What’s the connection between global warming and income inequality in the United States?
Republican lawmakers denied both for years, and only recently have some reluctantly come to believe both exist.
This thought-provoking comparison comes to us compliments of Massachusetts Rep. Barney Frank, who recently spoke about strategies for tackling the nation’s income inequality during a forum at the Economic Policy Institute (EPI). A couple weeks ago, while we were in the middle of our fight for the Employee Free Choice Act (lots of coverage on the bill at Firedoglake here, here and here), EPI held its sixth Agenda for Shared Prosperity event, where economists, policymakers and others came together to discuss ideas for moving America forward after 2008.
Frank keynoted the More Jobs, Good Jobs forum, where he notes many Republicans
now acknowledge that we have increased inequality. But the latest figures by the best measures show there is now greater income inequality than at any time since 1929. Think about what that means. It’s now worse than it was in 1929. That means Hoover made it better than it is today.
And Hoover’s approval ratings were probably higher than Bush’s. But back to income inequality.
The point Frank makes, which was reinforced by two scholars who presented papers after his keynote, is this: U.S. figures on job growth seem to indicate a rosy economy (last Friday’s jobs growth report, for example). But these statistics are belied by less-reported data deeper down the economic pipeline, such as those demonstrating the extent to which the rich are getting richer while the middle class is disappearing.
In fact, from 1979 to 2004, the percentage of households in the “middle class” category—those with incomes between $30,000 and $90,000—fell from 47 percent to 39 percent, according to no less a economic mainstreamer than Washington Post columnist Steven Pearlstein.
Further, as Frank points out, productivity and wages, which rose together until the mid-1970s, have split far apart. In fact, workers’ productivity grew an impressive 18 percent between 2000 and 2006—but most people’s inflation-adjusted weekly wages rose only 1 percent during that time. This was the first economic expansion since World War II without a sustained pay increase for workers.
But this group is not about sitting around and complaining. The network of experts who have participated in Agenda for Shared Prosperity forums are all about finding concrete solutions. Addressing the nation’s health care crisis is the first step, says Frank. But so is getting across to Republican lawmakers that unions are part of the solution.
I keep telling them to get over this dislike of unions and accept unions as a very important thing…whatever the argument was about whether unions raised wages in the 50s, it is clear that the absence of unions has helped lower wages today. Unions are important and they are one of the prerequisites. The restoration of unions to a central place in the economy, particularly for these low-wage workers, is one of the things that has to be done to diminish inequality.
Republican aversion to unions is no exaggeration, as Jane Hamsher pointed out here last month. In June, all Republicans in the Senate—except Pennsylvania’s Arlen Specter—voted against moving the Employee Free Choice Act bill forward to a vote.
Here’s the quick version why union membership leads to a stronger middle class:
-
Union workers earn, on average, 30 percent more than nonunion workers.
-
Union workers are much more likely to receive employer-paid health insurance and participate in an employer-provided retirement plan.
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Union women earn $179 more a week than nonunion women; African Americans $187 more a week; and Latinos $217 more a week. (Get more on the union difference here.)
In addition to getting Republican lawmakers to understand how unions are instrumental to a strong middle class, speakers at the Agenda for Shared Prosperity event all called for greater government involvement in stimulating growth.
Frank says:
It is very clear any effort to diminish the growth and inequality in America that’s caused by globalization, technological trades, and all these other factors will require a much more active government role, and I think we have got to insist on that.
Jamie Galbraith, professor of government at the University of Texas, describes the need to restructure what’s left of government after the Bush administration. His discussion was focused on global warming, where again we see the connection between global warming and income inequality: Both require the same solution.
…government will have to be rebuilt. The competencies necessary will have to be learned. The necessary powers will have to be legislated. Safeguards—against corruption, against abuse, against predation, against regulatory capture—will have to be designed.
