Pach!

Zed

Gore!

zedelicious!!!

Proud to say I already do most of the things they suggest!

6?

Arrgh!!!

dawgonnit

Yeah, this crowd is tough.

oddmommy @ 8

dawgonnit

I’m with ya there, Ma’am!!! *g*

Plea to all Greens: Please support Al Gore for President. ;0)

Kermit would be proud – it is easy being green.

Al looked really good when he spoke at the NY/NJ concert after Melissa Etheridge sang.

carry 2 folding bags in a purse so’s I don’t have to use plastic; ride bike to work as often as possible; ALL lights in the house are CFLs; air dry clothes (especially in summer!); re-use/re-cycle; plan to make cheesecloth produce bags soon. Once one is in the habit, these things are pretty easy…

Oklahoma kiddo @ 11

Plea to all Greens: Please support Al Gore for President. ;0)

I would love ta, but, he has ta!!! *g*

Anyone have a good online link for the concert? Live, I mean?

Oklahoma kiddo @ 11

Plea to all Greens: Please support Al Gore for President. ;0)

I’m green, and I’m for Al ;-)

I am doing a lot better..my ex-wife helped me scale back my life style and energy use.

Thanks. I love seeing Kermit. Reminds me of more gentle times and songs about rainbows.

Evening all. It cooled off to an almost balmy 94 today. Still TDH, but much better than yesterday. Tomorrow it is supposed to be in the upper 80s (almost normal for this time of year).

Steve @ 18

I am doing a lot better..my ex-wife helped me scale back my life style and energy use.

Whatever it takes Steve.

Live Earth by all indications was a spectacularly successful event.

Regardless of whether you want Al to run for Pres, he did a helluva job pulling this thing together and it was one of the most impressive acts of global leadership I have seen in some time.

Can anyone imagine W getting 2B of the world’s population to pay attention to anything other than a disastrous and immoral war?

Crickets…..

Steve @ 18

I am doing a lot better..my ex-wife helped me scale back my life style and energy use.

I hope it feels like a win/win.

Valley Girl @ 16

Anyone have a good online link for the concert? Live, I mean?

Try this:

http://liveearth.msn.com/?GT1=10227

Steve @ 18

I am doing a lot better..my ex-wife helped me scale back my life style and energy use.

ditto

Steve @ 18

I am doing a lot better..my ex-wife helped me scale back my life style and energy use.

Just like Gov. Ah-nold helped me scale back

Changed some of my lightbulbs to CFL’s in 2001 after the west coast got Enroned. Changed 4 more a couple months ago when I found vanity CFL’s (the big round bulbs for the bathroom vanity, not my ego. :) )

Installed a programmable thermostat for my furnace and it more than paid for itself the first winter.

My lawnmower is a manual push reel. In other words, TOW powered.

I have a bike and need to ride it more often.

Oh no, the dreaded spinning comment wheel…reposting:

Laura @14, the grocery store where I shop recently came out with their own reusable bags, nice heavy-duty mesh. No more landfill-clogging plastic bags in this house.

I just wish I could use public transportation, but out here it’s difficult, especially working shift work. But I definitely use CFL bulbs, turn off lights, and generally just try to be a good resident of Mother Earth.

O those governors. I don’t recall that W ever mentioned the subject and about the same for his successor (Mr. Good Hair as Molly Ivins noted) Perry. The Stars at Night are big and bright, deep in the Heart of TX: You just can’t see them any more.

I air dry most of my clothes most of the year. Drive a Prius. And shop for produce local and organic, mostly directly from the farm. Buy most everything organic. Including some of my clothes. I’d love to get compact flourescents, but the quality of the light creeps me out. I walk to some things.

There is hope. Why? Younger folks are onto this. My own children (now early 20s), were taught this their entire school years. (Thank the teachers for this!) Yes, even in the late 80s. Way before their time. That’s why Inhofe, et al will not win.

DrDick @ 20

Evening all. It cooled off to an almost balmy 94 today. Still TDH, but much better than yesterday. Tomorrow it is supposed to be in the upper 80s (almost normal for this time of year).

Any fires around Missoula? The four times I have been there to fish there have been fires.

IIRC, San Francisco just outlawed plastic grocery bags.

LoudounLib @ 17

Oklahoma kiddo @ 11

Plea to all Greens: Please support Al Gore for President. ;0)

I’m green, and I’m for Al ;-)

A big smile for you… ;0)!

We ride public transit here, although we joined a car share agency about one year ago for motoring about; use it monthly, perhaps, for countryside jaunts. We walk a lot.

Return and reuse plastic grocery bags — the corner store has started giving a free two-liter soda for each bunch of bags, so that’s a nice incentive. Return and reuse paper handled bags as well.

Always turn off lites — who wants a higher PG&E bill?

Gotta get into those CFL bulbs. I hope they don’t flicker like office fluorescents. But I will try them.

I helped make sure that summer school this year was all in certain parts of the school where I work, and that the AC would be set to 90 in the other areas. Also, this is the first summer that all computers are to be shut down every night. At home, We now unplug the TV/VCR/DVD when not in use and have almost all flourescent bulbs.

CTuttle @ 15

Oklahoma kiddo @ 11

Plea to all Greens: Please support Al Gore for President. ;0)

I would love ta, but, he has ta!!! *g*

;0)

From now on… he is only Big Al to me

greenwarrior @ 30

I air dry most of my clothes most of the year. Drive a Prius. And shop for produce local and organic, mostly directly from the farm. Buy most everything organic. Including some of my clothes. I’d love to get compact flourescents, but the quality of the light creeps me out. I walk to some things.

Can a Prius really do 100mph? I think Gore’s kid can beat the speeding rap, the cops are lying.

I am doing better every year. Recycle what I can. Bike to work in good weather. Live modestly and use CFL (sort of limited in what I can do in terms of household energy use as I rent an apartment).

Suzanne @ 33

IIRC, San Francisco just outlawed plastic grocery bags.

I heard water bottles.. great idea to outlaw both. I always take my own bag to the grocery store.

Lets see shrinking arctic ice caps, nahh not until the penguins are in danger. More wildly unpredictable weather, nahh if 1 in 5 Americas believe the Sun revolves around the earth, its just God’s wrath for something or other. Flooding , or drought unlikely. Putting all this off until its to late well thats about the time most folks get the clue, just look how long it took to figure out how bad invading Iraq took.

Steve @ 39

greenwarrior @ 30

I air dry most of my clothes most of the year. Drive a Prius. And shop for produce local and organic, mostly directly from the farm. Buy most everything organic. Including some of my clothes. I’d love to get compact flourescents, but the quality of the light creeps me out. I walk to some things.

Can a Prius really do 100mph? I think Gore’s kid can beat the speeding rap, the cops are lying.

The company issued a statement that it would go 103MPH – I suppose with a tail wind.

greenwarrior @ 30

I air dry most of my clothes most of the year. Drive a Prius. And shop for produce local and organic, mostly directly from the farm. Buy most everything organic. Including some of my clothes. I’d love to get compact flourescents, but the quality of the light creeps me out. I walk to some things.

Will you consider a vote for Al? ;0)

TeddySanFran @ 35

We ride public transit here, although we joined a car share agency about one year ago for motoring about; use it monthly, perhaps, for countryside jaunts. We walk a lot.

Return and reuse plastic grocery bags — the corner store has started giving a free two-liter soda for each bunch of bags, so that’s a nice incentive. Return and reuse paper handled bags as well.

Always turn off lites — who wants a higher PG&E bill?

Gotta get into those CFL bulbs. I hope they don’t flicker like office fluorescents. But I will try them.

The CFL’s are great, nice color light. The only down side is a slight delay to get up to temp. and full light out-put.

I’ve been using cloth bags for years, and not for the ‘refund’.

I have CFLs – I think there are four incandescents left at my place, and none of them are on more than an hour a day. They’ll get changed as they need replacing.

I walk to the train station four days a week. The other day is ‘cat visitation’ and mail pickup day, so I have to drive (mailbox place closes fifteen minutes after the train gets in in the evening!), but my car is a hybrid.

Suzanne @ 33

IIRC, San Francisco just outlawed plastic grocery bags.

For the big grocery and pharmacy chains only — the mom & pop stores pled hardship to the Board of Supes, so they are exempt. But it’s a start. Most good things do start here! ;)

My CFL bulbs do NOT flicker. I told my BF about some flickering (from what I heard) and he says those were the OLD ones. They have improved, acccording to him.

Hope it’s true.

Steve @ 32

DrDick @ 20

Evening all. It cooled off to an almost balmy 94 today. Still TDH, but much better than yesterday. Tomorrow it is supposed to be in the upper 80s (almost normal for this time of year).

Any fires around Missoula? The four times I have been there to fish there have been fires.

Nothing serious. There have been a couple of minor blazes, but all under control and no serious damage. Could get ugly later in the summer. This is really just the bare beginning of fire season.

Eureka Springs @ 38

From now on… he is only Big Al to me

;0)!

CFL bulbs contain Mercury. So, I am not totally sold on them. Good for now, maybe not later. Read the labels.

Steve @ 39

greenwarrior @ 30

I air dry most of my clothes most of the year. Drive a Prius. And shop for produce local and organic, mostly directly from the farm. Buy most everything organic. Including some of my clothes. I’d love to get compact flourescents, but the quality of the light creeps me out. I walk to some things.

Can a Prius really do 100mph? I think Gore’s kid can beat the speeding rap, the cops are lying.

We had this conversation the night of III’s speeding,etc ticket. I’ve had mine up to 85 a few times. At 85, it feels like I’m doing MUCH less, so I have no reason to doubt it could comfortably do 100.

Before we get to crazy about CFLs, remember these things contain Mercury. In small print on the packages, they say do not dispose in normal trash, but bring to a recycling center. They print an internet site you can use to help find a site. I live in a suburban area, yet the closest recycling center is 60 miles away. I think the energy I save on the bulbs I will waste on the drive to the center.

In theory these things reduce mercury pollution since they contain less than the amount of mercury released in burning the coal to power an equivalent incandescent lamp. Still, mercury is mercury, and the places that sell these bulbs should also accept them back. Stores already do it for NiCad batteries. Even IKEA already does it. So please, put pressure on legislators or wholesalers like COSTCO or SAMs or BJs to take back the old bulbs.

The other problem with CFLs is they do not work with X-10 or other computer controlled switches or light sensors. So they tend to burn during the day, since timers will not operate them. They need to redesign this stuff so it does. That would save even more energy.

Steve –

Re: Al Gore Jr. In addition to that, what stoned person (as they accused him of) ever went 100 mph? haha

The accomplishment of putting this whole thing together is enough to merit the Nobel Peace Prize imho.

