Via Bloomberg:
A quick pardon for Libby would go against Justice Department guidelines, which recommend that a supplicant wait five years after conviction or release from confinement before seeking a pardon. On the other hand, there’s no requirement that a president wait; President Gerald Ford pardoned his disgraced predecessor, Richard Nixon, shortly after taking office in 1974, and before Nixon was convicted of anything.The focus on a Libby pardon is obscuring other options available to Bush, including conditional pardons, commutations, remissions of fines and amnesties, Ruckman said.
One possibility would be to issue a respite directive, which simply delays carrying out a sentence and lets passions cool, he said. George Washington first granted respites in June, 1795, delaying the executions of two men involved in the Whiskey Rebellion; they were later pardoned, Ruckman said.
“Bush can keep Libby out of jail without exercising a pardon,” Ruckman said.
Good lord, if they are reaching all the way back to the Whiskey Rebellion for some obscure out for Libby, then it sounds to me like the pardon beg is falling on entirely deaf ears in the West Wing. Maybe the rumors about Fred Fielding keeping them away from the President are more than just rumors? Whatever the cause, desperation is setting in among the Free Scooter brigades.
A respite directive? You are telling me that Mrs. Libby is content to settle for a “respite directive” after all the crap that she and her kids have gone through on Dick Cheney and George Bush’s behalf? No freaking way. And if they are getting down to the point where they are grovelling publicly for a “respite directive,” they are getting pretty desperate for something…anything…to keep the Libbys and their pals on the protecting Dick Cheney bandwagon. This isn’t the first time that a “pardon trial balloon” has fallen flat — the Joe DiGenova attempts got bogged down early on in the proceedings prior to trial and conviction — but truly, the Whiskey Rebellion? Pa. The. Tic.
I’m with Joe Wilson on this one: No pardon. No way. (H/T to ThinkProgress for the great interview video — well worth the watching.) And that means no pretend pardon on a technicality either.
And, for your reading pleasure, if you haven’t read Emptywheel’s speculation on the Novak testimony gaps, you really ought to do so. Intriguing stuff. Also, here and here for more background on this.
(Photo via Amnesix.)
UPDATE: Tucker Carlson’s daddy — one of the big shots of the Free Scooter Defense Fund – had this to say today:
“I hope it puts pressure on the president. He’s a man of pronounced loyalties and he should have loyalty to Scooter Libby,” said former Ambassador Richard Carlson, a member of Libby’s defense fund. “It would be a travesty for him to go off to prison. The president will take some heat for it. So what? He takes heat for everything.” (emphasis mine)
Really respectful tone to take about the President on whom you are dependent for largesse for your man Scooter, eh? Yes, Richard Carlson, so what if Libby disrespected the rule of law and was convicted of multiple federal felonies — your personal loyalty toward Dick Cheney’s minion should trump everything for President Bush. And you and all your Free Scooter peeps will stamp your feet and hold your breath until you turn blue until he does what you want. Does that about cover it?
Good lord, the nation is being run by a bunch of petulant, selfish, narcissistic 11 year olds. Some days it is just more obvious than others, isn’t it?
Related posts:
- The Bush Fairy Tale on the Libby Pardon
- The Taxpayers Paid Dick Cheney’s Personal Defense Attorney to Obstruct Any Inquiries Into His Crimes
- Dick Cheney, Scooter Libby, and the “Unremarkable” Meat Grinder
- Cheney’s Betrayal Made an IIPA Charge for Libby Possible
- SCOTUS Denies Valerie Plame Wilson Her Day in Court





Spotlight







Support this site!
Subscribe to the newsletter
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About Firedoglake
Advanced search

zed?
Jail Guitar Doors for Scooter!
well then…
Yes!
I don’t think FDLers were expecting another post so soon…
I was busy remembering The Clash.
My take? Bush has too much on his mind these days to pardon Libby now. He might wait till Jan 2009 when he’s on the way out. This administration has so much flotsam flowing against it. And Bush keeps telling people he sleeps well at night? If that’s true, then that’s even more frightening than anything else.
Gang — I pulled this thread back — I mistyped the time on it. Please come back to it later. Thanks!
Christy:
Hiccup: Also, one can’t get here from the front page…
Biodun at 8 — See my comment at 7…
Fitz!
howdy!
Cheney is currently no friend of Bush right now – hard to believe the shrub would add to his troubles by pardoning Scooter…
Snoopy dance!
I am sure KKKarl will help Shrub make the right choice. What is KKKarl’s wish?
OT: I’m dying to see this on youtube:
Putin translator lol:
“We’ve seen the worms and we appreciate the wormness we have received”
I hope Scooter is having a nice lunch today…’cause there ain’t no antipasto where he’s going.
Meanwhile someone like John Walker Lindh receives no such sense of compassion. His crime? Being in Afghanistan when we invaded it. And what about all the innocents being held in the Guantanamo dungeon for five years so far?
EvilDrPuma @ 15
I hope he gets a cellmate who eats lotsa beans!
EvilDrPuma @ 15
But there will be lots of bologna…
Leave the computer for a few minutes and all heaven breaks loose.
