It is a persistent theme from President Bush and his compliant party that they are never responsible for the dreadful consequences of their failed policies. To the extent they even concede that things are going badly in Iraq, Afghanistan or elsewhere it is someone else’s fault.
The White House’s latest spin on the National Intelligence Estimate is that it’s Pakistan’s fault for allowing Osama bin Ladin to reemerge as strong as ever along the Pakistan-Afghanistan border, even though everyone knows that Bush/Cheney ignored their Secretary of State, their intelligence professionals and senior military leaders and took their eye off the ball by invading Iraq when they should have focused on Afghanistan.
If you want a more plausible translation of the NIE, watch Roger Cressey on Countdown. Christy nailed it last night, beating today’s NYT editorial to the punchline: “Shorter [de-spun] Fran Townsend: The NIE proves President Bush is a failure and his failed policies have made you less safe. But it’s not our fault and don’t worry, we’re taking the increased threat to our credibility security very seriously.”
If the Taliban are surging, it’s NATO’s fault, according to this White House, because our allies don’t understand the threat and put too many restrictions on their troops’ willingness to engage in combat, even though every one of our allies knows that the reason we have too few troops in Afghanistan to confront a resurgent Taliban is because the necessary combat forces are bogged down in Iraq. If too many Afghani civilians are killed from air strikes, turning the population against US/NATO forces, it’s because the Taliban hide among the people, not because we didn’t have the boots on the ground and either didn’t know who we were targeting or didn’t care about the collateral damage.
Listening to Tony Snow explain it, if the American people hate this war, it’s not because the Administration misled them into accepting an unnecessary war and then completely bungled its planning and execution. And it’s not because the Vice President and Secretary of Defense encouraged and condoned the evils of Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo, while no senior official was ever held accountable. And it’s not because the Administration is breaking our Army and Marines and National Guard with stop-loss, multiple deployments, extended tours, insufficient rest and recuperation, ill-defined missions, changing purposes, undefined enemies, or that the Administration ignored the needs of our returning soldiers. No, according to President Bush it’s the American peoples’ fault for not being patient enough, or not sufficiently understanding the threat, or tiring too soon, or allowing the violence to affect our psychology, or — most galling to vets when it comes from these privileged chicken hawks — not being willing to sacrifice to achieve the President’s vision.
Before Petraeus, Bush blamed the Iraq debacle on his own Generals, even though he himself picked them and assured the American people they had the right plan — which, it now turns out, is probably what the President will go back to when Petraeus’ plan doesn’t get the job done.
And now it’s the Democrats’ fault for failing to support the war, even though 70 percent of the public agrees with them on ending our occupation and even though Congress has approved every one of the President’s requests for authorizations, troops, and funds.
In last night’s marathon Senate debate, the Republican Party repeatedly blamed the “surrender” advocates, “partisan” Democrats (thanks Joe) who allegedly seek a “precipitous” withdrawal, even though every single proposal by the Democrats and a handful of disillusioned Republicans says nothing about surrender or a precipitous withdrawal. Instead, the Democratic proposals call for the military to develop plans for a gradual withdrawal consistent with our soldiers’ safety, which means every plan has always given General Petraeus until next spring for his “surge” to work. And every Democratic proposal in the Senate would leave unknown thousands of troops in Iraq to defend Iraqi territorial integrity from outside invasion (except ours) and for counter-terrorism, as well as “force protection.” In short, the President’s Republicans, at the urging of Bill Kristol who claims credit for the “precipitous withdrawal” framing, are simply lying about what this entire debate is about.
This long overdue Congressional debate is good for the country. The country needs this debate to continue. But the debate is not about a precipitous withdrawal. It is about redefining the mission, with the hope of bringing the mission in line with something more plausible, more consistent with the level of troops we can sustain, and most important, consistent (one hopes) with a more defensible view of our security interests and the virtues we respect as a nation. The Democrats may not have all the right answers yet, because we haven’t really had the debate about what those interests and virtues are and what they imply for the use of US military might, but at least Democrats are starting to ask the right questions: What should we be doing there? What justifies having our military forces engaged in that region? What can they accomplish, and what must we just accept or solve through other means? And what are our strategic interests and the virtues we want to project to others?
The White House and the Republicans do not want to have that debate, because they know they will lose it. They know it would mean that everything they’ve done so far in this war would be called into question. They know they can’t defend anything this President has done or anything he or his Vice President have said. They can’t defend this occupation’s rationale, and they can’t look the American people in the eye and tell them their selective sacrifices have been worth it. So they’ve been reduced to claiming that we should continue to make war because in their twisted logic that’s what supporting the troops means. They’ve got nothing left but a cowardly, deceptive slogan.
Don’t expect Mitch McConnell and his sinking Republican party, including the extreme war partisan Joe Lieberman, to admit any of this. This regime doesn’t believe in accountability or accepting responsibility. So when every thing fails, you can expect this crowd will point a finger at someone else.
For other reactions to the Senate debate, the NYT has early a.m. coverage (h/t N=1), and check out Bob Geiger, live blogging at Think Progress, and a YouTube of repeated Republican objections to voting on the Reed-Levin amendment. What else are you seeing out there?
Related posts:
- The Failure of Phantom Victory in Afghanistan
- Afghanistan Review: We Know Failure When We See It
- Afghanistan: 21,000 Plus 13,000 – or Plus 115,000?
- Changing of the Guard: US Troops Withdraw from Iraqi Cities; Maliki Declares “Sovereignty Day”
- Torture: Obama Heeded Maliki on Abuse Photos, Says McClatchy; What That Says for Our Occupation





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wow…
sorry, twice this morning. no sleep making me loopy..
Good morning Scarecrow!
Morning! Thanks, Scarecrow, for writing such insightful and compelling posts.
Inhofe-Iraq trained the terrorists! Saddam=Hitler
Talk radio & Fox keep the troops informed, they don’t have to rely on CNN
Seriously, A HUGE thank-you to all the posters/mods/lurkers.. you ROCK!!!. So many people have faith that we can turn this mess around and YOU GUYS deserve huge Kudo’s for giving us a place to vent, learn and share…
Thank-you
Double caw!
nonplussed @ 5
——————————————-
Which means they can hear the propaganda……
did Inhofe just say that the US and iWaqi troops were getting intimate? I wonder if they allow them to go to the bathroom together?