By the way, Darfur is the first ecological war. But not the last.

Skipping over things (I’ll go back).

Eli, are you suggesting that the democrats don’t have enough smarts to insist on paper ballots? Or a paper back-up that’s legit? If they don’t, they have no business governing. Cuz we all know that Diebold is a crock. At least I think we do, am I wrong?

OT: For weeks I’ve been wondering about all the op-eds begging and pleading for mercy on poor Scooter (a convicted obstructor of justice) from hard-ass Bushies who’d show no mercy to anyone who’s not well-connected in neocon circles. My general question was: “What do they hope to accomplish that isn’t already in the bag.” There’s no doubt in my mind that Bush will eventually grant a prophylactic (Nixonian) pardon to each of his soldiers; Bush is a man who knows no higher morality than “can I get away with it?”

It has now become obvious that those tearful entreaties were simply a smoke screen for a quid-pro-quo deal that went down in mid-February between the White House and the Libby Defense Team — Thom Hartmann goes into detail here: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/07/05/2299/

The deal was exactly what James Madison warned us about — in short: “When a President pardons henchmen for deeds he put them up to, it’s time to impeach the president.” For details, see Marcy Wheeler’s thread of 7′6/07: http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/07/06…..n-censure/ She quotes James Madison:

[I]f the President be connected, in any suspicious manner, with any person, and there be grounds to believe he will shelter him, the House of Representatives can impeach him; they can remove him if found guilty.

That’s how the founders wanted us to treat presidents who treat their henchmen the way Bush treated Libby. They gave us this constitution; what’s wrong with us?

Suzanne @ 33

IIRC, San Francisco just outlawed plastic grocery bags.

I like the concept behind it, yet, how many more trees are felled to replace the plastic bags??? Just a thought! 8-)

Oklahoma kiddo @ 44

greenwarrior @ 30

I air dry most of my clothes most of the year. Drive a Prius. And shop for produce local and organic, mostly directly from the farm. Buy most everything organic. Including some of my clothes. I’d love to get compact flourescents, but the quality of the light creeps me out. I walk to some things.

Will you consider a vote for Al? ;0)

At this point, I’m an Edwards girl, but if Al comes in, I’ll be busting my ass to get him elected (and sworn in).

Chris Rock said to stop driving big ass cars

argosfalcon @ 42

Lets see shrinking arctic ice caps, nahh not until the penguins are in danger.

I can assure you that all the shrinking arctic ice caps envisioned in the worst case scenario of the most pessimistic environmentalist will not place any penguins in danger.

Now, antarctic icecaps — that’s a different story.

CTuttle @ 58

Suzanne @ 33

IIRC, San Francisco just outlawed plastic grocery bags.

I like the concept behind it, yet, how many more trees are felled to replace the plastic bags??? Just a thought! 8-)

my grocery uses recycled paper bags, which i recycle into garbage bags, dump in the outside bin and then reuse again (if in ok shape). if not, then they go into the recycle container next to the trash bin and the cycle continues.

I make the kids walk everywhere.

Elliott @ 60

Chris Rock said to stop driving big ass cars

707!

Some stores are going to use bags like plastic but of some bio-origin. More.

Paper or plastic? Not anymore in San Francisco.

The city’s Board of Supervisors approved groundbreaking legislation Tuesday to outlaw plastic checkout bags at large supermarkets in about six months and large chain pharmacies in about a year.

The ordinance, sponsored by Supervisor Ross Mirkarimi, is the first such law in any city in the United States and has been drawing global scrutiny this week.

“I am astounded and surprised by the worldwide attention,” Mirkarimi said. “Hopefully, other cities and other states will follow suit.”

Supervisor McDreamy is my supervisor.

Pectopah @ 53

Before we get to crazy about CFLs, remember these things contain Mercury. In small print on the packages, they say do not dispose in normal trash, but bring to a recycling center. They print an internet site you can use to help find a site. I live in a suburban area, yet the closest recycling center is 60 miles away. I think the energy I save on the bulbs I will waste on the drive to the center.

In theory these things reduce mercury pollution since they contain less than the amount of mercury released in burning the coal to power an equivalent incandescent lamp. Still, mercury is mercury, and the places that sell these bulbs should also accept them back. Stores already do it for NiCad batteries. Even IKEA already does it. So please, put pressure on legislators or wholesalers like COSTCO or SAMs or BJs to take back the old bulbs.

The other problem with CFLs is they do not work with X-10 or other computer controlled switches or light sensors. So they tend to burn during the day, since timers will not operate them. They need to redesign this stuff so it does. That would save even more energy.

Well its not just redesign the hardware it the underlying philosophy of planned live spans of months or a few years and no recycling plan aside from ship it to some third world country. Where we dont have to deal with it.

Arctic – polar bears
Antarctic – penguins

Good evening, ladies and germs. . .

greenwarrior @ 59

Oklahoma kiddo @ 44

Will you consider a vote for Al? ;0)

At this point, I’m an Edwards girl, but if Al comes in, I’ll be busting my ass to get him elected (and sworn in).

That’s great. I like John Edwards too. A lot.

Can a Prius really do 100mph? I think Gore’s kid can beat the speeding rap, the cops are lying

.

My husband convinced me to sell our Prius and buy a hybrid Camry because he drove WAAAY to fast in the former. I still miss it, it was a zippy little thing.

Like GreenWarrior and others, I buy organic (including clothes, when I’m not buying thrift). Apropos repetition, one of the things I think bears saying over and over is the organic is just something nice for the consumer. Farmers/farmworkers–not to mention everyone else in the vicinity of agriculture are stuck breathing/drinking/and coping with pesticides–which most definitely are linked to miscarriages and birth defects. Folks overfocus on the “trace” amounts of pesticides that remain on food by the time it hits the grocery stores!

The other problem with CFLs is they do not work with X-10 or other computer controlled switches or light sensors. So they tend to burn during the day, since timers will not operate them. They need to redesign this stuff so it does.

I have a CFL on a timer. It’s a standard timer, not computer, but it works fine. Shouldn’t be a problem using them with any other kind of timer either. IIRC, it’s the standard fluorescents and the old CFLs that had problems. (Still can’t use them with dimmer switches.)

Elliott, that reminds me — one of my coworkers recently bought a Hummer…

Why does she hate the environment?

Hi Pach,
thanks

Mets and Astros not saving energy tonight. Going to the 16th inning.

Hey Pach. I have an idea. Why not recycle your blog posts?

Driving more slowly is something that really makes a difference. The increment between 55 and 60 is only about half as wasteful as the increment between 65 and 70.

Or something.

Hi Pach!

Hey Pach, thanks for this thread :-)

Elliott @ 60

Chris Rock said to stop driving big ass cars

True, I drive a four-banger and am much appreciative for it, particularly with Hawaii’s exorbitant prices for gas!!!

Loo Hoo. @ 56

Skipping over things (I’ll go back).

Eli, are you suggesting that the democrats don’t have enough smarts to insist on paper ballots? Or a paper back-up that’s legit? If they don’t, they have no business governing. Cuz we all know that Diebold is a crock. At least I think we do, am I wrong?

In my opine no, but who’s to say now that the courts are stacked against inquiry, back to square one and paper until the code and machines are fixed.

Shell @ 54

Steve –

Re: Al Gore Jr. In addition to that, what stoned person (as they accused him of) ever went 100 mph? haha

I think the bust was a political hit. Driving 100mph in Ca is not that excessive. If you are going 85, you are an obstruction. A couple of years ago I was driving on US 8 into San Diego, going 100-110 and I was being passed by 25% of the traffic. It’s crazy out there.

LoudounLib @ 72

Elliott, that reminds me — one of my coworkers recently bought a Hummer…

Why does she hate the environment?

Hummers in SF get stickered alla time by DFHs. My favorite is:

ASK ME ABOUT MY SMALL P***S

Looks great on the ass end of one of those stupid machines, especially on city streets.

Suzanne @ 67

Arctic – polar bears
Antarctic – penguins

Sorry wrong pole my bad turning map around, top now oriented north.

LoudounLib @ 72

Elliott, that reminds me — one of my coworkers recently bought a Hummer…

Why does she hate the environment?

It’s a puzzlement. Never did understand the appeal of those vehicles.

bhatten @ 29

O those governors. I don’t recall that W ever mentioned the subject and about the same for his successor (Mr. Good Hair as Molly Ivins noted) Perry. The Stars at Night are big and bright, deep in the Heart of TX: You just can’t see them any more.

Reminds me of the one I love,
Deep in the heart of Texas

So much really good music out of Texas.

Steve @ 80

Shell @ 54

Steve –

Re: Al Gore Jr. In addition to that, what stoned person (as they accused him of) ever went 100 mph? haha

I think the bust was a political hit. Driving 100mph in Ca is not that excessive. If you are going 85, you are an obstruction. A couple of years ago I was driving on US 8 into San Diego, going 100-110 and I was being passed by 25% of the traffic. It’s crazy out there.

I always thought that there was too much traffic out there to drive faster than 30 mph.

TeddySanFran @ 81

LoudounLib @ 72

Elliott, that reminds me — one of my coworkers recently bought a Hummer…

Why does she hate the environment?

Hummers in SF get stickered alla time by DFHs. My favorite is:

ASK ME ABOUT MY SMALL P***S

Looks great on the ass end of one of those stupid machines, especially on city streets.

707!

Elliott @ 83

LoudounLib @ 72

Elliott, that reminds me — one of my coworkers recently bought a Hummer…

Why does she hate the environment?

It’s a puzzlement. Never did understand the appeal of those vehicles.

I think people buy those things to say “look how much EXTRA money I have”.

Oh yeah – my Prius has been up to 75mph. I don’t see a need to speed, so I haven’t tried to find out how fast it will go.

Laura @ 70
The Prius isn’t for people with lead feet: that puts it into low-mileage mode. They really need to tell people that up front. (Drive with a light foot, and it does get the mileage they claim.)

I met recycling as a serious idea back about 1969. My brother had a HS teacher who was, and is, seriously into it. Start early, get the habit established.

I also buy organic a lot (cannot afford to do it all the time) and when possible I buy local (much easier in this area and most of that is organic). Has the added bonus that it tastes better and is fresher and lasts longer.

TeddySanFran @ 81

LoudounLib @ 72

Elliott, that reminds me — one of my coworkers recently bought a Hummer…

Why does she hate the environment?

Hummers in SF get stickered alla time by DFHs. My favorite is:

ASK ME ABOUT MY SMALL P***S

Looks great on the ass end of one of those stupid machines, especially on city streets.

Did you know, if your SUV weighs over 6,000lbs, you can qualify for a $25,000 federal tax credit?

