Rep. Hilda Solis (D-CA) on the floor of the House talking about the SCHIP legislation. You can help Rep. Solis advance a progressive agenda by contributing to her via Blue America.
Chris Bowers at OpenLeft and Simon Rosenberg at NDN both have some critical peeks at the electoral numbers from the last election cycle. And while the numbers and analysis may prove shocking to the David Broders of the punditocracy, they back up what we've been talking about across the broad spectrum of progressive blogs: the victory that brought Democrats into the majority in both houses of Congress in 2006 was a progressive victory, not a centrist one.
And the Democratic leadership and consultant classes ignore that vital piece of information at their own peril.
Let's take a single issue as a case study on why progressive politics matter to all of us -- and as an example of how Democrats, adhering to progressive values in legislating, can not only do some good but can also reach out to a vital piece of the base that has been shoved to the side for far too long -- the working poor. As Ruth Marcus points out in a WaPo op-ed today, the SCHIP legislation recently passed by Congress has gotten a lot of GOP heat -- factually inaccurate, trumped up, false heat, but heat nonetheless:
...Bashing Democrats on immigration -- accusing them of doing everything but carrying illegals' luggage across the border -- is a GOP mainstay. But the accusations that Republicans started to peddle last week reached a new low in dishonest nativism.
The first salvo involved the House version of the measure to extend the children's health insurance plan, SCHIP....
Paid, fed and sheltered? Federal law already prohibits this. But this debate isn't really about making good use of federal funds. It's about using immigration as a weapon against at-risk Democrats -- and assuming voters won't bother to learn the truth.
As Jane has already pointed out, the GOP keeps on trumping up their spew on immigration at a price -- and the numbers show that the hispanic vote, in particular, does not favor the Republican party as a result of their constant racially-tinged malignancy. SCHIP as an "illegal" immigrant bonanza? It's just so much bullshit, and Rush Limbaugh has been at the forefront of the wingnut Wurlitzer's factually inaccurate malarky peddling:
First here is an editorial from yesterday's Washington Times. "Unsatisfied with thwarting a Republican effort to authorize $3 billion for a border fence, congressional Democrats are trying to enhance the incentive for illegal aliens to enter the United States by removing the citizenship requirement from the popular State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP)."...So this is the sneaky way that the left is attempting to get universal health care without taking it in one big bite. They do it in a stealth fashion, and they put it under the guise, (sniveling voice) "It's for the little children. We cannot deny the children health care. There's so many of them without insurance." So it's a sneaky little thing, and now to expand it even further; remember this is about the redistribution of wealth. This is about controlling people. This is about eliminating or putting as many obstacles in the way to acquiring wealth, by the way, on the part of wage earners as possible.
Here is the truth. Having worked with at-risk kids for years in my legal practice, both in my own firm often as a guardian ad litem representing the kids or as a prosecutor representing the state's interests against abusive parents, the problem of uninsured children living in poverty, and of the working poor, is enormous. Most especially because these children have health care issues that desperately need to be addressed, but cannot be because the only recourse uninsured or underinsured parents have in this situation is to continually take their children to the emergency room where care is costly and far too often comes with little to no follow-up. Which can be disastrous. (via the Children's Defense Fund)
Deamonte Driver, died at the age of 12, Prince George's County, Maryland: Deamonte Driver, a seventh grader in Prince George’s County, Maryland, just outside of Washington, D.C., died because he couldn’t find a dentist who would accept Medicaid and his mother couldn’t afford an $80 tooth extraction. The inexcusable loss of this 12-year-old’s life started when he complained of a toothache. His mother, Alyce, who works at low-paying jobs, had been focused on finding a dentist to see Deamonte’s brother, who had six rotting teeth, when Deamonte began complaining of pain.
After an unsuccessful search for a dentist who would accept Medicaid, Alyce took Deamonte to a hospital emergency room where he was given medicine for a headache, sinusitis and dental abscess and then sent home. But his condition soon took a turn for the worse, and he was back at the hospital being rushed to surgery where it was discovered that the bacteria from his abscessed tooth had spread to his brain. Heroic efforts were made to save him, including two operations and eight weeks of additional care and therapy, totaling about $250,000. Unfortunately, it was all too late. He died on February 25....
This child died due to a missed $80 tooth extraction. It was not his fault that his family could not afford it, nor was it is fault that the emergency room visit was inadequate -- you get the best care they can give you in the moment, but medical professionals will tell you that is no substitute for an ongoing preventive care relationship with a medical doctor who has up-to-date family history and who can do follow-up care.
Preventive medicine for families with no health insurance is spotty at best, and it is the children in these families who suffer the most for it, because they have an entire lifetime to live out the consequences of this medical neglect. Hard-working low-income parents have difficulties with this often because of costs that exceed the parents' ability to pay, but it is the children who must suffer the consequences for this in the end.
Rep. Steve Kagan (D-WI) sees this every day in his medical practice: (via Balt.Sun)
Dr. Kagen knows. Give him a few minutes and the allergy specialist will tell you one story after another about patients who were not following his prescriptions simply because they could not afford the medication. He ran for Congress, he says, so Americans would no longer have to choose between buying their next pill or their next meal.
Republicans are trying to block SCHIP, and President Bush has threatened to veto it, not because it isn't desperately needed -- because it is for a whole lot of families -- but because they want to make political use of it in the next election cycle by couching it in terms of "us versus them," trying to make a bogeyman out of all sorts of "brown folks" who are not supposed to be covered by SCHIP anyway if they come to this country illegally.
As LatinaLista recently noted, 96 percent of America's children are legal residents in this country. So, where's the scary bogeyman now?
Using class and color bait under the guise of the rule of law that the Republican party otherwise could care less about is unconscionable and extremely dishonest. The fact is that immigration issues are immensely complicated, and that a lot of families are entertwined with both legal and illegal issues -- so does that mean to the GOP that legal immigrant children should suffer simply because they might look like others who might be undocumented? I don't even know where to start with something that asinine and narrow minded, including the deliberate and willful feigned "ignorance" on the issue of accountability:
The House provision makes the documentation requirement optional for states, which, after all, have an interest in seeing that their Medicaid dollars are spent properly. Adults on Medicaid would still have to prove citizenship, swear that their children are citizens and provide their children's Social Security numbers. And states would have to conduct annual audits to ensure that no illegal immigrants are being covered.
Opponents point to Congressional Budget Office estimates that lifting the documentation requirement would raise costs $2 billion over 10 years. But, CBO Director Peter Orszag told me, that's almost entirely because it would increase enrollment of eligible children.
The Republican party is lying. Again. And they are using divisive, inaccurate rhetoric to advance their corporate welfare agenda. Again.
Which is why calling their bluff and voting SCHIP through Congress was so important. And why understanding that the vast majority of Americans value politicians taking a stand on issues that are important to progressives, rather than running away from them due to electoral worries. As Chris and Simon's number crunching shows, Democratic victories hinge on one important thing: acting like Democrats.
The whole "bipartisanship above all else" conventional Beltway wisdom is just so much crap. What people want is leadership -- and what can be better than leadership which lifts children in poverty up so that they can actually have a future, instead of losing it like Deamonte Driver did over an $80 tooth extraction that came too late for him to survive.
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zero-no?
Exactly so, Christy.
Christy!
Recent work in Orange County, CA: hotbed of social rest.
http://freewayblogger.blogspot.....ounty.html
Morning Christy!
Morning…
Just now getting to the Lake.
Morning all — this one took a while to pull together. Sorry for the length, but it needed saying this morning.
