Joe Biden says he’s going to that “Daily Kos thing” but he’s got a bone to pick with inaccurate bloggers:
[O]ne of the things that happens is that the public is coming to grips with how to deal with this instant, unfiltered information that may be deliberately mis-edited.
But I think — and this is naive maybe — I have confidence that the American people will put this in perspective. Like when one of the bloggers said, “We’re going to take back the Democratic Party.”
They don’t own the Democratic Party.
I’m going to go out on a limb here and assume Biden is referring to the famous Eli Pariser quote about the Democratic Party, “We bought it, we own it, and we’re taking it back.” As the Executive Director of MoveOn at the time, he was speaking to “professional election losers” who run the Democratic Party, and by “we” he meant “the people.” No blogger in sight.
I’m also going to do Joe the credit of assuming he didn’t “deliberately mis-edit” and just didn’t know, once again, what the hell he was talking about. Presidential timber, that one. Too bad he’s not running as a Republican.
Speaking of MoveOn, as Christy noted this morning the Live Earth concert is happening in DC. I’m going to try to be there, it looks like it’s going to be a really good show and I hope everyone shows up in support.
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First!
JANE!
Second
Teefs ‘n Tufts!
Lou, you beat me to it.
MMMM Biden jam goes good with Lieber-toast if you ask me.
Has his campaign been denied bankruptcy yet?
EPU’d – a must read for later re: Cheney, Rich, Plame….
http://www.consumersforpeace.o…..ction.html
The Mitt Romney of the Democratic party.
Good afternoon Jane, hope you’re doing well. Curious to know if you know my cousin Nancy J.. She also went USC and produces film withDrew.
Joe Meant: Uhmmm?
The question is not “who owns the democratic party?” The question is whose democracy is this? And whether we have a govt OF, BY & FOR the people, or a govt OF, BY & FOR the corporations.
I’m actually much more concerned about the carefully filtered information presented as “news” on television. Most of it appears to be designed to keep people uninformed, unquestioning, and afraid.
Who exactly controls my Party? I haven’t a clue. I’m a Democrat.
Hi Jane.
I hope you’re doing well.
Please pat Kobe & pals for us ;->
I think he was referring to the “bought it” part by that comment. Just saying we’re taking the party back…doesn’t seem to justify a response, but the suggestion that someone donated so much money that they can be influential in that way, does.
Good question mister Biden. Who does OWN the Democratic Party?
I guess Biden is going to do a Bush and try to deny that he is a wholly owned subsidiary of MBNA.
Didn’t he learn his lesson when his racist words from South Carolina were thrown back at him? Or is he just too clueless for words?
What does he mean by that Daily Kos thing? Does he mean Yearly Kos? If so, he’ll never make it through that without wishing he never went to it.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 13
Compared to the opposition party, I think that’s a good thing, eh? ;->
I’m reposting this ’cause I gotta say it:
135
demi says:
July 6th, 2007 at 12:04 pm
Big Mitch @ 27
A lot of the “Clinton did it, too” is bullshit and amounts to swift-boating. Here follows my response to yesterday’s example. Unfortunately, Dana Milbank stole my shtick when he appeared on K.O. Countdown last night.
Today, Tony Snow responded to criticism from the Clintons about the Scooter commutation thus:
“I don’t know what is Arkansan for chutzpah [1] but this is a gigantic case of it.”
We have reached a sad time when goyishe [2] Tony Snow is speaking Yiddish from the White House. Don’t we Jews have enough tsouris?[3]
Apparently, in this latest iteration of the “Bill Clinton did it, too” excuse, the White House is seeking to evoke the recollection of the Mark Rich pardon. Gay gezinteh heit. Chub a gutten yur. [4]
On Bill Clinton’s last day in office, he pardoned a refugee from the Nazis, Mark Rich, M.O.T., [5] a financier and philanthropist who had been falsely accused of tax evasion by Rudy Giuliani.
blah….
You have a good heart, but, as Quincy Jones said to Everyone who came to record We Are The World, iirc, check your ego at the door.
I read this more than several times here….
I’ve seen you on other sites.
New day. New Comment. Please.
there’s a side of Biden I like, however. the loose cannon that calls the Preznit “brain dead” for instance.
Joe Biden. Public financing of elections. “Retail politics”.
The only filter Biden passes information through is his ego.
Still you have to give him credit although he comes across a little plastic on balance he’s quite the card or at least that’s my opinion at any rate.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 13
I do. From my secret lair deep inside a skull-shaped rock on a tiny Pacific island. So watch your mouth, or I’ll send my orcs to avenge me.
Hugh @ 23
he’s not ready for prime time.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 22
at the 7-11
For the girls only…and maybe a few of you other people…
I had the most bizarre dream about Joe last night. (Hint: I was naked.)
speaking of live earth (and let me give a caveat that i support awareness of global warming as well as good concerts), does anyone beside skippy find it ironic that al gore enlisted the very same music acts for this event that his wife railed against before congress some 20 years ago for vile filthy language in their lyrics?
For some reason I’m having trouble posting a comment.
