What did I like best at the Yearly Kos Convention? — apparently the last, as next year’s convention seems to have been re-branded Netroots Nation by the man with the brand, Markos himself. Meeting ‘pups and bloggers I had not met. Connecting again with those I hadn’t seen in a year. What did I like very little about YKos? — location, location, location. A venue with $4.50 pint bottles of water and three-dollar bananas; miles to walk between events on hard marble and concrete; with no commons to sit, meet, and chat except an outrageously priced restaurant and a bar; completely disconnected from the city where we’re located — well, it is entirely beyond me. Especially since I know there must be summer-available college campuses in Chicago where we could have been happily hosted for less than half the room-rate, close to a vibrant downtown, and with lots of space for meetups with other folks that weren’t almost miles from one another.
But here’s what I liked the very least: the overarching theme seemed to be, much like the song from Oklahoma about farmers and ranchers, “Why Can’t the Bloggers and the Media be Friends?” I came away from lectures by Mike Allen (of George Bush’s and Karl Rove’s favorite new website politico.com) and Jay Carney (Glenn Greenwald’s nemesis at Time) and Ezra Klein (of the American Prospect and Tapped) feeling just icky. Why icky? Because I believe American traditional media to be complicit in an illegal and immoral war and occupation of Iraq. They are unable and unwilling to expose the shredding of our Constitutional rights but quite concerned about Paris Hilton’s incarceration. They are entirely unbothered about their own absurd appearances at Correspondents Dinners rapping with Karl Rove, to my mind the architect of an American Presidency chock full of the worst American war criminals ever.
So don’t expect me to fly all the way to Chicago and make nice with representatives of Traditional Media when they say that the Washington Post and New York Times didn’t lie about murders in New Orleans and Governor Blanco’s complicity in the disaster. They were printing White House talking points and anybody who takes a moment to read coverage from the Houston Chronicle knows it.
And don’t get me to pay $175 a night for a room in a Hyatt with surly customer service and then pretend that Matt Bai-toy is a great “get” as a debate moderator, especially when he made Chris Matthews look professional. What’s the point of having a New York Times reporter moderate a YKos debate, anyway? And especially Bai-toy, who has, shall we say, history with the netroots. Anybody who thinks he’s being clever by trying to get commitments from Presidential candidates to visit all 50 states doesn’t know about Richard Nixon’s stupid promise at his nominating convention — a promise many Republicans still will tell you cost him the Presidency in 1960. And don’t ask me to be proud of our DailyKos co-moderator, who insulted Mike Gravel by asking him if all Alaskan politicians are corrupt. Hello, unclear on the concept?? The current Alaska Congressional delegation, all of them in trouble, are all Republicans. Why try to further marginalize a guy who does pretty well on his own without quite yelling “Kids, get offa my lawn!” And why compound the Traditional Media frame that “all politicians are crooks?” This is the distinction-favoring, precision-employing netroots?
Politico.com’s Mike Allen, for instance, was on a panel where he sucked up to the netroots, saying he’d really like all of us to write to him — “here’s my personal email!” — when we have a great story for him or even a correction to one of his stories. He couldn’t say enough times how well-treated he’d been at the convention and what a wonderful thing it was and how we’d really arrived. Then he lost no time rushing to Tucker Carlson’s wee little MSNBC programme, where they both made fun of our cathode-ray-tube tans and nametags with “HighAcidity” and “TRex” on them. (Yes, our theropod got a Mike Allen shout-out.) Mike also entirely misrepresented the YKos experience of a young military man whose fellow servicemembers, former and current, tried to keep him from exposing himself to disciplinary charges, as he was in uniform and doing politics. Funny that Malkin and Drudge both featured the same story, isn’t it? No, Mike, it’s not: we know you love Drudge and get your best story ideas from him, so don’t expect emails from me to correct or tip you to story ideas. Not. Gonna. Happen.
Ezra Klein maintained, on another panel, that we know all about Judy Miller’s being duped by her sources in the runup to this fiasco in Iraq because she is the exception, not the exemplar, in Traditional Media. She’s been exposed for her wrongdoing, and shamed; therefore she must be the only one. He didn’t answer my shouted question about Michael Gordon, who shared her Pulitzers and still shills for The Regime. Yeah, right, Ezra — the New York Times and Washington Post are entirely self-correcting enterprises.
And Time’s Jay Carney? Well, Swampland’s Jay Carney blogs with (and presumably as Time Washington Bureau Chief employs and supervises) Joe Klein, who now thinks that Preznit Chimpy McFlightsuit deserves a Nobel Peace Prize for — what? — not dribbling down his pants leg when he pees?
No, thanks.
I want the revolutionary, angry, Establishment-challenging, rabble-rousing netroots back. If Netroots Nation sees its new mission as pleasing Traditional Media, or allying with it, or making nice, or merging the two into some amalgam that pleases anyone in the Establishment: then it’s not my Netroots Nation. I’ll just sit over here on the Left Coast and take well-deserved potshots at people who insult our Constitution, insult journalism, and insult the First Amendment. I’m sure they’ll enjoy the cocktail weenies while I do.
On the plus side, I did get to shake John Edwards’ hand!
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Welcome back Teddy!
welcome back
Zed?
zed
TSF!!
TSF
(crap forgot to dive)
boing reverse three-and-a-half somersaults, tuck, no splash
Hi Teddy!
I don’t come here to make friends. But I love it just the same!
Hmmm. More disappointment, like Suin’s.
Oh Well, at lwast I read the whole comment before everyone esle. Sorry Teddy that the MSM were jerks. I assume other bloggers felt the same? Those MS folks should be there to listen and not control.
Hi everybody, it’s nice to be back in the world of Capital Letters, which I have not yet mastered on my traveling treo. I’m not planning to master them either — until my treo masters loading FDL cleanly.
And how was your weekend, TSP notwithstanding?
Coulda taken a zed. nope. Had to read the post first. Live and learn.
Suzanne @ 7
Have you started diving again, now that we effectively lack a Congress?
TeddySanFran @ 12
disappointing, we were deceived.
Excellent post, Teddy. I was not there but I read similar posts about the venue.
See, I told you guys it should have been held in Portland, OR, home of the most microbrews in the country…ah well, maybe next time.
Elliott @ 15
I’m with Elliott. I spent all day today in a definite funk.
TeddySanFran @ 12
Nice as we are getting rain around here. Went to a traditional Tewa Indian dance this afternoon that was rather cool to watch.
TSF…Can you compare last year to this meeting. From watching from afar, the Las Vegas meeting seemed to be more net-root oriented.
Hey Teddy, I’m with you. Let’s rid the roots of same old same old and build something fresh and bold and brighter and … less stupid.
Well, if it had been held at some place like a college campus, rather than the Hyatt, the MSM wouldn’t have bothered. (”Stay in some punk kid’s dorm room? Yuck.”)
That seems to be the whole point–to get the MSM to notice. The MSM notices because it has a vested interest in co-opting such proceedings.
AZ Matt @ 11
I don’t presume to speak for the other bloggers. For me, the event gave TradMed entirely too many platforms on which to pitch their icky woo. It didn’t feel right.
And my feet hurt. You would not believe how huge and ill-laid-out the place was. It felt like I was being processed into a corporate-convention-goer.
The takeaway from this seems to be the co-opting by the corporate media. They need to stay on the outside if there’s any hope of actually breaking down the stenographic “news” industry.
Evening all. Welcome back Teddy. Give ‘em hell!
This is the official Fire Dog Lake BBQ Pork Butt reporting live from inside the world’s largest outdoor BBQ. Just had another big fire flare up NE of town Also have big ones just E and SE. Several more burning way north (up by Glacier) and one way south. So far nothing burning immediately to the west, but there are some big ones a bit farther out in Idaho. Air quality today is poor-marginal and predicted to remain so for the foreseeable future. Did get a break from the heat, but it is supposed to warm up again by the end of the week. My kingdom for some rain (basically we had none in July).
Teddy,
That assessment sounds about right… so far two lakers have panned the party… Waiting to hear Lady Jane and Redd… Snarkman Trex…
Bottled water is taking it hard these days…
Hear! Hear! I too was at YearlyKos—I had a great time, learned a ton, and I’m greatful to the organizers and volunteers…..But I totally agree with Teddy regarding the vast, soul-sucking, over-priced McCormick Center. And I totally agree with him regarding bloggers making nice with the establishment media. What WAS Matt Bai doing moderating that debate? Sheesh! And why even have Mike Allen on a panel?
TeddySanFran @ 14
Yeup, and I’m wearing a diving suit that has a giagantic one finger salute (front and back)
Great read TSF!! Fuck the msm especially nyt and wapo for their mouthpiece action in this entire shitmire. No “do overs” for them!
TeddySanFran @ 22
I liked your idea for the campus venue.
hi teddy,
guess i’m not the only one in a pissy mood.
dont have an answer, but i agree enthusiastically with you (sans the local experience, i didnt go)
tough week to be a progressive. we’re gonna need one of your “week in review” posts here soon to dust ourselves off and re-focus.
Well, when YKos wanted the Presidential candiates there the media certainly was going to show up like it or not. It sounds as if the moderators needed to be better slected, you know, people who understand what the netroots are about.
Will be doing a rain dance for you all, DrD.
I’m glad you got to shake Edwards’ hand. I really like him.
brownbuffalo @ 20
Imagine having to build something new — we are only two years into this! But I think you may be right.
montag @ 21
True and and think perhaps Kos and some others have at least some interest in being co-opted (at least partially. I get a distinct impression that they would like to be more mainstream in terms of power and influence.
