Yesterday the spouse and I went to the Washington County Fair just east of the Twin Cities. It’s a nice little county fair of the sort you’d expect from a suburb/exurb of a major metropolitan area. One of the big draws: The tandem horse pull.
Hey, what can I say? I may be a city girl, but I’m only a generation removed from the soil.
Oh, and to repeat what Christy posted below: It’s time to hit the phone lines, boys and girls. The House will be taking up the FISA legislation — and I refuse to allow the Constitution and probable cause to go down without a fight. So let’s hit the phones, shall we? (H/T to katymine for the numbers)
1 (800) 828 – 0498
1 (800) 459 – 1887
1 (800) 614 – 2803
1 (866) 340 – 9281
1 (866) 338 – 1015
1 (877) 851 – 6437
Please take some time today to call your elected representative and tell them that you don’t trust the Bush Administration, and neither should they. And while you are at it, let the leadership know that as well:
Speaker Nancy Pelosi, (202) 225-4965
Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, (202) 225-4131
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County and state fairs can really be OK. Oklahomans love fairs and bein’ close to the dirt. ;0)
I learnt to plow behind horses and well remember when the first tractor came to our area. Our horses knew what they were doing so did not need a lot of input, especially from a a raw youth.
A more peaceful time from my memories. I enjoy going to our local fair and seeing these giant, gentle, beasts doing their thing and they do not need bloody oil bought by too many deaths to fuel them.
I did some volunteer work at the 4H Fair last week, It was fun.
MN. on a stick:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-5Lr2IhB_o
OT The Fisa fiasco last night was a clear indication that the Democrats either do not have the majority or are not ruthless enough to hold the majority in crucial instances. The idea of bowing to the evil ba**ard in the WH is beyond my understanding. A total caving in to this incredibly dishonest, traitorous group is so out of range of my comprehension I have no idea what to do. Phone calls, emails and land based letters obviously no effect. A revolution is needed to counteract the coup. I am absolutely furious with the lot of them.
My favorite is mule jumping.
It has to be seen to be believed.
My Grandfather farmed with horses until 1945 and I think he was never the same after tractors arrived.(near Comfrey Minnesota)
He had a team so well trained that they would mow 20 acres of hay by themselves. He farmed till he was 75 by which I was 10. The saddest day of my life at that point was the farm sale in 1964. Thanks for the memories PW!
Good morning Phoenix Woman!
nomolos @ 5
Did you call them?
1 (800) 828 – 0498
1 (800) 459 – 1887
1 (800) 614 – 2803
1 (866) 340 – 9281
1 (866) 338 – 1015
1 (877) 851 – 6437
Please take some time today to call your elected representative and tell them that you don’t trust the Bush Administration, and neither should they. And while you are at it, let the leadership know that as well:
Speaker Nancy Pelosi, (202) 225-4965
Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, (202) 225-4131
Phoenix Woman @ 9
I sure did, or tried anyway, answering machines are not good conversationalists. I also sent email to my Congressperson.
Prospero @ 6
Ah. Here it is.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kO-ULQOzV6s
Is this a great war or what?
Sheiks as ‘Security Contractors’ for U.S.
In Iraq, a Perilous Alliance With Former Enemies
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..id=topnews
nomolos @ 10
Call the third number down, and this ask to talk to Betty McCollum. Betty McCollum’s staffers are around and talking to people — and they’re astonished at what’s happening.
According to McCollum’s staffer, the bill version Bush most wants — the one giving AGAG oversight — is the one least likely to pass.
Prospero @ 11
Oooh! Nice!
any connection between the picture of dumb animals at the top and the plea to call Congresscritters?
edit: no offense meant to lovers of real animals
Well, I have to take off for a bit. Hang out here or with Christy and do ring up a few numbers in between looking at the pretty horsies and OK Kiddo’s Minnesota State Fair video!
jayt @ 15
Heh!
When you call, tell ‘em people are talking “primary challengers”.
PW – you are a powerhouse! I think you’re single-handedly holding down FDL here. (no aspersions against the fine folks who are also on board, but Our Girl From Minnesota is going the extra mile here!)
both machines are of course full. what else can we do?
Well I just read S.1927.ES at http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/thomas
It’s a short read and obviously dangerous. Feingold is correct… they are simply trying to suspend the constitution and hand over enormous powers to the DNI and AG.
Called worthless Maloney (D-NYC). Person answering phone was clerk, not legislative aide, none of whom were around. So he took my message that she should not vote for any measure giving President Bush power to do warrantless wiretapping. With that, and a subway card, I can get around the city. Off the email the (laughingly-referred-to-as) leaders.
dexx @ 19
email. I usually use the C-SPAN website as my starting point.
Sending snail mail would be more dramatic,but these days I think the DHS holds all congresscritter mail because of all the anthrax scares after 9/11.(and btw,WHY doesn’t anyone pursue that mystery? People did die from that)It’s too bad,because there’s alot of things one could send via the mail for dramatic effect(personally I was thinking fishnet stockings and cheap lipstick).
Well, the Media Player just shuffled “Not Ready to Make Nice” and the theme from the Soprano’s back-to-back, so I guess that’s my sign to get busy.
as advised above, i called Betty McCollum’s office and spoke to a saffer as well. i thanked them for actually working and had a nice conversation where i of course expressed my anger about this fisa situation and had a nice long conversation which i then had to end lest my rage at the “dlc” wing of the democratic party boil over and disgrace me on the phone.
sigh…
anangryoldbroad @ 23
How about post cards w/ pictures of the lipstick and fishnets telling them to quit trying to dress up the pig?
To assume that it is a lack of spine on the part of some Democrats is false, these decisions reflect their beliefs.
How about postcards that call for “primary challengers.”
It’s getting time to stop “making nice.”
dakine01 @ 26
Snail mail to D.C. office does get held up – not to the local offices though. Problem is, (at least with my Sen’s), the local offices don’t seem to give a damn about national issues, just local stuff.
Post cards get straight through to D.C. though.
I called and spoke to an answering machine – which I suspect will have little impact. But I did it anyway to make myself feel better.
We need to stop kidding ourselves about this Democratic Congress. They will do nothing to stop BushCo. Hell, they can’t stop enabling him, let alone stopping him.
How about postcards with Osama on them with the words “I won. You surrendered to George Bush. How noble of you.”
An ACLU person was quoted in the WaPo today describing the Democrats as Pavlovian: Bush says “terrorism” and they roll over and play dead.
It is appalling.
YK2 streaming panel is talking about New Orleans. My heart is breaking again.
Is the Senate now finished, and off to vacation?
There’s nothing on C-Span from the Senate this morning – just the House.
EllenG @ 30
It’s past time to stop electing millionaires into office. Being a Public Servant doesn’t mean the public is your servant. All of our Senators are millionaires,most of the House is. That,IMO is a HUGE part of the problem. It’s about protecting asses and fortunes,none of which are OURS.
oddmommy @ 32
It is. We have ABSOLUTELY NO proof that there is today a terrorism threat … except what these LIARS are telling us.
We only know what LIARS are telling us. And Congress believes these LIARS!
I am so sick of this shit.
And the threats that they do “expose” to us are laughable entrapments of clueless adventurists.
Reid’s D.C. mailbox is full.
