Video of Sen. Joe Lieberman on CNBC via tparty.
“The Surge” celebrates its first Friedman today. Here is Turncoat Joe yesterday on CNBC:
“Give the American soldier a break…putting their lives on the line every day for us, losing their lives, they’re making progress, it’s as if the American troops have the enemy on one side and Congress is sniping at their heels on the other side…”
Contrast that with former Gen. William Odom:
No U.S. forces have ever been compelled to stay in sustained combat conditions for as long as the Army units have in Iraq. In World War II, soldiers were considered combat-exhausted after about 180 days in the line. They were withdrawn for rest periods. Moreover, for weeks at a time, large sectors of the front were quiet, giving them time for both physical and psychological rehabilitation. During some periods of the Korean War, units had to fight steadily for fairly long periods but not for a year at a time. In Vietnam, tours were one year in length, and combat was intermittent with significant break periods.
In Iraq, combat units take over an area of operations and patrol it daily, making soldiers face the prospect of death from an IED or small arms fire or mortar fire several hours each day. Day in and day out for a full year, with only a single two-week break, they confront the prospect of death, losing limbs or eyes, or suffering other serious wounds. Although total losses in Iraq have been relatively small compared to most previous conflicts, the individual soldier is risking death or serious injury day after day for a year. The impact on the psyche accumulates, eventually producing what is now called “post-traumatic stress disorders.” In other words, they are combat-exhausted to the point of losing effectiveness. The occasional willful killing of civilians in a few cases is probably indicative of such loss of effectiveness. These incidents don’t seem to occur during the first half of a unit’s deployment in Iraq.
After the first year, following a few months back home, these same soldiers are sent back for a second year, then a third year, and now, many are facing a fourth deployment! Little wonder more and more soldiers and veterans are psychologically disabled….
The president is strongly motivated to string out the war until he leaves office, in order to avoid taking responsibility for the defeat he has caused and persisted in making greater each year for more than three years.
To force him to begin a withdrawal before then, the first step should be to rally the public by providing an honest and candid definition of what “supporting the troops” really means and pointing out who is and who is not supporting our troops at war. The next step should be a flat refusal to appropriate money for to be used in Iraq for anything but withdrawal operations with a clear deadline for completion.
The final step should be to put that president on notice that if ignores this legislative action and tries to extort Congress into providing funds by keeping U.S. forces in peril, impeachment proceeding will proceed in the House of Representatives. Such presidential behavior surely would constitute the “high crime” of squandering the lives of soldiers and Marines for his own personal interest.
Which of these two men cares for the nation’s soldiers as human beings — and which of them sees them as a means to an end, for salvaging his own reputation and the reputations of his neoconman political allies?
Digby had a superb piece yesterday on the costs of George Bush’s failures — we are up to nearly a half trillion dollars expended on Iraq alone, and still counting. How much is enough? How much would satisfy the likes of Turncoat Joe — how many other people’s children have to die until he stops wagging his finger in mock indignation to cover his own complicity in this disaster?
How many more?
(H/T to Dan Froomkin for the Odom piece link.)
Related posts:
- The US Military Suddenly Discovers International Law–When the Taliban Breaks It
- Report Confirms Poor Electrical Work by KBR Endangers US Troops in Iraq and Afghanistan
- Changing of the Guard: US Troops Withdraw from Iraqi Cities; Maliki Declares “Sovereignty Day”
- Electrocution Deaths: DOD IG Finds Multiple Failures by KBR, Military
- Holder Refuses to Stand by Statements Saying Violating FISA Breaks the Law





Spotlight








Support this site!
Subscribe to the newsletter
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About Firedoglake
Advanced search

Mornin’
Helloooo?
We should mention, over and over that the “benchmarks” Bush pleaded for were not met. Not one of them. Zero,zed
JoeLie is getting even more pathetic.
He will say and do anything at this point to further his pet war(s).
Shameless.
and as bad as iraq has been… how bad would it be if we attack iran?
must read piece from bernhard at moon of alabama today, “Ominous Signs of War“.
Shorter Odom: Bush’s surge-ery is clearly malpractice.
JoeLie (R-Turncoat) is bound to Israel.
And there is your real problem.
Death, Dismemberment, Family Trauma eh…. they don’t mean a thing to Joe. Because Joe has never known.
Waiting for Fox News to refer to the defecting GOPers as cutting & running from Iraq. More likely, they will just ignore & misinterpret their words taking their cue from Tony Snow.
“Give them a break” = force them to stay.
Ha!
Is LieberLiar implying that Congress is killing the troops?
Odom’s quote is right on. I wonder how long til they start calling him a terrorist.
selise @ 5
Ouch that made my stomach hurt. It’s scary, but then I think….maybe not…we’ve been warned before.
OK Redd… two great posts before 10:00…
What kinda of coffee are you drinking ???
I gotta get some !!
Joe is such a vile, whiny bastard.
I’d welcome reports from CT firepups who can tell us how he’s being covered in the press there.
OT, but valuable as a marked contrast to the pathetic J-LIE:
Dan Rather was talkin’ common sense in his colorful style this morning on Blatantly Diverse Morning Not-Imus.
What a treasure Rather is. And worth searching out on HDNet. [is this available online?] His take on the MSM was right on. Talked also about Boeing’s new Dreamliner and the nonreporting on the outsourcing of its parts and lack of quality control on that outsourcing.