TeddySanFran @ 76

Driving more slowly is something that really makes a difference. The increment between 55 and 60 is only about half as wasteful as the increment between 65 and 70.!

This will date me, but dropping the speed limit to 55mph in the seventies saved beaucoup oil. When we have a congress that works, maybe….

Ahh the glow of mercury vapor lighting how romantic.

Steve –

Tell ME! When I lived in LA, I got a ticket for going TOO SLOW — and I was going 5 miles OVER the speed limit. Sounds wacky, but those who live in the LA area will not be surprised. It was on one of those mountain roads. (Topanga Canyon?)

Twain @ 86

Elliott @ 83

It’s a puzzlement. Never did understand the appeal of those vehicles.

I think people buy those things to say “look how much EXTRA money I have”.

But how do those people have extra money?

Steve @ 80

Shell @ 54

Steve –

Re: Al Gore Jr. In addition to that, what stoned person (as they accused him of) ever went 100 mph? haha

I think the bust was a political hit. Driving 100mph in Ca is not that excessive. If you are going 85, you are an obstruction. A couple of years ago I was driving on US 8 into San Diego, going 100-110 and I was being passed by 25% of the traffic. It’s crazy out there.

Just don’t go 100 anywhere near Pismo Beach. woowoo flashing blue lights….

Elliott @ 60

Chris Rock said to stop driving big ass cars

In the last 4 years I reduced my gasoline consumption 90%. Now 5 to 10 gallons a month including my lawn mower. (had to let half my yard go back to the wild ways and retire the riding lawn mower. (now deer live there all summer long)

burnspbesq @ 74

Mets and Astros not saving energy tonight. Going to the 16th inning.

Yanks managed to lose in extra innings already.

Twain @ 86

Elliott @ 83

It’s a puzzlement. Never did understand the appeal of those vehicles.

I think people buy those things to say “look how much EXTRA money I have”.

well, with the tax rebate, you can actually get them for mostly free if you have any kind of small business. the government has created an incentive to buy hummers. most bigger than the rebate on hybrids.

TeddySanFran @ 76

Driving more slowly is something that really makes a difference. The increment between 55 and 60 is only about half as wasteful as the increment between 65 and 70.

Or something.

Hi Pach!

TSF, did you see Mr. Roadshow’s Drive the Speedlimit Day in the Merc News? Last Friday in June. He’s been cheerleading this all June with charts showing gas savings vs time saved (gas wins hands down). Lots of positive comments from folks who found driving in the right lane during commute a pleasurable experience compared to the fast moving lanes.

Suzanne @ 62

CTuttle @ 58

I like the concept behind it, yet, how many more trees are felled to replace the plastic bags??? Just a thought! 8-)

my grocery uses recycled paper bags, which i recycle into garbage bags, dump in the outside bin and then reuse again (if in ok shape). if not, then they go into the recycle container next to the trash bin and the cycle continues.

I understand, yet, I’m skeptical still! The UK produced an awesome skit for Live Earth, whereby, they reuse the plastic bags! A very cheeky skit, I might add! If I can find a link to it, I’ll link it!!!

For you Lahoma. See you tomorrow night.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDfVY_-yTv0

Valley Girl @ 16

Anyone have a good online link for the concert? Live, I mean?

Hi, VG. I’ve been listening all day here.

Steve @ 90

Did you know, if your SUV weighs over 6,000lbs, you can qualify for a $25,000 federal tax credit?

I wonder how that could possibly have happened?

I always thought that there was too much traffic out there to drive faster than 30 mph.

There is way too much traffic and it is bumper to bumper..going 85-100mph on the freeways.

TexB @ 85

Steve @ 80

I think the bust was a political hit. Driving 100mph in Ca is not that excessive. If you are going 85, you are an obstruction. A couple of years ago I was driving on US 8 into San Diego, going 100-110 and I was being passed by 25% of the traffic. It’s crazy out there.

I always thought that there was too much traffic out there to drive faster than 30 mph.

You haven’t lived until you have been bumper to bumper at 80. Used to do that on some of the freeways in Chicago. Do not miss that at all.

TeddySanFran @ 76

Driving more slowly is something that really makes a difference. The increment between 55 and 60 is only about half as wasteful as the increment between 65 and 70.

Depends on the gear box, I would think. Manufacturers can control this. Also, nowadays automatics have many more gears. I think.

TeddySanFran @ 35

We ride public transit here, although we joined a car share agency about one year ago for motoring about; use it monthly, perhaps, for countryside jaunts. We walk a lot.

Return and reuse plastic grocery bags — the corner store has started giving a free two-liter soda for each bunch of bags, so that’s a nice incentive. Return and reuse paper handled bags as well.

Always turn off lites — who wants a higher PG&E bill?

Gotta get into those CFL bulbs. I hope they don’t flicker like office fluorescents. But I will try them.

They’re good Teddy, just different. They take a minute to come up to full capacity.

They’re a little harsher somehow, not as “peaceful”, so if romance is the goal, stick with the candle.

These bulbs last forever.

Twain @86, yes!! I think that is exactly why she overextended herself bought it…

P J Evans @ 88

Laura @ 70
The Prius isn’t for people with lead feet: that puts it into low-mileage mode. They really need to tell people that up front. (Drive with a light foot, and it does get the mileage they claim.)

VERY true. The old mental egg between your foot and the pedal really helps. (I also enjoy the Camry’s little feedback screen, which gives me an “EXCELLENT!” when I break 40 mpg. (My hubby and I compete for the best mileage.) But, that said, the Prius can zip if you’re not paying attention…..

Big Mitch @ 55

The accomplishment of putting this whole thing together is enough to merit the Nobel Peace Prize imho.

By the way, Darfur is the first ecological war. But not the last.

It is, but it’s not the first. The fact is, almost all nation state conflict is about controlling scarce resources (that means basically anything that is not sunlight).

Hummer tax loophole

Some people buying very large SUVs have been getting more than just a gas-guzzling, eye-turning luxury symbol: They’ve been getting a federal tax break.

The so-called “Hummer tax loophole” was created in 1984, when Congress tried to crack down on how much money could be written off for luxury vehicles used for businesses. The law excluded vehicles with a weight of more than 6,000 pounds, in an effort to keep expensive, heavy-duty equipment affordable for businesses that depend on them.

But many SUVs top out at well over the weight limit. That has allowed small-business owners and the self-employed to claim tax deductions of upwards of $25,000 for large luxury vehicles that may not have been a necessity for their businesses.

I read elsewhere that some dealers help customers set up the Subchapter S corporations, or whatever, right there as they do their loan paperwork.

Eureka Springs @ 96

Elliott @ 60

Chris Rock said to stop driving big ass cars

In the last 4 years I reduced my gasoline consumption 90%. Now 5 to 10 gallons a month including my lawn mower. (had to let half my yard go back to the wild ways and retire the riding lawn mower. (now deer live there all summer long)

Wow! That sounds like a major improvement for your eyes and soul as well.

Hi everyone. I haven’t read all the comments but is anyone else feeling overwhelmed with the emotional power of these concerts?

I don’t really have words for it.

Elliott @ 103

Steve @ 90

Did you know, if your SUV weighs over 6,000lbs, you can qualify for a $25,000 federal tax credit?

I wonder how that could possibly have happened?

It was originally meant to be a small business tax credit but it is easy for the individual, with the help of the car dealer to game the system. A Commie, Pinko Democrat is trying to close the loop hole but he is being beaten up by the auto lobby and Repubs.

DrDick @ 105

TexB @ 85

I always thought that there was too much traffic out there to drive faster than 30 mph.

I used to do it fine — lived in LA. Now, when I go back, I have to hide my eyes. (No kidding.) And actually DRIVING in it? No way!

You haven’t lived until you have been bumper to bumper at 80. Used to do that on some of the freeways in Chicago. Do not miss that at all.

Elliott @ 103

Steve @ 90

Did you know, if your SUV weighs over 6,000lbs, you can qualify for a $25,000 federal tax credit?

I wonder how that could possibly have happened?

When President Fuc&-up was running against Al Gore they had a debate. I will never forget it. He ridiculed Gore for wanting to give a tax-rebate to people who buy hybrids. Bush said, “I want to give a reduction to everyone who pays taxes. How many people here drive hybrids? (This was in 2000) How many pay taxes?”

LoudounLib @ 72

Elliott, that reminds me — one of my coworkers recently bought a Hummer…

Why does she hate the environment?

I think Humvie owners fear the apocalypse…

Steve, bet you were on the desert side of San Diego, too. You can’t do that on I-5 or I-15 most of the time.

I don’t know why people think it’s okay to drive like NASCAR racers on the freeways. All it takes is a dead unlit vehicle and you’re a 15-second item on a traffic report.

Did you notice the time of Gore jr’s arrest? Early, early morning. Not much traffic (relatively speaking), probably going someplace after a party, and at that hour someone who’s high on anything has no clue how fast they’re going.

Eureka Springs @ 96

Elliott @ 60

Chris Rock said to stop driving big ass cars

In the last 4 years I reduced my gasoline consumption 90%. Now 5 to 10 gallons a month including my lawn mower. (had to let half my yard go back to the wild ways and retire the riding lawn mower. (now deer live there all summer long)

that’s very good, and good on you for letting nature rule! I’m about the same on gas usage and also would love to free the lawn from the tyranny of mowing.

deer and bunnies and butterflies and buntings. How bout raccoons and skunks? foxes? bear?

Suzanne, I had not heard of that, but here’s Roadshow’s report:

I declare Roadshow’s first “Drive The Speed Limit Day” a success.

A resounding hit? Ah, no.

Some disappointments? Alas, yes.

But my 11-day nag to slow down drivers to the 65 mph speed limit clicked with plenty of people Friday. Many of you reported less-stressful commutes, a boost in gas mileage and feeling hopeful that more motorists will get a clue and ease off the accelerator. The most important thing? We got people seriously talking about ways to change their driving habits.

“I was pleasantly surprised,” said Roberta Howe of San Jose, a music teacher who ferried me around South Bay freeways for a couple of hours Friday morning to see whether drivers were sticking to 65 or under.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 101

For you Lahoma. See you tomorrow night.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDfVY_-yTv0

Your notes for Lahoma are so sweet OKK.

do-si-do @ 117

LoudounLib @ 72

Elliott, that reminds me — one of my coworkers recently bought a Hummer…

Why does she hate the environment?

I think Humvie owners fear the apocalypse…

I think Hummer owners are causing the apocalypse.

Are there any Wordpress guru’s out there who can help me get my DraftGore.TV site going?

Wealthy people who want to help me hire professionals are also welcome to apply… :)

Comments really rolling tonight. Good tips and notes coming through.

