More from Steve Kornacki at the NYObserver:
Maybe the 50 members of the Senate’s Democratic Caucus should just call the bluff of their 51st vote and tell Joe Lieberman to take a hike.
The junior Senator from Connecticut, who was elected as an independent last year after losing the faith of his home state’s Democratic Party, continues to flaunt his tie-breaking status, all but calling his former partisan colleagues terrorist coddlers and daring them to do something – anything – about it.
It’s a bullying, childish game he’s playing. If Mr. Lieberman were to walk away from the Democrats completely and to caucus with Senate Republicans, he would hand the G.O.P. its magical 50th vote, which, along with Vice-President Cheney’s vote, would strip Democrats of the narrow majority they won in the chamber last November. And so he chooses to torment the Democrats, siding with them for organizational purposes only to amplify – at every pivotal turn in the four-plus-year evolution of the Iraq War – the White House’s most shrill and demagogic attacks on the party’s foreign policy credibility….
Never mind that Mr. Lieberman has been every bit the partisan that he accuses Democrats of being on the Iraq question: There hasn’t been a single consequential vote on which he’s strayed from the G.O.P. line.
This rhetorical disingenuousness is, of course, nothing new for “Holy Joe,” who routinely tries to pass off his hawkish war posture – which is at odds with the overwhelming majority of the American public – as the voice of bipartisan consensus-building. He champions the surge, reads from the White House’s script, and threatens to support next year’s Republican presidential nominee. And if his Democratic Senate colleagues have any thought of calling him out in public, well, there’s always the threat he reiterated to The Hill this week.
“I wouldn’t foreclose it as a possibility,” he said when asked if he might switch parties and become a Republican, “but I hope that I don’t reach that point.”
But what Harry Reid and Company might not realize is that, for all of Mr. Lieberman’s threats, Senate Democrats actually have the upper hand in the relationship with Mr. Lieberman. If they were to lay down the law with Mr. Lieberman, he might not run to the G.O.P. as quickly as he wants Democrats to believe he would. And even if he did, it would be a relatively minor and very short-term setback for Democrats – but one with long-lasting implications for Mr. Lieberman.
Mr. Lieberman’s association with the Democrats, for all his griping, is actually quite beneficial to him.
For one thing, it gives him a gavel – the chairmanship of the Homeland Security committee. Sure, he could keep that if he jumped ship, and in fact, he might do himself one better – who knows what prestigious gavel Republicans might tempt him with? But it would be fool’s gold, because the question heading into next year’s elections seems to be how many additional Senate seats Democrats will pick up – not which party will control the chamber.
Gee…who could have predicted that Mr. Shrill-Finger-Wagging-Self-Promoting-Ego would do things solely for his own benefit and that of the Bush Administration, whose biggest funders paved his way in campaign moolah back into the Senate so that he could serve as their legislative scold? It is well past time that the Senate Democratic leadership stopped kowtowing to Lieberman’s demands and instead tell him to STFU. He knows as well as we do how to do “the math” — and it’s not looking good for Republican control of the Senate. Kornacki is absolutely correct.
If ever there were a reason to work our asses off to elect a stronger majority of Democrats in the Senate, this is it: people like Joe Lieberman need to be made far more irrelevent. His scolding nag act on Iraq is beyond stale, and his usefulness as a tool for undercutting Democratic policy initiatives on Iraq, and his role as a gatekeeper on national security issues that desperately need to be addressed by preventing meaningful oversight is beyond appalling — it is outright dangerous and, worse, it is a slackassed slap in the face to every first responder in this nation not to take that duty of oversight more seriously. Joe Lieberman is a manace who is out for one thing, and one thing only — Joe Lieberman.
And if the Democratic leadership cannot see that, then they no longer deserve to be leaders. Period.
PS — And while I’m at it, Dianne Feinstein just made the shit list. (H/T Howie) Shame on her!



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Christy!
Zed!!
I want Mr. Lieberman to be dealt with, Harry Reid.
Darn it!! Tres? Quatro?
Bye, Joe!
And don’t forget, LIEBERMAN HAS ALREADY been BUSTED FOR POLITICAL CROSS-DRESSING
Feinstein’s been doing a pretty good job lately and now this!
GAWH!!! you can’t take your eyes off her for a moment…
(rudy’s a back biting puke)
any of you Greg Palast fans here?
***
Palast needs some loot to survive!!!!
Please spread the word…
http://gregpalast.com/
“Well, we’ve made it: Last Friday, the main-stream US media, through the venerable PBS program ‘NOW’, finally broadcast our reportage on the “caging” of voters, a story we first broke 3 years ago. BEFORE the 2004 election.
We’ve made it in another way: Friday was also the day I was informed that the Palast Investigative Fund was dead broke, technically bankrupt, with way less than zero in the account.
Bluntly: if we don’t get some help, and fast, we’re sunk. We are throwing staff overboard and halting some operations while we seek funds to keep afloat.
I’m pleading with you to do three things:
1. Watch PBS ‘NOW’ on voter ‘caging’. Then, if you think our work is important…
2. Donate at least $100 (tax deductible) to the Palast Investigative Fund. With heartfelt gratitude, I’ll send you a personalized, signed copy of Armed Madhouse (hardbound or paperback, your choice), or the DVD “Big Easy to Big Empty,” the untold story of the drowning of New Orleans.
(For $250, I’ll sign and send a whole BOX of Raw Journalism: 2 books: Armed Madhouse and Impeach the President, 2 DVDs: Big Easy to Big Empty and American Blackout, the Audio Book Armed Madhouse and the Spoken Word CD Live from the Armed Madhouse). Or simply make an open no-gift donation for a sum of your choice. (All options and many other signed items can be found at the Palast Investigative Fund Homepage.) Continue reading ‘Busted & Crimes of The Times’”
i think it was clear they didn’t care last summer when much (not all!) of the dem leadership supported lieberman against lamont. with their support, we probably could have had lamont in congress and lieberman would have been a problem for no one now.
EPU’d from an earlier thread today:
Biodun @ 59
Time to say good riddance.
oh, this can’t be good -
Probable Cause Out the Window in FISA fix?
via Muckraker
“If ever there were a reason to work our asses off to elect a stronger majority of Democrats in the Senate, this is it: people like Joe Lieberman need to be made far more irrelevent.”
Lahoma likes this. And so do I. We are pleased.