I’m starting to think we need a new meme that outsourcing supports the terrorists. Instead of learning the lesson of the danger of dependency on foreign oil, the corp-govt is rushing headlong over a cliff to make our food supplies and toys and technology and economy dependent on foreign outsourcing. BushCo is making us more vulnerable, not less.
Heckuva job, George.
[Sorry I can’t recount more about Rather, Fargo was hit by megahumonguous winds this morning and power knocked out in half–yep, my half–of town for a couple hours…still playing catchup.]
Jo-lie on c-span yuk!!! Unfair to introduce amendments. Unfair to the soldiers….yadda
Sniping at them from here…unfair. I oppose amendments.
and Holy Joe is standing behind them pushing them off the cliff. What a guy!
I was asked yesterday by a frustrated American, “What can I (we) do. Our congress does not listen, and I don’t have enough money to get my voice heard.”
My response is it only takes about $2.00.
1. Give it to Blue America
2. Give it to a progressive candidate in your area
3. Write a letter to the editor expressing your views and quoting your congresscritters’ response to your needs. Or better yet, get them on video and post it.
4. MY FAVORITE!!!! Buy a big posterboard, magic marker and 4ft wood stake. Print IMPEACH on the posterboard. Proudly display in your window or front yard. This simple act may actually change the discourse and convince her highness Nancy Pelosi to IMPEACH.
Most of all. DO SOMETHING.
[Sorry I can’t recount more about Rather, Fargo was hit by megahumonguous winds this morning and power knocked out in half–yep, my half–of town for a couple hours…still playing catchup.]
The Red River Valley wind is something that I do not miss at all since leaving North Dakota. I hope it didn’t do too much damage.
No, *-hole, you give the American soldier a break. Your craven support of BushCo policies are what’s causing their lost lives, their lost limbs, their lost sanity, their lost hope.
We are determined to fight dumb wars no more. To bring our sons and daughters, wives and husbands, friends and neighbors home. Soon. Alive. And whole.
Great postings this morning, Christy!
Jo-lie
Our main goal to protect civilians. Government cant get it together so we must stay.
sickening!!
I’d like to see the words Joe LIEberman and break in a different sentence construction.
The only word I have for him is schm*ck.
snowbird42 @ 15
Like the Webb amendment? The amendment that would give soldiers a decent rest interval? Or maybe we could get one in so soldiers wouldn’t be called back for the fifth time?
How will J-LIE vote on the Webb amendment? He should be shunned–starting with Harry Reid. Enough of the feckless indulgence of this slime.
Gawd I just love these two politicians.
When the Senate convenes today to start considering policy options on Iraq, two of the Democratic candidates (Hillary and Obama) will be far away from the legislative action, delivering speeches in Iowa.
And as for Lieberman, ‘Mr. draft dodger’ himself, I want this man to not be allowed to causus with my party. Take away his Senate parking space too.
urban pirate @ 4
We should ask HoJo if he is willing to fund the war himself. Otherwise he can STFU.
Are there any Peace Activist groups protesting Leiberman? I would love to see protesters surrounding Joe 24/7.
snowbird42 @ 11
i don’t think anything is certain… only that the threat is real and worth working to prevent.
a lot of very smart people think the risk is genuine. glenn greenwald, for example, wrote here (during book salon):
Christy: On top of that 1/2 a trillion, do we have to rebuild the infrastructure, hospitals & schools we destroyed?
I remember seeing a documentary on how soldiers acquired the “1,000 yard stare” for being on frontlines too long in WWII. I wonder how many American soldiers will have something similiar, if not worse. sounds like ChimpCo and HoJoe are really stretching the endurance of American soldiers without historical precedence.
mui @ 28
Sara Taylor has that 1,000 yard stare, doesn’t she?
mui @ 28
Even worse is the admin’s abysmal record on funding medical care for the troops. The psychological harms felt by the returning troops and those close to them will last decades. We are going to see A LOT of broken soldiers.
Wasting a 1/2 Trillion dollars is a Bush hallmark. G.H.W Bush wasted a 1/2 trillion on the S&L bailout, while all of his Texas and Florida buddies made out like bandits.
IrishJim @ 31
Don’t forget his sone Neil.
ccmask @ 29
Well, a little, now that you bring that up.
The other quote I like is:
Take this together with the Libby case and you have a motto for George Bush:
Loyalty not accountability.
If you remember last week there was the story wondering in tone about how Bush was so serene despite all of the troubles that surround him. But seriously what does George Bush have to worry about? He goes from a mansion, to a helicopter, to Air Force One, to a motorcade, to another mansion. It is the most pampered existence imaginable. If he had a conscience or any depth, he wouldn’t sleep nights, but he doesn’t and so he sleeps like a babe. Responsibility is for saps in Bushworld after all. It’s not like he will ever suffer a single negative consequence for any of his actions. Even if he were impeached, he would just exchange his mansion in Washington for the one in Crawford. That’s why he can send troops to Iraq 3 and now 4 times because when it comes right down to it, it’s not his *ss that’s on the line. If it were, we would have been out of Iraq before we ever went there.
Got a youtube of my own for you, Sen Lieberman, if you can stand to watch it. Phil Ochs was a friend of my late older brother. I remember him singing this in Henri’s apt. in L.A. circa 1970-71. Lyrics sound real current, unfortunately.
The vid’s kind of graphic in spots, but a guy who wants to keep the troops in Iraq until Baghdad freezes over should have no prob w/it:
One More Parade
Janda @ 30
And broken families.
Janda @ 32
Where did all that money go ??