Help me out here, are you feeling a bit hoodwinked by the power political players, using Kos as a backdrop. Or that it’s become more of an event and not as much is being done that could be done, as if some of the edge has been co-opted.
“The more things change, the more they stay the same”
Cozumel @ 36
You know, I have heard that somewhere before so it must be true.
Appropo to TSF’s laments regarding YKos, from a post I made here in FDL last October:
The bolding is today’s work.
With TSF’s tale of Mikey from Politico.com and the general miasma that Siun portrayed about this year’s YKos, it seems that both the MSM’s and the Democrat’s co-opt’ing of the blogosphere is well underway.
LoudounLib @ 17
I have felt the same way..I just read an obit. for Oliver W. Hill..and realized the NAACP Legal Defense team was facing much bigger odds..and I should quit being pissed off and work harder.
http://apnews.myway.com/articl…..3MJ00.html
I think we are all feeling hoodwinked. About dayam near everything.
YESS Teddy, reading the blogging on YKOS2, I got the impression it did not feel like YKOS1 at all. How fast we get suckered into the big tent of the MSM. Not even the name “Netroots Nation” sounds exciting at all. No wonder TRex had nothing to say about the convention – it must have been blaahhh di blabbedy blah. The best thing one can do is shake it off and hope for something better next year.
SanderO @ 25
Travel is scary for people who can’t drink tap water anywhere — the horrifically expensive bottled water is a symbol, to me, of the lack of consideration for people’s general needs. Many of us simply can’t drink tap water when we travel, for many reasons. Bottled water isn’t an affectation, it’s a necessity. And this weekend, a damn expensive one.
Doesn’t anybody want to ask about shaking JRE’s hand? Only a few of us got to do that — he caught me coming into and leaving the breakout session, so there were actually two shakes, one for each hand!
Yes! Please tell us about JRE!
Mad Dog,
if you don’t have money in America… you can’t play… at anything…. even being a blogger… and especially at being progressive.
The money people made it that way.
This is offtopic but I haven’t seen anyone mention it:
http://www.crooksandliars.com/…..sa-leaker/
The administration is wasting no time at all going down their “enemies list.”
I think everything worthwhile gets coopted by corporate America or at least gets a major pass made at it. Rock and roll, Rap Music, Cajun food, Video games, the moguls want to buy everything. Since I do believe that the blogosphere is here to stay, the major players can expect offers of access, resources, health insurance, who knows what else. This is almost a Ross Perot dilemma. He wanted to be the grain of sand in the oyster that a pearl could form around. The MSM is feeling the heat and it is easier to ruin the competition than to reform themselves and risk not getting invited to the really good cocktail parties.
The Mets win and Glavin gets his 300th win.
TeddySanFran @ 42
If you cant wash either hand EVER again, how will you use the toilet?
Didn’t ya see my comment above?
I’ve shaken his hand a few times: my daughter interned in his Senate office in 2003, and I’ve been to a couple of fund-raisers since. Got to meet both him & Elizabeth & actually TALK. Heard him speak too.
Welcome home, Teddy! Thanks for your insights–the mainstream coverage annointing the netroots as having “arrived” was irksome as well.
And in the night follows day category, there was another useless and repetitive column from L’il Deb in today’s WaPo:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01954.html
BigMitch @ 47
That’s one nice thing that’s happened today :-)
Did anyone notice if Mike Allen’s breath smelled like Karl Rove’s pen*s?
-GSD
(MOD NOTE: *Edited to allow through filter)
BigMitch @ 47
yuck. the day gets worse. ;) at least bonds is off for the day.
Thank you, Teddy. This makes me absolutely sick. And, not being there, I didn’t see how the fakes were taken. Did the crowd gush all over the VERY IMPORTANT PUNDITS? I heard some rumblings, but nothing exact.
The pundits seem to think the netroots are as stupid as the rest who bitch, but when AN IMPORTANT PUNDIT comes before them, they swoon. I can assure you that if I came face to face with Jay Carney, or John McCain, etc. — what I think about them now is the same as it would be then. And that is, I wouldn’t walk 2 steps to shake their hand. Nothing at all against younger people, but having a few years under my belt, I don’t fall for that.
I really really REALLY hope most there didn’t fall for it.
Ye gods, it seems like the weekend for being disappointed. :(
On a good note, though, I met Things Come Undone today when he brought me a check for the Breast Cancer 3-Day and visited my benefit yard sale. I look forward to knowing him better, as well!
Teddy,
Why can’t people drink tap water?
So one more thing how can we use this to our advantage as the net roots? Is there not some subversive use this this new found attraction the MSM and the power players have for the web and its denizens aside from a revenue stream or another echo chamber for their talking points.
Cozumel @ 37
I’m not happy with ‘OUR MAN’ Ciro’s vote on Bush’s spy legislation one bit. And I, and other’s here, gave that POS some money? For WHAT? ARRRG!
Re this morning’s conversation on Meet The Press about what makes a great president [list courtesy Doris Kearns Goodwin].
I’m convinced that Edwards will be a Great President. And Elizabeth will be a Great First Lady.
SP (at work) @ 46
using “classified warrants”
What kind of fuckery is that?
SP (at work) @ 46
Yep, with a whole new bag of tools to rundown the list of suspects.
-GSD
Great post Teddy. Makes me feel less bad that I missed the event myself.
As to the how and why… How gave the MSM such a giant soapbox at this event? Who let them all on the panels? Who chose them to do the moderating and speaking for everyone else?
What the hell happened to the ROOTS in Netroots there?
It will be interesting to see how Keith Olbermann handles Tuesday’s Dem candidates’ debate. I have hopes.
BigMitch @ 60
Tell me you didn’t know this was coming? Why the hell do you think he wants all this power?
Mat Bai? Oy. This is why I read firedoglake before dailykos. Well, there are a lot of blogs I read before dk, but I hit firedoglake early and often.
BigMitch @ 60
That’s Soviet Union, Chile’s Pinochet, Saddam’s Iraq, The Shah’s Iran, Hitler’s Germany kind of fuckery is what it is.
-GSD
Cozumel @ 58
I noticed that too Coz. I gave, twice.
Maybe its time to ask how Defcon keeps its edge.
((((((((((TEDDY))))))))))
I’m so glad you are home in the incomparable San Francisco! Just great to have you back in left coast civilization.
SanderO @ 56
Heh. What a ‘flourideless’ racket. What next, air for sale? Count me out on both ; )
Suzanne @ 7
No splash ?!! Was there water in the pool ? *g*
Evenin’ Suz !
((( TSF )))
Cozumel @ 57:
Man, when I look back at some of the fools I donated to [Ciro, Salazar, Sestak] [plus a few “not fools, but sad I donated” (Webb)], I feel like crying. Not that I passed out the Big Bucks [maybe $10 or so/per, except for Webb], but still . . .
I thought I was being Real Smart by donating through ActBlue and cutting off the DCCC/DSCC, but I feel pretty dumb now. OTOH, there were some good folks . . .
However, I recall that I was sent in this direction via DK — back when I was young(er) and foolish(er). I never go there any more — since I discovered this wonderful Lake.
Cozumel @ 70
Actually, much of the bottled water really is tap water. Sometimes specially filtered, but most comes straight from the municipal supply or from the same source.
To paraphrase Barfly — I don’t hate the Traditional Media, I just feel better when they’re not around.
Second thought — no, I do hate the Traditional Media…Welcome back to town, Teddy. Colder’n hell in the Haight tonight…
I know it’s OT, but more downer news from the NYT about the FISA Surrender:
What was previously criminal, is now legal. How can you explain yourself Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid?
I guess when Nancy said Impeachment was “off the table”, she had this in mind. Just take all the crimes that Junya and his criminal cabal have committed and make them legal.
Voila! Look Ma, no Impeachment!
mauimom @ 73
I donate only to Edwards. Told Nancy in my rant last night that I had donated in the past to the DCCC and wished that I had my money back.
Cliff Varnell @ 74
I do not “hate” the MSM. Hate implies a degree of respect and I have none for them. Despise or disdain, but not hate.
Suzanne @ 7
Tsk, Tsk, slipping, eh?!!! Bon Soir, Ma Cheri!
Well, I was tossing around the cocktail weenie jokes pretty liberally after reading about the goings on at YK07.
-GSD
P.S. Another sad, sad Monday?
Mad Dogs @ 74
And what these idiots don’t realize is that every time they bow and scrape to Bush on security matters, they paint themselves into a corner, and incrementally give insane fascisti like Giuliani a bit more creds for the need for extreme authoritarianism.
SanderO @ 45
Speaking of money people, look what they’ve done now… (As in “oversight? What oversight?”)
Credit Default Swaps: The Land of Efficient Insider Trading?
This is how 17 trillion dollars (current world credit exposure) gets “disappeared”. More selling underway in Asia … Could be popcorn for breakfast.
Not. Just. The. Media.
That the pols show up to your convention is one thing. That they won’t fuck you over is another.
I also do not understand the issue with tap water….I drink it whenever I can.
Suz, ygm
Dang, Teddy, I take it you were underwhelmed by our Net Roots’ passion and ardor, then???
“Why Can’t the Bloggers and the Media be Friends?”
Maybe if they stop approaching their gigs with all the panache of a disgruntled dog-watch shift table busser…Nah, never happen.
The ‘media’ as we know it has been on an extended fart break since the ’80’s, pimping the latest happyface infotainment and gossip while real news that affects the mass dies on the vine daily at the behest of their masters.
If telling the truth puts the trad scribes out of business, tough titty, and if a corporate propagandist feels the pinch too…Well, titties come in pairs.