Galbraith further bolsters his point with a quote from The Affluent Society, written by his father, John Kenneth Galbraith:
The role of the government, when one contemplates reform, is a dual one. The government is a major part of the problem; it is also central to the remedy. It is part of the problem of unequal development, inequality in income distribution, poor distribution of public resources, environmental damage and bogus or emasculatory regulation. And it is upon government that reliance must be placed for solution.
Another speaker at the event, Jeff Madrick, a visiting professor of humanities at the Cooper Union and director of policy research at the Bernard Schwartz Center for Economic Policy Analysis at the New School, made an excellent point.
The business section [of newspapers] is always talking about—oh my gosh—wages are going up. What kind of nation talks about wages going up in fear? But we’ve been fearful of that for 30 years.
Higher wages, says Madrick, do not ruin the national economy. Quite the opposite.
America paid the highest wages in the world since the colonial years according to the best economic history we can come up with. We always paid the highest wages available in the world, first in agriculture, then in construction and manufacturing, even though we didn’t pay enough often, especially in manufacturing. We had the highest wages in the world and what did we do? We grew like crazy. When did we stop paying the highest wages in the world? In the early or mid-70s, the trend started downward. How did it happen? It happened partly because business had to invest in productivity equipment because we paid the highest pages in the world.
And it happened because unions began losing strength. Madrick, the author of Why Economies Grow, also takes on the “low-tax, high-growth” neocon mantra.
I read in Fred Thompson’s piece that low taxes mean high growth. The fact of the matter is, taxes rose in America throughout the 20th century on average as a percentage of GDP and we became the greatest, most powerful and productive economy in the world. When serious people—and these are not especially progressive economists—do international studies of whether high taxes suppress growth in other advanced countries, they find no relationship.
EPI is compiling the proposals from this Agenda for Shared Prosperity event and all the others throughout the year into a briefing book for 2008 candidates. All of them. And let’s hope that, like Brookings fellow and moderate Democrat Isabelle Sawhill, they’ll “start talking about wages being down,” as Madrick puts it, and come to see that
oh my gosh—maybe even some hints of a class society, the lack of social mobility.



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zed
Fitz!
Hey Tula!
Predictably, red state Republican Senators backed by an alliance of business groups led by the U.S. Chamber of Commerce blocked the EFCA from coming to a vote. Which is too bad. After all, from wages and benefits to job opportunities and collective bargaining rights, it is red state workers who need EFCA most.
For the details, see:
“Red States Opposing Employee Free Choice Act Need It Most.”
Great post Tula.
I think the MSM is still pretending that upward mobility and income equality exist.
Sad to discover that, according to the numbers above, I don’t qualify for middle class.
In the 40’s through the 60’s union agreements were (informally) the basis for white collar, non-union wages and benefits in the same companies. When one went up they both went up. And this influenced white collar jobs in the rest of the economy. If unions had never had health benefits, for example, I doubt if white collar workers would have either.
How many Americans take jobs or stay in jobs only because of health or other benefits?
Supply Side economics doesn’t work. Nor does “trickle-down”. Neither does fighting hugely costly wars without raising taxes. Being anti-labor, against unions and being pro so called “right to work” works against the overall economy. It hurts the middle class and ‘kills’ the poor. These things do however enrich the rich.
And as for jobs? We need to have a WPA-CCC approach to the glocal warming issue.
Thanks Tula!
My bold…
Isn’t this the entire predicate for the middle class in the US?
This country is need of a sharp turn to the left.
I think this issue is gaining some traction in msm, at least I’ve seen more reports lately while it was an issue in the congress. I think that is significant, since the Iraq issue is getting louder.
Might we be at some tipping point here?
I’d be willing to bet that all the people who complain about having to pay higher wages are making more than $90,000 a year. They ought to try living on ‘middle income’ in some place like Los Angeles or New York where even rent is pushing the limit for the middle class. If you want to go someplace less expensive than LA, your choice is someplace hotter in the summer, with either a longer commute to the current job, or a new job that pays less money (but the expenses other than housing will, believe me, not go down).
OT: rebuttal to the Lie that Ms. Plame may not have been covert.