Anyway, I wanted to say that I know some politicians at the state level and they have the same paranoia about the progressive blogosphere as Joe Biden. I’m told this paranoia is fairly widespread among Democrats in Congress.
Maybe a few of the major bloggers could do a workshop for these guys explaining what you are all about. Just an idea.
Harriet worked for Joe.
punaise @ 26
;0)
PS:
I’m nor therapist, but I think the Naked part was about Honesty.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 13
Seems like no one does. That’s why there’s no coherent strategy when faced with a Republic party ready to self-destructing. Thanks to the Democrats, the Republics will rise again.
Is anyone of the opinion that Biden’s candidacy lends an air of the circus to the public perception of the Dems? He also seems to get more than his fair share of Sunday talk show airtime. Having only paid attention to politics on this level very recently, here’s my real naive and newbie question: Does the Dem party leadership have any real influence about how the candidates portray themselves in the media and how they interact in debates and events where the candidates are in contact with one another?
demi– Was he naked too?
Biden’s a boob.
but that’s an insult to boobs…
In the dream, I was there to help.
It was a big convention of sorts and as Joe left the Hotel room to go and speak, I grabbed him and said “Habeus Corpust”. You gotta say it. Make it right!”
Ed Deevy @ 29
Well, it’s not as though we meet in some secret dungeons (cept for TRex). I suspect the internet has now reached even the state level, and anyone can just read the posts. Just a thought.
demi @ 27
Jeebus!! better lay off the stuffed zucchini for a while
Well, it’s good to know who’s in charge, TRex, couldn’t be in better hands, er, paws, what do therapods have? Winglets?
punaise @ 25
I wish he would be ready for mime time. Too much empty talk.
N
There is no effective leadership of the democratic party unless they have the White House–no one’s in charge.. Dean is formally in charge- but no one pays any attention to him. Candidates can, of course, say whatever the hell they like. They’ll only pay at the polls.
rwcole @ 36
Yes — but, nothing happened like that… read my comment #37.
:)
A the parent of a small child, I can see how a parent’s views on obscenity might morph over time:)
skippy @ 28
Ed Deevy @ 29
That does need to be done. LiberalLucy over at MichiganLiberal works pretty closely with our state Gov. Granholm. She’s not afraid of us in the least because they meet face to face and talk quite a bit. It makes a helluva difference in our support with that nod of confidence. Now to figure out the hellish logistics of getting that many DC Dems to ATTEND dammit.
demi—Well then if the nakedness represented honesty- you were both being honest as hell- anyone ELSE there bein honest?
N=1,
I see you like Dave Barry too! It’s a good thing he decided to run.
For some fun:
http://www.realcities.com/mld/…..;pageNo=36
Steve,
There was nothing untoward in the zucchini…
that I know of.
The dream was about something else, I think.
BTW – Live Earth is happening all oever Earth – 22 hours to be precise.
Personally I am excited about the Yellow Magic Orchestra reunion performance whioch I will not be able to see on the Sundance channel because I do not subscribe to cable (in any sense)
Hopefully something will show up on the tubez
skippy @ 28
Fleetwood Mac weren’t available.
You had a dream about Joe Biden and you were naked? Shall I send a condolence card?
Back to my point about filtered news… I see that msnbc.com has a headline up: “Strong jobs report means Fed still eyeing inflation”. But the number of jobs added in June was 132,000 according to one estimate and 150,000 according to another. I thought 150,000 was considered a break-even point — now it’s “strong”?!?
Too bad he’s not running as a Republican.
Well, you learn something new every day. I thought he was…
Ed Deevy @ 29
I can think of 4 simple don’ts for politicians:
1. Don’t think we aren’t paying attention
2. Don’t think we won’t factcheck
3. Don’t think we don’t remember
4. Don’t think we won’t understand
egregious @ 41
never more so than when he has the floor at a Senate confirmation hearing. the dude is quite enamored of the sound of his voice.
rwcole @ 46
Not that I remember. I guess that might have been one of the Points of the dream.
OldCoastie @ 34
Yeah, boobs are a good thing.
I am all for a non Biden resolution.
Loo Hoo. @ 40
Tiny forelimbs.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 13
Don’t look at me. It’s not me. I kind of think nobody controls it. It’s like one of those giant dinosaurs that had a brain so small it needed a secondary brain near it’s ass to control it’s tail.
If I find out who runs it, though, I’ll let you know.
Now that MBNA is owned by Bank of America, & run out of North Carolina, do even they need Joe Biden anymore, or is he the 10th incarnation of Harold Stassen?
Final Skippy note:
As a final note, my daughter enjoys Madonna’s children’s books.
joe biden – the man from mbna – whatever – makes it difficult for a person to resolve debt issues – i’m not a fan nor am i amused by biden…
I thought nakedness in a dream meant exposing your true, real self. If you then try to hide your nakedness, you are then trying to hide who you really are.
In that picture, Joe Biden looks like the crazy starship captain who fights with Kirk in the crappy Star Trek episode where Kirk recites the Pledge of Allegience. Except that Biden is wearing a hideous green tie.
