaunts north?
This posting on the Siegelman case is certainly intriguing.
Whenever I look at his ugly mug I’m reminded Never trust a man who is always smiling
I have a very bad feeling about this. No matter how much we love to hate Rove, he was the last wall between Bush and Cheney. Cheney wants Iran.
Inside the White House, they’ve know for some time. For us, it’s a surprise. – Kelly O from the White House.
JPL @ 15
IANAL but as I understand it that would mean he would immediately lose his privileges and HAVE to testify truthfully before the various committees and investigations across the board.
More plausible deniability with the new FISA revisions taking effect? Firewall and door number 3 both sound plausible to me.
Uncle Karl- “You tell more about me, I consult the reams of NSA data @ my disposal & tell about you…”
The MSNBC clip over at C@L has Kelly O’Donnell explictity denying that this has anything to do with investigations 3 or 4 times.
She really needs to work on her lying.
Boston1775 @ 22
Kelly O’Donnell just spilled the beans. They are not reporters, just spokespeople for the cabal.
carmen @ 10
Ding, ding ding! This was my first thought too when my alarm woke me this morning to NPR reporting on this — with no mention of the pending investigations of course. Et tu Morning Edition?
RockPaperScizzors @ 21
You do underestimate the power of Poppy and his circles.
Besides, I don’t think that Rover was any such firewall of reason.
-GSD
SufiLizard @ 28
Of course it is. That’s why I said earlier it’s all bullshit.
Marie Roget @ 25
Please bring that catchy tune from the last thread up here. We could use some music on this somber occasion.
check this quote out also from think progress
that would ahve meant he would have replaced the entire party, beginning with bush, cheney and himself.
personally, I don’t think he really wanted to do that
Have the “journalists” told us why Rove resigning is bad for Democrats?
As those in the know will tell you, everything is bad for Democrats.
Rove still whoring the fantasy notion that there is a wall between George W. Bush and Republic Party sleaze.
Funny stuff.
-GSD
And I’ll quote you the salient bit of that Tuscaloosa News post:
raven @ 30
I don’t think it’s bullshit, I don’t think it’s a shiney object
the president banks his reputation on rove, I think this means there is trouble and big trouble
Kelly O from the White House.
Who also said – “Rove has said that he will not participate in the 2008 elections, either for a candidate or for the eventual nominee. That will interesting to watch”. (translation – ‘we in the know are *very* aware that what Rove says and what Rove does are so consistently diametrically opposed that I don’t believe it for a minute – but I can’t say that on air’)
perris @ 36
I really, REALLY hope you’re right. But that certainly isn’t my initial reaction.
Did Gigot offer Rove $20.00 for the blow job he gave him?
-GSD
piegrrrl @ 16
My eyes, my eyes!!!
Scarecrow @ 31
I almost linked “Oh, What a Beautiful Morning,” but classical music is so invigorating in the morning, don’t you think?
Mood Music for Rove’s Impending Departure
Jane:
From CNN:
CNN link
Someone posted on another thread ‘Why release this news on Monday and not a Friday news dump?” The entire month of August is a ‘Friday news dump” with everyone gone from DC. And Chimpy at Kennebunkport. Very suspicious. Indictment or flip coming. Waxman has the goods, maybe Fitzgerald too.
We got him. You’re next Dick.
dakine01 @ 42
CNN link
Awesome. Thanks.
valletta @ 20
And I always think when I see Rove smiling, Sharks always smile before they bite.
Looking for musical interludes?
quoting Marcy
“So it’s quite possible that Rove is leaving just three steps ahead of one of the many sheriffs that have him in their sites”
JF @ 40
does dc madam deal in same sex partners?
maybe gannon worked for her?
tee hee
Looks like someone doesn’t work for the American people anymore…WHACK!
;>)
Perris,
You are on the mark. Rove and Bush have been a team since the beginning.
Now Bush is literally going to need a brain transplant.
I think this is the old man stepping in hard to try to keep the ship from hitting the shoals.
-GSD
Rayne @ 46
Sharks have warmer eyes.
All the Exec Privilege that the Dems haven’t even tried hard to challenge will still be at issue, even if he loses his 5th. Plus – if he lies, what do you do? No one is producing any evidence and Dems have no guts for a prosecution.
Gigot provided some insight, not just into his editorial bent (which has been obvious) but into what reporting outside the op pages of WSJ will be like under Murdoch. Cracked me up when he noted Rove’s forebearance over being “dragged” by Fitzgerald before a GJ 5 times. And here I thought a few of those times where when he was asking himself to go and try to correct his prior “truthiness.” But obviously a WSJ reporter wouldn’t get those kinds of facts wrong.
BTW – did anyone bother to ask Rove why his son is off to college and not Iraq?
I didn’t think so.
Cooperating witness? Indictment? Leahy/Wax have the goods? This is like rooting for the Red Sox. (Aside from 2004 which may have been a dream)
Every year. EVERY damn year. And then in the end. Nothing.
That being said, I can’t wait for the perp walk.
Karl is leaving before the storm, a storm so big that Bush who has stood by Gonzo through everything so far has to get rid of Rove right now?
Sure Rove is being investigated for everything but my guess is somewhere, someone has proof of his guilt. After all even if Congress gets the Supremes to say Karl is not covered by Executive Priviledge whats to stop Karl from lying?
Unless somebody has some proof of a crime, not a normal crime like bribes by Abramhoff or election fraud Bush’s supporters don’t care about that stuff.