Can someone help me here? Our Michigan Att General has written an opinion piece in today’s Detroit Free Press where he criticizes bush’s commutation, while still bringing up the lies (Plame may have NOT been cover, Clinton was worse, etc. I’m working on a letter to call him on the BS but need the facts on when it became “official” that Ms Plame WAS covert.
Was it the head of the CIA testifying? Was this at the sentencing trial, or at one of the hearings? I want my facts to be airtight, unlike the airhead Cox.
BTW, his Op Ed is at
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs…..68/OPINION
newtonusr @ 9
Economists have always misunderstood productivity and who it benefits. Productivity comesfrom the substitution of capital for labor and the beneficiary is the owner of capital, which is exactly what is happening now and always did happen. In the 1960s, labor appeared to benefit, but actually economists had the causality backwards. Wages went up in the 1960s because labor was scarce (low unemployment rate). It was rising real wages that made labor expensive, while capital was cheap (low interest rates & capital goods prices), which led to the substitution of capital for labor & high labor productivity gains.
Since 1990, labor has become incresingly expensive owing to medical costs paid by employers, coupled with cheap capital, which had led to the substitution of capital for labor & soaring corporate profits.
Tula:
Thank you for this excellent post. Did you know that by 2020 it is anticipated that the US will be 1 million registered nurses short? And 20,000 physicians short?
Add to that the upside down factor that nursing faculty earn less than the newest two year associate degree nurse graduate in a first clinical job. Faculty are disparaged by other nurses, as well, because there is little, if any, ability for them to maintain a clinical practice component to teaching.
The average age of nurses is 47 and the majority of new graduates are second career adults – coming into the profession at an older average age.
Nequals1 @ 15
O/T Ed Schultz, (widely syndicated progressive talk show host) on Hardball tonight. Will call for impeachment. per his radio show, now playing.
TexB @ 7
Fuck that. I am staying in a marriage only because of health care benefits.
me @16
My comment got EPU’d. I said that there’d be no shortage of nurses if they were paid decently and no shortage of docs if AMA stranglehold on supply were broken.
The whole idea behind corporate America and big shareholders, for the last several years, has been to squeeze every last drop of sweat out of their workers, while at the same time to basically stagnate wage and cost of living increases. Hence, the rich get wealthier and the middle class becomes more of a myth in the this devilish process. Labor’s earnings cannot possibly keep pace with inflation. Bottom line? It’s all about greed.
We’re also seeing the return of the multi-generation household, partially because of the elderly needing care, but also because some of the younger generation can’t afford to live alone.
Big Mitch @ 18
Not sure how to respond to that one.
Kevin Phillips’ Wealth and Democracy talks a lot about income inequality and when it occurs in the lifecycle of an industrial ecomony (or economic empire).
[Blogwhore alert] I have summarized one of the central arguments here. It is highly germaine to the topic of this post.
TexB @ 22
There are worse reasons for staying in a marriage?
Does anyone think that Big Business is ever going to realize that if they’d pay their employees more, the employees could buy more?
What happens when their customers can’t make enough money to afford to buy the products?
eCAHNomics @ 24
Just to clarify a bit, my soon-to-be-ex and I are separated and proceeding toward divorce. But every month that we delay is a month of free benefits to me.
And my wife was a “benefits worker” i.e. someone whose cost of going to work roughly equalled her take home pay not including benefits.
If we keep heading in the same direction, the U.S. will become a banana republic of sorts. With the elite holding most of the wealth, and being the only group able to afford to send their children to college. Of course that perpetuates this awful GOP scheme.
Brisingamen @ 25
Henry Ford did this back in the early 20th Century. Wiki Link. (Ghod it feels weird saying that.) We need a similar visionary for the 21st Century.
TexB @ 22
It happens. Some people do one or the other or both. That is the sad state of health care and employee rights in this country. People are trapped in miserable jobs and/or miserable marriages because of health care issues.
The reality of the exhorbitant costs of health care slams right up against this wonderful spirit of the “ownership society” and Bush’s dreamy scenario of individuals starting their own businesses.