I’ve lost “faith” with the Democratic members of Congress. They’ve been gutless wonders letting the Republicans make fools of them by using every obstructionist tactic in the book —and then some.
epu’s last thread- as I googled to get details on Massa’s primary opponent I see that the word is he’s dropping out
http://rochesterturning.com/category/eric-massa/
That will out the $$ where it is needed-against the local very strong Republican blind eye machine
Good points re Lieberman. Dems need to learn to just do the right thing regardless of what they think it will mean strategically.
Lieberman is a self-serving, war-mongering sack of organic fertilizer. I agree they should just show him the door and let things shake out how they may.
It’s been my experience that doing the “right thing” often ends up also being the beneficial thing in the long-run even if you can’t foresee how.
So, it sounds like the “spy program X” is operating completely illegally right now. Now is the time to nail them. Wishful thinking.
Unless I am mistaken, Mr. Kornaki has it wrong on one point, a “majority’ in the Senate is 60 not 51 and the Committee structure is fixed until the next election. Throwing Joe out of the caucus has zero downside. If Reid and the leadership started busting Joe’s balls, maybe it might put a little fear into the Nelson/Pryor Dems.
My friends and i have been wondering if the Bush administration had some kind of terrorist event planned for August.
Unbelievably, President Bush says if Congress doesn’t pass his legislation this week, the Democrats will be responsible for any terrorist attacks that may happen in August ,even though he’s demonstrated no relationship between his proposals and a safer America.
The worst part is that Congress may actually be falling for Bush’s rhetoric.
Take Action: Tell Congress NOT to Cave In to Fear.
LecSmith just said, “we have to confront this: when they trot out the ‘Be Afraid,’ we have to ask, “are you planning anything? Do you know something you aren’t telling us?”
Drop Holy Joe now. Call his bluff, even better: preemptively kick him out of the party. Let him join the Republicans for all I care: we’ve got committee chairs until ‘08 anyway and the vast likelihood is that we pick up seats.
Joe has, at most, 16 more months of relevancy. Why even give him that long? If he jumps ship, he becomes irrelevant NOW.
wlgriffi @ 15
i’m waiting to see how the fisa scare turns out….
but, i do agree that the last 6 months have pissed me off.
I am still waiting on senate Dems to respect the Democratic primary results last year where they said Joe Lieberman is not their Democrat..
Kathryn in MA @ 20
Well, if one could believe that they are capable of executing a terrorist event for their own purposes, then one could consider re-examining the events of 9/11…
REPEAT of HEADS-UP 1st annced downstairs.
C-Span (1) is to carry Pelosi/Reid presser LIVE momentarily.
(In the meantime, they’re showing taped repeat of earlier program, but will break in whenever the presser starts.)
Hi Christy! Dandy topic. GOAWAYJOE!
Have a great YKo!
LS @ 19
What amazes me about all of this is that it’s nothing new. Bushco is known to have been breaking this law for a long time and even his party in majority control last year did not pass CYA legislation.. But now Dems want to do it and of course it’s all so urgent! (screams into pillow)
Buh Bye Joe. Don’t let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya.
But Joe won’t go. Would you? Whatever you say about the Rethugs, they know how to keep their members in line.
Democrats like Reid don’t even know how to spell party discipline let alone enforce it.
Do you think Joe wants Harry Reid or Dick Cheney as boss. Who would YOU want?
Yeah, I thought so.
P.S. After Pelosi caved on CAFE standards earlier this week, now let’s watch Reid cave on domestic spying. Fearless prediction; Reid will once again give Bush everything he asks for (re FISA in this case) and Abu Gonzales will be solely (and legally) in charge of the American Secret Police dossier building section……
And I won’t even be pissed because I am so used to being let down and pissed on by spineless Dems…….
A little more from that Salon interview:
Yeah, right.
I was watching the Senate on CSPAN this week and there was a vote on a bill and all of Lieberman’s subcommittee was late because of a “communications issue”.
It made me sick to watch the obsequious Holy Joe make excuses and even more so how Senator Reid mushed up to the jerk.
The sooner this self serving person is out of the spotlight, the better.
Lieberman’s smugness just makes me pewk.
Steve-AR @ 20
The organizing resolution was passed, and it leaves control in the D’s hands, even if Rape-Gurney Joe bolts. I don’t know what Reid et al. gave up to get that concession from the ‘thugs.
I think it’s time and past for Reid to law down the law with Joe Lie. Take his goddam gavel away, strip him of his seniority and let him go where he belongs.
As far as majorities go, 60 is the magic number for cloture, which is required to bring a bill to the floor for a vote. Some things are exempt from the open debate rule (conference reports, organizing resolutions, I’m sure some other things) and for most of those 51 is the magic number.
The Democrats really are doing the best they can, given the obstructions the ‘thugs keep throwing up. The ‘thugs are doing the things the minority needs to do to blockade legislations. The Democrats never had the inclination to play hard-ball when they were in the minority.
BC
There will be no decent legislation passed before the 2008 election anyway: Bush vetoes and GOP obstructionism ensure this. The ONLY way to get anything passed is the the senate to pick the most difficult to NOT vote for bills and for Reid, et al, to have informal “get togethers” with House members and BOTH decide on bill language so that there is NO NEED FOR CONFERENCE COMMITTEES and thus, removing a means of obstructionism from the GOP.
What am I getting at? The rules are such that even if Reid boots Liebershit completely and he officially caucuses with the GOP, the Dems still retain control of the Senate. They can STILL pull the no-conference-committee trick and force a few killer bills through and then all they need to do is hold out until 2008 when Lieberman WILL be rendered irrelevant. Even a single pickup by the Dems renders Lieberdickhead irrelevant. There is no gain whatsoever for Dems to keep Liebershitface happy and in the caucus (yeah, riiiiiight, he’s in the Dem caucus).
Dump the bastard, render him unelectable in CT next time around (there is no way he can get re-elected if he jumps, or is forced, into the orgy bed of the GOP). Best of all, the Dems picking up a single net set in 2008 renders Lieber, as I said above, irrelevant AND totally powerless – which will just kill that nasty f*ck. Doubleplus good!
The indications are that the Democrats are going to win big in 2008.
John at Americablog referred to Difi as Joe Liberman in drag. I though was very funny.
I believe (someone correct me if I am wrong) that that under the agreement that Majority Leader Reid worked out with McConnell at the beginning of the session would leave the Democrats in charge of the Senate for the remainder of this session even if there were to be a party switch by someone.