Also Arlen Spector is not likly to vote Karl in Contempt of Congress for lying about something like that. Nope Karl did something the GOP base would disapprove of something Larry Flynt might know about.
Something like that guy the mob took out for Abramoff. Something even Karl couldn’t sell the 30%ers on!
From us to you, Karl.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Jhmo8EOg0o
perris @ 36
Does anyone truly believe that Rove resigning = Rove being gone? I’m beyond hopeful this means the Dems are actually accomplishing something. But I can’t dispel the notion that this is a very public “human sacrifice” to illustrate the moral purity of BushCo.
Bush/Rove doing an announcement at roughly 11:30 ET. Oh. ET call home. There’s weird stuff going on here.
WSJ will be like under Murdoch. Cracked me up when he noted Rove’s forebearance over being “dragged” by Fitzgerald before a GJ 5 times.
The Falling Down crowd has suffered oh so much.
It almost makes me want to weep like Poppy Bush or Tony Snow.
-GSD
Um, we haven’t talked about Sara Taylor for a while. She got in trouble with Leahy for inconsistently invoking executive privilege. She and Kyle Sampson are young and inexperienced and may have been snared and are now flipping. And then there’s Susan Ralston. *crickets*
GSD @ 50
Didn’t something like this happen the last time 43 went to Maine?
More rain on the parade. Remember what a happy day it was when AG Ashcroft left? Only to be followed by Gonzo. Who is worse than Rove who will follow him?
I’m wondering whether Rove is moving into position to oversee operation of the anti-Dem-prez-candidate machine.
eCAHNomics @ 60
No one.
Thinkprogress:
Roll Call reports that a fight has been averted over Bush’s recess appointments. “Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) has quietly shelved plans to hold the Senate in pro forma session this month after the White House agreed to refrain from making any executive appointments during the Senators’ August break.”
Hmm….Not up for a fight, eh George? Looks like the shoving the face in shit politics might be coming to an end.
Look for an old school realist to come into the fore.
Perhaps James Baker to implement the much ignored Baker-Hamilton recommendations.
-GSD
things come undone @ 54
gonzales is a differant animal then rove, gonzales has to stay because any replacement that’s confirmable would would bring the president down.
gonzales is there till the last or unless the president can recess appoint in his place
rove’s replacement doesn’t have the same liability for the president as abu torture’s replacement has
Here’s my take on the bread crub trail:
Rove announcement timed for full news cycle: bright shiny object
What’s new w/ the Shrub? Spending more time and at shorter intervals with Babs and Poppy: Poppy is running the Russian and French diplomatic efforts, and now running foreign policy (Rice not there for dogs and suds with Sarkozy. Cheney not invited to Maine. No lobster for you. Evah.)
What can’t Shrub control? Market volatility. Housing collapse. Economic collapse. Iraqi civil war. Oil in ME.
What else is happening below the radar? Permanent and huge military hospital in Balad staffed by AIR FORCE and Army personnel. Balad’s air strips made enormous, permanent and hardened. Can you say Iran?
Unknown/inexplicable factors: Dems rolling over on FISA. Whitehouse/Feingold/Leahy/Waxman anger and willingness to take action. Pelosi’s off the table stance to Republican wrongdoing.
Rove sure isn’t leaving to go hug his family, that’s for certain.
Boston1775 @ 59
The Putin meeting and then Bush hurried home and commuted Libby’s sentence. That stepped all over the Putin meeting.
This(Rover’s departure) steps all over Romney’s straw poll “victory”. Which means this is about Bush and not the R-Party.
-GSD
Will this give Mr. Cheney even more power?
perris @ 48
That’s it. Lunch is 2 hours away and it’s ruined. Thanks for the weight loss plan.
Jonathan @ 61
I can’t see it in the US.
But a lot of US political advisors pimp out across the globe. I pick down Paraguay Way for Rove, tho.
eCAHNomics @ 60
More rain on the parade. Remember what a happy day it was when AG Ashcroft left? Only to be followed by Gonzo. Who is worse than Rove who will follow him?
A more unfettered Cheney?
And how does this effect Mr. Gonzales?
1970cs @ 51
To paraquote from John Steinbeck in East of Eden- “I don’t like that man’s eyes, mommy. They put me in mind of a goat’s eyes.”
Oklahoma kiddo @ 67
haha. could he have any more? does he need it?
There is no one worse than Rove.
-GSD
Mary @ 52
Executive Privilege would not apply against Congressional criminal investigations. He would have to talk.
People are making the same pre-election mistake in thinking that Rove is all seeing and all knowing.
He was totally blind before the elections and was literally casting about like a drowning man.
Let’s put to bed the notion that Rove will jump on board someones campaign.
No one wants to stand near the kid with political chicken pox.
Bill Kristol pegged it, there is a big political fight coming and Rove is leaving?
Weakness, weakness, weakness.
-GSD
perris @ 64
True but from an image standpoint losing Karl is worse than keeping Gonzo.
I can’t believe Karl would give up the power of being in the White House unless someone pushed him out. But what could be so bad that Bush would push Karl out?