CSPAN all nite. *blergh*
All I heard was the same things from the repugs. But it was all over at 7:30 this morn when Inhofe took to the podium and listed his conservative credentials.
Ewwwww! Iccckkkk!
Everytime I see him, all I think of is “what an ass-backwards fuck”.
preznit giv me turkee @ 9
He did indeed and he said they were learning to love one another. Makes me feel good all over… a giant love in in Bagdahd, flowers, d*pe, music and VDub busses everywhere. So much fun can’t wait to do it again on the banks of the Tigress.
Fran “Al-Queda WRIT LARGE!” Townsend sucks.
Good Morning all.. Had to catch a bit of sleep.. Why is there a Cloture vote at 11:00 ?? What happened to a straight up and down vote ?? Did Evil Bitch McConnell win ?? Am I having a nightmare ?
Good morning marathoners. Today’s NYT has a lead editorial that echoes what Christy said about Fran Townsends spin of the NIE. I’d added it to the third paragraph.
Anyone stay up for the dueration?
Ah, Scarecrow, thanks again. Still. Already.
I haven’t even looked at the MSM yet to see how it all came out. But some things you just know.
For months, I have watched in horrified fascination as it occurred to me the Iraqis are being set up as the ultimate fall-guys for the failure of George’s Lovely War.
BushCo blew in, blasted infrastructure to smithereens, destroyed much of the country (literally), killed (murdered?) Iraq’s people, positioned itself to siphon off mega-profits and oil, played warrior king and now BushCo says, “What’s wrong with you people that you can’t get it together? What ingrates you are for disrespecting our war!”
Point the finger of blame at the country we “rescued.”
These people have absolutely no shame and apparently no souls.
FWIW,
Please call your Senators and tell them that you watched all nite. This will give the Majority the reason to continue with making the obstructionists stand for CYA’ing the Presidents azz.
If you live in a state that has your senators supporting the prez, puh-leze call and get others to call. These senators are like cockroaches. The will shudder in their shoes when they find out that we stayed up and observed their nonsense.
CALL YOUR SENATOR. Your call may be the one that makes a difference.
Morning, all–
Many thanks to Suzanne & others who did such a great job all night!
Just wanted to comment that my freshman Sen. Klobuchar is doing a nice job illustrating the toll being taken on the Guard, the “citizen soldiers.”
Go, Amy! Hopefully next year, she’ll be the Sr. Sen from MN, with Jr. Sen. Franken!
On CSPAN’s Washingto Journal, Rep Mel Watt just said the bar for impeachment is so high that it will not be reached for Bush and impeachment would be counterproductive anyway.
Now he’s saying the Miers situation should play out in the courts, which is exactly what the Bush administration wants.
Oooh, now Watt’s dealing with another caller advocating impeachment and Watt’s saying that he hasn’t found the facts to justify impeachment.
Watt has been extremely disappointing. I think his office could use a few phone calls.
oddball @ 16
Can I call someone else’s Senator ?? Mine are McConnell and Bunning..
*xyz @ 18
Tel. (202) 225-1510
The photograph of the cots in Congress reminds me of the rows and rows of coffins of our returning young men and women.
Nola Sue @ 17
Curious to know how many of us Minnesnowtans hang out here at FDL.
Huckleberry is up — need more coffee…
Christy Hardin Smith @ 23
blergh. need more than coffee.
What Jackie said: “Wow!” Outstanding piece Scarecrow!
The dogs woke up me last night for a potty break. I turn on the Senate & I see McCain. Next time I turn it on Inhofe. Now, I see Ms. Graham is on, with a sign, even!
What did I do to deserve seeing these guys?
Huckleberry Graham up…wonder if he had a slumber party last night?
jackie @ 6
Yes, special thanks to Christy for her marathon yesterday, and she’s back early this a.m.! And the awesome TRex hung in there till the wee hours keeping the threads going. And Suzanne has been here all night — someone get the Lady a cuppa coffee and a danish.
selise @ 25
Get me a bucket.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 23
Looks like the rethugs decided they needed some visuals in the overnite. those “let Us Vote” posters that Menendez and others showed last night must have struck a nerve.
I understand that Kerry really had quite a good go during his early AM speechifying. And that Hillary looked wiped out but presidential. Anyone still around who saw them and who can comment further?
Christy Hardin Smith @ 23
there’s not enough coffee in the world to deal with him, and barely enough booze
Did Webb speak?
Scarecrow at 27 — We sent Suzanne to bed — she deserved some zzzzzzs and then some for her great work last night!
A reminder from Christy’s early thread:
How about we start the day by calling Democratic Senators and saying thanks. You can call toll free here:
1 (800) 828 – 0498
1 (800) 459 – 1887
1 (800) 614 – 2803
1 (866) 340 – 9281
1 (866) 338 – 1015
1 (877) 851 – 6437
While you have them on the line, mention you’d like support for habeas restoration.
Graham: “general petraus’ new surge strategy has been extremely successful in certain parts of irak…”
I guess he is referring to the rug district of Baghdad?
If you want a laugh, go back thru late late late night and read about Miss Lindsay and her vapors.
At some point, I think Webb short-sheeted her cot.
I haven’t giggled so much since my own slumber parties!
Just heard that Republican Sununnu is down 20 points in the polls. Anyone know how other Repubs up for reelection are doing?
Thanks nomolos. I’ll give his office a call and encourage others to do so. He needs to be made known that impeachment is warranted and that the Miers situation should be dealt with through the Congessional powers of inherent contempt or impeachment. Punting to the courts is an abdication of duty that will allow Bush to play out the clock and avoid accountability.
Disconnected around 12:30 a.m. thanks to those who stayed up and practiced their oversight responsibities.