At least the Democrats had the forethought to work that out ahead of time.
Steve-AR @ 20
I pointed this out yesterday when another article from the NY Observer was quoted saying much the same thing. I agree. The organizing resolution is a done deal. The way it was written means that the Democrats keep control barring the Republicans finding 60 votes to change it until January 2009. Since committee chairpersons were designated by name, it also means that Holy Joe gets to keep his chairmanship of the DHS committee until January 2009.
It is the “club” atmosphere of the Senate and not a fear of losing control that is motivating Harry Reid and the Democrats.
LS @ 29
Doesn’t it. ;0)
I want Pelosi and Reid to suspend legislation of all bills for the duration of this Congress and spend that time on ending the war, oversight, and impeachment, so we can bring all of these criminals to justice. Screw the whiners.
Bargain Countertenor @ 32
Nothing. They had 51 votes; there was nothing the Repubs could do about it, no concessions needed.
The only reason Jeffords was able to turn the tables in 2001 was that the Dems controlled the chamber (with Gore) for the first two weeks, so they could have rammed through an organizing resolution keeping Dem control until 2003 if they felt like it. Instead, they created this “power sharing” structure with the caveat that any change in Senate membership would create a corresponding organizing resolution change. Jeffords switched, that provision kicked in, and the Dems then controlled the Senate.
(And proceeded to approve the Iraq war; nice going guys… not).
Adie @ 26
Great! This is when the Dem leadership gives away the entire Constitution to Bush/Cheney. This is when they declare that they are just tired…and besides, we haven’t been using the Constitution now for over 7 years anyway…so why not just make it official!
Upholding one’s oath of office is hard work! Too hard!
And then there’s this one from the Salon interview:
WTF is he talking about?
OT – HOUSE UPDATE:
House is back in session, live on C Span.
Pelosi/Reid presser op apparently evaporated.
Anyone else know what happened?
I’m tired of running in circles after these people!
Gummint’s makin’ sausage today…
Oklahoma kiddo @ 34
I saw that earlier. Aren’t those beautiful words!?! Let’s make it so! *g*
Keep the Repubs in Congress for the month of August arguing about FISA, and then give them NADA. Sounds like that might be what they are planning to do.
Adie @ 41
Earlier they said it would be on cspan 2 or 3 if House was back in session at the scheduled presser time.
EPU’ed, plus a link to one report I forget to post:
Public Service Announcement
While Chicago is in the limelight & visitors are here, I’d like to bring this to everyone’s attention.
Recently, BP Amoco (BP Petroleum) petitioned the State of Indiana for permission to drastically increase their volume of toxic dumping into Lake Michigan, from their Whiting Indiana refinery. Indiana granted the permission.
Involved are Ammonia, Mercury and what BP calls “Suspended Solids” (petro-sludge). Lake Michigan, as many know, is the source of drinking water for literally millions of people in several states. Whiting Indiana is visible from downtown Chicago, just a few miles south & east.
Since receiving approval for the increased dumping, opposition from state & local goverments, environmental groups, and many local grass roots organizations has been growing. Petitions are being circulated & law suits against BP are being threatened.
I urge everyone to help by signing petitions you may run across while in town. If you’re not here, on-line petitions are becoming available.
BP has little concern for our quality of life and resources. Likewise with George Bush’s EPA, who by granting BP tacit approval for the increased dumping, has sent the message that profits come before the interest & safety of the citizens.
Please help by being aware, spreading the word, and signing a petition to deny BP expanded toxic dumping rights.
Thanks
http://abclocal.go.com/wls/sto…..id=5489366
Mr. Lieberman is a betrayer of monstrous proportions.
Hi y’all–just dipping into the lake at the library and had to jump in wrt Lieberliar.
Lieberman and Feinstein– 2 war hawks that do not represent me.
That’s pretty much it.
War mongering corporatists are what they are– ptooey!
Hope that everyone has a wonderful time in Chicago!
{and elsewhere on our (burning and suffering) planet.}
hope to join in soon again.
oh and hey Joe– what about those still trying to survive on the Gulf Coast??? Huh???
LS @ 37
Then next year (Ghu willing), primary every one of the Dem leaders. Put Reid and Pelosi on notice, because they haven’t admitted yet that they can’t and won’t do the jobs they’ve been elected to do.
I also wonder: Will Joe-Lie, like Dianne Feinstein, vote for Southwick? That will be something.
Hmmmm…sounds like they are going to throw in emergency legislation for $200,000,000 for MN bridge reconstruction. That will get tied up for sure. They need to throw in a bunch of impossible bills at the last minute and cause an August “overmonther”.
Bargain Countertenor @ 31
with all due respect, i must object.
there was no reason for the suck up and 97-0 vote for the dangerous lieberman amendment s.amdt.2073.
On the FISA thing Bush wants from congress now bf they leave for recess:
I think that if Bush wants a new FISA he should trade Gonzales for it. Why give incompetence more responsibility? Also, any provision that would give anyone in office immunity from past illegal surveillance activity should be taken out bf congress considers it.
The pres/VP, communication cos., and others do not need legal immunity from past deeds in order for America to be safe now from terrorists.
Adie @ 41
Perhaps the Feingold threat to torpedo the FISA giveaway bill had the effect of torpedoing their presser to announce the giveaway.
holy shit!
watching c-span now. house floor. representatives are being asked to vote on the rule for the new fisa law. but there’s no legislation…. they’re being asked to vote on something.. and congress isn’t even being show it…
let alone us, the people.
this is what how our dems are running the house. WTF?!
I read that Pelosi and her husband had dinner at the WH with W and Laura earlier this week, following a meeting between W and Nancy.
The fix is in.
Finally, there’s this bit from the Salon interview:
selise @ 54
Shut congress down – wake us up 11/7/08.
Milan River @ 52
I would add that as part of the agreement, the Dems should “demand” that Patrick Fitzgerald be the replacement AG.
The next Dem Prez would then be well-served to KEEP Patrick on as their AG. An honest and uncorruptable AG is what we need, NOT a party hack (of either party).
LS @ 55
Please remove tin-foil. They are the leaders of their respective branches. They could have been talking about anything. Dining together does not signify collusion.
twolf1 @ 46
I’m keeping track of CSan 2 & 3, and it’s not there either. I’m hoping it might be good news they withdrew the presser, because earlier word had it they were gonna cave to boooosh on fysa.