I had a friend who tried to do that, worked her butt off to make her business a success and had to go back to the corporate world because she was losing so much money investing in her business to no avail and paying for catastrophic health insurance, which was all she could afford.
Brisingamen @ 25
When I was doing eCAHNomics on Wall St., I called this “firing your customer.” Where is Henry Ford when you need him.
You might have noticed that consumers have made up the difference by going more & more heavily into debt, which, in turn, makes them more scared and malleable by the powers that be.
althespook @ 29
Hopefully one like Ford but without the overt anti-Semitism and support for fascism, eh?
Brisingamen @ 25
That this simple insight has escaped the MSM and most CEO’s has always flabergasted me
This truthout article (essentially) says that to add insult to injury, they’ve been using savings from outsourcing to unfairly boost productivity numbers.
eCAHNomics @ 19
Well, actually, it’s working conditions that are more of a drawback than salary at the moment – but collective bargaining only covers between 15-20% of nurses (I don’t know what the number is for physicians and collective bargaining). And in the US, physicians pay their own way and accrue the entire educational debt burden, therefore having to plan their practices according to their financial needs, rather than their clinical interests and patient concerns as the highest priority.
ruffian @ 34
The difference is that it requires a communal rather than self-centered outlook in order to implement a plan like this.
I’m positive most Americans take, and stay, on their jobs only for the health benefits.
Big Mitch @ 32
picky picky. I was speaking of his *economic* vision. In every other way he and his heirs are right b*st*rds. Hopefully they have finally driven the company into the ground and it can be taken over by somebody with a little social horse sense.
Return Question: Is the Principle Of Enlightened Self-Interest an Ayn Rand thing?
Brisingamen @ 25
The customers take their business elsewhere. Ask G.M. and Ford Motor Co.
Remember, if America is a banana republic, autos are the bananas.
Biodun @ 37
It’s certainly why I stay at my primary job. Jobs #2 and 3 and the tutoring are because I love them.
Gartner: Lull in semi equipment demand has arrived
No one is immune from demand deflation… even the progenitors of the productivity boom.
It won’t be pretty for anyone when the tech recession kicks in hard… again…
Deflation — the great equalizer? Or just… everybody loses.
Silver lining: political upheaval.
ruffian @ 34
I believe it is in the psychopathic nature of the corporation to operate this way, which is why the playing field must be leveled by government. They will not stop as long as the rules don’t change.
eCAHNomics @31:
Ok — they go into debt. But–isn’t that eventually going to hit a wall? I would guess that there has to be a limit to how much people will be allowed to borrow.
I look at the financial situation, and a little voice in my mind keeps whispering, “Great Depression.” (Right down to the drought affecting many areas of the US this year.)
Me @ 37:
Clarification: I meant full-time staff jobs. My frame of reference: in industries where freelancing is prevalent: media, publishing, design, and so on.
althespook @ 38
No, that’s Adam Smith. Ayn Rand thought being selfish and greedy was being enlightened.
GordonM @ 45
Thank you. Economics is a big blank spot to me. And Ayn Rand makes me wish evolution weeded out the unfit a little faster….
Good evening from Crete Greece….. just checking in to see if the rest of the world is still there….. since arriving in Greece I have had several conversations about global warming unsolisited from locals.
Our taxie driver from the airport to our ferry talked about how concerned Athenians are about the “warming of the globe” and its impact to Athens. It was 48 degrees C the day we landed, an heard of high.
It has been very warm, in the 40’s C and humid, the locals are very concerned with the heat killing their bees and crops. Conversation with a shop keeper about glbal warming, she was resigned, that there is no hope. That the people in power will do what they will and it is the “little” people who end up paying.
althespook @ 38
My knowledge in this field is limited, but that never stopped me from having an opinion.
1) Ayn Rand’s brand of enlightened self-interest is awfully close to libertarianism, and not my cup of tea.
2) Most people are not very enlightened. For example, how many people know which auto is manufactured in the most environmentally friendly way? Well, environmental degradation is a cost of the auto you purchase even if it is not on the sticker.
