So George Bush takes advantage of the groundwork put in place by the Libby Lobby and builds on the story that Richard Armitage (whom he refers to as “that person”) is the only one in the administration that exposed Valerie Wilson’s identity as a CIA agent (because as aficionados of right wing logic will have no trouble accepting, this act means that Karl Rove and Scooter Libby could not have also done it too, and at the same time absolves them from legal culpability when they did).
It’s nice that he thinks the decision to commute Libby’s decision is “fair and balanced.” Bush could have pardoned him outright but he decided to accept the decision of the jury with regard to Libby’s essential guilt. Because he felt the sentence imposed by Judge Reggie Walton was too harsh, however, coming down as it did right in the middle of the sentencing guidelines, Bush wanted to make sure Libby didn’t pay an excessive price for being hounded by partisans looking to criminalize politics. Presumably this means by Bush appointee Patrick Fitzgerald and Bush appointee Reggie Walton. Fortunately as president he has the ability to commute Scooter’s sentence at the point he thought Libby had served a “fair” amount of time. Coming when it did, we can safely infer that “fair” means no time at all.
Are you with me? Good. Because Bush wonders what would have happened had the leaker, whom we all know to be Richard Armitage and nobody else, had told the truth at the beginning of the investigation in 2003. Which, in fact, Armitage did, it was Karl Rove and Scooter Libby who lied, but they weren’t as we all know leakers so don’t mind that. Just because nit-pickers like Marcy Wheeler keep trying to aggravate the situation by pointing out that in the fall of 2004 Armitage and Novak’s statements still did not match up it’s no reason why Fitzgerald did not drop his investigation before it actually began despite the fact that he didn’t know at that point whether Armitage had deliberately leaked Valerie Wilson’s identity to Novak or not.
Anyway, Bush says it’s time to move on. I think I speak for many when I say I’ll be ready to do that around the time I’m ready to get over what happened in Florida in the 2000 election, or the hundred soldiers (not to mention the untold number of Iraqis) dying every month in Iraq because these clowns can’t seem to do much well besides wipe their ass with the Constitution.
Do you suppose he can follow that?
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as Josh says, “truly a shameful man”
Hi Jane, nice job this A.M..
; )
Crap, now my head hurts.
Sorry, pretzel logic to me means you obviously must have beer to wash them down with.
Jane!
Jane,
GET SOME!!!
OOOH RAHHH!!!
Dave in Okinawa
Made the top 10?
The man wouldn’t know the truth if it walked right up, said howdy-do, and bonked him on his empty pumpkin head.
Oh yeah, we’re ready to “move on” ..right on to impeachment and war crimes tribunals.
Is the WH Press core really so uneducated as to late that crap pass. Sometimes I think they just don’t want to do the work needed to be able to challenge bullshit.
One of my Best Yet:
http://freewayblogger.blogspot…..erday.html
I think you’ll agree.
Jane writes:
Works for me! And speaking of Pretzel Logic
(what can I say, it’s one of my fave Steely Dan tunes…)
After deep deliberation (I like your title), Bush determined that, like every other member of his administration, Libby must not be punished, regardless of his guilt.
This is how it spozed to be in the Bush Millennium.
Hmmm, this does stop the wingnut talk that no underlying crime was committed.
scarlet p. @ 9
Excellent and thanks for all you do.
KestrelBrighteyes @ 7
Well actually he would know it, but he’d have to shoot it.
Yay Jane!!!
So, can we impeach already???
Bob in WI
Can you print it in a very large font, with lots of pictures, and use a colored marker?
Kornwhole Smith @ 12
No it won’t; they’ll just ignore him like they do everyone else that contradicts the meme of the day.
OT to Dak — The Dan rocks! There’s a cult of us on this site who feel the same.
OT: I called Kerry and Kennedy to complain about their support of the Iran amendment and they weren’t interested in hearing about it. I told the guy on the phone from Kerry’s office that it is ridiculous to support saber rattling on the basis of the faked intelligence we have seen. He said Kerry had an intelligence briefing on this and he believes it is true. I brought up that he thought the Intelligence on Iraq was true too. Thank you for your call they said.
clem @ 11
Being a Bushie means never having to say you’re sorry.
Bob in WI (temporarily)
You know what the roughest part of this whole deal is ?
They’re not goin’ anywhere..
very debilitating..
A modest proposal: For this and other outrages, may George W. Bush rot in hell.
thank you, Jane. Perfectly said.
KestrelBrighteyes @ 7
[snark on]beg to differ .. i think he definitely recognizes the truth by the feeling of terror it gives him whenever he runs into it. gotta know what he’s running from [end snark]
scarlet p. @ 9
And How! What an inspiration you are my dear!
retirin’ in five @ 18
***
Wow… I’m a member of a cult now.
Don’t tell my fundie relatives, they already spend too much time praying that I’ll see the light (they’re also loyal Bushies, so who’s blind in THIS picture?)
“that person”
sounds like: (Bush, wagging finger) “I did not authorize a leak of that woman’s name for that man… Mr. Armitage.”
Don’t worry, Jane. Didn’t ya hear the President? It’s all behind us now.
JANE!!!!
i feel exactly the way you do!! thanks for putting my thoughts in your inimitable way ;o)… still searching for my “f”…. lol
Excellent post…
Now I’m depressed again…
I’m going to reiterate my plea to Fitzy…
Resign from this admin and give us the full
details…
When is the judge to rule on Wilson’s civil case?
How much time does it take to rule?
Nice title Jane: Pretzel Logic. Remember, he almost choked on pretzels.
As President of the United States, Bush didn’t have to munch of pretzels whilst he wonder what might happen if the leaker came forward. It was known to be a senior admin. official. These are about 30 in number. All he had to do was to require, by asking or by notie, that each one to come forward to state his or her innocence or guilt in this matter. I can tell you from the experience of friends that when the President asks something of officials—and even of private citizens—he gets it. It’s a very hard phone call to say to no. And this is all the more so if he damnds it—esp if, as Ms. Taylor indicates, they have deluded themselves into thinking they are under loyalty to Bush personally. Of course, he did not pursue this quick and honest route because, knowing the truth, and being implicated in it, he wished to cover up the guilt of his minions.
Similarly, every time I hear the “no underlying crime” bullsh*t I want to scream.
Lets say Joe Blow is convicted of obstruction of justice for shredding documents that would likely have led to his boss’s indictment. Would anyone be allowed to get away with claiming “no underlying crime”? The media never seem to challenge this BS.
I hope I outlive that clown so I can spit on his grave. The odds are against me, as we’re about the same age, and I’m hanging in there for Medicare. One can hope, though.
Schuster for Prez…
No, I don’t think “the evil one” can follow that Jane. As your title indicates his logic is so twisted he doesn’t understand a damn thing and it’s Cheney’s ass he’s wiping with the constitution.
yellowdogD @ 34
No worries – our kids, grandkids, great-grandkids, etc, can do it for us – they’re the ones that will be paying down his f***ing debt for the next God-only-knows-how-long.