Oh sigh…
House Dems not talking about “only just now” having received a copy of FISA… LIVE on C-1 currently. I’m gonna give up interrupting here. Sorry for all the mayhem folks.
Sausage now being made on CSpan 1 for anyone who can stomach watching….
Praedor Atrebates @ 55
sounds good to me ;->
just flipped on the cspan and Harmon sounds mad about FISA legislation – anyone know what’s going on?
Biodun @ 40
Thanks for this, Biodun (and thanks to all you FirePups who are here in the comments, you keep those of us at YKos well informed).
You know what this sounds like to me, besides a typical Republican non-response?
I think Joey’s got some ’splaining to do. Ever wonder why we’ve never seen any obvious investigation into his campaign slush fund???
How many folks do you think contacted the FEC and the DOJ asking them to look into this??
Ahem.
JF @ 59
You could be right. I could be right. We’ll never know. I’m not wearing tinfoil. Pelosi should not be socializing with a president who persists on showing blatant contempt of the body she represents. She should be impeaching his butt. My two cents.
selise @ 56
I just e-mailed my Democratic Congressman and reminded him just WHY we elected Democrats to congress last election.
OldCoastie @ 62
Yup: Harmon is ripping the carpet up with truth. I’m *really* hoping this is a good sign that chaos will continue to ensue so this crap does NOT get done.
Given how radical BushCo is, I do not think it is kind, or a good idea to tell anyone to remove tin foil hat. BushCo is tinfoilia incarnate.
selise @ 54
They used a rules vote to cover their sorry asses about a month ago on a vote for the war where they all caved with the exception of Kucinich, Hinchey, Jordan-Lee, and a couple of others.
Watch this and watch how Kucinich votes.
LS @ 55
The next day he mocked her in a presser. I don’t know if that means anything since Bush the Bully is forever mocking someone. But it was a hopeful sign.
oh gawd! David Drier busting Harmon’s chops!
that man has got to go!
If you think I’m wearing a tinfoil hat, you are wearing blinkers. So there! ;>
fdl reader @ 66
WHICH C-span?
Harman – “I’m not interested in lunacy” (as a response to Drier)
Milan River @ 67
I do not trust Bush at all. Pelosi, on the other hand, we have to put some trust in. We may not all agree on her tactics, but she is one of our few hopes at this point.
OK just spoke to DiFi’s office-sounds like they are getting an earful. Please -respectfully- call and inquire as to why she is doing this 202 224 3841
fdl reader @ 68
Dems are FURIOUS at only just now receiving copy of proposed FISA, & some don’t even have copies yet, but they’re being pressured to vote for it. They SHOULD be mad. I’M mad!
cspan – the main channel (one, I guess you’d call it)
I’m waiting for fistacuffs
I love it when they all start screaming and fighting…popcorn
james @ 69
oh i remember that. my rep (jim mcgovern) is vice chair of the rules committee… i was mad as hell.
Adie @ 60
You’re not interrupting, Adie, you’re keeping us apprised of the goings on which I, for one, really appreciate.
I don’t have the stomach to watch this either. Out here in L.A. what they’re now doing is known as “putting skin on baloney” & I frankly don’t have time for it, plus got to head out to work.
Read you all this evening…
Alcee Hastings tearing up the floor…
Why hasn’t somebody found a way to yank this into committee if this FISA bill is so contentious???
Crazy.
LS @ 64:
My own sentiments precisely. The contempt is not only blatant but also, shall we say, palpable.
Hastings ripping them a new one!!! Yeehaw!
LS
I was supporting you.
Praedor Atrebates @ 74
C-Span 1
LS @ 64
This is a man “heading” an administration whose number two tells a member of the Senate to “Go fuck yourself” when that member is trying to show some comity and Bush never disowned the comment or the attitude it betrayed.
Pelosi should not be fraternizing, not with these people, not at this time, not while they continue to lie about TILLMAN and everything else.
Remember perception management?
Well, this ain’t how you do it…you let Bush appear less than lizard-like and that ain’t what we want.
LS, see your two cents and raise you two cents.
they keep trying to get Alcee to yield but he wouldn’t…
Milan River @ 85
I know, I was adding to my reply to JF just for fun. :} Thanks.
LS @ 79
It is healthy and we need more of it!!!!!!
Senate just showed up with legislation.
nitwit Lungren up.
james @ 88
Me three.
Lungren trying to get McConnell to oversee warantless wiretap. Invoking “Clinton did it too”.
LS @ 88
Woot Woot Woot I gotta new hero to look up to.
WOWEEEEEEE!
Throw s’more hotpeppass into that sassage!
Effing Lungren is on? Ok, now I really must leave…
Lungren declares, “single most important bill I’ve ever seen”.
There are many important things for my party to accomplish. Dealing with Joe Lieberman is one of them.
We support the Speaker. We want Al Gore as the next president. And we will support Senator Clinton should the Senator be the nominee of our party to be the next president of the United States.
Get the Repewks so pissed off they walk out again and then say…too bad, so sad..you left…no bill..Repubs walk out on FISA….
Maybe they would rather stay in Washington than face the voters……..
Isn’t this what they did with the PATRIOT act?
This asshole is complaining because no one had a chance to read this thing?
OldCoastie @ 100
sumbuddy puleeze find the lad his glasses. He wouldn’t know if he sat on um.
Would the gentleman yield?
Would the gentleman yield?
Would the gentleman yield?
Would the gentleman yield?
Would the gentleman yield?
Would the gentleman yield?
Would the gentleman yield?
Bwaaahahahahahahah
My friend suggests to me, that the bottom line is to get rid of the Republicans.
concern troll, Mike Rogers from Michigan is blaming the dems for obstructing the legislation since last year.
I said this when we first gained the majority and lieberman threatened to vote against our interest;
when my parents used to buy me a gift that I really wanted they would once in a while try to withold that gift as a punsihment when I did something wrong
even as a child I would have none of it, each and every time they witheld a gift of theirs as punsishment I never used that gift again, as far as I was concerned, a gift was mine it’s not a tool of theirs like a carrot on a stick
I accepted punsishment but I would not be carrot and stick prodded like some jack ass
in hind sight now I see I was pretty darned sophisticated when I was young
anyway, we need to purge this judas sheep known as liarman from our party
solai @ 69
Nope. The mocking shows further dissing, and adds to the utter contempt that he has for Congress.
LS @ 106
707!