I’m not here (or anywhere else) to make nice with greedy lickspittles who enable lawless thugs.
Mad Dogs @ 76
http://www.cindyforcongress.org
Might be worth a bookmark if you’re into that sorta thing…
Oh wait I almost forgot! All of this is an elaborate ruse by Pelosi and Reid! Yea, that’s the ticket!
The Repubes are falling right into it by taking too much power, and now we’re really gonna git ‘em!
After further review…I guess I’ll bookmark that site after all…
Most bottled water IS tap water than has been filtered a few times.
Prairie Sunshine @ 59
The one characteristic I thought was glaringly absent from her list was ‘honesty’.
darkblack @ 87
But who would tell us about runaway brides, missing blondes, and Paris Hilton? Your daily dose of crap, served up for your pleasure.
SanderO @ 89
Sometimes this is true, sometimes it IS just bottled tap water packaged in plastic.
LoudounLib @ 44
We were sitting right by the pathway he used to enter the breakout room. I was trying to take pictures when I realized I’d be able to shake his hand — reached out my right hand and he grabbed it and looked right at me. I just said, “Hi John, please win” and he let go, walking into the center arena. I think he was the only candidate who did the 360 town hall meeting setup.
He’s absolutely dreamy. He really looks at you when he talks and he is getting real good at taking on the establishment. I’m not embarassed to say he reminds me of RFK when he talks about the moneyed interests in America, and poverty, and education, and health care for all.
He’s the real deal, I think. I wanted to ask about teh gaze marriage, especially with the fiance sitting right next to me, but just before he called on me he must have realized he had already called on two men. He looked right at me and said, “I’m gonna call on a woman now.” Which was the right thing to do. But I wish I had a chance to ask.
Fiance got to shake his hand as he left the room, and JRE grabbed my left hand.
He said any of us who didn’t get our questions answered can ask them on the website, and he’ll attend to them all. I hope so.
GSD @ 80
That dude Mark from down below was a little cryptic in his phrasing there toward the end of his remarks. I do not dispute what he said, but I think he got a little scrambled up there at the end, don’t you?
Wow, Teddy — so glad for you that you were able to interact with him. I am so pulling for him.
darkblack @ 86
DING!
Twain @ 91
Perez Hilton, The Matt Drudge of breathlessly overstimulated pepperpot prattle
;>)
AnnieW @ 84
There are bugs in tap water that folks with compromised immune systems must avoid. These bugs vary by municipality. One adjusts to one’s own local bugs, sometimes, but travel means sticking with bottled. So I’m told, by people who’ve an investment in my health.
hackworth @ 93
Siun is still on that thread and has clarified some things. You might wanna go back and read what she has said.
Twain @ 75:
Yeah, I’m pretty much limiting this cycle’s contributions to Edwards, plus a Dem who’s running again in an adjacent district [MD-06] to unseat a rotten Repub incument, and a couple of others.
This discussion made me go back to the ActBlue page I set up last year [raised over $5K]. Those who were on it: Andrew Duck [my MD-06 guy]; McNerney; Shea-Porter; Hodes; Lamont; Wulsin; Massa; Lampson; Tester; Busby; Duckworth; Jack Carter; Laesch and Webb.
Only Hodes, McNerney, Shea-Porter & Andrew Duck are on this year’s page. Oh, and I donated, per an Alaska friend’s request, to the person who was trying to unseat Young up there. [In exchange, he contributed to Duck.]
CTuttle @ 86
The ‘roots passion and ardor was there, but the event itself was overlaid with an aspiration to Establishment acceptance that seemed very un-rootsian.
Teddy SanFran,
Good after-the-conference takedown. Some of the points you made are similar to points made after YK1 – the inevitability of media and money co-opting the netroots being one. I’m not surprised that this came up again.
What does surprise me though is your description – no doubt pretty accurate – of how un-egalitarian and upscale the venue was, and how difficult it must have been for some doggies – TexB comes to mind – to get around without a lot of hassle. You’re certainly right that some underused facility like a college campus would have been more appropriate.
Loved your comment about the Gravel incident, but Alaska Dems were fairly corrupt when they were in power here. Alaska Democrats created the regulatory regime which led to the Exxon Valdez spill. That was a large part of the reason our Green Party became the most viable in the USA. Not many opportunities since the early 90s for the Dems in AK to be corrupt.
Mad Dogs @ 76
They didn’t give a shit about making anything legal; they were, are, and will spy on US citizens law or no law. I now think the whole last minute FISA thing was a Rove ploy to bust the Dems balls. He knew they didn’t have to votes to stop it and it would just cause the shit to fly in the Dem base. It seems to have worked.
GSD @ 53
oh! my sides are hurtin’, I’m laughing so hard!
Why I never drink tap water:
I live downstream from Aerojet. I once worked in that conglomerate of buildings. No, I didn’t work for Aerojet, but a place that rented one of their buildings. I saw the strangest bugs and plants there. This is in Sacramento, and I never saw them anywhere else in California, or any of the other 40 states I have visited.
I would never EVER drink tap water in Sacramento. EVER.
At least with bottled water, I have a chance.
this will make you smile.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/8/5/16596/93621
drive by-just got in, long story-
teddy, glad you still have a little perspective………i remember being in the same situations, it was hard to swallow, yet, i learned a lot……hopin’ you still have what you need, that it didn’t get lost in the big city………..or, if it did, that you gathered it all back when you went back home………stand straight and tall………
nite all………
AnnieW @ 84
I recently saw a report of this issue, and every single “water expert” that was interviewed said they drink tap first and foremost. Had something to do the plastic leeching, and the fact alot of what is filtered out is actually pretty good for you.
TeddySanFran @ 97
Ahhh. That makes sense and the filtering would effectively remove those.
oh mod! clean-up at 8:54 please
TeddySanFran @ 100
I really think that is part of the official Kos masterplan. I think he and some others want to become the new establishment.
> http://www.firedoglake.com/200…..y-27-2007/
teddy follow the links at 68……….make you feel better……..
bonkers @ 87
Damn, Bonkers, I committed myself last nite to make a contribution to Cindy’s war chest! The House Dems folded like a cheap lawn chair…!!!
TeddySanFran @ 92
I’ll bet dollars to doughnuts he will, too.
TexB @ 110
I dunno. Sometimes I think it’s good to be reminded of the mentality we’re dealing with.
TexB @ 111
Definitely.
TexB @ 110
Please!!!!
SP (at work) @ 45
This is offtopic but I haven’t seen anyone mention it:
http://www.crooksandliars.com/…..sa-leaker/
The administration is wasting no time at all going down their “enemies list.”
Well, thank heavens the president got his Executive Order done just in time, otherwise this guy might be able to hire lawyers and stuff. And eat, and pay the mortgage. And people might join with him, materially hurting our effort in Irak by contributing to a legal defense fund.
Whew! Just in the nick of time, Mr. president!
Why the TV shots of Pelosi smiling so much Friday night? Her daughter needs to make another documentary called “Bluffing For Nothing With Nancy- The New Journeys With George”
TeddySanFran @ 93
I concur that John Edwards is the best choice for POTUS. He is the most sincere and I am glad that he has changed his tone and gone on offense. Elizabeth is a great inspiration and as First Lady, she would really help to regain America’s lost prestige.
Good night all, and peace.
TeddySanFran @ 98
IIRC Cryptosporidium is widespread in the upper Mid-West.
‘Nite, Loudoun. Did you get rain tonight? We did!!! [Yea!!!]
Teddy, it was so good to meet you and so many of our fellow FireDogLake community at YKos2. I’m not going to let the weirdness of the media’s attempt to manipulate the event undermine the value of meeting with you and others, because in the end, the stronger we are as a community, the better armed we are to kick the ass of the media.
I cannot accept the word of an overwhelming majority of corporate-paid media because I have not forgotten what Armstrong Williams said after he was uncovered as a payola recipient.
There are others, he said.
Who are they? How many are there? What kinds of payola, for what agendas and clients are they working?
We still don’t have answers. Hell, I don’t think we even know if Williams was held accountable for this civil infraction.
Which makes me wonder, of course, whether Mike Allen is also one of those unnamed others. If I cannot be certain, why should I trust him at all???
Night LL. Sleep well and keep us all safe from ourselves.
grouch potato – older, cynical urban pirate @ 106
You got that right! You didn’t mention the part about sideaches and crying from laughing so hard…
I’ll be back in an hour. John from Cincinatti just came by.
TeddySanFran @ 98
I see, we’re on well water now, but my husband who has had a very compromised immune system due to harsh chemo was allowed to drink tap water, but not well (or bottled spring) water.
I also have a reverse osmosis water maker on our boat in Mexico that produces VERY clean water and I keep my tanks in great order and I know to keep bottled water for friends that still want “good” water. I test regularly, my water is better quality than most bottled.
Steve-AR @ 122
In parts of NE Oklahoma there is salmonella and E. coli in the ground water. Periodically the health department would shut down some small town’s water supply when I lived there.
I agree with some of your criticism of the event, but I thought the panel with Mike Allen, Jay Carney, Glenn Greenwald, and the woman from Feministing whose name I can’t spell was a pretty good event. Mike Allen does actually answer his email, so I don’t think his “here’s my email shtick” was phony.
I think that blogs are making a difference in MSM coverage. And that things like that panel are evidence that. Don’t get mad, we’re getting even.
Our well in Alaska is 120 feet deep. The aquifer which feeds it gives us water which has been down there for longer than people know. We fill a bunch of bottles before we travel. We don’t use the store-bought ones, but Nalgene bottles. We don’t EVER buy bottled water.