OK kiddo @ 13
“I don’t belong to a political organization. I’m a Democrat.”
In the dream, I didn’t try to hide my nakendess. Maybe it’s the part of me that’s here at the Lake.
demi @ 66
What will we tell the children? :)
This thread needs a serious spew alert. I can’t stop giggling.
Was there a tree and some fruit in the dream?
Demi-
Then if you are not embarrassed by your nakedness in your dream, you are not embarrassed by being seen as who you are and what you believe in. It’s a good sign.
demi @ 66
you’re skinny dipping, is skippy dinning?
Or skimpy dining.
We can only be honest, if we want to share the truth.
PS – My youngest child, the only one still at home is at overnight camp this week. I’ve got one more day….
But, I’m still truthfull with him.
Eureka Springs @ 6
Now that is wickedly funny!!!
:-)
Do you have such dreams when the kid is NOT at camp?
I pray to all that is good and holy that I never have a dream that involves both nakedness AND Joe Biden.
alias @ 45
Offer them free weenies?
rw are you psychoanalyzing?
How many elephants had to die to make those giant ivory tooth-like things in Biden’s head?
LooHooo
Well- not with any talent!
No dining involved. Skimpy or otherwise. But, I think the “Habeus Corpus” line from me to him was the most relevant dialogue.
I honestly want the leaders who still have a “Say” to stand up to the Real Issues.
Do ya think?
(It was kinda sexy, though, if truth be told.)
Ah, the real power.
This will forever be known as the “demi-dream” thread.
I have important dreams when I need to, kid here or otherwise.
And thanks….
N=1 @ 34
No the Democratic party has no control. Biden hurts only Democrats when he opens his mouth and Holy Joe hurts us with his votes and words. Harry Reid needs to lay down the law with these twerps.
Or else Biden might be right power fills a vaccume if Harry can’t hack it we might have to start briniging discipline to the Democrats. But where to bit players like Biden and Joe get off thinking they can threaten us? Joe is a Republican tiebreaker with no real friends or influence and Biden’s own worst enemy is his mouth.
Why is there even a Delaware? How did we end up with these micro-states?
Ah, Scarecrow.
I hope this isn’t my fifteen minutes. Ha!
demi @ 86
Well, if I were wandering around nude in front of Biden, I’d probably wish for only 7.5 minutes, and not the full fifteen. Just me.
Twould be very difficult to be at war with one’s own mouth. The president may be in the middle of such a war.
So, if the week began with a commutation, what’s the Friday dump gonna be? Kinda hard to imagine a bigger turd than that. (Please do not infer that I am comparing demi’s “dream” candidate to a legislative byproduct.)
There’s nothing more OT than Joe Biden, no matter when or why he’s brought up, so –
LS came up with a real find in the stub of the previous thread. Well worth a read, as it comes as close as any credible article I’ve read on the subject of why Brewster-Jennings was taken out (Joe W’s op-ed merely pushed the operation out into the open):
The Daily Kos reported in July 2005, that Valerie Plame, who was “outed” to journalists as a CIA undercover employee as early as June 2003, was working for a CIA cover business called Brewster Jennings and Associates and that this entity, shut down after the “outing”, apparently had the responsibility to monitor developments in weapons of mass destruction. But it was involved in reporting on the oil trade, particularly as it related to Saudi Arabia and the Arabian American Oil Company (ARAMCO). ARAMCO is a combine, involving the Saudi royal family and major U.S. oil companies, that runs Saudi Arabia’s oil fields. Plame described herself to friends as an energy analyst.
Depending on Plame’s responsibilities within Brewster Jennings, she would have been in a position to know a little or a great deal about Marc Rich, his colleagues and relationships that may exist between Rich, Cheney and Halliburton. Plame’s “outing” has been viewed as a punishment for an attack by her husband, former ambassador Joseph Wilson, on Bush pre-occupation claims about Saddam’s nuclear capability. However, recent reports that Plame’s CIA work may have been disclosed to one or more reporters before Wilson’s attack was published, raise questions about the intent of the “outing”. The Washington Post reported Nov. 13, 2005 that Cheney “is shown by the indictment (of Libby) to be interested in Plame and her CIA status long before her cover was blown.”
Wilson was reported to have begun work on the John Kerry presidential campaign in May, 2003 as an unpaid foreign policy consultant. Might it be possible that administration officials feared that Plame could provide her husband with damaging information in the run-up to the 2004 election, particularly as she might have been in a position to continually monitor the growth of the new “Rich World” in Iraq. Possibly Cheney had come in contact with Plame when the CIA challenged the deal he was promoting to get the Export-Import loan for Tyumen Oil.
It goes on to discuss the part where I’m pretty sure Armitage had to get involved – heroin smuggling. The article doesn’t put any shine on Big Mitch’s Marc Rich halo, though.
Is today the day for recess appointments?
cathy @ 18
Don’t worry on that score. Old Joe the plagiarist will undobtedly be using someone else’s words and ideas.
I’ll never forgive him or any of the other traitor DEms who helped pass the disgraceful Bankruptcy Reform Act. Now there’s something that needs fixing and fixing fast especially with the undercurrent of a housing problem about to completely burst in certain areas of the country.