1. Lieberman, the (I)diot, was brought back in and given his power back by Reid in and many other other top Dems.
For a reason!
2. Lieberman will never become a Republican and give up his chairmanships. NEVER.
3. And most important, the DLC Dems now in full power in both Houses, have us all by the balls.
We were all suckers.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 108
Getting rid of the Republicans is called electoral euthanasia.
off topic guys sorry
this is one of the most riveting conspiracy movies I have ever seen
there are some contentions and points which obviously we’re not gonna agree with but man that is one powerfull piece
you have to get past the intro before the fun starts but have a look see
Shorter Rogers: Protect the troops ~ Pass FISAlite!
ol’ Mikey sayin’ we need this bill to protect the soldiers and protect the “homeland”
ew.
The DLC is the thorn under the saddle.
As feisty as the argument between them is, I don’t see how they can possibly pass it.
Dems. Dig your heels in for what is right. Let them sit out there with their stinkin’ illegal intelligence activities.
Mike Rogers…”and even The Homeland”
“For the Homeland this is not the place for gamesmanship.”
Foooking Traitor to America!!!!
OldCoastie @ 107
that gives me hope! excellent.
although i really need to see what bill it is they are arguing about.
Anyone surprised that the fix is in? How many Democrats in Congress can we honestly say are there to defend the Constitution and the people?
Mr Rogers was an FBI agent in the midwest during the time Coleen Rawley and her colleagues were trying to get warrants to look at Moussaui’s laptop. Denied by a guy who was later promoted within the organization.
Where was this guy when the Bush administration was eviscerating the Bill of Rights?
He was in the Congress…elected in November 2000. Throughout the entire rape of our constitution this asshat has been there doing the bidding of the fucking White House.
I never heard him complain about the PATRIOT act being rushed through or about the use of torture to extract info or the loss of habeas corpus for US citizens.
Adie @ 76
Chimpy, rather like your parents, has taken away our Constitution… but let me say I will be damn glad to get it back again and I will use it to the utmost
Republicans can no longer refer to our country by its name. So, go move yourselves to your precious “Homeland” and get the hell out of the United States of America. Traitors.
I pledge allegience to the flag of the Homeland.
Shame.
LS @ 117
Gods give me hope: that’s the feeling I’ve got too!
selise @ 118: THEY don’t even all have the text either! Unbelievable.
He’ll retain his chairmanship even if he switches. Committee chairs are fixed by name till the end of this Congress.
A red flag on that Jefferson verdict??
http://rawstory.com/news/2007/….._0803.html
The US Appeals Court for the District of Columbia Circuit: anyone know their history??
This doesn’t smell good…
Another reason why FDL is so important: I seldom watched cspan before finding this site. It was too difficult to understand what was going on. But now, with notes in front of me, everything is more clear.
Thanks again, everyone.
Go Reyes! “Days of rubberstamp congress are over.”
Repubs might walk out again….move to adjourn…this would be good!!!
Walk away Repubs!!!!!!!!
Walk away from your illegal activities.
Go…NOW
So let me get this straight I think we can kick Joe out of his commitee chair and still keep control of the Senate? If that is so then where’s the downside?
Joe is the Chairman of the Homeland Security Commitee if we were to get a new chair who would use the subpeona power of that office to investigate things. Things like the Homeland Security mess handling Katrina.
The advantage would be ours. Keeping Joe has no benefit.
solai @ 127
Me too!
Motion to adjourn the house to ask DCI if he LIKES this bill??? Wow! Pop more popcorn!
LS @ 90
Sorry, had to be away for a minute. I agree that I don’t like that Pelosi met w/ Bush, but to ascribe (is that the right word? Is that even a word?) their meeting to collusion is highly doubtful. After the verbal slaps she’s given him, I do not see them conspiring. Blinkers on! ;)
This is revolting.
http://news.yahoo.com/photo/07…..MEnptH2ocA
OT
US Cannot Account for 190,000 Guns in Iraq: Report
Published on Thursday, August 2, 2007 by Agence France Presse
US Cannot Account for 190,000 Guns in Iraq: Report
by AFP staffwriters
BAGHDAD – The US government cannot account for 190,000 weapons issued to Iraqi security forces in 2004 and 2005, according to an investigation carried out by the Government Accountability Office.
According to the July 31 report, the military “cannot fully account for about 110,000 AK-47 assault rifles, 80,000 pistols, 135,000 items of body armour and 115,000 helmets reported as issued to Iraqi forces.”
…
…
US commanders often accuse foreign powers such as Iran of supplying arms to illegal militias fighting in Iraq, but the report shows they cannot fully account for the hundreds thousands of weapons they brought in themselves.
Last month, Turkey raised concerns over reports that separatist Kurdish guerrillas launching cross-border raids from northern Iraq had received US-supplied guns supposedly destined for Iraqi security forces.
So the terrorists are attacking us with our own guns. While we try to pin Iran for smuggling in guns, we lose enough to fully arm over 100,000 geurillas/terrorists/insurgents.
The Iraqi military is in on this fix. What WE NEED – Instead of setting up FISA for us American citizens, why can’t we start wiretapping Iraqi generals, commanders, and down the chain of command so that we can actually find out who is our ally and who is our enemy?
And of course, having seperatists attacking sovereign countries like Turkey isn’t going to help. And this is how we drag -another- country into The War On Terror (TWOT).
Redux of last night possibly. If not now, it might occur later.
Voting machine not working..again…hee, hee, hee.
Wilson from NM asks for recess to determine if the DCI actually saw the proposed legislation (apparently, the Dems have introduced the bill after hammering a compromise with McConnell late last night but the pugs don’t believe it).
15 minute vote on recess now.
I’m lost on this atrocity
bill on FISA. What is in it? They are blindly voting on a bill sight unseen? The senate rushed in their version? WHAT IS IN IT?!
solai @ 128
yes… it really helps to have us all try to figure it out together.
LS @ 135
Does it have a paper trail?
Praedor Atrebates @ 138
i just called senator reid’s office. they couldn’t tell me what’s going on either.
Somebody on the Dem side needs to cobble tohether a quick meaningless amendment to this thing and introduce it, just to keep the House in session to piss of the GOP loing enough to get things sorted out.
JF @ 132
It is extremely difficult to stick to your guns on anything without caving somewhat if you are socializing with someone. What I mean by “fix” is compromise. Pelosi has no business putting herself in a position where compromise is a possibility. That was my meaning. :}
now, I may be wrong, but I think it was the Dems who didn’t produce the actual bill… that the negotiations went so late that only those on the Intelligence committee know what is in it…
but that’s just my impression.
vote is to end the workday… hmm – wonder if they will work tomorrow?