Did any of the Senators who voted for the war resolution in 2002 “step up to the plate” and accept any responsibility for their very serious mistake. Or did they keep saying that the “Iraqi people need to get it together” “step up to the plate” etc etc. Did they continue to blame Iraqi’s for the catastrophe that they supported?
preznit at 30 — I sat through the whole of Joe Lieberman’s self-serving, whiny, finger-wagging, “you are partisan if you don’t think like I do” diatribe yesterday evening. Nothing — and I mean NOTHING — could be worse than that.
Scarecrow, this is one of the best posts you’ve ever written.
You patiently explain their lies and their propaganda in a way that leaves me with a headache, but also with more determination to turn things around politically. Thank you for what you do here.
egregious @ 21
Yep. It also reminded me of Army barracks,something none of the chickenhawks have ever seen.
S&P 500 is actually off 17% from its year 2000 peak when adjusted for inflation. I wonder how long it will take Bobo Brooks and the rest of the Presidents mindless defenders to lie about the economy and say well gas prices are up but the market is doing great. Its just that Bush doesn’t get any credit for all the good things he has done (sob).
Maybe their point is we should be giving the Surge a chance out of Pity?
Both my senators boxes in Florida are full….I will try others
kinmo @ 28
Had my Starbucks double espresso. I often wonder what the world would be like if you took folks off of caffeine? There would be a revolution after people got up from their naps!
Nequals1 @ 32
The truth is, both were presidential. Kerry took on all the spin and stopped it point by point.
Hillary was gravely serious. This was not a campaign, it was her job.
Graham conflating Al-Qaeda with sectarian militias…again. What a tool.
Good God – he’s wrong about just about everything – this guy is a Senator?
always love reading your work scarecrow
let’s take this from the beginning;
it was Iran contra that gave bin laden his political influence, it was reagan ignoring the very threat and actuall feeding it
then it was bush who instigated the movement, empowered bin laden
then it was clinton that recognized the very threat, he created the very industry of tracking bin laden and taking him out
then it was another bush that shelved the programs that were QUITE successful stemming the threat of terrorism, it was bush that was told bin laden would be the most important threat of his presidency, it was bush that then proceeded to dismatle the anti terror league
it was bush that never showed up to one anti terror conferance, it was bush that fired the greatest expert on the planet concerning the battle against terrorism (that would be clark)
it was bush that took vacation when he was informed in NO uncertain terms bin laden was about to attack this country
it was bush that ignored a briefing so precise concerning the impending attack that he was told when it would happen, (within months), he was told who would be the master mind (bin laden), he was told where it would happen (washington and new york), he was told what the weapons were (commercial ailineters), he was told the method of attack (highjacking)
HE WAS EVEN TOLD THE PRECISE TARGETS!!!
(financial and political structures)
inteligence this precise is almost NEVER constructed, it was INCANNY
THE INTELIGENCE WAS MORE CERTAIN ABOUT THIS THREAT THEN ANY IN MEMORY
so much so, EVERYONE’S HAIR WAS ON FIRE
so much so the president was PERSONALLY BREIFED TO MAKE CERTAIN HE UNDERSTOOD THE THREAT
the president was given a precise template for action that needed to be taken, a template we KNEW would be successful
we knew it would be succesful becuase the template had a track record of performance
if you read page 128 of the 9/11 report you will see that president clinton was given an ALMOST IDENTICAL BREIFING.
that’s right, the brifing is almost identical, the only real difernace is the breifing bush rescieved was more certain and more severe.
president clinton put into place a plan of defense WHICH WAS AN UNQUALIFIED SUCCESS
that template was ignored
instead this president took vacation, norad was instructed to stand down, and the president, when told that our country was under attack thought the very best place for him to be was in a grade school reading “my pet goat”
has anyone associated the “pet goat” theme”?
most people know what a goat as a biblical referance, and there bush is holding “my pet goat”
what sublimanal force do you think caused him to grab a story called “my pet goat” of all books?
so there is the history
the republicans created the terrorist threat, reagan thought it was grand strategy to burdon russion with terrorists and financed them
bush sr exacerbated the terrorist threat
bush junior allowed it to regain strenght, ignored the precise intel telling him of the impending attack
then bush goes further, he actually invades a country that has NO terrorism, DIVERTS the resources NEEDED to fight terrorism, attacks a country he KNEW posed NO threat
and even though he is informed in NO uncertain terms his invasion WOULD CREATE MORE TERRORISTS, he thinks this is grand strategy
does anyone see a patern?
Good morning
Dems speak of people . Repugs speak in bullet points.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 40
Scarecrow @ 34
Thanks for reminding us..
press, roll, turn, slap, press, roll, turn, slap……
FDL, posters, mods & commenters deserve a standing ovation every single day. Consistently intelligent, informative & entertaining.
I couldn’t pull an all nighter but what I did see & read on the liveblogging, the repugs have their usual diarrhea of the mouth.
Blaming the Iraqis drives me crazy. It’s like throwing rattlesnakes, grizzly bears & wolverines in a pen, expecting them to join hands & sing kumbaya and then are shocked it was a disaster.
scarecrow,
your gift for exposition is inspiring. you really assemble your arguments so flipping well, i’m alarmed to learn that i can handle them so early in the morning. thanks for your consistent excellence.
almost 7 years of these fatheads blaming everyone else and never having the personal integrity to admit their failures. what more is needed to prove their weakness as adults, let alone leaders?
Christy at 40 — agreed. And nothing could be worse than Joe LIEberman. I had it on but had to keep turning away.
Thank you for everything you’re doing here — it really does make a difference, even if it can’t change fast enough.
1. Every sentence in this article is dead-on. Very good job, Scarecrow.
2. When Commander Guy tries to shift blame to the Generals by stating that he asked them “if they had everything they needed”, the Generals probably answered in the affirmative with respect to necessary forces to cause military defeat of opposing military forces.
By carefully parsing, Commander Guy fails to acknowledge that he never asked the Generals, or State Dept. if we had everything we needed for a peaceful OCCUPATION. Indeed, as we know, Commander Guy didn’t even have a PLAN for post-war occupation.
In the corporate world, such an omission would result in the person being fired swiftly and without ceremony.
Ghostman
Could not get through Senator Voinovich’s office for two days. Got through late yesterday.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 33
Well, then if no one else wants teh danish . . .