Biodun @ 31
I’m skeptical it was a pretzel. And I think putting Barney at the scene was the type of gratuitous embellishment nervous liars offer.
ITMFA
Bush – what an ass-clown.
Can the Republic survive another 18 months with this ass-clown remaining in office?
The whole press conference was like that. When he needs to have al qaeda be a monstrous organization, part of a long ideological war of evil people who hate freedom vs people who love freedom then it’s a grave and growing threat.
When he needs to have worked hard and successfully reduced the threat to the homeland, then they are a diminished threat.
But what really gets me is that he, again, said that we are going to permanently occupy Iraq (provide border security, training support and anti-terrorist activities [he leaves out the baskin robbins truck drivers]), and nobody seems to bat an eye.Oh, and he also keeps insisting on Iraqi sovereignty.
If only Clinton had said “it’s time to move on…”
*Sigh*
I guess he wasn’t so smart after all.
What Jane said. Well-written and to the point. I can only add that none of this is any reason to get “depressed.” Don’t mope, organize.
since there’s no underlying “crime” – but i guess the jury was sooo wrong when they convicted the felon – why the rush to commute convicted felon’s sentence? ‘fraid felon’s conviction would be upheld – help me understand this legal firepups plz
that’s where the name MoveOn.org comes from
Pretzel Logic from Pretzel Boy.
What a shock.
And this is why Amy Robach is no Keith Olbermann, and why Craig Crawford is still stuck back in the midterm elections…From Countdown yesterday:
I mean, “Where do things stand in the White House right now with Congress?”
Are we expecting any word from Walton? He asked all the parties to respond to the commutation. They all agreed that Bush could leave the supervised release thingee intact, so Walton may just let it be. But he must have asked for a reason other than just wondering what their opinions are.
I am asking because I am hoping against all hope that Walton can define “supervised release” as weekends or nights or both in jail.
Better than nothing.
My favorite song from one of my most favored albums! And so apropos….
PRETZEL LOGIC
I would love to tour the Southland
In a travelling minstrel show
Yes I’d love to tour the Southland
In a traveling minstrel show
Yes I’m dying to be a star and make them laugh
Sound just like a record on the phonograph
Those days are gone forever
Over a long time ago, oh yeah
I have never met Napoleon
But I plan to find the time
I have never met Napoleon
But I plan to find the time
‘Cause he looks so fine upon that hill
They tell me he was lonely, he’s lonely still
Those days are gone forever
Over a long time ago, oh yeah
I stepped up on the platform
The man gave me the news
He said, You must be joking son
Where did you get those shoes?
Where did you get those shoes?
Well, I’ve seen ‘em on the TV, the movie show
They say the times are changing but I just don’t know
These things are gone forever
Over a long time ago, oh yeah
i know KO needs time off but find his subs not quite up to par – maybe they don’t have license to fully express opinions as KO does – when he’s not on i really dont watch…..
I wish Pretzel boy’s number was in the DC madam’s phone records.
And why Shuster is, well, Shuster. Also from Countdown:
Wow, so Bush is going to pretend it’s all Armitage’s fault. And OJ’s still looking for the “real killers”.
Hey, Big Media! How come you’re going to repeat Bush’s words uncritically and without comment, yet you (rightly) dissected OJ for saying something equally disgusting?
Anyway, Bush says it’s time to move on. I think I speak for many when I say I’ll be ready to do that around the time I’m ready to get over what happened in Florida in the 2000 election, or the hundred soldiers (not to mention the untold number of Iraqis) dying every month in Iraq because these clowns can’t seem to do much well besides wipe their ass with the Constitution.
Do you suppose he can follow that?
bad form to answer a rhetorical question, I know, but I will anyway:
I really doubt it.
I’m getting seriously afraid! I just read an article on Raw Story that indicates that the subject of this post is not the only thing this president is trying to once again delude himself about. In an exchange with David Gregory, he apparently insisted that the same people in Iraq that are doing the bombing, the insurgents are the same people who came here and bombed us on 9/11. I really don’t think this guy can distinguish the difference between fantasy and reality anymore. That line isn’t just blurred; it’s gone altogether. He used to know that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. He said so on national TV. I’m sure someone has clips of him saying it.
I was already pissed that the SOB still hasn’t apologized to Joe & Valerie Wilson, but now this, and another article where he said “…so now we’re just going to move on…” He truly is an embarassment to all of our principles and an offense against our sense of fair play. I think the Congress needs to set forth a serious Bill of Impeachment to include Contempt of Congress, Abuse of Power and Obstruction of Justice. Apparently that the only way left to stop him. If we’re gonna waste time (the next 18 months or so) with a court that gave us this disaster to begin with, we might as well go ahead and impeach both Bush and Cheney together and let the chips fall where they may, whether there are enough votes or not.
Helen @ 47
The minute Walton does anything like that The Appointed President will pardon Libby. Libby has apparently made it clear through Rove that the minute he actually has to go inside a prison other than as a visitor, he’s calling Fitz. I hear he has Fitz’ cell on speed dial, and his cell is always with him. His offer to Fitz is simple: I walk and you get Rove and Cheney. And Fitz will take it.
This is why the Angler editorial showed up in the Wapoo. (Excellent take on it at Truthout.) Bush had decided NOT to pardon Libby, and Cheney gently informed him of what would happen (as noted above.) Cheney apparently THEN told Chimpy what would happen to Chimpy in those circumstances. Cheney is NOT going to jail for his chimpenfuhrer.
After what was probably the worst tantrum ever thrown by an adult in the white house, Chimpy agreed to pardon or commute libby’s sentence if needed. But in retaliation he did two things; he stopped letting Cheney be by his side all the time (remember the “lurking cheney”?) and he commissioned the hit piece, probably through one of his stooges at the WaPoo who farmed it out in some way. Once he knew he had to use the commutation, he dropped the hammer on the Angler piece.
Cheney and Libby are holding Chimpy at gunpoint. And this ain’t no disco, this ain’t no party, this ain’t no foolin’ around. If they spill the torture, renditions, black ops, ghod knows what that they’ve done in Bush’s name (and perhaps some that elder Bush did), the World Court will strip the Bushes of every last dime. Bush will end his days in a prison cell in the hague and be lucky to do it. And ALL Cheney has to do is call up Fitz and drop the hammer. No need for impeachment, poltical theatre, supreme court. Bush might literally have to run for his life. Cheney will be in Dubai with his family, and continue to help run Kuwait (more on that later.) THAT, by the way, is the reason Haliburton is moving to Dubai, so it can be close to Kuwait.
Bush sat down to dinner with the devil. He just forgot to use a long spoon.
BigMitch @ 44
Yeah. Censure and Move On. And that’s another reason why we need to be really careful about the censure motion for Libby’s commutation. I can hear the wingnuts’ screeching howls already.
I encourage Ms. Hamsher, or some other member of Team Hamsher to run an article on the Libby subject at least once a week; every week. I also encourage the entire progressive blog folks to, at least once a month, issue a call to the readership to contact Congress and express outrage. Even when nothing has happened on the Libby front for a period of time.