Looks like, after going to his web-site, the Senate *is* supposed to be in session later today.
not that we need it but, if you want to get fired up just go watch the video of Howard Dean’s speech to Yearly Kos.
as for farming and draft animals, my grandfather was a share cropper and toll gate keeper in north alabama where he plowed with mules before he moved his family to knoxville, tennessee in a wagon. my mother who was four at the time always had a fear of water as they had to ford a stream that was deep enough to come up into the wagon during the journey.
most every saturday there was a “mule day” in columbia, tennessee where they sold, bargained and traded mules. i don’t know when they stopped having it but imagine it was in the early fifties. i saw a few of those events when i was a kid …….
OT, in yesterday’s WaPo EJ Dionne pointed out that Ykos and by inference the blogs are a tool for motivating. It’s time now for YKos and other progressive blogs to begin to motivate people to get out on the streets to apply pressure directly to Congress. If one reads history, it’s astounding to see how opposition parties in the Reichstag rolled over bit by bit to the demands of Hitler. The opposition thought that the time to resist lay off in the future when the political situation would be more to their advantage. By the time they tried to do anything it was too late. The Reichstag had become irrelavent. This is what is happening in Washington today. If the blogs are going to have any effect then they have to considere adopting the tactic of direct action. Get people off their asses and out into the streets!
I called Chris Murphy’s office, and they said he is still considering the bill and taking calls. So please, anyone of his constituents from CT, call now.
Pelosi’s D.C. mailbox is full.
Democrats have become as corrupt as Republicans. They both bank on us voting as reflexive partisans and as long as we do there will be no meaningful change. IMHO if this nation is to be rescued it will be a third party that does it.
anangryoldbroad @ 35
The problem is that you have to be rich to afford to run for Congress — if you’re not, you’re forced to suck up to the rich to get campaign money.
The solution? Taking the money out.
I cannot phone in, but I have been emailing like crazy. GRRRR!!!!
Comparison of the 109th (GOP) and 110th (Dem) Congresses
fdl reader @ 36
So if they were able to discern this alleged terrorist threat with the powers they now have, why do they need more powers? Hmmm?
So, what’s on the docket today (literally)? Is the FISA update over to the House?
Anybody have a sense of Rep. Gillebrand (NY) as far as principles, courage, and beholdenness (is that a word?)?
Phoenix Woman @ 44
Amen. Can’t happen fast enough. But we’re going to have to get collectively mad enough to override the power those with money are wielding at present. Bah!
Senator Bayh’s (who also rolled over) mailbox still has room, though I just used up some of it.
Pelosi’s email is sf.nancy@mail.house.gov
To get to Reid, I had to go thru webform. Got autoreplys from both.
Oh, and if you want to vent at Klobuchar, her campaign office number is 1 888 714 2006.
also in the Post today (style section) some drivel about how the poor old congresscritters all can’t wait to go on recess. Seems they’re all tired and bummed out and want their mommies. Boo-fucking-hoo.
Phoenix Woman @ 52
I am surprised by her vote. Any explanation?
Great column from the Star Tribune: LINK
Phoenix Woman @ 52
Just left her a piece of my mind, concluding with: netroots will find better candidates in the future if you’re going to vote the way you did on FISA.
eCAHNomics @ 51
I hate being reduced to sending e-mails only.
Hi guys!
I’m in the front row for Hillary!!! I’ll get pictures up later. TexB is teaching me how. I know a lot of you don’t like Hillary, but I can’t tell you how excited I am! (Don’t tell RevDeb…)
I still haven’t seen TRex, and I have his birthday present.
More of Coleman’s column:
My husband and I both called Mike Arcuri’s office and encouraged him to vote NO on the Senate version of FISA coming down to them and to stand tall against the Administration and support the Constitution. We both got to speak to real staffers in his office (and we both thanked them a lot for being there to answer our calls). I also emailed Pelosi – and told her that the House is our last hope of holding the line on giving the Administration the right to suspend the Constitution of the US. I asked her to rally all the Democrats to hold the line against the lies of the Administration and told her in no uncertain terms that by voting NO, they would not be “soft of terrorism” but would be STRONG on the Constitution.
Nothing like getting all hot and bothered on a Saturday.
And, though I did not grow up on a farm, my husband and I raised sheep and dairy goats at our place here in the Southern Tier for years. We only got out because of people allowing their dogs to run wild. Between the “Death Cat” and the mules, we seem to be having animal day here…;)
Loo Hoo. @ 58
I’ll be counting how many times she gets booed. I believe it’s going to be streamed: http://ustream.tv/channel/year…..ntion-2007
Loo Hoo. @ 58
Hi guys!
I’m in the front row for Hillary!!! I’ll get pictures up later. TexB is teaching me how. I know a lot of you don’t like Hillary, but I can’t tell you how excited I am! (Don’t tell RevDeb…)
I still haven’t seen TRex, and I have his birthday present.
Any word as to whether Harry Reid will show his face?
Loo Hoo. @ 58
well of course it is exciting! Enjoy.
LooHoo –
If you actually get close enough to Hillary to talk to her, please tell her that the Southern Tier of New York State thanks her for her strong “no” vote (her and Chuck Schumer..woohoo) on FISA. I know a lot of folks hate her guts and see her as Bush lite, but she did the right thing here.
Nothing yet, Jayt. The morning panel had to be cancelled.
Ecahn, how did Hillary vote on FISA?
This poor-pitiful-me tale will not make you any happier: “Desperate for a Reprieve from Capitol Punishment.” Lanny Davis is especially full of it. Every American working his/her butt off to pay these phonies’ salaries should read this and run to a voting booth the next time an election comes up and give the fools a reprieve.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..099_2.html
Oh good, Toby!!!
Toby Wollin @ 64
what’t the Southern Tier? I grew up in NYC and I’ve never heard that b4.
Is it Long Island?
Fern @ 47
Ding! Ding! Ding!
My brainstorming today is centering around TWO definite strategies:
1) “primary challengers” now.
2) dismantling this terror shit ~ these are LIES being told to us by LIARS and it’s driving what is happening today in Congress! It was unbelievable but now it’s even being picked up in the MSM!
Just a drive by.
Glenn Greenwald has a column up today on the FISA debacle and places responsibility for it squarely with the Democrats.
http://www.salon.com/opinion/g…..index.html
I have to say I agree. This whole FISA mess is ill considered and poorly thought through. Pelosi and Reid could have and should have handled it so many other ways. Democrats were elected in November 2006 to oppose Bush. Instead they have chosen to enable his worst excesses, first on Iraq, now on FISA. This is a self-inflicted wound. I would ask when will Democrats ever learn but the answer is they like Republicans never do. Thanks, Reid and Pelosi for nothing.
Toby Wollin @ 64
Q for those who are in the know. Does Reid manage which Ds have to vote for FISA & which get to vote no? I.E., did Hillary get to vote no because she’s running for prez & needs to suck up to the base, but Klobuchar had to vote yes because her vote was needed to pass the legislation & she’s not up for reelction for another 5-plus years?
Gonzo needs to go if Bush wants this law so bad whats more important the nation’s security or Gonzo’s job.
I can’t believe the Democrats caved in 70% support for ending the war they can do whatever they want! Just how much reassurance do the Senate Democrats need to build up their confidence? I used to think Republicans were insecure but compared to Senate Democrats after last nights performance…well a mountain of v**gr* couldn’t help them.