DrDick @ 111
Let’s remember that Markos had little to do with YKos — he let them use his brand. Twice. He appeared to preemtively take back the Kos brand in his keynote Saturday nite.
He introduced the diary by saying:
I wonder if Markos has decided that YKos no longer needs — or perhaps deserves? — his brand. He’s just a guy with a website, and YKos seems to want to be much, much more. Not all in a good way.
TexB @ 111
already taken care of tex (refresh your page and it is gone)
TeddySanFran @ 100
Dang, some Kool-aid contaminated the well, eh???
Asked if they’d hire a blogger in the White House, all the PrezCandis raised their hands. John Edwards made it official, though: Elizabeth will be his White House blogger. Not one other named anyone.
damn – another bubble burst!! kissing up to scrubs lol(MSM)as if the msm respected the netroots…..
I thought it was well-known that Kos was a sellout. Surely one can network despite the trolls at such an event.
Teddy,
This is a wonderful post! About three Hetch Hetchy showers and a sweet potato pie from Brother In Laws BBQ and a walk through the Castro should wash that crap off.
TeddySanFran @ 135
Did anyone ask if any of the candidates would do away with the WH Office of Political Affairs (an office which Reagan created), on the basis that the President was there to work for all the people?
TeddySanFran @ 134
I agree and disagree, TSF. I think that the problem with branding the event as a “Kos” event means that any f*ckup on the part of the venue, the volunteers, the attendees, the speakers and exhibitors becomes Kos’ f*ckup, even though we as members of the community understand that’s not true. If that detracts from the work Kos can do in the future, there should be some separation between the man and the event.
But I also see this as a reflection of the truth that he tried to convey in his closing remarks. This is not just a website operated by a short, Salvadoran-born partisan. YKos is a community that organically became part of a larger movement; it deserves an identity of its own, if only to encourage it to live on beyond the reach and capacity of the man whose website launched it. It’s succession planning, in corporate-speak; we netroots are the heirs and assigns.
TeddySanFran @ 132
Does sound as though he is not entirely comfortable with the relationship. Still hold to my original point, but this may not be the way he wants to go. He is certainly particular about doing things on his own terms (which is not a bad thing). This is not meant as a criticism, just an observation.
TeddySanFran @ 135
John Edwards has many attributes that make him the best candidate, not the least of which is being Elizabeth Edwards’ husband !
one more baseball comment – TOM GLAVIN got his 300th win – YESSSSSSSSSS!!! and GO METS!!!
TeddySanFran @ 135
Elizabeth would bring class and competence to the WH as First Lady!!!
I think this whole issue needs serious discussion: whether or not we can force our way into the mainstream media at all or whether we’re better off being completely dismissive of them. It seems to me that Glenn Greenwald has succeeded in forcing his way into the MSM conversation, partly by sheer strength of argument but also because he bends over backwards to be fair most of the time. He was certainly polite on that panel.
Is that bad or good? (This is not a rhetorical question.)
Where is punaise? Is he missing along with Alfred?
juslin @ 142
Congrats, Glavine, the Mets are the class of the town! ;-)
Alfred is not missing – he is working at his day job for a couple weeks.
Punaise is vacationing the month of August in France.
Twain @ 146
Punaise is in France … I wonder if he’s figured out Mime puns … *g*
Rayne @ 141
Here’s an example of just that sort of thing.
Suzanne @ 150
Wow! A month in Paris – how wonderful. No doubt he will return and say all sorts of things I don’t understand.
I miss them both.
it’ll be interesting to see if the other firedogs concur with TSF… somehow i kinda knew it wasn’t in markos’s hands – the venue told the tale
AnnieW @ 83
Can someone help me with this. I’ve run turbidity tests on my tap water and it was disheartening. I won’t pay for bottled water (unless I need a new bottle) but I have two Brita filters that work over time. Is that a good thing or am I cheating myself of something?
Suzanne @ 147
You’re the mostest with the bestest…!!! *g*
$8 sandwiches too. It was ridiculous.
Ian Welsh @ 154
Oof, posh quarters, eh???
Ian Welsh @ 156
And $12 for a 10 inch pizza.
TexB @ 156
Are ya home, Ma’am? 8-)
TexB @ 157
Aye Caramba !
NETROOTS MUST REGROUP!!
CTuttle @ 159
Nope. I am still in Chicago. Sightseeing with RevDeb tomorrow.
TeddySanFran @ 135
Well if they told us who their WH Blogger would be, next thing you know we’d be asking who the Secretary of Peace would be.
You know, blogs follow an archetypal curve; it’s difficult for most to survive 3 years, let alone 5 years, without facing major upheaval and changes in ownership/operation. Look at MyDD and OpenLeft — the transition of Chris Bowers could easily have been predicted. And perhaps Kos is feeling the same restlessness that Bowers felt, a need to encourage seeing this less about a blog and more about a movement, one that is ready to move on to even bigger things.
Look at what we are doing here at FDL, for example, in comparison to what its owner/operators and community were doing a couple of years ago. We are no longer looking from day to day for what happened to justice for Valerie Plame, but how we can actively shape the direction of national policy on a number of matters. That ain’t peanuts, and it will be reflected in changes to the blog itself, let alone how the community organizes itself.
While I think there was entirely too much credence and power given to MSM at YKos, I also think we were for the first time co-opting them as much as they were co-opting us. We were EXTREMELY conscious of them, followed their moves, were highly skeptical of them. (Believe me, I noticed it keenly; I was credentialed as media, had the same MEDIA flag on my ID badge, and YKos folks treated me skeptically and at arms’ length until I clarified who I was and what I was doing. I was credentialed to gather info on the media, in order to write about them covering us on behalf of ePluribus Media.) And I know we were not taking their shit, called them on it.
At one point during the onslaught of corporate media that arrived around lunch on Saturday in advance of the Presidential forum, one of the many television reporters commented after an interview of one of my compatriots that we were taking her job and kicking her ass.
Yeah. I think that sums it up. The corporate media’s business model is in its death throes, and they know it; what we saw at YKos were its dying gasps as it tries to understand its terminal illness.
TexB @ 160
Where are you guys going?
TexB @ 157
I hope you’re not having difficulty sleeping because of pain, Betsy. Do you have any ideas about a better model and/or venue for
YK3, uh Netroots Nation 2008?TexB @ 150
Here’s an example of just that sort of thing.
Thanks for the link, TexB — this post of mine is link-deprived due to time, and I appreciate your linking this up. It’s the same story Mike Allen told on Tucker’s show, without the Drudgian and Malkinite shading. In other words, a first-person truthful account. Thanks.
Nate @ 152
No, I’ve worked for my local DWS and only disagree with the chlorine levels! A single cartridge system is ample!!!
ON the lighter side, check out this brand new Tom Tomorrow cartoon strip in which a special “friend” of FDL makes a cameo appearance at Panel 5…
The tapwater in my town (Woodland, California) is vile tasting (high in carbonates). I fill jugs from the water store for $1.25 per gallon. It’s the same water, only running it through an RO system makes all the difference. It’s a pain in the ass.
Rayne, I hope you are right.
Rayne sez:
At one point during the onslaught of corporate media that arrived around lunch on Saturday in advance of the Presidential forum, one of the many television reporters commented after an interview of one of my compatriots that we were taking her job and kicking her ass.
She’s got a job now because she shows up for work. She’ll have a job in three years if she shows up for work and helps uncover the mess that her professional colleagues know about but are afraid to uncover.
I saw the panel with Jay and Mike online and had exactly the same reaction. Almost could puke watching Mike try to ingratiate himself — and had absolutely no doubt that he was being completely cynical and would go back to his full-time job of publishing Drudge’s ’scoops’ as soon as he got home. And funny how Jay carefully avoided any mention and redirected any hint at his ‘conspiracy theory’ moment of glory, which really encapsulates everything that’s terminally rotten about these people who inhabit the septic tank also know as the DC establishment. No common sense, and a completely broken moral compass.
And what were they simultaneously smoking, snorting and injecting in their veins when they decided to offer that gig to Bai-toy?
TeddySanFran @ 167
Yes, thanks for the link, TexB. I was there in room for the panel, took photos of the fracas.
And I asked security to step in and monitor the situation, because I truly believed the serviceman in uniform was not in his right mind.
Rayne @ 162
Mahalo, Rayne!!! I respect your assessments!!! *g*
I still think that the YKos seminar Spooning with Mike Allen went too far.
-GSD
MZ what was Jay’s conspiracy theory moment of glory?
-GSD
TexB @ 157
I am sad for all the money I spent that would have been better routed to BlueAmerica candidates.
Technicolouryawn @ 168
Ironically, you’re right, it is a pain in the ass, but, not for the effort, for the Rowpu water itself! I’ve read numerous scholarly studies on Reverse-Osmosis, it is the worst purification system utilized!!!
Did y’all catch Jane on CNN this evening with Rick Sanchez ?
Perhaps someone could put up the link for those who missed it.
Who has the entire ABC Iowa debate on video download?
Teddy, so sorry your trip was lousy. Did JE have soft hands? Firm handshake? Was Elizabeth there too? I couldn’t go on a trip to the store without a bottle of water much less fly to Chicago. That’s why I didn’t go. I could always ship a case to the hotel but the thought of having to fly without it I couldn’t cope.
Petrocelli @ 179
OK.
Petrocelli @ 177
Ask and ye shall…
Jane on CNN
Petrocelli @ 178
C & L has it up.
GSD @ 176
Yes. There are persons who should be deemed persona non grata until their relationship with the radical neo-conservative elements of the right are completely disclosed and neutralized.