“If Democrats use the defense authorization bill to pander to the far left at the expense of our national security, they should expect serious opposition from Republicans,” Kyl said.
70% of US citizens are now considered far left. Wouldn’t that put the “center”, the “mode” and the “median” in the far left? Hell, maybe enven the “mean”, sometimes known as the “average”. Math is so damned confusing.,
There’s not a finger big enough to flip that sorry SOB.
The story line led by Lieberman will be that whatever mistakes Bush made concerning Iraq pale next to what everyone else did in abandoning Iraq.
It is an essential part of the sociopathic nature of Bush/Cheney that they will let the suffering and deaths continue so that what they think is inevitable disaster (leaving Iraq) will not occur on their watch, thereby giving them what they think is a legacy exit.
Expect Bush/Cheney and Lieberman to push back against every rational exit strategy for Iraq because they think there is none.
To keep this in perspective, the next President will not likely inherit 30% unemployment or a civil war (here) but the Clintons are no Roosevelt or Lincoln. They are part of the problem not the solution.
Marie Roget @ 35
I am considering sending this video to lieberman.
Per Joe Lieberman yesterday on CNBC:
Joe mixes a bizarre metaphor. It’s the enemy who is sniping at the troops, and not at their heels. But Joe and his White House buddies won’t let the troops get out of the line of fire.
Mojo @ 37
GW’s 2000 Presedential Campaign.
Youkillednoodle @ 38
Well ya, know, Math is used in science and we can’t have that so math must be bad too
Here’s a delusional Tony Snow:
and now Graham is tag-teaming his good friend Joe….C-span on mute.
Lieberman is not the only finger wagging hypocrite on the Iraq occupation.
Remember when people were mocked for saying that invading Iraq might end up costing several hundred billion dollars? Make sure that’s on the long list of things the “serious people” were wrong about.
Janda @ 30
Too true. There are WW2 amputees who still feel phantom pains. And for every guy they show in the propaganda TV who’s out running a marathon or something, there’s many more so disabled by pain they can barely function at all.
Bush, Deadeye, Rummy and their acolytes should all feel nightmare hellfire in this life and the next.
Totally OT,
have you seen THIS??
Gonzo had multiple reports of wrong doing before he told Congress that there were no abuses.
Sounds like grounds for contempt or perjury.
I support the troops. Bring them home.
mui @ 28
The Army and marines have a 20% casualty rate – physical and mental health problems which cause them to be deemed not fit for (active) duty. Those are simply unsustainable losses. Add to that Bush’s plans to CUT VA healthcare spending beginning next year, and the answer to that equation is incalculable suffering, suicides, violence, homelessness, and on ad nauseum.
next time a progressive is on with this coward he has to ask lieberman how the hell he thinks he can make milirary claims when he dodged the draft and has no military experience training or knowledge
they have to say he is clueless when it comes to what’s good for our soldiers, the strength of our armed forces as a whole and what’s good for national security
Oklahoma kiddo @ 51
Soon. Alive. Whole.
Christy,
I’ve been reading John Darwin’s After Tamerlane, The Global History of Empire, which takes a breathtakingly broad view of the history of imperial growth and decline in Asia since the early fifteenth century. It puts our present effort in the historical perspective I think we need to understand how we got into Iraq, and what is likely to happen when we inevitably have to leave. I strongly recommend it, especially the last two chapters, which bear more directly on current events. It’s exceptionally intelligent, and I think is going to transform our view of the history of that region.
What I have taken away from it is that our effort to impose an imperial hegemony over that part of the world is doomed to defeat, and was made possible only by the temporary demise of the Russian state. Had the Soviet Union not collapsed and gone into hibernation for a dozen years, our home-grown imperialists would have never attempted the naked grab for territory that Lieberman and — to be fair a very large part of the foreign policy establishment — think is basically a good idea. Our part of that particular Great Game is now over. The Bear has come out of hibernation. There is no way that we will be able to maintain a permanent presence in that part of the world once we are forced to retreat from Iraq.
It’s going to take time for all this to sink in. At least the American public has concluded that the game isn’t worth the candle. So have our military, who will have more influence on the next administration than they have on the one we now suffer under.
IrishJim @ 31
It’s not just the Bush cronies that make out like bandits. There’s always one or more Bush with fingers in the pies. The Bush family fortune was built and continues to grow on these deals. The Bush family business is cronyism.
OT the dollar hit a new low against the euro. In October 2000, the euro was worth 82 cents. Now it takes $1.37 to buy one. At the same time, the pound is near 26 year highs and costs $2.02. And no, this is not a good thing. A strong economy has a strong currency. BushCo and the pro-business Republicans can’t even get business right. Typical.
http://www.nytimes.com/aponlin…..ref=slogin
Biodun @ 45, sometimes I find myself missing Scott McClellan, at least his performance was more “ignorance is bliss” vs Snow’s arrogant condescension.
Nequals1 @ 52
But ya know, this will be a big boon for the private prison industry so even more of Bush’s friends can get rich off of someone else’s misery.
oddball @ 7
Very, very true.
(And still I dont expect an attack on Iran. Everybody knows that this would be a much greater desaster than the current one in Iraq. It could/would cost the carriers and other ships involved! And many aicraft too.)
Thanks for a fine article, have a good day all.
Diane @ 58
Yep. Scott was adept at giving no info whatsoever, the inverse of what he was supposed to be doing.