Could be he’s resigning the White House, but maybe his new job is coordinating the attack on Democratic candidates in 2008. Could be, I suppose.
utahgirl
And there’s this over at Think Progress: http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..id=topnews
Ney aide wore wire…
And then read this:
http://www.democracynow.org/ar…../26/157241
Ney, Rove, Iran, oh my
wow… the news woke me out of a dead sleep… I don’t know what is going on but Rove’s non-appearance before the SJC certainly pops to the top of my mind.
utahgirl @ 78
This one makes some sense…
Let us not forget the Tillman murder. Michael Gerson who was then a speech writer, is supposed to testify about what he knew about and who made the official statements. His colleague Matthew Scully, describes how closely KKKarl monitored official statements by Gerson. Scully also implies that going to war with Iraq was not too difficult. Scully admits “we’ve taken the country to war”. From the Atlantic article
_______________
It was a rare day when Karl Rove, Josh Bolten, Dan Bartlett, or someone else didn’t open the door to see what we were all howling about, or to add to the fun with their own routines…
As John observed in late 2003, around draft 20 in the typically chaotic revising of an education speech, “We’ve taken the country to war with less hassle than this.”
The more and more I think about this, the ONLY reason that Rove would SO publicly announce resignation (with presser AND Gigot-friendly editorial) is that something like an indictment or major investigation is coming down the pike. They have to make a bid deal, with dates, of a separation from the WH. The date August 31st is everywhere. Not a coincidence. They always have to beat you over the head with the talking points.
OT, but you really need to read: The miners have really no chance of rescue.
It may be important to understand how the Speaker views this resignation.
From WSJ article:
“I just think it’s time,” Mr. Rove said in the interview. “There’s always something that can keep you here, and as much as I’d like to be here, I’ve got to do this for the sake of my family.” Mr. Rove and his wife have a home in Ingram, Texas, and a son who attends college in nearby San Antonio.
In the interview, Mr. Rove said he expects Democrats to give the 2008 presidential nomination to Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, whom he described as “a tough, tenacious, fatally flawed candidate.” He also said Republicans have “a very good chance” to hold onto the White House in next year’s elections.
Mr. Rove also said he expects the president’s approval rating to rise again, and that conditions in Iraq will improve as the U.S. military surge continues. He said he expects Democrats to be divided this fall in the battle over warrantless wiretapping, while the budget battle — and a series of presidential vetoes — should help Republicans gain an edge on spending restraint and taxes.
Don’t be absurd. Karl’s resigning so he can spend more time with his family. And I assure you, that’s not a well-known code phrase for “fucked up real good, trying to deflect blame from superiors.” Honest.
Wasn’t rove W’s point man on rebuilding NOLA post-Katrina? Anyone asking what he hasn’t done, how horrible things there still are and who might replace him to continue the clusterfcuk?
utahgirl @ 78
I hope it works as well as his brilliant 2006 strategery.
-GSD
moeman @ 88
Lieberman is babysitting Katrina.
*blinks*
Whoa. I’m awake now, no need for the coffee I just made…
And yeah infuriating about the news media. It almost needs as much in the way of wakeup calls as the government does.
But, privately owned, directed by their owners and advertisers, what hope does the average person have of getting real news from this kind of setup? I suspect this is why the blogosphere analysis of news is growing…
Have been away from news for the past three days, and so only heard of Rove’s resignation this morning on NPR. The coverage was pathetic, and unfortunately reinforced my decision not to them any more money for the time being. Nothing at all on his likely role in the USA firings, and the coverage was overall sympathetic to him as opposed to, as Rove put it, the Democratic ‘mod’. Pathetic is too kind for this kind of coverage. If I hadn’t followed these stories on the blogs, I wouldn’t have the faintest idea what was going on.
IMHO: somebody nailed him. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
The Dems should withdraw all of their Presidential candidates. The chickens are coming home to roost, and the Dems shouldn’t be there when said chickens arrive. Why should we clean up this mess? What’s in it for us, other than headache and heartache? Let on of the neocon incompetents take the helm (but not the Congress) for another four years, and they’ll go from critical condition to dead as a door nail.
Mitt Romney? perfect guy for the job. He can’t even deal with his own mess – much less that of BushCo and the Cabal.
Same goes for any of the other feckless, ideology-driven (we need idea-driven – a huge distinction) intellectual lightweights.
Trust me: this is the only way justice will be served on those deserving it.
Absolutely possible that Rove is about to be connected to some real dirt, although the most of the media just won’t want to connect the dots, as judged by NPR’s performance this a.m.
Maybe someone will finally publish that two of the planes that flew out the bin Ladens and their buddies post-9/11 were the same air charters that are flying the rendition flights for the CIA (anyone remember the cargoes in both directions for the Hasenfus flight way back during Iran-contra?). Abramoff got a bribe from one of those post-9/11 sheik escape charters later on (the one owned by the President of Gabon). Maybe some of that 9 million fell into Rove’s lap. And the owner of the sheik flight out of Providence was owned by an associate of mobster Ray Patriarca. Don’t know if he’s got any connection with Gus Boulis or SunCruz, but, hey, it’s a small world.
The problem with keeping the money all in the family is that eventually the bigger picture becomes evident. Anyway, at least Mister Rove gets to spend more time with his family.
Joshua Green from the New Atlantic just spinning about Miss Piggy Rove. Something is up….they are bringing em all out to throw up sand and smoke-screens…Wonder WASSUP…this week is going to be interesting….
Ah Green just said Rove has been through quite alot!
And what about Rove, voter caging, and the missing White House/RNC emails?
Oh boy.
Calling Luskin?
Any word on who the new Katrina czar will be?
Knut – we all just learned about this earlier this morning.