Wow! Solis is wonderful! Thanks for the clip;->
One thing I’ve not seen mentioned about medical care for imigrants is infectious diseases. I think we really don’t want en epidemic to start among that segment of the population. (Bird flu anyone? How quickly we forget.) But public health has gone the way of everything else that has public in its name.
I had a conversation with my fiancee this morning about the misdirection that the media and the current administration is pulling. All of the War on Terra and fear mongering has created a class of tin-foil hatters looking for the next Osama among their refugee neighbors, while the proto-fascists are gutting the last of what we knew as American ideals.
This posting exemplifies that perfectly. The chattering class is so busy creating fear of the other, we can’t see where our true problems and possible solutions lay. Bi-partisanship is a ruse to keep us in the dark and under their sway.
Stand up. Keep fighting! –Paul Wellstone
Pusillanimous prevaricators.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 7
Don’t make me come in there!
So help me, young lady, if you apologize for the length of your beautiful posts one more time, I’ll…, I’ll…,(!) *g*
Withholding medical care just makes no sense on any level.
Kristol likes Hillary? There can be only one conclusion. Run away! Billy K wants more of the same. It’s time, however, for real change, like Obama. Hillary was pro the war. She then showed bad judgment again by trying to downplay it and by not admitting she was wrong. Guess who is owned by, ooops I mean taking contributions from lobbyists and who isn’t?
FDR was right: the only thing we have to fear is fear itself. Change is needed. Let’s be courageous.
“Hillary Clinton, Neocon? The blogosphere is atwitter today with the quote in the Washington Post from Bill Kristol, the editor of the Weekly Standard, that “Hillary Clinton is becoming the responsible Democrat who could become commander in chief in a post-9/11 world.”
(snip)
Back in the real world, Bartlett’s compatriot Matthew Iglesias, sees this as being less about political gamesmanship than ideology: “One can try to speculate that Kristol is playing some odd angles here, but I think the record indicates that he’s genuinely more committed to war — criticized Republican critics of the Kosovo War, criticized Bill Clinton for not killing enough people during the Kosovo War, backed John McCain in the 2000 primaries — and based on the evidence thinks Clinton will be more sympathetic to his agenda than the alternatives.”
Further to the left, however, the approval of the Weekly Standard isn’t considered a mark of distinction. Arthur Silber at Once Upon a Time feels a Democrat will be considered “responsible” only “if you think the United States should still have troops in Iraq at the end of your second term as president, which is to say, at least through the end of 2016 — which is, of course, the view of the entrenched foreign policy establishment that believes in a foreign policy of aggressive, neverending global interventionism maintained by an empire of military bases around the world, all to guarantee American hegemony.””
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/?hp
What damned elections? There aren’t going to be anymore elections in this country. The King has a little surprise for us all between now and 08. We already live in a police state. What Constitution? What laws. The king has already paid Blackwater to build and staff concentration camps. Do you think they’re doing that for nothing.
Democrats must stand for Confrontation and Not Cowardice!
The only way to fight this Repug scourge, is to stand up and call them out. Not once, not twice, but every single feckin’ time!
If they lie, call them Liars!
If they steal, call them Thieves!
If they kill our soldiers, our parents, our children, our friends, call them Murderers!
Do.Not.Give.Them.One.Inch! EVER!
eCAHN at 9 — That’s a really good point, and one that I simply ran out of time and space to hit in this piece. But it isn’t just potential flu epidemics, it is also all sorts of epidemiological issues including TB which put everyone at risk. There are very good reasons to keep an eye on all of this and to provide preventive care for the public’s well-being. And that gets shoved to the side entirely in the “scary, scary” us versus them rhetoric. It really ought to be “what’s best for all of us.”
Christy Hardin Smith @ 7
Yes, you should be ashamed. When I get distracted by reading these marvelously constructed tomes, all hope of snatching the zed vanish utterly.
cynic at 15 — I think you are wrong. There will be an election, and fearmongering on our side of the aisle is just as bad as coming at it from the other side. But maybe that’s just me…
Just sent a few bucks to Hilda Solis ( 10% tip). Thanks CHS.
PB @ 18
excuses… excuses… heh, me too *g*
I think this is all a part of Rove’s strategery. Immigration is his latest version of the divide and conquer road tour. (Last time the issue was gay marriage). Is immigration a top priority for most Americans, not that I’m aware of, but neither was gay marriage but Rove made it a top election year issue…with the aide and assistance of the beltway punditry world. I just think the math on this issue won’t be there for him.
emal @ 22
MSNBC cooperating just dandy by giving Pat Buchanan bully pulpit to spew his bile. Unfair and imbalanced. Last word. Shout-overs. Solo time.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 19
I also think there will be an election, but I have grave doubts that it will be an honest one, unless people vote so overwhelmingly Democratic that it can’t be covered up…
this is OT….but is anyone else disturbed about what’s going on at that Utah mine? In particular, that the guy in charge seems to be more interested in covering his ass than getting those guys out of there?
“Rescue them dead or alive”??
What IS this bullshit, and why is it not getting more attention? (I don’t mean here)
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/08/.....index.html
Prairie Sunshine @ 23
CNN with Lou Dobbs.
Christy - you guys do the hard work to put this stuff together into a way to help the rest of us boneheads understand the implications. Never ever apologize for that. The educational process is necessary to combat the “junk food edu-tainment” out there.
Another thing the GOP uses besides fear is the whole “someone else (who doesn’t look like you) is going to get xxx (some perceived advantage) that you (or your kids or your wife or your brother or your parents) won’t get.” It is that whole classism/racism/money-ism thing in disguise. This is a stick that has been used for years and years. Shoot, it’s a stick that has been used in the 19th Century. When people feel vulnerable, it’s the easy and effective stick to use. It’s an emotional tool, so using logic and reason may not be the most effective tool against it. I think we need to appeal to everyone — because everyone has relatives or friends who are hurting, or has heard of someone at work whose spouse has gotten laid off and they’ve lost their health insurance, or whatever. This is hitting everyone…except for those smug self-satisfied people who already “have theirs” or have enough money that the issue is a non-issue for them. so the appeal has to be to the heart as well as to the head.
So….the proposed SCHIP law will not provide benefits to the illegals? I’m ok with that. Why not just insert a sentence or two in the language of the law: i.e., “this law (SCHIP) does not apply to illegals”. Seems like that would quiet down the R team.
Ghostman
Powerful piece Christy. Thanks. I have been doing research of late (for my work) on the power of political symbols. The Dems need A LOT of remedial work on this. The Rethugs are pros. Pups might want to take a look at John Fraim’s insightful and often funny “Battle of Symbols: Global Dynamics of Advertising, Entertainment and the Media.” It deals in part with 9/11’s aftermath and the Repub party’s use of symbols thereof (remember the Oklahoma license plate with the twin towers now for sale promoting anti-terrorise). But this work is relevant here too. Also, for those with access to J-Stor and more of an academic interst, see Rebecca Klatch’s “Of Meanings and Masters: Political Symbolism and Political Action.” She runs through a broad sweep of theoretical views and their striking political complements-anti-war and others. Among various scholars she cites Eric Hoffer (The True Believer) on how the poor and alienated in society often hold on hardest to the symbols of power promoted by the rich and powerful (war, flags, security). I would note too in view of the issue of minority presence here now we have two now largely disempowered groups (American underclass and outsider migrant labor)both being further alienated from the benefits of the state (wages, decent housing, health care) suggesting they have an even greater need to believe in these symbols of power (being promoted by the Rethugs). On a more positive note, if we (Dems) can find a way to create new symbols -which in a liminal era are more open to accepance (via Victor Turner) we may be able to reach them. Alas, now the Madison avenue symbol fashioners are all largely working either for big business, or for big-business approved political candidates. In short, the creative energy, and both financial and media means to disseminate these symbols and make them at oncecompelling and viable are largely out of our reach.