Where are Hilary and Obama on this I want my future Presidents who are in the Senate to denounce this craven caving in to this false Either you vote for my bill. Or if we get attacked its your fault choice.
How about some pushback Democrats how about you know its funny Mr President how when ever your in trouble or want Congress to take away the freedoms of the Consitituion we always seem to have a terror alert. Are YOU coordinating your political stategy with Al Quieda? Or are you ussing terror threats to bully your way into getting what you want!
“We have nothing to fear but Fear itself” FDR remember that Senate Democrats or Hilary and Obama can forget about being president!
eCAHNomics @ 71
holy sh*t. If that’s how it works I am REALLY gonna be sick.
Oldmommy – that’s Southern Tier, not the South Shore (grin).
If you look at a map of the State of New York, the Southern Tier basically is the long straight border that runs along the northern border of PA. This is where the cities of Binghamton, Elmira, Corning and Jamestown can be found.
Loo Hoo. @ 65
Nothing yet, Jayt. The morning panel had to be cancelled.
Have fun today!
Does the FISA thing still have to go through the house? Is it a temporary measure just for August?
Called my Rep. Jerry Nadler (Upper Westside, don’tcha know). He will, I am sure, do the right thing, and I got to speak to an actual real person. Pelosi’s and Stoyer’s offices are closed. Their mail boxes are full and you can’t leave a message. Good Work Folks!
Toby Wollin @ 74
Ah. Actually my daughter is just today coming home from sleep away camp up around there. I drove her up two weeks ago……it is beautiful country.
A new study from a Yale scholar tries to explain why the image of a tough Hillary Clinton may not resonate with voters. But the findings, which suggest angry men are rewarded in American leadership roles while angry women are penalized, may do more to explain the unlikely rise of George W. Bush.
For the details, see:
“The Secret to Bush’s Success? The Angry Man Theory.”
AZ Matt @ 59
everybody should read Coleman’s piece. he nails it, and the Republicans are screaming up there over his last piece. wait til they read this one!
behindthefall @ 48
S. 1927 was referred to the House last night.
Hillary is tough enough to handle a few “boos”. I saw her speak in Seattle years ago when she was the face of universal health care at the beginning of Bill’s first term.
The RW haters were out in force and the “opposition” to her health care policy looked professional and organized and VERY hostile. The signs didn’t look home made, you know what I mean?
I just happened to be in the area, wasn’t as politically aware, but came away impressed with her ability to talk to an angry crowd….and this was back in the day (ashamed to say) that I didn’t agree with universal coverage.
Quite a bit different than Bush and Cheney, huh?
Hoyer’s mailbox is full, and there doesn’t appear to be any way to e-mail him, unless your zip code is one of his constituency.
Loo Hoo. @ 65
she voted no. better question would be, why did all those other women Senators vote yes?
Hillary is not going to be booed in here. We had to choose which break out session we wanted to attend and have the right color wristband. People here are Hillary supporters.
OT but a good thing! if mentioned earlier I did not see it– last night Debra Bowen Sec’y of State, CA, made huge changes in our voting system. At the last minute possible she brought back paper ballots, mimimized electronic voting, and each precinct will have only one computerized voting machine for people with special needs. This is a huge step towards eliminating election fraud in this state, she has a spine of steel and what is more she ran on cleaning up the elections fraud mess and is actually doing what she said she would do! This is huge! for more info–
bradblog.com.
Toby Wollin @ 64
I don’t hate Hillary but I don’t think she did enough. We needed it to be defeated. And if the Senators with clout can’t convince the freshman to vote their way then they’re not strong enough leaders. Or, they used their vote as cover knowing that it would pass anyway. Was there no arm-bending by the leaders? Doesn’t appear so, thus I”m angry with all of them.
oldmommy @ 73
I don’t know if that’s how it works; just askin’. These days you can’t be too cynical.
An OT example: I emailed my army major efriend, outraged that Kensinger has skipped out on his subpoena, & got back a joke about how army rangers are trained to evade & escape. I told him that if he thought it was a joking matter, & was typical of the army, that it had reached a new moral low, even by the standards of a cynical person like myself.
eCAHNomics @ 71
The simple truth is that Reid doesn’t make any effort to manage his caucus. If you don’t believe me, I have two words for you: Joseph Lieberman.
Another truth is that Senate Democrats have few tools to coerce fellow Democrats. What is worse is that Reid exercises no leadership to try to persuade or guide the members of his caucus. Reid may have been a boxer but it is clear he never was a fighter.
I think it is time to start considering how to switch from opposition to resistance.
How did Solidarnosc survive occupied Poland? How do you network when the internet is blacked out? How do you communicate and distribute information under a fascist state? People should be saving information now before it is erased under Martial Law.
Others have done this before, so can we. But do not insult us by telling us we should call our representative. How long did it take for Amy Klobuchar to be co-opted? Not long at all. They are the problem and belong to the ruling class. If you don’t get that by now you have no memory at all. Elections are equally useless and have been gamed for decades. It makes no difference if you vote, even if everyone you want gets in it makes not a whit of difference. It is the system that is corrupt to the core.
At 1:00 is the presidential candidate panel. Not sure how we’re all going to make it there in time…Maybe Hillary will only speak for a half hour or so.
jayt @ 82
Look at the adddress of his local office & type in that zipcode.
eCAHNomics @ 71
Most of these votes are tactical with the intention of accomplishing a task, which may or may not mesh with party philosophy, with a strategy of staying electable. The outrage generally subsides within a few weeks, the electorate quickly parks their brain and re-elects them out of loyalty, electablity, etc.. Rinse, repeat
Greetings from Wash Co., MN, and belated welcome, PW. Did you get the willies hanging out Michele Bachmann’s district, like I do?!
Just left a message at Sen. Klobuchar’s local office — 612.727.5220 — to the effect of disappointment that a former prosecutor couldn’t show greater respect for the rule of law.
Won’t bother calling Bachman again. Seems like a big waste of breath.
Loo Hoo. @ 76
yup. has to be passed by the House. it has a sunset provision (180 days) but that looks like a sham, too. it really lasts up to 18 months.
eCAHNomics @ 87
Has Kensinger showed up yet? Is it too soon to be concerned about his safety? Or just his courage?
EXCELLENT! PAPER BALLOTS IN CALIFORNIA! My state.
Reid may have been a boxer but it is clear he never was a fighter.
Why didn’t I come up with that line?
Very good.
Hugh @ 88
ugh. I know we are all upset but let’s not resort to foul obscenities.
: )
And I totally agree, you can’t be too cynical. There is nothing I would put past these people……nothing.
Hugh @ 88
Thanks for the info. So we may assume that Klobuchar really voted her heart? Ditto Hillary (who still may have done it to suck up to the base, since in most matters she favors the imperial presidency, hoping to be empress soon).
Not good news on Reid for anything Ds want to accomplish, but I am not surprised. Certainly consistent with the “results” to date.
Toby Wollin @ 64
i just sent John Edwards a benjamin. i’ve decided that he’s my man. it really pisses me off the way the MSM is trying to cut him down.
that said, i will listen to Hillary, and as OK Kiddo says, “I will support the Democratic candidate.”
we had all better resolve to do that. the circular firing squad is not our friend. it’s quite possible that we will not get the candidate who is the most progressive in ‘08.
when it comes to the crunch, rampant idealism and an unwillingness to come together is a losing strategy.