Note my comment about Armstrong Williams above; Maggie Gallagher and Mike McManus, along with a couple of other folks who wrote for the likes of Cato Institute, were all found to have been payola recipients.
The one thing that all these identified payola recipients have in common is a role as content contributor to either The Heritage Foundation or to Townhall.com (formerly part of Heritage and now spun off, whatever that really means).
Go ahead and Google up Mike Allen and Townhall.com.
Highly suspect.
Newtonusr’s is the YouTube link. Mine goes to the raw files at CrooksandLiars. You have choices now. :)
saturday pix
friday pix
thursday pix
GSD — back when the first evidence of the USA firings came to light and the blogs were the only ones touching it (most politicians and traditional media wouldn’t touch it), Jay dismissed it all as a conspiracy theory:
http://time-blog.com/swampland…..sacre.html
what needs to change for the next NETROOTS gathering? this sounded a tad too “commercial” or maybe i dont get it…..
It’s good to see corporate America continue to make bold decisions.
Chrysler’s new CEO is Bob Nardelli, seeing how good he was for Home Depot.
woohoo, pix – thanks tex
lolo @ 181
The trip was better than I make it sound, I guess. It wasn’t lousy, but the event has sure morphed! There were sessions that were good as well — Lane Hudson’s which starred Jane Hamsher and Pam Spaulding; the ONE folks including our own Siun; and of course the Libby liveblogging panel with Christy, Marcy, Jeralyn, and Sheldon.
JRE’s got smaller hands than mine (which most men do) and his handshake was firm. He looks you in the eye when he shakes your hand, which when he’s shaking only five or six hands while walking — says a lot to me. Elizabeth was not there, but JRE had spoken to her just before he addressed us in the breakout and he said she is doing great.
TexB @ 186
Ma’am, there’s no new pix!!! :-(
TSF,
I wonder if your mood, and Siun’s, were affected by the FISA takedown? It must have been hard to party in the wake of that.
I’ve been trying to find the exact wording of the FISA law just passed, and on the way, buried in EPU on the last thread, I wrote this:
The fight is not over.
Meanwhile, has the netroots nation joined the Washington Press Club? How about a bit of internal subversion?
Bob in HI
TexB @ 187
I bet you have a great time going over the photos with Cassie when you get home!
By the way, C&L has a new video by Ava of Peace Takes Courage: the history of nixon and the future of cheney
AnnieW @ 191
Just as important to note that the new owner of Chrysler, Cerberus, is the same company that was contracted to provide services at Walter Reed Army Hospital.
Cerberus’ CEO is John Snow, former lying sack of shit who was our Treasury Secretary that came to us after running CSX into the ground as its CEO. Dan Quayle is Cerberus’ VP of international investments, if memory serves.
Since much of my household’s income comes from contract work for Chrysler, you can imaging how freaking thrilled I am at the prospects for Chrysler…
Why don’t y’all do this in New Orleans next time? Wanna make a statement? There’s your chance.
AZ Matt @ 194
Saw that earlier. Another reason to have hope for the future of America.
TeddySanFran @ 191
That’s cool, Teddy! I was personally surprised at your age in TexB’s pixs, I’d made an Ass of U and Me, and thought you were younger!!! *g*
DrDick @ 184
Who the fuck is that “host”?!? What a maroon. He thinks he’s charming and witty, but it’s actually smarmy and shitty. I can only imagine this dude in a bar trying to “pick up chicks.” He thinks he’s got it goin on. How Jane doesn’t roll her eyes is beyond me.
juslin @ 189
Well, we should have had Neil Young there leading us in “Let’s Impeach the President.” Or something music-wise…
I really enjoyed meeting you and your fiance, Teddy. You too Rayne and TexB. I also got to meet Rev-Deb, Christy, egregious, katymine and TRex! That was so cool.
bonkers @ 199
I thought he did hit on Jane, tho!!! ;-)
I found the ABC Iowa debate at YouTube. Romney is more pathetic than usual. He’s gonna break downward over the next two weeks unless the media comes to his rescue. These guys have definitely forgotten the 11th Commandment.
bonkers @ 200
CTuttle @ 201
Which picture is Teddy, please?
Rayne @ 196
I remember Nardelli being a big Shrub backer in ‘04. Can’t remember details, but there was some dust-up about something he said or did during the campaign. Hmmm, with John Snow now owning Chrysler, I guess the mafioso wanted to keep it all “in the family.”
dideau @ 198
Many of us requested NOLA as a venue. Don’t think we ignored it. I don’t know how the final decision was made.
Frankly, although I was fine with the choice of Chicago as a location, the venue did suck eggs.
As I am sure that others more qualified to know will tell you, it is HORRIBLE for disabled attendees to navigate, and made worse by the security precautions required for the Presidential candidates. I had met a woman and her spouse from North Carolina; her husband was in a wheelchair and completely immobile, got stuck OUTSIDE the venue and unable to go up an elevator into the building because the elevator’s electrical system had failed after being shut down to prevent unauthorized use and access while the candidates were on site. Maintenance and security folks were able to move the gentleman and his chair indoors, sparing the poor wife a half-mile or more trek pushing him back around and in through another route. But I’d tried to find security personnel to help and it took me quite a trek of my own and numerous flights of stairs before I could find anyone to help. By that time security had arrived on their own to help.
Sucked. We have got to start thinking about EVERYBODY when we select these venues.
What’s the 11th commandment?
Ed*ard Teller @ 202
Haven’t they all sinned by violating the original ten, already??? ;-)
Rayne @ 196
And, given some time, and the kinds of deals Quayle has been making for them, in five years, Cerberus might well be the next BCCI….
Loo Hoo. @ 208
Thou shalt not speak ill of other Republicans. It dates from the 50s, IIRC.
Loo Hoo. @ 207
Thou shall not speak ill of another Repuke, Reagan’s decree!!!
One thing I noticed about this year vs last year is that there was not as many people chatting in the FDL threads while sitting in hallways this year. Perhaps that is just a late nite phenomena but there did not seem to be the party (having fun) atmosphere that was prevalent in reports from Vegas last year.
TeddySanFran @ 170
Me too.. *snicker*
Rayne @ 196
Home Depot has been one of my company’s clients (and my responsibility) for over 12 years and the changes I have seen have been unbelievable, and not for the better, so I get where you’re coming from.
I can’t believe that the stockholders are happy (God knows, the employees won’t be, but they don’t count in todays world) as Nardelli was good and enriching himself foremost.
Unbelievable.
CTuttle @ 214
If Frederick of Hollywood gets in I imagine there will be a lot of breaking of the 11th.
bonkers @ 200
Awww, be nice to Rick Sanchez, he was voluntarily waterboarded … *g*
Suzanne @ 213
Yeah, but wireless was everywhere in Vegas. Easy.
Suzanne @ 213
I had this exact same thought. Musta lost that new car smell this year.
dideau @ 197
The deciding and choosing of where the event occurs are rather closely held. There was a “which city” vote on DK, iirc.
montag @ 211
Oh, yeah, believe me, when I heard the winning bidder was Cerberus, I immediately thought this was the new money laundering facility.
They will run it into the ground and leave my home state of Michigan hung out to dry, another wave of the slow-moving hurricane that is forcing blue-collar workers to leave the state in droves.
Suzanne @ 212
Location, Location, Location??? ;-)
Twain @ 215
Dang, I’ve gotta clean my Monitor!!!
Twain @ 216
Ahh yes. Frederick of Hollywood. A man with the moral fiber of Nixon, the depth of Reagan, and the work ethic of Shrub. Great choice there.
Loo Hoo. @ 208
St Ronnie’s: Never speak ill of another Republican.
Did anyone ask Chucklenutz Cooper what it is like sharing the network with such great journalists as Glenn Beck and Laura Ingraham?
-GSD
I’m not sure what it was – whether it was location or what but this felt like a business convention to this observer watching from home.
DrDick @ 224
And the hot manliness of Fred Fielding.
-GSD
Petrocelli @ 217
I suspect it was a familiar experience for him, with all of his experience in singles bars.
Midwest Meg @ 26
I don’t have a problem with Allen so much as one with Bai. You have to have an establishment presence.
Petrocelli @ 217
I wonder why Dirty Sanchez didn’t call the The National Re-tool fool on his, “That was the tamest tantrum I’ve ever seen.” Yo, Sanchez even said at the beginning that they didn’t show the actual tantrum, which happened during the commercial break.
DrDick @ 223
Damn! Now I have to clean my keyboard and Monitor!!! :P
Asian Stocks Drop, Extending Global Rout, on U.S. Housing Woes
Now there’s an Aussie who tells it like it is…
Petrocelli @ 179
It’s up on Crooks & Liars.
Laura Ignoranus is on CNN?!?
neokneme @ 233
This happened in August, 2001 too.
Eureka Springs @ 215
The reporter seemed really genuine about her comments to us, that we were taking her job and kicking her ass, but I took the time to point out that blogs are a conversation about media, not necessarily a replacement for media, and that it’s really only now that the media has been able to hear the conversation instead of being firewalled off from it. She didn’t accept that premise, but I think she is still pretty clear-eyed about the prospects for corporate media.
Another compatriot who was privy to that exchanged pointed out how easily we had that conversation, that it was easy to see them as people like us…that the relationships between elected officials and the Beltway media are pretty easy to understand, given how much proximity they share.
Touche.
Ed*ard Teller @ 203
He got smacked around by a waitress in NH this week too.
Not to mention the ‘vote for me I’m a religious guy’ but don’t ask about my religion schtick.
-GSD
so nowthat its over – whats the plans for the coming election cycle?any unified strategies about to be unveiled TSF??
Suzanne @ 213
Wifi was sucky.