3) Enlightened self interest presumes that the consumer/citizen has free choices. When I was a kid, you had a free choice of one of three TV stations, one of three autos, one newspaper, (you get the idea.)
4) On the other hand, enlightened self interest depends on greed. Greed has proven itself to be more reliable than gravity, since we can observe the effects of greed in outer space.
My $.02
Brisingamen @ 43
The post-WWII history of debt in the U.S. is that it only goes up, unless some major other event intervenes to make that impossible. E.G., workers who lose their jobs can no longer borrow. The financial sector was very heavily regulated, which means that the extent of borrowing power was not probed. Deregulation has been a process of finding how much leverage is too much leverage. The line is found (as with teenagers) by going over it. That may or may not happen soon, and it may happen in small parts of the economy in a way as not to jeopardize the macroeconomic picture. Or if the debt problem is big enough to be a macroeconomic problem, the Fed can lower interest rates & bail the economy out.
In other words, you’ll be right in the final analysis, but don’t hold your breath while waiting for the debt implosion.
Thanks by the way to all the Dems who voted for bankrupcy reform, e.g. Joe Leiberman.
(”Thanks” is a code word, for a common three word phrase. See if you can figure it out. Here’s a clue: F*c& Y0^ A$$07&)
eCAHNomics @ 49
M1 and M2. By controlling them, it is amazing what the Fed can do. I DO understand that much!
Perhaps someone else has noted this also, but Kucinich and Biden both hammered on many of these points in recent speeches to the steel workers union at an Ohio meeting. Both speeches played on CSPAN last night, and both were good, in their own way.
Big Mitch @ 48
Ayn Rand refused to call herself libertarian (b/c she insisted she invented everything herself), but most libertarians these days are Randians.
And can you believe that an economist got a Nobel Prize for realizing that sometimes some people rip others off?
More powerful, but really not quite as reliable. If everyone were equally greedy, greed would lose as a policy. It only works when there are marks to be had.
althespook @ 51
Not anymore. Only really works when you can’t transport capital across borders freely. That’s really what WTO, NAFTA and all those good things are about. The moneybags had to get their stashes out of the US.
At this point, the amount of “money” speculating on currency exchanges dwarfs anything you can call real money. It’s become a very bizzare world even outside politics.
GordonM @ 53
Well, that’s pretty reliable, too. According to the calculations of one expert on the subject 525,600 new ones were born last year alone. (Source: P.T. Barnum)
(whispering, with a nudge…)
I think you guys just sucked the air out of this thread.
I’ll grant you that unions are in general a force of positive social change. I’ve read “The Jungle.” I understand that without collective bargaining, low-status workers are doomed to short and brutish careers.
But how do those facts relate to the ongoing failures that are the US auto and air travel industries? Or public schools in general? Can unions have too much power? Or is total economic collapse and descent into mediocrity the endgame of unionization in every industry?
casual observer @ 52
Biden is (D-MBNA).
Kucinich doesn’t have anything that would make me vote for him. (None of the others currently running do either. YMMV.)
One more point and I’m back under the bridge…
In a word… China. They own so much of our debt now and who regulates them?
When the yuan ticked up against the dollar the first time, it appeared only as a pin-prick. What went pop? The housing bubble.
Now that our guys are pushing to un-tie the currency peg, this will really dry up the liquidity for marginal borrowers.
And what of the “carry trade” where cheap yen are borrowed at deflated Japanese interest rates and repackaged into subprime mortgages and sold to eager financial institutions as collateralized debt obligations? They dry up too, resulting in a cascading failure of debt roll-over and further restriction of consumer credit. Sounds like a fast-acting vicious cycle starting its approach.
This economy will experience a hard landing in the last quarter of this year, extending into all of 2008.
And what about dropping reporting the M3 with Bernacki at the Fed who has the nickname of “what the hell, just print more money”.
For someone who is in Europe with the Euro now worth $1.37, it was worth 98 cents when GWB became Prez. THAT means our dollar has lost 40% of its value.