Thanks, TiredFed. Hope to meet you sometime!
Fern @ 95
I’ve seen nothing new on Kensinger.
cahuenga @ 43
I agree strongly, but what keeps a third party from becoming corrupt?
Hugh @ 88
It’s naive to believe that Reid is necessary for these types of deals.
Hugh @ 88
How much power does the Majority have over “his” Senators? The Johnson era “Masters of the Universe” are long gone, killed for good or bad by Senate “Reforms”.
S. 1927 was referred to the House last night.
yup. has to be passed by the House. it has a sunset provision (180 days) but that looks like a sham, too. it really lasts up to 18 months.
Saturday Night Fights tonight?
gonna take a break and get some lunch. keep an eye on CSPAN for the debate on FISA. could be some fireworks.
fahrender @ 100
I’m beginning to think that the most important quality of the Dem candidate might be the toughness and wileyness needed to start cleaning up the messes left by this administration.
Jonathan @ 103
Lack of power.
Hillary is here and looks beautiful!
Hugh @89
Hugh the vote was 60 to 28 I think a deal was made and enough Democrats defected with the aproval of Harry Reid to provide some political cover for the Republicans who voted as a block for this bill so they could all go on vacation.
Vacation is apparently more important to the Senate than doing its job.
Prospero @ 6
My guess is, they act the way my lil Arab used to.
No WAY they’d go over that contraption till they skidded to a stop and inspected it thoroughly for safety, rider still in place or – not. heh.
My little cutie did every thing else with utter perfection and ease, but not that jumpin’ nonsense. Nosireee. Dumped some of the best riders on the Smith College drill team, she did. And yet when it came to gymkhana events,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gymkhana_(Equestrian)
she was the favorite ride in the stable, for everyone. Just LOVED those games.
oh sigh… days i miss…
Wonderful YouTube PW. Beautiful team!
Nanz @ 85
That is huge! And may it just be the beginning. See, now THAT’s Leadership! Good on Debra Bowen: she’s living up to our hopes!
Jonathan @ 104
Nothing. But voting for a candidate rather than a slick packaged brand will more likely promote candidates who reflect your own beliefs.
Mic went out and she called vast right wing conspiracy!
Fern @ 110
Not if the 3rd party reps and sens pull a Lieberman.
Anybody watching the House session on cspan? Kabuki theater at it’s finest. The level of debate is just stunning. Anyone that thinks a thoroughly corrupt system can be “reformed” through elections, letters, phone calls, and emails is not only naive but willfully ignorant of history.
She’s so f’ing manipulative, starting out with transparent flattery of netroots.
Thanking us and wishing we had the blogosphere 15 years ago.
She helped start Media Matters.
I messed up the quotes on my comment at 112 can I get the mods to seperate them please.
Jonathan @ 104
There are times, we in this house think, when one has to take a chance. ;0)
Not to defend Reid, but unless the Majority leader is a corrupt son of a bitch in the manner of a Tom DeLay, how exactly is he going to twist the nuts of some like Jim Webb to make him change his vote?
The pressure HAS to come from the Senator’s own constituents.
The R’s could hold a tighter group because the pressure to conform would inveritably come from all the talk show hosts of the AM radio brigade screaming in unison about the betrayal, then the megachurches, etc. We don’t have that “hammer” to back up a leader’s pressure.
We have to be the pressure.
Jonathan @ 116
True – but only if they are in position to hold the balance of power in a minority situation.
When push comes to shove. Senator Clinton will have mine and Lahoma’s vote.
Doin nice things for people who help you to get elected is a key part of our system- and so “corruption” is built in. Of course when you are one of the one’s gettin the nice things- it isn’t corruption- it’s loyalty.
Hillary reads blogs and gets a lot of ideas. Filters as we all do.
Blogs help create a space 24/7. More challenging for candidates in some respects, but millions of voices.
That is #1 and the next next nine qualities. All of the evil we see is the result of decades of hard work by Republicans. I will vote for the candidate who will enforce the rule of law and cut the guts out of the Republican party. All of the smirking shills that are lying their asses off at Congressional hearing need to know they will have a date with a Grand Jury.
USstream not working here. Off air.
What is Hillary saying??
Jonathan @ 103
or hijacked, or coopted. just look at the libertarians in Pa.
any third party in this country will be used as a tool by the Republicans or the Democrats.
i wish it were not so but nobody i’ve ever read or listened to has even begun to convince me otherwise, and there is plenty of history that points to the almost certainty of the futility of it.
She’s talking about Bill O’Reilly trying to scare people from coming.
She got booed for saying Cubs not Sox!
LS @ 129
Try refreshing or rebooting. Working fine for me. (Hope that doesn’t jinx it!)
Oklahoma kiddo @ 125
I’m not taking any options off the table. She has to earn my vote …
Fern @ 124
This is a self fulfilling prophecy. This way of thinking locks you into a situation were there can never be meaningfull change.
eCAHNomics @ 132
I tried refresh nothing worked. I’ll try rebooting thanx.
Prospero @ 11
Perfect for a blog pix to so the hurdles the Dems are facing and how they CAN do it with a bit of courage and skill.
AnnieW @ 123
I think that’s right. And we cannot support dems just because they are dems … we have to work in the system to place and only keep candidates that reflect our values.
cahuenga @ 114
Except in primary contests and rare circumstances, such a true and principled vote will get the team containing all bad guys elected.
I’m flabbergasted by the numbers of voters who register as Independents.
They haven’t got a clue what they are doing. They eliminate themselves from voting in the primaries in closed primary states. The opportunity to vote for real change lies in the primary races.
wigwam @ 133
We (Lahoma and I) understand what you are saying to us. We are in sympathy with your view. ;0)
rwcole @ 125
That is the conundrum isn’t it. With the system today, if you have a pure heart, you don’t have the resources to get elected. With the present situation, I will vote for any Dem and hope to reform the party, one primary at a time.
The “Third Party” option worked real well for us in 2000. I had hoped Nader has killed any talk about third parties.
Questions now.
NCLB- what will you do about the backlash.
Hillary-rare question and needs more emphasis. We need to admit that it was an unfunded mandate. Breach of the bargain.
Dept of Ed has been less than competent. Rendered irrational by the way it has been handled.
Principle of accountability is great. New Supt. in DC found a warehouse of textbooks never opened.
Need a growth model-track individual students, not the aggragate. Working on electronic educational record. Poor kids move, and can’t be tracked now.
cahuenga @ 133
This is a self fulfilling prophecy. This way of thinking locks you into a situation were there can never be meaningfull change.
No, just a statement of the reality of a minority government. Here in Canada, if no party wins an absolute majority in Parliament, the smaller parties have some clout. Otherwise – nothing.
LS @ 135
Did jinx it for me, but did the refresh at the top of the window, not one under the little picture, and got it back.
hackworth @ 138
Only if you believe that this is a nation of two parties and not a nation of people.
cahuenga @ 104
Reid does have power over the scheduling of legislation. For any who might not remember this what Reid said last September when the Military Commissions Act was being rushed through before the elections.
The current FISA bill is deja vu all over again. It isn’t just that Reid let this all happen. He actively worked to make it happen.