I just finished catching up on my weekend FDL reading, now I have to go catch up on Marcy’s stuff. It is what we do on yet another rainy, steamy, tropical day in central Texas.
Lazy Lightning/Supplication.
Inquiring prison medical staff want to know: Is Scooter claustrophic?
That sorta, kinda, slightly seemed to work for Ms. Hilton. Just a thought, in case Team Libby is lurking and running out of options.
LoudounLib @ 18
Well, then, he may fit in.
Biodun @ 6
By then Scooter will have served enough time to be forgotten by most people.
‘He pardoned who? Scooter who? What did he do, steal tricycles?’
Peterr @ 22
He did spend a night at a Holiday Inn..
Peterr @ 22
Paris can give him tips on how to cope with incarceration.
EPU’d -
I guess we ought keep in mind that Bush can pardon Libby for offenses not even yet charged. See Murphy v. Ford 390 F. Supp. 372 (U.S. District Court, W. District of Michigan, 1975). The Gerald Ford pardon precedent.
So, the idea that a post-pardon Libby could then be forced to testify truthfully under threat of subsequent perjury is a non-starter. Bush can indemnify Scooter totally, put him beyond the reach of the law.
Balrog, “We are everywhere.”
What a nice 4th of July treat. I just wish Fitz had a reason to reopen this, I still dream of Rove being frogmarched, Cheney would be even better.
I don’t think a pardon is coming. Libby is the scapegoat for W, KKK and Shooter. Shooter may feel he is above the law and advocate a pardon, but W and KKK know better, and will wait until they are out the door. If they pardon him, then the light shines directly on W and KKK.
AZ Matt @ 26
He can spend his time reading his fanmail from Harriet Miers
Beats me what bush will do about scoots. He’s takin shit from the right wing over immigration- so he would probably like to throw em a bone but scooter may not be a big enough bone.
“Please- Please- don’t put me in that bear cage”.
If Libby had been involved in the Whiskey Rebellion I’m sure he would receive a pardon. Anyway, great post Christy!
AZ Matt @ 17
Gives new meaning to spill the beans.
Hi, I just got home and signed on, what good news..
Boosh probably needs ta go out and arrest about a half a million illegals in order to get some of the wingnuts back.
rat bastahd @ 28
Who are the Grateful Dead? And why do they keep following me around?
Clang. !
We know what the topic will be on Hardball today don’t we? Scooter Libby whinefest part 20.
OT-Last week Matthews was on early in the day to talk with Alex Witt about the Edwards challenge. He made an ass of himself, again. He didn’t mention Aqua Velva, but it’s just as bad.
Here’s the shorter version (four minutes), with snarky commentary.
Here’s the full clip (six minutes) with no commentary.
Old joke from when I did prosecutions.
Christy:
Well, wait just a second. If they can go back to the Whisky rebellion, then why can’t we, in spirit, go back to oh, say, they way they punished people around the time of the Boston Tea Party, which is to say that Scooter serve a portion of his sentence in the public stocks and pillory? On the lawn, in front of the Linclon Memorial. I’m just, mwahha ha ha ha ha, sayin.
Peterr @ 22
Perhaps they could allow him a picture of aspens in his cell.
A respite directive? You are telling me that Mrs. Libby is content to settle for a “respite directive” after all the crap that she and her kids have gone through on Dick Cheney and George Bush’s behalf? No freaking way.
Libby might flip over that.
He can choose felon or he can choose whistleblower.
HA! From EPU-land to seer, in about one minute flat!
me, from last thread:
:)
I hope Libby will be able to enjoy the Wilson lawsuit against him and the rest of the thugs. It will give him something to look forward to. He can testify in his prison uniform.
RevDeb @ 19
Sing it, Sister. Aaaaa-men.
So scoots has ta cough up $250k in fines—now he’s got the Wilson’s sittin in front of him with a tire iron askin “So how much ya GOT?”
Poor scoots- he needs ta get a gig with the American Enterprise Institute like Wolfie…Think they hire cons- while still in the slammer?
Updated the post above, gang — Tucker Carlson’s daddy opened his big yap again.
“Tucker Carlson’s Daddy”
Nasty work- but someone needed ta do it
How much are the Wilson’s asking for? Anyone know?
Billion in punitive damages oughta bout cover it- Cheney can cough up most of it.
personalloyalty
needs space
Note the Two Redacted Pages. Libby snitches on Cheney, and Novak snitches on Rove. These were previously censored but there are still several pages of redactions. A “Pardon” is likely Obstruction of Justice.
Prairie at 52 — Got that one already — spotted it after the post went up.
“Good lord, the nation is being run by a bunch of petulant, selfish, narcissistic 11 year olds.”
On behalf of my 11 year old son who has more compassion, maturity, and selflessness in his left pinky than the entire cabal of Bush clusterf**ks, I request an apology.
In the context of today’s Appeals Court ruling, the Peter Baker pity party in WaPo assumes additional heft: Chimpy meets with theologians, chats with real historians, bike-rides with right-wing radio hosts, and sits down with real authors of real books.