Christy@40
I know what you mean…..People have gotten the Presidential Medal of Freedom for enduring les!
707
Christy Hardin Smith @ 40
That was punishing indeed. Death by lethal diatribe…
Huckelberry must have some really good under-eye cream!
Scarecrow @ 27
Good morning from L.A. & let me echo that thanks.
Got to make a run to LAX this a.m. (sig. other going to Toronto on business), but there’s coverage on NPR, plus it gets me away from having to watch Graham dropping hairpins while dissing the Dems. When I get back I’ll make habeas calls & fax Mary Landrieu to give her an attaboy for her speech last night. Carrots & sticks…
Read you all later, & thanks again so very much :-)
Nequals1 @ 30
I sat through the whole night.
Hillary and Kerry really impressed me.
Hillary looked wiped, but she spoke well, without reading from her notes, and was quite eloquent and persuasive.
Kerry really demolished many of the GOP talking points, and really laid the accountability squarely at the Repubs feet.
Franco at 61 — Shhhh…the Hollywood trick is to use some Preparation-H to shrink swelling, and then a little yellow-tinted concealer to cover the dark circles. You could ask Mitt Romney’s travelling make-up people about that one… ;-)
Shorter Graham: More security, political unity, and ‘can’t they all just get along’…imposed on Iraq.
Now he ratchets up the fear, Al-Qaeda = Hitler, and then describes the extreme right wing in the US…”When moderation raises its head, lop it off”…
He said it….CALIPHATE
ther you go
On Washington Journal a caller with the most wonderfully deep interesting voice just made the comment, “Using the words ‘intelligence’ and the ‘WH’ in the same sentence is an oxymoron.” *g*
Glimmers of sunlight (and intelligence) showing thru’ the clouds of despair in our beloved country, dear fire pups.
Mr. S wants Novak to explain why–if it’s a nothing story as he doth protest too much–he got immunity for ratting?
preznit giv me turkee @ 30
His nite lite kept some repugs up in the cot-tage. Mornin’ CHS, Scarecrow and all pups.
I just heard on NPR that Reid allowed some of the more “elderly” members to have a break. At the request of Boxer. Why? I say make them all stay. And if at the end of 30 hours it hasn’t worked, do it again and keep repeating until the Rethugs break.
Force is all these creeps understand.
Senator Graham asked a grreat question. Why do the polls indicate that the American people have no faith in congress?
If you had not noticed Senator Graham the majority of you voted for a war resolution in 2002 that allowed the Bush administration to invade Iraq without checking back with you folks.
The majority of Senators and Congresspeople voted for the war and sent American soldiers into an unnecessary war based on false intelligence and very few of you have “stepped up to the plate” and accepted responsibility for your immoral and criminal mistake.
Hundreds of thousands of people are dead, injured and displaced due to your vote.
let’s just start with that.
Missed Hillary and Kerry. when was that. Anyone know the site for transcripts?
There he goes again……..IRAN
Lindsey Graham at his finest…
Christy Hardin Smith @ 64
and here i thought it was the thoughts of “5 rugs for 5 dollars” that brought out his latent interior designer
Calls made to Senator Hagel, and Senator Nelson from nebraska. Asked them to restore habeaus corpus, and asked them both to watch Bill Moyers special on impeachment and the constitution. Thanked Ben Nelson for the democrats strong stand through the night!!
It feels good to be part of a democracy!!
Where is the verifiable proof for these claims Senator Graham? Where? Niger?
jim at 70 — Well, the Dems have some elderly members, too, so I’m assuming it was because some of them were looking pretty wilty last night. The debate didn’t stop — but there’s no need for cruel and unusual punishment for the coot off crowd, now is there? *g*
Senator Linsal Quaedham
Hillary was on about 4:30, Kerry shortly after, IIRC.
Just called Norm Coleman and left a message. Most of the time I really hate that he’s one of my senators, but when he’s on a fence and I feel like I get to help push him off, it makes it a little better!
(Hi, Barbara. There are a number of us here — there was even a meet-up a few months ago, but I couldn’t go. Maybe we should try again? BTW, I really like your blog!)
Scarecrow @ 75
I think between 0430 and 0530. The Lede at the NYT has some of the coverage of Hillary – interesting.
twolf1 @ 74
Snort!!
Thanks for the laugh before having to battle morning traffic on the way to the airport :0)
Christy Hardin Smith @ 64
Wow I would think if Huckleberry tried that trick he would shrink down to nothing.
twolf1 @ 74
That’s hilarious.
Note to lindsy: Al Qaeda was ‘bolstered’ when OBL was allowed to escape at Tora Bora.
Graham cracker just said “in conclusion” so someone with a brainshould be up shortly
Hello Senator Graham do you read history books. The U.S. and the U.K. overthrew a democratically elected leader in Iran. This guy is lying almost as much as Senator Liarman.
Iran is just a bit concerned with the what took place next door. The invasion of a country based on a “pack of lies” And Israel invaded Lebanon
Is it any wonder why Iran is deeply concerned by all of the Israeli leaders and the “cakewalk in Iraq” lunatics calling for a pre-emptive attack on Iran.
Anyone would be concerned
jim oconnor @ 70
Byrd is about 90, it hits both sides. It was a smart move.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 64
$150 a pop is a LOT of Preparation-H, don’t you think?
Maybe they’re applying it heavily to the swelling between his ears…
Senator Graham “bomb bomb Iran” What horseshit!
Seymour Hersch and Scott Ritter have been on target and trying to wake us up for years in regard to the Bush administrations agenda with Iran.
This is a must read by Seymour from 2005…”the Iran Plan”
http://www.newyorker.com/archi…..417fa_fact
Scott Ritter on Iran…we are all ready in Iran.
http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0620-31.htm
U.S. special forces or Mossad could be twisting the IED supply into Iraq. Create a reason for the Bush administration to pre-emptively strike. Hey Israel and the U.S. have done this before.