Demi’s Dreamthread would be a kewl name for a band. Something under the old Motown label maybe.
Just read through this thread. See what you started, Jane? Who knew??
demi @ 20
Oy and Amen!!
cleter @ 85
It was just a ‘lil ‘ol colony for starters.
P J Evans @ 65
Will Rogers. ;0)
scarecrow @ 87
I really need to go out and buy a camera….
to sleeper chants, to dream
Delaware was a swedish colony- and then a dutch colony- it took advantage of the declaration of independance to sign for itself and thus become the first state- much to the chagrin of Pennsylvania and Maryland who both laid claim to her.
Thanks for smacking down Biden, Jane. Been too busy to do it today, but I’d read that horsesh*t comment of his this morning on Salon and I damned near came unglued.
This is a meme we need to take a stake to, pound it through its chest and cut off its head. Stu Rothenberg lipping off about “angry party activists” earlier in the week, followed by MBNA Biden going off about lefty bloggers are both part of an on-going meme designed to minimize the truth.
The truth is:
– So-called “angry party activists” are NOT separate from the core of the Democratic Party. Take both Marcy Wheeler and myself, for example; we are party officials, not just foaming-at-the-mouth fringe elements. We didn’t become party officials by being outside the party.
– Many lefty bloggers are NOT separate from the base of the Democratic Party. We are merely that part of the party that feels quite comfortable stating our minds in print on the internet, rather than limiting our comments to the confines of a party meeting. I’ll point to the numerous group blogs/blog rings that Democratic Party members have established across the country, like MichiganLiberal.com here in my own backyard. These people ARE the Democratic Party.
If there are people who aren’t representative of the Democratic Party, it’s these DINOsaurs who continue to demand blind and mute adherence to the Democratic Party machine of the past and its elitist backroom deal making and utter reliance on the consultant class.
WE ARE THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY. And we certainly did buy it with our shoe leather and sweat equity and hard-earned money in 2004 and 2006, and any elected party official who thinks otherwise will be facing a primary, bought and paid for by the “angry party activist” “lefty blogging” base.
punaise @ 99
Aye, there’s the rub.
I always thought that “Clusterfuck and the Shooters” would make a good band name.
Loo Hoo,
I was just puttin’ stuff together in my head, figurin’ out what that dream meant and you, as usual, are right on. My subconscious also puts all sort of things together, and because I’ve been watching more tv this week, just Jon Stewart and KO and a little CNN, they have been running commercials for “Dream Girls” lately. You are so Right On. I realized that was part of my subconscious that put that dream together.
punaise @ 99
Starting early today, aren’t we ! I enjoy.
punaise @ 21
He’s not a loose cannon. He’s a loose popgun. Completely ineffectual.
Twain @ 105
I was just thinking that.
Sorry if I started Late Night a bit early.
Jane started it!
She brought up Joe B.
And I never tole her ’bout my dream, yet.
Loo Hoo. @ 96
Now it receives the war dead which Americans are supposedly too fragile to see….and so they are forbidden to see them.
I have to say, at the end of the day, I like Biden. ;0)
rwcole @ 100
Hmmm interesting wording there…many people have taken advantage of our founding documents to help themselves to greatness.
A certain family comes to mind with a few senators not far behind.
brendan @ 106
I don’t know the validity of this, but sources are cited. There may be some major here, there:
http://www.spitfirelist.com/f277.html
I like Biden cuz he talks fast…
Calling Bush “brain-dead” was a kick in the pants to the Dead.
Afuckingmen.
Biden is overdue for a reality check.
Keep runnin yer yap and pissin’ off the REAL democratic party dumbshit.
You’ll be on the outside lookin in, Jack.
And my Mom’s favorite drink was Delaware Punch.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 109
The sound of his voice puts you to sleep too?
Oh goody. We might possibly have a debate. I’m ready.
his teeth keep me awake
Ed*ard Teller @ 90
Correct me if I’m wrong, but this statement in the above is misleading: “The Washington Post reported Nov. 13, 2005 that Cheney ‘is shown by the indictment (of Libby) to be interested in Plame and her CIA status long before her cover was blown.”‘ What the Post was presumably referring to by “long before” was Cheney’s interest in Plame after the Kristof piece and before the Novak outing.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..85_pf.html
This Brewster-Jennings theory is premised on a coincidence: that Wilson happened to show up on the scene with public criticism of the Niger report.
To all the folks who disapprove of Biden, enlighten us as to your fave Dem candidate for president and why.
Waxman’s letter re: Halliburton/Iran and more from April 2003:
http://www.ratical.org/ratvill…..Rummy.html
I’m off to finish my novel (reading, not writing, Gawd, I wish) and will probably nap; if I have any more interesting dreams, I’ll let you know later…but, I must drop the zuchinni casserole off at the bar…so who knows?
And, Scarecrow, by your calculations, I still have 7.5 minutes left.
aliasofwestgate @ 45
The DLC’ers think of us as DFH. Last I checked, Biden was a DLC’er. Most of them are afraid because we are not afraid to take anyone to task(unlike Republicans).