Elliott @ 103

Steve @ 90

Did you know, if your SUV weighs over 6,000lbs, you can qualify for a $25,000 federal tax credit?

I wonder how that could possibly have happened?

Can you spell B-I-G O-I-L?

In the 70’s, in LA if you weren’t doing 65 at the top of the onramp you got run over, nothing quite like it.

Here in Virginia as of July 1 there are new laws on the books about speeding and reckless driving — can’t remember all the particulars, but I do know there are humongous fines for reckless (20 mph over the speed limit), so pricey that they allow you to pay in installments…

TeddySanFran @ 111

Hummer tax loophole

Some people buying very large SUVs have been getting more than just a gas-guzzling, eye-turning luxury symbol: They’ve been getting a federal tax break.

The so-called “Hummer tax loophole” was created in 1984, when Congress tried to crack down on how much money could be written off for luxury vehicles used for businesses. The law excluded vehicles with a weight of more than 6,000 pounds, in an effort to keep expensive, heavy-duty equipment affordable for businesses that depend on them.

But many SUVs top out at well over the weight limit. That has allowed small-business owners and the self-employed to claim tax deductions of upwards of $25,000 for large luxury vehicles that may not have been a necessity for their businesses.

I read elsewhere that some dealers help customers set up the Subchapter S corporations, or whatever, right there as they do their loan paperwork.

thanks for the good details, Teddy. this one’s always irked me.

TexB @ 85

Steve @ 80

I think the bust was a political hit. Driving 100mph in Ca is not that excessive. If you are going 85, you are an obstruction. A couple of years ago I was driving on US 8 into San Diego, going 100-110 and I was being passed by 25% of the traffic. It’s crazy out there.

I always thought that there was too much traffic out there to drive faster than 30 mph.

Hey TexB,

California a big assed state just like Texas! We’re bumper to bumper at 70mph at least..

P J Evans @ 118

Steve, bet you were on the desert side of San Diego, too. You can’t do that on I-5 or I-15 most of the time.

I don’t know why people think it’s okay to drive like NASCAR racers on the freeways. All it takes is a dead unlit vehicle and you’re a 15-second item on a traffic report.

Did you notice the time of Gore jr’s arrest? Early, early morning. Not much traffic (relatively speaking), probably going someplace after a party, and at that hour someone who’s high on anything has no clue how fast they’re going.

Correct..It was a long upgrade in a cut through the mountains..I think the locals knew there were no speed traps. It was a real eye opener for me.

VG, also you should use IE with the link I posted so that you can switch from location to location.

DrDick @ 122

I think Hummer owners are causing the apocalypse.

Right on!

greenwarrior @ 125

Elliott @ 103

I wonder how that could possibly have happened?

Can you spell B-I-G O-I-L?

Actually it was a rebate meant for vehicles like delivery trucks, but the big SUV’s just slipped right in.

boxer @ 110

Big Mitch @ 55

The accomplishment of putting this whole thing together is enough to merit the Nobel Peace Prize imho.

By the way, Darfur is the first ecological war. But not the last.

It is, but it’s not the first. The fact is, almost all nation state conflict is about controlling scarce resources (that means basically anything that is not sunlight).

I agree with your point that Darfur is not the first war over resources. But Darfur is different. For years one group of people, herders, lived peacefully with farmers. But draught, brought about by global warming, has changed the equation. Sorry, I don’t have the facts at my fingertips, but this is what I recall from reading an article about it in the ATlantic Monthly.

Can someone help?

DrDick @ 122

do-si-do @ 117

I think Humvie owners fear the apocalypse…

I think Hummer owners are causing the apocalypse.

touche! can’t they do both? ;)

argosfalcon @ 42

Lets see shrinking arctic ice caps, nahh not until the penguins are in danger. More wildly unpredictable weather, nahh if 1 in 5 Americas believe the Sun revolves around the earth, its just God’s wrath for something or other. Flooding , or drought unlikely. Putting all this off until its to late well thats about the time most folks get the clue, just look how long it took to figure out how bad invading Iraq took.

You’re getting way ahead of the game here. The Catholic Church just recently (1986?) agreed that Galileo was right.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galileo_Galilei

So the four Horsemen are going to drive hummers now?

greenwarrior @ 121

Oklahoma kiddo @ 101

For you Lahoma. See you tomorrow night.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDfVY_-yTv0

Your notes for Lahoma are so sweet OKK.

They so are. (And I hope you don’t mind that I changed the way one was written out to underscore its poetry….)

argosfalcon @ 137

So the four Horsemen are going to drive hummers now?

The Governator’s converted his four Hummers to bio-diesel, though….

I am so not a fan of big ass cars..SUVs etc. But what is it about Hummers? They are totally ugly. Why would you want one to even go near?

CTuttle @ 58

Suzanne @ 33

IIRC, San Francisco just outlawed plastic grocery bags.

I like the concept behind it, yet, how many more trees are felled to replace the plastic bags??? Just a thought! 8-)

Read this and think again. Trees grow back.

greenwarrior @ 125

Elliott @ 103

I wonder how that could possibly have happened?

Can you spell B-I-G O-I-L?

Yes
C.H.E.N.E.Y

Elliott ;-)

I heard a commercial for Big Cars…
Girl voice says I know it’s a little Bigger than what I need, but I feel So Much Safer.
blah blah.
It answered my question about why they are driving those things….
But, I still think it’s about the ego.

P J Evans @ 46

I’ve been using cloth bags for years, and not for the ‘refund’.

I have CFLs – I think there are four incandescents left at my place, and none of them are on more than an hour a day. They’ll get changed as they need replacing.

I walk to the train station four days a week. The other day is ‘cat visitation’ and mail pickup day, so I have to drive (mailbox place closes fifteen minutes after the train gets in in the evening!), but my car is a hybrid.

My hero!

LL what’s your upcoming work schedule?
home tomorrow?

Loo Hoo. @ 136

argosfalcon @ 42

Lets see shrinking arctic ice caps, nahh not until the penguins are in danger. More wildly unpredictable weather, nahh if 1 in 5 Americas believe the Sun revolves around the earth, its just God’s wrath for something or other. Flooding , or drought unlikely. Putting all this off until its to late well thats about the time most folks get the clue, just look how long it took to figure out how bad invading Iraq took.

You’re getting way ahead of the game here. The Catholic Church just recently (1986?) agreed that Galileo was right.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galileo_Galilei

I don’t have the poll at hand but its was one of those ask three thousand people things, I laugh and cry, and it makes me glad I don’t teach. I have a friend who teaches science, and the dance he has to do around certain subject, qualifies he for a solo part in lord of the dance.

Elliott, yes, one more day off — and I am so enjoying myself on this 3 day weekend :-)

trying to do my part. plan my shopping for one day a week and buy a tank of gas about every 4 to 6 weeks. my grocery uses both paper and plastic and will reuse the paper bags if you take them back. My cat is also recycled.

LoudounLib @ 148

Elliott, yes, one more day off — and I am so enjoying myself on this 3 day weekend :-)

Woo Hoo!
what’ll you have?
a nice German pilsner, perhaps wine?

DrDick @ 122

do-si-do @ 117

I think Humvie owners fear the apocalypse…

I think Hummer owners are causing the apocalypse.

The four hummen of the apocalypse.

deer and bunnies and butterflies and buntings. How bout raccoons and skunks? foxes? bear?

Raccoons are suffering from a rash of some unique (to them) form of distemper or something like that.. I have noticed a huge drop in the skunk population the last few years… But we have them all including an increasing population of elk, reintroduced some years ago.. they are getting closer to my part of the river each year.

Allowing a chunk of my yard to go back with the woods was one of the smartest and most beautiful landscaping moves I have ever made.. cannot recommend it enough.

greenwarrior @ 125

Elliott @ 103

I wonder how that could possibly have happened?

Can you spell B-I-G O-I-L?

No shit. I grew up in the DC area when they still had street cars. I have forgotten the year, but the transit company had just spent a huge amount of money upgrading the street car lines. The next year, the company was sold to a guy named Wolfson(sp) who began to tear up the tracks and sell the right of way and assets. Even as a kid I thought this made no sense.

Many year later, I read that documentation had become available that show that GM, Standard Oil and Goodyear had set up dummy corps. to buy street car co’s and shut them down. Mr Wolfson was one of the front men and had done the same thing in several cities. More buses, more oil, more tires..the perfect scam.

Elliott @ 150

LoudounLib @ 148

Elliott, yes, one more day off — and I am so enjoying myself on this 3 day weekend :-)

Woo Hoo!
what’ll you have?
a nice German pilsner, perhaps wine?

Got any Guinness? ;-)

Big Mitch @ 134

boxer @ 110

It is, but it’s not the first. The fact is, almost all nation state conflict is about controlling scarce resources (that means basically anything that is not sunlight).

I agree with your point that Darfur is not the first war over resources. But Darfur is different. For years one group of people, herders, lived peacefully with farmers. But draught, brought about by global warming, has changed the equation. Sorry, I don’t have the facts at my fingertips, but this is what I recall from reading an article about it in the ATlantic Monthly.

Can someone help?

I think we’re on the same page. My point is that we fight to control these resources, so they can then be exploited and depleted. If we depend on anything that is non-renewable this will continue to be the case. I’m not trying to minimize the impact of global warming on the people of Darfur. I just think it’s not what’s killing them directly, the worldwide race to control the last remaining hydrocarbons is.

greenwarrior @ 151

DrDick @ 122

I think Hummer owners are causing the apocalypse.

The four hummen of the apocalypse.

LOL

ES, yeap – living in the woods with no lawn and just a few ornamentals that can be hand watered taught me the same lesson.

Steve @153, I’m dating myself but I remember the tail-end of the DC streetcar era…

LoudounLib @ 155

Elliott @ 150

Woo Hoo!
what’ll you have?
a nice German pilsner, perhaps wine?

Got any Guinness? ;-)

for you? of course! ice cold and coming at ya.

Elliott @ 142

greenwarrior @ 125

Can you spell B-I-G O-I-L?

Yes
C.H.E.N.E.Y

L.O.L.

Steve @ 153

greenwarrior @ 125

Can you spell B-I-G O-I-L?

No shit. I grew up in the DC area when they still had street cars. I have forgotten the year, but the transit company had just spent a huge amount of money upgrading the street car lines. The next year, the company was sold to a guy named Wolfson(sp) who began to tear up the tracks and sell the right of way and assets. Even as a kid I thought this made no sense.

Many year later, I read that documentation had become available that show that GM, Standard Oil and Goodyear had set up dummy corps. to buy street car co’s and shut them down. Mr Wolfson was one of the front men and had done the same thing in several cities. More buses, more oil, more tires..the perfect scam.