I especially appreciate Flynt Leverett expertise on Iran (ex CIA analyst and middle east expert who left the Bush administration just before the invasion because he disagreed)
Flynt is at the New American Foundation. He is the man to listen to about Iran.
http://www.newamerica.net/pres…..of_america
http://www.newamerica.net/pres…..n_and_iraq
This is all about how the White House forced the CIA to censor Flynt Leveretts 1000 word op-ed draft planned for the New York Times
http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/co…..use_offici
CHS at 78. I’m a product of the Sisters of St. Joseph. I guess that says it all.
Mojo @ 13
The cloture vote, if passed, brings the Amendment to the floor for a vote. It terminates the debate for an up-or-down vote.
If the cloture vote fails to gain the 60 votes necessary…the debate continues.
Nequals1 @ 82
Ah, thank you for that link to NYT; I’ve added to the post.
Has Webb been up yet?
It would be a nice touch to bring him in right after Graham, imo. Allowing Webb to tear Graham up twice in less than a week seems sensible to me.
Graham…”When people use their religion to dominate their neighbor..”
Eesh. McCain up now…
Hey! Get a grip!!! It’s the personal accountability President. He told us so in his power grab in 2000. Everyone else is personally accountable for Bush’s fuck-ups.
twolf1 @ 35
More likely “Coffin Street”.
Not only a marathon of white men talking, now it’s tired white men talking. Grotesque. But clear proof republicons don’t have a conscience among them.
R’s gonna bring their “C” team this morning – Craig, Chambliss and Cornyn
twolf1 @ 86
obl was “bolstered” by reagan, by bush sr, he was deminished by clinton, then he was “bolstered” when this “pet goat” took office
if this were a novel every single reader would know by now the “pet goat” is playing on the other team
but because this is reality we don’t put two and two together
Bill Nelson up…decrying the devotion to partisanship and ideology…paraphrase: People support our troops now, unlike Vietnam…”How do we bring some kind of success out of a very bad situation?”
Now he sounds like he’s getting pissed over the mischaracterization of the Reed/Levin amendment…
Excellent post, Scarecrow!
I hope that the Dems force a lot more of this kind of discussion. The good thing about lots of debate on the Senate floor is that lame talking points become very old, very fast. Particularly when contrasted with well reasoned and factually based arguments.
Juan Cole on the endlessly repeated claim that the Iranian President said that he wanted to “wipe Israel off the map”
[edit] Translation of phrase “wiped off the map”
Many news sources have presented one of Ahmadinejad’s phrases in Persian as a statement that “Israel must be wiped off the map”[4][5][6], an English idiom which means to “obliterate totally”,[7] and “destroy completely”, such as by powerful bombs,[8] or other catastrophes.[9]
Juan Cole, a University of Michigan Professor of Modern Middle East and South Asian History, translates the Persian phrase as:
The Imam said that this regime occupying Jerusalem (een rezhim-e ishghalgar-e qods) must [vanish from] the page of time (bayad az safheh-ye ruzgar mahv shavad).[10]
According to Cole, “Ahmadinejad did not say he was going to ‘wipe Israel off the map’ because no such idiom exists in Persian” and “He did say he hoped its regime, i.e., a Jewish-Zionist state occupying Jerusalem, would collapse.”[11]
The Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) translates the phrase similarly:
[T]his regime that is occupying Qods [Jerusalem] must be eliminated from the pages of history.[12]
Iran has repeatedly rejected the allegations that Ahmadinejad has stated ‘Israel must be wiped off the map’. [13][14][15] On 20 February 2006, Iran’s foreign minister denied that Tehran wanted to see Israel “wiped off the map,” saying Ahmadinejad had been misunderstood. “Nobody can remove a country from the map. This is a misunderstanding in Europe of what our president mentioned,” Manouchehr Mottaki told a news conference, speaking in English, after addressing the European Parliament. “How is it possible to remove a country from the map? He is talking about the regime. We do not recognise legally this regime,” he said. [16][17][18]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M…..and_Israel
MSM is all over this! CNN has the overnight session as a wee bullet point among its news stories. FOX calls it a ridiculous pajama party. And this just in: FOX tells us a top Iraqi al Qaeda official has been arrested. No! Surely not! Amazing coincidence, eh?!
I’m enjoying Nelson – he’s actually explaining the situation in Iraq.
grape_crush @ 102
—————
He is one of my senators….He sounds like a Dem today….maybe all those emails he gets from us here in Ft Lauderdale about running someone against him next time he is up for election are “SORTA” working….Hmmm
Senator Nelson reasonable, on target
Nola Sue @ 81
Thankee!!
WOW! Someone must have talked to Hacktacular Howie on his conflicts. This is the second paragraph in today’s Media Notes from the Wa Po0:
My bold
barbara @ 104
The overnite is the lede story on MSNBC.com and I saw the Rocky Mountain News had an AP story on it prominently displayed
i have to say, this calling the capitol in the morning could get to be a habit.
clinton and schumer’s lines were both jammed. so i spoke with someone on reid’s office and asked her please to convey my gratitude at this overnight session in defense of our troops, and to please have the senator consider a similar effort on behalf of habeas corpus.
Saxby Chambliss: 3 reasons why I’m against, then moaning about how the other important aspects of the bill are being held up with this debate…
How much you wanna bet that he doesn’t mention the Repubs blocking the Reed/Levin amendment? Effing predictable – even includes a shout-out to Lieberman…
The Democrats have eviscerated each and every Republican talking point and highlighted the failures and missteps of this administration. Just wish the MSM would let the people beyond the blogs know what is being said in the Senate.
Another WOW! from Howie! A shout out for Christy:
I wasn’t able to stay up watching. Did either Roberts or Brownback speak…I’d like to know what they said before I call their offices today.
What does it say when I call Sen. Rockefeller’s office and his staffer knew my e-mail addy without having to ask me for it? *g*
Missed the great debate, but it seems like a good idea to do it again. It smokes out the rethugs. Eventually, they will start reading from phone books, but making them to articulate their nonsense in a forum that permits a direct response is just the kind of daylight we need to bleach the stain of their crap from the body politic.
Chambliss: “It would be a mistake to give up on the president’s strategy right now”.
Oxymoron alert.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 116
You’ve made it to the bigtime! Good for you!
Dammit! The shaped charge IED’s are being used in the SUNNI-MILITIA held areas!