I think physical attributes are not fair game.
Ed*ard Teller @ 90
Cheney involved in selling Iraqi oil before he was Vice President despite the sanctions that made it illegal. We can impeach Darth for that and since it happened before Cheney was Vice President I don’t think White House privledge can protect him. The case for impeachment should be quick. I would love to see Republicans argue that supporting Saddam was not a crime!
rwcole @ 100
I’m not usually one to recommend the magazine, but here’s an amusing TNR piece from a few years back, “Delaware: America’s Rogue State”: http://www.tnr.com/doc.mhtml?i…..hait081902
LS @ 121
thanks, LS, hadn’t see that before
Bustednuckles @ 114
his reality check bounced. he had no overt daft protection.
Waxman’s letter re: Halliburton/Iran and more from April 2003:
http://www.ratical.org/ratvill…..Rummy.html
See me at 121. Read Waxman’s letter to Rummy.
I’m waiting.
Hey, let them think we’re all DFH.
It’s what threw Issa’s District Deputy, Poley, offguard so much. Loo Hoo and I not only bathed, but were looked hot! Nails and all!
Well let’s Democrats. Hillary is the front runner. Right?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 124
agreed. it’s his vanity I mock.
in answer to your other query: Gore, and you know why.
demi @ 131
Woo, woo…party on!!
Oklahoma kiddo @ 120
Announced candidates? Edwards. Because he talks about core party values that have been long neglected by triangulators.
Unannounced? I like Gore. If he jumped in I would support him.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 120
Right now, Edwards then Obama. In a perfect world, I wish Feingold would have run.
Anyone. Tell me about the DLC.
brendan @ 119
I don’t know that we have all the pieces to exclude Cheney’s or Libby’s advance knowledge of Plame’s role at Brewster-Jennings. Remember that Cheney had been making unprecedented trips to CIA offices in order to obtain intel on Iraq. The visits were perceived as pressure to produce the “right” intel on Iraq. Who did Cheney meet while visiting? What had he been told during the Energy Task Force meetings about both political and energy industry intel?
Having said that, I’m less likely to buy that Plame’s work was a risk because of ARAMCO; B-J covered Turkey, too, making an intersection with Sibel Edmond’s work likely.
ok, i’ll admit , my ignorance—–
what does MBNA mean?
Hugh @ 53
5. Don’t think we’ll vote for you in the general just because you have a (D) after your name
Err wait. Uh, I guess we will. Yeah, feel free to ignore the other Don’ts.
I would of course prefer Gore, absent that I would really like to see an Edwards Dodd ticket.
If Gore jumps in, I would like the other candidates to bail, and show the GOP a frightening display of party unity.
cleter @ 135
I keep reading that he says he’s not running, but when I listen to the videos they cite, he never says that. I say, he’s gonna run.
LS @ 121
this stuff floors me
demi @ 131
Oooops. Sorry. Forgot to leave my ego at the door. (tee hee).
biden thinks he has a lock on his senate seat – if he keeps saying silly shit that seat of his will be kicked to the curb i’m just saying and forget about the dem nomination – will HE be in for a rude awakening at yearlykos ;o}
cleter @ 135
I like Gore as well, as long as he told Bob Shrum and Donna Brazile to stay far, far away.
Gore for president! And yes… I know why.
punaise @ 128
nice bank shot
LS @ 143
I just saw An Inconvenient Truth. I really want him to run now. Where was this Al Gore in 2000?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 120
President Pelosi before x-mas ‘07.. That’s my candidate for now.
Elliott @ 144
Impeach! No wonder he didn’t want the energy taskforce documents released. Might have been a whole lot of shreddin’ goin’ on.
Al Gore will be the next President.
juslin @ 146
Biden, will be in the Senate for as long as he wants. He has the credit card money behind him. They are big business in DE. When he retires, he’ll try to pass the seat to his son(who is currently AG of DE). Just to warn you.
I don’t like people who sneer (sorry, that’s both a physical and mental attribute). Biden reminds me of frat boys who get pissed when the homecoming queen wants to dance with someone else and says they’re ugly anyway. Excuse me, your ego is showing.
I like Edwards. Because he’s talking my language.
If seeking truth makes me a lefty, well, the shoe fits. Politicians don’t like blogs because they don’t control it. Harder to control the message and they have to think of new ways to fool people.
“nice bank shot”—–but excessive english on the cue ball.
LS
Thanks! and remember, the best revenge is to go make a good life.
And,
I just can’t get behind (or in front of ) Obamam. The preachy style and that EGO is way out there. Like an ingenue (sp?) at a cattle call. Me! Me!
If I find out that Cheney had something to do with uranium sales to Iran somehow, just like they sold chemical weapons to Iraq, and then attacked the country based upon WMD’s….I’m gonna jump in the lake!
This lake!
Eureka Springs @ 151
;0)
cleter @ 150
Bottled up by his advisers(aka the Bob Shrum’s of the world).