Yes, there were two movies about this. One is either a portion of the excellent movie, “Who killed the electric car?” or else it was promoted on the DVD.

The other was “Who killed Roger Rabbit?”

Thanks Elliott!

as I sip the Guinness, I’ll close my eyes and think of England ;-)

As the world becomes more green and our communities shink back to psychologically and physically healthy sizes we will all be happier. We might grow our own food in neighborhood gardens. Maybe all that real estate taken up by roads can be shifted either back to nature or used to feed us. Imagine actually knowing your neighbors. The more we are self reliant the less power the corporate structure will have over us. I truly believe that when we start placing our feet back on the ground to get where we are going we will see the world as a place to protect. We will begin to be our own heroes.

Al Gore just introduced Bon Jovi.

LoudounLib @ 163

Thanks Elliott!

as I sip the Guinness, I’ll close my eyes and think of England ;-)

most people enjoy a Guinness… i’m just saying :)

Mary McCurnin @ 164

As the world becomes more green and our communities shink back to psychologically and physically healthy sizes we will all be happier. We might grow our own food in neighborhood gardens. Maybe all that real estate taken up by roads can be shifted either back to nature or used to feed us. Imagine actually knowing your neighbors. The more we are self reliant the less power the corporate structure will have over us. I truly believe that when we start placing our feet back on the ground to get where we are going we will see the world as a place to protect. We will begin to be our own heroes.

Nice, Mary! :-)

Thanks for a lovely evening. Goodnight

lol Suz! ;-)

g’night bhatten

Steve @ 153

greenwarrior @ 125

Can you spell B-I-G O-I-L?

No shit. I grew up in the DC area when they still had street cars. I have forgotten the year, but the transit company had just spent a huge amount of money upgrading the street car lines. The next year, the company was sold to a guy named Wolfson(sp) who began to tear up the tracks and sell the right of way and assets. Even as a kid I thought this made no sense.

Many year later, I read that documentation had become available that show that GM, Standard Oil and Goodyear had set up dummy corps. to buy street car co’s and shut them down. Mr Wolfson was one of the front men and had done the same thing in several cities. More buses, more oil, more tires..the perfect scam.

This is actually the backdrop to “Who Killed Roger Rabbit?” — the takeover of the Big Red Cars in LA by GM and Big Oil.

Earthlings currently extract ten terrawatts of power (averaged over time) from fossil fuels. That’s the equivalent of 10,000 Gigawatt nuclear generators, which cost roughly a billion apiece.

I mention nuclear because it doesn’t generate greenhouse gasses.

But traditional nuclear power has four main drawbacks:
1) the problem of disposing of highly toxic nuclear wastes.
2) the potential for nuclear proliferation.
3) the danger of a sudden environmental calamity.
4) the limited supply of nuclear fuels.

“I want to say one word to you. Just one word. … Are you listening? … ‘Thorium’.”

http://thoriumenergy.blogspot.com/

http://www.cosmosmagazine.com/node/1341

There’s lots more information available if you google around.

I just have to think that as the environment changes diseases find new habitats and begin a rapid adaptive change. Coupled with modern transportation of goods and people, the spread can be rapid. And with clean water becoming a greater problem, well you get the picture.

Elliott @ 119

deer and bunnies and butterflies and buntings. How bout raccoons and skunks? foxes? bear?

Hey, I was hit by a bear last year. No, I didn’t hit the bear, the bear hit me! Left a dent in the right rear fender. She was fine, though.

Here is a tip for green living: go vegan. It takes many more petroleum resources to grow crops for livestock. I know that’s not a popular suggestion but it’s something I am doing to help the planet and its inhabitants.

P.S. Congratulations Pachacutec, Machu Picchu made it to the new list of seven man made wonders of the world. ;-)

LoudounLib @ 167

Mary McCurnin @ 164

As the world becomes more green and our communities shink back to psychologically and physically healthy sizes we will all be happier. We might grow our own food in neighborhood gardens. Maybe all that real estate taken up by roads can be shifted either back to nature or used to feed us. Imagine actually knowing your neighbors. The more we are self reliant the less power the corporate structure will have over us. I truly believe that when we start placing our feet back on the ground to get where we are going we will see the world as a place to protect. We will begin to be our own heroes.

Nice, Mary! :-)

My heart’s with you, but I can’t see it realistically happening.

Thorium didn’t play a part in Dr Strangelove?

Steve @ 153

greenwarrior @ 125

Can you spell B-I-G O-I-L?

No shit. I grew up in the DC area when they still had street cars. I have forgotten the year, but the transit company had just spent a huge amount of money upgrading the street car lines. The next year, the company was sold to a guy named Wolfson(sp) who began to tear up the tracks and sell the right of way and assets. Even as a kid I thought this made no sense.

Many year later, I read that documentation had become available that show that GM, Standard Oil and Goodyear had set up dummy corps. to buy street car co’s and shut them down. Mr Wolfson was one of the front men and had done the same thing in several cities. More buses, more oil, more tires..the perfect scam.

It seems I learned about this a while back in a movie done by Michael Moore. Could it have been Roger & Me?

GordonM @ 174

Elliott @ 119

deer and bunnies and butterflies and buntings. How bout raccoons and skunks? foxes? bear?

Hey, I was hit by a bear last year. No, I didn’t hit the bear, the bear hit me! Left a dent in the right rear fender. She was fine, though.

Currently there’s a young bear running around Montgomery County, MD. Authorities think it wandered out of VA and crossed the Potomac after its mother kicked it out of the den.

Twain @ 86

Elliott @ 83

It’s a puzzlement. Never did understand the appeal of those vehicles.

I think people buy those things to say “look how much EXTRA money I have”.

When in reality, keep in mind, these people are one car payment away from bankruptcy. These poor people (not all) have been sold a lifetime bill. The banks win.

dharmarific @ 175

Here is a tip for green living: go vegan. It takes many more petroleum resources to grow crops for livestock. I know that’s not a popular suggestion but it’s something I am doing to help the planet and its inhabitants.

Diet for a Small Planet.

Eureka- those raccoons with distemper- rabies maybe? It is spreading.

argosfalcon @ 177

Thorium didn’t play a part in Dr Strangelove?

Exactly! It’s non-fissionable and doesn’t work well for making nuclear weapons. That’s why current reactor technology is based on Uranium and Plutonium.

bhatten @ 140

I am so not a fan of big ass cars..SUVs etc. But what is it about Hummers? They are totally ugly. Why would you want one to even go near?

Because they’re armored? If you’re in the neocon set, personal security is paramount.

Wait, how low is the Potomac now? What would motivate a bear to swim across the river? Did he take the General Jubal Early ferry?

dharmarific @ 175

Here is a tip for green living: go vegan. It takes many more petroleum resources to grow crops for livestock. I know that’s not a popular suggestion but it’s something I am doing to help the planet and its inhabitants.

P.S. Congratulations Pachacutec, Machu Picchu made it to the new list of seven man made wonders of the world. ;-)

what if its organically grass fed?

They killed a bear in a residential part of Anchorage yesterday.

Sorry for making light of substances who’s half life and toxicity is so great.

LoudounLib @ 158

Steve @153, I’m dating myself but I remember the tail-end of the DC streetcar era…

I am also dating myself, but the first time I remember riding on the street car was going to the Mall to watch the July 4 fireworks. Those were good years, except for the Korean War, duck and cover drills in school and they changed the Pledge to the Flag..That really pissed me off at the time.

GordonM @ 141

CTuttle @ 58

I like the concept behind it, yet, how many more trees are felled to replace the plastic bags??? Just a thought! 8-)

Read this and think again. Trees grow back.

Duly noted! The doldrums in the N. Pacific is caused by the ‘Hawaiian High’ that keeps the Isles at a consistent 70-90 degrees F, it compares to the Saragasso Sea! That turtle was an excellent representation of our excesses! We certainly need to clean up our oceans! In the South Pacific, I’ve heard of a miles-wide isle of refuse!

LoudounLib @ 179

GordonM @ 174

Hey, I was hit by a bear last year. No, I didn’t hit the bear, the bear hit me! Left a dent in the right rear fender. She was fine, though.

Currently there’s a young bear running around Montgomery County, MD. Authorities think it wandered out of VA and crossed the Potomac after its mother kicked it out of the den.

We get bears wandering into town all the time. There are a couple of neighborhoods on the edge of town where it is a real problem. Last year and year before animal control had to dart young bears just a few blocks from my place, which is in the middle of town. Even get the occasional cougar strolling through some of the neighborhoods on the edge of town. Deer seem to wander at will through town and are everywhere in the fall.

Valley Girl @ 182

Eureka- those raccoons with distemper- rabies maybe? It is spreading.

That may be what happened to the skunk population. They are a major reservoir for rabies and I know they go through a regular population boom-bust cycle.

TeddySanFran @ 184

Wait, how low is the Potomac now? What would motivate a bear to swim across the river? Did he take the General Jubal Early ferry?

lol Teddy! And do you know, that ferry is still going strong…

Mary McCurnin @ 164

As the world becomes more green and our communities shink back to psychologically and physically healthy sizes we will all be happier. We might grow our own food in neighborhood gardens. Maybe all that real estate taken up by roads can be shifted either back to nature or used to feed us. Imagine actually knowing your neighbors. The more we are self reliant the less power the corporate structure will have over us. I truly believe that when we start placing our feet back on the ground to get where we are going we will see the world as a place to protect. We will begin to be our own heroes.

Some of my happiest times were camping for whole winters at the tip of Baja. Life was VERY simple. Candles for light. A cooler buried in the sand for food. A trip into town every 4-5 days to replace the block of ice, buy more food and fill up the water containers. I “showered” by pouring a gallon of water over my head. Of course, I was right on the beach so I was in the water all day.

So these is a way Libby can do his community service collecting garbage in the worlds oceans.

Steve, yes I know about that absurd tax credit for cars/ SUVs/trucks that weigh ridiculous amounts. Talk about STUPID.

boxer @ 186

dharmarific @ 175

Here is a tip for green living: go vegan. It takes many more petroleum resources to grow crops for livestock. I know that’s not a popular suggestion but it’s something I am doing to help the planet and its inhabitants.

P.S. Congratulations Pachacutec, Machu Picchu made it to the new list of seven man made wonders of the world. ;-)

what if its organically grass fed?

The book, Diet for a Small Planet, makes the case that apart from the petroleum resources issue, there is efficiency in vegetarianism. It takes 3 pounds of vegetable protein to make 1 pound of poultry protein, and 21 lbs. of vegetable protein to make one pound of beef protein. So, if we planted edible crops where we grow grass for cattle we could feed everyone and eliminate world hunger.