Jane, hope you’re feeling well. It’s hard to be surprised by the abysmal failure of the MSM and the pontificating punditocracy. They have been a complete failure in being honest brokers of the 4th Estate. It’s time that the monopoly of the MSM filter be exposed and broken.
It is my fervent hope that Mary, Marie and Kevin Tillman will turn up as part of this calculus.
It is my own version of wishful thinking, but I want them to have a role in avenging the torture done to them by this administration.
So here we all are, fiercely focused on Turdblossom’s resignation. What’s going on in the meantime? ‘Cause sure as Musselman’s grows little green apples, this is a colossal front for something even more humongous. Just sayin’.
Wonder who will be Karl’s replacement?
Lemme guess, is this to stop any further potential investigations? Or did kkKarl already get the main tool he wanted and needed….for 6 months of unfettered spying on Americans such as those he considers enemies of the state (hello any and all Democrats)overseen by his bff Fredo. Come on this resignation is symbolic only, but it certainly won’t mean the end of the culture of smear and fear. He’s just moving his operation out of the Whitehous for appearance sake only. That is unless there is some criminal charge pending…and I’m not so certain of that.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 104
Barney, aka Bush’s new brain.
Good riddence to bad trash I say when it comes to KKKarl. Who will wipe George’s nose now?
Remember, The Machine would toss Rove into a paper shredder or literally feed him to sharks if it meant maintaining a modicum of credibility.
Rove may have just learned that he’s not the only chess player in Washington.
-GSD
Marcus Aurelius @ 95
But as someone pointed out to me recently, what about Supreme Court nominations?
I also heard today, here in Indiana, that many red states like ours are terrified of how it will hurt our Democratic candidates to have HRC at the top of the ticket in ‘08.
I heard on the local news on NPR this morning that they’re estimating it hurting state and local candidates by at least 3-4 points. That could mean our three Freshmen Democrats from Indiana in the House could lose those seats back to the Republicans.
Certainly something to consider — I’ve been vocal in my opposition to HRC before, and this is yet another reason for my concern.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 104
Jeb’s not that busy these days.
Just finishing this little parody of “Eleanor Rigby” renamed “Republican Party”, and had just added the last, final verses aboutold Turdblossom, when I read about his premature departure for the Bush administration.
My bet? Rove will switch parties and startadvising sleazy Democrats…
Now that he has single-handedly handed the Democrats both the demise of the Republican Party and JohnMcCain’s political stock.
Karl, there is no place to hide form the question marks of history, your journey has only begun.
Here’s that song…
Republican Party
(to the tune of “Eleanor Rigby”)
Ah, look at all the lonely people.
Ah, look at all the lonely people.
Republican Party, picks up the trash
in the hall where their meeting has been
Lives in a dream.
Stares out the the window, wearing a leer
that could bring out the blush on a whore.
Who is it for?
All the corporate big-wigs, where do they all come from?
All the corporate big-wigs, where do they all belong?
Deadeye Dick Cheney, writing the words of a speech that nobody believes,
The web that he weaves: look at him working,
hand up his sockpuppet Bush when there’s nobody there,
Who do they care for?
All their corporate buddies, where do they all come from?
All their corporate buddies, where do they all belong?
Ah, look at all the lonely people.
Ah, look at all the lonely people.
Republican Party, lied to the church
about Foley and other big sins.
How can they win?
Turdblossom’s done now,
wiping the dirt from his hands as he walks from the grave.
No R was saved.
Except the corporate big wigs, where do they all come from?
All the corporate big wigs, where DO they all belong?
So many comments so many threads up this morning is there a secret FDL alarm clock that goes off when big news happens?
barbara @ 103
Indeed. These are the times the blogosphere vaults into action to disclose whatever may be behind the curtain. Stay tuned…
Sufi said:
“I heard on the local news on NPR this morning that they’re estimating it hurting state and local candidates by at least 3-4 points. That could mean our three Freshmen Democrats from Indiana in the House could lose those seats back to the Republicans.”
Are these the same people that were predicting the Republican firewall would hold and they would keep the House and the Senate in 2006?
-GSD
GSD @ 74
Cheney is worse than Rove, but then, he’s already in charge.
eCAHNomics @ 60
Cheney? *wild baseless speculation* If Rove tamped down the Iran plans, then Cheney removed him? I have no clear idea on how well or not these two men worked together or to which degree each are important to the chimp.
Very odd indeed. Press conference at 11:30ET? In another hour and a half?
things come undone @ 112
Houseguests. Got up to make ‘em coffee. Howie and Joel.
things come undone @ 113
you mean like a dog whistle?
To quell the market?
Bay State Librul @ 119
Dow is up 53 points
things come undone @ 112
The Lake just knows. *g*
barbara @ 103
Hi barbara, I’ll do a recap because this started early and is moving at different speeds, depending on where you are getting your information.
Television is saying that Rove “will be missed”.
Every paper except for the WSJ was dissed by the WH.
Jane, Scarecrow and Marcy have been moving full speed ahead to give us the best analysis of Rove’s resignation. The rest of us are working on the analysis as well.
Here’s some coffee. Now get to work.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 104
Which Karl, the Deputy Staff Director or the Political Office?
Remember the tale of two Karls? If his Deputy staffer had been a different person than his political chief, they would have been violating the Hatch Act whenever they got together to strategize.
So Rove was, essentially, a walking hatch-act violation. In one body. A veritable “two-faced liar” (because he lied in both capacitites).
I always wondered if it ever hurt.