Everything ebbs and flows. My step-dad was put out of business by union thugs. See, the lyrics to Bob Dylan’s “Sundown on the Unions.”
However, the pendulum has swung, and now the owners of capital, and the CEO class has obtained too much power. Time for a Union rennaissance.
Bumper sticker that I like: “Unions: the people who brought you weekends.”
Wow. I just came across this interesting letter regarding Kissinger in 1968. Considering he is still “the Godfather”, read what he said about Nixon..there really is an “elite”:
http://nixon.archives.gov/virt…..rstein.pdf
tekel @ 57
Well, some unions seem to have that as a goal. I’ve often wondered about those that prefer the company going into bankruptcy-after-strike to compromise. I think it’s the win-at-any-cost attitude: there’s no difference between a union leader with that view and a company exec with that view, because both of them prefer corporate death to compromise.
And here’s hatchling Rove from 1973 with his attached PLAN:
http://nixon.archives.gov/virt…..3_rove.pdf
GordonM @ 54
Actually I never was a fan of the Ms, esp since in the early 1970s when I worked in the First National City Bank Economics Dept. There were a bunch of Friedman-Money Supply fans there who thought they walked on water–a very obnoxious bunch.
My first objetion was general–that you can’t control (back then) a multi-hundred-billion dollar economy on the basis of a multi-million money supply. Too much slippage.
Then, when financial market decontrol began in the the early 1980s, the relationship bet. Ms & economy, such as it was, really fell apart. Adding international slippages made it all the more ludricrous.
My model: monetary policy influences the economy through interest rates. Most of that is NOT the actual cost of borrowing, but rather through expectations. When rates are declining, people expect the economy to improve & vice versa.
Correction to #61: Union Sundown
Refrain:
Well, it’s sundown on the union
And what’s made in the U.S.A.
Sure was a good idea
‘Til greed got in the way.
tekel @ 57
Seriously, read my link @ 23 – promise you, no jargon, it’s not long, pretty easy read.
Management loves to blame unions for their problems. And unions, like any other organization, are prone to corruption, laziness and stupid policies. But it is not unions that cause the problems – it’s management, who having achieved some success, prefer spending time on the golf course to investing in the next generation of their business. Competition takes away business, management starts the complaining game.
G. Kerby @ 13
It became official when the CIA referred the matter to the Justice Department for criminal investigation. It was reiterated by Fitzgerald in his opening remarks and not contested by the defense. It was further reiterated in a statement submitted for the Plame hearing by the CIA director.
No one in a position to know has ever made any suggestion that she was not covert. It is pure BS and wishful thinking, and has stood for as long as it has because people who know and who actually care about protecting national security cannot speak out to either confirm or deny an intelligence official’s status.
neokneme @ 59
re:China & U.S. debt
China owns so much U.S. debt (”Developing countries finance the U.S. wasmy old headline for this)that it is not in China’s self-interest to do anything that would disturb the value of that asset. Shorter version: large debtors own the bank.
My space bar is not working properly.I try to go back & insert them where missing, but don’t always catch the problem in my haste to post. Hope you all catch my meaning.
Borrow a million and you are a debtor.
Borrow a billion and you are a partner.
GordonM @ 67
I would parse the term “Management” to mean senior administration and board of directors – those who report directly to the interests of investors.
It’s an important distinction because many managers and directors are caught between a rock and a hard place: implementing the oppressive policies and programs handed down by edict.
I think these folks carry a double whammy because they aren’t protected by collective bargaining, and they don’t have the golden parachute protections of the senior administrators. (I admit bias – I was in this category.)
O/T
The harriet meyers fiasco today could lead to imeachment, if handled correctly. I think we progressives in the blogosphere shoud be devoting all of our attention today to making it so.
On that cheerful note, to all adieu.
LS @ 64
Oh My LS – thanks for this great archival catch!
Nequals1 @ 72
Absolutely correct. The word “capital” is no longer widely understood in this context, and the Marxian term raises blood pressure, and besides, I can’t spell it.
tekel @ 57
I guess that must be why Europe is in total economic collapse, since unions have long been much stronger there than in this country, right?