Not much time to hear from Libby Lobbyists, is there?
Fielding has built a wall around his president, taking John Dean’s advice: pardon talk leads to articles of impeachment. Why else would Ambassador Carlson wail in the media? Because he’s not getting through via normal (Veep) channels, that’s why.
Who’s got Tucker-watching duty today?
When Mr. Carlson visits, he can take Scooter a nice hot Swanson frozen dinner.
Tucker Carlson’s daddy doesn’t know Bush the Lesser as well as you’d think, it seems. For Bush loyalty is a one-way street—unswerving loyalty to him, and anyone can be tossed aside and left to the wolves whenever it’s convenient for the boy king.
I’m wondering if Fred has threatened to resign if W pardons Scooter?
(Probably not yet, but is holding that card as his ace in the hole.
I’m speculating that:
a. Fred’s sense of justice wouldn’t allow a get-out-jail card to be played
b. Fred knows he’s in a pretty powerful position, given all of the subpoenas he’s fighting for the WH)
Any Thoughts ???
It’s this kind of crap that led Jefferson to say “A little revolution now and then is a good thing…”
Of course, I’m guessing Jefferson would have called this crap treason.
Christy — your hand o’fleet fingers beats my lowly refresh….
Was it Tucker who wrote about Bush’s comments on Karla Fay? If so, what’s the odds Daddy Carlson’s gonna have any sway with Petulant Son?
RevDeb @ 19
Jeepers. That’s what I’m sayin’…just went to a local political activism meeting and look what happened while I was gone. Sheesh.
I guess I might have to step away more often.
rwcole @ 47
The fresher the better! That’s why they call them neo-cons.
AEI, putting the “tank” in “think tank” since 1979.
I think it was Trex who called the DC crew “toddlers in ties.” It was someone here, anyway. I love that phrase and image. It’s perfect.
I’d be slightly kinder and say 17 year olds, with the folks outta town and the keys to the liquor cabinet.
As for the Carlsons; were one to look up the word “shill” in teh dictionary, it’s a crapshoot as to whether you’d find Pappa Carlson or his little, bowtied geek of a pup.
TheOtherWA @ 64
707
Aynsley @ 59
Fred’s heard John Dean remind us all that pardons are impeachable, when the criminal conspiracy advances the political aims of the Oval Occupant. When your former boss goes public with a reminder like that, it cuts through the Libby Lobby noise.
I would keep an eye on the Lynne-Laura channel, though, Fred: that’s as likely a pathway to pardon talk as any other. Certainly Mr Carlson-Swanson isn’t getting through.
A respite directive that hasn’t been used for over 200 years? Good luck with that one. I hope Team Fitz has fun researching the legal precedents, at least.
I’m still waiting for Mrs. Scooter to flip and spill everything she knows about those bastards. Pleaseohpleaseohplease….
whichever, you guys have done a great job.
Biodun @ 6
Like Daddy, like son…The difference being that the average voter didn’t ‘get’ Iran-Contra (Selling arms to a rogue nation in order to finance an illegal war on behalf of narcotics smugglers…So much nuance, so little time) making it easier to run out the clock and then bluff.
Explaining thousands and thousands of deaths and injuries, and hundreds of billions in expenditures might not come so easy.
I don’t like calling them toddlers or children or teenagers. These are grown men, they do not have the luxury of claiming innocence of youth or inexperience. They have willingly and knowingly made these choices, and damn them for it.
Via @ 69
The pain… THE PAIN!
I do feel sorry for Mrs. Libby. What must it be like to think you married a successful, prominent citizen only to find out he’s a LOSER! There goes the status.
Frank Probst @ 68
Isn’t a sentence commutation a more logical choice?
Also, he would still be able to plead the 5th in the civil suit since he doesn’t have a pardon.
FWIW, the use of “respite” has more modern examples. It’s the least intrusive tool that President Bush has, but he doesn’t even need to deploy the respite tool until the day incarceration is scheduled to start.
The root issue will be what he uses for justification. Error by the courts? Ooops, I didn’t mean to call for an investigation? Or just do it without offering any justification?
The 800lb Gorilla staring at Libby et al are War Crimes. The law is on the books and I don’t think the “It doesn’t apply to us” card will work. A couple of years in a “country club pen” is pretty tame compared to a death sentence.
OT..Speaking if war crimes, five more US dead in Iraq on 07/01 and god knows how many Iraqi’s.
http://icasualties.org/oif/prd…..Ref=7-2007
He can choose felon or he can choose whistleblower.
And if he chooses Door #2, maybe the next *Democratic* president can pardon him – like on January 21, 2009.
Hell, Scoots, what’s one extra day in the slam? Take your pound of flesh, man.
T- @ 75
Absent a pardon, though, he’d be disbarred, right? Would have to become an AEI “Resident Scholar”.
Wouldn’t scoots be disbarred even WITH a pardon?