Marcus Aurelius @ 94
Part of cleaning up all the messes is the need to clean up the justice system, including th DoJ AND the Federal Courts. Most of the “liberal” (i.e., those who follow the law as written) justices on the SCOTUS are in their 70s and ’80s. I would rather NOT have Willard or Rudy or Freddie of Hollywood appointing more right wing nuts like Scalia, Alito, Roberts, and Thomas thank you very much.
Is the world and the country a mess? You bet. Are the Republics mostly responsible? You bet. Will it get any better at all if we follow your recommendation? Absolutely not.
GSD @ 76
Rove was a little distracted in 2005-6. One way Fitz was at least partially sucessful against Rove.
Waccamaw @ 121
Completely OT. Still absorbing the nicknames and such around here, but I liked this one. I take it that makes Jane the Lady of the Lake? That fits :-)
barbara @ 106
How about Jim Vanderlei? (sp) from
the politburo…
GSD @ 11
Ah yes, but one thing that can be said in Rove’s behalf is that he made Young Bush a PLAYER in history, and having been a PLAYER is really enough for these folks.
GSD @ 115
Actually I live here, and I’d be willing to bet it could hurt our other Democratic candidates even more than the predicted 3-4 percent. Seriously.
It is VERY tough for Dems in a state like Indiana and all three of our Freshman Congressmen are from traditionally Republican districts. Independents around here tend to lean more to the right and it takes a harmonic convergence for them to support Democrats.
Jane,
I think it’s Kaffeeklatsch, not coffee klatch. But thanks for using such a great, under-used word.
Smooch.
Maybe Rove just feels that Georgie is ready to go it alone. That he has grown up and is ready to stand up on his own. Hahahahahaha…..
We have a moratorium on discussing politics in this house–I am a die hard dem and hubby is an independent who worshipped St. Ronnie.
I think he was trying to be optimistic this morning for me when he said:
“Did you see Karl Rove is resigning?”
me: “Yes.”
hubby: “Well that’s good, right?”
me: “Yes, but…..(silence while I think of how the neo-cons have damaged our country and the world, possibly irrevocably during the course of my lifetime)…yes, it’s good.”
Sigh.
Boston1775 @ 122
Serious smackdown. Uffdah!
1970cs @ 91
I cry for NOLA.
I bet Keith O will start exposing what is REALLY going on
GO KEITH
SufiLizard @ 109
This is why the rethugs want her. And, as before, the DLC could care less about how the election plays out. they are largely in it for the money.
PB @ 126
Then who is Arthur, Lancelot, Merlin ? I vote Rove as Morgan Le Fay, Bush as Mordred
GSD @ 114
He’s right. Indiana only very tentatively stuck its toe into Democratic waters in 2006. And, given that we tend to produce voters of limited knowledge and/or sophistication, a Hillary nomination would probably send Indiana back to the red side.
Not that it makes sense, but if Indiana Republicans are told to fear Hillary, they’ll just say “Okay”, and revert to their genetic predisposition to pull the red lever. Hillary is, as I keep saying, a walking, absolutely free, GOTV campaign for the Repubs.
In the pending matter of Rove v. Humanity, do you think the issue of a pardon has been broached with King Toddler?
things come undone @ 137
The Lady or the Tiger?
Look at what is happening right now. Even under immunity, there are invocations of privilege. First you need evidence of the crimes. But more importantly, you need a Congressional committee with the guts to flat out call it a crime and a criminal investigation. The Dems are not showing even the smallest desire to move in that direction on anything so I would think Rove would feel pretty safe.
DOJ is just the label on a tacky dress draped on a manequin in a window for a discount chain. There is no compliance – lots of cover up – and whistleblowers are getting no support and cover from the Dems. So technically – it is likely that the Sup Ct would find that – just as in an Exec branch criminal investiation, Exc privilege will fail in light of a criminal investigation – but don’t rely heavily on that.
Congressional power to investigate crimes is intended to be in connection with impeachment or legislative functions. If he’s already gone and there’s no legislation and no DOJ investigation into his crimes – it isn’t a slam dunk what the courts will do. After all, we have both the Arar and el-Masri cases actually in court and actually dealing directly with torture crimes and conspiracies and kidnappings executed by not just the Exec branch – but with Arar by the DOJ specifically (Thompson signed off on sending Arar to Syria – Comey signed off of the affidavit invoking state secrets) .
In those cases, the souped up version of Exec privilege – State Secrets – has been to date sucessfully used to completely evade criminal responsiblity for clear and blatant crimes committed.
So connecting the dots on what theoretically could or should be – vs what the Dems in Congress and the loyal Bushies who have guided the DOJ into its role as co-conspirator will actually puruse – has to date been a pretty unrewarding activity.
Still, who knows. It could happen. I mean – the military isn’t allowed to do things like make up a person and announce for domestic propaganda that the made up person has been running terrorist operations and has been killed, then caught, then caught after being killed, etc. They can’t do that – it’s against the law. People would get in trouble and go to jail for that, right?
And it’s against the laws of war to use “following orders” as a defense against charges of committing atrocities and murder on unarmed civilians, right? So of course, no one would get released with just time served in the brig for participation in conspiracy to murder and murder of civilians in Iraq – right?
The boundaries of law, civilian and military, have been destroyed by this President, this military chain of command, and most importantly by this Dept of Justice, all with the acquiesence of not just the Republicans but the Dem leadership in Congress.