Nequals1 @ 52
116 suicides:
Deaths: Self-Inflicted
As reported by the DoD as of 6/30/07
http://icasualties.org/oif/
Diane @ 58
And he occasionally appeared to be having guilt pangs from the lies he was telling. Snow just get’s off on it.
hychka @ 50
Found my absolute first thought about that right in the article:
Justice officials said they could not immediately determine whether Gonzales read any of the FBI reports in 2005 and 2006….
(snip)
the old “ignorance is bliss” defense.
“…losing their lives, they’re making progress…”
Yeah, right, a-hole Joe.
jayt @ 64
It is so enraging that the top law enforcement official in the nation can’t be bothered to oversee the agency he is charged with overseeing. I don’t see how anyone can not come to the conclusion that he is either corrupt or incompetent. He needs to be impeached.
Christy thank you for bringing our attention to General Odom’s comments. I’ve emailed them to many on my list and my Republican representative Donald Manzullo. He votes 96% with repub’s. It feels futile every time I contact him, but maybe this will get to him.
Lieberman needs to be stripped of his powerful chairmanship of Homeland Security since he’s doing nothing (he’s probably doing lots of evil secretly). Can’t believe that Reid gave it to him. Was he on C-Span as a democrat? Thanks again for your brilliant work.
Joe Lie in the morning really is off-putting. ;^(
And then to add Abu G. – double heartburn.
The pain! The pain! (a la Fantasy Island)
Read Bush’s 4th of July address to W. Virginia Air National Guard if you want to see where he stands on Iraq. It’s still all about Sept. 11, Saddam, WMD’s, al Qaeda, blah, blah, blah.
And the money quote?
“Victory in this struggle will require more patience, more courage, and more sacrifice.”
from whitehouse dot gov:
http://tinyurl.com/yq4bam
Biodun @ 45
Benchmarks are so retro. The Bush Administration has decided it doesn’t need them. They just obscure the real progress that is being made in Iraq. This is what I wrote about a John Burns’ article at the NYT last night.
With both John Burns and Michael Gordon in Iraq, the Times has a strong pro-war team there. Gordon is an unabashed apologist and stenographer of whatever line the military and the Bush Administration puts out. Burns will say how bad things are in Iraq and then conclude this proves why we must stay there. This article is in this vein and largely reflects the views of Ambassador Crocker.
To his credit, Burns does point out that Crocker is redefining the parameters of success in Iraq.
As with Gordon’s reporting Burns does not note the obvious discrepancies in what he is being told. Crocker promises a “professional judgment”, an honest assessment. But then Crocker goes on to indicate that he is already changing the measures of progress so that they will accord with his predetermined judgment.
Iraq failed to live up to the benchmarks so they are in the process of being declared inoperative. You already know what they are going to say in September. The situation is difficult. Progress is being made (according to whatever spiffy new measures Crocker decides he can get away with) but more time is needed. And, of course, bad things will happen if we leave (as if they are not happening there now).
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07…..r=1&hp
What Joe is actually doing is trying to lay a foundation for blaming the Left for the loss of this war.
I know it seems preposterous, given what actually occurred in the run-up to this war and in its prosecution, but rememeber in the end the Right was able to convince a large percentage of the American public that the Left lost Viet Nam. The Neos are going to try to do it again.
So what’s to be done about Mr. Lieberman? I can’t recall any policians from either party calling him out.
Rainer Vogel @ 60
If you assume that about Joe.. All of his actions gain clarity..
Prairie Sunshine @ 22
How dare Lieberman lecture Webb, whose kids have actually SERVED in Iraq, on being an enemy of the soldiers over there.
He really has absolutely no scruples whatsoever. None.
Rainer Vogel @ 60
I think it would be more accurate to say he is bound to a faction of Likud, if he is bound to anything other than his own ego. I believe that polls show a majority of Isra***’s think the Iraq war is not good policy.
I always get mad remembering that one of the reasons Bush needed this war to happen right away in 2003 was that summer was coming, and it might get too hot for our troops to do what they had to do. Now, 5 summers later…
Jane Hamsher @ 74
That’s a prerequisite for signing onto the GOP bandwagon. If you have scruples you don’t last too long.
jayt @ 64
Dones not work. As AG the expectation is he will have read the documents. Neither ignorance nor dereliction of duty nor lack of due diligence is a defense.
Mojo @ 73
Does Joe stand by Gonzo too? What side of the contempt debate is he on? I mean, it’s not like he’ll ever be President, so he has nothing to gain by supporting this bullshit argument about Executive powers.
mui @ 41
Dear Senator Lieberman, I am writing to you regarding your appearance on CNBC yesterday June 9. In your comments on the Webb amendment, you said, “give the American soldiers a break.” I urge that you sir give the American soldiers a break. Enclosed is a youtube link to a Phil Ochs song, “One More Parade.” The lyrics and images are as relevant today as they were yesterday.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5W9QDIV_XNs
Sincerely, XXX Mui
c.c. Rosa DeLaura
c.c. Chris Dodd
Prairie Sunshine @ 78
Has anyone in Congress commented on this yet?
Prairie Sunshine @ 77
Marcy has something to say on this.
http://thenexthurrah.typepad.com/the_next_hurrah/
More BS from the WH:
Under pressure, White House predicts ‘new way’ in Iraq
[snip, to about halfway down on the page!]
The universal reaction to the last seems to be”
‘They’re just getting around to that NOW?’
mui @ 80
Thank you, mui!!