Ghostman at 28 — They did. And the GOP is still mouthing off about it. Rinse. Lather. Repeat.
PB @ 24
I tend to agree, but I can’t help feeling that Rove has been conditioning the American people to accept, really accept, outrageous WH behavior.
Christy:
I hope you’re right. I pray you’re right. But I’m too old, and have seen to much to believe that you’re right. Explain, (upstairs) if you will, why we have all the “laws in place” to completely stifle civil dissent, and the people who supposedly represent us were incapable of playing hard enough ball to maintain the rule of law? You can disappear today, be held without trial, be economically ruined and transported to a concentration camp, and it’s all legal.
That’s not fear-mongering. It’s the truth of the situation. The power is there. It’s there for a reason. Historically, when power has been there, it has been used.
People ought to be personally talking to their representitives. The Dems are not the only game in town. They’re the same game as the Rethugs. What’s the point of voting. They don’t protect us anyway. Why not withold any money from them, and any support of any kind if they don’t fix some things in the next session. Yeah, maybe they’ll lose, but what’s the difference if they don’t vote to restore the Constitution? The results are the same. We now live in a police state, and they are only waiting to spring the trap.
We have the power, we just don’t know how to use it….and apparently, we’ll never learn.
And before everyone jumps on me about the voting, please remember that I fought for this country too, and I will vote, but I will write in my cat if the people running are as unresponsive to the people who put them there as this group seems to be. Hard ball is played in back rooms with people’s pet pork projects….or with defunding certain areas of government, quietly, but doing it until they have no money to run anything but the war…..and no one at the Pentagon to run it with. That’ll get their attention. It is not, for example, unconstitutional to cut the President’s salary to 30,000 a year. It’s a public service job. He should be willing to serve his country.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 30
Well then….in that case, the problem gets back to the lack of will of the D team to stand up and fight. Much, much has been written here on my beloved D team’s lack of fighting will. Sigh.
Ghostman
The Democrats, as they continue to identify themselves, are not progressive. There needs to be a progressive party in which we have a different choice other than what we currently have.
OT
Apparently there was a tornado in Bay Ridge, Brooklyn. Report on radio that roofs are ripped off of brownstones, which is simply amazing. Then the usual stuff about downed trees & smashed cars.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 30
I know “Mudcat” Saunders is not well liked around here. He did however, have a good suggestion. If the Republiscum want to use faith as a basis of their policies, why can’t the Democrats throw it back in their face. Case in point. The kids. For those that believe in Jesus, in the New Testament he says, “That what you do to the least of my brothers, that which you do unto me.” I think we all know what that means. So hammer the Republiscum with it. Ask them if they really believe in the bible, how can they let the children suffer. I guess what I am saying it, if we used every tool in the toolbox, we could send the Republiscum the way of the Whigs.
The really sad thing is, as bad as it is, kids and the elderly probably have the best potential for getting medical care. It is the group between 19 and 65 that really get screwed. Kids that I had operated on as newborns and usually several more times after that couldn’t get insurance as adults because of pre-existing conditions.
I don’t care where a kid comes from. If that child is in our country and is sick, I want that kid treated.
Ghostman @ 33
C-Span, last night, broadcast a roundtable moderated by Thom Hartmann that addressed just that, along with other issues. The roundtable took place on July 14th I believe. They all agreed, we need better Democratic leadership and that it is up to us to demand it.
Meanwhile, more raids coming:
But Republicans, it seems are too distracted by uh. . .other matters to deal seriously with immigration.
Unless the immigrants in question are well hung.
Steve-AR @ 37
Part of the reason is that old people vote. Young people don’t.
Steve-AR at 37 — That is a whole series of posts in and of itself. And it is maddening to see it unfold — especially in law enforcement terms just in the area of mental health preventive care. Beyond appalling that someone cannot get necessary medication to deal with a chemical imbalance that leads to violent behavior when not treated unless and until they are arrested and on probation.
And I could go on and on and on about the impact that this has on the entire system…
My party is failing to realize that the victory last November was propelled by common sense people; compassionate folks who know the definition of fairness.
The Hispanic vote is ours for at least a generation.
Illegal immigration will be the lead wedge issue for the GOP in 08-just as in 02,04 and 06 (gay marriage) there will be a passel of anti-immigration ballot measures to rally the wacky 25%.
It won’t work and will end up mobilizing more Latinos than whackjobs.
Anything the wingnuts can do to keep us all infighting with each other detracts from all the damage they’re doing. Without chaos and infighting,it’s kinda hard to steal and cheat because alot more people notice(see,for example,Occupation,Iraq).
Uniter not a Divider my ass.
This is REAL personal for me. My parents and siblings don’t speak to me or my kids because their religion and politics pretty much demands it. I’m going to hell,I’m evil,you know the drill. So yeah,I take it personally,maybe too much.
The list of their “real americans”is very,very small. This one thing has allowed more damage to occur than perhaps anything else. They could not have done all this without getting people to hate each other first.
Health care is something near and dear to whats left of my heart, no child should ever have to suffer such a fate as in the above. As an adult I have weather healthcare insults, to let children die in such a way, is beyond the pale. To reject this type of bill only underscores the absence of compassion and basic lack of humanity the has become the hallmark of this administration and its admirers.
’sfunny how immigration will bite the GOP in the ass. By whipping up a climate of anti-foreigner bile (especially against brown foreigners) they’ve encouraged plenty of permanent residents to file those N-400s that, USCIS processing permitting [rolls eyes] will bump up the voter rolls for 2008.
Of course, the obvious response will be voter intimidation, with pasty Young Republicans giving the stink-eye to people committing the crime of Voting While Brown.
Oh, and let’s not forget the limbic principle to oppose S-CHIP on the right: the perception that those swarthy folks are outbreeding the pasty majority, and that access to healthcare just encourages their rutting. In other news, Michelle Duggar just had baby #17.
Kevster @ 45
They are the largest group joining Pentecostal churches now. I fear that the whole right wing framing of abortion, birth control, marriage and similar issues will impact them as well. In short, I won’t count them eggs yet.
And then there’s this:
eCAHNomics @ 35
Might have been part of the same weather system that tore across us in n.e. OH last night. Looked and sounded horrible w/ non-stop lightening and rumbling, but we were lucky, because all the fury of it was up high.
Still, yesterday, there was flash-flooding all over the place in odd spots not used to such.
Agreed. Brooklyn?! egad.
hey norquist a la roverbooschtick! how’s that infrastructure-be-dam*ed gig goin’ for ya?
Medical care in an advanced society is essentially a human right. Doesn’t matter what color the skin, or what religion, etc. That’s how I’d like to see the Ds frame the debate.
On the bright side of the NYC storm it did flood the fox propaganda room.
I will say, however, that there’s a different wedge that the GOP might take w/r/t S-CHIP, and that’s divide-and-conquer across the generational gap. Seniors vote. Kids don’t. And parents of kids likely to benefit from S-CHIP don’t vote as much as seniors.
My guess was that Lap Dog Heath Shuler voted against S-CHIP because he doesn’t want to piss off the Bircher retirees in his district.
argosfalcon @ 53
whoot! gee, hope they didn’t lose any important data.
OT via TPMmuckraker, the much investigated Ted Stevens returns to Alaska
More proof that Republicans do have a sense of humor. They just don’t know it.