This outrage must not be forgotten. Steady and consistent pressure is needed. If for no other reason, than to continually shove the WH people into their own toilet bowl they created.
Ghostman
mc @ 50
I don’t know what it is, but I have the distinct impression that pretzel boy’s libido was quashed by mother Babs a very long time ago. (the woman is a classic Alice Miller enraged mother type…worth reading the Drama of the Gifted Child with Shrub in mind) Everything that we see, the posturing, the bike riding, the war-mongering, the bloodlust, the belligerence, etc — it is all a compensation. If he had a real libido, he would not be so consumed with the trappings of power.
Awhile ago, I was turned onto a site by John Amato of Crooks and Liars called The Power of Narrative — the Alice Miller essays there are really worth taking the time to read.
I ‘want’ Karl Rove even more than I want Richard Cheney. I desire to be ice clear about it.
The only viable option is to withdraw completely and unconditionally from Iraq today.
As to December 12, 2000, we will never be able to get over it. Never. The horror of it hasn’t even begun to begin. But there is no reason the Iraqis have to keep suffering because of our utter nastiness and stupidity. Hail the cynicism of people like Sandra Day O’Connor and the cowardice of the Democrats who played dead even before the vote counting had begun: see Kerry and the Swiftboaters.
yellowdogD says:
July 12th, 2007 at 12:26 pm
I hope I outlive that clown so I can spit on his grave.
Change the word “spit” to something a little more scatological and I’m right there with ya.
A very brief ThinkProgress post: Michigan AG: Libby commutation ‘was plain wrong
I don’t need to recommend digby, but her observations on Taylor/Miers in her “Politics in the Extreme” post today are good.
http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/
I wish Pretzel boy’s number was in the DC madam’s phone records.
She would never have been arrested, so you’d never know.
Ghostman @ 57
Amen!!!
And the constant meme should be, what is the WH hiding and why are they hiding it?
Or said differently, if they have nothing to hide, why don’t they level with the citizens of the US?
He is either trying to drive us all nuts. Or he is already nuts. Delusional, folks. And sounding more so.
It’s the war on error!
TheraP @ 66
LOL! The War on Error. That is a keeper!
mc@50, a few posts up-thread,
The Power of Narrative is by Arthur Silber, an exceptionally gifted, erudite man. Amato’s Crooks and Liars is also incomparable, but in another way. Arther Silber: remember the name and read his site which is now called Once Upon a Time.
I may be mistaken, but I think the Post may have changed its method of counting troops killed in Iraq. I saw 3600-something the other day, did a double-take, and noticed a separate, smaller number for non-combat deaths. I seem to have an optical memory of 3800- and 3900- figures for a couple months.
This report on Iraq from the Bush boys is a sham. As will be the “report” from this guy Petreaus in September.
Re: uncritical Big Media:
Greenwald in Salon today points out a paradox:
althespook @ 55
so, Al, what do we do as a citizen movement to manipulate this?
as much as i admire fitz/walton, i’m just not seeing them able to force this any further, i mean, can walton come back with some jail time: it’s not lookin’ like it.
meanwhile, the stoopid senators don’t know that they are voting on counterfeit intel regarding iran. it’s getting even scarier.
Ohhh, yeah!
That’s about the time I expect to stop being p*ssed off at all three branches of government for their various forms of incompetence. Because they all are, just not in the same way. The MSM, um, I might consider it when the Fairness Doctrine is written into law. With a supermajority (at least 75 percent) required to repeal.
Pretzel Logic?..I don’t think so..Bush’s logic is following the straight and true. It is only “Pretzel Logic” when viewed through the lens of a “reality based mind-set”. That is not Bush’s and his drones’ view.
Howie Klein re-posted a link to the Suskind NYT article of ‘04.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/17/mag…..ssuserland
The operative paragraph is this:
The aide said that guys like me were “in what we call the reality-based community,” which he defined as people who “believe that solutions emerge from your judicious study of discernible reality.” … “That’s not the way the world really works anymore,” he continued. “We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you’re studying that reality– judiciously, as you will– we’ll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that’s how things will sort out. We’re history’s actors… and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.”
With the Iran vote and Bush’s bluster, more obstruction, the whole picture is getting very Wagnerian. Except with Bush the ending isn’t “The Twilight of the Gods” but “End Time” and Rapture.
If we keep using reality based methods to deal with this psychopath then we are screwed. Bush doesn’t care about Iraq, that was 1999, Bush is looking to Iran and beyond. Right now we are investigating accidents; we need to stop the Bush Bus.
KestrelBrighteyes @ 7
I purely love this comment. Both parts. ;)
Quentin @ 68
Yes, and his companion site which is called The Sacred Moment which hosts the Alice Miller Essays–which are beyond brilliant.
At least he admitted that Valerie Plame had an identity that was exposed.
If Bush says one more time that his most solemn duty is to protect the people of this country, I’m going to throw a brick thru my HDTV.
The President’s most solemn duty is to uphold and defend the constitution from enemies foreign and domestic. I can take care of myself, thanks.
If Bush continues to believe our protection is his most important duty rather than following the constitution, he is incompetent in the least and a threat to this republic at most. Either way he needs to impeached, prosecuted and punished.
This congress doesn’t believe George is a serious menace and they won’t until the day he bombs Iran. But by then it will be too late.
And when the next major terrorist attack happens in this country and martial law is declared, it will be way too late. And it won’t be the national guard that enforces it because they are pretty much toast by now, it will be Blackwater.
They are playing games with George. George isn’t playing a game.
Ann in AZ @ 54
Remember, this is the White House that told us in 2004 that they would take charge of defining reality, and that all Democrats would do is study it and complain. (Ron Suskind)
I agree. It has to be done. See looseheadprop, and “Impeachment by Frog-Marching Congressional Oversight“.
Bob in WI (temporarily)
Woodhall Hollow @ 58
Also, years of hard drinking can destroy the libido. But, Bar most definitely has the capacity to neuter by proxy.
Phoenix Woman @ 52
This is a good sign. By uttering the canard he casts doubt on it. He’s now mucking around in the talking points, no longer pretending to be above the fray.
What do we know abut the U.S. Attorney for the District of Columbia. Of course, he is a W appointee. But do we know anything else that can shed light on how he will re-act to a contempt referral from Congress?
The are almost the same talking points that Powell used last weekend at an Aspen Institute interview sessions with evilRove… this is from an article in the Aspen Daily News…
http://www.aspendailynews.com/article_20591
Note that Powell helpfully stood up in the audience to explain why no crime was committed when reporters were questioning Rove… if there was any doubt he’s still in Bush’s pocket, this clear that up:
“Former Secretary of State Colin Powell stood up in the audience during the question-and-answer period to say that it was his deputy secretary of state, Richard Armitage, who sparked the CIA leak case. Powell said that Armitage responded to a question by Novak about Wilson, saying “I think she works for the CIA…”
Powell said that Armitage later called him and told him he had been the one who had talked to Novak about Wilson. Powell and Armitage then met with the FBI on the matter.
“The FBI knew on day one of Mr. Armitage’s involvement,” Powell said.