TeddySanFran @ 139

argosfalcon @ 137

So the four Horsemen are going to drive hummers now?

The Governator’s converted his four Hummers to bio-diesel, though….

Ya, die Prius iss vahr die girlie-men. Die Humvee vill pump. you. up!

Eureka Springs @ 152

deer and bunnies and butterflies and buntings. How bout raccoons and skunks? foxes? bear?

Raccoons are suffering from a rash of some unique (to them) form of distemper or something like that.. I have noticed a huge drop in the skunk population the last few years… But we have them all including an increasing population of elk, reintroduced some years ago.. they are getting closer to my part of the river each year.

Allowing a chunk of my yard to go back with the woods was one of the smartest and most beautiful landscaping moves I have ever made.. cannot recommend it enough.

Personally, I think you should add to your FB photo album, with riparian views

That’s disturbing about the raccoon distemper. Do you worry about CWD with Elk down there? It’s just hitting up here.

A pair of Horned Owls helped eliminate our nuisance skunk population. Nothing like having to give a crabbed cat a ketchup bath.

I must confesses that the edges of my yard are a bit overgrown on purpose, there’s always a need for a brier patch in the corner.

And my grass is weedy but I don’t care, because just yesterday I saw a honey bee for the first time in fifteen years! She was on the white clover that’s sprinkled about the yard. little bee, big thrill.

LoudounLib @ 163

Thanks Elliott!

as I sip the Guinness, I’ll close my eyes and think of England ;-)

you’re cute

Valley Girl @ 182

Eureka- those raccoons with distemper- rabies maybe? It is spreading.

Not rabies and it is spreading.. It’s awful when hiking or hunting in the deep woods finding a completely disoriented critter like that or signs of many who died to young.

No more bears on Bear Creek. Have spawning salmon, redwoods, a temperate rain forest. Perfect for bears except for one thing – people. Has been many decades since the last bear was seen.

LoudounLib @ 193

TeddySanFran @ 184

Wait, how low is the Potomac now? What would motivate a bear to swim across the river? Did he take the General Jubal Early ferry?

lol Teddy! And do you know, that ferry is still going strong…

The satellite says he’s headed for the Libby mansion…

I am going to the fridge for a beer now. There better be one in there!

GordonM @ 174

Elliott @ 119

deer and bunnies and butterflies and buntings. How bout raccoons and skunks? foxes? bear?

Hey, I was hit by a bear last year. No, I didn’t hit the bear, the bear hit me! Left a dent in the right rear fender. She was fine, though.

scared you!

boxer @ 186

dharmarific @ 175

Here is a tip for green living: go vegan. It takes many more petroleum resources to grow crops for livestock. I know that’s not a popular suggestion but it’s something I am doing to help the planet and its inhabitants.

what if its organically grass fed?

Well that would be better for the environment but I would guess that less than one percent of livestock are fed with organic feed. And that doesn’t help the animals or the workers involved. Just the exchange rate of taking multiple pounds of vegetable protein (don’t know the exact number) to make a pound of meat protein. I didn’t mean to start the vegan wars. :-)

Next year I am going to start keeping bees. Tons of people are doing it in my area. Organic bees are not dying. And the honey is unbelievable.

CTuttle @ 190

Duly noted! The doldrums in the N. Pacific is caused by the ‘Hawaiian High’ that keeps the Isles at a consistent 70-90 degrees F, it compares to the Saragasso Sea! That turtle was an excellent representation of our excesses! We certainly need to clean up our oceans! In the South Pacific, I’ve heard of a miles-wide isle of refuse!

Wow, you mean those kids I saw making peanut butter “sandwiches” where the “bread” was psylocibin mushrooms did all that?? (Big Island, around 78).

Actually, every ocean has a doldrums, and they’re all filling up with plastic trash. And like a lot of the hydrocarbon chemistry products we use, they do all kinds of strange things – like imitate hormonal chemicals and cause completely unpredictable phenomena. Like the plastic used for bottled water is implicated in causing prostrate cancer.

Valley Girl @ 182

Eureka- those raccoons with distemper- rabies maybe? It is spreading.

OT..but Raccoons have become a huge problem in Europe, esp. in Germany. The Germans call them Wachsbaren (wash bears) and they are everywhere. They aren’t in England yet but the Brits are preparing for the invasion of the Nazi Bears. (They were introduced into Germany by Goering

Lets see reduce habitat, more humans into habitat fringes. Compress animal populations so disease spreads quickly in a population. Coupled with the general human population’s view should act more like a Disney movie. Yes that makes it just about right for all species to be extinct or endangered in a few decades.

Big Mitch @ 97

burnspbesq @ 74

Mets and Astros not saving energy tonight. Going to the 16th inning.

Yanks managed to lose in extra innings already.

GO, ANGELS! I quit using my diswasher, and air conditioning decided I could live without them. I only use my washer and dryer when I have full loads to do. Wasting food is a big thing with me. I never buy more than I will eat in three or four days so nothing gets thrown out. I tear paper towels in half, they seem to do the same job then last twice as long. I try to do all my errands all in one day per week to cut down on gas usage. I rarely buy anything new like appliances or electronics until the thing completely falls apart. I’m going to get a drinking water purifier soon though the LA water is disgusting.

dharmarific @ 206

boxer @ 186

what if its organically grass fed?

Well that would be better for the environment but I would guess that less than one percent of livestock are fed with organic feed. And that doesn’t help the animals or the workers involved. Just the exchange rate of taking multiple pounds of vegetable protein (don’t know the exact number) to make a pound of meat protein. I didn’t mean to start the vegan wars. :-)

However, if you are eating range fed beef, the conversion is of plants humans cannot digest. Your point holds for hogs and poultry which largely eat the same kinds of things as humans.

Sometimes I think global warming is about Mother Earth taking a mulligan.

Well, let’s see.
I play acoustic musical instruments rather than electric.
I walk to work at least twice a week.
I recycle newspaper, office paper, glass, aluminum cans, and plastic beverage containers.
I save peanut butter jars, Frappucino jars etc. after cleaning them out and removing the labels (they make great refrigerator jars). In fact, I save lots of throw-away glass and plastic containers to re-use them. I use the recycled frappucino jars to take my leftover coffee to work in the morning.
I re-use plastic bags.
In fact, I am a pack rat and have a hard time throwing anything away. I had a Grandmother who said things like, “Waste not, want not.” I grew up in a family that mended clothes rather than throwing them away and buying new ones. In fact, I have a few mended pairs in my drawer right now (they’re hard to find colors).

I would like to think that these are ecologically wise behaviors, instead of anal retentive personality defects {g}

Bob in HI

should have added animals between like and disney, sorry

Also, re: vegan. Isn’t part of the argument that livestock animals produce an extraordinary amount of methane gas (thus contributing to greenhouse effect)?

My mother has in her kitchen a cabinet that, when you open it, a large quantity of paper bags falls onto your head. Does this qualify in some way?

Valley Girl @ 51

CFL bulbs contain Mercury. So, I am not totally sold on them. Good for now, maybe not later. Read the labels.

This is exactly right! Big Al better get on the people who sell those things (including himself) to make sure there are ecologically acceptable ways to dispose of them. (I have several installed right now).

Bob in HI

Teddy, did you get that beer?

DrDick @ 211

dharmarific @ 206

Well that would be better for the environment but I would guess that less than one percent of livestock are fed with organic feed. And that doesn’t help the animals or the workers involved. Just the exchange rate of taking multiple pounds of vegetable protein (don’t know the exact number) to make a pound of meat protein. I didn’t mean to start the vegan wars. :-)

However, if you are eating range fed beef, the conversion is of plants humans cannot digest. Your point holds for hogs and poultry which largely eat the same kinds of things as humans.

Actually, most all beef sold in this country is fed on subsidized corn at CAFO centers. I highly recommend The Omnivore’s Dilemma by Michael Pollan for more information about that.

Elliott @ 205

GordonM @ 174

Hey, I was hit by a bear last year. No, I didn’t hit the bear, the bear hit me! Left a dent in the right rear fender. She was fine, though.

scared you!

I’m in rural Maine. I was more worried I’d hurt her. If I’d been on a bike, yeah, I would’ve been scared.

I was very worried when a completely disoriented racoon started hanging around my house. Or when I turned a corner on a bike ride and found myself looking up into the distinctly non-empathic eyes of a moose. He decided I wasn’t a threat, though.

Big Mitch @ 197

boxer @ 186

what if its organically grass fed?

The book, Diet for a Small Planet, makes the case that apart from the petroleum resources issue, there is efficiency in vegetarianism. It takes 3 pounds of vegetable protein to make 1 pound of poultry protein, and 21 lbs. of vegetable protein to make one pound of beef protein. So, if we planted edible crops where we grow grass for cattle we could feed everyone and eliminate world hunger.

The math doesn’t work. If I sit down and eat sixteen ounces of free range chicken (a breast and a wing) you have to grow harvest and eat 3 pounds of vegetable protein (also not a complete source of protein). Ever tried to eat 3 pounds of vegetables at one sitting? Additionally, the edible crops that would grow where grass grows are other grasses, therefore inedible by humans unless processed and the energy required to produced a loaf of bread from seed to table, is far greater than what is required to produce a free range chicken.

We should support artists who create art from found materials.

LoudounLib @ 218

Teddy, did you get that beer?

does he need one?

TeddySanFran @ 216

My mother has in her kitchen a cabinet that, when you open it, a large quantity of paper bags falls onto your head. Does this qualify in some way?

Is she recycling your brain cells?

argosfalcon @ 214

should have added animals between like and disney, sorry

I knew exactly what you meant. Whenever I hear that they killed a bear and the people say, “He came right up to the house, coulda eaten our kids” I think Well you built your big house right where he lived didn’t you?

Elliott @ 223

We should support artists who create art from found materials.

Teddy found a bunch of paper bags!

dharmarific @ 219

DrDick @ 211

However, if you are eating range fed beef, the conversion is of plants humans cannot digest. Your point holds for hogs and poultry which largely eat the same kinds of things as humans.

Actually, most all beef sold in this country is fed on subidised corn at CAFO centers. I highly recomend The Omnivore’s Dilemma by Michael Pollan for more information about that.

No question. The point was made in reference to the discussion of organic range fed cattle. That is actually a growth industry (as is organic and specialty farming) here in Montana as more and more farmers are looking for “value added” methods of surviving our insane agricultural economy.

I bring all our used egg cartons to school and the art teacher has kids use them for mixing paint colors.