Kevster @ 45
That is the only “bright side” to this shameful mess. I think the Rove “Republican Majority for ever” was predicated on the Hispanic vote. By not being able to keep the lizard brains under control, that plan has gone into the shitter.
I’m gonna opine here a bit:
Christy, it’s the steady and trusting relationship a patient or a family has with a healthcare provider (not confined to solely physicians) that makes the critical difference. The history of community health nursing is my case in point. In the late 1890s and through the 1920s it was a cadre of trained nurses - first in NY - who climbed fire escaped and visited families in tenements - they formed the Visiting Nurse Service of NY, which is still going great guns. They taught families basic hygiene, disease prevention, contraception (Yes - it wasn’t abstinence only crap), well child care, nutrition - you name it - they taught families how to not only survive, but to thrive. These activist nurses became university professors of nursing as that occupation moved form an apprentice based training model to an independent, scholarly university-based model.
Dentists may serve as another primary healthcare provider who can teach many of the same skills and health principles.
We have a nursing shortage growing in true crisis proportions. Primary care physicians are also becoming more and more scarce.
We pay nursing faculty LESS than the greenest of green two year community college new graduate.
Children don’t vote. Nurses, physicians and dentists carry a professional obligation to advocate for all patients - especially those who don’t themselves have a voting voice. And now FDL readers can carry that message and advocate as well. Blog whoring - I write about patient advocacy ad nauseum, and you can search that term to read the archives.
But it’s critical that everyone become much more aware of professional nursing and the role it plays in the nation’s health. Nurses receive no press and no coverage for the research that they do, for the contributions to health that they make (RNs provide 95% of ALL healthcare services, didja know?), and the little reported fact that preventable deaths and morbidity (complications) are significantly lowered when patients are cared for by a baccalaureate-educated registered nurse.
Rove is the mastermind behind all this immigration fuss. This individual is one of the nastiest pieces of work to ever come down the pike. Him and Tom Delay.
Look Karl. Go after the employers of illegals. If you have the nerve. Of course you won’t. Because these employers and shareholders are your political base.
The Republicans are never short of sex-crime scandals..
Adie @ 55
Irrelevant. They make it up as they go along.
In a country where one part of the government feels that civil rights are an inconvenience and the other side often is to weak to resist there erosion, Human rights become invisible.
Thanks for this, Christy.
argosfalcon @ 53
Is that right? What a hoot.
Couple of thoughts…
Bush will whack schips…He has already said it “costs” the insurance co. too much{sweet flamin jesus ugg}
If they give even the perception that they are cracking down on immigration it will be as effective as concentetion camps and white trains….remember,when un-employment starts to hit BAD…about nov-dec…they will have to have something…
Reason I say it will go to hell soon is no money is being lent…the construction industry,of which I am part will have a lot of their current projects done…and with most new construction on hold….it is going to get ugly fast.
anangryoldbroad @ 46
Angryoldbroad.
Well, I don’t know about you, but I’m not interested in infighting with anyone. As much as Christy and I seem to disagree about things (a long and unnecessary story), I’d probably vote for her if she were to run…..in my state, of course…..And no one is arguing that this country is one of the worst when it comes to insurance. We need national health. But what was Sister Frigidare (’scuse me, Hillary) able to do about it. She was unable, in spite of her talk tough stance, to get into the back rooms and crack heads. Yeah, she was only the first lady, but I’ll bet she had a lot to do with Big Dawgs strategy….with the excption of a certain…er…never mind. We need someone with a “take no prisoner’s” attitude on this side of the asile.
PW at 63 — You are most welcome. I’ve been stewing on this one for a while, I just couldn’t get time to hit it until now. Which is irritating…but there are only so many hours in my day. SIGH
It’s amazing that filthy rich omnivores like Rush Limbaugh are so short-sighted that they just do not realize the costs we pay later if we don’t take care of children’s welfare. Even if you drop the moral argument of a society’s need to take care of its children — which of course Limbaugh is completely impervious to — it’s fiscally short-sighted. But then again, the GOP is the party of drug-addled spend-thrifts, so I guess we shouldn’t be surprised. What they really want to do is make poor people suffer, no matter the cost.
Oh, bloody H… Headline in the Disgrace today:
Many states don’t vaccinate underinsured children
Terrific, hello pertussis, measles, chicken pox…
Jane Hamsher @ 68
;0)
Faux news story http://www.mediabistro.com/tvn......asp?c=rss
Whether it’s providing health care for undocumented workers or american citizens for that matter, welfare, food stamps, medicaid or any gov’t aided programs, the republicans never have an answer for the “what then” question. They don’t ask the question or propose solutions. I don’t think they give a rat’s a$$. They seem to believe all you have to do is abolish all that & the problems just disappear like magic. Poof. It’s a miracle-the undocumented workers, poor, people w/o health insurance simply vanish.
I have this peculiar idea that that’s not what God would be in favor of.
N=1 @ 58
I come from a family of nurses. Amen.
cynic @ 66
I’m not talking about liberals and dems infighting,I’m talking about my neighbors,who before 9/11 let their kids come over to play with my kid. Now they can’t because we aren’t christian republicans. I’m talking about my family being torn to shreds by this crap(my parents have been in Amway and gone to fundie churches and sent money to GOP causes for decades). If neighborhoods and families are strong,you can’t get in there and get people to vote against their own best interests.
Brisingamen @ 69
how do they get into school without vaccinations? parents have to present immunization records to register kids for kindergarten…
Jane Hamsher @ 68
What is missing is for any of these would-be healththieves to have actually been the ones to see the suffering and to be the ones to tell people needing healthcare, “NO SERVICE” The first time I had to discharge a homeless person to the street is when I converted from a child to an adult - real dayam fast. And do you know what the patient told me (she could see my distress) - “Honey, I’ll be all right. Don’t worry.”
Little things like that tend to stay with a body, if you know what I mean….
ironranger @ 72
I think god is the least of their worries
Brisingamen at 69 — Do you have a link for that?
Jane Hamsher @ 68
The super rich don’t plan on paying anything more in the future. They’re living in gated communities,riding around with bodyguards in armoured cars. Crime doesn’t matter to them, and they enjoy the cheap labor that the poor provide. I think it’s deliberate. U.S. going to Latin American style society.
Jane Hamsher @ 68
They have no intention of paying for it later, either. You know the drill. Blame the sick on not taking care of themselves. And, if there is any move toward universal care, as per Hillary, it will be at the most base (not basic) level, and to get real care you will have to pay for a separate insurance as well as a very high out-of-pocket. The point is that government (including a government supported health system) is NOT supposed to work, according to these people. Hence the drill against these plans as Socialism- bad for individual initiative.
The Republicans are today’s robber-barons. Imagine how things will be if the GOP captures the WH again in 2008.
anangryoldbroad @ 74
Angryoldbroad:
Yeah, you got a point. Wish I knew the answer. Maybe when those folks lose their jobs and can’t pay for their own or their kids health insurance, they’ll come around.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 59
I think Rove went as far as he could with the immigration bill to make it appear as pro-immigrant and guest worker friendly as possible, in-order to get the Hispanic vote for the GOP. The same strategy that has had the Cuban vote locked up for generations. The lizard brains bit him in the ass.
Ahh the upper poor asking for such things as a livable wage, shelter, food and adequate health care. Why don’t they know their place is to serve the needs of their betters and just suffer in silence (snark with a touch of outrage).
From the AFL-CIO Dem debate last night:
Snuffy@77: But, but, I thought they live by God’s word 24/7.