And so did Patrick Fitzgerald, Powell said. Fitzgerald was the special counsel brought in to find out if someone had maliciously exposed Ms. Wilson’s undercover identity with the CIA, where she was known as Valerie Plame.
“If everybody who had any contact with a reporter during that period, had done what Armitage had done, I think this would have ended early on and not dragged out the way it has dragged out,” Powell said, adding that he knew early on that no crime had been committed in the incident. “Mr. Libby got in trouble for an entirely different set of reasons and circumstances.”
“Pretzel Logic”
then this won’t be off topic:
McCain campaign co-chair & Florida state legislator Bob Allen (R) was not arrested for trying to buy sexual services in a park outhouse…he was arrested for trying to SELL sexual services in a park outhouse.
(sorry…just too funny)
(running away…)
karnak12 @ 78
It is already too late.
again – why does bushco still manage to grab an audience? every time i see him in front of an audience i wonder why there’s no outrage!! if its money – economic indicators aren’t really in his favor so what up with this bunch?? i really do not understand this madness and i fear for america
The leadership of my party cannot seem to come to grips with the fact that much of the rest of the world, and many in this country view our Prez as being nothing but a terrorists.
Biden Logic:“This progress report is like the guy who’s falling from a 100-story building and says half-way down that ‘everything’s fine.’”
BigMitch @ 82
Taylor, the DC USA, IIRC, is required by law to forward the citation to a DC Grand Jury. Not that in Bushite reality of today, required by law means much.
Armitage? So far my party has let Bush get away with everything. Why not Armitage?
I thought it was quite illuminating that the President referred to the testimonry that his people were forced to give “as a result of the special prosecutor.”
So you see it wasn’t the law-breaking that was the root of this, it was that darn special prosecutor.
Sort of shows exactly what he thinks, no?
Ghostman,
Rest assured we will not forget Libby. Pulling on that thread unravels so much.
Did we forget to talk about Lieberman after the election? Jane was on national television this very day zapping him.
cc in nm @ 83
I thought that Powell was a military officer, not a lawyer. And that a main aspect of a military officer’s code of conduct is to always tell the truth (which is why adultery is subject to court martial). Both of my grandfathers were colonels in the Army–and would be rolling in their graves if they could hear this kind of tripe. Sorry Grandpa, sorry Papa. Your sacrifices and legacy deserve better than this…
reposting my comment earlier at TNH on this same point:
I am angry that the Dems do not prepare simple counters to the GOP lies, so that the GOP lies are simpler for the MSM to convey than the truth.
For example, how hard is it to say, “Armitage was A leaker, but not the only leaker, and the record shows a campaign to leak Plame’s name coming out of OVP.”
Or: “Go back to the coverage at the time. The WH wanted to punish one Iraq dissenter, but also send a message to make potential dissenters afraid to come out.”
Two sentences, and you have motive, means, and action summed up.
It all really started going down hill when my party let Joe Lieberman do what he did in CT., last November.
breaking news in NJ….will she keep the crown?? why YESSSSSS – this is news here LMAO!!
Page 40 of recently released documents:
http://pacer.cadc.uscourts.gov…..-3138a.pdf
Yet the
article had that effect precisely because the leaked
information—Plame’s covert status—lacked significant news
value. In essence, seeking protection for sources whose
nefariousness he himself exposed, Cooper asks us to protect
criminal leaks so that he can write about the crime. The greater
public interest lies in preventing the leak to begin with. Had
Cooper based his report on leaks about the leaks—say, from a
whistleblower who revealed the plot against Wilson—the
situation would be different. Because in that case the source
would not have revealed the name of a covert agent, but instead
revealed the fact that others had done so, the balance of news
value and harm would shift in favor of protecting the
whistleblower. Yet it appears Cooper relied on the Plame leaks
themselves, drawing the inference of sinister motive on his own.
Accordingly, his story itself makes the case for punishing the
leakers.”
karnak12 @ 78
If Bush bombs Iran, the martial law we get will be there to keep order while the rest of the world cleans up what’s left of our country. And we’ll deserve it.
Ann in AZ @ 54
I watched it Ann. I assure you–he’s lying. He made the transparently idiotic claim that because they have adopted the same name as bin Laden’s group, they are bin Laden’s group.
If he had said something like these are Saudis, trained in Afghanistan and Pakistan who were part of the same crew, then perhaps one might think that he was fooling himself. But to just say that they’ve adopted the name of the same group, therefore they are the same is just too stupid for words.
fdl reader @ 72
okay, we need to understand some things here:
1) there are limited things we can do right now that are useful. They mainly involved keeping up the blogging, telling friends and neighbors, spreading the word at every opportunity that things are not as they seem and danger may be very real and very near. Also we must keep up the pressure on congress, although they finally seem to realize what is happening and are starting a few tentative measures, but it may well be TLTL.
2) We no longer have the luxury of worrying about war with iran. we must concentrate on preserving our republic, our personal freedoms and way of life, and protecting both for our children. Bush still wants to go to war with Iran, but he won’t do it until our forces are safely out of Iraq (he is planning, IMHO, to move about 80,000 troops to kurdistan within six months to 9 months, and pull the remainder back to kuwait. Expect iraq to be on its own by march 1 2008.) Once the troops are laagered in kuwait and kurdistan, at the right moment in political terms and economic terms (oil), he will unleash virtually the entire naval air complement of the us on iran. no nukes, but everything else. no ground invasion, just air power. and he will keep it up until iran is basically reduced to rubble. and there will be little the iranians can do to stop it. oil will spike to 100 a barrel, but be brought down by production increases in other countries to about 75 and that will not wreck our economy. eventually iran will fall apart and the russians and turks will occupy it under UN mandate or something. (Russia would like its oil and gas, turkey wants a buffer from kurds and other hostile neighbors). We can do little or nothing to stop this.
3) If all goes well, bush will leave office in 2009 and we can get to work cleaning up the damage. That is what I now expect to happen. he will pardon himself, cheney, the zodiac killer and ghod knows who else as he goes out the door, just to keep things tidy. but at least he will leave, and his political appointee stooges with him.
4) If all does NOT go well, then it will be time for hard choices. but i will not cross that bridge until i have to. and even then, no violence of any kind. ever. or we are no better than they are.
Gunga Djinn @ 85
That’s devotion to the campaign.
Steve-AR @ 89
Well that is moderately comforting.
Jim Pharo @ 91
Yeah, forced to give in the same way that every other citizen is required to give when required to testify in front of a grand jury.
Not to mention that the said special prosecutor was appointed by his own acting Attorney General.
I wish Leahy would subpoena Fitz and Comey and force them to testify about the process of the investigation.
TexB @ 85
I agree it may be too late..I think the only thing that will prevent the Iran strike is for the Military to refuse to do it. Unfortunately, the Air Force is “christianist” and would love to bring on the Rapture.
A “soft coup” to stop the Iranian war would be good in the short term but terrible for the long term future of our Constitutional Democracy.
Democrats. It’s time to take it to the people.