Boudica at 72 — FWIW, she seemed very nice and quite sharp at the trial, during my interactions with her. She was worried, clearly, but also seemed to genuinely care for Scooter. This would be quite difficult — it always is on the family of the person who has broken the law. But that does not absolve that person of any punishment for bad conduct. She was a lawyer for one of the foreign policy committees on the Hill, as I understand it, on the Dem side of things, when they met. But Libby himself holds the key to opening doors for himself — he can stop obstructing the investigation and, instead, move it forward. He won’t likely do that…but that is HIS choice, and unfortunately for them, his family has to pay the penalty for that choice along with him. Just as they have to pay the penalty for his repeated choices in lying to the federal agents and the grand jury and covering Cheney’s behind.
Daddy Carlson’s son is proof again, the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree.
Poor Scoots has been punished enough. He doesn’t get ra ride around in the BIG plane anymore. He doesn’t get ta kiss Uncle Dick’s ass first thing in the morning and last thing in the evening. He’s forced ta spend time with his FAMILY- who HATE him….
Come on- cut the guy some slack!
Scoots will be disbarred regardless, if I’ve read the VA Bar rules correctly. Anyone a VA bar member and know for certain on that?
rwcole @ 80
A pardon wipes the crime off the books, IIRC.
OffT: McCain campaign in meltdown, layoffs of fifty staffers planned.
What is a man like Richard Carlson doing on WETA’s Board of Trustees?
But wiretapping laws from the 70’s are ancient and outdated.
Pathetic people who have always gotten their way.
-GSD
BobbyG @ 79
Doesn’t the AEI Resident Scholar status result from the sentence?
What about disbarred? Does anyone know? If not, why not? I mean you know, Mark Rich and all.
McCain may be the first presidential dropout. He’s the guy who the Clusterfuckers told “Come on- just play ball with us and kiss ol Shrubbery’s ass- and you can be the NEXT president- fer SURE- we’ll support ya.”
Well, well. Driving home from extended wknd & just as I pass Ventura CA the Libby news hits Sirius radio. Great posts on this, CHS, & a great day for Justice…
My prediction, for what it’s worth- plenty of Wurlitzer, but no pardon in the forseeable (near) term.
The nut cuttin hour is the hour Libby, Libby, Libby is asked ta report to the slammer. We’ll see what Clusterfuck is made of.
Anyone know the ETA for Libby at the prison?
We were hearing 4-6 weeks as I recall at the time he was sentenced.
rwcole @ 95
IIRC the Judge estimated 45 – 60 days.
rwcole @ 91
And he falls for it again and again and again. Will Scooter do the same. You would think being a nasty attorney would prickle his meanness.
Christy, Froomkin gave you top billing (and links) in the “blogger reaction” to the WaPo’s big story on Bush in his column today:
Atta girl!
Days like this (ok, everyday) I’m so glad to be able to come here and get great info from Christy and the FDL community. I don’t know how I’d get thru these times without all of you.
Thanks, Al Gore, for the nifty intertoobz!
When the talk turns to pardons, I find myself putting this back up.
Re pardons,
From the annotated Constitution: http://www.gpoaccess.gov/const…..02/012.pdf
on pages 485-486 (640K PDF file)
Steve @ 77
so good, it had to be repeated
Christy,
You made a mistake when you wrote:
“Good lord, the nation is being run by a bunch of petulant, selfish, narcissistic 11 year olds.”
Hey Christy,
11 year olds are people too. Lets show them some respect. Some of my best friends…etc..
Joel
I can’t shake off the feeling this is all some weird piece of kabuki performance art. Other than I. Lewis Libby, for whom is it a benefit that Libby is pardoned? Who benefits if he is given a respite or his sentence commuted?
Bush cannot pardon, as it is likely obstruction of justice.
Cheney cannot ask for a pardon, as it is even more likely an obstruction of justice to do so.
Neither of them can even breathe a word about doing so. But are commutation or respite similarly potentially obstructive?
And is it Libby who’s doing all the pleading via Friends of Libby, threatening in the subtlest manner to squeal if Bush/Cheney cannot find some other manner to release him? Or are there other dark players who are worried they will be revealed if Libby were to squeal? Are they so concerned that they continue to flail away at this so desperately?
Which makes me wonder what happened after the Franklin case, a.k.a. Iran-Contra II…who were the moles in the administration? We already know about Cheney’s office being breached by a Philippine spy; who else was there, likely building the case for the Iraq War, and now possibly the Iran War?
Will Scooter follow the way of Enron senior executive, Clifford Bater, who conveniently “committed suicide” hours before testifying to the Grand Jury? Watch out Scooter; these guys play really dirty. You will be dropped into an acid vat of oblivion and melt away while your pals go on with business as usual. Cheney will give the eulogy.
Is there any process by which an individual can be stripped of U.S. citizenship?
re: Scooter and McCain
One has to be completely delusional to be a loyal Bushie. When it suits him, W just fucks these people over, time and time again. When will they ever learn?
If Scooter has any sense of self-respect (let alone brains) he’ll turn on those mother fuckers. If he did that, I’d consider pardoning him.
the democrats are handling this very badly
they SHOULD be saying;
libby is convicted of covering the tracks for traitors, anyone that thinks he should get a pardon is as much a traitor as the people this criminal is covering up for”
or;
“we know as a fact this man was a tool, helping traitors expose one of our assets in the fight against terrorism, even SUGGESTING the president give this criminal a pardon tells us what these people think about protecting this natin”
see this?
that’s what the democrats need to do
Can’t see scoots turning on his gooper buds. He still expects a pardon- but failing that- he wants to fall into the gooper welfare system for fallen executives.