OldCoastie @ 75
Damnifino, the article doesn’t speak to that aspect of the problem. But in some states, T-dap (tetanus, diptheria, pertussis) is one of the vaccines the kids aren’t getting. Delightful, huh?
cynic @ 15
Where are these concentration camps? Educate me.
it’s the disconnect I don’t understand… the repugs I know who are most adament are also the very same people that hire undocumented workerst to clean their houses and raise their children and cut their lawns…
and they have great affection for “their” workers (creepy possessive attitudes)… I can’t figure how they square this up in their minds…
eCAHNomics @ 79
If they think that,they are very,very foolish.Every nation is 3 meals from a revolution…and with todays “entitlement”attitute,things will go real nasty fast.Tell joe q. public no more suv,beer,football,and toys…and he will look for scapegoats…
Christy Hardin Smith @ 78
Googling up on the phrase “Many states don’t vaccinate underinsured children” brings up an uncomfortably long list of articles on this issue…
Christy Hardin Smith @ 78
No link, I’m reading this from hardcopy, but here are the specs:
Byline: Carla K. Johnson, Associated Press
Dateline: Chicago
PB @ 73
Nurses were the lifesavers in the Pediatric Oncology Ward at Kaiser. Smart, knew their field, great troubleshooters and had a terrific bedside manner. We counted on them for hard decisions, emotional support, candid conversations and a gentle touch. These are the unsung heroes. Viva la Nurses!
Biodun @ 85
Kuchinich is nuts! He is extreme! We need to nuke Iran!
QuakerGirl @ 87
Good question. Has there been any follow up on the $385 million KBR contract for the ICE detention facilities?
Mabel at 93 — I believe you neglected to put in your snark tag…
snuffy @ 89
By the time things get so bad here that revolution becomes a possibility, everyone who’s alive today will be dead. People in general only started waking up in the last 2 years. Remember What’s the Matter with Kansas? The Middle Class is just beginning to feel what is going on and still thinks the U.S. is the shining city on the hill. Today’s rich have little to fear from the masses.
QuakerGirl @ 87
Read the piece I think that’s second on the page upstairs, big picture of one of the wwII relocation camps, and follow the links, it’s in there. And I misspoke, it’s not only Blackwater, it’s KBR, and they’re built and staffed.
This is the final link, but he has a lot more in there.
http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2.....ntion.html
Brisingamen @ 86
Parents can “opt out” for religious reasons, and not every state provides for mandated school-provided vaccination (meaning that it’s the parents’ burden to get them independently, rather than in a public venue, such as a school clinic or public health clinic)
A little more from the AFL-CIO Dem debate:
Jane Hamsher @ 68
And let’s make sure those poor folks are too sick to vote, ’cause they all vote Democratic anyways.
Kinda reminds of Junya’s non-response to Katrina: We ain’t gonna hep those folks. Not ’cause they’re mostly poor. Not ’cause they’re mostly non-white. No, we ain’t gonna hep those folks ’cause they’s mostly Democrats. Rover tells me if ah don’t hep them, they ain’t gonna be able to vote. Yipee!”
ironranger @ 85
Some of the uglist/niceist people I know are xians.The ones I despise are the ones who have a selective veiw of the bible….the dispensioist,ect who justifie their greed and evil acts saying “god has favored my endevors…it is his will I rule and am wealthy beyond reason”…..and not realiseing that it was luck.. being simply born in the right bed
Sherrod Brown’s wife is on wnyc.org, talking about spouses of prez candidates.
Mabel’s Wig Shack @ 93
I take it you are being cynical, right? Wouldn’t want a misquote from some wingnut on another post.
N=1:
That seems like a mistake… school IS a public health issue and looking out for all the children’s health is critical. CA requires the vaccines and I’m sure also allows for religious opt-out reasons… I’m glad we require them here.
After this years near death experience I once only loved nurses now I worship them (in the most respectful way possible) I my opinion there is no you you can pay them enough, and when they save your life there is no way thats any amount of words can say Thank You.
QuakerGirl @ 104
I am so frustrated that Kuchinich’s policy proposals are not seen as the most truly progressive of all the candidates.
I was being ‘facetious’ I guess. Or cynical. yes.
argosfalcon @ 105
argosfalcon @ 71
Hmmm…Faux News broadcasts from a bunker. Who’da thought?
OldCoastie @ 105
That seems like a mistake… school IS a public health issue and looking out for all the children’s health is critical. CA requires the vaccines and I’m sure also allows for religious opt-out reasons… I’m glad we require them here.
a lot of side-issues supposedly arise from vaccination: asthma, allergies, ADD, etc… the list goes on and on. it’s a tough call about whether the ‘original’ protection offered by vaccinations justify the later side-effects.
Jane Hamsher @ 68
Oh but Jane, if we did things to protect the children today, where would the profits come from for the privatized prison systems? /s
snuffy@102: Ah yes, I know too many of these gilded turds too.
snuffy @ 102
Seems to be an accurate description of members of the Bush family.
OldCoastie @ 104
That seems like a mistake… school IS a public health issue and looking out for all the children’s health is critical. CA requires the vaccines and I’m sure also allows for religious opt-out reasons… I’m glad we require them here.
One other factoid:
School nurse funding has been totally eliminated in many districts. Those nurses now, if employed at all, care multiple school caseloads, and many literally carry students’ health records in rolling files from school to school to school. The time to perform routine wellness and developmental screenings has gone from barely enough time to negligible. Nurses may not be able to screen for vision, hearing, physical growth, speech impediments or delays, chronic illness (asthma, lead poisoning, dental health, vaccination protection, etc), as well as to pick up communicable diseases -
TB, influenza (pandemic flu, anyone?), food poisoning, etc. Plus, given that so many students take prescription meds (Adderal, insulin, inhalers, SSRIs, etc,) and require close supervision and medication administration controls, that nurses are finding the case poads intolerable.
eCAHNomics @ 96
I think its going to hit very very fast.Peak oil is NOW.I am also fairly certain that ,haveing gathered all this power to themselfs,they will not give it up.Would the right really want Edwards/Obama team to have the power that bush and cheny have?…I dont think so.I doubt if we will see another election…for one reason or another
see previous post….hungry men get real mean quick.Hungry men with hungey/starveing kids go batshit crazy in a heartbeat.”Let them eat cake”is real bad policy…The rich had better remember that lesson
OldCoastie @ 105
That seems like a mistake… school IS a public health issue and looking out for all the children’s health is critical. CA requires the vaccines and I’m sure also allows for religious opt-out reasons… I’m glad we require them here.
I’ve lived in three states and all have required vaccines for kids,unless you get a waiver for religious reasons. I’ve never heard of a state not requiring the basic childhood immunizations,I thought that was a national thing.
argosfalcon @ 107
Nurses are pretty special, even if I am a tad biased! *g* Thanks for expressing such a lovely sentiment - and glad you are here and with us now!
OldCoastie @ 104
That seems like a mistake… school IS a public health issue and looking out for all the children’s health is critical. CA requires the vaccines and I’m sure also allows for religious opt-out reasons… I’m glad we require them here.
I’m not up on vaccines for kids, but here’s a couple of observations & maybe someone can educate me. About a decade ago, when my son was late-teens, we had repair-the-bridges coffee with a woman in my apt bldg who’d had a run-in with him in the gym. Turns out she is a public health nurse & she described the set of innoculations that were now required for school attendance. Were 2-3 times as many as had been required just less than 2 decades earlier for my son. Yet I didn’t hearof a lot of problems in my son’s generation. So have they gone overboard?