OKK @96
i think it started going downhill when dems failed to respond swiftly and strongly to “swiftboaters attacks” imo
Quentin @ 68
Noticed a post over there yesterday where he calls firedoglake commenters, “you people over there” “useful tools” and “idiots”… refering to all comments on yesterdays FDL lieberman love fest post..
nice guy.
Steve-AR @ 74
I remember that article well… I was horrified at the passage you quoted when I read it and equally, if not more, horrified now.
This statement and the rapture connection are really what Bush is all about I think.
And as Greenwald said in his online chat at FDL, thinking about that angle makes people uncomfortable, so it’s never really discussed.
The only thing that doesn’t quite mesh is… why is Bush so concerned about how history will view him if it’s all going to end in 2012 (per current rapture theory/hysteria)?
Steve-AR @ 105
There was a kind of “soft coup” a few months ago: “http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article1434540.ece
Since it’s out of our hands anyway (or, as Bobby Knight once said…) I thought I’d try to at least tamp down the hysteria.
Woodhall Hollow @ 94
Military officers tell the truth? LOL. Dontcha remember the first casualty of war is the truth? Guess that applies to political as well as military wars.
I didn’t watch the whole presser, maybe 45 mins or so, but it seemed that the press corpse wasn’t cackling quite as much as they usually do. There were noticeably crickets chirping on at least one occasion when Bush was attempting humor.
Just got this from the State Bar Association:
Conference featuring U.S. Supreme Court Justice Alito Sept. 14
Tickets still available; seating limited to first 125 registrants!
A conundrum – should I be sick that day – or show up heckler-ish, learn to swear in several different foreign languages, wear pink, stand and turn my back with a Buck Fush shirt on backwards, ask him to explain stare decisis, sit in front and fart a lot….
Hey, if anybody wants to go, I can get ya tickets!
OT – Another anti Iran Senate vote on cspan2 now.
(Sessions amendment:
Makes it the policy of the US to develop defenses against Iranian Nuclear Program.)
They keep turning it up a knotch.
jayackroyd @ 100
Here’s how it works:
In the summer of 2001, Al Quaeda operated openly in a failed state, Afghanistan.
In the summer of 2007, Al Quaeda operates openly in a nuclear power, Pakistan.
George’s stratergery has worked perfectly. Orange alerts until the end of time.
althespook @ 101
Thanks for the reply: I really enjoy all of your writing and your ability to track so many influences at once.
We need leadership that hates war! Why is my country and my government so full of warmongering? [Rhetorical wail.]
From my corner, I really doubt bush will manoevre to stay on past 2008 … his fondest wish it to go in endless vacation. [President] cheney, well that is completely another kettle of rotting fish.
Thanks again, Al. Take Care of everything there!
Powell is a cowardly politician. Nothing more.
-GSD
juslin @ 87
The “Audience” is fake… GOP Shills recruited to stand and be “window dressing” for another BushCo Photo Op.
cc in nc @ 112
humor? we’re talking about the guy who made a 13 yr old cry yesterday in Cleveland, when he tried to turn her question about immigration reform into a cynical joke… she burst into tears, the rethug audience laughed, the shrub laughed too.. then his aids shuffled the ‘lil miscreant into a backroom. That’s what passes for humor in shrubworld. I’d only have respect for the WH press corps if and when they stop bothering to show up to the self-indulgent fiascos he calls pressers.
jayt @ 113
Steve-AR @ 90
I believe it was the then DC USA that refused to prosecute Anne Gorsuch back in the ’80s for contempt of congress so not like it hasn’t been done before.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 96
IMO it started going down hill long ago with the first lie. The illegal invasion of Iraq, and the outting of a covert CIA officer to cover the lie. If there aren’t negative consequences for bushco as a result of these criminal acts it’s no wonder the republics know they can get away with murder.
Howdy Jane –
I saw the clip at TPM and was just ill at that weasely little pr*%k who despoils our White House. I’d rellay like to think he’s overextinding his unitariness, however, by tellingf someone to ignore a legal subpoena from a co-equal branch of government, and that some folks might find that disturbing.
I did see a standard poodle in a Kayak a few days ago, and that makes up for a lot. Art to follow.
GSD @ 117
The quintissential example of the Peter Principle. Happened about the time he became a Lieutenant.
Brendan at 110.
I was told(by a general) a similar type of event will portend a US strike on Iran.
So if you hear about generals quitting start filling sandbags.
-GSD
realworld @ 19
LOL selise gave the link to the amendment text here:
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/…..0:SP02073:
and follow the link to pages 9035-36.
If your read the facts part of it, you will note that most of it is based on releases by the military’s PR spokesmen Bergner and Caldwell. Most are from Bergner who recently was working at the White House. The infamous and largely discredited February 11 Baghdad briefing is also referenced. In other words it is still the largely unsubstantiated case it ever was. It is truly scandalous that Senators continue to buy into this stuff unquestioningly. They should be telling the military and intelligence communities to put up or shut up. Real evidence, guys, not the made up stuff.
Also if they are going to call out Iran, how about similar treatment for our good buddies the Saudis and Pakistanis. Saudi money continues to go to the Iraqi insurgency and radical madrassas everywhere. The Pakistanis continue to back the Taliban against the Karzai government in Kabul.
TheraP @ 66
The War on Error – unfortunately, that’s perfect. Did anyone read his remarks at the Cleveland venue earlier this week? I thought that it showed clear thought disorders. TheraP -it’s up your alley. What’s your take?
cc in nm @ 109
The word “history” may mean something very different to him. To me, re-reading that paragraph and the recent events, demonstrate that a “reality based approach” isn’t going to work. And I include Impeachment without certain conviction in the “isn’t going to work”. His now open, and willful disregard for the Constitution and Laws of the US, to me shows that whatever psychopathology Bush and his “true believers” have, has reached a new and very dangerous stage.
Geographic location?
Indiana University School of Law-Indianapolis will host the conference in the Wynne Courtroom of the law building, Inlow Hall.
Topics to be addressed at this day-long conference include the process for nominating federal judges, judicial activism, judges’ pay, impeachment, and congressional efforts to limit federal court jurisdiction.
(my bold)
The wheels of justice move exceedingly fast for the poor and dispossessed. For the rich and well connected it moves at a glacial pace, to their benefit. Equal justice under the law? Another big myth of American exceptionalism.
Eureka Springs @ 108
Who needs nice? His post is great, even if he does call me a “laughingstock” (you, too, selise). We need more of this, not less. Here is a particularly apt comment:
“So, barring further extraordinary events, I think Pelosi will be successful in her efforts to keep impeachment “off the table.” What a pathetic comment on the state of American politics that is: the one constitutionally provided remedy that is unquestionably required, and for which a massive amount of evidence is already in the public record, is “off the table” — while initiating yet another criminal war of aggression, perhaps even using nuclear weapons, remains “on the table.” The moral inversion of our age is complete.”
I’ve personally gone from hardened cynicism about our representatives, like Pelosi to an acknowledgment of their limited real powers in a lawless, imperialist state.