QuakerGirl @ 103
Oh QuakerGirl, you’re a conspiracy theorist after my own heart. Did I ever tell you about my theory where Dick Cheney, personally, operated the RC units that directed the drones into the WTC, thereby igniting the thermite that had been previously planted there by teams of Blackwater work crews dressed as custodial engineers?
Of course he’s going to get pardoned. Bush doesn’t think he did anything wrong – and that’s the uncynical way of looking at it.
I guess he could choose respite, or whatever, but he’ll take the same heat for it, which ever he chooses, so he might as well pardon him. I agree with Richard Carlson. That’s how Bush feels.
Look at it this way. This is legal. It’s legal that he pardons Libby. It’s disgusting, but it’s legal. Isn’t it?
Pressuring Attorney Generals to prosecute Democrats is not legal, but he did that anyway. Wiretapping without a warrant is illegal, but he did that. Manipulating intelligence to start a war is illegal, but guess what, no problem for W. So, why wouldn’t he pardon Libby?
(I’m not saying, by any stretch, that this is justice or isn’t appalling. Just that it’s Bush we’re talking about. Until someone takes his power away, he’s going to keep using and abusing it.)
mc @ 105
Christy @ 81,
I wonder what the downside of flipping would be? I can’t imagine it would be great.
Do you think the Libbys have been told what might be the reaction of DC society, not to mention Bushies? Or does it just go without saying?
97, Today Froomkin gives a nod to Jeralyn, too.
Blogger Jeralyn Merritt writes: “How close did Karl Rove come to getting indicted in PlameGate? As they say, ‘this close.’”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..00879.html
rwcole @ 107
Is there any way in which turning on people would legally benefit him – after all he’s been tried and sentenced, and I don’t see how his cooperation would change that.
I’m just waiting for Cheney to declare that he also has the power to pardon.
Either that, or go duck hunting with Scalia.
Bluetoe @ 104
Not yet, but Joe Lieberman is working on that for the dirty freaking bloggers who mock him all the time..
johnSwifty @ 109
Gee, that sounds logical to me ;))
we also need to shame bush out of a pardon…this should be simple, he’s a child
all we have to do is get people to sart saying;
“cheney has his hand up the president’s back like a ventriloquist’s dummy, if cheney tells bush to pardon this traitor it’s hard to see bush disobeying the pupettmaster even IF it means letting someone go free who covered the tracks of traitors, even IF it compromised national security”
OH BABY…I need to get a job with pelosi or someone
BobbyG @ 27
Can he pardon him for crimes not yet committed? That would be more than I would suspect. Of course I guess there’s no limit on the number of pardons a person can get. (What Scooter, they’re bothering you again? Poor boy. They have no honor.)
Wow! Tragic Legacy came already! The book not the event.
Sixty Something @ 115
Or a quiet secret get-away with Scooter for his last holiday before the pen.
QuakerGirl @ 116
Try it whilst wearing a sailors hat made from Reynold’s wrap; everything suddenly becomes crystal clear! ;-}
In almost semi-seriousness, though, the most damning evidence I have seen to date which indicates this administration could ever do something so insidious, is that they continue to claim that they have not.
That, and the wtc7 video clip keep me up nites. Not with Reynold’s wrap, though…to expensive. Any generic brand will do.
Hey, seriously, good luck with the adult onset of Chicken Pox. A good friend of mine recovered last year, but not without going through hell first.
It won’t be long before the nation moves on and ignores these scoundrels. They are quickly becoming irrelevant.
Pardons can be “full and complete” for “all crimes committed” without referencing those crimes, whether known or unknown. (See Ford, Gerald)
I do wonder if the pardon power can be delegated, like everything else seems to be in BushCheneyCo. Because if it can be, I bet it has been.
Techs: You RSS feed is 404ing, for me anyway.
Unintentional humor:
Coultergeist
Both photo and text provide amusement.
perris @ 117
hey, the ambassador does it right;
nicely done
I feel sorry for his family but wonder at the foolish loyalty to Cheney.
Does he believe in his cover-up enough to submit his family to his incarceration.
Marie Roget @ 92
JohnnyO (sig. other), w/whom I did not make the extended wknd trip up north of L.A., is getting back @ me by asking a ? I can’t really answer, but others here might. Is there another discernable way, besides those already discussed in these last couple posts/comment threads, that Libby does not begin his jail time starting very soon?
realworld @ 118
IANAL, but it appears that his pardon power is limited only by the threat of political repercussions (e.g., impeachment). As to crimes yet to be committed, there’s no case law on that that I’m aware of.
George W. Bush doesn’t care what anyone thinks about what he does, and has relished poking people in the eye since childhood, so that angle is a non-starter.