I’ve also read that all the germ-eradication we are doing is making people sicker because lack of exposure in small quantities, which encourages antibodies, leaves people more vulnerable.
hard to know, Mabel but school is such a petri dish (especially with the little ones) - if an epidemic were to start, it’d start at school… I’m in the era where polio vaccines were just invented… lots of kids got polio from the vaccine in those days, but in the risk/benefit column, it was a risk worth taking.
N-1 @113: Now, add on the fact that many adults/children will still go work/school, even when they know they’re ill and in all likelihood, contagious.
I’m really dubious that we can make a quarantine stick even in the face of a pandemic. (I work for HHS.)
eCAHNomics @ 117
The best blogger for the vaccination discussion is Respectful Insolence. (How can you not love that name?)
Brisingamen @ 119
Egg-Zactly!
eCAHN at 117 — Part of the problem, as I understand it, is that we are a much more mobile population globally. Which means that a lot of diseases that were highly unlikely to show up in the US 20 or 30 years ago, say, are much more likely now. Some of which are fairly virulent. There is a fairly big debate ongoing about the efficacy of certain vaccines over others — but that’s a part of why the argument for them is stronger these days, as I understand it. But we have a lot of medical professionals in our readership who can likely discuss the whys and wherefores much more thoroughly than this brief thumbnail from me. *g*
A little more from the AFL-CIO Dem debate:
snuffy @ 114
Peak oil is a concept developed by the oil cos. in the 1950s in order to scare people and raise prices. Oil cos make a lot more profit with lower quantity & higher prices. Read the full, very interesting, history in Armed Madhouse by Greg Palast. The world is awash in a sea of oil, but the oil cos want to dish it out a low rates to make big bucks.
In California, there is a years long waiting list to get into nursing school. I have no idea what or who is responsible for this- but the consequence is a shortage of nurses.
eCAHNomics @ 125
DeBeers Diamond Strategy: phony scarcity, market control drives up prices
OldCoastie @ 105
Yes. But then you have the whole mercury in vacination scandal, and mega-increase in autism which needs to be addressed alongside this.
That seems like a mistake… school IS a public health issue and looking out for all the children’s health is critical. CA requires the vaccines and I’m sure also allows for religious opt-out reasons… I’m glad we require them here.
eCAHNomics @ 9
But why should American taxpayers pay for illegal immigrants? These are people who would be entitled to something in their own country, or if not, why should the US taxpayer pay what their country won’t or can’t? We cannot support the rest of the world…
Prairie Sunshine @ 126
Exactly.
rwcole @ 125
In almost every state, there are long waits for qualified candidates to enter - and to complete nursing. Nursing programs are costly because of the lower student to faculty ratios required in the clinical course components. Nursing faculty must be prepared at the masters or doctoral level, and the average age of nursing faculty is now in the early fifties (for all practicing nurses it’s around 46-47 years old as more second career folks enter the profession later in life). Nursing faculty salaries are paltry and are much less than earnings in a traditional hospital setting (new two year graduates often earn more and have better benefits packages). Many nursing faculty are part timers without benefits (sound familiar), and the teaching loads and work hours are grueling and largely uncompensated(for instance, common to pay clinical faculty for only on-clinical-unit time - about 10-12 hours per week, and not reimburse for course preparation, pre and post clinical conference time, student advisement time, and assignment evaluation and grading time, among other things (may include uncompensated committee service, travel expenses to and from clinical sites, etc.) Tenure track faculty work under almost slave-like conditions, and at the end of their seven year “trial” period of overachievement, they are often denied tenure, lose their annual contract and have to move on as any migrant worker - to seek another junior entry level faculty job.
I happen to have my kindergartner’s health form for school entry right here. it says down at the bottom “If your child is unable to get the school health check-up, call the Child Health and Disability Prevention (CHDP) program in your local health department. If you do not want your child to have a health check-up, you may sign the waiver form (pm 171 B) found at your child’s school.” We’re also supposed to have an Oral Health Assessment/Waiver Request Form filled out, but it has a place right on it to mark for why you didn’t have it done, like “I cannot afford an oral health assessment for my child.” or “I am unable to find a dental office that will take my child’s insurance plan.”
All of this ties right back into education too. How can a child be expected to learn if they have a toothache or if they can’t see the board or if they have something more serious wrong that is going undiagnosed because of a lack of medical care? Yet I’m supposed to be held accountable for that child? (I’m a teacher)
The concept of peak oil is unassailable and historical..The best practical example is the oil production of the us which peaked decades ago- of course any limited resource must inevitably become used up…the questions are “when” and “what’s the shape of the production curve?” In the case of the US- once production began to decline, it fell off quite sharply. This is what is expected for world production as well.
“The only reliable way to identify the timing of peak oil will be in retrospect. M. King Hubbert, who devised the peak theory, predicted in 1974 that peak oil would occur in 1995 at 12-GB/yr “if current trends continue”.[2] However, in the late 1970s and early 1980s, global oil consumption actually dropped (due to the shift to energy efficient cars,[3] the shift to electricity and natural gas for heating,[4] etc.), then rebounded to a lower level of growth in the mid 1980s (see chart on right). The shift to reduced consumption in these areas meant that the projection assumptions were not realized and, hence, oil production did not peak in 1995, and has climbed to more than double the rate initially projected.
Colin Campbell of the Association for the Study of Peak Oil and Gas (ASPO) has suggested that the global production of conventional oil peaked in the spring of 2004 albeit at a rate of 23-GB/yr, not Hubbert’s 13-GB/yr. During 2004, approximately 24 billion barrels of conventional oil was produced out of the total of 30 billion barrels of oil; the remaining 6 billion barrels coming from heavy oil and tar sands, deep water oil fields, and natural gas liquids (see adjacent ASPO graph). In 2005, the ASPO revised its prediction for the peak in world oil production, again, from both conventional and non conventional sources, to the year 2010.[5] These consistent upward (into the future) revisions are expected in models which don’t take into account continually increasing reserve estimates in older accumulations.[6]
Another peak oil proponent Kenneth S. Deffeyes predicted in his book Beyond Oil - The View From Hubbert’s Peak that global oil production would hit a peak on November 25th, 2005 (Deffeyes has since revised his claim, and now argues that world oil production peaked on December 16, 2005).[7]
Texas oilman T. Boone Pickens has stated that worldwide conventional oil production will top out at 84 MB/day[8] (31 BB/yr).
Colin Campbell, a well-known petroleum geologist, has put the tilting point at 2010. The U.S. Department of Energy predicts that the peak won’t happen until 2037.”
Christy @122: We are one jetload of people away from a major epidemic. If Ebola ever goes droplet, and one of those exposed to it flies to a major transportation center…ugh.
And then there is the slow killer, TB. That’s taken a major upswing in the last 10 years. The carriers are likely to be people who use public transportation, which gives you quite a vector for the disease to spread through.
If anyone wants further reading, may I recommend The Coming Plague?
Sorry, I’m in California.
I love getting older. You have such a long history of experience to draw from. Reflection has real meaning. When I was oh-so-young, I taught school for seven years. When I moved to Berkeley I taught in the Oakland School District. Being new I was assigned to West Oakland - heavy poverty area where gangs ruled.
Here is what I faced every day in my fifth and sixth grade class. Hungry children with that same vacant look in their eyes I saw Fasting Month in Indonesia. No, let me repeat that, no health and dental care whatsoever. At least one parent murdered each year. My young girls raped and/or forced into prostitution at age eleven. They were expected to learn under these conditions. I was expected to teach under these conditions.
My first Principal was compassionate so he saw to it the children had breakfast at the school so they didn’t feel too weak to pay attention during class time. We had a full-time nurse at our school to check any child who didn’t feel well and provide medical care for them. Dental was the most needed care. It worked. We could prevent some serious illnesses.