Perhaps Senator Clinton might surprise us. Perhaps this person will be a great president. We think the Senator has a mind of her own. And we think the Senator can be tough.
eCAHNomics @ 118
You don’t like the lady, do you, eCAHN?
I am really enjoying and respecting the level of diversity in the opinions being expressed on this thread. Pro Hillary, anti Hillary. Third party, go with whoever the Dem is. Work the phones, it’s all useless. You all are so great to hang out with.
Steve-AR @ 140
there are some who say that, in his heart of hearts,
Ralph is a Republican.
Hugh @ 89
Lieberman wouldn’t be there if it weren’t for Schumer, Emmanuel and Clinton among others.
fdl reader – left you a reply below.
500
Hugh @ 144
Yes. A little strategic stalling would have solved a lot of problems – instead they have rushed through bad legislation. Passing something that Bush would be sure to veto would have been another angle.
For those interested in streaming YK2 and saving a tiny amount of bandwidth, I embedded the video feed (minus the chat window) in a blank page here: Yearly Kos
I am using it as a pseudo stand-alone player. Just open it in it’s own browser window and resize the window to the video size.
As the Talmud says, “Those who understand, will understand.”
My Congresswoman’s phones(Giffords of AZ)don’t answer – either in DC or AZ. I left a voice mail and sent her an email.
Pelosi’s and Hoyer’s mail boxes are full, so you can’t even leave a voice mail.
The Senate session last night was tortuous to watch. Senator Reid may be a good man, but he got rolled – as did the entire Democratic leadership. Seems like they will never learn.
jayt @ 106
There’s a copy of S, 1927 linked on Steny Hoyer’s website, if anyone’s interested.
Hillary-
Move toward national standards on testing. They winked and said let’s lower the standards. She is in favor of moving toward
No unfunded mandates. Reading and math are important, but so are science, social sstudies and art, and PE.
Kids get inspired in other ways than sitting in a classroom. She remembers her field trips a lot more than her time in class. YAY!!
Pre Kinder is really important for lower income kids.
We pay far too little attention to high school. Drop out rates show we are not doing enough for kids not academically inclined. I started the clapping AND SHE THANKED ME PERSONALLY!
Richmond @ 149
Au contraire, all it took was Rove and A*P*C and the pharma lobbyists.
Edited and released by Mods
Oklahoma kiddo @ 145
OK, Seems you’ve had a sudden change of opinion. What changed your mind?
Where is the moderator (the one at YK2, not the ones here)with “reclaimng my time”? If Hillary filibusters on every Q like she’s doing on education, she’ll get about 3 Qs.
BigMitch @ 153
You’re being a little cryptic this morning!
Hugh @ 70
really important piece by glenn.
An A-Bomb from the A-Rod.
Alex Rodriquez becomes the youngest player ever to hit 500 home runs.
Okay, no more sports postings for me.
twolf1 @ 152
Thanks twolf, works great!
Richmond @ 149
Au contraire, all it took was Rove, A*P*C and the ph*rma lobbyists.
Edited and released by Mods
twolf1 @ 153
WOW! Thanks! That works great! The uStream page is a mess for me … maybe it’s the W98 no SE … *g*
fahrender @ 100
Fatalistic support of status quo candidates isn’t much of a strategy either.
AnnieW @ 123
Promise to cut any earmark that the Senator makes or any earmark made by another Senator trying to launder money to him to his state or his campaign contributors. Then tell his campaign contributors and his state why their in the doghouse. Until the Senator changes his mind. If the Senator defects like Liebermen keeps talking about then we defund all his states military bases.
We do have to trim the number of military bases so all the other Senators would rather vote to close Joe’s base rather than their own.
Its not about saying I can’t so I won’t because chances are if you have that atitude you didn’t want to do it anyway.
Its about saying I’m trying if this doesn’t work I’ll try something else. We need primary challenges to get some real Democrats in the Senate!
We need people who act like they want to end the war. We need people willing to miss vacation. We need people with principles they are willing to fight for!
hackworth @ 157
not to be too presumptious here, but I believe the gentleman has a very persuasive lady in his life…….. : )
oddmommy @ 147
You may have heard me say this before on this site: I was 2 years ahead of her at Wellesley. Although I didn’t know her then, I know the type well. I didn’t like it 40 years ago, and I like it even less now. Workaholics with command of details (all the stuff you get tested on at school or on the campaign trail) but no heart, no scope. I could go on with other more recent actions of hers,but we’ll leave that for another time. (P.S. She never answers my emails & doesn’t have a regular email list for constituents.)
hi all
watching chs & digby & taylor et al onstage for Hot Topix.
we’re all appalled re FISA.
at our table are ‘pups leslie kathryn matt katymine me & fiance.
please callyour ‘critter if you can.
love to all … tsf
Question- When can we expect Guantanamo to be closed?
Voted against it and restoring Habeas Corpus is most important. Getting a coalition together in the senate.
Closing Gitmo, we need to look at all of the issues. When I’m president I will do both of those things.
Question from Jeralyn! The senate passed a FISA bill. Thanks to Hil for voting against it. What warrentless wiretapping wilol you allow and how will your AG be different than Abu?
Hillary- It will be great to have an AG who believes in the rule of law. Bush has gone with imcompetents and cronies.
Bush still supporting him speaks volumes about his contempt for the rule of law. Abu should be removed or he should resign. His actions will continue. Rule of law and not the Rule of Bush.
OT, but some good news: CA severely limits electronic voting for ‘08
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200…..g_machines
…Diebold (mostly) banned.
hackworth @ 158
I have said for quite sometime I would support the nominee of my party to be the next Democratic president. Reality suggests that Senator Clinton (absent a Gore run) will be the nominee. The Senator has potential it is felt. However, if I am disapponted, depending on the degree of that disappointment, we in this house will actively do our best to support a third party in the elections of 2012. ;0)
Hugh @ 166
i’ll meet you half way (no kumbayas required) …..
Did you know the pResident has declared a National Emergency?
Neither did I.
Hillary-
There is a legitimate role for surveillance. We need checks and balances. We’ll see how the House goes on FISA. We need to protect security and civil liberties both.
Two more questions. Her spokesman said one, and she said let’s take two.
Hugh @ 167
There is corruption to the very heart of our country.
We need to reboot.
selise @ 150
And I you … Thanks!
sunny @ 176
He’s just rearing to declare that emergency here in the USA isn’t he? Ya know he wants to… :P
eCAHNomics @ 167
oh, ok…..I have seen that, didn’t remember it was you.
(btw, this proves that you ARE a girl, like I thought.)
Actually I completely agree with you. I don’t like her either, for exactly the reasons you state.
Did you see the movie “Election”? I think you would enjoy it.
oh…. and: what digby said
oddmommy @ 68
No, the Southern Tier is southwest NY state. You know that flat border at the bottom?
TeddySanFran @ 168
Teddy: saw your pic…..you are SUCH a cutie.
[blush]
oldmommy @ 189
What gave me away? Will check out Election; thanks for the recommendation.
Question, Don’t ask don’t tell, repeal welfare reform, telecommunications act, Nafta.
Hillary, many brave and qualified people have been released from the military. I hope to repeal it (respect for military decisions I think). Behavior not sexual orientation should determine status.
DOMA gave us a chance. Marriage decisions should be left to the states. Part three of DOMA needs to be extended.