Steve @ 209

OT..but Raccoons have become a huge problem in Europe, esp. in Germany. The Germans call them Wachsbaren (wash bears) and they are everywhere. They aren’t in England yet but the Brits are preparing for the invasion of the Nazi Bears. (They were introduced into Germany by Goering

They’re called “wash bears” because they have no salivary glands. To eat food, they must have water. They’re just soaking it. Actually, they’re pretty filthy.

Elliott, see Teddy @204 ;-)

Who’s the band on Live Earth right now– the old white guys playing instruments (Lead guy playing bass and singing) with black ladies’ chorus back-up singers ? (Showing my ignorance)

Bob in HI

Laura Doty @ 226

Elliott @ 223

We should support artists who create art from found materials.

Teddy found a bunch of paper bags!

omg — my mom’s a found-materials artist! who knew?

yes, Anchor Steam, very very cold.

Suzanne @ 33

IIRC, San Francisco just outlawed plastic grocery bags.

Still legal down the peninsula, but I finally broke down and bought a Trader Joe’s bag. Have switched to CFLs (except enclosed bulbs and ones on a light-sensitive switch, which don’t work so well); air dry most of my clothes, and when I was working in SF took the train. Do I get credit for the pick-a-size paper towels?

What does a cheese-cloth produce bag do? Must have missed something.

Elloitt, I don’t know what CWB is but the game and fish watch the Elk here closer than a mother watches her little one so I doubt they worry about health care.

I miss the bees

And I know many artists who work with found materials,, you would love my town!

Steve, Ever go to the Coon Supper in Gillette? I hunted for many years on a family friends ten thousand acre parcel just a few miles from the Supper site.

Laura Doty @ 215

Also, re: vegan. Isn’t part of the argument that livestock animals produce an extraordinary amount of methane gas (thus contributing to greenhouse effect)?

Years ago, I read an article in Scientific American about the Cows in India. They did a thermodynamic analysis of the effect of having free ranging cows and not eating them. A situation that seems rather odd to us. The bottom line was that the cows produced much more dietary protein by the milk than if they were eaten and the cows converted grass to a usable fuel..the dried dung.

Do CFLs work on dimmer switches?

GordonM @ 220

Elliott @ 205

scared you!

I’m in rural Maine. I was more worried I’d hurt her. If I’d been on a bike, yeah, I would’ve been scared.

I was very worried when a completely disoriented racoon started hanging around my house. Or when I turned a corner on a bike ride and found myself looking up into the distinctly non-empathic eyes of a moose. He decided I wasn’t a threat, though.

whew!

Nate @ 113

Hi everyone. I haven’t read all the comments but is anyone else feeling overwhelmed with the emotional power of these concerts?

I don’t really have words for it.

Totally. And Gore is also reminding the rest of the world that the United States is good.

How can we thank him?

Bob Schacht @ 214

Well, let’s see.
I play acoustic musical instruments rather than electric.
I walk to work at least twice a week.
I recycle newspaper, office paper, glass, aluminum cans, and plastic beverage containers.
I save peanut butter jars, Frappucino jars etc. after cleaning them out and removing the labels (they make great refrigerator jars). In fact, I save lots of throw-away glass and plastic containers to re-use them. I use the recycled frappucino jars to take my leftover coffee to work in the morning.
I re-use plastic bags.
In fact, I am a pack rat and have a hard time throwing anything away. I had a Grandmother who said things like, “Waste not, want not.” I grew up in a family that mended clothes rather than throwing them away and buying new ones. In fact, I have a few mended pairs in my drawer right now (they’re hard to find colors).

I would like to think that these are ecologically wise behaviors, instead of anal retentive personality defects {g}

Bob in HI

I’m smiling now remembering how my dad, once he broke some piece of clothing in, would NEVER part with it. My mother had to keep mending and mending – pajamas, underwear, flannel shirts, sweaters, everything. He liked the comfort of his familiar clothing.

What does a cheese-cloth produce bag do? Must have missed something

I thought of making produce bags from cheese cloth because they’re light and would work like the clear plastic bags….mentioned that at my local Community Market and the clerk told me she’s seen others bringing them in….great minds eat alike.

I was it a park Service meeting where this was discussed man the locals just hated hearing about these; take fuffy’s food inside and get special trash cans unthinkable. Made me glad I was an archaeologist (people hate us for a whole other set of reasons) and not a ranger.

Bob Schacht @ 232

Who’s the band on Live Earth right now– the old white guys playing instruments (Lead guy playing bass and singing) with black ladies’ chorus back-up singers ? (Showing my ignorance)

Bob in HI

O. M. G!

Pink Floyd amigo. :)

boxer @ 221

Big Mitch @ 197

The book, Diet for a Small Planet, makes the case that apart from the petroleum resources issue, there is efficiency in vegetarianism. It takes 3 pounds of vegetable protein to make 1 pound of poultry protein, and 21 lbs. of vegetable protein to make one pound of beef protein. So, if we planted edible crops where we grow grass for cattle we could feed everyone and eliminate world hunger.

The math doesn’t work. If I sit down and eat sixteen ounces of free range chicken (a breast and a wing) you have to grow harvest and eat 3 pounds of vegetable protein (also not a complete source of protein). Ever tried to eat 3 pounds of vegetables at one sitting? Additionally, the edible crops that would grow where grass grows are other grasses, therefore inedible by humans unless processed and the energy required to produced a loaf of bread from seed to table, is far greater than what is required to produce a free range chicken.

More to the point, in most areas where cattle are grazed on grass (as on much of the Great Plains), this is actually the most efficient human use of the area. Edible crops require more water than is naturally available and must be irrigated, which is extremely expensive (and leaves a big carbon footprint) and environmentally degrading (many of the aquifers are being severely drained by irrigation in Nebraska, Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas).

dharmarific @ 220

DrDick @ 211

However, if you are eating range fed beef, the conversion is of plants humans cannot digest. Your point holds for hogs and poultry which largely eat the same kinds of things as humans.

Actually, most all beef sold in this country is fed on subsidized corn at CAFO centers. I highly recommend The Omnivore’s Dilemma by Michael Pollan for more information about that.

And furthermore, subsidizing corn is an immigration issue. Mexican farmers used to raise maze. I just said that because it rhymes. Actually, they are being put out of business because they can’t raise corn anymore. It is not economic to compete with subsudised American corn. And then there’s high fructose corn syrup that is directly linked with obesity and diabetes…

Don’t get me started.

boxer @ 221

Big Mitch @ 197

The book, Diet for a Small Planet, makes the case that apart from the petroleum resources issue, there is efficiency in vegetarianism. It takes 3 pounds of vegetable protein to make 1 pound of poultry protein, and 21 lbs. of vegetable protein to make one pound of beef protein.

The math doesn’t work. If I sit down and eat sixteen ounces of free range chicken (a breast and a wing) you have to grow harvest and eat 3 pounds of vegetable protein (also not a complete source of protein). Ever tried to eat 3 pounds of vegetables at one sitting?

Why wouldn’t I just eat the one pound of vegetable protein? Protein is protein. A healthly vegan diet has enough protein.

Oh jeez — WaPo gave Byron York the front page of the Outlook section to blather on about how Bush has lost his base, over immigration and no-Libby-pardon. duh.

TeddySanFran @ 237

Do CFLs work on dimmer switches?

Nope,

TeddySanFran @ 217

My mother has in her kitchen a cabinet that, when you open it, a large quantity of paper bags falls onto your head. Does this qualify in some way?

Is this some kind of revenge-of-the-mom or do they also fall on her head when she opens the cabinet?

LoudounLib @ 230

Elliott, see Teddy @204 ;-)

I must have drifted right past it

Loo Hoo. @ 239

Nate @ 113

Hi everyone. I haven’t read all the comments but is anyone else feeling overwhelmed with the emotional power of these concerts?

I don’t really have words for it.

Totally. And Gore is also reminding the rest of the world that the United States is good.

How can we thank him?

So well stated Loo Hoo. Take more than a pledge. Change your life. How do I channel this flood of gratitude for such a service to humanity.

greenwarrior @ 248

TeddySanFran @ 217

My mother has in her kitchen a cabinet that, when you open it, a large quantity of paper bags falls onto your head. Does this qualify in some way?

Is this some kind of revenge-of-the-mom or do they also fall on her head when she opens the cabinet?

A way of saying no cookies before supper?

TeddySanFran @ 246

Oh jeez — WaPo gave Byron York the front page of the Outlook section to blather on about how Bush has lost his base, over immigration and no-Libby-pardon. duh.

Thanks for the heads-up — I’ll skip right over that one tomorrow…

TexB @ 225

TeddySanFran @ 216

My mother has in her kitchen a cabinet that, when you open it, a large quantity of paper bags falls onto your head. Does this qualify in some way?

Is she recycling your brain cells?

LOL

TeddySanFran @ 232

Laura Doty @ 226

Teddy found a bunch of paper bags!

omg — my mom’s a found-materials artist! who knew?

yes, Anchor Steam, very very cold.

for real!? I think that’s really neat, inspires awe in me, that creativity.

Hurray! I Don’t Need No Education.

GordonM @ 229

Steve @ 209

OT..but Raccoons have become a huge problem in Europe, esp. in Germany. The Germans call them Wachsbaren (wash bears) and they are everywhere. They aren’t in England yet but the Brits are preparing for the invasion of the Nazi Bears. (They were introduced into Germany by Goering

They’re called “wash bears” because they have no salivary glands. To eat food, they must have water. They’re just soaking it. Actually, they’re pretty filthy.

Having Raccoons around is no joke and quite unpleasant. I used to have a neighbor that feed them, then they came to my house expecting a free lunch. I am talking about 8-10 adults and a few kids on the deck,every night raising hell and shitting everywhere for spite. This went on for years.

They don’t recycle plastic bags around here (only #2 plastic). But I discovered they are great during the winter for insulating drafty windows. Cut one open (down the sides), twist it about 4x, then push it into the cracks around a window with a putty knife. It has enough “memory” to expand and block the draft. Then in the spring, you just dig out one end and pull it out.

I respect veganism as a choice. However, at the point in time when man lived most in harmony with nature (which was prior to agriculture) he/she ate meat. Therefore I don’t see veganism as an answer to bringing us back into balance.

Eureka Springs @ 234

Elloitt, I don’t know what CWB is but the game and fish watch the Elk here closer than a mother watches her little one so I doubt they worry about health care.

I miss the bees

And I know many artists who work with found materials,, you would love my town!

I all ready do.
and there’s gingerbread!

Nate @ 242

Bob Schacht @ 232

Who’s the band on Live Earth right now– the old white guys playing instruments (Lead guy playing bass and singing) with black ladies’ chorus back-up singers ? (Showing my ignorance)

Bob in HI

O. M. G!

Pink Floyd amigo. :)

Thanks! I would never have guessed. Nice shtick he did with the kids at the end.