House is voting on w/n to adjourn, and end legislative work for the day.
Do it! Go home before this goddamm FISA mess has enough time to clear up the issues.
Go home!
Oklahoma kiddo @ 133
Another WH photo op. Would that they had put as much effort into attending memorial services for the 4,063 killed American soldiers.
Your are so right, it is revolting
selise @ 140
WHAT?! THEY have already passed the bill and they don’t know what they passed?
Praedor Atrebates @ 137
See my answer to JF at 142.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 133
Yep. The husband is coming in tomorrow. See, the Repugs will be having their convention here in the Twin Cities, so…
BELOW IS NOT MY QUOTE!!!
nomolos @ 123
All this complaining from people who relegated Democrats to basement rooms for meetings, who turned off mikes during debates, who extended votes for three hours or more to ensure they had the numbers they needed.
LS @ 142
Point taken. Agreed.
Walk out…Please!
Adjourn.
Go away.
Keep FISA in its currently “illegal” status!!! Then get ‘em.
May direct not must direct
How long did it take junior to get to Mississippi & Louisiana 2 yrs ago?
Ooh, poor babies! The Republicans are stymied by what they think are malfunctioning voting machines.
Jay Carney, Mike Allen and Glenn Greenwald on the same panel.
This should be fun.
Adie @ 149
Praedor Atrebates @ 147
i don’t think the senate has passed anything yet… just negotiations (but i could be wrong!)
Adie @ 149
Oooops sorry it was perris at 108. I screwed up somehow and am dreadfully sorry
Heather Wilson wants to
Run away, run away.
Yeah, Heather, and stay there when you get there.
LS @ 152
,i>
Adjourn.
Go away.
Keep FISA in its currently “illegal” status!!! Then get ‘em.
Exactly. To hell with George Fucking Bush’s urgent need for more dictatorial power for himself and Abu.
Gotta wonder why the Repub’s made the Motion though. I’m missing something here.
selise @ 158
What was the announcement from the senate then? I thought they indicated that they have a bill…
cancer_cures @ 134
This is actually quite a common problem. Why just a few months ago I myself put 190,000 guns in a closet but when I came back to check on them a few weeks ago they were GONE! I suspect mice.
Oh, yeah?
This guy is really something.
re the Senate vote – I thought a couple of people showed up with a big pile of bills for consolidation (might just be one) a little while ago – don’t know if it is FISA but that would be my guess.
With Wilson’s motion and Trent Lott telling congress to flee till after September 12, I can only suspect Bush has a bag full of recess appointments he wants to make.
Stop everything…voting machine display malfunction. Oh, the irony.
jayt @ 161
Exactly. To hell with George Fucking Bush’s urgent need for more dictatorial power for himself and Abu.
Gotta wonder why the Repub’s made the Motion though. I’m missing something here.
They can’t stand the truth. Hastings punched a hole in their bubble with reality and truth.
Blog & Mainstream Media panel is running on Ustream YKos feed now:
http://ustream.tv/channel/year…..ntion-2007
Adie – sometimes when people trim down a quote, the attribution gets messed up because the comment box is too tiny to see the entire thing.
Pach:
Mike Allen? Politico’s Mike Allen? That twerp!
ironranger @ 167
Stop everything…voting machine display malfunction. Oh, the irony.
Not to mention that it’s the Repub’s who are bitching about it…..
Hugh @ 163
Missing guns this month, missing money last month, missing arms and legs every month. Dubya smirks.
JF @ 139
paper trail doesn’t help, most people won’t know their votes were flipped and the paper trail will reflect the flip if they don’t check
in other words, an audit will show the flipped result not the voted result
nomolos, perris,
thanks guys for explanation, i guess.
still seems weird it could happen.
would appreciate it if someone would backtrack and fix it all. thanks.
I hope the “new” FISA bill is about 20,000 pages long. That would keep them there until September.
jayt@173: Typical, typical, typical. My kids were better behaved & had more common sense by the time they were 10.
Biodun @ 173
Yep. Mr. “1×2×6″ himself.
Swopa is choming at the bit to ask a question.
LS @ 177
How long was the Ptriot Act? How long did they spend reading that?
Kathryn in MA @ 19
I thought the same thing.
Praedor Atrebates @ 163
i thought it was a copy of the bill – probably from the negotiators that the senate will also be voting on???
but i am very confused and just guessing here.
LS @ 177
… but only IF they READ it. *sigh*
JF @ 180
It was really long. I don’t think they read it at all. /s
perris @ 175
So? I would check the paper before I i validated the final vote. That is the way it is SUPPOSED to work and the point of the paper trail: to check to validate that it matches with what you voted (or think you voted for) and then hitting a “confirm” button of some sort to make it official.
This is actually quite a common problem. Why just a few months ago I myself put 190,000 guns in a closet but when I came back to check on them a few weeks ago they were GONE! I suspect mice.
You too?
I’m not thinking mice – more likely *rats*
Wasn’t it Conyers who famously said, ‘We don’t read …”
Margot @ 181
I cannot find any citation for Bush saying that (August terror attack). Someone cited the ACLU claiming that yesterday, but I am not finding any link to this specific Bush statement.
LS @ 178
won’t make a bit of difference to those who don’t plan on reading it.
on the other hand… i do want to read it… and 20,000 is too long for me.
Wilson motion to adjourn? Margot @ 181
Do you have a link of Bush saying this. Couldn’t find verification.
Guys, Joe’s their whore–bought and paid for and now he has to perform. Hell with him.
If they DON’T fully read the FISA bill, and it contains language that undermines the Repubs (which it surely will), they will be held responsible for voting for what they don’t want…which is oversight by Congress and the FISA court. It may contain language that ultimately exempts the AG for that matter…who knows…
Leave it be. Leave it in its currently illegal status. Right now, it is illegal, because a judge recently deemed it so. Hence the rush. They are currently breaking the law!!!
This is really fun watching the consternation of the Republicans on C-SPAN.
Praedor Atrebates @ 185
what I’m saying is you and I would check but most people wouldn’t and there is the rub
if a vote is flipped and most people don’t recognize the flip or are too embarrassed because it looks like they made a mistake, then a paper trail is meaningless
what I’m saying is we need paper ballots, no e voting period
Repubs!!! Go on vacation and continue breaking the law. Go for it.