IMHO this is going to boil down to whether or not there is a rift between W and Cheney – as I suspect there is. If so, W may simply chose to ignore the entire Libby situation until he passes out of office or Cheney passes away from natural causes.
Cranky
I am a post-boomer baby, so I was just literally a baby in my mom’s arms when Watergate was happening, so I am curious: Did the word pardon, or the idea of a pardon, for Tricky Dick’s henchman get tossed around so easily like it is with Scooter? Or is this time around indicative of this administration’s stance that the unitary executive is really a monarch?
Apparently NONE of these dimwits understand the man lied and because of his lies obstructed an investigation. I mean, isn’t that the jist of Libby’s case?
Thus, he was tried, convicted, the whole nine yards as they say (no intention of mentioning the jailyard is 9 yards) – sentenced, and now it’s time to SERVE him up!
Presumably the court has Irve’s passport, yes?
TSF, I seem to remember Libby turning in his passport at his first court appearance after he was indicted. IIRC.
Offtopic and I apologize but…are ya’ll aware of the firestorm that pelosi has set off at DKos over her glib remark in a “face-to-face” phone interview with web reporter Mike Stark? She was asked about what they (the Dems) were going to do to restore the Constitution and checks and balances, with the question directed at impeachment. Pelosi’s answer? Here is the part of the question-answer that IS going to live in infamy:
THAT phrase, “the Constitution is worth it if you can succeed” is perfidy. THIS statement makes her unfit for office.
The Constitution is “worth it” even if you DON’T succeed. The Constitution is “worth it” ALWAYS and without exception.
Pelosi needs to resign. Now.
You can read the exchange at several locations now but the transcript of the cellphone conversation is at ePluribus . Read it. Call Pelosi. EJECT Pelosi.
Get Tough @ 130
During confirmation hearings to be Vice President, Gerald Ford was asked if he’d pardon Nixon should he succeed to the Presidency. His answer — “The American people wouldn’t stand for it” — was prescient but obfuscatory. Ford always felt he’d denied himself his own Presidential term by pardoning Nixon.
Al Haig supposedly presented pardon options to Ford at the very end of his Vice Presidency, but those were rejected. Ford said he found his early Presidency consumed with issues of Nixon’s documents, Nixon’s actions, and Nixon’s possible prosecution, to the point where he couldn’t govern. By this measure, Ford’s pardon was to lighten his own workload.
Public discussion? Not so much. It came like a bolt out of the blue; America was outraged.
Jane is now upstairs with a new post.
Thank you, Teddy. I find it vulger that so many are clamoring for Libby’s pardon when he was convicted of a serious crime. As I watch Shooter operate, it sends chills down my spine that this guy is setting precedent for the next set of dweebs and jerks in the coming years to pick up where Shooter left off. He is setting precedent here, like it or not. Yikes.
Wordsmith @131:
Folklore has it that the “whole 9 yards” refers to the amount of material it takes to make a shroud, not a prison yard.
Cranky Observer @ 129
Um hmmm. I agree in that W. has been taken back into the Kennebunkport womb and is being isolated from Cheney. My guess is that pappy is going to insert some influence, and maybe Cheney is going to left dangling. Nothing assertive and obvious, mind you, but just cut off from W. I wouldn’t be surprised to see more Maine excursions and more of 41 and Babs.
The ? is Hadley – where does his alliance lie? I thought he was a Cheney acolyte, but he’s in Maine.
As much as I dislike the Dems inability to frame the debate and stand up to the Goopers, having Pelosi resign will not help our cause Praedor. I consistently bemoan the political process in DC (and it is the #1 reason I remain an Independent), yet Pelosi knows how to play the game.
As much as cherish the Constitution over any politician or party and as much as I’d like to see impeachment now, I also can understand the position she has taken. I don’t have anything to back up my belief, but I truly believe that she is capable of changing her mind if the facts come up to push the issue (ala Watergate). I’m hoping that whatever Leahy has regarding the subpoenas could be a watershed moment. It’s hard to be patient, that’s for sure. I just don’t see how a Pelosi resignation gets us there.
let’s call him “g gordon libby”..he goes to jail & keeps his secrets…
johnSwifty @ 121
Chicken pox is much like this administration – it keeps coming back in a new disguised form masking as “something different” while it spreads its vengeance. What’s happening to me? I see a political plot in everything? My own shingles??? :-0 It must be the medication.
rat bastahd @ 140
The so-called “investigations” in Congress are theater, nothing more. They are tools being used to embarrass the Administration and its supporters, NOT a means of correcting the incredibly illegal and damaging actions taken these last 6 years. They are tools being used exclusively for political games. Other than that, they are being conducted VERY SLOWLY because there is no intention of calling to account and correcting wrongs, but simply to run out the clock. That is why a subpoena is drafted and held for weeks (See the Rice subpoena that has NOT been served). That is why after disobeying multiple subpoenas all that will happen is a spate of angry letters from various pansies in the Senate complaining about how uncooperative the Admin is being. Letters, letters, and more letters but never ever any action. Never ever any consequences for ignoring subpoenas and letters (oooooooh, a letter…scares the shit out of ME!).