RIP Phil. You had the voice of an angry angel & a patriot’s heart…
Something that really really scares and upsets me is that no matter what happens now – whether or not we withdraw, whether or not Bush, Cheney, Gonzalez, etc. etc. are impeached – it looks pretty darned good that Iraq is going to go down and its neighbors are going to be drawn into it and I think we can all give some thought to how that could end, not only in the Middle East, but also in areas of Europe with significant populations of disaffected people with ties to that part of the world. There are an awful lot of people in the US who have always taken the rather narrow view that all they were voting for, when they voted for Bush/Cheney, was to fight abortion, or gay marriage, or Clinton or whatever. I hope they are starting to realize now that what they did by voting for Bush/Cheney was encourage and facilitate the killing of hundreds of thousands of people, destabilize an entire region, make every American traveling abroad a murder target and trash the US Constitution in the process. Very efficient, that.
Diane @ 58
Froomkin once made a list of Snow’s dodges. Here’s mine:
Farm out to somebody else that will never get back to you
Answer a question with a question
Mischaracterize the question being asked
Attack the questioner
Say that someone who has a diametrically opposed opinion actually agrees with the White House and Bush
Claim that something that is in contention is fact
Answer your own question
Act as if you have expert knowledge when you don’t have a clue
Marie Roget @ 85
Marie Roget. I really sent it. Maybe I can get staffers to defect in the very least.
I guess part of the argument (which I don’t buy and neither does anybody else around here) for keeping Uncle Joe happy is that we don’t want to lose the symbolic value of actually having our caucus with the majority in the Senate, but with LA rethug Vitter now caught with his pants down inside the DC Madam, is there any prospect that he’d have to resign? Since I think LA has a Democratic governor, presumably that means his appointed successor would be a dem… giving us that symbolic majority in the Senate, even without Traitor Joe.
Does anyone else feel like we are watching a “shell game” from the WH ?? If they really Do come out at the end of the week in response the the Iraqi report card full of F’s and say “We have a new approach” I’m gonna scream..
Last I heard Mr. Lieberman’s 20 year old son was studying in Israel. Not serving in the U.S. military. The Democratic tent is not big enough to house Joe Lieberman. I want him gone, Harry.
perris @ 79
lol
Here’s what Paul Krugman said about Joe-Lie last November after the election:
(NYTimes link behind TimesSelect firewall.)
perris @ 78
I wish I could write like this. (In any language). Thanks.
As chair of the Senate Homeland Security committee, shouldn’t Joe be investigating this?:
“Vacant Homeland Security jobs pose danger to U.S., report says”
http://www.iht.com/articles/20…..meland.php
Perhaps if he spent less time stabbing his colleagues in the back, he might actually do his FUCKING JOB! (h/t to Sam Kinison, RIP)
“Give the American soldiers a break”????
That’s what the Webb Amendment is about, dung-schmuck.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 90
Now THAT is VERY interesting.
Has Joe been threatened, his son’s safety used as leverage???
I still do not believe that Joe is at all ethical, hasn’t been for as long as I’ve been watching him, but this kind of chess play would work on someone like him.
Hugh:
You’re so dead on especially about these four:
Harry Reid took a tentative first step yesterday in his news conference toward countering Lieberman’s latest ‘we have to stay for the Iraqi civilians’ excuse [which war criminal Lieberman pretends will justify the continuing slaughter of Iraqi civilians in the chaos and civil disorder of Iraq].
Namely: Reid actually stated that the Iraqi people want us to leave. Which they have for some time, by something like 4 out of 5 proportions, despite the ongoing chaos, violence and civil disorder we are ‘overseeing’ in Iraq. That’s truth about Iraq coming from the Senate majority leader – a rare breath of fresh air, and a fact that he didn’t learn from our “mainstream media” that’s for sure. Reid instead told this to the “mainstream media” yesterday. And if he sticks to such facts, and adds to them, he can counter Lieberman’s fig leaves very effectively and expose Lieberman as the patronizing racist that he is, with regard to the will of the Iraqi people.
Another approach for debate in the Senate (because the lies have to be countered, regardless of which egos get trampled in the process) is for Senators to accept and acknowledge the reality that the occupying power in Iraq (which is the massive military superiority and might of the Americans) is the responsible party when it comes to ‘law and order’ in that country. Unarmed Iraq hasn’t failed to create civil order. We have, and disasterously so for everyone in Iraq, four years after we first invaded and destroyed that country’s ordered daily life.
Finally, for people like Feinstein who brush off talk of impeachment because ‘the country is too divided’: My response is to point out that the only “divide” of any significance in this country about our occupation of Iraq or about investigating impeachment of this administration is the gaping, apparently unbridgeable, chasm between the will of we, the people, and the actions of our “representatives” in Congress.
perris @ 79
From ‘Judas Sheep’:
CT voters…I’m looking at you!
Hugh @ 87
It’s almost impossible for me to watch him, most particularly because the job is killing him. Surely he could aid his pod masters in a less stressful way. I realize this is wholly emotional but still…
So if they are trying for a sympathy factor with the stricken spokesman, it’s not working for me, it only makes me madder.
Mojo @ 90
yes
Dones not work. As AG the expectation is he will have read the documents. Neither ignorance nor dereliction of duty nor lack of due diligence is a defense.
Not a defense against impeachment, maybe, but certainly is a defense against a perjury.
Marie Roget @ 85
I really want this Mp3. Its brilliant. I can play it outside Lieberman’s house.