OMG! The voting malfunction has Bilbray in conniptions because he can’t check the votes to make sure he votes *correctly!*
Bright sunshine!
Biodun @ 172
Glenn Greenwald had a piece about Allen today on his blog. The Politico was put together by conservative suckups and shills from the WaPo John Harris and Jim VandeHei using money from conservative media owner Robert Albritton. It has the same relationship to real journalism as a $3 bill has to real money.
This is way OT but I am pissed….
There is no showing of No End In Sight within 1 1/2 hours of me. I hate living in this red mecha of a blue state.
David W. Bartoo @ 187
Yes, it was. Conyers is seen plain as day speaking that line in Moore’s F-9ll.
LindaR @ 193
I have never, ever seen the Repubs so rattled.
I suspect LIEberman will be dealt with in good time. The only question is if he can sniff the wind well enough to jump before being booted.
LS @ 179
so… are we even gonna have any idea how this House FISA vote came out, much less what it means???
voting display not working.
clock not working.
are their lights on?
Diebo*d label on any of those?
IF Pelosi & Reid actually have the huzpah to hold a presser after this awful mess is finished, whut the bloomin’ heck will they say? EGAD!
This smacks of Florida & Ohio.
Now they know how WE felt on election day!?!
“The engineers are working on the problem” says the Chair. Oh goodie. How comforting.
Dorothy, where are yoooooo?
Yeah, apparently the votes are being tallied correctly, but they are having fits because they can’t see how other people voted!
LS @ 184
It was really long. I don’t think they read it at all. /s
Don’t know the exact answer – but it was *very* long, very much written in legalese adding and amending current law by code numbers only. I tried to sit down with it one time, and IAAL, couldn’t do it. I figured that if I had been *in* a law library, with a staff running back and forth to cross-reference and analyze full effect, etc., I could do it in a few days, if I had nothing else whatsoever to do.
Members got 2 or 3 days, max, IIRC.
No way that *huge* bill was put together in the amount of time between 9-11 and the introduction of the bill. It was ready to go – just needed a reason to push it.
Praedor Atrebates @ 39
well, I’m tired, and I’m still here! get to work Nancy and Harry.
The Repubs of the 109th Congress knew all along that the FISA law was being violated. The Dems, except for a very few, were sworn to secrecy with a threat of a felony.
The FISA law is currently illegal. The Repubs are complicit in the breaking of this law – then and now.
“There hasn’t been a single consequential vote on which he’s strayed from the GOP line.”
Excellent point, Christy.
And one which Hillary Clinton HAS to be aware of. :o)
I can’t believe what children these Republicans are being, my gawd.
Adie @ 202
This vote, is a vote to “adjourn” by Heather Wilson.
LS @ 198
Be still my beating heart! Do it! Do it! Recess because the voting machines are broken!
Steny asking to vacate the vote so the machines can be fixed.
selise @ 189
Now, you and I and all our friends, much as we’d like to read this thrilling narrative, ain’t gonna get that chance. This here’s a democracy and ONLY secrecy is keepin’ us safe. Our betters, why, they know better than we. How much is enough? Secrecy, cowardice or complicity?
Adie @ 203
i don’t think this is the fisa rule vote. this is on if the house will ajourn to ask for dni mcconnel’s opinion on the fisa legislation (that i don’t think anyone has seen) before voting on the rule…. and then voting on the bill.
Vacate the vote???
The GOP is going to cry if they have to start this all over again.
Have they never heard of technical difficulties?
OldCoastie @ 210
Oh, ain’t that too bad…they’ll have to change their flights…
at least today they are laughing about vacating the vote…
All hands on deck!
Bush is telling the Democrats that he’s going to order them to stay in session unless they pass a FISA deform he likes. (And while he can’t order them to pass specific bills, he CAN keep Congress in session.)
Here’s what you tell them when they ask why they should call Bush’s bluff here:
1) No recess means no recess appointments by Bush!
2) It preserves DCCC’s and DSCC’s fundraising leads over RCCC and RSCC (they need the August recess mainly to fundraise, and they need it MUCH more than the Dems do)
3) They can hold more hearings!
4) They don’t have to pass Bush’s bills (he can keep you in session, but he can’t control what you vote on), but work on other stuff (such as impeaching AGAG).
Here are the numbers:
1 (800) 828 – 0498
1 (800) 459 – 1887
1 (800) 614 – 2803
1 (866) 340 – 9281
1 (866) 338 – 1015
1 (877) 851 – 6437
“The Homeland”
The image of a Storm Trooper flashes in my minds eye, every time I hear that phrase.
I know that invoking Nazi’s is often frowned upon and seen as a debate cop-out.
But I’m not copping out when I see the “Homeland” Nazis…I’m recalling Germany’s broken spirit, climate of fear & nationalist reactionism that created such terms.
Dreir having a little hissy fit.
LindaR @ 201
Which, by the way, is perfectly OK and they know it.
David W. Bartoo @ 212
oh, we’ll get to read it alright. just probably not before it’s voted on.
Phoenix Woman @ 215
Yes!!!! ATTACK!!!
what in the world did they do before computers were invented?
Why can’t they just vote their own conscience without needing to know how everyone else voted?
Can’t they act without the mob?
Dreier is touting the seriousness of the matter…heh, heh…yeah…Dreier..your little spying game is currently illegal.
fdl reader @ 194
Oops … that was Dreier … still from CA.
OldCoastie @ 222
And on such stuff the fate of the free world rests!
Gunga Djinn @ 216
Dubya always refers to the US as the Homeland, and him as the Commander in Chief. Always. It is the cult of personality surrounding the Bushies. Democractic President must introduce legislation to change the name of Homeland Security. Maybe something like Domestic Security, or something like that.
It’s definitely time to boot Lieberman out. Pandering to keep him in the party is just a distraction, and it sends the wrong message. He lied to get elected, the people of CT will have to deal with that next election.
Regarding FISA: If there is another terrorist act in this country in the next few months, the Bushies should be #1 on the suspect list. A real terrorist can recognize that he can’t do a better job than GWB at terrorizing the American people, and it would be pointless to try. I would be keeping a VERY close eye on Cheney and his merry band of thieves.
Dapper Dave Dreier – pompous little pissy ass…
Phoenix Woman @ 217
All hands on deck!