GSD @ 227
Dang, I’m keeping all consumables well out of range of my ‘Puter!! ;-)
GSD @ 238
Osama bin Forgotten is pretty religious too, I hear…
DrDick @ 229
I loved him saying in the end, how passionate he is about politics …
bonkers @ 235
She’s filling in for Zahn until she is replaced by the wife of Dan Senor of the Paul Bremer Iraq goon squad….Campbell Brown.
-GSD
Loo Hoo. @ 240
I really don’t know why they decided to have it at McCormick, which really is in the middle of nowhere. The American Anthropological Association holds meetings there in a couple of downtown hotels just north of the Loop and they get about 4000 people and have hundreds of sessions over 5 days.
Well, then. Maybe I’m glad I didn’t go.
Teddy, I can’t tell you how many times I saw Ezra Klein standing in the back of the room at panel discussions last year, rolling his eyes at the stupid, earnest questions from the audience and even stupider answers from panelists. Everyone but him was so stupid. I wanted to rip his sneer off.
I’m just outside of Zion right now, heading for the river. See ya in a coupla weeks.
Petrocelli @ 243
Well, if he knew anything about politics, that would make him an idiot savant.
Loo Hoo. @ 202
I was so glad to meet you and TexB, too, Loo Hoo; wish I’d met TSF’s beloved as well, they looked so cozy together. But there were SOOO many people to meet, very easy to get lost in all of it. Made some fascinating connections, one of which may have paid off in the form of a job, and another to whom I paid a karmic debt. A technical blogger covered YKos for his media outlet; I’ve used his work for my consulting work over the last couple of years. Was great to actually chat with him and let him know that I appreciated his work.
this to senator Dianne Fi of Cali:
What part of the following — the fourth amendment to the Constitution — dont you understand?
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
I am OUTRAGED at your vote on the FISA act. This is caving to fearmongering and failure to protect the US Constitution.
What part of needing a warrant from a judge is too complicated for the Bush administration.
Why would anyone trust Abu Gonzalez and the rest of this administration. Fix this, or lose my vote and all my family members.
What’s up with ABC’s rigging of their post debate polling results? Didn’t Ron Paul and No Thanks, I’m voting Dem Swept the top two!!! WTF!!!!!!
TeddySanFran @ 220
Although New Orleans may appear a “politically correct” choice, N.O. in August would be HORRIBLE: hot, hot, hot and HUMID. Please, unless it’s gonna be in October [hurricane season] or Jan/Feb [Super Bowl], let’s NOT do New Orleans!!
bonkers @ 231
He was too busy keeping the “Liberal” in line with “Kerry was a Flip Flopper” spiel …
Loo Hoo. @ 201
Bah. I missed you.
BRAVO, Teddy! FUCKING BRAVO!
So pulling any of us into the fold is what? Cool? Is that what they think we want – coolness? Puhleeze! I was fucking cool before it was cool to be cool. I’ve been waiting for the others to catch up; they still haven’t.
It’s about control….always. Howard Dean was absolutely correct in talking about the power of the internet.
Ed*ard Teller @ 235
I remember that. I was about to short the airlines. Glad I didn’t.
Needed a break from the GOP Iowa debate, so watched Jane on CNN. She was great, but what a waste of her time, dealing with these idiots, eh? I foresee more such appearances for her, though.
Loo Hoo. @ 239
The US Stream Geeks were not happy either!!!
Ian Welsh @ 254
You’re getting to be a rockstar, Ian. Every time I saw you, you were deep in conversation that I didn’t want to interrupt.
;-)
Mommybrain @ 247
enjoy the river mommybrain – you will be missed at the lake until your return
GSD @ 238
Romney thinks he’s going to get away with it… and that no one will notice… and, considering he made it all the way to the governership with that weak noodle, he has no reason to believe otherwise.
Ed*ard Teller @ 256
Name recognition… FDL mentioned 3 times at least.
:-)
GSD @ 244
OMFG. Beck, Ignoreham, King…is CNN worse than Pox Noize now? What’s next? Michael Savaged Weiner as news dirctor?
montag @ 247
Amazing that in a few minutes, Jane made him and the Tool look so utterly stoopid just by being herself.
Nardelli is gonna finish with the smash and grab and then off to Sardinia for a birthday party with ice statues that piss champagne a la Koslowski.
Let’s build a Bastille somewhere.
-GSD
Thanks Suz. I may come back riding a firefox *g*
Rayne @ 258
LOL. I only wish. But thanks for the kind words. One main reason I did go was to meet FDL commenters (I suppose I should have forced myself out of bed for the breakfast, but, ummm, I’m not exactly a morning person.)
Okay, off to bed. I’ve returned to the Great White North to spend four more days decompressing with my kids at my folks’ place.
And mom said she’s cutting me off internet after midnight from now on (I think she forgot tonight…).
Some things never change, no matter how old you are.
‘Niters, ‘Pups. Get some rest and be ready to hit the ground running tomorrow morning.
And TexB, you have a great time with RevDeb. I so enjoyed talking with her, hope you two have a blast taking in the sights tomorrow.
CNN is hiring Savage to cover gay issues.
-GSD
I missed you too, Ian. I did meet newstouer and Marcy!
Mommybrain, you have a good trip! As far as punaise goes, they do have computers in France…
neokneme @ 255
LOL – but had you done that, nobody would have asked very many questions. We got caught heavily invested in travel-related investments the next month.
GSD @ 264
Only If I get to operate the metaphorical guillotine.
Rayne @ 258
Peter would be proud.
Night Rayne.
Loo Hoo. @ 268
Better and cheaper High Speed ‘Puters!!!
Ed*ard Teller @ 256
Will we ever see the day where she’s asking the questions on CNN ?
I agree that the venue was horrible. Everything was spread apart so much that it became a chore to go from one room to the next. I got so many blisters on my feet but the front desk of the Hyatt had no bandaids, if you can believe that. I heard right before I left that they were available for sale in the coffee shop. A medium coffee and a blain bagel was almost $8.00 Room service was an additional $3.00 above the menu price and a 21% gratuity. So, my two eggs with sausage and potatos was $20.00, without coffee. I had no coffee pot in my room. The third day I was told by housekeeping that you have top request it because people steal them, which I believe is a bunch of crap. They would rather take your $3.50 for a medium coffee. There was a patio area for smokers which was never cleaned up all day. It was like a disaster area even at noon today. I only got to meet a handful of people from FDL. I wish we had FDL stickers on the backside of our badges, at least. My tab was $536.00 this morning for 3 nights, on breakfast with no coffee, and one day of internet access for $9.95 per 24 hours. Can you imagine a blogger convention without wifi? Only free internet connection in McCormick Place, next door to the Hotel. The Hyatt has to make as much money as possible. Even one star hotels have wifi for their customers. Other than that, it was okay. It was great to see all of the candidates. The Teamsters gave us a hell of a nice Barbeque. I just wish that FDLers would have sent an email or something for a meetup. I was disappointed I didn’t meeet you TSF. I would have liked to. Glad you are home safe and sound and I agree I would have rather given the money to Act Blue.
Rayne @ 267
You’re in Canada ?
Petrocelli @ 274
She wouldn’t dare cross over to the Dark Side!!! *g*
Loo Hoo. @ 269
You met a bunch of people Loo Hoo, and they remenber meeting you.
:_)
The highlight of my experience last year – sitting in the hallways of the Riviera in Vegas, most of us plugged in to the too-few outlets and talking with firedogs everywhere. Ian, RevDeb, Newton(?), Teddy, Katymine, Stirling Newberry and many many others.
Rinse. Repeat.
Ted; let’s save a little bandwidth here.
Fuckin’ A! :o)
Petrocelli @ 275
No, but we may see the day by about 2009 where enough people watch her asking questions on the web that CNN becomes almost inconsequential. Which gets us back to TSF’s exclamation about YK2. It doesn’t have to be about the money, folks, if our ends meet fairly comfortably, and we get our honest message out there.
Sounds like Ykos turned into an ordinary event with the passion sucked out of it. Expensive and lacking in imagination. Or am I being too too.
Go to New Orleans next year. Everyone can have real fun and witness the mess that is not cleaned up yet. It will put the mojo back in everyone’s anger. And I can go since I have a place to stay.
Mommybrain @ 280
Aye, I was sad you weren’t able to make it this year.
Teddy SanFran, I love you.
sparky @ 16
Then I could attend if so inclined.
I recommend NH next year.
-GSD
marymccurnin @ 282
I actually had a good time. There are things that definitely sucked, but it wasn’t a disaster. I’d even say it was a success.
But… it wasn’t as good as last year, or as good as it should have been or quite easily could have been. Hopefully they’ll fix it next year.
TeddySanFran @ 192
Is the liveblogging panel available online? I couldn’t find it on Ustream.tv, but maybe I didn’t look hard enough.
Bob in HI
Ed*ard Teller @ 281
The unvarnished Truth! Nothing more, nothing less!!! *sigh*
Ian Welsh @ 289
Next year should be San Francisco which has the most perfect weather in August and everyone has so much fun in that great city.
The time for shitting pickles is nigh.
Read the second paragraph…….
-GSD
So, here’s what I’m getting from today’s visit to the Lake:
YKos sucked. Why? One reason is that it was too much like the tradMedia.
How to make it better? Don’t have it in Chicago. There’s no question in my mind, it should be in Washington D.C.
It should have major music. Go back and listen to Crosby Stills Nash and Young. We need Phil Ochs. We need Bob Dylan.
It should be understood that the convention –YKos or whatever it will be called next year — is an abject failure unless it concludes with a march to the white house.