We could do little about the gangs but we could report a parent who put their child out to prostitution. How did we do this? We leveraged other parents in the community. We regularly invited parents to our school and encouraged them to observe the classroom. We had small groups of parents meet to discuss hardships in their home. They began being supportive towards each other. They built a community. They became watchdogs for early prostitution.
Could we save everyone. NO. And, if you want all or nothing, nothing will rule. But we reduced dropouts, increased learning, reduced hunger and malnutrition greatly, and, improved the safety of our school.
Three years later we got another principal. He was Rush Limbaugh’s double in attitude and stopped all programs. All our progress began slipping away until once again he could prove these people were just depraved and hopeless. See, he was right all the time.
rwcole @ 132
Have you read Armed Madhouse?
There are several things going on with nursing. First of all, you have an extremely high burnout rate because of the conditions of working and the low pay rate. Second, not only are nursing schools unable to cope with turning out enough new nurses to replace the turnover, they are not sufficiently funded to expand their programs. You can also throw in factors such as rapid population increase, rapidly aging populations, and greater career opportunities for young women these days, which do not include requirements for evening and weekend work.
First step would probably have to be improving the pay and working conditions AND giving nurses a greater role in caring for a patient (nurses do 95% of the work, but must be supervised by a doctor at every turn which is just batshit crazy). Then you’ll need to think about increasing nursing school capacities and so on.
PB @ 137
Don’t forget that nursing, like teaching, is still a female-dominated field, which apparently makes it ok to pay us less while expecting more.
Mabel’s Wig Shack @ 106
I feel the same way. I walk across the room to hear every word he says. If nothing else, he forces the other candidates to take notice even if they don’t want to give him credit. And, people are listening. I love Kuchinich.
QuakerGirl @ 134
What a compelling story!
california nursing salaries
eCAHNomics @ 124
I belive you are so mistaken…There is a place www.theoildrum.com Where a lot of geoscience/oil people hang.Its real.If the world is swimming in it,why are we loseing blood and treasure in Iraq?and threatining Iran?and acting just the way a empire must when its lifeblood is threatened?
Read Stuart Sanifords analisis of whats left of the Gharwar…or read Matt Simmons book “Twilight in the desert”or Thom Hartmans “Last hour of ancient sunlight”.
Then be afraid.Its playing out just as described in the last man standing senerio
Pink-collar ghetto.
shrub on msnbc pushing tax cuts…
Bush rationalizing his tax cuts to choir.
Lea-no uh @ 137
Nurses are dominated more by non-healthcare providers such as their employers and regulatory bodies (insurance companies) than by physicians. The core problem is that nurses by virtue of serving as employees, are loyal to employers over patients. I advocate for self-goverance and professional practice group models whereby nurses contract directly with healthcare organizations and patients to deliver nursing care. In this model they elect/select their own nursing leaders, instead of having those “leaders” chosen for them by employers and thus splitting nursing loyalty and undermining professionalism and patient advocacy. More blog whoring - this is near and dear to my heart. Thanks for bringing it up. (This is also why I blog under a pseudonym - very dangerous non-mainstream stuff)
Bush - “Dems spending all your money”
snuffy @ 142
That’s the key. They’re in the industry and they’re engineers, so they look only where exploration has already occurred. The Sunni triangle in Iraq has been deliberately unexplored - red line set up by Brits in 1920s to assure that no holes will be drilled. But some is known about this area which is expected to contain much larger deposits than anywhere else in Iraq/Iran. That’s just one example. The Stans are another. The industry is all about convincing consumers that the supply is limited, which is why you can’t trust industry experts.
PB @ 136
This is such an easy fix. It is not complicated and it isn’t some monstrous problem endemic to the nurses. However, the profession suffers from long time prejudices against women’s value in the work place even if some men are in the field. It’s like the secretary. There is a profession that requires multiple skills so men avoid it for two reasons - it’s hard work requiring highly skilled workers and it is low pay demeaning the accomplishments and value of the worker.
National salary data for RNs with 5-9 years experience is 54,000 per year.
Is that too little? More than national teacher salaries I expect. I don’t really know what their salaries should be.
Bush - “I will use The Veto to keep your taxes low.”
funny how he doesn’t mention how much Iraq is costing…
eCAHNomics @ 137
Are you thinking “No Child’s Behind Left?”
rwcole @ 126
Nursing schools (like medical or dental schools) require massive public investment. In California, the Legislature/Governor choose not to invest the funds required to expand health education.
Thus, the shortages continue.
eCAHN @ 125
Actually, it isn’t. It’s a concept of, IIRC, Carl Hubbert, a petroleum geologist, who paid enough attention to notice that fewer oil fields are being found, and those are smaller, at the same time as larger fields are producing less oil, and the demand is not levelling off.
Translation: oil is not infinite, there’s really nothing the oil companies can do to change that (although they don’t want people to notice), and BushCo (knowing this, and you can bet that Cheney does) wants the oil fields for their buddies. There’s a good reason why oil companies are getting into solar and wind power. It’s the only way they can stay in business in the future.
Fresh thread for everyone…
New thread: You Work for Us
Sestak speaks out
my best friend has a few choice bumper stickers–one of them is-
the bush legacy-leave no child a dime
eCAHNomics @ 147
I trust retired industry people w/no ax to grind….the us peaked in 1972..just like King Hubbert said it would…Its not a matter of politics..its a matter of geology..why has their not beem a meg find since 1960?its cause it aint there fella…
I quoted 3 souces includeing thom hartmann…palast has got it wrong on more than one occasion
demi @ 153
Yes, that’s in there too. The book is quite a compendium of Rovian & other scuzzies. IIRC (book’s in country, I’m in city), Palast sez at beginning it’s written in a style that’s easy to read in short sections in the bathroom. Also has stuff about R voting misdeeds.
LibertyLee @ 129
You DO realize that infectious diseases do not discriminate? Vaccinating everyone means that these diseases do not get a foothold anywhere.
There’s a reason why we’re trying to develop a vaccine for avian flu — I assure you that WASPs are going to catch it and die from it right along with the undocumented workers.
Withholding medical treatment just because the person isn’t a US citizen is insane and counterproductive. Do you have any clue as to how expensive a pandemic is going to be? (And I’m not just talking about lives lost.)
The reason Bush won’t sign the SCHIP legislation under any circumstances is simple. SCHIP kinda like ” belongs to” Blue Cross Blue Shield. SO if the government intervenes and sets specific payments, like with a “contract”, BCBS/SCHIP won’t be able to raise their premiums. SCHIP premiums are sky high anyway . But not signing…. trace that money back…. and bingo , it’s BCBS>
Brisingamen @ 161
If they are illegal they should get treatment in their home country, not burden the US taxpayer. That’s simple. Why should you pay for uninvited gate crashers to your house? I don’t think you would. (Now if you want to pay my home mortgage, I would think differently)…
and to liberty Lee above, withholding medical care in America is quite dangerous too however it is being done on a daily basis by millions of doctors across America
rwcole @ 151
Believe me when I tell you when I am in need of a nurse I don’t want the lowest paid no more than I want to travel on an airline put together and maintained by the lowest bidder.
rwcole @ 126
The problem is that there is a critical shortage of nursing faculty, RW. Nursing education is a pretty hands-on thing, especially on the clinical side of things. Enrollment in doctoral nursing programs is down, and the current professoriate is fixing to retire. If I had a child who was interested in health care education, I’d steer him to doctorate in nursing. The field’s going to be wide open for a while.