So talking about whether or not, legally, someone can invoke privilege (it hasn’t even really been invoked in all the cases where Congress is letting it lie – lawyers should have gone to a court to get Mier’s subpoena quashed and invoked it on behalf of the holder, the President, but that never happened) — these days, that’s kind of like talking about Camelot.
A law was made a distant time ago, here …
And of course the GOP/Media Complex can never, ever mention that Rove’s conviction that he had Ohio in 2004 might have perhaps been due to rigging the goddamn vote.
things come undone @ 138
As a HUGE fan of Mists of Avalon, I must protest disparaging Morgan le Fay like that.
Yahoo reports: The US has begun major operations inside Iraq. Gen. Odierno reports they are rolling up AQ cells and also Shiite militias with ties to Iranian Quds forces. Reports that the US has captured an Iranian operative who has been financing the Shiite insurgency.
A prominent Sunni politician is calling out Shiites allied with Iran on attempting a regional take-over and on genocide against Sunnis in Iraq.
Yahoo link.
-GSD
I don’t know what is going on..but it is giving me a sick feeling in my stomach.
N=1 @ 84
That’s an important reminder. And it seems the mine owners were aware of dangerous roof conditions in the mine months ago. The whole mine was on stilts, just wating to crumble.
barbara @ 133, didn’t mean it as a smackdown, just coffee and a recap. There’s so many disconnects!
moeman @ 134
The guy from the WH who once did an anonymous kos diary said of all the evil things that were coming out of the administration, Katrina non-response was the one they thought they were most vulnerable on, when the public found out what the truth was. Of course, that was before Tillman.
It was sufficiently important to bring in the big repub money to keep lieberman in office, and chair of the committee overseeing Katrina issues.
my hope is that Rove will not be brought to trial until after the shrub leaves office…
GSD @ 144
And so as Rove fiddles, Darth fixes his murderous gaze more firmly on Iran.
OldCoastie @ 149
Well that’s interesting…given the slow machinery here, and the inevitable turn of attention toward the campaign [insert standard rant for campaign reform here] it may not be until after elections that a trial, if any, for Rove comes up…
Boston1775 @ 147
Okay. Have you noticed that everyone’s a little tense lately? Et moi aussi.
His job was to use political pancake make-up to keep the rest of us from seeing Bush’s ugly anger, ignorance and arrogance.
It wasn’t possible.
Under the Bus, Karl!
moeman @ 88
That can’t be true with a man of such tremendous honesty as Preznit. It must be that the liberal media refuses to report on all of the good news out of NOLA. Besides, a loyal Bushie like Rove would never leave before this job, or any job, is done. It’s like Bush always says: You can’t take the brush to market if you don’t finish the harvest.
Badwater @ 7
Would that be the original, or photocopy #3,457?
in case you missed it the first time, from june 28th, a harpers article about the seigelman case, which is another doj scandal……..
http://harpers.org/archive/2007/06/hbc-90000402
SufiLizard @ 143
I agree but where in literature can we find such dumb vile villians as Bush and Rove outside Comedy?
Rove says he was not forced to quit. Will spend his post-White House career writing and teaching (per CNN).
Oklahoma kiddo @ 139
The pardon plans were settled long ago.
my link to harpers at 156—and a ROVE scandal……forgot to add that……..
radiofreewill @ 153
Problem is HE’S THE DRIVER!!!
What happens when you throw the bus driver under the bus he’s supposed to be driving?
Scarecrow @ 146
They can’t get a Jolly Green up there? Even if it requires dissasembling the drill into a couple of parts? The whole damn thing stinks.
Ghostman
barbara @ 158
Miss Piggy Rove is sooooooooooo radioactive, he can only get a job at wingnut welfare think-tanks…That is IF he isn’t in the slammer.
barbara @ 159
There should be a prohibition against this man teaching.
barbara @ 158
Liberty University has open faculty spots?
barbara @ 152
These are interesting times. If we can keep our heads there is a wealth of information here which will “bubble up to the public”. (Someone from MSNBC finally opined that there was the mixing of politics and government under Karl Rove’s reign.)
I can’t bear to think of the pain that Dean David Broder must be experiencing with the departure of his porch-buddy and quail chef Karl Rove.
It is all so sad.
-GSD
Most of the slime leaving D.C. is sliding to my neck of the woods. Every silver lining has a dark cloud.
There’s something odd about the timing of the announcement. Why not on a Friday night? It suggests the WH is not in control of whatever shitstorm is heading its way.
barbara @ 158
What is Kissenger is getting too old to teach so Harvard now has an opening for a war criminal?
emptywheel has another post up.
Perhaps it would be wise if Cheney took Karl quail hunting.
The first historical draft of a definitive assessment of Karl Rove from The Atlantic, apply titled “Lessons of a Failed Presidency: Why Karl Rove Couldn’t Deliver”:
As a farmgirl, i rode the school bus and ours was a slow backroads trip. One Fri afternoon in high school i rode home with a friend on a different route which headed out of town on the main highway where the bus could get up to speed. As we passed a farm on the highway, a huge hog trotted out of the ditch & onto the highway. Bus & hog swerved at the same time with the unfortunate result that the bus ran over the pig. KERTHWUMP-WUMP!!!!
That memory sprang vividly to mind this morning when i saw the Rove headlines. Sure hope Jane & Marcy are right and that this is a big pig going under the bus. Hate to think it’s more of his nefarious schemes.
Sure brightens my day, though, as i head off to work!
barbara @ 158
Rove says he was not forced to quit. Will spend his post-White House career writing and teaching (per CNN).
and collecting huge speaking fees.