The ultimate problem here is the oath of office does not give Pelosi the choice of whether or not to uphold and defend the Constitution (sorry, the Constitution is ALWAYS worth it, win or lose, period), every single member of Congress MUST support and defend the Constitution. The oath clearly states: “I take this obligation freely without reservation or purpose of evasion.” Pelosi is evading her obligations under that oath and her bald statement that the Constitution is optional (or worse, merely a political tool) rather the THE ultimate, supreme law of the land upon which NONE can tread and beyond which NONE may venture.
She, by her statement, proves herself unfit for office and she HAS set off a shitstorm…and not only at DKos.
This whole Libby thing, and the picture of him in deep shock downstairs- did he really think that, in addition to his own lying, loyalty was a two way street with Shooter? Shooter may have cash, but he is a bankrupt soul without character or conscience. What a scum.
Scooter- I think you are on your own. Save a bit of yourself for your kids. You really need to get vocal now. I’ll bet that not all of those in the Free Scooter Defense Fund group are your friends. There is more than one agenda there. Save yourself. I wouldn’t blame you for ratting out the scum.
Can’t wait for Libby’s radio talk show or stint as MSNBC “expert” when he gets out of jail!!
Just ask Peter Pace, a man who gave up great dignity and credibility to stand by the President during his misadventures and then was unceremoniously shitcanned.
Always remember these jokers were surveiling the Dems long before the 2004 election. They know every dirty secret possible and my guess is the have let all the players know that they know. The impeachment is off the table because… it might get senior dems in big trouble through backchannel unnamed sources to the media. Same with the Rethugs. Whenever something came up that Cheney didn’t like, he held closed door sessions with the Rs and got whatever he wanted…..hhmmmmmmmmmm
TheOtherWA @ 133
That would be the normal proceedure.
Frank33 @ 115
Naturalized citizens can be stripped of citizenship if it was obtained fraudulently. This sometimes occurs in the case of Nazi war criminals.
perris @ 106
Right-on!
Being a criminal is ok. Just as long as you’re a ‘loyal’ criminal.
Hugh @ 99
Marshall was alive in the days of the Whiskey Rebellion. Is this still good law? More directly to the point, did Nixon ever accept or plead his pardon? According to my recollection, he did not.
BobbyG @ 85
He will be disbarred beyond any doubt. A pardon will have no effect.
Pardon my ignorance, and pardon my request for a pardon, but what does IIRC mean/stand for?
Christy Hardin Smith @ 81
Yes, this is one of the deterrents to crime. In other words, many people don’t do many bad things because they don’t want to hurt the ones they love, bring shame on them, or be separated from them. Tough shit on her that it didn’t work in the case of the scumbag she married.TeddySanFran @ 67
If the import of what John Dean is saying is that it can be a high crime or misdemeanor for the president to exercise his pardon power when the purpose is to obstruct justice, I say he is wrong. Really, really wrong.
> what does IIRC mean/stand for?
IIRC = if I remember correctly
IMHO = in my humble opinion
IMNSHO = in my not-so-humble opinion (less common)
YMMV = your mileage may vary
Christy–Scooted has been disbarred in DC–understand that he may have beens suspended in PA, where he was also licensed. As noted in a footnote in his Wikapedia entry:
Lewis Libby is no longer listed as a “member” of the DC Bar, which revised its “Professional Rules of Conduct” on 1 February 2007, according to its “Bar News” section, both accessed 5 June 2007. On 3 April 2007, the District of Columbia Court of Appeals filed an “Order” (”In the Matter of I. Lewis Libby, Jr. … Bar Registration No. 950758″), suspending Libby “immediately from the practice of law in the District of Columbia pending resolution of this matter [in United States v. Libby],” which the Office of Bar Counsel (DC Bar) received on 4 April 2007, directing it to “inform the Court if the matter is resolved without the necessity of further court action.” In that order, “the Board directed the Bar Counsel to file a brief addressing whether [Libby’s] crimes inherently involve moral turpitude.” In its brief, filed on 24 April 2007, entitled “Statement of Bar Counsel”, the DC Bar stated that his crimes did so and recommended to the District of Columbia Court of Appeals Board on Professional Responsiblity that Libby “be disbarred pursuant to D.C. Code § 11-2503(a),” which reads “in pertinent part”: “When a member of the bar of the District of Columbia Court of Appeals is convicted of an offense involving moral turpitude, … the court shall, pending final determination of an appeal from the conviction, suspend the member of the bar from practice…. If a final judgment of conviction is certified to the court, the name of the member of the bar so convicted shall be struck from the roll of the members of the bar and such person shall thereafter cease to be a member.” Pursuant to the policy on “Moral Turpitude” contained therein, it is also noted (n. 4) that Libby’s “disbarment should be deemed to commence, for reinstatement purposes, on April 11, 2007, the date that [he] filed an affidavit in compliance with D.C. Bar R. XI, § 14(g).” The brief lists Libby’s admission to practice law in that jurisdiction as 19 May 1978.
Brisingamen @ 138
Yes, I know – I was just being a smart ass. A shroud will do.