Oklahoma kiddo @ 153
Don’t know what you’re smoking, but could I borrow some?
LS @ 152
There already has been. Or didn’t you miss the pictures from the end of last year. The shredder company trucks in front of the VP residence.
jello5929 @ 140
If I could vote for Bernie Sanders, I would. And I’d certainly consider voting for Jim Jeffords.
But I don’t live in VT. I think what we need to do is seriously consider supporting Green and Independent candidates who have proven they will caucus with Dems — unlike that sack of sh*t Joey Liebermonster — and encourage them when there is no viable Democratic candidate in a race against a Republican.
Further, I’d throw my vote to a Libertarian if there were only a Libertarian and a Republican in a race, provided the Lib had proven cred as a Lib.
But getting a quality Dem candidate should be addressed right now, pre-primary, so we don’t have to evaluate these other more complex strategies when it isn’t necessary.
dmac @ 139
They’re one of the largest banks/credit card issuers in the world, registered in Deleware, and the distinguish Senator acts as if he is on their staff.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 124
But, but..
What will we tell “Kate O’Beirne’s Teeth”????
Speaking of the role of bloggers – have you all seen the one by David Sirota from a few days ago: http://www.alternet.org/bloggers/sirota/56083/
Snip:
…This term “punditocracy,” you see, used to have a very literal meaning: Rule by Washington Pundits…
… But at some point in the last few years, things changed. The people – those sheep that the Heroic Herders like Krauthammer and Will bravely corralled, those unwashed masses that the Courageous Cleansers like Klein and Friedman valiantly scrubbed down – the people found their own power through the Internet, through thousands of blogs, through newsletters, through alternative media and – gasp! – through actual organizing. The pundits have lost their ability to order the people’s representatives around. They have lost their ability to rule. In short, they have been stripped of their “ocracy”…
demi @ 157
I saw him in person, and he was quite awesome. I was 10 feet away from him at one point, and his ability to rouse the crowd (22,000) was something to see. I also think his wife is amazing. I think he has sucky advisors.
demi @ 131
We use -all- our weapons.
Truth and beauty.
Twain @ 161
Two things, first, has anyone else noticed that Gore has lost weight recently? Hmmmmm
and
Twain, watch out. You might have some weird dreams. :)
Joe Klein’s conscience @ 162
dmac @ 139
Big bank out of Deleware. Mostly did credit card business as far as I know. BofA bought them out. Biden, as senator from Delaware, voted in favor of the bankruptcy bill which favored MBNA big time.
I don’t smoke. But a few in my family do. And I don’t care.
brendan @ #119,
the phrase from the WaPo article “is shown by the indictment (of Libby) to be interested in Plame and her CIA status long before her cover was blown.” is imprecise, but when it could have merely said “before” rather than “long before,” I don’t think the author’s premise is any more unclear than the Post’s conjecture.
This Brewster-Jennings theory is premised on a coincidence: that Wilson happened to show up on the scene with public criticism of the Niger report.
Given what we know in the Wheeler and Marshall timelines, that is correct. They’ve been very careful to construct scenarios which are foolproof. The article I cited from LS’s link has a lot of conjecture in it, but other advances in real Plameology over the past 3 and 1/2 years have also begun as speculation. Often things which seem coincidental with a certain amount of knowledge become rationally connected when one knows more.
joeklein@154
hasn’t that credit card money moved west? anyhoo i still think biden’s a jack-ass for mocking the blogs…as for me OKK – none of the above move me yet – my hope was that sen feingold would’ve run
LS @ 167
Yeah, but, rousing a crowd is about charisma. Jerry Falwell did it too.
does Biden have a bone to pick with inaccurate MSM? or is it just bloggers?
demi @ 169
Not about Biden but maybe Bill Clinton !
dmac @ 139
MBNA = Maryland Bank, National Association, its name before Bank of America acquired it.
demi @ 169
He’s a big guy. He’s way better looking and more “manly” than let’s say, Thompson, Ghouliani, Gingrich…jeesh
okkiddo at 115 says “And my Mom’s favorite drink was Delaware Punch.”
what’s delaware punch?
dmac @ 139
Huge financial conglomerate; lots of MBNA credit cards out there. Probably once stood for Maryland Bank National Trust and Association, or something like that, decades ago.
LS @ 158
Please do. LS, I don’t know how you find such great links, but they are….cerebral!
LS @ 180
dmac @ 139
Used to have an MBNA card. Shitty customer service. Motto: “We don’t care because we don’t have to.”
Cut the card up long ago.
dmac @ 180
It’s better than Pepsi or Coke. ;0)
dmac @ 180
I think it is any drink where if you have more than one, you’re over the border.
Ed*ard Teller @ 186
Way too sweet and it’s pink.
Loo Hoo. @ 183
Twain @ 161
haha. how are you gonna return it? seriously, accept no substitutes.
Just ran into Lucy K’s words on an old thread elsewhere, and thought that they might be worth considering:
Biden is very good at stupid.