P.S. Teaching? The straight lines haven’t stopped anyway. Thanks, Karl.
JEP – that’s a good question – who is driving? Fielding?
It looks like Karl is going to ensconce himself as the next Straus at a School in Texas, where he can hold court over his salon of ‘world dominance planners.’
barbara @ 158
Teaching GED and citizenship courses to fellow inmates, and writing lesson plans (one can hope)
rove the topic of conversation on npr’s on point.
don’t know if i can stand it. just heard that rove on one side and dean and the netroots on the other have caused the polarization of american politics.
Jane Hamsher @ 117
Jane, I bet this adds several points to your feelgood meter. Hope the feeling lasts all week!
Rove teaching? Perhaps Pepperdine would be perfect. Can you imagine what kind of parents would enroll their child in one of Rove’s classes?
Oh, heart, be still …
Fresh thread up and running for everyone…
Oklahoma kiddo @ 180
Please, no Rove in CA. We already may have to suffer Condi’s return.
In the WSJ, announcing his resignation, Rove’s own view of himself:
And what about the recent subpeona and contempt charges? Did congress grow a temporary spine and issue charges of contempt for not showing up?
Can the president still claim executive privlege even if Rove is a civilian? I know that executive privilege has been abused and isn’t a legal reason to avoid a congressional subpeona to begin with, however, does this leave Rove more vulnerable in that case?
I don’t know if this has been noted but the de-mythification of Rove has begun in some quarters (subscription required):
“Lessons of a Failed Presidency: Why Karl Rove Couldn’t Deliver”
http://www.theatlantic.com/doc…../karl-rove
The article, by Joshua Green, ends with this line: “In the end, the verdict on George W. Bush may be as simple as this: He never questioned the big, booming voice of Oz, so he never saw the little man behind the curtain.”
There’s no way the king would let Rove leave unless there is such big trouble ahead for Karl even his lordship can’t stop it.
Looking forward to Froomkin’s column on this. He may not be able to learn the facts but he won’t pretend like the MSM that he believes any of what the Kid is saying.
Marie Roget @ 41
Love your selection of music! A fantastic choice. I am whistling the tune as I work.
Good Morning Dawgs!
You make it hard to stay in a frump around this house. Wonderful news, articles, & comments flying low & fast at the Lake, and I was clueless till a friend told me in an e-mail. Embarrassment X 100’s. I have always told her the news! *blush*
As mentioned upthread, maybe ignoring rover was the ticket LOL.
The reaction (NOT!) of the MSM is disgusting. Thank goddesses for the Lake and Marcy!
I sorta like(!) the combo of these 2 perceptive comments below. If trubble is looming large & comin’ fast, they may have had to leap over a step or 2 in a hurry, despite their best-laid plans. Ya’think?
perris @ 36
Nola Sue @ 9
Now. Back to lurk and try to catch up, egad!
Methinks it’s news from the Lake & Huffpo, Keith & Jon for this week, & ignoring the babble of the rabble on MSM. *g*
I wonder how many millions Rove has waiting for him in rubber-banned stacks?
Citizen Jane @ 132
Did you at least burn his toast as, you know, a little payback?
I do like the idea of having a celebratory pig-roast.
It could also be something completely unrelated and only personally sordid, like consorting with prostitutes or boys or boy prostitutes. When they call up their families, it seems more often to be personal, rather than official, misconduct.
Just a thought.
Hopefully, and I feel probably, this will lead to a degradation in Bushco cohesion. More perps willing to talk, less coordination in the spin machine, etc. A fully incoherent regime will become less coherent.
I grant Rove isn’t leaving to be with his family. Probably hasn’t seen them in months. Can’t imagine the real reason. Perjury, corruption don’t seem large enough. It has to be something for which executive privilege can’t be claimed. Maybe Jeff Gannon flipped. That guy could make interesting conversation.
Shows there’s a need to turn blogs into news gathering organizations, not simply commentators on what MSM put out. Don’t know how to go about it, but it’s something to talk about.
BTW it seems they are trying to organize a general strike for 9/11. Nice symmetry there. Something else to think about.
shrub/kkkarl presser starting.
I don’t believe I’ve ever heard kkkarl’s speaking voice before.
piggy’s gonna cry….
I’ve posted this before and I know that most of you just dismissed it, but follow me one more time — remember a year ago that John McCain was the sweetheart of the ball but somehow he took the advice of neocon, religious righties, and Bush “insiders” and he systematically destroyed himself. Then came Rudy, who looked great for a while but then somehow couldn’t quite wear the neocon hat very well. Try as he might, he just couldn’t lie with the conviction that ‘head Cheney or Bush do — and his stars has fallen.
Now we have Mitt, who is the new darling, but we all know there are too many vulnerable chinks in the armor. He is rising fast and he will fall just as fast — he’s just one “you’re not really a true conservative” blast away. Especially, if the lines start coming from the leaders of the religious right.
Let’s fast-forward to early/late November and look at the Republican field. No clear leader, no truly strong front runner, and definitely no one to unite/excite the Republican Party for the coming election. What to do –
In steps Jeb, reluctantly, wholesomely, not strident, didn’t really intend to, and nothing bad to say about Rudy/John/Mitt or any of the rest of the field. He says that he was asked to join the field by James Dobson (Terri Schiavo), then Mel Martinez (Cuban vote), then by his son George P. (Hispanic vote).