That’s where our humvess are getting blown to SH*T! Just look at the casualty and death reports…the troops dying from IED attacks on their vehicles are disproportionately in Sunni zones.
So all this bulldada about the Iranians “supplying the Shiite militias” with shaped charges is just so much deception.
Does anyone really believe that these Shi’a militias will sneak into Baqouba, Fallujah, and Anwar to sit about in places where the US is seeking out al-Qaida or Sunni militias – sit around in dire peril to themselves all day (or weeks, as the dates that the US is going into these areas has to be reasonably secure) and then – when a US convoy passes by- detonate explosives that they had to carry0in and conceal in a SUNNI district?
Lemme tell you, those Shiites would have to have gigantic cajones to do this.
Or the Iranians would have to supplying Al-Qaida and the Sunnis with these explosives. Which is unlikely? AND UNPROVEN!
Let’s face reality…the explosives come from someone who IS SUPPLYING the SUNNIS…and that would be our dear friend Saudi Arabia.
Bluetoe @ 113
Many phone calls and emails to Sens and Reps seem to work. Maybe a concerted effort to the NYT might do the same?
Senator Graham .. what Iranian President Ahmadinaijad said about Israel
http://winnipeg.indymedia.org/item.php?2815S
What upsets me about the MSM coverage of this is the verbiage used to describe the showdown, for example, my local paper ran this AP headline: “Democrats Stage All-Night Debate on Iraq” (my bold).
Here’s the first few paragraphs, notice again, the slant inherent in the verbs used.
jim oconnor @ 70
Ah, but the media would have focused on the poor fainting Republicans and used it as Yet Another Club with which to pummel the Dems. (I only wish I were kidding.)
lol janda — I think it has more to do with the fact that I’ve been calling them a lot. *g*
Bravo, Scarecrow!
Another one out of the park!
dakine01 @ 111
Ah, but what about the REAL news sources, like CNN and Fox. You know. The people’s news.
janda @ 119
Yes! Another Good sign
Bob Corker my Senator respond to my mail
What crap!!
Christy Hardin Smith @ 117
It says you’re kickin’ ass, Christy, and word is getting around. *g*
OT: Waxman turning over another stone (h/t to Swampland):
More specifics in the article. Now back to our programming…
Bluetoe @ 114
Exactly.
When I hear people asking about a given thing “Why aren’t the Dems raising holy hell about this?”, much if not most of the time it turns out that they have been, but the press is ignoring it. Whereas even when they’re in the minority, anytime a leading Republican breaks wind he or she’s got three dozen reporters ready to praise the forthrightness of the stench.
the right time to examine the strategy was before you all voted for the war resolution you silly people you
nomolos @ 122
IMHO the MSM is so dysfunctional and so wedded to the status quo that letters and phone calls will have little effect on the publishers, editors, and editorial boards. The MSM (print and broadcast) needs to be supplanted by new organs that reach the public at large. The blogs are moving in that direction.
september surprise? Why do all senators say we cannot wait until september, or why we have to wait until september?
Is Patreaus’ assessment so important? Every other mile stone that has passed has passed in limited success or absolute failure.
Bush, Iraq, and Patreaus are going to have to surprise us with some pretty big success in two months.
If this isn’t the best coverage there isn’t a best site.
Great story in the b section of phila inquirer to-day.78 year protester was arrested for protesting out side of the free speech zone when the pres. went by. He’s now suing over the arrest .Republician lawyer ,for the republician township,argues in front of a bush appointed judge not to allow the idenity of the pres. to be mentioned because it would favor the defendent What a great president
Go Senator Lautenberg shine the truth light
Senators and Congresspeople who voted no on the war resolution
http://www.democrats.com/node/6890
Sen. Whitehouse’s office answered right away. Told staffer all at fdl have been up all nite, and his speech this mornin tore up all the repug spew points. I’m a big Whitehouse fan.
Breaking News via Al The Spook:
Remember the Angler series? We suspected there were more segments yet to be released? Well the next one hit today in the Washington Post and it’s a whopper.
We have the energy task force documents that Cheney was willing to go to hell to prevent us having. And they were leaked by an insider. It is in the same tone as the Angler series but has different writers credited, altho someone might want to check that.
Link To Page One Of The Three Page Article
Link To a Detailed Graphic Of The Task Force.
It’s quite the scoop.
And Lautenberg smacks it out of the park! “Mission Accomplished? Mission Accomplished? 139 American soldiers had died by that day. Now the figure is over 3600…”
Senator Lautenberg has a heart and soul, rare these days in congress
I clipped this from c and l
pretty good stuf, download and watch our senators work hard and passionate
http://www.crooksandliars.com/…..Debate.wmv
Harold Meyerson has a great editorial in the WaPo about the spineless GOP members who think we can’t win, but won’t vote to make a pull out happen.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01487.html
barbara @ 22
Another Minnesotan here. I live in Zimmerman, northwest of the ‘cities.’
Lautenberg reminding all those ReTHUGS about Mission Accomplished….
“A show of grandeur, false etc”
Now on to Darth Cheney and his lies
Statements that DEFY reality….he is kickin it
reminding about Rummmy…war could last 6 days 6 weeks, but not 6 months…. YEAH RIGHT
The whole speech about ALL the lies….GOOD ON HIM!
Senator Lautenberg
http://lautenberg.senate.gov/
How is it that the President can talk “Al Queda in Iraq” without someone else saying that he created “Al Queda in Iraq”. It’s nice that they are saying that “Al Queda in Iraq” didn’t exist before Bush invaded Iraq, but that’s missing the essential spin that Bush is fighting something that he created.
We’ll know that we are making progress when the likes of Christy, Jane, Marcy, Thom Hartman, Amy Goodman, Glenn Greenwald among many other elequent, passionate progressive voices are heard and seen in broadcasts and quoted in print. It’s moving in the right direction.
When did Petraeus become Grant, Sherman, Pershing and Eisenhower all wrapped into one?
According to last night’s GOP speakers that area of the world has not seen such an accomplished general since Salaadin or perhaps Alexander the Great.
This is another frame job our politicians are letting Rove and Co. pull on us. Come September, it is going to be hard to argue against Petraeus the Great.