.
dmac,
MBNA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MBNA
You could fit Delaware into my back yard and have enough room left over for part of Rhode Island.
thanks for the mbna answers…..now the title makes sense, thanks.
i remember the credit card fiasco…highway robbery…my dad told me back in the late 70’s that credit cards would kill off (be the death of) the middle class……he was right…told me have one credit card, and only use it if i have the cash to cover it at the end of the month…..use it, don’t let it use me….if you don’t have the cash, you don’t need it….he’s a retired corporate accountant. an honest one. an fdr democrat.
Little states make you feel like you are making great progress when yer driving- I like em.
Ed*ard Teller @ 173
Thanks. I’ll definitely read the whole thing.
You can call him Mr. 26%:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19623564/site/newsweek
dmac @ 139
Big credit card company (and about the only major employer N or NE of Portland ME). Acquired by BofA last year. Lots of layoffs around Belfast.
OKK – Announced: Chris Dodd, John Edwards and Bill Richardson, in that order. All are electable and can beat any Republican opponent. No one else running on the Dem side can make that cut.
mc @ 197
damn. what are we waiting for?
Twain @ 187
Not that it matters, but Delaware Punch was dark purple. And yes… it was sweet don’t know what the brix was, but it was definitely sweet. And oh sooo good. ;0)
Dodd, Edwards, Richardson— yeah– that’s the ticket!
OT
3/4 of the country hates him (W, that is). I think it’s safe to impeach now.
TiredFed @ 200
Heh
TiredFed @ 200
Republican approval, of course.
cnn.com
http://www.pugwash.org/reports…..-paper.pdf
okkiddo 185-”It’s better than Pepsi or Coke. ;0)”
edward the teller 186-”I think it is any drink where if you have more than one, you’re over the border.”
ohhhhh like long island iced tea!!!!! or a cosmopolitan!
just got back from running errands, catching up on threads,really hot here, turned on the air, filled the bird feeders and just popped the top on a stella artois….refreshing…..takes more than one, though.
I still have faith that Congress is going to keep the impeachment ball rolling. Leahy has more hearings on tap; so does Conyers. Waxman ain’t quitting and neither should we. Have a restful weekend gang. Next week is shaping up to be a good one.
Pun—Yeah- of course SOME of that 64% disapproved cause they though Libby should have been nominated for sainthood rather than just havin the jail time removed.
http://www.pugwash.org/reports…..-paper.pdf
“Thirty years ago Henry Kissinger, Donald Rumsfeld, and Dick Cheney were among the
senior U.S. officials in the Ford Administration who signed-off on a huge secret nuclear
9
deal with the then Shah of Iran, Mohammad Reza Pahlavi, including the proposed sale of
a complete turnkey spent-fuel reprocessing plant for separating plutonium. These
gentlemen had no qualms then about Iran’s acquisition of a sensitive nuclear fuel cycle
facility, perhaps because they believed the Shah would be on the Peacock throne
indefinitely.9″
TiredFed @ 199
;0) I like all these guys. I am particularly fond of Dodd.
Ed*ard Teller @ 173
Okay, I read it, and I’m in no position to judge how fruitful the avenues it opens are. But I do want to adduce another reason for skepticism: it makes no mention of the reason (established in the MSM) for Rich’s pardon: the Israelis repeatedly asked for it. Here’s what the article says, making it sound as if Rich’s ties to Libby, and, ultimately, Cheney, somehow drove the pardon:
“When Congress held hearings on the Rich pardon in 2001, one of those testifying on Rich’s behalf was I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby. Libby told Congress that Rich’s tax problems resulted from faulty legal interpretations by the Justice Department. Libby, who was to become Cheney’s chief of staff, provided legal representation for Rich from time to time between 1985 and 2000.”
It strikes me as a naive article.
Also, I have to reiterate my previous comment, adding more of the quote to show either how ignorant or manipulative the assertion really is:
“However, recent reports that Plame’s CIA work may have been disclosed to one or more reporters before Wilson’s attack was published, raise questions about the intent of the “outing”. The Washington Post reported Nov. 13, 2005 that Cheney “is shown by the indictment (of Libby) to be interested in Plame and her CIA status long before her cover was blown.”
“May have been disclosed…?” I’m hardly an expert, but this writer seems fundamentally illiterate in Plameology.
That all said, I think there’s something fertile about all this. I’ve wondered for years when Cheney became “neoconservative”, i.e., when he decided we were going to occupy Iraq and attack Iran. I think he joined them at some point late in the Clinton adminstration, up to which time he was floating the idea of dropping the sanctions on Iraq, while Halliburton was violating the Iran sanctions. I think he might have preferred a Libya-style rapprochement, but then threw in at some point with the PNAC’ers for “regime change”.
anyone else think that pic of Biden looks like TRex’s attack bunny from last night’s Late Nite?
Fresh thread upstairs, served by Jane.
O/t and overheard on radio this morning:
About that ball game shrub attended yesterday………..per Air American, his presence was unannounced.
Don’t know whether it’s true or not, but, if so, can ya say, “Gutless wonder”? Unidentified when the audience can’t be under 100% control.