Woodhall Hollow @ 94:
Google Colin Powell and the My Lai massacre and you’ll see how Powell feels about truth. You’ll most likely be disappointed.
Completely OT:
You will pry the 18 1/2 minutes out of my cold, dead fingers.
The present wrecking crew makes one look back longingly on
Tricky Dick and his respect for the Constitution, doesn’t it?
fdl reader @ 116
Thank you, but i am very disappointed in myself. I should have realized cheney was blackmailing chimpy from the tenor of the wapoo piece and the lurking cheney and cheney on a CVN (aircraft carrier) incidents.
The kicker is that Bushco is Buying Paraguay (no snark google it!) and getting ready to shift their assets there and darth is moving to dubai. you see, kuwait is actually a corporate state, its government is its board of directors. full citizens are stockholders (more or less) and vote that way to some degree (it’s so weird i can’t puzzle it out yet but i will because it is important). Guess who owns a big fat chunk of Kuwait Nation stock? Darth. He’s on the board of directors of kuwait.
So that’s why the odd maneauvers out there, and the sale of as many infrastructure assets to dubai and such. Bush and Cheney intend to literally run away with their loot and watch us and laugh as we try to clean up their mess. They don’t WANT an endless reich, they just want their cut and then its off to the good life.
In their dreams.
Inherent contempt
Apologies is everyone has already seen this.
First, Nancy Pelosi’s blog has the full statement by Rep. Sanchez concerning Harriet Myer’s refusal to appear before Congress.
So Nancy is on board the train that Rep. Sanchez and Rep. Conyers have set in motion. But which train is that?
Second, the Next Hurrah’s March 27 essay, Dusting off “Inherent Contempt,” is must reading. Check out the comments regarding the chamber pots in cells in the basement of the U.S. Capitol.
The MSM’s assumption that only the US Attorney can prosecute a contempt citation or enforce a subpoena is just flat wrong. Daily Kos has something up now on Congress’ separate power to use its own Sargeant-at-Arms to enforce its inherent contempt power. (Picture the S-at-A showing up at Harriet’s apartment . . . . )
Is inherent contempt pardonable? by Kagro X at Daily Kos is worth a look also.
ES @ 108
I can tell, looking at that, that he doesn’t lurk here, or he’d know better.
Mutant Poodle @ 123
money shot, MP! Poodle IN the kayak, preferably with helmet.
scarlet pimpernel at 9
absolutely your best yet!!!!!!!!
perfect layout!!!!!!
More right-wing freedom of speech.
Today was a historic first for religion in America’s civic life: For the very first time, a Hindu delivered the morning invocation in the Senate chamber — only to find the ceremony disrupted by three Christian right activists.
http://electioncentral.tpmcafe…..the_senate
Bush says, “It’s time to move on.” How terribly convenient for BushBoy! I should not have come to my computer so soon after lunch. I feel queasy uneasy.
Did my country have a coup and we are the only ones who don’t know it? The rest of America has accepted it especially the Democrats and I still think I can make a change. Tell me it isn’t so.
Steve-AR @ 128
Any discussion of politics that attempts discussion of George Bush psychology (such his supposed “Oedipal complex” in attacking Iraq) or eschatology (as if he in any way believed any of that religion) is sympomatic of an imbecilic press that refrains from the real, political causes of things. It is utterly fatuous. Bush is a figurehead President in whom only disempowered, slack-jawed yokels “believe”.
allan_in_upstate @ 115
To me, it’s simple. We (Senate/House Dems) need to stop all this “debate” and attempts at appearing cooperative with the president. Just.Stop.It.
Apologize to the nations of the world and ask for their input as to what we can do to try and make restitution for what we have wrought.
I think that would be a good start.
Nancy, just pretend he doesn’t exist and extend your hand to other nations. After all, he pretends that Congress doesn’t exist, so ignore his ass and take charge. You went to Syria, after all. The wingnuts are going to hate you no matter what you do.
Steve-AR @128
I agree completely that the reality-based approach is NOT working… the guy is clearly out in LaLa land…
Which leaves the glaring question then – what will work?
A military coup?
dakine01 @ 131
Actually, now that you have refreshed my memory, I knew that in my subconscious. Thanks for the reminder….
Vietnam being a profoundly immoral war (the one grandfather who was still alive and retired in the early 70s was profoundly conflicted about it–as it challenged not only his ethics, but also his sense of duty. I was really proud when he finally spoke out against it at a family Thanksgiving dinner…to the shock of most present!) brought out the latent rats in the military and provided them with the cover to advance up through the ranks.
cc in nm @ 143
Is it wise for us to talk about that openly at this point? Besides, weren’t WE the ones afraid of a military coup just a while back? I hope we don’t get jane in trouble here…
Al @ 101
Mid-June price of oil: $66.00.
Today’s price of oil: $72.50.
Seems to me that getting oil down to $75 will look like a bargain price in a couple of weeks, long before March 2008 rolls around.
Prof @ 135
And here is a typical MSM article from the AP, ignoring the “inherent contempt” power (which Congress can enforce directly), and thinking that the House can only go through the Bush Administration’s US Attorney to enforce its investigative demands:
Wrong.
Peterr @ 146
Oops. Bump my estimates up by 50$. been out of touch.
cc in nm @ 143
I think you mean a coup in Iraq, but to be snarky, I’m of the view that Congress will only act to end the war and stop the president when one of two things happens: they see the pitchforks of an angry mob marching on Capital Hill, or they spy the turrets the Cheney’s tank columns advancing on the same. In either event, it’ll be a bit too late.
Hugh @ 126
Welcome to the gang of “laughingstocks”. I called Webb, though I’m pretty dismissive of the significance of the vile amendment. I posted a summary of my phone call near the end of the “Yay, Jane” thread.
Much of the propaganda in the litany of Iranian offenses is NYT-supplied, too. They’re still laundering this stuff.
dakine01 @ 120
In the Gorsuch case, the USA never received the complaint. The DOJ stopped it in Fed court..same effect, different mechanism. The House can have it own lawyers do the job and bypass the USA. If the Fed Courts are rigged, then it won’t make any differance.
Actually, my mistake: the amendment’s not referencing NYT; I was just recalling the Times coverage of the “shaped projectiles” from this spring.
althespook @ 145
Given that neither I, nor Jane, nor you I presume are in the military… I believe people can safely view this as a hypothetical.
is there a reason some of the “f”s in the names are blue
Triangular Bullshit meets the Fine Art of Bitchitude over at AAB (and shouts out to FDL!).
QuakerGirl @ 140
I vote for moving on past Bush to a new administration, with all possible dispatch.
Prof @ 147
Oh, “wrong” doesn’t begin to tell the story.
If the inherent contempt proceedure is followed, then Bush would be forced to go to court. This conflicts with his unitary executive theory.
cc in nm @ 153
Sorry. I spend too much time on the net in places where just posting a comment like that could get an entire family tossed into a truck, never to return.