Bob in HI

Bob:
:You are SO young.
Pink Floyd.
All in all, you’re just another brick in the wall.
No offense, hon.

TeddySanFran @ 236

Do CFLs work on dimmer switches?

Generally no, but I think you can get a special kind that will work. We just replaced the dimmer switch (didn’t use it anyway).

They also don’t work with those switches that go on at dusk; when we tried one it just went on-off-on-off-on-off, and the bulb burned out.

but…Roger Waters IS an old guy now…

DrDick @ 244

boxer @ 221

The math doesn’t work. If I sit down and eat sixteen ounces of free range chicken (a breast and a wing) you have to grow harvest and eat 3 pounds of vegetable protein (also not a complete source of protein). Ever tried to eat 3 pounds of vegetables at one sitting? Additionally, the edible crops that would grow where grass grows are other grasses, therefore inedible by humans unless processed and the energy required to produced a loaf of bread from seed to table, is far greater than what is required to produce a free range chicken.

More to the point, in most areas where cattle are grazed on grass (as on much of the Great Plains), this is actually the most efficient human use of the area. Edible crops require more water than is naturally available and must be irrigated, which is extremely expensive (and leaves a big carbon footprint) and environmentally degrading (many of the aquifers are being severely drained by irrigation in Nebraska, Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas).

Well, it’s a very old book. At the time, it made sense to me, and I became a vegetarian. I was really healthy and ate really well. I thought I was doing something good for the to combat world hunger. I lived in Southern Calif so getting a variety of vegetables was no prob. Then I moved to Alaska and fell off the vegetarian wagon. I might get back on because, even after my recent loss of 30 lbs, I am still 55lbs over what I weighed back then, 30 years ago.

greenwarrior @ 248

TeddySanFran @ 217

My mother has in her kitchen a cabinet that, when you open it, a large quantity of paper bags falls onto your head. Does this qualify in some way?

Is this some kind of revenge-of-the-mom or do they also fall on her head when she opens the cabinet?

She is a child of the Depression and (somehow) her memories of the Depression enable her to put her hand up to contain the bags as she opens that cabinet. I, being a wasteful and overly-permitted child of the baby-boom, forget. So when I open the cabinet and rage about all the damn bags falling out, she can be quite sweetly self-righteous about “saving things.”

At least it’s not aluminum cans or, worse, glass jars.

boxer @ 259

I respect veganism as a choice. However, at the point in time when man lived most in harmony with nature (which was prior to agriculture) he/she ate meat. Therefore I don’t see veganism as an answer to bringing us back into balance.

That is your choice and I respect that. But giving up one meat meal a week would probably do more good than changing a few CFL light bulbs.
Just a thought.

ES,
I meant CWD (sorry about the misleading typo)
Chronic Wasting Disease, caused by a prion not unlike MadCow and affecting the wild population in the midwest and s Canada, I believe.

Steve @ 257

Having Raccoons around is no joke and quite unpleasant. I used to have a neighbor that feed them, then they came to my house expecting a free lunch. I am talking about 8-10 adults and a few kids on the deck,every night raising hell and shitting everywhere for spite. This went on for years.

I had that problem in CA. Couldn’t chase them off until the dog had pups. One bark from her (as a bitch) and they were gone.

Here in Maine, they’re so fat and happy from what they get in the woods, they’re rarely a problem.

And with that – good night all!

TeddySanFran @ 204

I am going to the fridge for a beer now. There better be one in there!

If not, there’s a teenager about. Frisk ‘em.

Pach and Big Al are upstairs

Elliott @ 268

ES,
I meant CWD (sorry about the misleading typo)
Chronic Wasting Disease, caused by a prion not unlike MadCow and affecting the wild population in the midwest and s Canada, I believe.

It’s a very large problem in the west as well.

Big Mitch @ 245

dharmarific @ 220

Actually, most all beef sold in this country is fed on subsidized corn at CAFO centers. I highly recommend The Omnivore’s Dilemma by Michael Pollan for more information about that.

And furthermore, subsidizing corn is an immigration issue. Mexican farmers used to raise maze. I just said that because it rhymes. Actually, they are being put out of business because they can’t raise corn anymore. It is not economic to compete with subsudised American corn. And then there’s high fructose corn syrup that is directly linked with obesity and diabetes…

Don’t get me started.

Oh, okay. I won’t. But, you’ll prolly go off anyway….
Loo Hoo…
re: How to thank Al… don’t get me started…:)

Got here late, had to pop in and say the NYT has a Sunday editorial that made my day: “The Road Home”

It begins “It is time for the United States to leave Iraq, without any more delay than the Pentagon needs to organize an orderly exit.”

GordonM @ 257

They don’t recycle plastic bags around here (only #2 plastic). But I discovered they are great during the winter for insulating drafty windows. Cut one open (down the sides), twist it about 4x, then push it into the cracks around a window with a putty knife. It has enough “memory” to expand and block the draft. Then in the spring, you just dig out one end and pull it out.

Those bags are not recycled here in HI except by Safeway. So I save’em up and then when I’ve crammed one bag as full of’em as I can, I take it on my next trip to the Safeway. And the stores charge you $.03 for each bag they use bagging your groceries, too.

Oh, and they make good waste basket liners, too. Why buy new ones in the stores?

Bob in HI

greenwarrior @ 239

I’m smiling now remembering how my dad, once he broke some piece of clothing in, would NEVER part with it. My mother had to keep mending and mending – pajamas, underwear, flannel shirts, sweaters, everything. He liked the comfort of his familiar clothing.

My dad complained loudly when his Navy-issue boxer shorts finally fell apart after 30 years. :~)

boxer @ 258

I respect veganism as a choice. However, at the point in time when man lived most in harmony with nature (which was prior to agriculture) he/she ate meat. Therefore I don’t see veganism as an answer to bringing us back into balance.

Outside of the arctic and subartic (boreal forests of the Americas and Eurasia), the bulk (60% ) of human diets have come from plant foods. Early in human evolution, during the australopithecine and Homo habiline era (the time when we were most one with nature), meat was only a very minor part of the diet. Some studies do indicate that the increase in meat consumption by Homo habilis (still small by modern standards) was critical to the development of the larger human brain.

Modern humans, like our nearest relatives the chimps, are natural omnivores. There are some necessary nutrients which it is easier for us to get from animal sources than from plant sources. It is still possible to get an adequate and healthy diet solely from plant sources, though I have no desire to do so.

Mary McCurnin @ 207

Next year I am going to start keeping bees. Tons of people are doing it in my area. Organic bees are not dying. And the honey is unbelievable.

Good for you, Mary. Will you hire someone or do it yourself?

Bob Schacht @ 214

Well, let’s see.
I play acoustic musical instruments rather than electric.
I walk to work at least twice a week.
I recycle newspaper, office paper, glass, aluminum cans, and plastic beverage containers.
I save peanut butter jars, Frappucino jars etc. after cleaning them out and removing the labels (they make great refrigerator jars). In fact, I save lots of throw-away glass and plastic containers to re-use them. I use the recycled frappucino jars to take my leftover coffee to work in the morning.
I re-use plastic bags.
In fact, I am a pack rat and have a hard time throwing anything away. I had a Grandmother who said things like, “Waste not, want not.” I grew up in a family that mended clothes rather than throwing them away and buying new ones. In fact, I have a few mended pairs in my drawer right now (they’re hard to find colors).

I would like to think that these are ecologically wise behaviors, instead of anal retentive personality defects {g}

Bob in HI

They’re the same things my parents did, and I do them too. I think it’s the lessons of the Depression they learned and never forgot.

Al Gore just infused this country with life again.
And hope.
No wonder Inhofe didn’t want him to play in Washington DC.

TeddySanFran @ 266

greenwarrior @ 248

Is this some kind of revenge-of-the-mom or do they also fall on her head when she opens the cabinet?

She is a child of the Depression and (somehow) her memories of the Depression enable her to put her hand up to contain the bags as she opens that cabinet. I, being a wasteful and overly-permitted child of the baby-boom, forget. So when I open the cabinet and rage about all the damn bags falling out, she can be quite sweetly self-righteous about “saving things.”

At least it’s not aluminum cans or, worse, glass jars.

Sweet!

spurious @ 276

greenwarrior @ 239

I’m smiling now remembering how my dad, once he broke some piece of clothing in, would NEVER part with it. My mother had to keep mending and mending – pajamas, underwear, flannel shirts, sweaters, everything. He liked the comfort of his familiar clothing.

My dad complained loudly when his Navy-issue boxer shorts finally fell apart after 30 years. :~)

Yes, exactly!

Loo Hoo. @ 278

Mary McCurnin @ 207

Next year I am going to start keeping bees. Tons of people are doing it in my area. Organic bees are not dying. And the honey is unbelievable.

Good for you, Mary. Will you hire someone or do it yourself?

I’m going to learn to do it myself.

Mary McCurnin @ 283

Loo Hoo. @ 278

Good for you, Mary. Will you hire someone or do it yourself?

I’m going to learn to do it myself.

I’ve always wanted to keep bees, they’re such interesting critters. I’m just not a honey fan, and can’t justify it. Did you read the book about beekeeping by the woman who worked at the Library of Congress? I can’t remember her name–came out 18ish years ago, I think. What a delight. Something I think a poet like you, Mary, would enjoy, if you haven’t already read it.

Mary McCurnin @ 280

Al Gore just infused this country with life again.
And hope.
No wonder Inhofe didn’t want him to play in Washington DC.

Mare-
Do you want to join me and Loo Hoo to say thank you? We could start by holding hands and ask him to dance.
It is Saturday night.

Suzanne @ 33

IIRC, San Francisco just outlawed plastic grocery bags.

((((((((((Mayor Gavin Newsom))))))))))

Mary McCurnin @ 280

Al Gore just infused this country with life again.
And hope.
No wonder Inhofe didn’t want him to play in Washington DC.

D i n g!

argosfalcon @ 188

Sorry for making light of substances who’s half life and toxicity is so great.

Other things being equal, the longer the half-life, the lower the radiation toxicity. Thorium’s half-life is 14 billion years. As it comes from the ground, Thorium needs no processing to serve as reactor fuel, but there are (supposed to be) work rules against eating and/or inhaling it.

From what I’ve read, Thorium reactions produce from 1/1000 to 1/10,000 of the waste produced by traditional Uranium reactions, but the waste products have a relatively short half-life, i.e., are relatively radioactive.

Lea-no uh @ 5

Proud to say I already do most of the things they suggest!

I’ve been buying CFLs for about 15 years. I Love led lights! I want to get that funky led “bulb” I saw on Mythbusters.