Since Traitor Joe thinks Iraq is soon to become the shining star of democracy, why doesn’t he listen to the will of the Iraqi people and pull our troops out tomorrow ??
because….. he’s a fraud maybe ??
jayt @ 103
Willful contempt of Congress?
Years ago, Lieberman used to play more of a supporting role to this administration regarding War. He has now outstripped them. He is, bar none, the most bellicose voice in the Senate, including McCain. His continued drumbeat for war is heard even more often than Cheney’s, or Bush’s. It is a remarkable thing, and I believe this is his last term in the Senate. Nutmeggers have got to be wondering what the hell they were doing in Nov. ‘06.
Now, I love this Joe Lie-berman website. *g*
mc @ 95
I thought backstabbing was his job. He certainly does it enough.
McCain is now on the Senate floor, trying in vain to point out Iraq “successes” in order to justify staying there.. What a tool..
Prairie Sunshine @ 106
Contempt of Congress: What Is It?
Joe makes about as much sense as Bill Kristol, who is probably supplying Lieberschmuck with his talking points.
mui @ 28
One of the first diaries that really touched me on Kos was one in early 2004 by a person named Theoria who fell in with a group of returned GI’s in a bar in Cheynne. She wrote about their ‘thousand-yard stare’. This was early on in the conflict, and they were already burned out, and were fated to be sent back.
Blub @ 89
He’s a repig. They don’t resign anymore for this—if it were with a boy, maybe. He’s confessed his sin and expects forgiveness. Whoop de do.
Remember this is LA. Not big news in the Big Easy.
mc @ 94
They ran out of loyal Bushies to fill all the jobs in Government!
Hugh @ 57
It’s never off topic. Preserving the dollar as the oil reserve currency is one of the factors that led us to attack Iraq and which drives a desire for attacking Iran. Emptywheel, for one, considers it a prominent motive.
Meanwhile, the U.S.S. Enterprise (a third carrier) is on its way to the Persian Gulf, and the Democrats in Congress don’t have a freaking CLUE as to how serious the situation is.
They just don’t get it, and apparently we don’t either. And no, I won’t email another damn rep or senator. These entreaties have the stink of death about them. Our leaders do not listen. They most assuredly do not. Remember the definition of insanity we were wall using some time ago to describe the Bush “strategy” … doing something over and over again that has no chance of succeeding is just plain nuts. Well, there ya go. Are we insane too?
This is not a “normal” situation. I think we’ve mostly approached it in precisely the wrong manner. I think we need to go WAY below the surface on this one, and I mean far beyond politics or physical action. — we need to go inside ourselves. That’s the long and the short of it, just the kind of declaration to elicit ridicule in the blogosphere, eh? :-) But that which moves one to apply the snark is precisely where one should look…
Toby Wollin @ 86
And what will we do for oil? At some point the America population MUST realize that their own survival is a stake when we cannot maintain the basic structure of our lives without access to that black sticky stuff. Americans have no backup plan. We don’t have a big oil credit card.
Knut Wicksell @ 113
Wow.
Sen. Lieberman, can you say a thousand yard stare?
Biggus Diggus @ 111
Of Course.. Kristol’s Daddy formed the Leo Strauss Society known as the PNAC.. Little Billy Kristol is the puppeteer for ALL the cabal members.. Probably even for Dickless Cheney
Mary McCurnin @ 116
What will do? We’ll pay more! And guess who reaps those pretty profits?
Thanks, Lou @ 111. This certainly seems to apply:
Congress can hold a person in contempt if that person obstructs proceedings or an inquiry by a congressional committee. Congress has used contempt citations for two main reasons: (1) to punish someone for refusing to testify or refusing to provide documents or answers, and (2) for bribing or libeling a member of Congress.
If he argues that he didn’t read the reports, that sounds like deliberate obstruction to me.
Biodun @ 108
classic!
my favorite section, Adopt a Jew for Jesus
I posted on this a few weeks back, but I’ll throw it out again for some response.
What about the introduction of a bill that requires, during times of war, military conflict, or action exceeding sixty days, that all defense/military contractors and/or suppliers, be paid on a cost reimbursement basis only?
This bill would:
1. Save tax payers billions of dollars
2. Be an easy sell to the public
3. If someone is not in favor of it, what would their reason be?
4. End this war and all future unjust wars.
Morning Christy. Bless your heart.
Thanks for covering this.
Yesterday, I happened to be watching CNBC.
The anchor was droning on about something and about to interview hojo, so I paused to try to listen.
Just couldn’t do it! Hojo opened his mouth and my hand reflexively punched the remote.
I cannot watch that man live. Thank you and all the dawgs for giving me a synopsis plus expert commentary that I can read. I feel shamelessly spoiled. ;->
now, back to read….
(always late to the Lake these days as we continue fighting to keep veggies happy, birdies watered & nectar-ed, in continuing drought – n.e. OH version)
Mauimom @ 13:
Here’s a CT interview with Lieberman. Normally this is a CALL IN show, but the coward didn’t allow that.
Also, he didn’t attend a funeral last week for a fallen soldier from New Haven. He sent a representative. He didn’t even have the decency to attend a funeral in the city in which he lived for 47 years!
One last interesting item from an alternative newspaper (The Advocate) which reported a visit LIEberman made last week. It’s called Fuddy Big Dud. According to the article LIEberman stopped by Homes for the Brave in Bridgeport. This is a transitional housing facility for formerly homeless vets. Well, it didn’t go well for Fuddy Dud. Those in attendance “put the senator on the spot by questioning his reasoning for supporting such a pointless war” and questioning his endless support for continuing deployment to Iraq. Another offered his support of Kucinich, his proposal for a “Department of Peace”, and a 12 point exit strategy. LIEberman’s response? –”by simply disregarding the message altogether”. The reporter said he also “got the blow-off from his [LIEberman’s] flak.