Does anyone think in September that Petraeus the Great is going to tell us his baby is ugly? I don’t think so.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 23
cinnamonape @ 93
Thanks !!
I’ve re-supplied my Starbuck’s and I’m READY..
Thanks to all on FDL for keeping on top of this,, and thanks to CSPAN2 for continuous coverage..
Great post Scarecrow… Now if only these Senators would read it. It don’t know how the Rethugs can represent the people and vote for this war.. Don’t the polls show 70% against the war ??
GeorgeSimian @ 148
Kerry took it all apart. He was great.
Someone should point out that if this is “just theater” then why was Condi recalled from an important trip to help prevent further haemmoraging of Republican Senators.
If this is “theater”it’s a high Shakesperean Drama.
And McConnell knows damn well that he can’t simply walk away from this – if he does he loses the ability to BLOCK the Amendment and it will win in a floor vote. The Republicans will go down, not as someone who simply voted on some obscure parliamentary procedure…but will have to put their names down as opposing things like the Webb Amendment, or setting a Spring date for withdrawal of troops, or rescinding the 2002 War Powers Act (long overdue).
They will have those albatrosses hung around their necks.
And then Bush will have to VETO it…and the Pugs will have to VOTE yet again.
It’s a glorious Oklahoma morning. But some of the natives are restless.
“Blame someone else”? Isn’t that the playground bully way?
Lahoma is stirring. She got up about two in the morning and watched that Senate business with me on the tube for all of about 15 minutes. Then she said, “boring, I’m going back to bed”. But before she went back to slumberland she said to me: “What do you mean about Indian women and alcohol don’t mix (reference to yesterday’s poolside frivolity)? I noticed you only had one julep yesterday and you were pretty buzzed.” I said that’s because I’m a half-breed, and therefore it only takes me 1/2 as much to get drunk. She said, you “breeds” are all alike and “kiddo… you kill me”. I said, ‘I know’.
Back to seriousness. Is my party going to accomplish anything with this all night thingy?
GeorgeSimian @ 147
BOOYAH
THAT’S the metric our democrats need to use, THAT IS THE TICKET
More from Corker. Looks like they will be asking for more troops in Sept.
This man is vile
Senator Lautenberg was born in Paterson, New Jersey, the son of Polish and Russian immigrants who came to the United States through Ellis Island. His early life was unsettled as his parents moved about a dozen times while struggling to support the family.
Lautenberg’s father, Sam, worked in the silk mills, sold coal, farmed and once ran a tavern. When Lautenberg was 19, his father died of cancer. To help his family, he worked nights and weekends until he graduated from Nutley High School.
After graduating from Nutley, Lautenberg enlisted and served in the Army Signal Corps in Europe during World War II. Following the war, he attended Columbia University on the G.I. Bill and graduated with a degree in economics in 1949.
With his military service completed and his education secured, Lautenberg set out to build a career. He joined with two boyhood friends from his old neighborhood to found the nation’s first payroll services company, Automatic Data Processing. Lautenberg served as chairman and CEO, and along with his partners developed ADP into one of the largest computing services company in the world.
This guy knows what it’s like to put on a uniform
old gold @ 149
when the pet goat shopped and shopped til he found someone that might go along with the scheme everone else said would fail
I’m guessing Pete Domenici did not stay up to make a speech? Anyone hear him?
Senator Lautenberg and Senator Menendez tied in my book for moving and sincere stances.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 153
see dkaine @110 this thread. Senator Reid and Senator Pelosi have finally figured out how to bypass the MSM gridlock. I just sent them max contribs as a thank you.
Kathleen @ 160
when this is all done perhaps we can have a post with all the moving speeches linked somewhere
would be nice
Larry Craig is shameless. Oh, that’s right he’s a Republican. Just out of curiosity, was David Vitter in our out of his diaper?
FYI, New Thread Upstairs. It’s tasty.
snowbird42 @ 130
Perhaps the “wait until September” senators could be asked by what mechanism they intend to stop the president in September, after the Defense authorization bill has been passed. That’s the real bait-and-switch here — they’re trying to run out the clock past the “must-pass” bill, so they can distance themselves from the president by boldly declaring that he must change course at a time when they can do little about it.
Christy has a new post ready.
Scarecrow, are you still here?
Boston1775 @ 167
whazzup?
It is wonderful that all the Republicans have followed the party-educated McCain with their endlessly repeated “precipitous”. What the Hell does McCain think leaving Iraq has to do with steep slopes? Perhaps he is really quite cerebral without knowing it, and in the depths of his mind he actually knows the US’s remaining in Iraq is indeed a metaphoric steep and even slippery slope which will lead to the end of the US world hegemony wen we go broke.
They all mean “precipitate”, of course.
Listening to another WH spokesman (maybe Dana Petrino)on my Countdown podcast this morning, she attempted to explain how the war in Iraq was , of course, a recruiting tool for al Quaida because “It’s like poking a hornet’s nest. Every time we launch an operation some people get upset”
My Pa told me not to poke hornets’ nests for that very reason.
You are doing terribly important work. Thanks so much for it.
So… are we going to get an ‘up or down’ on troop withdrawal?
Bluetoe @ 135
Was listening to Jonathan Alter on Young Turks this morning and he firmly believed that Reid’s forcing an up or down vote was an attempt to appease the progressive blogosphere and show them that they are growing a spine and taking a harder line with the Repub obstructionism and are serious about ending the war.
I.e., Maybe they’re finally listening?
Boston1775 @ 171
Thanks; it’s just guilt; I feel badly I missed your tea party.
grape_crush @ 47
It’s the confiction!
And…edited for accuracy.
snowbird42 @ 129
And yet Huckleberry Graham just said that it was Democrats that were blaming the Iraqis?
Cornyn should be reminded that there have been a half dozen Iraqi governments…most hand-picked by the US. They’re finally “getting it”?
Didn’t Bush ballyhoo the rate of Iraqi troop training as almost being completed just before the Iraqi elections (and earlier)? What about all those Bush “landmarks” and “benchmarks” and “corners turned” and “last throes of the insurgency”? How many times have we been told that the bombings, beheadings, and attacks were evidence of “their desperation” because they were “losing”.