Bush is telling the Democrats that he’s going to order them to stay in session unless they pass a FISA deform he likes. (And while he can’t order them to pass specific bills, he CAN keep Congress in session.)
Can the Congress likewise order George Fucking Bush to stay in his office and give up his quality time with the brush of Crawford Texas?
Phoenix Woman @ 217 –
i’ve already called my congress critters (and reid and pelosi) twice today.
are there anyother people you know of, who are key to these decisions, that i can call?
LindaR @ 206
Children of the Cornholes.
-GSD
new thread
Phoenix Woman @ 215
Sounds to me like BushCo really doesn’t want ANYBODY to go home to hear what the people have to say about all this bushit!
No Recess!!!!
Bush ordering no recess? Perfect. Who’d a thunk he’d do our work for us. Hmmmmm.
The only people who truly will be pissed will be the Repubs.
Bwwwhahahahahah…love..it.
LindaR @ 205
Dryer has the gall to say this would be entertaining, if it weren’t so serious…
Dryer all in a tizzzy over exact period of time for which the vote has been being held open.
Lets have a pool.
I put 2cents on vote total of 1550/23 for adjournment.
Hugh @ 162
aaaah. there is now a wad of gum stuck to my screen! I’m just glad I didnt swallow it. very funny hugh.
Award for the Sound Bite of the Day goes to:
“…I make a motion that we adjourn UNTIL THE MACHINE IS FIXED“.
LS @ 234
I think he’s bluffing big-time, which is why we need to call the Democrats and tell them to call his bluff:
1) No recess means no recess appointments by Bush!
2) It preserves DCCC’s and DSCC’s fundraising leads over RCCC and RSCC (they need the August recess mainly to fundraise, and they need it MUCH more than the Dems do)
3) They can hold more hearings!
4) They don’t have to pass Bush’s bills (he can keep you in session, but he can’t control what you vote on), but work on other stuff (such as impeaching AGAG).
Here are the numbers:
1 (800) 828 – 0498
1 (800) 459 – 1887
1 (800) 614 – 2803
1 (866) 340 – 9281
1 (866) 338 – 1015
1 (877) 851 – 6437
Gunga Djinn @ 237
So they’ve adjourned? Excellent!
Phoenix Woman @ 215
And
5) Bush will look like an ass cutting bruch in Crawford TX for three weeks.
LS @ 198
Karl must be taking names.
Oh my, Hoyer is using the calm-down-the-child-having-tantrum voice.
Actually, didn’t I read recently that boosh had a bunch-a weeds, I mean weed, to chop down on his plantation?
perfect karma…
they’re in perpetual session, with no recess possible.
beep beep beep
ALERT
THIS IS NOT A TEST
Please to stay at your desk until further notice.
REPEAT.
THIS IS NOT A TEST
ALERT
beep beep beep
Phoenix Woman @ 239
I’m not sure if they’ve adjourned, just saying that that phrase was priceless…
*THE* machine is definately broken. And it needs fixin’.
:)
LS @ 122
They will not leave of their own accord. They may have to be forced out.
TiredFed @ 241
Taking names? He already has them.
What’s teh problem?
……no documents
……………no testimony
…………………..no way, jose!
do insead
…….federal elections by paper ballots only
…………..publically funded federal elections
…………………..short, strict, structured campaign seasons
Mitch McConnell is shilling on CPSAN2 about the FISA law, replay.
Have made four calm and rational phone calls to congress in the past hour stating my, and other FDL patriots good sense sentiments and ideas about not voting on the new and improved FISA at this time. Hope its not too late. Met with courtesy and sensed sincerity in their communication that the message would be passed on to the Ohio critters. No rolling eyeballs detected on the other end of the line. I think the aids get the importance of the thing going on.
The DNI sent his request to update FISA in April. Now, in August, its come to a point of being CRITICAL to our national security.
When did the republicans start sounding the horn on just how urgent this is and is there merit tot he argument?
How many of the elements (authorizations) in the bill are responsive to the stated issue?
Are some of the newest authorities a further expansion of executive power without oversight?
Correction-spelling aides with an e.
Phoenix Woman @ 215
is this man really this much a moron?
doesn’t he know we WANT congress to stay in session?
as far as a fisa law he “likes”
congress nees to SLAP HIM DOWN right there and then with this;
“the president is going to get a fisa law that protects our national security and our constitution, he is NOT going to get a law that allows officials to steal information without a judge to make sure they aren’t stealing”
then hit him with THIS;
“if we are attacked while the president refuses to guard our constitution and national security it will be because he has kept the inept in office, he has forsaken his oath and our constitution and he has refused to accept the oversight that is neccessary for this government to operate.
this president thinks he is above the law, the thinks anything that he doesn’t want exposed to his boss, the people of America, falls in the catagory of “executive priviledge”
the president is on branch of three branches and he is not entitled to avoid the oversite that is neccessary for our survival”
or something like that
Reid on C-Span; Pelosi standing by grinning widely. (2:19 PM CST; 1419 hours)
I’ve never understood the whole “we need to keep Joe because of the narrow margin” thing.
It assumes the Joe would actually vote against his convictions (such as they are) just to spite the Dems.
Which I suppose is a fair assumption.
I guess the real problem is the way the situation is typically framed. It’s usually framed as if all close votes would just magically go the other way if a Senator changes his party affiliation.
A crucial element is missing from this version: This only happens if the Senator in question is a weasel.
A Senator with integrity would choose his party based on his values, and therefore (in a perfect world) his votes.
Joe is threatening to do the opposite. Because he’s a weasel.
how does one go to YKOS? I live in Chicago, can one just walk into the convention center to meet the likes of Christy and Jane and Pach and Scarecrow and all, or did one already have to get a ticket or a pass?
Harry and Nancy better hold on to their asses:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..v=hcmodule
“…
“And while I’m at it, Dianne Feinstein just made the shit list.”
This wasn’t a great decision by Senator Feinstein. But this kind of rhetoric is idiotic, exactly the kind of self-destructive circular firing squad that we don’t want to get ourselves into.
orcatjf @ 256
IIRC, registration closed a couple of weeks ago.
DiFi shouldn’t have JUST made the shit list. She has been playing this game for years. With so many rabid right-wingers even worse, she gets little attention to her shenanigans.
Someone needs to run against her next time. (When is her term up?)
selise @ 9
Lieberman is closer to them politically than Lamont or anyone here. That’s the sad truth of it.