Other than that…the corporate news is very quiet.
casual observer @ 107
It’s the war with Lieberman. It was always about invading Iraq, even back in 2000, and staying there while starting a war with Iran is all it will be about for the remainder of his career. I’m as guilty as anyone of attributing personal motives to Lieberman for his bellicosity, but those kind of subjective appraisals are really superfluous, and even counterproductive. All you need to know is that he’s only in politics for the war at this point.
bookwoman @ 126
The Kucinich part didn’t surprise me. Alot of people in CT like Kucinich.
mui @ 104
Need to finally drive to work now, but thanks again, mui. When I saw how the vid had grabbed the essence of Phil’s song I felt as you do. IMO should be required listening/viewing for Sens & Reps alike as we, their constituents, all stand on one foot waiting for…what exactly this September?
GeorgeSimian @ 115
my thots exactly! Yesterday I was trying to imagine all these perfectly qualified candidates, one after another, being bounced for giving the wrong answer to question on Roe vs. Wade…. *sigh*
And here’s a delusional Bill Kristol:
calamity-Janes? Sweep the Repugs to ruin? Bill Kristol needs to learn how to write.
There is another “Friedman Oil Unit”, that is the cost of oil. This metric is 60=very bad and 6=very good. This measure gives the result that the War is VERY BAD.
—————————-
Thomas Friedman, August 6, 2002, The Guardian
Depending on how the war went, that impact could be very bad and lead to a sharp spike in oil prices, like $60-a-barrel oil. But – wait a minute – it could also be very good, and lead to $6-a-barrel oil that would weaken Opec and, maybe, also weaken the Arab autocrats who depend on high oil prices to finance their illegitimate regimes and buy off opponents.
Adie @ 128
Roe vs Wade? You mean Bush vs Gore!
“The president is strongly motivated to string out the war until he leaves office…”
I beg to differ.
It has become his raison d’etre. It is pulsating and throbbing in the largely-empty space between his and his fellow mouth-breathers ears, like a neon sign in a barroom window.
If he/they can do it, the NEW “Mission Accomplished” sign will be the size of Mt. Rushmore.
But the problem for the true believers, is that the GOP conger eels know that THEY, too, will be left holding the flaming bag of shit, and if they have been suicidal enough to NOT join the democrats in going after bush, then they will pay the price for letting him get out of town with some vestige of his turd-legacy, intact.
Not to worry, folks. It aint gonna happen.:o)
As we post here, the senate cloakrooms are seeing plans hatched for getting rid of these liver-lesions-on-america. The MSM is already openly speculating about a Cheyney resignation. So far, they aren’t talking about one for bush, but that’s still them knowing which questions not to ask. Such as the one that is CERTAINLY ratting around in republican gourds:
“If Cheyney goes, why the fuck should we leave goatboy sitting in the white house for the democrats to point to, in 2008?”
I’m telling you, firehounds; the WHOLE SHITTAREE is hanging by a thread. And it could break at any moment. Our military are looking at reality; not pie-in-the-sky “doable” bullshit. Not, “give-us-5-more-years-and-we’ll-stabilize-Iraq” idiocy.
Every republican who stands up and says “This is not working. We need to start getting out” is a dagger in bush’s chest. A much BIGGER dagger than anything the democrats can throw at him.
Of course, they also need to put THEIR names on the legislation to force the drawdown, but that is the next step, and it WILL be taken.
Patience, all. Let us bitch and rant and point out all of the miserable distortions and lies that were use to create and sustain this bloody misery, and let us insist that the democrats do it, too. ESPECIALLY, them, but this thing has it’s own momentum now, and it it’s the impetus of truth and reality.
It not completely beyond our poor power to add or detract from the reckoning that bush and the republicans are going to face, but about all we need to do is keep up the drumbeat and make sure they don’t start WWIII, to try to enfold their clusterfuck.
Those are the “chores”. Let’s take care of business, and the reality-hog will root out the warpimps like they were truffles; only, foul, rancid, truffles. :o)
Jim Webb gave a great speech on his amendment yesterday.
http://webb.senate.gov/newsroo…..78441&
He speaks with sincerity and credibility – we need to give him more power in our party. He is a real leader.
Karen
Read Jonathon Shays,”Achilles in Vietnam”
for the impact of modern warfare on Vietnam Vets. It compares Vietnam to Achilles, a Greek hero noting why modern warfare is so morally and ethically damaging to our soldiers. They are never whole again and live lives of trauma and despair. I hate war, especially wars of choice where countless human lives are wasted.
New thread from Christy:
Her sin…
boxer @ 124
“God bless our defense contractors!” ~ Why We Fight
brendan @ 116
Yes, I have been wondering if exchange rates are part of what is keeping crude oil prices high. The Brent spot (world and European benchmark) is trading at $77.78 a barrel in the absence of war, weather, or other disruption or threat. West Texas crude is trading at $72.10 but this American benchmark has really lost its relevance because it doesn’t represent a significant volume anymore. This explains why you can have such a large differential between it and the Brent.
BTW as I have been saying for the last week or so gasoline prices are on their way back up although supplies should be good.