And what about schools? Despite persistent Republican attempts to paint public schools as a broad failure, I have seen little actual evidence that they are; can you cite any?
Since it’s indisputable that that teaching is still a very low-paid profession considering how important “the children” supposedly are in our society, the complaints about “all-powerful teachers’ unions” usually center around the fact that they use their influence to push for teaching practices that they think are best, which sometimes do not agree with what parents think (or at least the loudest and most active parents.) Personally, I can’t imagine how a union that can’t get you higher wages can be considered powerful.
The most damaging influence on public school education in the past decade or so, in my view, has been the idea that standardized testing is the one true way to measure actual learning, and therefore equals accountability.
I know there’s a new thread upstairs, but Tula, I want to thank you for a first-rate blog! Democrats should jump on this “strengthening the Middle Class” meme with both hands and both feet. There’s all kinds of ways the Democrats can use this issue– if they get out in front on it, building on past talking points and showing how it is really the Democrats who have been pushing policies most favorable to the Middle Class.
Thanks again,
Bob in WI (temporarily)
Follow your link back to Cox’s op piece and see cmugirl’s comment with link to Salon verifying Plame’s covert status.
As to the rest of Mr. Cox’s arguments, Clinton lying about his affair with Lewinsky may have imperiled his marriage and taken his character down a notch. While a partisan Republican congress was successful in impeaching him, the Senate would not convict and voted merely to censure because removal from office was just a little heavy handed compared to the crime.
Maybe you should just remind Mr. Cox that exposing a CIA agent also exposes her contacts, real or innocent, to torture and death by this nation’s enemies.
good luck
ejd
Big Mitch @ 73
Nothing leads anywhere until the dems install a collective spine.
Bob Schacht @ 77
What Bob said. Thanks Tula!
OT: rebuttal to the Lie that Ms. Plame may not have been covert
Redshift @ 68
Thanks. I’ve submitted a response. We’ll see if it’s too snarky to be published! If you want to pile-on, send an email to letters at freepress dot com !
G Kerby @ #13
Sorry, see my comment at #78. I screwed up the format but can’t repair now.
ejd
e. julius drivingstorm @ 78
Here’s what I wrote:
Mr. Cox also tries the equate President Clinton “lying under oath during the Monica Lewinsky scandal” (for which he was never convicted) with Mr. Libby’s CONVICTIONS for lying under oath and obstruction of justice with an underlying crime of TREASON. If you think that “treason” is too strong a word, ask two of Ms. Plame’s former CIA colleagues, Larry Johnson and Michigan’s own Jim Marcinkowski. They will tell you that it was not just Ms. Plame who was betrayed, but her entire overseas operation. This includes her CIA colleagues as well as any foreign nationals with whom they were known to associate. Their operation was to track weapons of mass destruction in unfriendly countries. The damage to our national security is incalculable.
The reference to President Clinton does serve to remind us that Mr. Cox has also had extra-marital affairs. But that is a private matter, unlike undermining our national security.
Thanks to Tula, we get to debate the economic perspective!
Economic forces seem to trump the political machines in our world of make-believe. I would suggest the analogy of turbulent flow vs. flimsy structural impediments. Kind of like a hurricane making landfall…. along with the after-effects and all.
(I am a member of the hinky space bar club, too.)
G. Kerby @ 83.
HAHAHAHA
good one
ejd
P J Evans @ 12
The biggest and most influential complainers are tenured professors of economics. I know. I’m one of them. It sounds so good — free trade, anti-cartel (including anti-labour cartels). It all works out in the elementary theory we teach our first-year grad students. Few of my colleagues have ever lived in a situation where they were actually told what to do, and do it or get fired. They are independent entrepreneurs, with the real added benefit of assuming no risk because their jobs are ensured. Nice work if you can get it. I love it!