We’ve put up with years of this Newspeak. If there were NO BOMBINGS, NO KIDNAPPINGS, NO BEHEADINGS, No slaughters of schoolteachers or students, of police; NO Sabotage attacks on infrastructure, ad nauseum…We WOULD BE WINNING. And they would be losing.
For Repugs “Up is Down”, “Black is White” and “1 1=3″.
Scarecrow @ 174
You’re setting the table for the next one.
sandflea @ 173
no it’s much more than that. see dkaine@110. Reid and Pelosi have figured out how to crack the MSM firewall.
Favorite WH Quote this week from Fran Townsend
Question – the President was warned before the war that this was actually going to help al Qaeda gain influence. And now you have a report suggesting maybe it has gained influence from the war in Iraq. Isn’t that something that the President ignored?
MS. TOWNSEND: But you’re assuming it’s a zero-sum game, which is what I don’t understand. The fact is we were harassing them in Afghanistan, we’re harassing them in Iraq, we’re harassing them in other ways, non-militarily, around the world. And the answer is, every time you poke the hornet’s nest they are bound to come back and push back on you. That doesn’t suggest to me that we shouldn’t be doing it. It suggests — you hardly need to be warned that they’re going to use this for propaganda purposes. They’re going to.
My Pa told me not to poke hornet’s nests for this very reason.
What about yours?
upstairs
nomolos @ 122
Oh my! I don’t know if this has been picked up on yet (I can NOT keep up with y’all) but this sounds like a good idea as well — pressuring the newspapers to cover things properly…!
In any case, thanks for all the commentary on the filibuster. I was not able to watch the proceedings (is CPAN closed captioned?) but it’s good to know what has been happening (and infuriating to see the news outlets tip toeing around things)…
BEG @ 181
I believe Reid and Pelosi have figured out how to crack the msm firewall as you mentioned. our phone calls and emails are important, but the msm works on “hooks”, the unusual, the dangerous, etc. confrontation is their red meat, particularly with easy to grasp visuals. this maneauver gave them that so they covered it a bit.
But, SOME papers, some TV stations are GETTING IT RIGHT! And that is the crack we need. once a few stations air the real facts, then it spreads like wildfire and the msm has to at least tactily acknowledge it, or find a way to spin it to their advantage.
That was how Katrina worked. This is an orchestrated version of that. and if I’m correct, this is the first of MANY such opportunities.
Also, we have made it clear to the rethugs that:
a) our parliamentarians are better than theirs.
b) we WILL go to the mat with them (the Sergeant at Arms was authorized to go get members for a quorum and rethugs scurried into the chamber like cockroaches (apologies to cockroaches).
c) they think they have power, but it is only power to obstruct. once that is clear to the american people, the whole debate changes.
masterful political work. I am once again proud to be a Democrat.
BEG @ 181
Rayne made the point yesterday, and I am in complete agreement, that when we assemble it has to be at the site of news organizations and their owners (GE and Disney etc.). It will hold the press accountable for getting the message from the 70% of Americans that they haven’t clearly covered yet.
Good Morning Scarecrow.
Thank you for your wonderful posts. I’m playing catchup re: the filigrie upstairs, but will return to read your whole screed shortly, especially quickly if Inhofe stays on his feet. ;->
Comcast here in DC usually shows CSPAN on channel 78 and CSPAN2 (senate) on 79 – BUT LAST NITE IT WAS ALL BASEBALL on 79, they did not show the Senate show at all until early this a.m. Weird.
Scarecrow:
I had a long dispute with CHS and some others the other day about Afghanistan. I objected to the notion that we could ever “finish the job” once the “job” no longer was simply capturing or killing OBL, and I repeatedly made the point that I think the real reason we’re there at this point is that it presents another front against Iran. I thought the exhortations to use our supposed military might were cavalier, naive about the prospect of winning, and pretty immmoral given the amount of ordnance we’d have to drop.
It seems the notion that “more boots on the ground” would fix things is predicated on the idea that there is a static level of resistance to us there, not that resistance might wax or wane in relation to our own strength and come not only from indigenous Afghans, but various patrons abroad. For example, Pakistan has a vital interest in “strategic depth” in Afghanistan and is a patron of the Taliban. China and Russia wish us to fail, bloodily. Perhaps most importantly, Iran must see us fail for the vital reason that we’re using Afghanistan as a platform for terrorist attacks inside Iran, something you don’t even mention.
I’ve said it in comments here before, and I’ll say it again: the biggest lie that Republicans have told is that they believe in personal responsibility. It’s a subtle point, but in fact, as Scarecrow suggests in this post, it ties together every single one of Bush’s failures of the last six years.
althespook @ 182
Hear, Hear!
I thought we were invading any country that harbored terrorists? Wasn’t that our MO? That there was no difference between the terrorists and those that harbored them? So when are we invading Pakistan?
The debate doesn’t matter. The stratagy doesn’t matter. The tactics don’t matter. The soldiers don’t matter. The families don’t matter. The country doesn’t matter. The oil doesn’t matter.
When will you people realize?????
George W. Bush is on a MISSION FROM GOD!!!!!
God is infallible therefore Bush’s mission is infallible. He will not stop. For any reason or for any person. He will not end the occupation. NO MATTER WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENS.
George W. Bush is on a MISSION FROM GOD!!!!!
Out only hope to end this sensless slaughter is to impeach this monster along with his criminal henchman Cheney.
THAT IS OUR ONLY OPTION!!! Any other action is doomed to fail.
IMPEACH, INDICT, CONVICT, IMPRISON.
But the debate is not about a precipitous withdrawal. It is about redefining the mission, with the hope of bringing the mission in line with something more plausible, more consistent with the level of troops we can sustain, and most important, consistent (one hopes) with a more defensible view of our security interests and the virtues we respect as a nation.
Well it SHOULD be about precipitous withdrawal. The above is not the goal of the progressive left. That’s just imperialism lite.
This calls to mind that odd little map that appeared online of the United States where it was split in half as the top bleeding into Canada read:
The United States of Canada
and the bottom half read:
JesusLand