Here’s the thing. Cheney, Rummy, etal., sold WMD’s to both Iraq and Iran, and they have already attacked Iraq using the claim of WMD’s to get in to steal their oil; and now they are after Iran for the exact same reason. I see a pattern here…helllooo See me at 211.
Plame was involved in stopping proliferation of WMD’s, and that is exactly what Rummy and Cheney have been in the business of for 30 years!!
Arrest them.
oh, and am watching richard lugar from last night’s charlie rose…….he packs a lot in a half hour…laying out all of the reasons we can’t stay in iraq……..didn’t know he was a rhodes scholar……
people might want to watch it since he is the one who is spearheading the republican opposition to staying in iraq…..to use his talking points on repub senators when you call or write……….just an idea…….that’s why i read and listen to the dark side……to feed them their own talking points to steer them in the right direction……
i don’t understand why people don’t do this more…….
that’s why i wanted the repub book from ccmask. thanks ccmask………
i have even read limbaugh’s screed……..laughable.
anyway, if you know their sugar, you can gather them and swat them with it.
Brendan,
Poor Darth. When you’re always playing both sides, it’s sometimes difficult to know when to reward your enemy or stab your best friends in the back.
OT from an irate Arkansas Democrat (that would be me).
Pryor is a former gang of fourteen member and calls Lieberman his mentor, is up for reelection next year with no opponent except a green party candidate.. I think its time to listen to Raynes fine comment early in the last thread.
Unfortunately Biden, as right on as he often is, shares the Inside-The-Beltway fear of mad, hippie, irrational bloggers.
Not True…..
What I get on the left blogosphere are reasoned messages from Glen Greenwald, Joshua Marshall, Digby, Sadly, No and many others.
These wonderful blogs lay out the real story, with links to BS (with real information why it’s BS) and to other blogs about the same subject.
I NEVER get this, even from my beloved NY Times, which is becoming increasingly less well-loved with every Michael Gordon story about “dangerous” Iran.
I go to the bloggers to recover the sanity I lose when I watch most cable news shows and the in-depth information I don’t get from newspapers…
YAY to the blogosphere…voice of the real people!
What the politicians don’t like is that blogs like this one are BETTER then the MSM, and as I have said all along, when it comes to news they are more accurate than the MSM, and when the readership gets up above a certain percentage, because the MSM= state controlled media, and people stop reading it, then here is where the advertising will come. Biden is the worst kind of an “old man” who doesn’t get it (I can talk, I’m older in age than he is). Especially FDL, which draws the educated, both as readers and as our commentators. I have learned more here about the law (from people who practice it or have practiced it) than in any New York Times article. You don’t argue with people like Biden, or Holy Joe. You vote them out. No one should bother to tell these clowns (because they won’t listen) that we have smarter readers (who vote), and smarter commentators, and we care deeply about America. FDL and a few others have become the 21st Century journalists. The MSM might not want to hear that, and the gang in Washington might not want to hear that, but that is the fact.
And unlike the MSM, we don’t have to guess at our stats. You hit the page, you get counted. Advertisers can’t argue with that. Sorry to ramble, but the pooh poohing of something that is such a powerful force is typical of people who live in the past….and might have no place in the politics of the future.
The NY Times, and the WaPo started (maybe not those VERY papers, but newspapers in general) as broadsides, handed out on the street and tacked to telephone poles.
And as for accuracy, at least on this side of the “blogosphere” I don’t think the Pajamas media types realize that our readers take our commentators and other readers to task much more quickly than anyone in the MSM. And we don’t censor them. This is something a paper sheet can’t do, and as the online WaPo found out, if you’re going to operate in this sphere, you’d better not close down the comments.
to all of you that call Joe Biden, MBNA Joe -
Go look at Hillary’s #1 supporter – it’s Citicorp.and while you are at it, look at all the corporations that support her and Obama.
Hillary is also in debt to the insurance companies, so think about that when she is talking about insurance reform.
Biden is out there campaigning by shaking hands. He is not selling his soul to the corporations like the ‘top tier’ to get money.
He is not a pre-packaged politician that just says what you want to hear just to get your vote.
If you want perfect packaging, then vote for Hillary or Obama or Edwards.
But if you want someone with answers, someone who speaks the truth, then you may want to listen to what Senator Biden has to say.
Nothing pisses me off more than people that try to smear someone without knowing what they are talking about.
Rayne @ 138
And according to the unclassified statement of her work at the Counter-Proliferations Division she was only transferred there in January of 2002. That statement doesn’t mention what other section of the Covert Operations section she was transferred from. Or if she had previously worked in CPD (her cover as “energy consultant” at Brewster Jennings was several years old by that point).
The fact that her husband was sent to Niger on a prior mission in 1999 suggests that Plame may have been working on IRANIAN efforts to obtain WMD’s…as Joe Wilson DID find there was some credibility to claims of IRAN’s desire to purchase yellowcake at that time.
Joe Wilson’s trip was essentially a reprise of his earlier, successful, mission. Thus Wilson was immininently qualified to undertake the 2002 mission…which is why Plame was approached when the issue of Cheney’s queries about an Iraq-Niger deal were raised.