Many — I think perhaps most — of them are idealists in a twisted sort of way. They think that if the dream world of the principles book could ever be made to come to pass, the world would be in a perfect state and on automatic polite for the rest of eternity. These are, as you might infer, not deep thinkers. It’s like I always say: The University of Chicago Department of Economics does an exceptional job of turning first-class minds and third-class minds into second-class minds.
Thanks, Tula!
Dang, Republican Math is weird.
gkerby at 13….late into the thread, don’t know if anyone anwered you..one instance i know of is–at the hearing, when valerie testified, director hadley wrote a letter clarifying it……you might want to email emptywheel or christy and ask for more specifics…….
gkerby-
just caught up, see you already had plenty of facts now……
GREAT LETTER!!!!!!!!!!!
gkerby-
my comment didn’t post, so here it is again…….
i see that you got all of the facts you needed…
GREAT LETTER!!!!!!
eCAHNomics @ 69
Can China act in its own self-interest? Can any country?
Look at their pollution problem – 70% of surface water supplies polluted and unhealthful. Sound bad?
CHINA 90% of cities have polluted underground water
China can no more act in their own best interests than we (the US) can stop global dessication with deregulation.
No, the answer is not a pie in the sky tech-fix. It isn’t even thinkable how to curtail our human induced climate disaster. Moreover, we have no idea how to change our lifestyles to comport with an austere [read: sustainable] energy budget.
It is up to Nature now. Humans lost control the moment they thought they had Dominion over Life On Earth. T’ain’t so.
Now everything is just tainted…
To become affected with decay or putrefaction; spoil.
dmac @ 90
Thanks. I spotted a couple of minor typos that I didn’t see before I emailed it, but nothing of consequence. That always happens when I proof my own writing!
I’ve got to call ‘misuse of statistics’ on this one, Tula. I’m sitting here with the Census Bureau’s Income, Poverty, and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2005 in my lap, and while it shows (using slightly different lines of demarcation, mostly at multiples of $25K rather than $30K) that the groups in the middle have shrunk a bit over that interval, it’s because overall, people have been getting richer, but at different speeds: the under $30K group has shrunk, and the over $90K group has grown. There’s been more of the latter than the former, which is why the group in the middle has shrunk, but still, that movement is a good thing.
That said, let me re-tell the story.
Between 1979 and 2000, all the low to middle income groups shrunk as a proportion of the population, in inflation-adjusted dollars, as an additional 12% of Americans moved into the top two groups from the lower groups:
Population Proportions
Income 1979 2000
… 0-5K .. 2.6 2.6
. 5-10K .. 7.0 4.8
10-15K .. 7.2 6.3
15-25K 13.4 12.0
25-35K 12.9 11.6
35-50K 17.2 14.9
50-75K 21.5 18.7
75-100K 9.9 11.9
.. >100K 8.3 17.2
Households were moving up the income ladder; the ‘middle’ was moving upwards.
Then from 2000 to 2005, that process reversed itself:
Population Proportions
Income 2000 2005
… 0-5K .. 2.6 3.3
. 5-10K .. 4.8 5.0
10-15K .. 6.3 6.4
15-25K 12.0 12.4
25-35K 11.6 11.4
35-50K 14.9 14.9
50-75K 18.7 18.4
75-100K 11.9 11.1
.. >100K 17.2 17.2
All the groups over 25K shrunk or stayed constant, but all the groups under 25K grew.
Moral: Bush is bad for average Americans.
That workers are only getting a small fraction of our economy’s productivity gains in their paychecks is the problem. That the 30-90K income group is shrinking as a proportion of all households is NOT a problem.
Now there’s an interesting paper waiting to be written.
“The US economy of real people – the usual numbers, but with everyone who from birth is worth over $1M omitted from the data.”
Averages, trends, recession analysis, the works. That… that would be a fascinating read, and a really compelling PR piece. We know that income mobility sucks in (your) country – so remove all sympathy for those who made it via their own bootstraps from the equation, and you’re left with a group for whom just about nobody has any sympathy at all. The massive difference in the economic numbers should be illuminating indeed…
delete