The netroots phenomenon is big enough that it is time to talk about something other than the netroots phenomenon. And Democratic presidential candidates speaking at YK’07 doesn’t change my perception that not enough came out of YK’07 in the way of a co-ordinated strategy for change. (If I am wrong, please correct me.)
The blogosphere is not a parallel universe to the MSM. It is a different beast. For one thing, it is collaborative, rather than competitive. (Put aside competition for Zeds.) It is natural for the MSM to see us through the prism of their experience. And then to try to co-opt the ‘nets.
I would love to go on, but the Republican debate is on, and I need to smash my television.
Time to agree on a strategy for change.
Twain @ 290
Yes! And I have a place to stay there, too.
CTuttle @ 278
No, I meant that she gets so much exposure that the public wakes up and demand more real journalists.
GSD @ 291
That is no way to talk about the first lady.
GSD @ 291
Why not? George shits Pickles every day….
Interesting – TSF mentions Alaska, the GOP debate mentions Alaska. Usually forgotten unless there’s a disaster there. Maybe people will begin understanding the place soon. I know I’m still trying…
GSD @ 292
This is TurdBlossom’s idea of a charm-offensive.
They’re back.
I wouldn’t shit Pickles, she’s too big a turd.
-GSD
Thank you and Good night.
I hear echoes of our dismay at what happens when we send our annointed elected off to the Factory in DC: they fall off their pedestals.
As our Air America station tags it: Progressive is the new mainstream.
I didn’t think it sucked though. I met a lot of really nice people and I thought it was very well organized and I’d have to say it was a success. For me, at least. But the Hyatt was not a good choice, IMO. I don’t mind spending money but it would have been nice if the Hyatt had spent some also.
Night GSD
TeddySanFran @ 34
One thing that’s different about this medium, as opposed to broadcast and print media, is that it changes very fast. When I look at old bookmarks files I’m reminded how true that is. The reason it’s changing so fast is that once you’re on the Internet, it’s much less expensive to put the word out than it is in other media. You don’t need to buy transmitters, and you don’t even need to buy or rent a building and a printing press. You publish by uploading formatted text.
So I think the good news is that this medium will work around the need for money better than the others have, at least for a few more years. After that, I’m sure everything will be different anyway.
“E-mail addresses for American individuals were found on the same password-protected e-mail chains used by the United Kingdom plotters to communicate with Qaeda handlers in Europe,”
In light of the recently passed bills and the newly minted authority……
-GSD
GSD @ 291
This is the main source for that story:
“Mr. Gadahn, who has been on the FBI’s most wanted list since 2004, was born and raised in rural California and was a devotee of death-metal music before joining Al Qaeda, according to a profile of him earlier this year in the New Yorker.”
Hmmm…!!!
The best part was meeting Jane & Christy for me. Gotta turn in or suffer from JetLag at work tomorrow. Nite all.
Petrocelli @ 294
Dood, you’re more of an optimist than I??? *gasp*
(waving g’nite to all the sleepy pups leaving)
Cujjo359 @ 304
Another thing Howard Dean mentioned – the internet being as great an intervention as the printing press.
Just a few words about venues for large conferences. Please feel free to disagree.
I belong to a fairly large guild whose membership is 95% women. There are only 22 hotels with sufficient rooms and space to host us in the United States, and the yearly conference has been going on for over 20 years at this point. The reason why it’s so hard to find a venue? Women don’t spend as much money, evidently. Hotels don’t want groups that won’t spend money in their restaurants and bars, whose attendees split rooms to save costs, etcetera. There’s also the added issue of who’s covering the room block, rental fees, and the unbelievable logistics of planning a conference for 1000 people.
The college idea sounds great, but would there be food available? How about colleges that would turn down the group because (after all,) some alumni might not like a blogger gathering at the school in question?
As far as airfare is concerned, picking a venue in Chicago isn’t as bad as it could be. It’s a few hours from everywhere in the country, and it’s a major travel hub. I would have much rather gone to Chicago than to the conference I attended last month in Dallas, for instance.
It doesn’t sound like a great time was had at the McCormick Place Hyatt, but if you have suggestions on how it could be better, please offer your assistance to the planning committee for next year’s Netroots Nation. I’m sure they could use all the help they can get.
-S
Mad Dogs @ 76
It did a lot more than provide a “legal framework,” IIRC– didn’t it actually absolve WH personnel from any FISA-related crimes that may have been committed since 2001? That’s the wording I want to see.
BTW, Nancy Pelosi’s letter to Conyers asking for an immediate fix to the law as soon as Congress reconvenes is back online. If interested, I’d suggest making a copy of it, in case it gets taken down.
Bob in HI
CTuttle @ 305
Yep sounds like those fierce Miami terrotists, the guys who were going to blow up the New Jersey airport by blowing up gas lines, and the group of untrained amateurs with small arms who were going to attack a US Army base. Yep. I’m quaking in my boots.
As to the email addresses, I am quite certain they have been mining ALL electronic communications for several years.
I am not shitting pickles about AQ, I ams shitting pickles because the path has been paved now for anyone to be suspect because your e-mail address appears somewhere.
Got your address book hacked and your e-mail sent to some jamoke in Nigeria, say hello Fredo.
-GSD
Big Mitch, you’re on to something with the idea of having it in DC. I love the idea of the march.
And yes, there’s something about music that brings people together and makes an event more memorable. Doesn’t have to be the old protest songs, but something that people are familiar with. Maybe old songs and new ones.
GSD @ 305
CTuttle @ 307
They forgot to add, “Mr Gadahn, who voted for Howard Dean, wrote for Daily Kos, had posters of JFK and Jimmy Carter in his room, and hates puppies…”
Big Brother is watching. Literally. The Dems gave him the greenlight over the weekend. They’re cranking it up a few notches now.
I created a Dem metaphor earlier:
Hillary – Humvee
Obama – VW Jetta station wagon
Edwards – Prius
I’ll make a GOP Iowa debate metaphor:
McCain – Hudson
Brownback – Crosley
Giuliani – Studebaker
Hunter – IH Scout
Tancredo – Fraser
Thompson – Nash Rambler
Romney – DeSoto station wagon
Paul – Nash Metropolitan
I forgot Huckabee – Edsel
marymccurnin @ 296
Aargh, you got me, Mary … went and read the article before I realized what you really meant … *g*
ccmask @ 276
Sorry I missed you too!
GSD @ 316
And once on “the list” there is nothing that they won’t know about you. Then, one day, you will disappear.
bigmitch@293
thanks for expressing what i tried to say earlier…whats next…..?
Secret warrant, sorry Mam, can’t talk about it.
-GSD
montag @ 21
very important word/concept:
co-opting.
we should never forget it.
Just wanted to say THANKS, TeddySanFran — thank you for shelling out the ridiculous $um$ for water, & bananas, & bed, so that we who are equally outraged but cannot (for whatever reason) make it to the annual netroots mecca, can know what transpired, and how we need to create a different mecca next year. And THANKS for telling us, from your heart, what you thought of it. We need that, badly.
Swimming against the tide, or upstream, or whatever, absolutely REQUIRES that we have scouts like you to remind us that the effort is vitally worth it — as well as what to avoid, so that we are not sapped by those who would seek to divert us.
Ed*ard Teller @ 319
McCain is definately a Pinto
marymccurnin @ 283
NPR? or some MSM report said that YKos was sounding like what you’d hear at any Iowa Caucus, except there was a lot more energy!
I really like the idea of having the convention in NOLA next year. But NOLA in August perhaps isn’t the best choice regarding temperature and humidity. . . .
Bob in HI
GSD @ 314
Hey, Alfredo, Analyze this!!! *g*
Oh, and Ralph Nader – Chevrolet Corvair…..sorry, Ralph.
Hey TSF – you see how high the #’s are on the right side? (hint hint)
ET, I thick Huckabee should have been the Nash Metropolitan, because that car reminds me of Huckleberry Hound.
CTuttle @ 308
According to Bill Gates, Television as we know it is headed for extinction and the internet is at the forefront of technology. If Jane does a few video interviews online with the candidates and it goes viral, it could catch the attention of the MSM … more audience means more $$$ for their bottomline.
And yes, I am an optimist … the alternative doesn’t seem like a lot of fun …
Ed*ard Teller @ 330
Nice touch.
Ed*ard Teller @ 330
Excellent metaphors, ET !!!
Was this taking place at the Hyatt O’Hare? *blinks* If it is? and it happens next or some other year? Suggestion. Bring your OWN suppplies. A rice cooker for one, and snacks of all types.
That place is notorious for sneakup charges. Crazy for conventions but it’s also the only place that can handle 12,000 or so anime geeks in one weekend and stay standing. That way we dont’ raid the ambush pricing fridge and by bringing our own supplies we seldom go and eat anything out of the overpriced ’snack bar’.
Well, it is bed time for me. Take care and enjoy the snark.
argosfalcon @ 58
THAT’S teh ticket …..
bonkers @ 316
As I recall, Gadahn was the rather young son of a goat farmer outside of Riverside, CA, and was minor trouble even before he went to Pakistan (although he seems not to have actually done anything except make anti-American statements on al-Qaeda-produced tapes, for which he was indicted on treason charges).
Just because someone was able to beat his name out of Khalid Sheik Mohammed doesn’t exactly mean he’s the mastermind of much of anything….
Petrocelli @ 333
Dang I hate you’re reasoning…!!! *g*
DrDick @ 337
Goodnight, Sir !
The MSM doesn’t get it. They can’t see the revolution occuring right under their noses….
….neither can the dead or dying pachyderms. *g*
bonkers @ 326
Yup, rear-end him and he goes up in flames….