Cranky Observer @ 155
TY, but don’t forget IARIYAAR= It’s all right if you are a Republican.
Mr. Bush takes great pride in being loyal. But like most things he touches, he has turned a virtue into a vice. Loyalty, like racial discrimination, can do good when properly used; abused, it can do enormous harm. The wife who remains loyal to a temporarily faltering husband is praiseworthy; the wife who remains loyal to the father who habitually drives his children to school while drunk is a criminal danger to herself and others.
How might a President show loyalty to his party and his country? If he or she insisted that a federal agency keep a whistleblower in their job despite her disclosing corruption that would cost millions to repair. By promoting a climate scientist whose work was first rate, even though she irritated ExxonMobil and the Senator from Oklahoma. Or, by insisting that his Attorney General keep David Iglesias and Carol Lam as US Attorneys even when their work exposes the corruption of friends and supporters. That is loyalty in service to something of lasting value, at the cost of pursuing immediate advantage. That’s political courage.
George W. Bush has none of it. He demeans or dismisses whistleblowers because they expose fraud and corruption; he penalizes climate scientists for being right, but politically incorrect; and he defends Alberto Gonzales because of his incompetence and lack of integrity. No matter how he masks it, the only greater good Mr. Bush is willing to pursue is his own.
Keeping Mr. Gonzales as Attorney General, for example, risks corrupting the most important department in the US government. Mr. Bush is doing so in order to avoid admitting his own mistakes and Gonzales’ incompetence, to avoid bruising confirmation hearings for his successor, and to avoid exposing himself to the investigations of the half dozen Patrick Fitzgeralds that Gonzales’ successor will inevitably launch. That isn’t loyalty, it’s corrupt self-interest. It is George Bush the CEO being loyal to the CFO who shares his corruption, even though every fraudulent financial statement they file costs their shareholders millions.
George Bush avoids change not because it shows that he’s weak, but because he’s afraid of it. It requires knowledge and judgment that he has never learned or acquired. His is the judgment of a drunken ship captain insisting that his officer-friend remain at the helm in heavy seas despite knowing that he panics even in calm weather – because he’s too afraid to take the helm himself.
I have always heard:
IOKIYAR = It’s OK if you’re a Republican
FROGMARCH!
FROGMARCH!
FROGMARCH!
FROGMARCH!
FROGMARCH!
All of them!
Big Mitch @ 152, I think Marshall’s opinion on pardons, in which he used the language for the rules on forming a contract, is only partly still good law. A pardon no longer requires delivery or acceptance; it is complete and effect when issued. Somewhat inconsistently, a pardon remains an admission, perhaps more acuurately (in my opinion) a restatement, of guilt.
earlofhuntingdon @ 162
I know that Gerald Ford always took this position, and according to Chris Matthews he carried with him a copy of a Supreme Court(?) case supporting this view. However, I have always doubted it, though I never read the opinion. It is difficult to accept that a person, e.g. RMN, could accept or acknowledge guilt by taking no action. And what of posthumous pardons, e.g. Jimmy Carter’s pardon of Dr. Mudd who treated John Wilkes Booth (under duress) and thereby lent his name to the expression “His name is mud.”
Per MSNBC, Pres. Bush has commuted the prison sentence of I. Scooter Libby.
Unbelievable. Simply unbelievable.
The effect of this act is to take away the prison portion of Libby’s sentence. Kelly O’Donnell, dim bulb that she is, is saying that it will result in the losso of his license, which I read has already happened.
All the time, energy and effort spent by everyone (especially the amazing folks at FDL) and it’s swiped away with the stroke of a pen. I can’t believe he had the balls to do this. Guess I should have expected nothing less…
We all figured he would get a pardon or commutation but not this quick. The President and Cheney were covering their own asses. Libby may not have squealed but you can bet his old lady would have.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19570081/
WASHINGTON – President Bush Monday spared former vice presidential aide Lewis “Scooter” Libby from going to prison for 2 1/2 years for obstructing the CIA leak investigation, a White House official said.
The official said Bush “has commuted the prison sentence … leaving intact the probation and fines handed down by the court.”
“That means he is not going to jail,” the official said.
Praedor, I take it all back. Impeachment is now a must!
Just a note from the GOP side thinking how timely and prescient this blog was today :-)
My, how clever our Dem friends are!
Congratulations, Don Fortier.
Your party has just rewarded a convicted felon for taking one for the team, and as a direct result, the legitimacy of our justice system is once again severely compromised. We are told once again that justice is not for high ranking republicans. However, if you or I committed perjury, regardless of how noble we felt our reasons were, we would undoubtedly wind up in the pen. Lovely.
In the meantime, your insipid gloating (and identification with the GOP) paints you as the ultimate hypocrite. Tell us, just how loudly did you call for the head of Bill Clinton, who also committed perjury?
No. No. No. You don’t have to go all the way back to George Washington for a respite/reprieve. Bill Clinton issued a couple himself.
And the punishment that is delayed is entirely irrelevant. The respite/reprieve isn’t the power to delay executions. It is the power to delay sentences – of any kind. If you want to see “get out of jail” free examples, see my National Reivew piece.
best,