BC
Oklahoma kiddo @ 59
They have no intention of actually going after them in a serious way, just enough to inoculate Republicans against the criticism that they’re not doing it. They never had any intention of effectively dealing with immigration any more than they want to actually implement their platform on abortion; they’d rather milk the issue forever and tell their base that it’s the liberals’ fault they’re not getting what they want.
eCAHNomics @ 160
Ahhh, two houses. :) Not to take bucks away from this site, but…
Greg writes… through the venerable PBS program ‘NOW’, finally broadcast our reportage on the “caging” of voters, a story we first broke 3 years ago. BEFORE the 2004 election.
We’ve made it in another way: Friday was also the day I was informed that the Palast Investigative Fund was dead broke, technically bankrupt, with way less than zero in the account., in his latest article.
quaker
The data wasn’t for “lowest paid”- it was national average..what should nurses salaries average in your opinion?
rove mastermind on immigration?
Doesn’t seem likely that Rove would work goopers up into a frenzy to oppose Clustefuck’s desired policy. Rove is the guy who is most afraid of goopers losing the hispanic vote.
EPUd but of interest: The Kaiser Daily Health Policy Report is free and can be subscribed via email. Today’s report demonstrates the clear advantages - health, economic and patient satisfaction - of having a trusted and steady healthcare provider relationship, of providing preventive health services and of providing public health clinics. You don’t have to be a health policy wonk to enjoy this very high quality Monday through Friday digest with links to important health news. it’s written in common use English, and it’s very, very readable.
Bargain Countertenor @ 166
And my Mom the RN says, “If you want to go into medicine, be a doctor, not a nurse, because the doctors are the ones making money.”
Until nurses’ work is compensated the way doctors are, why bother being a nurse?
brisin
You think that nurses should make the same as doctors?
Brisingamen @ 171
rwcole @173:
Damn straight I do — in the hospital the doctor sees the patient once a day (maybe) for 15 minutes during rounds (maybe) — while the nurses care for the patient round the clock during their stay.
Who sees that the patient gets their meds?
Who sees that the patient is bathed and fed?
Who changes the surgical dressings, checks the IV, monitors the patient’s urine output, etc?
It isn’t the doctor.
That sounds like BS. Exploration requires going places where you haven’t looked. They’ll explore places more than once, too - the place I grew up was explored more than once. They found some oil the second time, and put in several wells. Not big production, but it’s there. I haven’t heard any reputable geologist say there’s really big unexploited fields left; what’s unfound is, by definition, unknown, and anyone saying that there are big unfound oilfields is giving you a WAG.
There’s places that are truly uneconomical to drill in, because of the cost of getting in the equipment and the people to do it, and maintaining the wells afterward, and the ’stans might be among them; I can’t think that it would be easy to get in there, and the cost of keeping the warlords paid off might be more than any oil company wants to deal with (not to mention that, with the Chiquita case, they’d be liable for all kinds of stuff).
Brisingamen @ 174
Again, complex - physicians and nurses for the most part pay for their own education, and physicians’ education runs into the hundreds of thousands of dollars - they need incomes to be able to pay back tuition loans and expenses.
Nurses can enter practice after just two years in a community college, and the many routes to entry are a real problem and source of dissension in nursing. I am doctorally educated, but employers have repeatedly crowed that the jobs for which I was hired didn’t require that and they were dayam well not going to pay based on that, regardless of what benefit they received from my incurred expense, education and experience.
N=1 @177 — I understand that, I just happen to think that until “women’s work” (nursing, teaching) is seen to be as valuable as “men’s work” (doctor, lawyer) nurses aren’t going to get the pay they deserve.
But then, I believe that the government should PAY for the education of anyone interested in being a doctor, nurse, therapist, etc. In return, those who received that funding would serve a certain number of years in a medically underserved area.
Pipe-dream, I guess.
CHS@0
In light of other posted comments and analysis of how the bills moved through congress — I’d add: leadership also means putting the job over vacation on important things. Gah!
rwcole @ 173
Hell, yes! Doctors are very important, BUT — without nurses, they’d be dead in the water. AND — nurses provide all the care, know the details of each patient, keep the meds straight and so on and so on and on. Honestly, it truly is a misunderstanding to see nurses as “subservient” to doctors. They are not. They are providing an equally important level of care. It’s just along different dimensions. You’re dead with out the doctor. You’re dead ten times over without the nurse.
rwcole @ 169
I’ve had to deal with some serious life-threatening health issues in my immediate family as so many people do. Here is where we learn so much about the profession we would otherwise rarely come in contact. In oncology I found highly specialized nurses. A nurse couldn’t just transfer into that area. In Pediatric Oncology the nurses had special training and on those rare occasions we had to deal with a “regular” nurse the difference was dramatic.
I know your data was based on average pay, my point, though unclear, was that the average paid equates to low pay for such an important profession. To me there isn’t a one size fits all. Nurses attending patients with very serious illnesses, requiring specialized training and on-going training and education to keep up with new developments, should be paid higher. A general nurse (I’m sure there is an industry term better than general) who does not have such heavy responsibilities should be paid accordingly. If I need brain surgery, I want a nurse who didn’t just come from the Pediatric /Birthing Ward. There are gradations in expertise and nurses, like teachers, should be paid accordingly.
A problem with our system is the one size fits all approach. It doesn’t give incentive to those who will go the extra mile. None of us wants a nurse who is heading for “burn out” to care for us when in critical need or preparing our chemotherapy medication. Beyond scary. I wonder how many medical disasters are the result of burn out and poorly trained nurses. Any idea?
Brisingamen @ 177
I’m with you and I sure appreciate your perspectives and your interest in the subject. It’s nigh unto impossible to find an audience that cares about nursing issues beyond the emotion-laden, stereotype of the “nurses are so wonderful” variety. Sorry I went on and on and on - guess I let the cat out of the bag about where my passion lies….
Richmond @ 49
Richmond, you are right, do not count on them yet, especially when you[Democrats] throw them ‘under the buss’:
14(!) cowardly democratic senators voted against latest immigration bill – read: against Latinos. 14 !!!
And now what? Silence… No questions during debates, no statements, no attempts to try again. Nothing. Just silence. COWARDS!!!
I am an immigrant(what you call ‘legal’) from former Soviet Union, not a Latino, but trust me, we[immigrants who can vote] are never going to abandon our brothers and sisters who are considered ‘illegal’ under some idiotic unjust law. Legalize them, change the law and we(30 million) will be yours forever! Hide, use the issue for election points and we are going to stay home. In the best case.
Do something!
N=1, part of my viewpoint is that I’m bitter on my Mom’s behalf. She is 70, and will be retiring in September. The pension from the hospital she worked for will just cover her health insurance, so she’ll be depending on Social Security to cover her living expenses.
What a fine reward for a lifetime of service…
Brisingamen @ 183
In my case - no pension _ I was shuffled around a hospital system during one of its many downsizings, and the powers that be wouldn’t recognize all of my service - so after all of the salary cuts, crappy work schedules and being perpetually on call - nothing. That happens to many nurses who never get vested, let alone get to collect. Another hospital’s board used the pension funds to award exec bonuses before it went under - and so almost everyone lost every bit of their pensions.
NO Pension?!! That stinks. I’m just gobsmacked over that one. Kucinich’s remarks last night on pensions and company execs are starting to make a lot of sense to me.
The shortage of nurses is due to a shortage of nursing instructors. The applicants are there.
eCAHNomics @ 97
They should fear that the masses might stop buying stuff (simply because they can’t afford to). That is the kind of thing that can really slow the economy and hurt a lot of businesses.