Telecommunications, you’ll have to ask Al Gore, he is the expert. Take a hard look at this more closely.
Nafta- we have to have smarter trade agreements that include environmental impact. We have to find ways to stimulate trade agreements.
Welfare reform more positive than negative, but we have to protect medical and educational aspects for people coming off welfare.
(She’s so smart, I don’t know how she is remembering all the parts of this question.)
sunny @ 176
When are the Democrats going to stop him?
jayt @ 34
Oh, the senate IS “finished” all right. They finished off their last reason for existence by quickly giving the keys to Bush and saying to him, “Knock yourself out!”
They capitulated 100% and so fast it is incredible. False Flag operation is on the way, count on it, and then their “jobs” will be quaint and outdated officially.
Long live the new dictatorship!
eCAHNomics @ 182
Wellesley…
“(P.S. She never answers my emails & doesn’t have a regular email list for constituents.)”
Senator Clinton needs to work on this big time. ;0)
sunny @ 175
Don’t want to take the time to check this out now, but if it’s what I think it is, check out this:
http://www.antiwar.com/blog/2007/08/03/bruce-fein/
oldmommy @ 188
I thought you meant you’d figured it out before I mentioned Wellesley.
“not to be too presumptious here, but I believe the gentleman has a very persuasive lady in his life…….. : )”
;0)
fdl reader @ 178
got it. thanks.
Look how well that YearlyKos thing is turning out! Woohoo! The Kos party (Democrats) are caving in, 100% and absolutely, to authoritarianism and is officially going along with the elimination of the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
Don’t get me wrong, I am a Kossack from several years back, but it is now officially too little too late. Everyone that we have supported, even the new candidates we put into office (JIM WEBB!) have voted to eliminate the Constitution and dispense with the Rule of Law.
What is the point of being a Kossack (or Firepup) if the people that we support, the people that are supposed to “save the day” are 100% behind eliminating liberty and civil rights shoulder-to-shoulder with the Christianist GOP? Our true candidates vanished from DC when Tip O’Neill left. All that remains, even Feingold, are cowards, criminals, and haters-of-freedom.
eCAHNomics @ 189
well, I suspected…..don’t know why…..sort of like with Digby.
Then someone called you a “he” the other day and I got confused.
oldmommy @ 188
hint: I sometimes say her/his . . .
Last question-public transportation.
We are living off the investments that our parents and grandparents made. It is critical to our economic development that we do much more. We have 1 trillion in unmet needs. Electronic infrastructure too. Universal free broadband.
WhoHoo!
We’re down to 25% now. We need to look at what Europe has done and do it in a hurry.
Mass transit must become a priority. Some parts of the country are more well suited for it. We are losing money and time, we are adding to our energy problems and global warming. We need long term bonding and regional decisions. Our rails are outdated and need to improve them. We need to incentivize people to use it. Public education needed.
Every election is about the future. I have been fighting for change my entire life and I am proud of my record. How much power and energy will we have for this election. Bush has been mortgaging our childrens’ future. A war that the president would not pay for. I am realistic but positive about our future. Pre K- college educational affordability. Etc. I can’t do any of it without your support. Blogosphere can help and i Invite you to help. Reach out to people who don’t already agree with us. Break down the barriers. It’s easy to be smart when we’re only speaking with each other.
9/11 workers need our help. People may not really know the issues, but they know in their core that something is wrong. Over.
Praedor Atrebates @ 192
your anger is very righteous and very well expressed, imo.
You should have your own blog if you don’t already.
Well, I must say what a pleasure it is to listen to someone who speaks intelligently in coherent English sentences, who is familiar with the issues. Hillary’s performance is the finest that Wellesley has to offer. And that is meant to be geniune, not a snark.
I have suggested to Lahoma that we go out back for a swim (I cleaned the pool this morning) and shelve politics. She says good idea.
Any Presidential Candidates at KOZ talking about the subprime mess?
eCAHNomics @ 196
actually, you “outed” yourself earlier this week i believe when you were talking about the rafting trip with Molly Ivins, Donna Shalayla and all of those other fabulous women …..
things come undone @ 201
Not that I’ve heard yet.
It’s so funny that she mentions this.
If you read the RW blogs or papers, they will argue that spending money on such absurd things is ridiculous.
I read one RW blog post blaming the collapse of the Minn. bridge on money that was wasted getting a light rail line.
Kind of sad that they’re willing to spend almost a trillion on a war that lines pockets, but money that would help us be able to not depend on the Middle East is social*stic and a waste.
Edited and released by Mods
Thanks Mod!
Can someone tell me why I’m not supposed to think that either A)Congress is being blackmailed into supporting BushCO’s agenda,or B)that they are complicit and like the way things are? Because right now,I don’t see how it can be anything else. But,I concede I may be missing something.
anangryoldbroad @ 206
Second that; think it’s more likely B.
What a guy. High above the fray. Our prez in action. All he needs is a fight suit and a cape.
AP – President Bush surveyed Minneapolis’ collapsed highway bridge from the ground and air Saturday, viewing the concrete slabs and twisted steel that once spanned the Mississippi River. He pledged to help cut the red tape to reconstruct the span.
eCAHNomics @ 204
Whats your take on this issue is Bush doing anything?
Bush is just lying again.
Hello, everyone. Howie has a great Blue America candidate upstairs.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 209
Funny red tape I thought his spokesman Tony Snow said it was the state’s responsibilty. Its the states Republican Governor who won’t raise takes to fix the bridges!
eCAHNomics @ 191
No, Fein was talking about this one, dated July 17. The latest one is dated August 2, and broadens and expands it into a NATIONAL EMERGENCY.
AnnieW @ 205
The right thinks it is a rural-urban thing. But the buses are no longer covering these areas, and the airlines business here is a racket (and full of no-shows). This issue really is about big oil (cars) and the auto industry. And, they are bigger losers than the cities on this one, because cities already are paying for urban transport and it works very well.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 209
Big difference with New Orleans. A black and white issue-pun intended.
eCAHNomics @ 204
Edwards had an entire tour around it – saw him visiting poor neighborhoods in the midwest talking about it. FYI.
Thank you, Loo Hoo. I watched U-Stream and there were some hateful comments streaming. Hillary haters should have just stayed away but this is how they get their kicks.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 209
Did he promise money? Cutting red tape is pretty damn cheap.
Watching and listening to the king in Minneapolis must be especially painful for the Katrina victims.
This morning my Republic relative asked if I had heard the New Orleans folks will get $150,000 to move back there. I have not heard that; told him the only people I know who are getting money from Katrina are the Republic cronies.
Sally @ 218
There are good reasons to despise he Democrat collaborators like Hilary. Everything she is saying right now is a lie so she can get elected or haven’t you been paying attention the past few days?
I called my Congressman, John Yarmuth, but had to leave a message. I also sent an email to his office. I feel so powerless!
Jacqrat @ 217
Edwards is starting to be my candidate I know Hilary is the front runner and I really want to elect Obama or Richardson but maybe they can be vice president.
The Senate cowardice today and the refusal to stop Bush’s Presidential decree’s about seizing assets with no trial is ironicaly pushing me further to the left.
The center/Senate (democrats) are refusing to hold allowing (Bush’s) anarchy to be lose on the world.