Bush sucks and the GWOT is a joke in terms of our effectiveness, but even without either of those factors, there are a lot of ugly places out there still.
cc in nm @ 142
I think the Dems should precipitate a “Constitutional Crisis” and bypass the usual approach and go to court now. If the “fix is in” with the courts, then that is an answer. we are screwed. That is what was done in H2O-gate.
perris @ 154
the f is a link to a facebook profile for that poster.
BigMitch @ 160
gna ah ahhhh
*goes to look at pictures*
Eureka Springs @ 108
Yeah, he sneers at the idea that we call our representative, then says we should follow his instructions in another of his endlessly self-referential posts. Go there, and what do you find?
[emphasis mine].
Prof @ 147
Let the record show that Jeff Taylor is the INTERIM United States Attorney for the District of Columbia. According to the DC USA website:
He has one of the “indefinite interim” appointments, courtesy of the behinds the scenes amendment to the Patriot Act. No senate confirmation needed.
Hmmm . . . perhaps to the extent that the cooperation of his office is required, lots of pressure should be brought to bear to force him to recuse himself. Given that the subject of the investigation in question is the appointment process in which he himself is currently emmeshed, during the very time frame of his own appointment, it seems to this non-lawyer that recusal (either voluntarily offered or judicially enforced) ought to be a no brainer.
BigMitch @ 160
I am almost done with a complete visual tutorial of how to get on facebook and how to get the kewl kidz “F”. when i’m done i’ll post it on my blog and everybody can link to it. it is really very easy and quite useful.
Sessions amendment to the appropriations bill
Makes it the policy of the US to develop defenses against Iranian Nuclear Program.
Final vote 90 ayes 5 nays amendment passes.
#150
Kerry made the mistake of sending out an e-mail yesterday wanting people to redister suuport for the troops by supporting Webb’s amendment.
I told them I’d consider it when they read the stuff before they voted on it, and when they stopped basing their votes on what the administration (known liars) told them about the situation. With luck they may take m off the mailing list.
althespook @ 148
Floating through space with Dr. Evil, were you?
Steve-AR @ 159
To me, declaring a “Constitutional Criss” is reality-based… obviously he eschews anything constitutional.
And, Kagro X had a great post on DK earlier about the recent Repub mantra of “taking it to the courts”, meaning the Congress vs. Bush wrt the USAttorney crimes… and KX very clearly laid out how the courts are fixed and even cited a Watergate era Fielding using the “courts” to shoot down Congressional oppo to Nixon.
Soooo… in light of all that… the contitution and the courts arent’ the answer.
It appears this entire path has been well thought out, and with the Senate uneffingbelievably laying the groundwork for an Iran invaion… there’s probably not much we can do to stop it.
GordonM @ 162
Give him a break. You don’t oscillate between black fatalism and incensed activity? He’s got good stuff, including what I quoted above.
He’s a good reminder that when Democrats win next year they’ll only mitigate our foreign policy, not make the ship of state turn on a dime.
swopa upstairs
Jane, Marcy et al:
They’re already winning the MEDIA WAR — which ultimately supersedes all the annoying little facts that darn left wing brings up.
I don’t know how to encourage this any stronger — but in all seriousness if the good guys on the left don’t reframe the totality of what has been happening for American mainstream audiences (TV WATCHERS) — from GWB43.com to Plame to USApurge to Cheney claiming to not be part of the Executive Branch, then we are ceding the whole game while complaining about BushCo lying cheating stealing abusing power, shredding constitution.
YouTube is not MSNBC or CBS — but it’s a hell of a lot better than what was avail 2 years ago. You and Marcy and Josh Marshall are 3 specific people (talents) who have the ability to CRUNCH this stuff down to bite-sized morsels for mainstream America to digest — and so with with a pleasant presentation style.
That’s critical because swingvoters have long ago already been programmed to view the left as “the angry left” and “they’re just out to get Bush in any way possible”… And the Wurlitzer has then on top of that, planted and reinforced the idea of “bloggers” being extreme people who wear pajamas and type type type and never see the light of day to experience the “real world”… So the mainstream media has marginalized bloggers in a way that compounds the “angry far left” foundational association.
All of that translates, to mainstream America, as “I don’t care what some blog says. I don’t have time for that. I hear they can’t be trusted. They’re not real news people.”
But we here on the left who partici[ate daily in the blogosphere obviously find all that preposterous.
My point for several years, since the Dean campaign, has been “well that’s TOO BAD that it’s preposterous and wrong and highly inaccurate. Because you don’t change a perception by continuing to simply assert “the blogosphere got it all right,we were correct — it was the mainstream media who blew it on the runup to Iraq, on torture, on wiretapping, on and on down the line. It doesn’t matter, effectively, because mainstream America isn’t coming to these “CHANNELS” of content and investigative reporting.
It has been my strong contention that we need to go where THEY are, and use the medium THEY use — and that’s quite simply, TV. And communicate in that medium.
THe beauty of this is: it’s not like you have to develop some new skill. You and Marcy & Firedoglake team PIONEERED this by your standup commentaries during Libby trial.
Those are beautifully accessible and “play” to mainstream, because they are a format the mainstream gets.
Please do not squander these opportunities in time. There are very short expiration dates on the time to influence America.
if Bush pushes out the meme “this whole thing is over”, yet Leahy and others cannot make a clear “mainstream” case for why it is NOT over — and what REALLY has been going on, then it will play out exactly in that predictable way: The public gets jaded by the Dems doing the investigating, they buy inot the mIghty Wurlitzer framing of “much ado about nothing” “no underlying crime” etc, and we get pissed because yet again the Bush Admin gets away with total abuse of power.
It really IS in our hands — not Leahy’s — they are not good at communicating with “the people”. But you are, Marcy is. ANd I hate to say it but it’s up to you two and Josh Marshall and anyone esle who can crunch this stuff down and TELL THEM whta the big picture is, and why it is not as the President portrays it.
All it takes if for you to either work with PTV — or even just use a simple webcam — record your standup pieces — nightly, or 3x a week, then upload them to YouTube — tag them effectively, get C&L to embed your videos, diary at Dkos and embed those videos, same at Firedoglake — and push this stuff out.
Please. The text text text her and throughout the blogosphere informs us beautifully — but it also enrages when the public is still not making heads or tails of it.
my more than 2 cents.
but i do want to footnote it: I put my money where my mouth is a week ago when you asked for contributions. I ponied up $200 – and asked that it be used to establish a FDL YouTube Channel. I’ll help you do it. But it’s YOUR talent and Marcy’s that would instantly make a huge difference.
Thanks very much,
rhfactor
brendan @ 141
Actually, there is one such discussion going on on my local radio station, which caused me to look at Wikipedia to see GWB’s story with respect to his dead sister. I highly recommend that you follow this link to that article. Good laugh is guaranteed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W
Just scroll down to the list of Contents.
Peterr @ 163
Recusal. There’s something to call reps about.
There’s chaos and a civil war going on in Iraq. We’re getting ready for Iran. And the Middle East is poised to explode. But our boy reports, he sees ’cause for optimism’ in Iraq? Based on this ridiculous report issued today on “benchmarks”. Who exactly prepared this so called report?