Marie Roget @ 129
As FDL netizen I have a proposal: WE all buy Phil Ochs and send it to our reps and senators.
GeorgeSimian @ 133
well, i’m trying to cool off here by enjoying the Lake. Get me started on BvG & my head explodes instantaneously. Not a purty sight!
but OH! How right, I mean correct, you are!!!
*grrrrrrrrrrrrrrRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!*
now look whut ya gone & done, pant pant……
Biodun @ 131
Please see my earlier comment about Bill Kristol.. He is not stupid.. He acts that way so no one will believe his true power. He PUT Dubya in office to carry out PNAC agenda..
GeorgeSimian @ 133
No, I would wager Roe v Wade was what was meant given that Ol’ 60 Grit’s husband is on record as saying views on Roe v Wade were among the important criteria for positions with the Coaliton Provisional Authority in Iraq.
on the sub-thread of the devaluation of the dollar – this is a typical result of imperial overstretch – the devaluation of the currency.
The regime runs the printing presses day and night and sens literally tons of cash shrinkwrapped on pallets over to the mercenaries in Iraq, as well as borrowing like a f*cked up frat boy on daddy’s credit card, and the result will be that the dollar will turn into the peso, maybe acheiving 1 to 1 parity.
then as a final middle finger to everyone, the trillions in debt and reserve holdings in the Asian central banks will have their value evaporate right out of the vault.
It also makes the low or negative savings rate of most Americans seem more economically rational.
Dear Joe,
The troops are not putting their lives on the line for me or to preserve freedom or keep terrorists from attacking the USA.
They are dying for George W Bush and a few other egomaniacs such as you.
Please support the troops, Joe. Bring them home!
Hmmm . . . ya don’t suppose there’s room in the “DC rolodex madam’s” for one more card – filed under “L?”
Okay, just a thought . . .
I saw JoeHole this morning pushing his BS and NOT ONE Dem got up afterwards to challenge this evil man and his pious bloviating on the Iraq war…
SHAME ON THE DEMS TO PUT UP WITH THIS DIMWIT!
The CIA World Fact Book says there are about 27M Iraqis. The CRS says the occupation of Iraq is costing about $10B/month. So we’re spending about $100 per week per Iraqi to lower their standard of living and reduce their security. There are probably cheaper ways to achieve the same end. But they don’t have the same money-recycling potential.
Please have a look at Atrios from last night and this AM. He does a spectacular public service by lining up quote from pundit after pundit, pol after pol from exactly one Friedman ago. As Atrios as so often documented, NOTHING CHANGES from Friedman to Friedman. I would love to see Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi hold a press conference where they read these quotes aloud, the whole list. In fact, seriously, WHY NOT JUST THAT???? Atrios did the work for you Madame Speaker and Mr. Majority Leader. Please put that work on the public airwaves! That will help fulfill the agenda above from Gen. Odom.
And while you are at it, go ahead Madame Speaker and give the green light on impeachment processes getting started against Big Time Cheney. The possibility of attacking Iran is reason enough to hobble and cripple that dangerous man.
Hey, Holy Joe, Congress is NOT sniping at the heels of our soldiers … it is sniping at the heels of their CIVILIAN leadership. But such distinctions are far too subtle for you, aren’t they, Holy Joe?
By the way, Holy Joe, Congress (at least some of Congress) is trying to get the soldiers home as soon as possible, that is, to safety, so they can resume their shattered lives. Congress (at least some of Congress) is actually truly honestly trying to help the soldiers, which is more than I see you doing, Holy Joe.
Here’s a short video clip I made which compresses Holy Joe’s entire message into 3 soundbytes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bw5_EYohDzo
RELATED:
I really would love to see the blogosphere use more on-camera VIDEO in their blog postings — since TV is the language of Mainstream America.
Firedoglake really is the groundbreaker here — with the video standup pieces (done with PoliticsTV) throughout the Libby trial featuring Jane, Christy, Marcy, Jeralyn, Swopa. These were outstanding — and seemed to prompt the move inot video by Josh Marshall.
This is a VIDEO DIARY I posted today at dKos –
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/7/10/42345/0916
or
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDT2Uk6a-3I
…and I am looking to meet with people interested in using more video and streaming methods for reaching mainstream. If you’re going to YearlyKos, send me an email please: rhfactorUSA
at Gmail dotcom
How many of “turncoat Joe’s” relatives our serving in his war for Israel and control of the oil in Iraq?
Odum served by putting on a uniform..Liarman serves by sending other peoples family members to die.
George Galloway has told the truth about Iraq best. Iraq based on a “pack of lies”
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7883488
wagonjak @ 147
The only person I have witnessed challenge Liarman to his face his Senator Chuck Hagel (several times) Hagel has even been brave enough to bring up the lopsided policies in the Israeli Palestinian conflict.
http://www.crooksandliars.com/…..lieberman/
Heard an NPR story this morning about the Defense Budget…it amounts to 30% of the total national budget. THIRTY PERCENT !! That says a lot about us, we are supposedly the most powerful country on earth and we need to spend one-third of all our tax dollars (plus what we borrow from China?) to maintain this status? Last week GW made an interesting statement although I’m sure he didn’t mean to and didn’t catch the double meaning when he reminded us that in the Revolutionary War it took a rag-tag bunch of unorganized but passionate insurgents six years to defeat the most powerful military in the world (at that time). Might not take that long this time around……
Give Joe Lieberman the “Blivet” of the week award.
Ten pounds of nonsensical propaganda in a five pound suit.
–cognitorex–