Things are getting bad the alleged stability of the center Democrats/Bush stay the course is now a vote for anarchy, entropy and nilhism.
He’s in the pool. It’s payback kiddo.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOuaet4Evp4
L.
looseheadprop @ 183
lhp! you still around? left you some goodies over at my place (click on my handle). thought you might like to see summaries on the CRS report on contempt power.
If you haven’t seen the Aug. 3, Gonzales letter to Senator Leahy TPM has a copy of it.
Here is a link
So is Markos working for Clinton/Obama?????
No questions for Gravel, and only one little bone thrown to Kucinich.
“In March, Bush visited survivors of tornadoes that ripped through Alabama and Georgia. In April, he offered words of hope at Virginia Tech after a gunman killed 32 people and committed suicide. In May, Bush went to Kansas after a tornado wiped out the tiny town of Greensburg.”
Talk about a human jinx.
-GSD
jayt @ 82
some have suggested “adopting” a zip, ahem.
Hanging out at the library while Daughter meets with the anime clup. Just published part 3 of my transcription of Howard Dean’s keynote address.
Hmmm Bush and tornados.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…..mp;search=
And I see Lahoma was messin’ with my keyboard.
I think I have figured out the Democratic strategy. They are giving George W. Bush enough rope to hang the Democrats.
-GSD
GSD @ 233
Could be. ;0)
President criticized for Katrina response says he will stand with Minnesota
Anyone still here? Hillary just said she wasn’t ifluenced by lobbiests. 707
One fine day Bush will no longer be in the White House.
eCAHNomics @ 236
And the DLC either?
eCAHNomics @ 236
You should come upstairs. We got a real live Progressive, Russ Warner, in Blue America.
eCAHNonics,
I’m still here, and I heard it. Does she honestly think we’re all idiots?
-S
eCAHNomics @ 236
What trucks do these turnips think we fell off of?
newtonusr @ 239
I know, but I want to bloviate about the prez panel at YK2. & I’m not good enuf to do that & upstairs too.
eCAHNomics @ 242
I’ll bloviate with you.
Edwards looks better and better. Clinton and Obama just lost me.
BTW, someone had better call Hillary Clinton and let her know that “SiCKO” was fact-checked. Her contribution from Big Pharma was documented in the film.
IMHO, YMMV,
-S
Strategerie @ 243
I’ve been with Edwards pretty much all along. Campaign contributions being a very major factor. Part of the whole DLC thing under Clinton was to get big business contributions away from the Rs. Who needs that?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 241
She’s pushing me towards the Greens.
Imagine how much better that whole conversation would be without her on that stage spewing DLC lies.
Eureka Springs @ 245
The turnip greens?
So how’re we going to combat Hillary?
Anyone have the final vote tally, names attached, from the Senate FISA debacle. or at least know where I could find it?
Hey OKK, Lahoma sounds like a peach! You lucky dawg. (p.s., I’m lucky that way too.;->)
I liked that debate. Especcially the cheering.
Anyone want to weigh in before I move upstairs?
Adie @ 247
see dkos “The day the music died”
eCAHNomics @ 250
I have supported Edwards since 2004, am from Iowa, and he continues to grow.
eCAHNomics @ 250
I saw about the last 45 minutes. Seriously. If Gore’s not in, it’s Edwards all the way.
Hillary Clinton did not do herself any favors this afternoon, because bloggers had the facts on that one less than thirty seconds after the comments left her lips. They won’t remain silent on it, either.
IMHO, YMMV,
-S
eCAHNomics @ 250
Hi. I’m here trying to find anyone who knows where to dredge up a tally, with NAMES, on the Senate FISA vote. Any ideas? ;->
The turnip greens? *G*
I have no new ideas atm. I do know she is the last person on that stage who I would vote for and after saying things like that about lobbyists.. I may just not vote at all (for president) in Nov ‘08 if she is on the D ticket. It is the only way I can avoid hypocrisy enough to be able to live with myself.
Adie @ 254
On an earlier thread I believe.
solai @ 251
Thanks much. I think I’m proud of at least one of my Senators. Just wanna be sure. ;->
(((Loo Hoo)))
I couldn’t get a clear connection… but I stand between voting for Kucinich and Edwards in the primary.. nothing I heard today changed my mind.
Anyone know what happened in the House today?
Wow. That debate was outstanding. Edwards stood out…all were great, actually. Now Madam Pelosi must pull through for us today, or we’ll be depressed…
Richmond @ 260
They are still on the energy issues it seems
Anyone know if CSPAN is going to show the YKos debate and if so, when?
LS @ 261
You know, I’m starting to think maybe Edwards can pull this off.
I suggest that no one sends a penny more in contributions to the Democratic Party until they grow some balls. I now return envelopes sent to me with money solicitations back with a message–NOT A PENNY MORE UNTIL THE ELECTED MEMBERS OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY GROW SOME BALLS AND END THE MADNESS OF KING GEORGE–NO MORE MONEY!
I think that sends a message more than a telephone call handled by a staffer.
NOT ONE PENNY MORE!
Fern @ 264
I sure hope so. He is not the only one who can beat Freddie boy, but Hillary and Barack sure can’t.
Here is the list. Now write, call or send a carrier pidgeon, but in the name of the US Constitution. DO SOMETHING about this outrage!
16 Dem’s voted Yes but it was enough for the chimp.
ALSessions (R) Yes; Shelby (R) Yes.
ALMurkowski (R) Yes; Stevens (R) Yes.
AZKyl (R) Yes; McCain (R) Not Voting.
ARLincoln (D) Yes; Pryor (D) Yes.
CABoxer (D) Not Voting; Feinstein (D) Yes.
COAllard (R) Yes; Salazar (D) Yes.
CTDodd (D) No; Lieberman (I) Yes.
DEBiden (D) No; Carper (D) Yes.
FLMartinez (R) Yes; Nelson (D) Yes.
GAChambliss (R) Yes; Isakson (R) Yes.
HIAkaka (D) No; Inouye (D) Yes.
IDCraig (R) Yes; Crapo (R) Yes.
ILDurbin (D) No; Obama (D) No.
INBayh (D) Yes; Lugar (R) Not Voting.
IAGrassley (R) Yes; Harkin (D) Not Voting.
KSBrownback (R) Yes; Roberts (R) Yes.
KYBunning (R) Not Voting; McConnell (R) Yes.
LALandrieu (D) Yes; Vitter (R) Yes.
MECollins (R) Yes; Snowe (R) Yes.
MDCardin (D) No; Mikulski (D) Yes.
MAKennedy (D) No; Kerry (D) Not Voting.
MILevin (D) No; Stabenow (D) No.
MNColeman (R) Yes; Klobuchar (D) Yes.
MSCochran (R) Yes; Lott (R) Not Voting.
MOBond (R) Yes; McCaskill (D) Yes.
MTBaucus (D) No; Tester (D) No.
NEHagel (R) Yes; Nelson (D) Yes.
NVEnsign (R) Yes; Reid (D) No.
NHGregg (R) Not Voting; Sununu (R) Yes.
NJLautenberg (D) No; Menendez (D) No.
NMBingaman (D) No; Domenici (R) Yes.
NYClinton (D) No; Schumer (D) No.
NCBurr (R) Yes; Dole (R) Yes.