Prof @ 146
That is basically my understanding of the (usual ) process, “Inherent Contempt bypasses the DOJ..Last used in 1934(?) and ruled
constitutional by the SCOTUS. A good summary at Talk Left:
The Congressional Subpoena Power: How It Is Enforced
By Big Tent Democrat, Section Law Related
Posted on Sun Jul 08, 2007 at 04:03:01 PM EST
Tags: (all tags)
http://www.talkleft.com/story/2007/7/8/1731/15806
brendan @ 131
arthur silber is great – and right. i don’t mind being called a “laughingstock”. i mind needless wars, death and destruction.
i occasionally send arthur some $ – the only other blog i send money to (nowadays – it used to be more) besides fdl… and i encourage you-all to do the same.
brendan @ 139
You are right..but a figurehead for which group? That is the question. The German Industrialists thought they could control Hitler. I think the American “Free Capitalists” thought they could control Bush.
ES @ 165
Ahh, yess, Sessions (R-Far Side Luna).
I guess he hasn’t gotten the word that building a working atomic bomb is a little more difficult than making nitrogen tri-iodide. Or lobbing a chunk of sodium into a pool with a potato gun.
I don’t doubt that Iran is working on nukes. I doubt that they plan to use them on us immediately (and I don’t think they can do intercontinental, although anything within a thousand miles of them is potentially in danger). I think we’re in much more danger from Pakistan’s already-in-place nukes, with their unstable (and known-to-be-corrupt) government.
realworld @ 19
well, at least they got two calls – yours and mine. let’s hope there will be more.
the thing is… even if all that intel were true (and i have my doubts) – is the amendment wise? does it help make us safer?
could we please start thinking clearly about taking actions that actually help?
althespook @ 137
wow, THAT descripton, (my bold) is EXCELLANT…man I hope waxman and leahy read the lake and start using THAT
realworld @ 19
well, at least they got two calls – yours and mine. let’s hope there will be more.
the thing is… even if all that intel were true (and i have my doubts) – is the amendment wise? does it help make us safer?
could we please start thinking clearly about taking actions that actually help?
Mr. pResident,
A question:
Whereas you say Armitage was the leaker and you must have known he was the leaker for a couple of years and whereas you indicated that you would fire anybody responsible then why was Armitage allowed to stay on for years after you knew he was the leaker? You could have put an end (scapegoated Armitage)to it years ago. Why would you hide this important information and allow your friend and key staff person (Libby) go through a lengthy trial process?
Follow-up question:
Your indication that the case is over sounds like an attempt to suppress free-speech of the American people. Is that your intent?
brendan @ 169
Why would I do anything asked of me after being called a “useful tool”?
Rayne @ 183
‘cuz there are bigger issues at stake than being called a harmless name?
Jane, you have a wondrous way with words.
I see that Billy Kristol wants to attack Pakistan now as well as Iran….there’s never enough wars for the Neo-Cons who stay home and betray the troops at every opportunity. I’ve got an idea!
Since we seem to be going back to olden days of yore, so wonderful they were, in the minds (?) of the neo-cons why not raise armies the old way. Let’s have guys like Billy Kristol and his ilk (too numerous and disgusting to mention) raise their own little armies that they can ride in the front of at the front. All the Noble Neo-Cons defending the world from terra over there……what do you think? It would be kinda like the Crusades. Us normal folks could just grow food, make music and tear down massadra (sp?) schools like the Law School where Ms. Goodling matriculated.
Bustednuckles @ 2
Yeh, I’m late to this game, but nice work Mz. Hamsher . . that CNN Talking Head spun like the head of the girl in The Exorcist, but, you held yer line and didn’t break!!!!
The Bluey reminds me of the green pea soup the girl barfed in the same movie . . . only he’s a bad actor. *G*
Randy Rhodes is killin it all this week, and always.
What Say, Mz. Hamsher??? Anyone pitch her to get you and FDL w/Marcy onto her show????
About ANY number of topics!!! *G*
As Swopa’s link posits: What ARE they afraid about “So Help Me God?” *G*
They is on the run, and Al Queda is more menacing now than then, and Liebershitz wants war with Iran, which EVERY Dem signed off on (so to speak) . . . .
Time to get HARSH, folks.
And, I think, Ms. Sanchez DID that just yesterday, in a BEAUTIFUL 7-5 vote for inherency!!!!!!!!!! *G*
selise @ 179
I’m afraid that calling a couple of Senators isn’t going to be enough. War with Iran is a central part of the Democratic platform for 2008.
“We need to use every tool at our disposal, including diplomatic and economic in addition to the threat and use of military force”
That’s not George Bush talking, that’s Hillary Clinton last February. She has repeated the same thing over and over since then:
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap…..n-Iran.php
brownandserve @ 33
This is just a test to see if my Facebook icon appears.
DrenchedOtter @ 187
no, but if thousands of us would call… it might make a difference.
btw, clinton does scare me w/ regards to iran (so do most of the others, to a lesser degree).
selise @ 189
Agreed. I’m glad you called.
retirin’ in five @ 18
Add me in . . . Still Reelin To Do It Again Cuz I Can’t Buy A Thrill!!
althespook @ 55
Good to see you out and about again, trust all is as well as could be with you and yours.
Thanks for the above insight . . . it spins things differently, but, I’m not sure it offers hope of halting the Iran Do, or this admin, or putting Dem’s feets to fires . . .
Are we just DOOMED to a life at the hands of the billionaires who run the planet (pro war mongering folks they are)?
althespook @ 101
231 years to the month.
And we now find ourselves and our nation under siege from a revolution within which has left us all as captives.
Alfred, sometimes, blood will spill, with or without our permission.
And I believe, the bad guys who STARTED this revolution upon our Republic intend to spill a LOT of our blood. With our without our permission.
But, perhaps, We Fight On, somehow.
Dawg help us all . . . .
lee5 @ 24
Let’s not forget the leaker Ari Fleisher. I am sure he hopes we will.
“and now we are going to move on” in your dreams Prez in your dreams
I haven’t read the comments yet. I just needed to say that I’ll be ready to “move on” about this issue when NOLA and her dead are restored to life and when every person who lost life in the attacks on 9/11, in the subsequent attacks against Afghanistan, and the invasion and occupation of Iraq are returned to life and those who have been maimed are made whole.
cc in nm @ 84
Funny that Powell never said that Armitage told Bob Woodward, too…seems that Dickie Bird kept making these mistakes with National Security information.
And did he tell Powell the SOURCE of his information…the docuemnt requested by Lewis Libby that was marked with “Top Secret”?
And that this document was ordered by Dick Cheney…and that the identity of Plame was specifically checked by Cheney…for what reasons? Other than to use it to undermine the character of Ambassador Wilson?
So does Powell think that the Top Secrets of this country, including the identities of covert officers working on Counter-Proliferation, should be widely desseminated to journalists?
That WH officials should be able to lie about their involvement in that dessimination?
Amazing stuff coming from the man that once ran our military!
Jane you rock!!!
I’m just waiting for a movie, putting all this together, from you!!