The base rallies around him as they finally have someone with impeccable conservative credentials, and absolute known quantity that is acceptable to everyone. Karl Rove comes out of retirement to run just one more campaign because “it is so important to the future of the country”. Fox news and the Wall Street Journal have finally found someone that they can endorse “for the good of the country”. Ken Mehlman, the neocon machine, Dick Cheney, Rush Limbaugh, and the entire right-wing noise machine can all coalesce around his candidacy because, while they can’t be super enthusiastic they don’t need to be super enthusiastic. It’s just the right thing to do (have any of them supported any of the other candidates yet — have any of them really given any air time to any of the other candidates yet — they put a Rudy on the air to help him Stick his foot in his mouth — same with Mitt, same with John)
It’s too late for any of the other candidates to really do sufficient background research that could undermine Jeb and even if they have some things there’s not enough time to work it in effectively.
I can go on and on but the real question is — WHAT ARE YOU (THE NET ROOTS) GOING TO DO ABOUT IT?????? Runaround gnashing your teeth. Talking and posting back and forth to each other about how it shouldn’t be happening while the 60% of the electorate that doesn’t read blogs is being (neocon-icily) manipulated into feeling comfortable (if not enthusiastic) about Jeb Bush. Maybe you will all follow the DailyKos guide of marginalizing yourselves into ineffectiveness — see Ralph Nader And the Green Party — you’ll lose, the causes that you care so much about will be trampled, but you can always say that you fought the good fight.
By now, you should all be very angry with me in this post, but the question remains — what are you going to EFFECTIVELY do about it???. Effectively here is defined by actually winning the election — not by snobbery, or correct thinking, or righteous positions, or political extortion (read Markos) or by intellect alone. WHAT are you going to do about it?
Here’s a plan (there are others), pick a candidate, any candidate, and work on getting the whole party behind one candidate. He/she does not have to be perfect — they don’t have to kiss your ass. They don’t have to agree with you on every issue. They don’t have to acknowledge that you are the smartest, most righteous progressive thinker and activist since sliced bread. What they have to do is win — – — – and then we can get to the work of changing things.
Next, flight or fight — are you going to choose flight by attacking this post and sticking your head in the sand and assume that it can’t happen or are you going to choose flight by considering it as a possibility in preparing for that possibility. Attack Jeb now. Alert the other GOP candidates now.
Lastly, if you see this post and the finger in your eye, you’re already a loser. I’ve done plenty to work for the progressive cause and, like you, the neocons and the neo-feudalists outflanked me too. Don’t underestimate the neocons, the international neo-feudalists, the Bush family, Karl Rove, or Rupert Murdoch just because you have a “feel-good” by surrounding yourselves with people who think like you — that doesn’t WIN on Election Day.
“Why Don’t Journalists Just Tell Us What They Know?” – Jane
Because the msm “journalists” haven’t had time to read the blogs yet.
typos corrected
and his star has fallen.
an
dabsolute known quantity that is acceptable to everyone.By That time It’s too late for any of the other candidates to really do sufficient background research that could undermine Jeb …
By now, you should all be very angry with me
infor this post, but the question remains — what are you going to EFFECTIVELY do about it???.Next, flight or fight — are you going to choose flight by attacking this post and sticking your head in the sand and assume that it can’t happen or are you going to choose
flightfight by considering it as a possibilityinand preparing for that possibility.Lastly, if you see this post
andtheas a finger in your eye, you’re already a loser. I’ve done plenty to work for the progressive cause too and, like you, the neocons and the neo-feudalists outflanked me also. Don’t underestimate the neocons, the international neo-feudalists, the Bush family, Karl Rove, or Rupert Murdoch just because you have a “feel-good” by surrounding yourselves with people who think like you — that doesn’t WIN on Election Day.Actually Harriet Miers and Shaha Riza are 2 of the ones on my hate list. Miers ahould cool her heels in the can for multitudinous years, the other is a crook and should have her ass fired from whatever job her current boyfriend has got her.
Fie on you ladies, be not back this way anytime soon.
things come undone @ 54
According to one of Marcy’s links, Abramoff has been singing like a morning bird.
That whole affair, which encompasses Houses Of Bush And Saud, and Cold War Ex-CIA, and MANY an American Politician (dem’s likely, too), is going to be the thing that brings this admin down . . . except for ONE thing.
The Dem’s are involved somewhere in the Scams of buying, selling, losing arms and weapons around the world . . so they will soft peddle ANY leverage they might have to keep THEIR asses clean . . . Rove was a point of negotiated comprimise between House Of Bush, and complicit Dem’s . . . lotta negotiating going on behind the scenes . .
Things will get MUCH worse, before they ever start to get better again. And within all this, a fight to the death for wealth, power, control and the right to rule the planet between the Pub’s and The Dem’s . . .
We live in interesting times.
Niccolo MacPlato @ 199
Well crafted . . . I’m with you all the way on that one. Thanks for sharing!
Oklahoma kiddo @ 44
A few days ago I was suggesting Gonzales should go very very soon.
But, as the credit crunch turns into a crisis it seems to me we need to speed up the process and perhaps jump right to Cheney. Getting Rove out of the way only makes it easier.
I hope Congress has enough to make their case against Cheney plain and simple for the American public.
If this credit crisis turns into a full-blown disaster, then we need to move very swiftly to get somebody with good sense in the presidency.
JEP @ 161
Without a driver the bus goes out of control. That’s the Republican party right now.