NDConrad (D) Yes; Dorgan (D) Not Voting.
OHBrown (D) No; Voinovich (R) Yes.
OKCoburn (R) Yes; Inhofe (R) Yes.
ORSmith (R) Yes; Wyden (D) No.
PACasey (D) Yes; Specter (R) Yes.
RIReed (D) No; Whitehouse (D) No.
SCDeMint (R) Yes; Graham (R) Yes.
SDJohnson (D) Not Voting; Thune (R) Yes.
TNAlexander (R) Not Voting; Corker (R) Yes.
TXCornyn (R) Yes; Hutchison (R) Yes.
UTBennett (R) Yes; Hatch (R) Yes.
VTLeahy (D) No; Sanders (I) No.
VAWarner (R) Yes; Webb (D) Yes.
WACantwell (D) No; Murray (D) Not Voting.
WVByrd (D) No; Rockefeller (D) No.
WIFeingold (D) No; Kohl (D) No.
WYBarrasso (R) Yes; Enzi (R) Yes.
TiredFed @ 266
i only caught part of this… but was stunned by senator obama’s inarticulateness. i thought he was supposed to be the amazing rhetorical genius. did i just catch him at a bad moment?
‘course compared to our current POTUS, there’s not comparison… but still.
LS @ 262
Thanks LS
Art @ 267
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Kerry and Cantwell didn’t vote!!!!:-#
Are any Firepups in SL at YKSL today? Watching the debate with a bunch of other people around was pretty exciting.
selise @ 268
I don’t think he does off-the-cuff well. Speeches yes, improv no.
I am bull shit. Where the HELL was Kerry? (buying more spandex)???!!!! I mean really REALLy pissed. I would support any Dem who decides to go against him in the primary as a result of this. GGGRRRR
Oklahoma kiddo @ 235
Suppose this is where trickledown economics is to be demonstrated officially – NOLA, help is on it’s way!!!!
Arnie @ 274
It is a black-white issue. Plus the Gov is a rethug.
Here’s the deal. Most of the time candidates are consumed with money. We get what time there is left over.
Fern @ 272
I’m catching the breakout with Obama right now on uStream: I see why people go nuts about him in this kind of casual setting he is good, much better than he is in any of the debates where he hems and haws and I haven’t been able to understand why people like him. Interesting.
Not sure if this thread is still active, and I don’t want to interrupt upstairs — but I’ve been out all day, and when I got home I turned on CSPAN and it seems that the House is still in session. Any updates as to what’s been happening? Thanks!
Art @ 265
Way ahead of you there. I went on that pledge when Alito made the SCOTUS. I was JUST about to open up again but then they voted to cover for Bush while he spies on Americans in violation of the 4th and 5th Amendments and that tore it. There is nothing, short of them actually taking up arms and invading the White House grounds, that can get me on board with that lot of criminals and sell-outs.
Except for this: I DID give some money to Edwards. That’s it.
Information overload time. I am editing a manuscript, have Obama on Kos speaking, and on XM Air America am listening to Frank Rich on Ring of Fire. TOO Much!
eCAHNomics @ 208
No, it’s A and B combined. Do you really think there hasn’t been any illegal snooping of phones/emails of the Senators by this administration?
LoudounLib @ 278
Hi LL ~ House in session to deal with energy bill and something else (can’t recall) before back to FISA later today/tonight. Senate passed Bush’s version of FISA last night. House may vote on same version or amend it to make it different before voting. If it passes identical to Senate’s version, then Bush gets his FISA. If there is some move by House to vote on a version different/amended, then the two will go to conference committee to reconcile.
We are hoping that House votes no or changes the bill enough that it cannot be reconciled with Bush’s version. I’m not too good at all this so I may not have this right!
Stay tuned.
Oh and generally everyone is up in arms about all this fuckery!
fdl reader, thanks so much — did know about the Senate last night (grrrr, Webb!) but had missed everything/anything that might have gone on today. Thanks again!
FYI, late last night the Senate adjourned until September 4th.
[Harry Reid took the time to praise Sheldon Whitehouse - who was about to gavel the session to a close in the President’s Chair - saying he was “the talk of the Judiciary Committee” for working like a dog on the (presumably) Rockefeller/Levin FISA bill and overall FISA issue “past midnight” and with great dedication. Too bad Whitehouse’s caucus prefers the venal character of Dick Cheney to the high ethical standards and compassionate competence of their colleague Senator Whitehouse. The vote on McConnell/Bond was obviously ARRANGED to reach 60 and therefore passage - it was no accident of fate from the Democrats overseen by Reid and Durbin.]
House FAX Numbers:
Nancy Pelosi = 202-225-8259
Steny Hoyer = 202-225-4300
Rahm Emanuel = 202-225-5603
James Clyburn = 202-225-2313
Jane Harman (Intelligence Committee) = 202-226-7290
Alcee Hastings (Intelligence Committee) = 202-225-1171
Also, FYI, Nancy Pelosi flat out stated twice yesterday (once in a news conference, once on the House floor) that letting oversight of this unConstitutional spying (that an amended FISAct would “allow”) to remain in the Executive Branch rather than the Judicial Branch is “unacceptable” (I believe she used that word – Cheney’s favorite) on Constitutional principle. If her word is her bond, no FISA bill that leaves oversight to the DNI and/or the AG ought to make it to the floor of the House, Dick Cheney’s monarchy be damned.
This is Nancy Pelosi’s chance to put the Democratic Party and the House of Representatives on the map as defenders of our Constitution and of the rights and personal liberty of we, the people that it exists to protect. Or to help hasten the end of our Republic.
P.S. Bless Debra Bowen.
pow wow, if the Senate adjourned, they must be expecting the house to pass McConnell/Bond, and therefore there is no need for the Senate to be in session to reconcile another version passed by the house.
just sayin’.
I called and e-mailed Waxman this morning, before 8am LA time. Also e-mailed Pelosi, and said the should hold firm on requiring probable cause, or repeal the Constitution and pass a law making George ‘his pissiness President-for-life George I’. I managed to be polite on the phone, less polite in the e-mails (which I suspect are deleted, possibly after being read).
WHY did so many Democratic senators vote for this horrid FISA bill? ~~~Edited in moderation for content.~~~ The coward from Crawford is under 30% and the Democrats still back down?!?!?!?!?
Don’t I know it, sunny @ 285. The final House vote will tell whether this was all pre-arranged yesterday, as to the timing of the House and Senate sessions.
Fax! It hasn’t passed yet, though it could still come to a vote today, so get your fax machines going!
CNN
Pelosi’s FAX # 202 225-8259, 202-225-4188
Who has faxes for the rest of the House? http://www.house.gov/house/MemStateSearch.shtml
Phoenix Woman @ 9
Debate is occurring right now. Watching live here:
http://www.cspan.org/watch/cs_…..mp;Code=CS
Summary so far:
Republicans: “9/11! 9/11! Terrists gonna gitcha! Your kids gonna go up in a mushroom cloud! Terrists gonna gitcha! Gonna GITCHA!!”
Democrats: “Let’s not eviscerate constitutional protections of American citizens in response to fear mongering, and let’s not give unprecedented and unnecessary powers to governmental actors who have proven that they cannot be trusted.”
Hey, guess what?
Republicans: “It’s Clinton’s fault!!!!!!!!!!”