CTuttle @ 340
I grew up amongst a lot of very strong women and an incredibly wise dad.
Nite, Dr(pause)D!!!
Thanks, Mitch, Petrocelli!
My dad bought a Hudson, a Fraser, two Studebakers, an Edsel a Rambler and an IH Scout in succession. In 1968, when he bought a Mercedes, only IH (and maybe – marginally – Rambler) was still in business. I told him I was tempted to write Mercedes and warn them.
Prairie Sunshine @ 60
we need to give serious money to John Edwards, Now.
its my beddy-bye – good night all on the lake and welcome back TSF – thoughtful post ;o)
Petrocelli @ 344
It takes a wise one to tangle horns…!!!
Ed*ard Teller @ 346
LOL !!!
There are still a few Scouts around in the Great White North.
CTuttle @ 349
… and a truly wise one to have better sense than to fight with the fairer sex … you can never win … *g*
Petrocelli @ 351
Never! It’s always a Pyrrhic victory, shall one succeed!!! *g*
Bob Schacht @ 312
I just made a copy. I’ll add it to my blog later. Thanks.
secret warrants
(old (’78) hat for the FISA)
secret courts
secret evidence
secret trials
secret prisons
secret prisoners
secret torture
not so long ago there was a USA i knew that opposed the Soviet System of gulags.
i fight for that USA.
Re the Cheney question on the ABC debate –
McCain “I’d be very careful that everyone understood that there is only one president.”
Thompson – totally dodges question…”honorable individual” … moves on
Ghooliani – “He can use VP Cheney the way he sees fit” – that’s a dodge.
Romney – “depends on the person…”
Brownback – “president over-relied on that…not somebody who takes over that job”
Paul – “we have drifted…”
Hunter – “We’re all in this together. I would not share the role of Commander-in-Chief”
Cujjo359 @ 353
Thanks Cujo, I missed this when Bob commented.
Mitch, have you seen this letter ?
Ed*ard Teller @ 346
excellent tale.
thanks
yellowdog jim @ 354
I served twenty years for that principle!!!
I’ve patrolled both; the East German Fence, and, the North Korean Fence in the dead of winter!!!
newtonusr, I’ve been racking my feeble brain trying to figure out who else I met…
Woo Hoo, Zed!!!
http://www.firedoglake.com/200…..y-chicago/
CTuttle,
No we didn’t. We served the people of the USA, the US Constitution and our comrades. In December, 1966, a group of warrant officers in my aviation company burnt the pictures of the SecDef and Sec of the Army in a little bonfire behind our barracks at Ft. Lewis. The CO had the enlisted men stand guard duty on the new set of chain-of-command pictures in the hall outside the company office until somebody was supposed to come forward to turn in the offenders. We didn’t.
New thread.
CTuttle @ 358
my dad was an air force officer ww2/cold warrior.
i am very proud of his service, and the service of all our men and women in our armed forces.
Now the Soviet System is gone,
but we run our own gulags.
Abu Ghraib just changed management.
now we are the torturers.
we are the war criminals.
Petrocelli @ 350
I know of several in NM.
Studebakers…were those the cars that kind of looked the same coming and going?
Petrocelli @ 356
In fact, “later” happened pretty quickly for once.
As I noted, this looks like an extra reason to let your congresscritters know how you feel about their votes yesterday and Friday.
Rayne @ 207
GSD @ 292
“…may be loose in the American homeland.” that’s the one that got me…
Ed*ard Teller @ 318
one of those ‘pubs should ‘a been an Edsel ……
montag @ 343
i’d pay a nickel to watch that ……
great post teddy
thank you Teddy for saying everything I think….after awhile all this stuff piles up too high and someone needs to knock it over and step all over it then kick it to the side…this making nice business just makes me nice – and SICK
fahrender @ 368
Gee… that Michael Chertoff must be psychic!
Next summer, go with a university or college with dorms. Many of them host these kind of events in summer and make a buck. Making about $200K or so for a weekend and attracting presidential candidates/senators, etc to the campus for a weekend retreat would be quite attractive for many universities.
And imagine, participants can stay in co-ed dorms. :-)
I didn’t attend YKos, but have the impression that there seemed to be a pervasive theme of “making nice with the mainstream media.”
Why? They are mostly incompetent assholes, and their stock is dropping by the day.
Very disturbing post. Having lived in Chicago I was puzzled by their choice of McCormak Place. It’s cavernous and isolated from the city and the people. Strange choice. Also disturbing to hear that there is a desire to make nice with the MSM. IMO they are as much to blame for the mess we’re in as the Republican Party. Why not make nice with the Bush Administration?
ecoast @ 374
College accomodations have improved radically since I last stayed in a dorm. My local university has just built a Hyatt. When I went with a friend to a class reunion, there were at least two hotels on campus. Quality hotels are seen as both a moneymaker and a way to accommodate alumni quite nicely. Colleges these days have so many events: Homecoming, reunions, college sports, graduations. I suspect colleges too, are starting to see more clearly the opportunity in conventions as well. They can now accommodate professional seminars, organizational meetings, and other events too small or obscure for the downtown convention centers to handle.
Colleges are often located in low-traffic areas with amenities and sightseeing places within a short walk from campus. They have rooms of varying sizes. They can offer blocks of rooms and a “cafeteria plan” for meals, have built-in services and reasonable prices.
As for food, just about no college closes entirely over the summer. There are international students, whether or not they live on campus, who need to eat. Adult students go through the summer and need to eat. Then there’s the employees and football players..and you get the idea. So the college cafeteria and eateries stay open if even for reduced hours. Also, in the communities and neighborhoods next to campus, there are restaurants.
I wouldn’t worry about alumni objections too much. Alumni most of the time know that colleges have to stay pretty neutral regarding the events they have on campus.
Bottled water is mostly a tremendous evil scam. The amount of energy used to manufacture and transport it, and the oil used to make the plastic, are such that each bottle is effectively about 1/4 full of oil. And, it’s made regionally which means it will have the same regional bugs as the tap water, except that bugs (yes including crypto) are removed through treatment and filtration. Dissolved solids are harder to remove with filtering (that takes reverse osmosis) and if my home tap water had that problem I’d probably try to a solar distiller. I won’t say I never drink bottled water, but it’s only as a convenience, or as a last resort, or as a way to spend money on purpose (i.e. I want to sit around at a cafe, but don’t want to drink any coffee or soft drinks, so I’ll order bottled water in order to fork over some cash and be a customer). If I were concerned about bugs in the local water, I’d bring a camping filter, some of which are pocket sized.
The part about Matt Bai moderating that debate just sounds nuts though. Aren’t we trying to replace the MSM? There are any number of bloggers who could have done it. If one with journalistic cred is needed, Josh Marshall immediately comes to mind.
Last years DFA was held at SDSU in San Diego. While it was cheaper room wise, it was a huge campus with miles between the meetings and events. But they were accommodating food wise off campus and on.
Cozumel, I agree with you!!! For Ciro Rodrguez, who we all fought for to return to the Congress to have him vote for this warrantless wiretapping anti Constitutional piece of legislation is an insult to the district. He will hear from me.
Bondage. What great fun when there is a strong love relationship not so much when a true sadist gets involved. Who will be in charge? The one who can tolerate the most pain? The MSM is completely bound up. The binders are so totally strung out on their drug/power the agreement/rule of law has become lost. The submissive has passed out, the RACK lost and another victim/partner has arrived. Net roots meet your new masters. Did anyone seriously not understand that MSM is just a willing victim? That the masters’ would/could not let an alternative narrative go unbound? There are in existence only 2 things. Power must have an anti-power in order to grow. Their methods have worked well in the past. Why would they not employ them again on the bloggersphere? And how could you hope to have a successful BDSM when you hold their last victim in almost total distain?
I was there, too, and I have to agree about the venue — too big and spread out, the bar was too small and too expensive.
That being said, I had an amazing time and met some amazing people, including Jane, Christy and Pach.
Hopefully they can do better on the venue next year.
Olbermann should have moderated the forum (although he is doing the AFL-CIO one tomorrow night in Chicago). If not the forum, it would have been great to have him there doing something — maybe he could have come to Chicago a few days early.
spiderpaws @ 372
Bravo to you, too. I tire of the fawning and pandering. Sometimes plain speaking says it best.
Well said, Teddy.
neokneme @ 82
Wow! Now that’s a story we’ve gotta keep an eye on.
Is it ‘the biggest theft in world history’ or just an unintended disaster?
spurious @ 90
Honesty (with others) is not an exceptionally important quality for politics. It’s like the joke George Burns told about making it in movies — he said it was all about “sincerity” and once you could fake that you’re gonna succeed.
Honesty seems important, but we need presidents who can lie out their wazoos with complete aplomb. If they couldn’t we wouldn’t trust them to be capable of doing ANYTHING to protect us and our Civilization.
I know it’s odd, but that’s life.
bonkers @ 108
I read about the plastic bottles being bad for landfills. How might we suggest water should be packaged to avoid that problem while still making it (and many other kinds of drinks) available to the masses?
Remember, you’re not a nanny, so just be a friend to our less well-informed neighbors.
Rayne @ 221
No doubt it’s part of their on-going plan to destroy unions.
aliasofwestgate @ 336
What I’ve learned from trips like that is that you have to go out to the city and find a WalMart or Target or something and buy bulk water, food, etc. and store it in your room(s) and only go out to eat dinner. Don’t buy into their “we’ve got you trapped” concept.
Marilyn In Texas @ 380
I don’t know why, but I sense the hand of Rahm Emanuel in this. Does anyone know of his involvement?